Kenya politician Fitz de Souza and wife Romola (Oral Histories Project)

[Selma Cardoso]

The Histories of British-Goans project presents a clip of a very rare interview with Fitz Santana de Souza and his wife Romola. In this clip, Fitz talks about his Father being posted to Kabul circa 1914. Their time in Zanzibar, about meeting Pio Gama-Pinto and Jomo Kenyatta. Romola talks about knowing Fitz in childhood and meeting him again in Kenya. Please note this is a clip of a three hour interview and not the interview in its entirety.

 

To see it on our website:

http://www.britishgoanproject.com/

or you can watch it here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7OKGaE9DGM&feature=youtu.be

 

Fitz Remedios Santana de Souza (born 1929, Mumbai), often known as Dr. F. R. S. de Souza and Fitz De Souza, is a Kenyan lawyer and ex-politician of Indian origin, who was an important figure in the campaign for independence for Kenya, a member of the Kenyan parliament in the 1960s and Deputy Speaker for several years. He helped provide a legal defence for those accused of Mau Mau activities including the Kapenguria Six, and he was one of the people involved in the Lancaster House conferences held to draw up a constitutional framework for Kenyan independence.

To read more about Fitz you may access the wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fitz_Remedios_Santana_de_Souza

Best,

Selma Carvalho

[Nazareth, Peter]

Selma,

This is the first time I have heard Fitz de Souza and he comes alive, very human and very Goan. It is striking what he says about the eyes of Jomo Kenyatta. 

I think that while Goans all over East Africa had something in common with one another, they lived on very different terrains and worked among very different people depending on which country they were in and where in the country they worked.  I don't recall meeting any Arabs when I was growing up in Uganda.  While I saw the lake (Lake Victoria) every day in Entebbe, and the source of the Nile (at Jinja) occasionally, I did not see the sea, though I have a memory of the sea at Dar es Salaam when I was two because my father could not take his vacation in Goa at the time and then more fully in Mombasa when I was six. The sea had was vast compared to the lake.

This is for Dale if he reads this omnibus message from me.  This morning I received the following message about a new on-line nilejournal from John Otim:

Hello Peter

Wanted to say we rolled online yesterday at http://nilejournal.net

We know you will be much occupied, we will be glad if you

would take a look

John Otim

Editor Nile Journal

Box 28342 Kampala

Otim was in real life one of the students rounded up by Idi Amin to demonstrate support for his Expulsion of Asians but who instead told him not to expel AsiansThe scene is described in my novel "The General is Up."  In this issue of nilejournal, Otim has written poetically about "The General is Up" and reproduced the cover, painted by Alex Tavares (born in Zanzibar, grew up in Goa, worked in Kenya, lives in Canada).  Dale, you should send your link to your essay on "The General is Up" to John Otim.  Until recently, he was a professor of political science at Ahmadu Bello university in northern Nigeria.

Best.

Peter

---

From: goa-bo...@googlegroups.com [goa-bo...@googlegroups.com] on behalf of Selma Cardoso [lescar...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 2:33 AM
To: goa-bo...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [GOABOOKCLUB] Kenya politician Fitz de Souza and wife Romola (Oral Histories Project)

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[Selma Cardoso]

Dear Peter,

Fitz is very reluctant to interview and I suspect this is only the second time, he's been recorded at length on camera. I think there is another BBC interview of his. I'm not sure if there are others. Even on this particular day he was reluctant but Eddie Fernandes and I, entreated him (the Bibilical use of the word almost apt here :-)

 

There is one interesting snippet of the interview I must mention here. During the time of the famous Kapenguria trials, due to the colour bar in effect in Kenya, Kenyatta's lawyers found it difficult to enter hotels etc for their meals in the outpost where these trials were being held. And so they were entertained frequently by a Goan family - and lo and behold it was Mervyn Maciel's inlaws. Small world in a way.

 

Any chance of you coming to London? I would love to interview you.

 

Take care,

selma

 

From: "Nazareth, Peter" <peter-n...@uiowa.edu>
To: "goa-bo...@googlegroups.com" <goa-bo...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, 21 April 2012, 14:46
Subject: RE: [GOABOOKCLUB] Kenya politician Fitz de Souza and wife Romola (Oral Histories Project)

Selma,

This is the first time I have heard Fitz de Souza and he comes alive, very human and very Goan. It is striking what he says about the eyes of Jomo Kenyatta. 

I think that while Goans all over East Africa had something in common with one another, they lived on very different terrains and worked among very different people depending on which country they were in and where in the country they worked.  I don't recall meeting any Arabs when I was growing up in Uganda.  While I saw the lake (Lake Victoria) every day in Entebbe, and the source of the Nile (at Jinja) occasionally, I did not see the sea, though I have a memory of the sea at Dar es Salaam when I was two because my father could not take his vacation in Goa at the time and then more fully in Mombasa when I was six. The sea had was vast compared to the lake.

This is for Dale if he reads this omnibus message from me.  This morning I received the following message about a new on-line nilejournal from John Otim:

Hello Peter

Wanted to say we rolled online yesterday at http://nilejournal.net

We know you will be much occupied, we will be glad if you

would take a look

John Otim

Editor Nile Journal

Box 28342 Kampala

Otim was in real life one of the students rounded up by Idi Amin to demonstrate support for his Expulsion of Asians but who instead told him not to expel AsiansThe scene is described in my novel "The General is Up."  In this issue of nilejournal, Otim has written poetically about "The General is Up" and reproduced the cover, painted by Alex Tavares (born in Zanzibar, grew up in Goa, worked in Kenya, lives in Canada).  Dale, you should send your link to your essay on "The General is Up" to John Otim.  Until recently, he was a professor of political science at Ahmadu Bello university in northern Nigeria.

Best.

Peter

From: goa-bo...@googlegroups.com [goa-bo...@googlegroups.com] on behalf of Selma Cardoso [lescar...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 2:33 AM
To: goa-bo...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [GOABOOKCLUB] Kenya politician Fitz de Souza and wife Romola (Oral Histories Project)

The Histories of British-Goans project presents a clip of a very rare interview with Fitz Santana de Souza and his wife Romola. In this clip, Fitz talks about his Father being posted to Kabul circa 1914. Their time in Zanzibar, about meeting Pio Gama-Pinto and Jomo Kenyatta. Romola talks about knowing Fitz in childhood and meeting him again in Kenya. Please note this is a clip of a three hour interview and not the interview in its entirety.

 

To see it on our website:

http://www.britishgoanproject.com/

or you can watch it here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7OKGaE9DGM&feature=youtu.be

 

Fitz Remedios Santana de Souza (born 1929, Mumbai), often known as Dr. F. R. S. de Souza and Fitz De Souza, is a Kenyan lawyer and ex-politician of Indian origin, who was an important figure in the campaign for independence for Kenya, a member of the Kenyan parliament in the 1960s and Deputy Speaker for several years. He helped provide a legal defence for those accused of Mau Mau activities including the Kapenguria Six, and he was one of the people involved in the Lancaster House conferences held to draw up a constitutional framework for Kenyan independence.

To read more about Fitz you may access the wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fitz_Remedios_Santana_de_Souza

Best,

Selma Carvalho

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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Third Thursday Goa Book Club" group.
To post to this group, send email to goa-bo...@googlegroups.com.
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[Mervyn & Elsie Maciel]

Dear Selma/Peter,

Just to emphasise Kenyatta's "piercing eyes", I am attaching a
photo showing Kenyatta and my late brother, Wilfred.
Wilfred was the ONLY non-White journalist at the famous
Maralal Press Conference where Kenyatta faced the World Press
for the first time while still in detention. Later that day, Wilfred
presented Kenyatta with a copy of Viktor Frankl's book(Man's search
for meaning), and
also interviewed him. A copy of the tape was flown to New Delhi
that same night(courtesy of the Indian High Commission in Nairobi).
Sadly, I don't have the tape, but can remember Kenyatta addressing
Wilfred as "Brother".
As for the Kapenguria trial, I was "seconded" to Kapenguria for the
duration of the trial(and based at the D.C.'s office); from my government
quarters, I used to see Kenyatta and the other "prisoners" being escorted
to the Courthouse daily. The Prison was behind the Government Asian
quarters.
I often got a lift from Kapenguria to Kitale(where Elsie, who was expecting
our first child was at her parent's home) - from one or other of the Defence
Counsels, more particularly Chief W.O. Davies of Nigeria.Have also
travelled with the British .Q.C(D.N. Pritt), who,with others like,
Diwan Chamanlal, Fritz, Davies and Achroo Kapila were frequent
visitors to my in-laws home at Kitale. I think they sought "refuge"
there as the Kitale Hotel
did not allow non-Whites!(Even Pritt, as a White man, could not entertain
learned Counsel in this establishment - how awful!!)

On Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 9:49 PM, Selma Cardoso <lescar...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dear Peter,

> Fitz is very reluctnt to interview and I suspect this is only the second