Suddenly, my VIT of 120 is 2181, even after replacing almost everything

[Gadget Lust]

Hi:

Last week it rained heavily, and my working GOES-16 receiving system suddenly starting giving me VIT's in the 2200 range.  Thinking I fried my LNA (which wasn't well protected) I ordered another.  No luck.  I rebuilt my PI 3 times taking care to install GOES tools each time.  No help. 

I also ordered another SDR at the same time (though I have others) on the off chance the noolelec SDR also fried.  Also no luck.

I have pointed and repointed and checked the dish, and I can see signals in SDR Console from this same system - I can see the EMWIN carrier and strong signals from the HRIT side of things.  I also spared in my Airspy R2, and same high VIT with a new message that said "phase flip detected from LRIT 180 deg to HRIT 180 deg", which I don't understand.

My only other idea is something wrong with the feed that's causing distortion that GOESRCV sees but I don't. 

Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks.

[Pieter Noordhuis]

Hey,

Can you confirm that the LNA is powered in your new setup, when running goesrecv? The phase flip message happens when the packetizer cannot synchronize with the packet stream. The synchronizer tries to correlate the bitstream with any of 4 synchronization words (LRIT at 0 degrees, LRIT at 180 degrees, HRIT at 0 degrees, HRIT at 180 degrees). For a perfect signal, it will find one of the sync words to be equal to the bits in the bitstream. As the signal deteriorates, a few bits might be flipped. As the signal deteriorates more (or if you're receiving noise), it may correlate best with any of the 4 synchronization words, and flip from packet to packet.

Seeing the message is a confirmation that you're not locking on to the signal. Can you share more output from goesrecv? I expect the frequency offset to drift around as well, if the signal is bad coming into goesrecv.

Cheers,

Pieter

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[Gadget Lust]

Hi Pieter,

Yes, the preamp is getting power over coax, and I can see signals on an SDR software on the same Pi in the GOES frequency.   I moved the preamp inside today next to the SDR in case we had voltage sag over coax, but it made no difference. 

I have this morning tried the USA Satcom software suite with the same RF path, and my Vi is 35 and sig quality is 97.5% with that software.  I am receiving images and all products fine with that. Difference is the software and not using my Pi4 (I spared out three Pi4's during troubleshooting, by the way).  GOEStools worked beautifully for a solid week and then refused to report signal, even when there.  Could this be an issue with an update?

Thanks,

Bob

Sent from my iPad

On Nov 15, 2020, at 3:56 AM, Pieter Noordhuis <pcnoo...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Pieter Noordhuis]

Hey,

Really, really odd. Can you post how you're running goesrecv, what its output it (the first 10 lines or so), and a copy of the configuration file? Perhaps there was an update and your configuration file got overwritten?

Cheers,

Pieter

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/goestools-users/C6919587-8FF3-4C0E-8EE6-99F97C60F3D6%40gmail.com.

[Gadget Lust]

Hi Pieter:  Sorry for the long delay - had a family emergency I needed to tend to.  Here is my GOES Tools config, and two screenshots - one of Cubic SDR showing the SDR in operation and receiving a good signal from GOES-16, the other the output when I start GOESRCV.  I am also including my config file as requested.  Any help appreciated. 

[Pieter Noordhuis]

Hey,

Thanks for the info.

Two things stand out to me:

1. The gain value of 5 (which seems low), you could try increasing that. 

2. The bias_tee = false. Presumably you're using an LNA right behind your antenna. How is it powered? If you power it through the SDR, bias_tee must equal true.

If those are fine, I don't know what else could be the issue here... The signal in the waterfall looks fine.

Cheers,

Pieter

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[gadge...@gmail.com]

Hi Peter:

 

5 is the recommended gain for the Nooelect Smarttee, and it worked fine with good signals and low vi till it didn't.  I have tried raising it as high as 30, with no difference.  The gain of 5 was the setting you saw on the waterfall image as well.

 

Bias_tee false is for this Nooelec SDR because it has an always-on hardwired Bia-tee, so it makes no difference what it is set for.  I had confirmed that when the system was working properly.

 

Thanks for the comments.  I am at a loss myself.  I have tried multiple RPI's and spared out everything in the signal chain but the dish itself, and it will not work anymore with GOES Tools.  It works just fine with other software, just not GOES Tools, and I regret that.

 

Thanks for all your help.

 

Regards,

 

Bob

 

From: goestoo...@googlegroups.com <goestoo...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Pieter Noordhuis
Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 1:42 PM
To: goestoo...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [goestools-users] Suddenly, my VIT of 120 is 2181, even after replacing almost everything

 

Hey,

 

Thanks for the info.

 

Two things stand out to me:

1. The gain value of 5 (which seems low), you could try increasing that. 

2. The bias_tee = false. Presumably you're using an LNA right behind your antenna. How is it powered? If you power it through the SDR, bias_tee must equal true.

 

If those are fine, I don't know what else could be the issue here... The signal in the waterfall looks fine.

 

Cheers,

Pieter

 

On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 2:24 AM Gadget Lust <gadge...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Pieter:  Sorry for the long delay - had a family emergency I needed to tend to.  Here is my GOES Tools config, and two screenshots - one of Cubic SDR showing the SDR in operation and receiving a good signal from GOES-16, the other the output when I start GOESRCV.  I am also including my config file as requested.  Any help appreciated. 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/goestools-users/CANZUNC_4fuL1AE4wOxg85LVRAS_eX%3DVaYTmjBXr-Bc8%2BU3fnFQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[Pieter Noordhuis]

Could you send a raw I/Q dump my way? I'm happy to check it out and see if anything comes to mind.

I think you should be able to run the following command to get a 10 second dump:

rtl_sdr -f 1694100000 -s 2000000 -g 5 -n 20000000 goes.raw

Cheers,

Pieter

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/goestools-users/002a01d6c293%24f020c9b0%24d0625d10%24%40gmail.com.

[Don Wade]

I’m not 100% up to speed in goes-world, but Bob, can you describe your cabling?

Antenna goes hard into LNA? No? It goes from Antenna thru cable to lna? LNA is direct connected to SDR? No, there’s another cable etc ?

On Nov 24, 2020, at 2:05 PM, Pieter Noordhuis <pcnoo...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[gadge...@gmail.com]

Hi Don:

 

Antenna pigtail connects to LNA which is powered over Coax, which connects to the other end of the LNA, which is connected on the other end to a SDR with Bias tee on.  All works with another GOES program, and I can see the signal on the Rpi using Cubic SDR.  I don't think this is a problem in the RF chain, but a software issue of some type.

 

Thanks,

 

Bob

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[Phil Biehl]

Bob,

Did you ever get a resolution to this problem? Suddenly I too have the same issue with my setup.

Thanks,

Phil

[Gadget Lust]

Not yet Phil.  I owe an IQ capture to Pieter which I have not done due to holidays at this end.  Same issues?

Bob Harvey

Sent from mobile

On Nov 30, 2020, at 10:50 AM, Phil Biehl <fylb...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Phil Biehl]

Bob,

Yes, it would appear to be so. Its been working fine for a few months now with VITs between 100-200 but its suddenly now acting as if there was no signal with VITs in the 2100 range. I wanted to see if there was a resolution to this problem before I go digging into the hardware. On the roof. In winter. Ugh.

 

Please keep us posted on your progress?

 

Thanks,

Phil

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[Gadget Lust]

Sure will.  I would make sure your signal chain is still good on cubic SDR or some other software to make sure you truly don't have a failure in the RF chain.

Regards,

Bob Harvey 

Sent from my iPad

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[Gadget Lust]

Here you go Pieter.  I had to change the gain to 6 to get above what "5" gave me which for some reason defaulted to 4.  This ended up being at 6.5 DB gain, which I checked and was still seeing the bird before and after this test.

I have uploaded the file to here.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/5kplnxpessz7c5l/AABaIuKeY09zGzCwWe2P6M0ea?dl=0

Thanks,

Bob

[Pieter Noordhuis]

Hey Bob,

I fed the file through a GNU Radio script to see if I can reproduce the signal you're seeing in Cubic, but no such luck. See attached screenshots for what I see here.

There must be some difference between the Cubic settings and the RTL SDR defaults. Could you share any Cubic settings? Perhaps something stands out...

In any case, I'm not surprised goestools doesn't see a signal, because I'm not seeing it either on the raw I/Q dump.

Cheers,

Pieter

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/goestools-users/ff1fff8e-58a4-47cc-9606-0594e63d2b2fn%40googlegroups.com.

[Phil Biehl]

Hmmm. Since there’s now 3 of us that are having trouble with this, does it mean there a problem at the bird? Anyone else successfully capturing and decoding?

Phil

Be kind. Do good work. Save the planet.

On Dec 1, 2020, at 11:18 AM, Pieter Noordhuis <pcnoo...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[tom]

I'm receiving and saving images fine, and have been.

Tom

>> pcnoo...@gmail.com <mailto:pcnoo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Could you send a raw I/Q dump my way? I'm happy to check it
>> out and see if anything comes to mind.
>>
>> I think you should be able to run the following command to get
>> a 10 second dump:
>>
>> rtl_sdr -f 1694100000 -s 2000000 -g 5 -n 20000000 goes.raw
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Pieter
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 7:59 PM <gadge...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>

>> Hi Peter:____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> 5 is the recommended gain for the Nooelect Smarttee, and
>> it worked fine with good signals and low vi till it
>> didn't.  I have tried raising it as high as 30, with no
>> difference.  The gain of 5 was the setting you saw on the

>> waterfall image as well.____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> Bias_tee false is for this Nooelec SDR because it has an
>> always-on hardwired Bia-tee, so it makes no difference
>> what it is set for.  I had confirmed that when the system

>> was working properly.____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> Thanks for the comments.  I am at a loss myself.  I have
>> tried multiple RPI's and spared out everything in the
>> signal chain but the dish itself, and it will not work
>> anymore with GOES Tools.  It works just fine with other

>> software, just not GOES Tools, and I regret that.____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Thanks for all your help.____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Regards,____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Bob____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> *From:* goestoo...@googlegroups.com
>> <goestoo...@googlegroups.com> *On Behalf Of *Pieter Noordhuis
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, November 24, 2020 1:42 PM
>> *To:* goestoo...@googlegroups.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [goestools-users] Suddenly, my VIT of 120
>> is 2181, even after replacing almost everything____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Hey,____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Thanks for the info.____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Two things stand out to me:____

>>
>> 1. The gain value of 5 (which seems low), you could try

>> increasing that. ____

>>
>> 2. The bias_tee = false. Presumably you're using an LNA
>> right behind your antenna. How is it powered? If you power

>> it through the SDR, bias_tee must equal true.____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> If those are fine, I don't know what else could be the

>> issue here... The signal in the waterfall looks fine.____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Cheers,____
>>
>> Pieter____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 2:24 AM Gadget Lust

>> <gadge...@gmail.com> wrote:____

>>
>> Hi Pieter:  Sorry for the long delay - had a family
>> emergency I needed to tend to.  Here is my GOES Tools
>> config, and two screenshots - one of Cubic SDR showing
>> the SDR in operation and receiving a good signal from
>> GOES-16, the other the output when I start GOESRCV.  I
>> am also including my config file as requested.  Any

>> help appreciated. ____
>>
>> ____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> On Monday, November 16, 2020 at 4:53:41 AM UTC-5

>> pcnoo...@gmail.com wrote:____
>>
>> Hey,____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> Really, really odd. Can you post how you're
>> running goesrecv, what its output it (the first 10
>> lines or so), and a copy of the configuration
>> file? Perhaps there was an update and your

>> configuration file got overwritten?____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Cheers,____
>>
>> Pieter____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> On Sun, Nov 15, 2020 at 9:22 PM Gadget Lust

>> <gadge...@gmail.com> wrote:____
>>
>> Hi Pieter,____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> Yes, the preamp is getting power over coax,
>> and I can see signals on an SDR software on
>> the same Pi in the GOES frequency.   I moved
>> the preamp inside today next to the SDR in
>> case we had voltage sag over coax, but it made

>> no difference. ____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> I have this morning tried the USA Satcom
>> software suite with the same RF path, and my
>> Vi is 35 and sig quality is 97.5% with that
>> software.  I am receiving images and all
>> products fine with that. Difference is the
>> software and not using my Pi4 (I spared out
>> three Pi4's during troubleshooting, by the
>> way).  GOEStools worked beautifully for a
>> solid week and then refused to report signal,
>> even when there.  Could this be an issue with

>> an update?____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Bob____
>>
>> Sent from my iPad____
>>
>>
>>
>> ____

>>
>> On Nov 15, 2020, at 3:56 AM, Pieter

>> Noordhuis <pcnoo...@gmail.com> wrote:____
>>
>> ____
>>
>> Hey,____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> Can you confirm that the LNA is powered in
>> your new setup, when running goesrecv? The
>> phase flip message happens when the
>> packetizer cannot synchronize with the
>> packet stream. The synchronizer tries to
>> correlate the bitstream with any of 4
>> synchronization words (LRIT at 0 degrees,
>> LRIT at 180 degrees, HRIT at 0 degrees,
>> HRIT at 180 degrees). For a perfect
>> signal, it will find one of the sync words
>> to be equal to the bits in the bitstream.
>> As the signal deteriorates, a few bits
>> might be flipped. As the signal
>> deteriorates more (or if you're receiving
>> noise), it may correlate best with any of
>> the 4 synchronization words, and flip from

>> packet to packet.____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> Seeing the message is a confirmation that
>> you're not locking on to the signal. Can
>> you share more output from goesrecv? I
>> expect the frequency offset to drift
>> around as well, if the signal is bad

>> coming into goesrecv.____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Cheers,____
>>
>> Pieter____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> On Sun, Nov 15, 2020 at 3:54 AM Gadget

>> Lust <gadge...@gmail.com> wrote:____
>>
>> Hi:____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> Last week it rained heavily, and my
>> working GOES-16 receiving system
>> suddenly starting giving me VIT's in
>> the 2200 range.  Thinking I fried my
>> LNA (which wasn't well protected) I
>> ordered another.  No luck.  I rebuilt
>> my PI 3 times taking care to install

>> GOES tools each time.  No help. ____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> I also ordered another SDR at the same
>> time (though I have others) on the off
>> chance the noolelec SDR also fried.

>> Also no luck.____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> I have pointed and repointed and
>> checked the dish, and I can see
>> signals in SDR Console from this same
>> system - I can see the EMWIN carrier
>> and strong signals from the HRIT side
>> of things.  I also spared in my Airspy
>> R2, and same high VIT with a new
>> message that said "phase flip detected
>> from LRIT 180 deg to HRIT 180 deg",

>> which I don't understand.____
>>
>> __ __

>>
>> My only other idea is something wrong
>> with the feed that's causing
>> distortion that GOESRCV sees but I

>> don't. ____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Does anyone have any suggestions?____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Thanks.____

>>
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[Hernán Freschi]

Everything running normally here (GOES-16), both images and EMWIN texts.

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[Gadget Lust]

Hey Phil,

I am and have been receiving images just fine on GOES-16 -- just not GOESTools, using the same RF chain and antenna.  Whatever the problem is for me, itnis unique to GOESTools. 

Bob Harvey 

Sent from my iPad

On Dec 1, 2020, at 8:53 PM, Hernán Freschi <h...@hjf.com.ar> wrote:



<Screenshot from 2020-12-01 20-12-22.png>

<Screenshot from 2020-12-01 20-12-05.png>

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[Timothy Elwell]

Yeah, i'M still receiving & decoding without issue here with goestools.

Tim

On 12/1/20 7:05 PM, Phil Biehl wrote:
> Hmmm. Since there’s now 3 of us that are having trouble with this,
> does it mean there a problem at the bird? Anyone else successfully
> capturing and decoding?
>
> Phil
>

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KG1GEM
Flower Mound, TX
Denton Co. ARES & SkyWarn Spotter

[Gadget Lust]

Hi Pieter.  Thanks for running that IQ file through.  I don't know what the issue is then.  This happened out of the blue with no changes, and it's clear the SDR works on that computer because I am able to see the signal when it's run in Cubic.  Cubic settings are pretty simple (below) and the SDR works.  I am able to listen to other services - including FM voice, with no problem.  I'll continue to look and see what could be the delta between this and what GOESPROC sees.  Could I have a duplicate config file somewhere?  Is there a way to check that?  Thanks.

Generic RTL2832U OEM :: 00000001

Offset (KHz) 0

Sample Rate: 2.56MHz

Run Time Settings

Direct Sampling = Off

Offset Tune = False

I/Q Swap = False

Stream Settings

Buffer Size 262144

Ring Buffers 15

Async Buffers 0

[Pieter Noordhuis]

How do you start goesrecv and goesproc? The paths you specify in that command line point to the configuration files they both use.

That said, if the I/Q dump you sent is accurate for 1694 MHz, then it won't matter. There was no signal to be seen in that dump, so if goesrecv sees the same, you won't get anything there either.

What puzzles me is why you do see something in Cubic. Do you happen to have more than 1 dongle plugged in your system?

Cheers,

Pieter

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[Gadget Lust]

No, PIeter, just the one dongle. 

I start it from the command line, pointing to the right config file, but will double check all of that.

Thanks,

Bob Harvey 

Sent from my iPad

On Dec 8, 2020, at 1:58 PM, Pieter Noordhuis <pcnoo...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Gadget Lust]

Pieter,

Your report that the raw file showed nothing really got me thinking.  I know for a certainty that I was receiving the bird with CubicSDR, so knew it had to be a config issue somewhere.  So, I checked my GOESRCV.CONF against several examples online, and found out that I was missing a single zero at the end of the frequency.  I had 169410000 instead of 1694100000, and once I corrected that, all was well, and I am know up and running again.

This still doesn't explain how that changed (I was not playing with the configs at any point) and I used the same tutorials on line, but somehow, somewhere, either I fat-fingered the frequency in the config file, or someone had one posted that was wrong.  It is hard to tell that I needed 5 zeroes after the MSD of 16941.  It would be nice if the config could allow 1.6941 GHz or 1694.100 MHz to prevent errors like mine :)

Thanks again for the help.

Bob

[Pieter Noordhuis]

Hi Bob,

Very glad to hear you got it figured out. The problem had me stumped!

The ability to set the exact frequency has been useful for folks who are using a L-band to VHF downconverter. Granted, the full precision is never needed, but changing to KHz or MHz also adds confusion.

Cheers,

Pieter

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