Pool swim workout import

[Francisco Rodríguez]

Hi,

Sorry if this has been discussed, before, but I made a search and could not find an answer to my problem.

I am trying to correctly import my pool swim workouts, but keep on getting wrong data. Time moving, distance (seems to count kms instead of m.), avg. speed and pace, they are all wrong in the summary view, xpace is also wrong, and swimscore value is 0 for all imported workouts.

Also, and depending on the workout, I get weird or normal speed graphs as seen in the images below (all graphs with smoothing=0) (missing cadence blocks in the second one are for drills)




Maybe it has to do with the way the Garmin 920xt records data, but I would like to know about how anyone else is doing this, as apparently I am doing somenthing wrong.

Any help will be greatly appreciated, thanks!!!

[Ale Martinez]

To import pool swimming workouts you need:

1) Use one of the supported formats: .tcx exported from Garmin Connect or .pwx exported from TP / converted from .fit using Device Agent.

2) Enable Garmin Smart Recording on Golden Cheetah preferences with threshold 25-30" or higher previous to import the files: https://github.com/GoldenCheetah/GoldenCheetah/wiki/UG_Preferences_General

For SwimScore and Swim Pace Zones you also need:

3) Define CV swim pace from a date previous to any swim workout: https://github.com/GoldenCheetah/GoldenCheetah/wiki/UG_Preferences_Athlete_Training-Zones#pace-zones-from-v32-on

[Francisco Rodríguez]

Thanks Ale, I really appreciate your support!

1) I was exporting TCX from Sporttracks, will use Garmin connect from now on.
2) OK, done that. One concern here. Does this impact run/bike imports??
3) I had a defined value already. Just typed another one and now I have Swimscore values.

All is good now, thanks!!!

[Ale Martinez]

El miércoles, 11 de noviembre de 2015, 19:22:21 (UTC-3), Francisco Rodríguez escribió:

1) I was exporting TCX from Sporttracks, will use Garmin connect from now on.

If you send me or post here the .tcx files for the same workout exported from Garmin Connect and SportTracks I could give it a look to see if we could support the ones from ST

 

2) OK, done that. One concern here. Does this impact run/bike imports??

If they have no gaps it does nothing, otherwise it interpolates up to the threshold duration and fill with zeros for longer gaps, which is preferred to have gaps IMHO.

[Francisco Rodríguez]

Ale, thanks again!

you can find attached my practice swim from today, as recorded in a Garmin 920xt and exported from Garmin connect, SportTracks and the SportTracks Mobi website

I hope this helps,

Fran

[Francisco Rodríguez]

Sorry, wrong Garmin connect file. MAybe I should workout a bit less :-)

The correct file:

[Francisco Rodríguez]

Ok, so I downloaded the last files and still see some issues:

1: no cadence graph when I import from Garmin Connect
2: high values at the end of intervals and wrong interval detection. see the GC and Garmin Connect  (below) images of today practice for comparison:
(I imagine it has to do with the Smart recording threshold...

[Ale Martinez]

Cadence is not included in that .tcx file and in some laps the last length comes in the pause instead of inside the lap, I'm afraid there is no much we can do with that file...

Can you upload the original .fit? I have an initial implementation of direct import and I would like to test this case.

[Francisco Rodríguez]

Here you go:

[Ale Martinez]

Francisco, I've found your .tcx exported from SportTracks looks pretty reasonable when imported to GC having Smart Recording enabled, it includes cadence but it doesn't have lap information.

WRT to the FIT file I can import it to v3.3 development, it look like this:

I hope to include this for RC2.

El viernes, 13 de noviembre de 2015, 5:08:01 (UTC-3), Francisco Rodríguez escribió:

Here you go:

[art...@gmail.com]

Hi Ale,

I did the first direct import of a .fit swim in 3.3 RC1. I imported an existing activity I imported before as.tcx exported from connect. I see two almost complete different calculations if I compare these two imports. SwimScore has a gap of almost 10 from .fit (67) to .tcx (76). The calculation of xpace and swim power of al laps are higher calculated at .tcx. I know .tcx rounds the seconds but such a big different in calculation? I tried this with a couple of .fit files a have and it was always the same result. Can you explain or do you have an idea what is going on there?

One note to the laps of swim and run activities. Have you seen that intervals overlap? E.g. Intervall1 stops at 600 and Intervall2 starts at 600. In bike activies intervall1 stops at 600 and intervall2 starts at 601! Is this by intention?

cheers
Andy

[Ale Martinez]

Andy, direct FIT import is not complete in RC1, there is an update pending which didn't make the cut for RC1 (https://github.com/GoldenCheetah/GoldenCheetah/pull/1664) to fix problems when importing from 920xt and there is some issues with interval alignment, anyway if you can upload a couple of these files (the .fit and the corresponding .tcx) they would be useful for debugging purposes.

[art...@gmail.com]

Hi Ale,

ok understood. Thanks for the info. I attached both files of my todays swim workout. If you need more, let me know it, please.

cheers
Andy 

[Portaner]

Hello Ale,
I have also a problem with intervalls in the FIT file (from my garmin Swim). For your debugging I upload two swim workouts for you. There are also screenshots from garmin connect from the workout.

1. swim workout :
GarminConnect_02_11_2015_2.jpg
GarminConnect_02_11_2015_2.jpg
activity_945481761.tcx
2015-11-02 16_39_56_0000_11.fit

2. swim workout :
GarminConnect_05_11_2015_2.jpg
GarminConnect_05_11_2015_2.jpg
activity_948233867.tcx
2015-11-05 18_35_56_0000_13.fit


Another prolem between the TCX and FIT import, is the field "Sport". When I import the TCX file, than is in the sports field "Swim" (GC_Sport.jpg), that is ok. By the import from the FIT file, this field is empty.

Hopefully I can help you with it.

Best regard
Jörg

[Ale Martinez]

Andy, I think I've fixed the problem that caused the lower xPace for the fit file, the change will be included in RC2.

[Ale Martinez]

Hi Jörg, thanks for the Garmin Swim files and complementary info, I've changed the sport detection code and it will work with these files in RC2, although there still remain some lap alignment issues with Garmin Swim and 920x files, mostly 1-sec displacement in some intervals/pauses which don't change the metrics but they are annoying anyway.

[art...@gmail.com]

Hi Ale,

do you refer here to the overlap of intervalls I mentioned before? I think I know were it come from but I am quit sure it is at Garmin side. From my point of view it depends if the intervalls stopped manual or automatic! I have some intervall trainings in my 910XT for running (e.g. 12x200 meters) and if I do such a training, the interval haven´t the overlapping issue. If I do a "free" training and stop manual they have. I checked also my bike activities and it is the same with a Edge500. It looks like Garmin stops intervalls a second earlier if you run a saved training programm. If I have a look into the trainings and I did e.g 6x1Min I got just 6x 0:59 seconds! It is the same if I look on that training on Garmin Connect. Swim workouts have the overlap always, because you have to stop them manually, at bike and run workouts,it´s depends!

cheers
Andy

[Ale Martinez]

Andy, it is an alignment problem, for example a 300m interval followed by a pause interval is shown as a 299m interval followed by a 1m interval, I've seen this behavior with some Garmin Swim and 920xt FIT files, but not with 910xt files yet.

[art...@gmail.com]

Hi Ale,

ok thanks for answer. I can see this currently in my .fit imports from my 910XT. I imported some of my older swim .fit and see exactly what you described.
For info if you haven´t seen this. I have some intervalls with start a second before the pause intervall ends!
E.g.
Intervall pause: start 912 - stop 959
Intervall 50m:   start 958 - stop 984

also the intervalls doesn´t end to a complete swim lap. Means if I did a lap of 50 meters, distance shows something like 0.048913 not 0.5.

cheers
Andy

[Portaner]

Hello Ale,
in the GC V3.3-RC2 my problem with the FIT-file (from 2.11.2015 and 5.11.2015) are ok. Thank you very much.

Yet, I have a spezial problem with my garmin swim. At the beginning of my workout, I set the garmin to "drill", start the training a stopped after the "drill" and input manuel the swim length of 600m and yet start the "right training". At the beginning is a quite larger displacement inside. Sometime but this is gone. In the TCX-File is this not, only in the FIT-File.

1. swim workout :
GarminConnect_11_11_2015_1.jpg
GarminConnect_11_11_2015_2.jpg
GC_11_11_2015_TCX.jpg
GC_11_11_2015_1_FIT.jpg
GC_11_11_2015_2_FIT.jpg
activity_2015_11_11.tcx
2015_11_11.fit

2. swim workout :
GarminConnect_16_11_2015_1.jpg
GarminConnect_16_11_2015_2.jpg
GC_16_11_2015_1_TCX.jpg
GC_16_11_2015_2_TCX.jpg
GC_16_11_2015_FIT.jpg
activity_2015_11_16.tcx
2015_11_16.fit

Best regard
Jörg

P.S.: In my workout (from 2.11.2015 and 5.11.2015) I don't use the garmin funktion "drill"

[Ale Martinez]

El domingo, 22 de noviembre de 2015, 14:05:18 (UTC-3), Portaner escribió:

Hello Ale,
in the GC V3.3-RC2 my problem with the FIT-file (from 2.11.2015 and 5.11.2015) are ok. Thank you very much.

Nice, thanks for the feedback! 

Yet, I have a spezial problem with my garmin swim. At the beginning of my workout, I set the garmin to "drill", start the training a stopped after the "drill" and input manuel the swim length of 600m and yet start the "right training". At the beginning is a quite larger displacement inside. Sometime but this is gone. In the TCX-File is this not, only in the FIT-File.

Very useful report, I've changed FIT and TCX lap swimming import to support drill mode in Garmin Swim for the next RC/release version, in PWX format it works without changes.

[Portaner]

Hi Ale,
so, I have RC3 installed and I see the "Drill" in the FIT File yet. This was the small problem, the biggest problem I see is the offset from the Intervall lines. At the beginning of the workout there is a offset. Time later, the offset becomes smaller, more time later there is no offset, than is all ok. The Intervall lines in the TCX File ok. I find the FIT curve in the Intervall better than the TCX curve, so I want better work with the FIT File.

Best regards,
Jörg

[Portaner]

Hi Ale,
the problem is only by my training with "drill", my other training without "drill" have not offset in the Intervall lines, this display from FIT-Files are ok.

Best regards
Jörg

[Ale Martinez]

Hi Jörg, thanks for your feedback!

In the TCX file format the structure practically warrants intervals alignment, in the FIT case Length and Lap messages are independent but carry time-stamps, which in these files are misaligned as far as I can understand, so I have no solution at hand for this issue.

As a workaround you could change interval alignment using "Edit Interval" in the Intervals sidebar menu or, in the future, end the session after the drill portion and start a new one to avoid the issue, then you can merge the two sessions in GC using Activities>Combine Activities...

Cheers, Ale.

[Ale Martinez]

For those still having problems importing .fit lap swimming files in v3.3 an alternative to the TCX export from Garmin Connect, which doesn't carry cadence, is to convert the .fit files to .pwx format which has cadence and correct lap alignment, the procedure is:

1) install Device Agent (free download from http://help.trainingpeaks.com/hc/en-us/articles/204073094-Device-Agent) to convert .fit lap swimming files to .pwx format locally, it allow multiple file conversion and it doesn't requires a TP account nor to be online.

2) import the .pwx files from DA output folder to GC, this can be done manually or automated using the AutoImport feature, see at the bottom of https://github.com/GoldenCheetah/GoldenCheetah/wiki/UG_Preferences_Athlete for details.

[Serban Mestecaneanu]

Ale, do you think your suggestion will work with FIT files from Garmin with HR data? The HR data from Fenix 3 with their swim strap I know that it is coded at the end of the fit file. My question, will this conversion bring the HR data in the end?

Many thanks,

Serban

[Ale Martinez]

No, HR from HRM Swim/Tri is not currently supported, but the other data (speed/cadence/distance/laps) is available for these files.