GL: Refuses Bridge Opening
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Ann Prete
Apr 7, 2017, 2:08:06 PM4/7/17
to Great American Loopers
Hello Fellow Mariners,
Yesterday on our return trip east from Lake Okechobee on St. Lucie waterway, the bridge attendant at Old Roosevelt Bascule Bridge Stuart FL refused to open the bridge then threatened to contact Coast Guard to fine us $5,000 because he felt we could clear the bridge.
Based on WWG stats clearance is 14 feet. Our boat air draft is 15 feet. There were two boats motoring east. A 40 foot main ship with about a 14 foot clearance and us. Since the main ship was lead boat he asked first and was refused. We then radioed requesting an opening. Bridge attendant responded with "what's your air draft clearance?" My husband said 15 feet. Bridge attendant said you can clear it. Bridge clearance is 15 feet. I then radioed back saying "board shows 10 feet at water line, no other posting on clearance, WWG says 14, our boat needs 15 feet, so you need to open the bridge!"
That's when things got ugly. He opened the bridge reluctantly but then began berating us with the intent of having us fined. Never in our 4 short years of requesting bridge openings have we encountered such arrogance and rudeness from a bridge attendant.
Once in port I called the Ft. Pierce Coast Guard Station asking if this was protocol. The officer I spoke with answer was "No." and if it should happen again to contact the Coast Guard on channel 16 to request assistance with bridge opening.
Just sharing an experience.
Ann
Sent from my iPad
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Yesterday on our return trip east from Lake Okechobee on St. Lucie waterway, the bridge attendant at Old Roosevelt Bascule Bridge Stuart FL refused to open the bridge then threatened to contact Coast Guard to fine us $5,000 because he felt we could clear the bridge.
Based on WWG stats clearance is 14 feet. Our boat air draft is 15 feet. There were two boats motoring east. A 40 foot main ship with about a 14 foot clearance and us. Since the main ship was lead boat he asked first and was refused. We then radioed requesting an opening. Bridge attendant responded with "what's your air draft clearance?" My husband said 15 feet. Bridge attendant said you can clear it. Bridge clearance is 15 feet. I then radioed back saying "board shows 10 feet at water line, no other posting on clearance, WWG says 14, our boat needs 15 feet, so you need to open the bridge!"
That's when things got ugly. He opened the bridge reluctantly but then began berating us with the intent of having us fined. Never in our 4 short years of requesting bridge openings have we encountered such arrogance and rudeness from a bridge attendant.
Once in port I called the Ft. Pierce Coast Guard Station asking if this was protocol. The officer I spoke with answer was "No." and if it should happen again to contact the Coast Guard on channel 16 to request assistance with bridge opening.
Just sharing an experience.
Ann
Sent from my iPad
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Michael Jurlina
Apr 7, 2017, 7:43:18 PM4/7/17
to Ann Prete, Great American Loopers
Wow, that's discouraging. Makes a fun trip a little bit disheartening.
Hope tomorrow is a better day!
Cheers!
Michael Jurlina
Captain, Boeing 777
American Airlines-DFW
214-695-1733
mkj...@flash.net
Hope tomorrow is a better day!
Cheers!
Michael Jurlina
Captain, Boeing 777
American Airlines-DFW
214-695-1733
mkj...@flash.net
Mary Taylor
Apr 7, 2017, 10:09:25 PM4/7/17
to Michael Jurlina, Great American Loopers, Ann Prete
That's not right and the Martin County transportation authority should
be made aware of. Hopefully the marine radio on the bridge is recorded.
be made aware of. Hopefully the marine radio on the bridge is recorded.
Randy Pickelmann via Great-Loop
Apr 8, 2017, 7:48:14 AM4/8/17
to annp...@gmail.com, great...@lists.trawlering.com
Hi Ann!
Don't take it personally and don't let it ruin your day. We've all been there!
Some of these guys are a bit power hungry. I had a similar conversation one day at Anna Maria Island. I asked him if he would assume responsibility for my boat if there was an accident. Of course he said no way. I told him OK, then open the damm bridge. I pointed out that because of people like me, people like him had a job. That probably didn't endear me to him but he opened the bridge while threatening to notify the CG. But it never happened.
At the end of the day it's your boat and your responsibility. Have fun and be safe!
Regards,
Randy Pickelmann
Morning Star-lying Sunset Bay Marina-Stuart, FL
Cool Change-hard aground in Thomaston, ME
www.CruisingMorningStar.com
Sent from my iPad
Don't take it personally and don't let it ruin your day. We've all been there!
Some of these guys are a bit power hungry. I had a similar conversation one day at Anna Maria Island. I asked him if he would assume responsibility for my boat if there was an accident. Of course he said no way. I told him OK, then open the damm bridge. I pointed out that because of people like me, people like him had a job. That probably didn't endear me to him but he opened the bridge while threatening to notify the CG. But it never happened.
At the end of the day it's your boat and your responsibility. Have fun and be safe!
Regards,
Randy Pickelmann
Morning Star-lying Sunset Bay Marina-Stuart, FL
Cool Change-hard aground in Thomaston, ME
www.CruisingMorningStar.com
Sent from my iPad
Michael Jurlina
Apr 8, 2017, 11:47:27 AM4/8/17
to Randy Pickelmann, great...@lists.trawlering.com, annp...@gmail.com
captnlen
Apr 8, 2017, 12:12:38 PM4/8/17
to great...@lists.trawlering.com
Many years ago I applied for a job as Bridge Tender. Won't list the
bridge is now a fixed span but the mechanism was in sorry shape. You had
to run up and down a rickety steep staircase during both opening and
closing to make a demand down at the mechanism and could not do the
whole operation from the control room. Was told was and danger because
if it malfunctioned you didn't know until you got back up to the
control and observed what the span was doing. You cautioned vessels to
wait for permission before entering the span area passage but as soon as
it started up someone would dash to be first not realizing the motion
could stop or reverse on its own and the tender was not at the controls.
There was over the years both boat damage and damage to the bridge
preventing passage for many days. Since it was the only bridge to a
large island if it had stopped open partially the issue would have been
major. After spending several shifts there with the experienced
operator, decided didn't need the stress or responsibility so
tenders can get frustrated too.
--
Capt.Len Susman Rtd
Trikini Trimarans
bridge is now a fixed span but the mechanism was in sorry shape. You had
to run up and down a rickety steep staircase during both opening and
closing to make a demand down at the mechanism and could not do the
whole operation from the control room. Was told was and danger because
if it malfunctioned you didn't know until you got back up to the
control and observed what the span was doing. You cautioned vessels to
wait for permission before entering the span area passage but as soon as
it started up someone would dash to be first not realizing the motion
could stop or reverse on its own and the tender was not at the controls.
There was over the years both boat damage and damage to the bridge
preventing passage for many days. Since it was the only bridge to a
large island if it had stopped open partially the issue would have been
major. After spending several shifts there with the experienced
operator, decided didn't need the stress or responsibility so
tenders can get frustrated too.
Capt.Len Susman Rtd
Trikini Trimarans
Kevin Redden
Apr 8, 2017, 5:03:31 PM4/8/17
to great...@lists.trawlering.com
About ten years ago, we had a new tender on a busy bridge in New Jersey. He
wouldn't answer radio calls from most recreational boats, just from
commercial ones, and when he did answer, he was nasty and refused openings
many times.
We took the audio output of a channel 13 receiver into the microphone input
to a PC, then used recording software to record and time stamp all received
transmissions. The resulting CD was sent to the district C.G. bridge office.
The C.G. got the bridge owner to correct the problem VERY quickly!
It's hard to argue with a photograph or a recording of the perp in action.
Kevin
wouldn't answer radio calls from most recreational boats, just from
commercial ones, and when he did answer, he was nasty and refused openings
many times.
We took the audio output of a channel 13 receiver into the microphone input
to a PC, then used recording software to record and time stamp all received
transmissions. The resulting CD was sent to the district C.G. bridge office.
The C.G. got the bridge owner to correct the problem VERY quickly!
It's hard to argue with a photograph or a recording of the perp in action.
Kevin
fr...@tug44.org
Apr 8, 2017, 5:18:10 PM4/8/17
to great...@lists.trawlering.com, Kevin Redden
Long long ago, one of Hackensack River bridge operators was known to sleep
on the job with his radio off ... so one of the tug captains rowed out
there late at night and shotgunned every light on the bridge ... and then
he rowed away into the night.
Service improved dramatically, though I don't recommend this technique.
:)
Decades later, I wound up on that same river with the same problems ...
so I did post all their phone numbers on my website. That helped.
Fred
Tug 44
----------------------------------------
From: "Kevin Redden" <kfre...@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2017 5:04 PM
To: great...@lists.trawlering.com
Subject: Re: GL: Refuses Bridge Opening
on the job with his radio off ... so one of the tug captains rowed out
there late at night and shotgunned every light on the bridge ... and then
he rowed away into the night.
Service improved dramatically, though I don't recommend this technique.
:)
Decades later, I wound up on that same river with the same problems ...
so I did post all their phone numbers on my website. That helped.
Fred
Tug 44
----------------------------------------
From: "Kevin Redden" <kfre...@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2017 5:04 PM
To: great...@lists.trawlering.com
Subject: Re: GL: Refuses Bridge Opening
Michael Jurlina
Apr 9, 2017, 3:47:34 PM4/9/17
to fr...@tug44.org, great...@lists.trawlering.com
Now that's the way to secure change!
Galen Johnston
Apr 10, 2017, 4:37:06 PM4/10/17
to Michael Jurlina, great...@lists.trawlering.com
Actually the tender can not refuse to open on demand or scheduled opening,
they can caution the boater if the USCG rules that you the boater could
have removed gear and cleared then a fine maybe issued and that fine can be
$25,000.00 dollars. The other side of the coin is if they refuse you the
boater an opening and the boater can not clear then then the authority of
that bride may receive that same fine, $25,000.00. It is a or either you
or the bridge. Once the complaint has been issued, by either party, then
USCG will review all evidence then will make a ruling one way or the
other. So bottom line for us boaters is to document everything and be
professional about it. This will serve your best interest. Make sure you
have a true request and you can not go wrong. Be safe out there!
--
Galen Johnston
Consultant
** Boating Education*
** **Instructional Design & Delivery*
** Power Systems*
they can caution the boater if the USCG rules that you the boater could
have removed gear and cleared then a fine maybe issued and that fine can be
$25,000.00 dollars. The other side of the coin is if they refuse you the
boater an opening and the boater can not clear then then the authority of
that bride may receive that same fine, $25,000.00. It is a or either you
or the bridge. Once the complaint has been issued, by either party, then
USCG will review all evidence then will make a ruling one way or the
other. So bottom line for us boaters is to document everything and be
professional about it. This will serve your best interest. Make sure you
have a true request and you can not go wrong. Be safe out there!
Galen Johnston
Consultant
** Boating Education*
** **Instructional Design & Delivery*
** Power Systems*
Ralph Yost
Apr 10, 2017, 6:44:33 PM4/10/17
to Galen Johnston, Michael Jurlina, great...@lists.trawlering.com
Does that legal situation apply to ALL bridges, or is that unique to bridges
over the ICW in which the USCG might have jurisdiction? What about
state-operated bridges (as are most) that are not over the ICW ?
R.
-----Original Message-----
From: Great-Loop [mailto:great-loo...@lists.trawlering.com] On Behalf
Of Galen Johnston
Actually the tender can not refuse to open on demand or scheduled opening,
they can caution the boater if the USCG rules that you the boater could have
removed gear and cleared then a fine maybe issued and that fine can be
$25,000.00 dollars. The other side of the coin is if they refuse you the
boater an opening and the boater can not clear then then the authority of
that bride may receive that same fine, $25,000.00. It is a or either you or
the bridge. Once the complaint has been issued, by either party, then USCG
will review all evidence then will make a ruling one way or the other. So
bottom line for us boaters is to document everything and be professional
about it. This will serve your best interest. Make sure you have a true
request and you can not go wrong. Be safe out there!
over the ICW in which the USCG might have jurisdiction? What about
state-operated bridges (as are most) that are not over the ICW ?
R.
-----Original Message-----
From: Great-Loop [mailto:great-loo...@lists.trawlering.com] On Behalf
Of Galen Johnston
Actually the tender can not refuse to open on demand or scheduled opening,
they can caution the boater if the USCG rules that you the boater could have
removed gear and cleared then a fine maybe issued and that fine can be
$25,000.00 dollars. The other side of the coin is if they refuse you the
boater an opening and the boater can not clear then then the authority of
that bride may receive that same fine, $25,000.00. It is a or either you or
the bridge. Once the complaint has been issued, by either party, then USCG
will review all evidence then will make a ruling one way or the other. So
bottom line for us boaters is to document everything and be professional
about it. This will serve your best interest. Make sure you have a true
request and you can not go wrong. Be safe out there!
Galen Johnston
Apr 10, 2017, 10:48:50 PM4/10/17
to Ra...@alphacompservices.com, great...@lists.trawlering.com
That I am not prepare a conclusive answer to all bridges. All the bridges
I deal with are, ICW, city, county, and Federal, which the Feds replaced
with 65 clearance fixed span. I thick the term they used is navigable
waters.
I deal with are, ICW, city, county, and Federal, which the Feds replaced
with 65 clearance fixed span. I thick the term they used is navigable
waters.
Sean Welsh
Apr 11, 2017, 1:05:08 AM4/11/17
to great...@lists.trawlering.com
All bridges on "the navigable waters of the United States." That happens
to include the ICW, which enjoys no other special distinction. The CG
does not operate bridges; they are all operated by state, county, city,
or private entities. All must comply with the CFRs.
-Sean
m/y Vector
lying New Orleans. LA
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com
On 04/10/2017 05:43 PM, Ralph Yost wrote:
> Does that legal situation apply to ALL bridges, or is that unique to bridges
> over the ICW in which the USCG might have jurisdiction? What about
> state-operated bridges (as are most) that are not over the ICW ?
>
to include the ICW, which enjoys no other special distinction. The CG
does not operate bridges; they are all operated by state, county, city,
or private entities. All must comply with the CFRs.
-Sean
m/y Vector
lying New Orleans. LA
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com
On 04/10/2017 05:43 PM, Ralph Yost wrote:
> Does that legal situation apply to ALL bridges, or is that unique to bridges
> over the ICW in which the USCG might have jurisdiction? What about
> state-operated bridges (as are most) that are not over the ICW ?
>
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