Re: [guzzi-singles] Digest for guzzi-singles@googlegroups.com - 3 updates in 1 topic

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Hydroglen

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May 29, 2023, 3:19:25 PM5/29/23
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Moving on the stand is "normal" and mine does that. There is little vibration an dyes run out on the flywheel is undesirable. That is why you have such a big flywheel. Suggest you pull it off and try centering it better.

Dorien

On Monday, May 29, 2023 at 12:40:43 p.m. EDT, guzzi-...@googlegroups.com <guzzi-...@googlegroups.com> wrote:


"ba...@shifta.co.uk" <ba...@shifta.co.uk>: May 29 02:30AM -0700

Hi lads,
 
I have a vibration from about 1000 rpm which doesn't clear untill 3000+, I
have no rev counter so these are a guess. It makes the fuel tank rattle
and when parked on the stand the bike will move backwards if the engine is
revved up, several inches. I have clocked the outer rim of the flywheel and
it has 0.15mm (0.006" ) run out and the side run out is 0.05mm( 0.002" )
is that enough to cause it and is there a tolerance figure?
 
Apart from an oil leak from the ends of the kickstart shaft she is fine.
Thanks for any advice given. Barry
"ba...@shifta.co.uk" <ba...@shifta.co.uk>: May 29 02:39AM -0700

I should have added does anyone know where I can get a new pushrod tube top
end seal please, I have tried the obvious sites with no luck, perhaps you
know a source I don't.
 
Thanks Barry
 
Alan Comfort <alan.c...@gmail.com>: May 29 08:26AM -0700

I think that the flywheel runout that you describe is excessive. If the
"runout" is caused by a loose flywheel or by play in the crankshaft
bearings, then this must be addressed. If you firmly grasp the flywheel and
try to wiggle it, you should not be able to feel any axial or radial play.
If you can feel any play, the first thing to check is the flywheel nut
after removing the lock ring. If the flywheel nut is tight then you are
looking at the job of replacing the bearings, as well as addressing all the
other issues that will be revealed when you open the engine. There is a
fair bit of work and expense in overhauling these engines, but the upside
is that you will never have to do it again.
If you cannot feel any play in the flywheel, it could be loose engine mount
bolts or a cracked frame.
Alan in Roberts Creek
 
On Mon, May 29, 2023 at 2:30 AM ba...@shifta.co.uk <ba...@shifta.co.uk>
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Roger Rowland

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May 29, 2023, 4:16:20 PM5/29/23
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Don’t want to be a doom merchant however I noticed a strange vibration, then the odd nut/ bolt would come loose, next at 70MPH the con rod snapped!! On examination there was play in the small end. My neighbour who used to race carts said he had experienced the same. I suspect the material which the bush was made to be incorrect ? 
Flywheel taper anyone know what it is? Could it possibly be Morse? From my experience this should be a very good fit, the key is for timing the taper the drive? 

          Regards Rog U.K. 

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On 29 May 2023, at 20:19, 'Hydroglen' via Guzzi Singles <guzzi-...@googlegroups.com> wrote:


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ba...@shifta.co.uk

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May 30, 2023, 5:46:28 AM5/30/23
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Thank Roger, I will pull the flywheel off again but I did do that last week and scrupulously cleaned the shaft and the taper bore, I deburred the keyway slot and dressed the key to ensure it didn’t prevent the taper making full contact. As it was mentioned elsewhere the key is just for location and not a locking device.  When you think that the O.D. run out is actually .003” e.g. .003” up and .003” down. The side run out is .001” by the same principle.  I am surprised that in the 50’s Moto Guzzi were working to closer limits than that.

 

I did rebuild the engine recently and checked both ends which were good with no discernible play, I cannot move the flywheel in any direction with levers so the main bearings are fine.

 

Roger I have to admit being an expert in putting conrods through the bottom of engines having done it with my bike transport van  on the way to Mallory, Did two Nissan Micra’s belonging to my wife and dropped one at Mallory through the bottom of a ZXR750 RR  race bike just coming into Gerrards.

 

I don’t treat Guzzi’s like that as I have too much respect for them.

 

I did note that there is no arrow mark on the flywheel for the timing and the number on the back does not match the engine number so may be from a different bike.

 

Thanks for your input mate.

 

Barry

Roger Rowland

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May 30, 2023, 1:51:57 PM5/30/23
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Hi Barry, back in the mists of time I used to scrape phosphor bronze bearings in on big grinders. This was the age old method of using micrometer blue. Which invariably ended up on your face etc. You don’t even seem to be able to buy scrapers so I think it’s a lost art although the train enthusiasts  must still do it ? Anyway with key out clean components and the dreaded blue you will see if the taper is in contact all along it’s length which it should be. Why I ask is it Morse is because a large taper sleeve would be a master ie reference. It’s possible as the Europeans used our pipe threads and chain sizes. Morse invented in the USA was and is used for decades.
My number is +447788510474 happy to help 
              Regards Rog gloucester 

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On 30 May 2023, at 10:46, ba...@shifta.co.uk wrote:



Richard Wood

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May 30, 2023, 2:06:12 PM5/30/23
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Engineers blue still needed for shimming crown wheel and pinions. Ironically last time I used it was early 80's after fitting a V7 Sport CW&P to a Guzzi 1105cc Special to make it truly gambalunga.

Richard

Patrick Hughes

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May 30, 2023, 4:08:48 PM5/30/23
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Hi Roger

I still use my scrapers and you can still buy them but they are not quality these days. The old ones are the best.

I had trouble with run out on my flywheel, it turned out to be the key, it was very slightly too high and would not let the taper seat properly. I filed a bit off the top of the key and all is well. The flywheel tightens up properly on the taper.

 

Regards
Patrick Hughes   CEng FIMechE FSOE FIPlantE

Managing Director
Harmill Systems Ltd
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Barry

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May 30, 2023, 4:28:42 PM5/30/23
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I still have spoon and triangular scrapers from my toolmakers apprentice days 68years ago.  I will give it a go.

ba...@shifta.co.uk

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May 31, 2023, 5:00:14 AM5/31/23
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I made sure the key didn’t foul the flywheel Patrick however I am taking it off yet again and blue it without the key in so it might throw up the problem.

 

Always grateful for any advice offered.

 

Regards

 

Barry

ba...@shifta.co.uk

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May 31, 2023, 5:02:32 AM5/31/23
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Hi Richard, I have morse sleeves so will check it out when I get the flywheel off. Good thinking mate.

 

Regards

 

Barry

Roger Rowland

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May 31, 2023, 5:22:11 AM5/31/23
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That’s good news suspect it might help with Ducati bevels, yes I have a few Eclipse scrapers and wish we could still buy Dormer Sheffield drills I still have a few new always do the job some are like rubbing a stick to make fire useless.

              The dreaded blue !!

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On 31 May 2023, at 10:00, ba...@shifta.co.uk wrote:


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