NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

[leafman60]

Three questions-

 

1.  Is there any source for information on production numbers and paint colors for the 70's era Nuovo Falcone bikes ?  Does Mick Walker's book, Moto Guzzi Singles, list any of this data?  Is there any other source?  I've found nothing on the net.

 

2.  What about unleaded gasoline?  Are there any serious problems from running unleaded in these old engines whose valve seats I assume are designed for leaded fuel?

 

3.  What about engine and transmission oils ?  What's the recommendation?  (I know I'll get a hundred opinions here.)  I generally do not use synthetics in old motors but has anyone used Redline Shock Proof Heavy in these Falcone transmissions?

[Gavin Bedggood]

1. Nothing I know about.

2. Have you valve seats redone to be lead free.... this will eliminate the biggest Nuovo fault which is valve seats falling out.  I had it happen and I have had my head done lead free with smaller stem valves.

3. I just use a good mineral oil in mine, nothing fancy. Engine and trans oil is shared. Oil filtration is minimal, so change the oil often.

 

Regards

Gavin

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[hubert casanova]

On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 3:11 PM, leafman60 <leaf...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Three questions-
>
> 1. Is there any source for information on production numbers and paint
> colors for the 70's era Nuovo Falcone bikes ? Does Mick Walker's book, Moto
> Guzzi Singles, list any of this data? Is there any other source? I've
> found nothing on the net.
>

somethink like this?
http://www.mgcn.nl/index.php/mg-framenummers-dameijer-database-39

> 2. What about unleaded gasoline? Are there any serious problems from
> running unleaded in these old engines whose valve seats I assume are
> designed for leaded fuel?
>

unleaded is ok, mine has now 75000 km on its original valve seats.
no sign of wear so far.
if you plan to ride it , you should check the head.
if it still has the 10 mm valve stems consider a head rebuild,
get other valves ( 8 mm stem) and other valve springs
the originals valve springs are way too strong and hammer the whole
valve train to pieces.
anything from lifters, cams, even valve seats gets damaged.
i changed the valve springs on mine, i went back from the original
110 kilo to 60 kilo force.
still no sign of floating valves , even if i miss a gear.

> 3. What about engine and transmission oils ? What's the recommendation?
> (I know I'll get a hundred opinions here.) I generally do not use
> synthetics in old motors but has anyone used Redline Shock Proof Heavy in
> these Falcone transmissions?
>

just engine oil, the falcone has no separate transmission oil.
as far as i am concerned any decent quality engine oil will do.

[Rick]

For paint I think you should just go to your local paint store and look at chips to find something close. I’ve said it before and I expect Moto Guzzi may not have been as bad as Ducati but I think they just had some guy in the paint room mixing colors by eye. Some Ducatis have been delivered with three different shades of paint on them. I joked about it a month or two ago how someday everyone is going to thing a certain color code is THE correct paint color because that’s what everyone is using. In reality it is probably just a shade that appealed to one guy, then he offered it to another and so on until it’s accepted as “correct”.

 

Valves/seats/guides don’t seem to be an issue beyond anything normal. But then that’s just what I’m seeing here.

 

Oil I think is more important to keep regular changes up. Both engine and gearbox. Synthetics are nice especially since they’re taking the zinc out of petro oils but if you change regularly I wouldn’t expect issues.

 

Rick Yamane

Motion Pro Inc.

We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!

867 American St.

San Carlos, CA 94070

(650)594-9600

(650)594-9610 Fax

ri...@motionpro.com

www.motionpro.com

 

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

 

---

From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of leafman60
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2012 6:11 AM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [guzzi-singles] NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

 

Three questions-

--

[leafman60]

Okay, I realize now that this is a unitized powertrain with the trans and motor sharing the same oil sump.  Thanks.

 

Regarding the paint, I am not trying to match a color so much as trying to determine what the color should be.

 

I have not been able to find any info on what colors Guzzi produced these bikes with.

 

[hubert casanova]

not sure if this helps?
http://www.guzzitreff.de/cms/index.php?Modifikationen:Lackierung%2FFarben

cheers,
Hubert

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> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/guzzi-singles/-/zdh74fpxzlUJ.

[Gavin Bedggood]

I have only seen the civilian bikes like yours in maroon or white.

Most I have seen have been white.

 

The signle seat military bikes came in other colours.  Green, blue etc...

 

Regards

Gavin

 

----- Original Message -----

From: leafman60

To: guzzi-singles@googlegroups..com

--

[Guzz...@aol.com]

Welcome Leafman.........Have fun with your new ride. These guzzi singles are a different cup of tea. Enjoy your ride.........I've seen an all green military color and the rest with red frames and white gas tanks with pinstripes.

 

Tim

[leafman60]

Okay, I've had the NFalcon long enough now to become familiar with it and put a few miles on it.  I'm impressed.  I can ride it a the speeds I'd like to ride.  I don't have to baby it.

 

The biggest thing that has surprised me is how nimble the handling is.  I have some modern sportbikes as a reference and the NFalcon does pretty well !  It is stable and yet very quick to turn.

[Gavin Bedggood]

I agree.   Strong frame, narrow tires and wide bars help in that.  I have never had a problem with the handling of mine, it's very solid.

 

I had thought of fitting new aftermarket springs in the forks some time.   Mostly to get less dive on braking.

 

Regards

Gavin (19 years of NF ownership and counting!)

----- Original Message -----

From: leafman60

To: guzzi-singles@googlegroups..com

Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2012 1:07 PM

Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/guzzi-singles/-/SUuBg5wpo1kJ.

[leafman60]

Yes, I may do that.  I need to disassemble the forks and replace the seals anyway.  I also need to remedy a little sluggishness of the brake mechanism.

[Stephen Pate]

I'm really pleased that you got a good bike and are enjoying it so much!! That's fantastic. The 'way it should be'!

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Stephen Pate, Owner

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ste...@restorationwerks.com

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[Gavin Bedggood]

Like all drum brakes they respond well to cleaning, lubing and careful setting up.   I still remember the first time I used mine after I did that years ago and it made a huge difference.

 

I see the fork springs on ebay Germany all the time... like this one.

http://www.ebay.it/itm/progressive-Gabelfedern-Moto-Guzzi-Nuovo-Falcone-/390065376452?pt=Motorrad_Kraftradteile&hash=item5ad1b54cc4

 

Lots of cheapish part for these bikes around too.... so stock up while you can!

I have multiple new cables and consumable parts and even a new barrel and piston set in my spares... all the bits I should need to keep it going for my life time.

I intent to grow older and die owning my NF as my last bike.

 

Regards

Gavin

 

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/guzzi-singles/-/fn7eXPiAA4MJ.

[Gavin Bedggood]

http://www.ebay.it/itm/MOTO-GUZZI-Simmerring-Set-Gabel-Nuovo-Falcone-/150895431407?pt=Motorrad_Kraftradteile&hash=item2322118eef

 

If you don't have them already then their are fork seals...

Regards

Gavin

----- Original Message -----

From: leafman60

To: guzzi-singles@googlegroups..com

Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 12:25 AM

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/guzzi-singles/-/fn7eXPiAA4MJ.

[leafman60]

Thanks Gavin.

[Rick]

At the risk of being self-promoting you might want to look into Motion Pro’s LW housing for the front brake cable.

Check our website under the custom cables. I use it on all my cable operated front brakes. It helps with heavy clutches too.

 

Rick Yamane

Motion Pro Inc.

We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!

867 American St.

San Carlos, CA 94070

(650)594-9600

(650)594-9610 Fax

ri...@motionpro.com

www.motionpro.com

 

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

 

From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of leafman60
Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2012 4:25 AM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

 

Yes, I may do that.  I need to disassemble the forks and replace the seals anyway.  I also need to remedy a little sluggishness of the brake mechanism.

 

 

 

 

[leafman60]

I can't find anything about a "LW housing" on the Motion Pro site.

[Rick]

Damn guys changed the webpages!

LW is longitudinally wound housing. That is rather than the housing wire being a coil, it runs lengthwise.

What this does is it eliminates collapse of the housing when the brake is applied giving a firmer feel and more power going to the brake itself. It also eliminates most of the change in inner wire free length when the cable bends or flexes. If you’ve ever felt the brake lever pulsate over bumpy road surfaces, that will be gone.

LW is still available for most applications. I’ll see about having the web pages redone.

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[Charles Mullendore]

I tried having Motion Pro make a brake cable for drum-brake "Loopframe" Guzzis. Sent a sample. Paid the $15 to have the drawing made and $45 for the cable. Was told by Preston Landers that they didn't have a necessary fitting, specifically the M9-1.25 threaded adjuster. Bought a bag of 10 adjusters from Flanders and had them sent to MP. Cable is made, arrives here - wrong diameter barrel on the lever end. Should have been 9 mm and was only 8 mm. Would have bought those too and sent them with the adjusters had I known. Preston said they would fix the cable if I sent it back and sent them the correct diameter barrel. Asked Preston which barrel he would need (supplied him with a link to all of those available from Flanders) and the only reply was basically "pick one". So I could have screwed around another few weeks sending the cable back, spending more money for postage, fittings from Flanders, etc. before I had what I wanted in the first place. But, I
just gave up and had Barnett make the cable instead. Fit perfectly right out of the box, doesn't stretch or compress, gives good lever feel, cost me $40 including shipping.  

Charlie
http://www.AntietamClassicCycle.com

[ne...@mindspring.com]

At Jerry suggestion I started buying parts from Flanders and soldering new cables up myself with a propane torch. No drawings, and you can make them up in minutes and quickly change the length if you measured wrong. Usually it's just the cable that's stretched, so I can usually reuse the adjusters and miscellaneous other parts (that already have a patina).

Flanders website is a little confusing, so I make sure to call in the order to be sure everything matches. They're very helpful. (http://www.flanderscompany.com/FlanCableSearch.html)

You could probably use just normal electrical connection solder, but I use silver solder to be sure. I use silveralloy 355 solder and Ultraflux and flux from Brownell's gunsmithing supply because I have it around. They are a little pricy, but you only use a small amount per cable. (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=584/Product/SILVALOY-355-SILVER-SOLDER)

Making your own is very liberating. You go from haunting ebay and bidding on new old stock cables, or spending time finding local suppliers of discontinued parts, to just going down to the basement and making them up in a few minutes. Once you start it's hard to stop....

>--
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[Rick]

Sorry that happened Charles.
Preston no longer works here. I know it's no help but......

The correct thing Preston should have done would be to have you measure everything out and confirm that we do or don't have the required parts. Once that was established, then ask you to send in the sample.

I'm never happy to hear stuff like this and I'm just the owner's mechanic in the shop.

The new man we have in Preston's seat is much better at around 6 months than Preston was after 2 years. His name is Matt and although we all make mistakes, Matt will ask because he wants to learn and he also has a years worth of cable building experience. Something that Preston did not have nor was he willing to learn. Our other man in custom cables is Joe. He's been there for over 6 years and he knows his stuff very well.

Matt got his job through the recommendation of the lead custom cable tech and myself. I'm proud and happy the way Matt has stepped up to his new position.

Again I'm sorry. It's ex post facto but if there is anything we can do let me know and I'll see if I can help.

Rick Yamane
Motion Pro Inc.
We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!
867 American St.
San Carlos, CA 94070
(650)594-9600
(650)594-9610 Fax
ri...@motionpro.com
www.motionpro.com

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

-----Original Message-----
From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Charles Mullendore
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 12:31 PM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: [guzzi-singles] NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

[Michael Moore]

> At Jerry suggestion I started buying parts from Flanders and soldering
> new cables up myself with a propane torch.

It is much easier if you make a solder cup. I used a 3/4" length of 1"
tube, welded a cap on one end and some scrap metal to the side as
a handle. You could use most anything similar -- maybe a metal
teaspoon. Cut up enough of the bar solder to fill it when it melts,
then dip the wire and end in the liquid flux, dip it into the molten
solder in the pot, and you're done other than maybe a little filing to
clean off excess solder.

You can heat the solder cup with your torch or a kitchen burner.

http://www.eurospares.com/graphics/cable8.jpg

cheers,
Michael

[leafman60]

Do they have the specs for a NFalcone cable?

[Charles Mullendore]

Barnett? You'd need to send them the old one as a pattern to work off of. Same thing with Motion Pro most likely.   Charlie http://www.AntietamClassicCycle.com

--- On Mon, 10/1/12, leafman60 <leaf...@hotmail.com> wrote:

[leafman60]

These are all good pointers.  In the past, I've had Terrycable make things for me but they may be gone now.  This time around, I may try the solder pot and make my own.  I've seen that done by the old-timers.

 

On the other hand, sending it out is so easy.  On the other hand, doing it yourself is so gratifying.  Problem is, when it breaks, you can't blame the darn cable maker.

[Rick]

I think that's the lesson of the year! Thanks Michael.

A propane torch always opens the possibility of over heating the joint. Also, never reuse the wire. Once lube has worked its way in you can never get it clean enough to get the strongest joint. We tested this on our cable dyno with new pre-lubed cable wires and all sorts of cleaning proceedures.

Rick Yamane
Motion Pro Inc.
We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!
867 American St.
San Carlos, CA 94070
(650)594-9600
(650)594-9610 Fax
ri...@motionpro.com
www.motionpro.com

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

-----Original Message-----
From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com]

[Michael Moore]

Hi Rick,

I've never had much luck with either a solder gun or a propane
torch. The solder pot is pretty foolproof and avoids burning off the
flux while getting everything evenly heated. As that Flander's page
mentions you do need to keep an eye on the solder wicking up the
cable so it doesn't go too far and make a stiff spot above the end
that will eventually break because it doesn't flex.

I bought a 1 pound bar of solder from Flanders many years ago,
and that seems like it will be a lifetime supply for about 20-30
people. :-)

cheers,
Michael

[Rick]

Terrycable is still around.

We’ve also been known to warranty cables that have Barnett labels on them. I still haven’t figured that one out……

 

On soldering your own, using a pot is the best, make sure you use a high quality flux and don’t dip the joint so long as to let the solder flow more than ¼” up the wire. You might want to practice a few before you actually solder your “cut” wire. As soon as it’s dipped we dip in a coolant to prevent any solder creep but that may be not practical for a homebuilder.

 

Rick Yamane

Motion Pro Inc.

We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!

867 American St.

San Carlos, CA 94070

(650)594-9600

(650)594-9610 Fax

ri...@motionpro.com

www.motionpro.com

 

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

 

From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of leafman60
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 7:25 AM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

 

These are all good pointers.  In the past, I've had Terrycable make things for me but they may be gone now.  This time around, I may try the solder pot and make my own.  I've seen that done by the old-timers.

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[Rick]

We go through one of those bars in about a week. :-)

Yup big +1 on the soldering technique. I used to think I knew how to build cables until I started working here.

Rick Yamane
Motion Pro Inc.
We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!
867 American St.
San Carlos, CA 94070
(650)594-9600
(650)594-9610 Fax
ri...@motionpro.com
www.motionpro.com

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

-----Original Message-----
From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Moore
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 7:58 AM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Guzzi Singles" group.

[steven s.]

What method are you guys using to 'Peen Over' the individual cable strands at the end of the barrel? Trying to hold such small items together by hand, while trying to spread the cable-end has usually been less than graceful for me.   Steven Seftel SLC, Utah --- On Tue, 10/2/12, Rick <ri...@motionpro.com> wrote:

From: Rick <ri...@motionpro.com> Subject: RE: [guzzi-singles] NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

To: "guzzi-...@googlegroups.com" <guzzi-...@googlegroups.com> Date: Tuesday, October 2, 2012, 9:06 AM Terrycable is still around. We’ve also been known to warranty cables that have Barnett labels on them. I still haven’t figured that one out……

On soldering your own, using a pot is the best, make sure you use a high quality flux and don’t dip the joint so long as to let the solder flow more than ¼” up the wire. You might want to practice a few before you actually solder your “cut” wire. As soon as it’s dipped we dip in a coolant to prevent any solder creep but that may be not practical for a homebuilder.

Rick Yamane Motion Pro Inc.

We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!

867 American St. San Carlos, CA 94070 (650)594-9600 (650)594-9610 Fax ri...@motionpro.com www.motionpro.com

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com ] On Behalf Of leafman60 Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 7:25 AM To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] NUOVO FALCONE TOPICS

These are all good pointers.  In the past, I've had Terrycable make things for me but they may be gone now.  This time around, I may try the solder pot and make my own.  I've seen that done by the old-timers.   On the other hand, sending it out is so easy.  On the other hand, doing it yourself is so gratifying.  Problem is, when it breaks, you can't blame the darn cable maker.         On Monday, October 1, 2012 7:52:44 PM UTC-5, Charlie aka Amboman wrote: Barnett? You'd need to send them the old one as a pattern to work off of. Same thing with Motion Pro most likely.   Charlie http://www. AntietamClassicCycle.com --- On Mon, 10/1/12, leafman60 <leaf...@hotmail.com> wrote:   Do they have the specs for a NFalcone cable?

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[ne...@mindspring.com]

I hold the cable just below the part I'm soldering with an old pair of vice grips (held in a bench vice).  They act as a heat sync so the solder does not flow down the cable (at least not much :)).  Also the cable doesn't move during soldering so it's easy to position the ends where they won't stick out.  If any do stick you can always grind them off with a dremel.

-Nick

[andrew nahum]

Hi Rick,

I wonder, have you tested the pull strength of 'solderless' screw-on nipples on your machine? I'd be interested to know the result. My 450 has them on both sides of the double drum as original, and so, after some failures of soldered nipples at the handlebar end I put them there too. I am talking about the kind with a grub-screw which compresses and deforms the cable inner.

Andrew

[Gordon de la Mare]

You may find it surprising but the front brake on Dondolinos uses solderless nipples.

I've done quiet a few parade type events on mine and it has been raced in the past with same fittings

It's just how they used to do things.

Oh, and my Ercole too has solderless nipples on the front though I do use two of them!!

Gordon

 

---

From: andrew nahum <andrew...@googlemail.com>
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, 2 October 2012, 22:30
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] RE: Cable soldering

[Rick]

Hi Andrew,

I don’t particularly care for solderless barrels but…..

There are many applications where they are the only thing that will work. I’ve had to use them on Bultacos, Ducatis, Motobis and Gileras. Surprisingly I’ve not had one slip while I’ve been here at Motion Pro. I have had them come off in the past. I used to run them as an emergency repair. Probably just not tightened enough but still a failure.

 

Rick Yamane

Motion Pro Inc.

We Ride! We Wrench! We Race!

867 American St.

San Carlos, CA 94070

(650)594-9600

(650)594-9610 Fax

ri...@motionpro.com

www.motionpro.com

 

Browse Our Interactive 2012 Catalog

 

---

From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of andrew nahum

Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 2:31 PM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] RE: Cable soldering

 

Hi Rick,

[Mac Dennis]

You can get solder type fitting for most any application. I got most of mine from Cosmo

25 years ago and I'm sure Flanders has most sizes.

Mac

[antonio]

Hi all, I have used solderless barrels for many many years; they come in
all sizes
and some were used by the factory as standard fittings. Innocenti used
them on the
Lambretta gear shift cables. I still have them on the brakes of my
Yamaha TD2 and
TD3 GP bikes, brakes that I also use on my racing Gold Star. I used
them on throttle
cables also and on my farm tractor; some times I made my own. On
occasion I had to
modify the front brake lever to accept the longer barrel. They never let
me down but nothing
made by man is perfect so I am sure that some failure did occur as even
the best
factory made cables have at times failed.
I do however like to make my own but I use a big soldering iron.
So, I had to put in my 3 cents worth. Good luck with your endeavors,
Zipolo

[leafman60]

Well, I've had my NFalcone ('74) long enough now to be really getting into it.

 

I massaged it a little bit and I've ridden it enough to have it running like a dream.

 

I find myself choosing it over some of my other bikes for errands and saturday morning breakfast runs.

 

It clips along great at 55-60 and I occasionally wind it up to 70ish.  The thing sounds great.  I am also very pleased with the handling offered by the bike.

 

As has been described here many times, shifting these things works fine as long as you don't get into a rush.  Grab the clutch lever and wait a while before flipping the shift lever.  Let the revs die down a little bit.  Doing that results in clash-less and smooth-transition shifts.

 

I do need to attend to a little issue.  The other day I kick-started the bike (always one kick) and the kick-start lever stuck in down position momentarily after the bike started.  It then moved up and down a little before releasing to normal position.  I assume something needs oiling or a spring needs attention etc.

 

Love my Falcone.

[leafman60]

Check this awesome specimen of a custon cafe NuFalc-

 

[IMG]http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/leafman60/Bike%20Pics/Falcone_zps8b46690f.jpg[/IMG]

 

 

 
On Wednesday, August 22, 2012 8:11:14 AM UTC-5, leafman60 wrote:

Three questions-

 

1.  Is there any source for information on production numbers and paint colors for the 70's era Nuovo Falcone bikes ?  Does Mick Walker's book, Moto Guzzi Singles, list any of this data?  Is there any other source?  I've found nothing on the net.

 

2.  What about unleaded gasoline?  Are there any serious problems from running unleaded in these old engines whose valve seats I assume are designed for leaded fuel?

 

3.  What about engine and transmission oils ?  What's the recommendation?  (I know I'll get a hundred opinions here.)  I generally do not use synthetics in old motors but has anyone used Redline Shock Proof Heavy in these Falcone transmissions?

[leafman60]

Check out this specimen of a custom cafe NuFalc-

 

[IMG]http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/leafman60/Bike%20Pics/Falcone_zps8b46690f.jpg[/IMG]

[leafman60]

Lets try this -

 

http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/leafman60/Bike%20Pics/Falcone_zps8b46690f.jpg

[Mac Dennis]

Look like a over grown Aermachhi.

 

Very nicely done.

 

 

On Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 01:52 PM, leafman60 wrote:

Lets try this -

 

http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/leafman60/Bike%20Pics/Falcone_zps8b46690f.jpg

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capr...@fastmail.fm

[hubert casanova]

you are lucky, i think it is is for sale...
i cant see the attraction of these cafe racers , but everyfifties
racer , dy its own.
i would like to build something around the lines of a fifties racer,
the chassis shouldnt be too hard to build,
the dustbin fairing and tank are available in GRP.

that would make a cool cafe racer....

cheers,
Hubert

[Michael Moore]

> dustbin fairing and tank are available in GRP.

Hubert, who is it that offers the works Guzzi single dustbins and do
you know which version of the fairing it is? They'd probably be
horribly expensive to ship to the USA (due only to the volume of the
box, not the weight).

cheers,
Michael

[John Mead]

You can find dustbin fairings at Airtech.

http://www.airtech-streamlining.com/vintage/vintagefairingsdustbin.htm

John Mead

--- On Fri, 12/21/12, Michael Moore <mmo...@eurospares.com> wrote:

[antonio]

For your viewing pleasure this is something I have been working
on...........
Zipolo

[Michael Moore]

> For your viewing pleasure this is something I have been working
> on...........

Good work! (and a lot of it). I presume you started with lots of
different photos and kept photoshopping until you got some good
side and front views to try and then expand into a 3D model.

John, Airtech doesn't have Guzzi dustbins. There's a "large vintage"
dustbin of unknown provenence. They've got an NSU Sportmax, a
Gilera 125 (those two are new since I last looked, maybe pulled
from originals from the Eling museum in Solvang) and a small MV
Agusta and none of them have the profile (or probably the
aerodynamics) of the late Guzzi GP single fairings.

cheers,
Michael

[leafman60]

Hubert, where is "for sale" info on it ?

[Bill Irwin]

Lovely Antonio! You are a man of many talents!

Almost there with the Dondo. Just waiting on some tubing.

Ciao Bill

[hubert casanova]

it is not advertised online,
but i can give you the email of the seller, if you want
it wont be cheap....

cheers,
Hubert

[Stephen Farthing]

If only Guzzi would produce some new singles (Or for that matter Ducati). A whole generation of riders is missing out on the great experience of riding one. 

Cheers,

Steve

[Alan Comfort]

most excellent!
alam in vancouver

On 2012-12-21, at 1:48 PM, antonio wrote:

For your viewing pleasure this is something I have been working on...........
Zipolo

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<dustbin fairing 001.jpg>

[Alan Comfort]

trouble is that it costs pretty much the same to build a first class single as it does to build a twin. The Guzzi V7, the Monster 600 and 250cc Japanese singles seem to adequately fill the new rider/small person niche. The big bore single cylinder cognoscenti represent a very small market. I do not see large numbers of Enfield Bullets rolling out of showrooms. I am more than content with keeping the old machines in service.

Alan in Vancouver

[andrew nahum]

Oh boy! You can make a Nuovo Falcone beautiful. But maybe only from
the RH side. would love to see other shots.
Andrew

On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 6:52 PM, leafman60 <leaf...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Lets try this -
>
>
> http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/leafman60/Bike%20Pics/Falcone_zps8b46690f.jpg
>

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>

[andrew nahum]

Re leaded gas etc. my view is 'wear out what you've got first' before
getting involved in getting new valve seats cut in at considerable
expense. There are probably thousands of miles of life in them.

It is easy to see if you do get significant valve seat recession in
use (ie wear or erosion) because if you set the tappets with your
feeler gauges, the gap will have closed up if you check them 1000
miles later.

What are Nuovo valve seats made of? The worst recession occurred in
cast iron head car motors where the seat is just cut into the iron the
head was poured from. (And the cars did 10X to 100X the mileage we
do). Bikes with alloy heads usually have a bronze or ferrous alloy
valve seat shrunk in which is better stuff and not so prone to erode.

There are also various 'faith healing' products you can pour into the
tank to protect the valve seats.

Oil: Oh boy. Lucky this isn't the Ducati list. My own policy is to use
monograde 50 SAE (Castrol GP 50) in my singles, because I think the
engine fits were made when oil was like that and hydrodynamic effects
must be important. Wait for the other 99 opinions.

Andrew

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[leafman60]

Yes, email me, hubert.  leaf...@hotmail.com

[Eric Todd]

this is one of my fav modern singles...I would love to have one...but they are not for sale in the USA.
et

http://www.fasterandfaster.net/2009/06/riding-impression-derbi-mulhacen-cafe.html
http://www.visordown.com/reviews/motorcycles/naked/derbi-mulhacen-659-2007---present/429.html

[Stephen Farthing]

I read somewhere that Aprillia had a 500 cc single concept bike based on the RS125cc rolling chassis, pretty much a race bike for the road, with a 490 cc Huskvana moto cross engine in it....Shame they never made it. I would have been first in the queue. 

Steve

[Charles Mullendore]

Interesting. Derbi is part of the Piaggio empire, so you'd think it would have an engine from one of their other brands, not Yamaha/Minarelli. Not that there's anything wrong with the Y/M engine - it's a well proven design.    There's some speculation that Yamaha is thinking about bringing the SR back to the US. Cycle World spotted one with manufacturer's plates running around SoCal: http://www.cycleworld.com/2012/12/17/2012-yamaha-sr400-spied-in-the-us/ I love my '77 XT500 and would have to seriously think about buying a new SR if they do.   Charlie http://www.AntietamClassicCycle.com

--- On Sat, 12/22/12, Eric Todd <tros...@earthlink.net> wrote:

[Charles Mullendore]

Back when Husqvarna was owned by Cagiva, they built a few Mito 125s with a Husky big single shoehorned into them. Sounded like a great idea to me.   Charlie http://www.AntietamClassicCycle.com

[Alan Comfort]

Impressive sitting at the curb, but being seen off on the road by a 125cc Honda?? The less said about that, the better.
Alan in Vancouver

[Patrick Hayes]

On 1/26/2013 8:37 PM, Leif Mann wrote:
> 2 issues
>
> 1. I adjusted the valves on my '74 Civile today and set the
> clearances to the loose "italian" specs .10 and .20 mm. Boy the
> thing make a lot of noise now. Tick tick.
>
> I may go back and tighten the valves to the "english" specs of .10
> and .05.

Are you using mm or inch?

Exhaust gets hotter and parts expand more. Thus, exhaust requires the
larger of the two specs.

Why do you list .10 and .20 with small spec first
and then
list .10 and .05 with small spec second?

Please clarify where you got the specs.

The online manual says:
"Tappets (measure cold) Intake: 0.10mm .004 inch Exhaust: 0.20mm .008 inch"

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[Leif Mann]

  Yes, Im working with mm.

 

There's a discrepency in the published materials from Guzzi.  The English language manuals says  Inlet=  .05 mm, .002 inch  /  Exhaust = .10 mm, .004 inch.  On the other hand, the Italian  language manual says Inlet = .10 mm, .004 inch / Exhaust = .20 mm, .008 inch.

 

This has been discussed on other forum sites but nobody understands or explains the discrepency.

 

I just set mine to the wider "italian" specs.  The motor runs fine but it makes a bit of noise, even after warm-up. 

 

 

[Leif Mann]

Also, what about that kick-start return spring?

 

Mine is distorting over towadrs the drive chain and rubbing on it a little.  Is there anything that should be there to prevent this ?  I see nothing on parts fiche.

 

[Stephen Farthing]

Guys,

I think it is important to remember that these bikes, especially the older ones, were seldom  perfect when they left the factory. And many of them were sold to customers who lived in places where the quality of fuel differed widely. So settings and adjustment may well vary and what is in the manual is only guidance. The important thing is to set them up so they work for you. And most of them are pretty robust so a wrong setting will not kill the bike. It will either not run, or not run right. To get it to run right you need to understand how it works. 

I know I am a bit of an old hippy at heart but one book every motorcyclist should read from that era is "Zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance " by Robert Pirsig. You can learn a lot from reading that. I'll end with a little story. A friend of mine some years ago took a Royal Enfield 350 Bullet on a tour round India. He lost the nut that holds the swinging arm miles from anywhere. He pushed it to the nearest village there was no garage there or phone. But there was a Sikh blacksmith who said he would fix the bike and told him to go and find something to eat. When he came bask the blacksmith had made him a nut by hand, including filing the thread with a riffler file, not a tap. He did this by eye and it fitted. Those are the sort of skills that we seem to have lost in the west. When I used to take the V50 out on a long trip I always took some bailer wire and a couple of tie wraps with me just in case anything fell off!

Steve 

On 27 January 2013 12:28, Leif Mann <leaf...@gmail.com> wrote:

Also, what about that kick-start return spring?

 

Mine is distorting over towadrs the drive chain and rubbing on it a little.  Is there anything that should be there to prevent this ?  I see nothing on parts fiche.

 

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[DENIS BELOTTI]

Hi Patrick
I don't know if you remember me but I have finally got my Falcone back and
have been riding her about.
There is just 1 little problem, there is a minor oil leak ( I have attached
a photo ). I took it back to the mechanic and he says he wants to strip the
shaft behind the magneto, remove the shaft and machine a groove in it for an
o-ring and this should solve the problem. When he said he had to machine the
shaft, I switched off as I don't want to do anything like that.
Have you got any idea what could be causing the leak and do you need any
other pics?
Enjoying all the emails coming through.
Keep up the good work.
Regards
Denis Belotti

[Guzz...@aol.com]

You only have one little leak......? Good for you !

Isn't there supposed to be a felt washer behind the magneto gear where it sits in the groove of the housing? You could pull the mag off yourself & check then maybe apply some sealant.

 

,,,,,,,Tim

 

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[DENIS BELOTTI]

Haha. Only one.

Thanks for that. I will have a look.

Denis

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[Patrick Hayes]

On 02/14/2013 10:45 PM, DENIS BELOTTI wrote:
> I took it back to the mechanic and he says he wants
> to strip the shaft behind the magneto, remove the shaft and machine a
> groove in it for an o-ring and this should solve the problem.

I concur that I'd prefer to avoid any permanent, destructive change. I
suspect he intends to groove the face of the magneto body where it hits
the engine casting.

As Tim says, the back side of the mag gear is hollowed out and has two
little pointed pins. A thick felt disc goes in there. It is supposed
to occupy MOST of the space between the gear and the engine casting.
The felt captures loose oil and flings it centrifugally. Over time, the
felt wears and if it abuts the engine casting the casting also wears.
Thus, the space grows and the sealing becomes less efficient.

I bought some 1/4" Viton foam and made a 'donut' to fit around the boss
on the face of the mag body. That donut gets squished when I mount the
mag and provides the sealing.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[DENIS BELOTTI]

Much appreciated.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Hayes" <peh...@comcast.net>
To: <guzzi-...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 11:08 AM
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] FALCONE TOPICS

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[leafman60]

I've read someplace that the Nuovo Falcone Civile series shares the same gas tank as the V35-50 bikes.  But, when I look at the V35-50 series, those tanks have a noticeable crease along each side whereas the Civile tanks are smooth.

 

Is the Civile gas tank shared with another Guzzi model?

[hubert casanova]

> Is the Civile gas tank shared with another Guzzi model/

i dont think you will find that tank on anything but a falcone....

cheers,
Hubert

[hubert casanova]

oh , just noticed one on ebay.de for a pretty reasonable 105 euro

cheers,
Hubert

[leafman60]

That thing looks kinda rough !  Rusty.

[hubert casanova]

it wouldn't look out of place on my NF,
Italian chrome and paint jobs don't cope very well with my daily 50
miles going to work. minus 4 degrees this morning , I still enjoyed
the trip.
cheers,
Hubert

[leafman60]

Oh come on, Hubert !  You ride that thing to work everyday, even in -4 temps !!??

[leafman60]

Hey, you Falcone experts.  Please educate me about valves dropping out of NFalc heads and trashing the motors.  I've heard about it a little but there is a terrible picture posted over on our ADV thread.  Is the sky falling? Do these valves drop a lot ?  I thought these motors were more durable.

 

Check this -

 

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?p=20783163#post20783163

 

 

[hubert casanova]

On Fri, Feb 22, 2013 at 2:03 PM, leafman60 <leaf...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Oh come on, Hubert ! You ride that thing to work everyday, even in -4 temps
> !!??
>
>

i must confess i do, and have been doing for a couple of years.
it is the most reliable bike i own..
but last week i bought a guzzi lario project bike, with is supposed to
become my next winter ride.
the previous owner was a 16 year old boy , who had lots of fun
dismantling it and putting it back together again.
i even got a box of 'spare" parts he had leftover after he finished the build.

not surprisingly it doesnt run yet , "spare" parts include a wheel
spacer, clutch thrust bearing , etc.......
i will have to strip it , just to check his work. i have to adress the
valve problems anyway.

cheers,
Hubert

[Charles Mullendore]

-4 C = 25 F. Still bloody cold... Charlie http://www.AntietamClassicCycle.com

[hubert casanova]

That is the piston of my NF

in short problems are:
- the valve springs are way too strong
- valves are too heavy, and dubious quality
- camshaft is lubricated with oil from the pressure relieve valve ( so
no lubrication at tickover)
- oil pump wears out rapidly

solutions:
- fit softer springs
- fit valves with 8 mm stems
- i like to fit a bigger ( tonti twin) oil pump to solve the camshaft
lubrication issue

with these mods you've got a bullet proof engine..

cheers,
Hubert

[leafman60]

Lord lord lord.  Now I gotta worry about breaking down my virgin motor and changing the valves and oil pump.

 

I assume new valves also get hardened seats to handle unleaded gas ?

[hubert casanova]

On Fri, Feb 22, 2013 at 6:13 PM, leafman60 <leaf...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Lord lord lord. Now I gotta worry about breaking down my virgin motor and
> changing the valves and oil pump.
>
> I assume new valves also get hardened seats to handle unleaded gas ?
>
>

i didn't bother changing the seats , they seem to last pretty well.
you might get away with the old oil pump if it still is in good shape.

[hubert casanova]

i was writing this on advrider , might as well write it here instead:

any proper machine shop should be able to fit a couple of valves .
i ended up with home made guides, fiat ( truck) valves, enfield bullet
valve springs, retainers and collets , and ducati lash caps.

or you can buy the complete set from escher.

On Fri, Feb 22, 2013 at 6:13 PM, leafman60 <leaf...@hotmail.com> wrote:

[Gavin Bedggood]

The only problem I have had with mine was the exhaust SEAT coming lose.... ie so lose it was rattling when it ran...

 

I then had both seats replaced with lead free type and new valve guides made and 8mm stem valves put in... I think the guy used Le Mans parts for the springs and keepers....

 

Regards

Gavin

--

[leafman60]

LeMans springs and keepers ?  Which LeMans?

 

What about the seats?  What source?

[Gavin Bedggood]

Not sure which Le Mans, but he owned a Mk3 at the time he did the work...

I know the valves were 8mm stem blanks that he machined to length and machined the collet grove.

Seats me made and had them cut in place and he made the guides also.

 

The bike sounds and runs exactly the same as it did before the seat came out.

 

Not much help really!! :)

[leafman60]

I still wonder how prevalent this valve-breaking issue can be with this motor.

[Gavin Bedggood]

I always thought the main issue was the exhaust valve seat coming lose.... not valves breaking on their own.

The valves have 10mm stems so would not be easy to break...

 

I think the motors are generally very strong.

I also think that Mick the wa#^!r Walker did them no favors with his inaccurate comments on them in his books.

 

Regards

Gavin

Nuovo Falcone owner for 20 years

[leafman60]

I was looking at the terrible picture posted by Hubert over at ADV.  Looks like the valve head there.  Yes, maybe it just dropped and was chopped up by the piston.

 

If that is true, wouldnt just a better retainer be the solution?

[Charles Mullendore]

Like replacing chrome bore cylinders on Loopframe Guzzis, sometimes it's better to pre-emptively replace things before they cause serious damage. Or don't believe Hubert, an experienced owner, and run it to destruction... Charlie http://www.AntietamClassicCycle.com

[hubert casanova]

on my falcone it was just the valve head snapping off.
the damaged piston is the result of valve head rattling around in the
combustion chamber.
nothing wrong with the seat , i didnt need to change it, and it is
still in there 40.000 km after the blowup.

apparently the valve issue is lack of lubrication of the camshaft , so
the opening ramp wears away
as a result the valve is violently slammed open.
due to the vertical valve guide the exhaust valve guide hardly gets
any lubrication and wears out , causing the valve to slam on the seat
while it is not properly centered , causing a bending force on the
valve.
the guide was pretty worn when i had the valve snap.
all this together with heavy valves and way too strong valve springs,
something has to give.

( i am not making this up myself ,a couple of guys from the german
falcone club found all this out , i consider them the experts.
looking at what happened to my falcone , i think they might be right)


the valve seat issue is a different issue
some heads are soft , and deform under the head studs .
those are prone to have loose valve seats.
i have one of those heads too, it took ages to get it off the engine ,
the casting around the head stud had deformed to the point it closed
up on the threads.

now the biggest question, is your bike likely to have valve problems?
who knows?
personally, after having one of my engines blow up 200 km from home i
prefer to be cautious.
i enjoy riding my classics as much as i can , i have no use for a bike
wich i cant rely on.
i change valves and - springs on every falcone i work on.
if i end up throwing away 150 euro of perfectly good parts i consider
it a small price to pay for my peace of mind.
after the mods i consider the engine bulletproof , i dont hesitate to
ride it as fast as it will go.

cheers,
hubert

[Bill Irwin]

I had the head of a valve fall off too. The cause was a very worn valve
guide (due to miss-matched springs) which had been allowing the valve to
land off-square. With good valves, guides and springs it shouldn't be a
big risk.

Cheers Bill

On 25/02/13 11:28 AM25 , "hubert casanova" <hubert....@gmail.com>
wrote:

[Tony Lai]

Hi

I ha e been following this thread. I just rebuild my Nuovo engine and yes the valve guides were worn, worse on the inlet. I had thought it due to lack of oil going to the upper most part of the rocker box. I have fitted the extra oil feed to the inlet tapper cover.

I wonder if the engines mentioned has had this extra oil feed fitted ?

Regards
Tony
Sent from my iPad

[Bill Irwin]

Mine is a Dondolino head - open like the Superalce so no direct
lubrication to the guides.

[hubert casanova]

Hi Tony,

the extra oil feed to the head was a factory mod, my falcone had it fitted.
it helps for the inlet guide , but hardly for the exhaust.
i tried to make a oil feed to the exhaust guide , but never managed to
get the metering of the amount of oil sorted.
what guides did you use for the rebuild?
cheers,
Hubert

[Tony Lai]

Hi Hubert
I got the inlet oil feed from tml in Holland.  It comes with a metered jet.  I have taken it off with the engine running and it squirt plenty of oil out.  The feed come off the external oil line to the rocker box, without the metering jet the feed to the rocker shafts would be compromised. btw we replaced the bushes for the rocker shafts.  The oil then drain down to the bottom of the rocker box where the exhaust valve and guide sits, before draining via the external return pipe back into the sump.  I would have thought that the exhaust valve area would be plenty wet with oil and well lubricated.

The valve guide where made by a local firm in UK out of cast iron and pressed into place using the original 10mm valves and original seats.  Cast iron is quite good for valve guides as they appear to retain oil quite well.  The originals were brass.

We started the engine yesterday, it ran well after sorting the fueling and carb settings. It was very much quieter than before in the top end.  We also rebored the cylinder and replaced all bearings.

I have added you to my circle as friend where you can see pictures of my rebuild.

regards

tony

[Hubert Casanova]

Hi tony ,

i know the external oil feed mod.
with the exhaust guide being vertical , i cant see why oil would find
its way up to lubricate the valve.
i made a internal oil feed to the exhaust guide itself providing oil
to a tiny hole halfway down the guide.
but metering the amount of oil is tricky.

I make the guides myself out of cast iron too, seems to work better
than the original bronze guides.

cheers,
Hubert

[Tony Lai]

Hi Hubert

I see what you mean, yes it would be hard to imagine the oil finding
its way up hill up the guide. I presume you drill into the head then
through the cast iron guide to let oil get into the guide/valvestem
space. Its all getting a bit technical.

I don't have the tools or experience even to make and replace cast iron stems.

I do have an imaginative mind, do you suppose if the valve stem is
give a bit of rifling and the valve guide rifled in the opposite
direction, then the movement of the valve might pump oil up to
lubricate the guide/valvestem space? Or should the direction be the
same to encourage the valve to spin thus carrying oil upwards?

Perhaps a squirt of 2 stoke oil in the fuel ?

regards
tony

[leafman60]

I try to run a top-end lubricant in my fuel to replace the missing lead in the fuel.  This may help reduce friction on the valve seat but it should also lube the guide as well.

 

Hubert?

[leafman60]

 

What are existing opinions regarding fork springs for the N Falcone ?  Progressive ? Non-progressive ? 

[leafman60]

 

No advice on fork springs?