Re: [Golden-Cheetah-Users] ALERT: TrainingPeaks Sync Deprecates from December 7th

[Magnus Gille]

Were you able to get a key for their REST Api? I wouldn't mind porting our upload service to it. If you haven't I can reach out to TP and ask for keys/documentation. The SOAP API was pretty awful anyway.

I and others use GC but our coaches use TP so it would be really useful to still be able to upload data there.

Their stance on upload agent isn't hurting anyone but themselves.

On Sun, Nov 27, 2016 at 3:30 AM Mark Liversedge <liver...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

http://help.trainingpeaks.com/hc/en-us/articles/234441128-TrainingPeaks-API

As part of this change TrainingPeaks are also revoking read access to users data from GoldenCheetah (and many other tools and services).

They are happy for us to continue to support device download and file format conversion and upload to their service, but we will not play along. They have deprecated their own Device Agent preferring to push responsibility for device and file format support to us. They claim that this is because the FIT file format is now a de-facto standard and they no longer need to support new devices and file formats. Good luck with that.

I will no longer recommend any users pay for their closed service and will deprecate support on the 7th.

Mark

--
_______________________________________________
Golden-Cheetah-Users mailing list
golden-che...@googlegroups.com
http://groups.google.com/group/golden-cheetah-users?hl=en
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "golden-cheetah-users" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to golden-cheetah-u...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Mark Liversedge]

On Thu, 15 Dec, 2016 at 5:42 PM, Arlen Vartazarian <arlen.va...@gmail.com> wrote:

It would be tremendous if you can fix it.

You need to direct that to TrainingPeaks, they have revoked access.

Mark

[Arlen Vartazarian]

+1 / up vote

This functionality is something I rely on too :-)

It would be tremendous if you can fix it.

Thank you!

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to golden-cheetah-users+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

[Jan de Visser]

And reading between Mark's lines I think his stance is that even if there are
hacks that would make uploading possible, he's philosophically opposed to
being complicit in having your data held hostage in TrainingPeaks walled
garden, however verdant that garden may be.

And if you allow me my soapbox for a moment: I wholeheartedly agree. Your data
is your own, just as much as your bike, your bibshorts, and your computer are.
One of the challenges of computing in this age is making sure that one's data
remains one's own, and it not kept somewhere from where it cannot be
extricated.

In addition to that TP cynically dropped support for device communication,
basically telling other systems to do that finnicky work for them after which
they can upload the data to them without being able to download it. Not nice.

[Arlen Vartazarian]

Got a reply from TP support. They are citing security as the reason forvthe change. Please let me know if it's bollocks and I'll follow up.

Aaron Calhoun (TrainingPeaks Help Center)

Dec 16, 2:19 PM MST

Hi Arlen,

Thanks for the email. Due to security reasons we updated our API that is used to send data to third party apps and websites. Unfortunately this means that sites and apps that aren't connected to our new API will no longer be able to receive data from TrainingPeaks. I apologize for the inconvenience.

Tailwinds,

Aaron Calhoun
Customer Success Manager

[Mark Liversedge]

On Saturday, 17 December 2016 11:41:30 UTC, Arlen Vartazarian wrote:

Got a reply from TP support. They are citing security as the reason forvthe change. Please let me know if it's bollocks and I'll follow up.

I would ask how WKO4 avoids this "security" issue?

Mark 

[Arlen Vartazarian]

Well obviously!

Aaron Calhoun (TrainingPeaks Help Center)

Dec 19, 10:50 AM MST Hello Arlen, Since WKO+ is directly associated with TrainingPeaks the software was updated to sync with our new api. Since Golden Cheetah software is a third party program and not associated with TrainingPeaks they have not updated their software for our new api. Tailwinds, Aaron Calhoun

On 17 Dec 2016 11:50, "Mark Liversedge" <liver...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, 17 December 2016 11:41:30 UTC, Arlen Vartazarian wrote:

Got a reply from TP support. They are citing security as the reason for the change. Please let me know if it's bollocks and I'll follow up.

I would ask how WKO4 avoids this "security" issue?

Mark 

--
_______________________________________________
Golden-Cheetah-Users mailing list

golden-cheetah-users@googlegroups.com
http://groups.google.com/group/golden-cheetah-users?hl=en
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "golden-cheetah-users" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/golden-cheetah-users/I5Qa1IUV4Q8/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to golden-cheetah-users+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

[Mark Liversedge]

Must think their customers are idiots.

Mark

On Monday, 19 December 2016 21:31:34 UTC, Arlen Vartazarian wrote:

Well obviously!

[Arlen Vartazarian]

LoL swings and roundabouts mate....

I don't really wanna have a mud-wrestle with them. Something tells me they might enjoy it more.

So I take it that you won't be rewriting the synchronisation using their new REST api?

Rest/Soap and security debate aside, I was never a fan of TP and the only reason I subscribed was the mobile app which leads me to the next question:

- Will you ever bring out a mobile version of GC? I don't think I'm alone in saying that we will happily pay for the product :-)

[Mark Liversedge]

Their REST api is upload only, so no we won't be supporting it.

We're more likely to create a generic web page chart to access things like Garmin Connect, TrainingPeaks etc.

Because we can intercept file download, we will import activity files when you click 'Download'. That would work with premium and normal users too, so no need to pay for their service to get your data.

We are adding functionality for web based training applications that do offer full APIs, Damien is working on that, and will include things like Today's Plan and SixCycle as well as the services already supported.

Mark

[Arlen Vartazarian]

That ace! Thanks Mark and co for a stellar job so far. Looking forward to the new features.

--


_______________________________________________


Golden-Cheetah-Users mailing list

golden-che...@googlegroups.com

http://groups.google.com/group/golden-cheetah-users?hl=en


---


You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "golden-cheetah-users" group.


To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/golden-cheetah-users/I5Qa1IUV4Q8/unsubscribe.

To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to golden-cheetah-u...@googlegroups.com.

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

-Arlen- +4474 9498 2252

[Scott Manning]

http://help.trainingpeaks.com/hc/en-us/articles/234441128-TrainingPeaks-API

As part of this change TrainingPeaks are also revoking read access to users data from GoldenCheetah (and many other tools and services).

They are happy for us to continue to support device download and file format conversion and upload to their service, but we will not play along. They have deprecated their own Device Agent preferring to push responsibility for device and file format support to us. They claim that this is because the FIT file format is now a de-facto standard and they no longer need to support new devices and file formats. Good luck with that.

I will no longer recommend any users pay for their closed service and will deprecate support on the 7th.

Mark

So DL from TP is now broken and won't be fixed. Right?

Since my coach useing TP, I am obligated to upload there and do so via Garmin Connect which automatically pushes it to them. Is there a way to download from Garmin Connect or do I have to manually take the data from the garmin to GC in addition to uploading to connect?

Thanks
Scott

[Mark Liversedge]

On Friday, 27 January 2017 06:57:55 UTC, Scott Manning wrote:

http://help.trainingpeaks.com/hc/en-us/articles/234441128-TrainingPeaks-API

As part of this change TrainingPeaks are also revoking read access to users data from GoldenCheetah (and many other tools and services).

They are happy for us to continue to support device download and file format conversion and upload to their service, but we will not play along. They have deprecated their own Device Agent preferring to push responsibility for device and file format support to us. They claim that this is because the FIT file format is now a de-facto standard and they no longer need to support new devices and file formats. Good luck with that.

I will no longer recommend any users pay for their closed service and will deprecate support on the 7th.

Mark

So DL from TP is now broken and won't be fixed. Right?

It is not broken, it has been revoked by TrainingPeaks, an important distinction.

 

Since my coach useing TP, I am obligated to upload there and do so via Garmin Connect which automatically pushes it to them. Is there a way to download from Garmin Connect or do I have to manually take the data from the garmin to GC in addition to uploading to connect?

Garmin Connect charge $5k for access to their API, we don't want to pay for that.

In addition, they have instructed us to avoid using their older API.

You should look at Tapirik, it uses the older API to sync and download .............

Mark 

[Peter]

I disagree with this statement:

"Their stance on upload agent isn't hurting anyone but themselves."

It hurts TP customers! 

If you are a TP customer then trying to keep your files in GC and share files with your coach is a real hassle now.

This change has put me in a difficult position of either moving off GC which isn't going to happen because it's a really nice app, or moving off TP because of the hassle factor.  I'm watching the market and as soon as a TP competitor emerges that has what I need to allow both GC and easy sharing with my coach then I'm leaving TP.  I really don't want to do this but TP is forcing me a 10 year customer to leave them.

-Peter

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to golden-cheetah-users+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

[Will]

Maybe Velohero has the features you want? There are other services as well that interface with GC. Or you could sync via Dropbox or Google drive and your coach could access directly via GC.

[Mark Liversedge]

On Tuesday, 11 April 2017 16:14:04 UTC+1, Peter wrote:

I disagree with this statement:

"Their stance on upload agent isn't hurting anyone but themselves."

It hurts TP customers! 

If you are a TP customer then trying to keep your files in GC and share files with your coach is a real hassle now.

This change has put me in a difficult position of either moving off GC which isn't going to happen because it's a really nice app, or moving off TP because of the hassle factor.  I'm watching the market and as soon as a TP competitor emerges that has what I need to allow both GC and easy sharing with my coach then I'm leaving TP.  I really don't want to do this but TP is forcing me a 10 year customer to leave them.

-Peter

TrainingPeaks are making noises that they want to be open, if they open up their API we will be happy to support them.

On the other hand, TodaysPlan are currently doing well picking up a lot of their customers, including Sky and Trek.

In 3.5 we have added sync for most of the major players and continue to add more (I'm working on SportTracks and Damien is doing Strava, Joern is on a secret-mission that might turn out to be rather cool indeed).

Mark 

[Chris Aitken]

 
From what I can see the API is open. Other programs & apps are using it, such as Tapiriik and Garmin (for pulling workouts from TP to Watches/Headunits).

Has anyone from the GoldenCheetah project filled in the API access application on the TP website? I am happy to do this if needed.

TP sync was great, now the workflow is clunky and a pain.

[Mark Liversedge]

On Tuesday, 11 April 2017 18:30:21 UTC+1, Chris Aitken wrote:

From what I can see the API is open. Other programs & apps are using it, such as Tapiriik and Garmin (for pulling workouts from TP to Watches/Headunits). 

I'm pretty sure. Here is the response I got from Ben Pryoda at TrainingPeaks on 19th November 2016:

"Device Agent is being retired because it is obsolete. Devices and apps push directly to TrainingPeaks right now, and with the acceptance of .FIT as the defacto standard we have not needed to add support for a new file format in over five years.

File:write is the only scope that I can offer Golden Cheetah at this time. Let me know what you decide. "

When I asked if this was closing to all 3rd party services and applications except WKO4 (which is against EU competition law) I received the following from Ben, on 29th November:

"No 3rd party services have been granted permission to access activity data stored in TrainingPeaks. You have been provided the complete documentation for our new API, and can see that the new API does not support the functionality in question. Golden Cheetah has been offered the same API access as everyone else."

I've seen recent blogposts on the tp website saying they will open up again in the future. If and when they do, I'd be happy to add support again. For now, we are where we are. 

The blogpost is here: https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/an-update-on-trainingpeaks-partner-api/

The link in the blogpost to the public API is still a closed ecosystem.

We wait to see what they do, if they open up, we'll add support.

Regards,

Mark

[Chris Aitken]

Thanks for the response Mark.
TP's blog entry seems to suggest that read access can be gained, as does the API info page:

In terms of openness are you waiting until anyone can use the API without applying for use, or does open mean R&W access? It seems that TP sync is still a clear advantage for many GC users. Again, I am happy to submit a request to TP for the project.

[Mark Liversedge]

On Wednesday, 12 April 2017 09:43:31 UTC+1, Chris Aitken wrote:

Thanks for the response Mark.
TP's blog entry seems to suggest that read access can be gained, as does the API info page:

The workouts they refer to are not activity data, they are planned activities.

Mark