how often do you usually run emacs for? 1 day? 1 week?

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Dan Jacobson

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Dec 26, 2001, 9:08:52 AM12/26/01
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Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?
For me it's like a pair of soiled underwear, beyond one day it's all
dirty and bloated with lots of buffers, need a fresh pair, however
after one day it's usually time to power down my computer, so I will
never know the joys of month old underwear, I guess.

By the way, with font-lock, flyspell, whatever all turned on, often I
notice when in the middle of typing the cursor freezes, the CPU meter
goes to max, and then after 1 or 2 seconds things recover, with no
input lost. Of course I'm only on a P166 CPU.
--
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Eli Zaretskii

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Dec 26, 2001, 12:38:44 PM12/26/01
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Dan Jacobson wrote:
>
> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

Forever (read: until the next power outage). For example, my office machine
is left running, days and nights, for months on end without restarting, with
a single Emacs session active at all times. (I do happen to launch
additional short Emacs sessions, for test purposes, but those are usually
very short-lived.)

> For me it's like a pair of soiled underwear, beyond one day it's all
> dirty and bloated with lots of buffers

What's your problem to kill the buffers or frames you don't need?

> By the way, with font-lock, flyspell, whatever all turned on, often I
> notice when in the middle of typing the cursor freezes, the CPU meter
> goes to max, and then after 1 or 2 seconds things recover, with no
> input lost.

If 1-2 sec delays annoy you, I don't recommend turning on flyspell. Use
ispell-buffer or ispell-region instead.

Simon Josefsson

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Dec 26, 2001, 1:25:19 PM12/26/01
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Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> writes:

> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

Until it crashes. Which for Emacs 19 and 20.7 meant forever, for
Emacs 21 two or three days, for XEmacs one day to one week depending
on version.

Kai Großjohann

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Dec 26, 2001, 5:01:50 PM12/26/01
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Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> writes:

> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

I start a fresh one when I come into the office in the morning.

kai
--
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Miles Bader

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Dec 26, 2001, 10:18:52 PM12/26/01
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Kai.Gro...@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:
> > Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?
>
> I start a fresh one when I come into the office in the morning.

Heh; when I come in to work every day, I turn on my machine, and update
emacs from CVS, compile, install, and run it.

This may seem rather stupid, given the possiblity that someone hosed
the CVS version (it happens), but I've only had emacs fail to start
twice in several years of doing it. [and it certainly gives me an
incentive to find the problem!]

-Miles
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Sergei Pokrovsky

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Dec 27, 2001, 4:42:11 AM12/27/01
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>>>>> "Dan" == Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> writes:

Dan> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

[...]

For 1-2 months at work; for a session at home (I turn the computer off
in the evening at home).

As a consequence, I have desktop session recording enabled at home,
and it is disabled at work.

--
Sergei

Scott Andrew Borton

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Dec 27, 2001, 5:17:44 AM12/27/01
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Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> writes:

> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

As long as hardware stability allows.

> For me it's like a pair of soiled underwear, beyond one day it's all

> dirty and bloated with lots of buffers [...]

There are ways to expire old buffers automatically. Investigate midnight-mode.

Besides, buffers belong in emacs, not in your underwear.


--scott

Joe Casadonte

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Dec 27, 2001, 10:08:59 AM12/27/01
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On 26 Dec 2001, Dan Jacobson wrote:

> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

For me Emacs stays ups until I reboot the machine (which for my NT box
at work is once or twice a day, for my Win2k box at home is once a
week or so, and for my Linux box at home is....whenever I do something
stupid to the kernel, maybe every 6 months or so). The only other
time I close my Emacs session is to play Civ III at home (it's a small
box) or when my VNC session gets all bollixed up.

--
Regards,

joe
Joe Casadonte
jcasa...@northbound-train.com

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Kai Großjohann

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Dec 27, 2001, 10:49:37 AM12/27/01
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Miles Bader <mi...@gnu.org> writes:

> Kai.Gro...@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>> > Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?
>>
>> I start a fresh one when I come into the office in the morning.
>
> Heh; when I come in to work every day, I turn on my machine, and update
> emacs from CVS, compile, install, and run it.

Actually, it's similar for me: I read some mail while it's compiling,
then start a second one.

I rename the old directory to emacs.SAV before installing a new
version; this gives me the safety net I need.

Dr. Rafael Sepúlveda

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Dec 29, 2001, 4:27:00 AM12/29/01
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Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> writes:

> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

I'm on a laptop, but I almost never turn it off, only suspend it. I
run emacs at startup in my X server and also in the startup in
console. This is possible, for me, using eshell.

I'm used to kill buffers whenever I stop using them, some of the
buffers I just ignore them, and also I have a function to kill all
buffers and open an eshell buffer after killing it.

I use this pieces of code to do the above:

====
(defun bs-dont-list-buffers (arg)
"Function that marks which buffers will not be shown.
ARG is the buffer evaluated."
(let ((buffer (buffer-name arg)))
(or
(string-match "^\\(\\*Buffer List\\*\\|\\*buffer-selection\\*\\)$" buffer)
(string-match "^bbdb$" buffer)
(string-match "^\\*Completions\\*$" buffer)
(string-match "^\\*Fetchmail\\*$" buffer)
(string-match "^\\*Messages\\*$" buffer)
(string-match "^\\*MailCrypt\\*$" buffer)
(string-match "^newsrc-dribble$" buffer)
(string-match "^sent-mail.*$" buffer)
(string-match "^sent-news.*$" buffer)
(string-match "^\\*tramp.*$" buffer)
(string-match "^TAGS$" buffer)
(string-match "^\\*WoMan-Log\\*$" buffer)
(string-match "^ " buffer))))

(add-to-list 'bs-configurations
'("all-intern-last-custom"
nil
nil
nil
bs-dont-list-buffers
bs-sort-buffer-interns-are-last))

(setq bs-default-configuration "all-intern-last-custom")
====

====
(defun kill-all-buffers ()
"Kill literally _all_ buffers and reaload eshell.
This keeps GNU/Emacs from bloating. Acts as a 'restart'."
(interactive)
(if (fboundp 'gnus-group-exit) (gnus-group-exit))
(loop for x being buffers
do (kill-buffer x))
(eshell))
====

--
Dr. Rafael Sepúlveda <d...@gnulinux.org.mx>
http://www.gnulinux.org.mx/~drs

F13B C41C 739B 7233 F738 D68E 2947 D868 1981 FDE7

A. L. Meyers

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Dec 30, 2001, 4:43:53 AM12/30/01
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Hi! Would also be interested to know what proportion of fellow
emacs users utilise emacs in:

1. preponderately text console

2. preponderately X

me 1.

Cheers!

Lucien
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Kai Großjohann

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Dec 30, 2001, 12:19:04 PM12/30/01
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Me X11.

Kathryn Huxtable

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Dec 30, 2001, 1:56:28 PM12/30/01
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At work, usually in a text console. At home on my Windows system, it's a windows GUI by default.

-K

Alan D. Salewski

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Dec 31, 2001, 2:52:28 PM12/31/01
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In article <m2bsgma...@dan.jacobson.tw>, Dan Jacobson wrote:
> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

On my machine at work, I have one copy that I just leave running all the
time between reboots (which I do once maybe every two months or so -->
whenever I recompile the kernel, or if I shutdown to add hardware to the
box), and I sometimes launch shorter lived copies when I muck with my
.emacs in such a way that I think may interfere with things at startup.

On my home machine, I always have an instance running while the machine
is on, but I tinker quite a bit with the box, so I find myself
restarting it more often (maybe once a week).

-Al

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Alan D. Salewski

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Dec 31, 2001, 2:54:11 PM12/31/01
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In article <87y9jlf3...@nomad.consult-meyers.com>, A. L. Meyers wrote:
> Hi! Would also be interested to know what proportion of fellow
> emacs users utilise emacs in:
>
> 1. preponderately text console
>
> 2. preponderately X

I run it mainly from within X.

Michael P. Soulier

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Dec 31, 2001, 3:32:09 PM12/31/01
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On this thread of how long you keep Emacs up and running, I'm
wondering if there is an "uptime" or equivalent command for Emacs? I
know I can get the process time from "ps" on a *nix system, but that
solution isn't platform independent.

Mike

--
Michael P. Soulier <msou...@mcss.mcmaster.ca>, GnuPG pub key: 5BC8BE08
"...the word HACK is used as a verb to indicate a massive amount
of nerd-like effort." -Harley Hahn, A Student's Guide to Unix

lawrence mitchell

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Dec 31, 2001, 4:08:56 PM12/31/01
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Michael P Soulier <michael...@rogers.com> writes:

> On this thread of how long you keep Emacs up and running, I'm
> wondering if there is an "uptime" or equivalent command for Emacs? I
> know I can get the process time from "ps" on a *nix system, but that
> solution isn't platform independent.

Indeed there is, uptime.el by David Welton, available at
<http://people.debian.org/~davidw>

--
lawrence mitchell <we...@gmx.li>

Is this "BIKINI BEACH"?

Glyn Millington

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Jan 1, 2002, 4:11:56 AM1/1/02
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michael...@rogers.com (Michael P. Soulier) writes:

> On this thread of how long you keep Emacs up and running, I'm
> wondering if there is an "uptime" or equivalent command for Emacs? I
> know I can get the process time from "ps" on a *nix system, but that
> solution isn't platform independent.

Dave Pearson has his great uptimes package somewhere on www.davep.org,
may be platform dependent though.

Glyn
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Chris Beggy

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Jan 1, 2002, 5:24:18 PM1/1/02
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"A. L. Meyers" <nospa...@replyto.because.this.is.invalid> writes:

> Hi! Would also be interested to know what proportion of fellow
> emacs users utilise emacs in:

X11, with ratpoison as the windomanager.

Chris

Tim Cross

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Jan 2, 2002, 12:59:20 AM1/2/02
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Chris Beggy <chr...@lackawana.kippona.com> writes:

For me X11 with sawfish as the window manager and emacspeak so that it
talks to me an I don't get lonely :-(

---
find / -iname microsoft -exe rm -rf {} \;

kgold

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Jan 2, 2002, 10:36:13 AM1/2/02
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I start emacs when I log in and it runs until I log out.

Since I run a reliable combination of RS6000 hardware and AIX (IBM's
UNIX), I only log out a few times a year when the building does power
maintenance or the IT department is installing OS patches.

I occasionally do c-x c-b, which for me is
Electric-buffer-menu-undefined, and delete old buffers.

Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> writes:
> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?
> For me it's like a pair of soiled underwear, beyond one day it's all
> dirty and bloated with lots of buffers, need a fresh pair, however
> after one day it's usually time to power down my computer, so I will
> never know the joys of month old underwear, I guess.

--
Ken Goldman kg...@watson.ibm.com 914-784-7646

Alan Mackenzie

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Jan 2, 2002, 2:42:21 PM1/2/02
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A. L. Meyers <nospa...@replyto.because.this.is.invalid> wrote on 30
Dec 2001 10:43:53 +0100:

> Hi! Would also be interested to know what proportion of fellow emacs
> users utilise emacs in:

> 1. preponderately text console
> 2. preponderately X

I use only the Linux tty (enhanced to 134 columns x 41 lines by
SVGATextMode) except when I need to test stuff under X. I _loathe_ all
the crud that distracts me under X, though ratpoison makes it almost
bearable.

I suspect when I finally upgrade to a new PC I'll have to use ratpoison,
since SVGATextMode has not been upgraded for more modern graphic cards,
and 80x25 would be horribly restricting.

> Cheers!

> Lucien

--
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Email: aa...@muuc.dee; to decode, wherever there is a repeated letter
(like "aa"), remove half of them (leaving, say, "a").

Alan Mackenzie

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Jan 2, 2002, 2:56:04 PM1/2/02
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Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> wrote on 26 Dec 2001 22:08:52 +0800:
> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

For however long I'm using it. Maybe four or five hours on a good
hacking run, typically maybe an hour. And I always shut my PC down at
night, because I think it's reckless and selfish extravagence to waste
electricity on a needlessly running PC, polluting the environment with
even more carbon dioxide or radioactive waste.

> Of course I'm only on a P166 CPU.

Mine's a 166MHz 6x86, with 64Mb of RAM. Of course, this is entirely
adequate for running Emacs, despite its doing just about everything in
interpreted code.

Unfortunately, Netscape is a core hog, and it causes my machine to thrash
horribly. If Emacs is currently loaded, it thrashes even horriblier, so
I usually C-x C-c before starting X and Netscape.

Sven Utcke

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Jan 3, 2002, 5:55:09 AM1/3/02
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Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> writes:

> Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

At work (Ultra5/10 400MHz, Solaris 8) I start Emacs Monday morning and
shut it down again Friday evening. I would stay logged in longer,
unly there's a bug in Solaris which makes it accumulated memory over
the days, and after about 5 days my 128MB simply aren't enough anymore
to run smoothly.

At home, on a 486DX4/75 with 40MB of RAM, I start Emacs when I log in
(done automatically on both machines) and only quit it when I log out
(which can be month after I started it, due to hibernation), or when
Netscape needs the memory...

> For me it's like a pair of soiled underwear, beyond one day it's all
> dirty and bloated with lots of buffers, need a fresh pair,

Strange --- I use desktop.el to assure that all the buffers get loaded
again everytime I start Emacs...

> By the way, with font-lock, flyspell, whatever all turned on, often I
> notice when in the middle of typing the cursor freezes, the CPU meter
> goes to max, and then after 1 or 2 seconds things recover, with no
> input lost. Of course I'm only on a P166 CPU.

That's one reason why I do not use font-lock (hilit19 instead) or
flyspell. Emacs still freezes ocassionally, but this is only related
to autosave now --- obviously disc-access isn't particularly fast on
my machine...

Sven
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| ' </ _ \/ _` (_-< phone: +49 (0)40 42883-2576 Vogt-Koelln-Strasse 30
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Eli Zaretskii

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Jan 3, 2002, 6:43:20 AM1/3/02
to
Sven Utcke wrote:
>
> At home, on a 486DX4/75 with 40MB of RAM [...]

>
> > By the way, with font-lock, flyspell, whatever all turned on, often I
> > notice when in the middle of typing the cursor freezes, the CPU meter
> > goes to max, and then after 1 or 2 seconds things recover, with no
> > input lost. Of course I'm only on a P166 CPU.
>
> That's one reason why I do not use font-lock (hilit19 instead) or
> flyspell.

I hope the slowness that annoys you is only on the 486, not on the 400MHz
machine. If so, then it's expected: 486 simply doesn't have enough power
to run the Emacs display code at adequate speed, even with font-lock being
off. With all those nifty display features people keep asking for, even a
P166 is a bit too slow.

Miles Bader

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Jan 3, 2002, 7:26:50 AM1/3/02
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Eli Zaretskii <el...@is.elta.co.il> writes:
> With all those nifty display features people keep asking for, even a
> P166 is a bit too slow.

Oh, I don't know... My main computer until recently was a 133MHz pentium
machine, and Emacs 21 ran just sweet 'n' dandy on that (and I used
font-lock).

_Compiling_ emacs, on the other hand ... whoa!

[Actually, the only reason I upgraded was because someone gave me a
450MHz PIII motherboard w/ 256MB of memory for free -- he said it was
too obsolete to sell!]

-Miles
--
`Life is a boundless sea of bitterness'

Dave Pearson

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Jan 3, 2002, 8:01:23 AM1/3/02
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* Michael P. Soulier <michael...@rogers.com>:

> On this thread of how long you keep Emacs up and running, I'm wondering if
> there is an "uptime" or equivalent command for Emacs? I know I can get the
> process time from "ps" on a *nix system, but that solution isn't platform
> independent.

<URL:http://www.davep.org/emacs/#uptimes.el> might be of interest to you.

,----
| ELISP> (uptimes-this)
| "emacs has been up and running for 73 days, 2 hours, 4 minutes and 9 seconds"
`----

--
Dave Pearson: | lbdb.el - LBDB interface.
http://www.davep.org/ | sawfish.el - Sawfish mode.
Emacs: | uptimes.el - Record emacs uptimes.
http://www.davep.org/emacs/ | quickurl.el - Recall lists of URLs.

Eli Zaretskii

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Jan 3, 2002, 9:20:05 AM1/3/02
to
Miles Bader wrote:
>
> Eli Zaretskii <el...@is.elta.co.il> writes:
> > With all those nifty display features people keep asking for, even a
> > P166 is a bit too slow.
>
> Oh, I don't know... My main computer until recently was a 133MHz pentium
> machine, and Emacs 21 ran just sweet 'n' dandy on that (and I used
> font-lock).

One of my main machines _still_ is a P166. It's generally adequate, but
there are some situations where it cannot keep up with my keyboard's
auto-repeat rate.

I forgot to tell that I have show-trailing-whitespace turned on in some of
the major modes, which tends to slow down the redisplay. For instance,
turn on font-lock and show-trailing-whitespace in lisp/term/internal.el,
and press and hold C-f or C-n in the portion there which has those large
tables with ASCII strings. On a slow machine, even the cursor motion
cannot keep up with the keyboard autorepeat.

A. L. Meyers

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Jan 3, 2002, 4:21:45 PM1/3/02
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Alan Mackenzie<no...@example.invalid> writes:

> A. L. Meyers <nospa...@replyto.because.this.is.invalid> wrote on 30
> Dec 2001 10:43:53 +0100:
> > Hi! Would also be interested to know what proportion of fellow emacs
> > users utilise emacs in:
>
> > 1. preponderately text console
> > 2. preponderately X
>
> I use only the Linux tty (enhanced to 134 columns x 41 lines by
> SVGATextMode) except when I need to test stuff under X. I _loathe_ all
> the crud that distracts me under X, though ratpoison makes it almost
> bearable.
>
> I suspect when I finally upgrade to a new PC I'll have to use ratpoison,
> since SVGATextMode has not been upgraded for more modern graphic cards,
> and 80x25 would be horribly restricting.

Don't despair, Alan. Have a look at the framebuffer device,
fbdev, AKA vesaframebuffer. Beautiful text consoles using
GNU/Linux. Slackware has done a very nice job making them easy
to use for those like me suffering from brain amputation. They
even provide ready to customise XF86Config files so there is no
annoying (and time consuming) video modes switching between the
text console and X, unless you have a monitor > 17 ". For the
rest one just puts something like "vga=792" into lilo.conf .

Lucien
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Kathryn Huxtable

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Jan 3, 2002, 9:02:47 PM1/3/02
to
Alan Mackenzie<no...@example.invalid> writes:
> Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> wrote on 26 Dec 2001 22:08:52 +0800:
> > Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?
>
> For however long I'm using it. Maybe four or five hours on a good
> hacking run, typically maybe an hour. And I always shut my PC down at
> night, because I think it's reckless and selfish extravagence to waste
> electricity on a needlessly running PC, polluting the environment with
> even more carbon dioxide or radioactive waste.

I have a similar attitude. When I'm not going to be using my computer
for more than an hour and I'm not doing a render, it's turned off.

Where I live, it's a mixture of both carbon dioxide and radioactive
waste. And yes, I use compact flourescent bulbs for my most common
fixtures, with a smattering of incandescent bulbs for when I want that
kind of illumination, which is mostly when I'm sewing.

-K

Michael Slass

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Jan 3, 2002, 9:23:55 PM1/3/02
to
Kathryn Huxtable <kat...@kathrynhuxtable.org> writes:

>I have a similar attitude. When I'm not going to be using my computer
>for more than an hour and I'm not doing a render, it's turned off.
>
>Where I live, it's a mixture of both carbon dioxide and radioactive
>waste. And yes, I use compact flourescent bulbs for my most common
>fixtures, with a smattering of incandescent bulbs for when I want that
>kind of illumination, which is mostly when I'm sewing.
>
>-K

My computer is powered by pedal-driven generators run by underfed,
blind, bound, gagged, developing-world slave children, who keep
pedaling or face repeated lashes with a rattan cane. I run my
computer all night, because the time I would waste waiting for it to
start up in the morning is far more valuable than sleep for my slaves.

At night, I park my Chevy Suburban (in which I drive a 2.5 mile solo
commute to a workplace easily accessible by bicycle) at a gas station
with the nozzle in place and running at slow so I can leave it idling
all night - I hate a cold car in the morning, and if I'm willing to
pay for the gas, what the hell's wrong with producing carbon dioxide?
Global warming is a farce - scientists in the pay of the petrochemical
industry say so, so it must be true.

Conservation, Hell NO!!! Drill ANWAR for more oil!

I eat endangered species which have been inhumanely hunted and then
kicked to death by displaced indigenous South Americans wearing Nike
sneakers made by underpaid Indonesian women and children.

I believe that radioactive waste is an important military input; where
else are they going to get material for tank-buster sabot darts?


--
Mike

NB: * The preceding is sarcasm.
* If the preceding were not sarcasm, it would represent my
opinions and not those of my employer.
* As it is, it represents niether my opinions, nor those of my
employer.

Kathryn Huxtable

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Jan 3, 2002, 9:26:40 PM1/3/02
to
Michael Slass <mik...@wrq.com> writes:
> My computer is powered by pedal-driven generators run by underfed,

Whatever.

-K

Kathryn Huxtable

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Jan 3, 2002, 9:30:37 PM1/3/02
to
Kathryn Huxtable <kat...@kathrynhuxtable.org> writes:
> Michael Slass <mik...@wrq.com> writes:
> > My computer is powered by pedal-driven generators run by underfed,

Oh, I should add that I wasn't trying to be self righteous in my post,
just agreeing with the other poster. Our civilization wastes so much
power that what I do doesn't make that much difference. But it does
make a slight difference and it doesn't hurt anything.

-K

Alan Mackenzie

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Jan 4, 2002, 9:05:50 AM1/4/02
to
Kathryn Huxtable <kat...@kathrynhuxtable.org> wrote on Fri, 04 Jan 2002
02:02:47 GMT:

> Alan Mackenzie<no...@example.invalid> writes:
>> Dan Jacobson <jid...@deadspam.com> wrote on 26 Dec 2001 22:08:52
>> +0800:
>> > Just curious, how long do you _usually_ let your emacs run?

>> For however long I'm using it. Maybe four or five hours on a good
>> hacking run, typically maybe an hour. And I always shut my PC down at
>> night, because I think it's reckless and selfish extravagence to waste
>> electricity on a needlessly running PC, polluting the environment with
>> even more carbon dioxide or radioactive waste.

> I have a similar attitude. When I'm not going to be using my computer

> for more than an hour and I'm not doing a render, ....

Not Rudolph the red-nosed, by any chance?

> .... it's turned off.

Which must also be good for the electronics. After all, any processor is
going to burn out after a certain number of petacycles.

> Where I live, it's a mixture of both carbon dioxide and radioactive
> waste. And yes, I use compact flourescent bulbs for my most common

> fixtures, ....

Doesn't that hurt?

> .... with a smattering of incandescent bulbs for when I want that kind
> of illumination, ....

I could do with that kind of illumination when I'm hacking Emacs. ;-(

> .... which is mostly when I'm sewing.

Do you use sew.el? I heard that "Black Beauty" was written by sew.el. :-)

> -K

Sven Utcke

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Jan 4, 2002, 9:39:16 AM1/4/02
to
Kathryn Huxtable <kat...@kathrynhuxtable.org> writes:

> Where I live, it's a mixture of both carbon dioxide and radioactive
> waste. And yes, I use compact flourescent bulbs for my most common
> fixtures,

Anybody ever tried to figure out what does more harm, the CO2 from your
local power-plant or the Hg once you need to dispose of the compact
flourescent bulb? And don't forget to _never_, ever put it into the
normal bin...

Sven

PS: With Linux, Suspend to disk can be used even on desktops which
have never heard of APM...
http://falcon.sch.bme.hu/~seasons/linux/swsusp.html
http://sourceforge.net/projects/swsusp

Kathryn Huxtable

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Jan 5, 2002, 10:25:24 AM1/5/02
to
Sven Utcke <ut...@tu-harburg.de> writes:

> Kathryn Huxtable <kat...@kathrynhuxtable.org> writes:
>
> > Where I live, it's a mixture of both carbon dioxide and radioactive
> > waste. And yes, I use compact flourescent bulbs for my most common
> > fixtures,
>
> Anybody ever tried to figure out what does more harm, the CO2 from your
> local power-plant or the Hg once you need to dispose of the compact
> flourescent bulb? And don't forget to _never_, ever put it into the
> normal bin...

Well, the compact flourescents will last a lot longer. I won't need to
dispose of them very often.

> PS: With Linux, Suspend to disk can be used even on desktops which
> have never heard of APM...

That's nice, but I run Windows at home because there isn't a 3DS Max
that runs on Linux, nor a Bryce, nor many other applications I have.

I prefer UN*X but am trapped by what I need to run. In my day job, I'm
a UNIX middleware developer. We run Linux as well as several
proprietary UN*X operating systems.

-K

Kathryn Huxtable

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Jan 5, 2002, 10:28:46 AM1/5/02
to
Alan Mackenzie<no...@example.invalid> writes:
> Kathryn Huxtable <kat...@kathrynhuxtable.org> wrote on Fri, 04 Jan 2002
> 02:02:47 GMT:
> > I have a similar attitude. When I'm not going to be using my
> > computer [...] it's turned off.

>
> Which must also be good for the electronics. After all, any
> processor is going to burn out after a certain number of petacycles.

Yep. And by then it will be how many years out of date?

Given the advances in electronics, I'm assuming I'll have to give my
current system to a less fortunate non-hacker type long before
anything gives out from that kind of stress.

> > .... which is mostly when I'm sewing.
>
> Do you use sew.el? I heard that "Black Beauty" was written by
> sew.el. :-)

I think we're a bit off topic here. I probably shouldn't have posted
anything. ;-)

-K

Galen Boyer

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Jan 5, 2002, 7:13:28 PM1/5/02
to

Sounded like a joke to me.
--
Galen deForest Boyer
Sweet dreams and flying machines in pieces on the ground.

Kathryn Huxtable

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Jan 5, 2002, 7:17:12 PM1/5/02
to
Galen Boyer <galen...@hotpop.com> writes:
> On Fri, 04 Jan 2002, kat...@kathrynhuxtable.org wrote:
> > Michael Slass <mik...@wrq.com> writes:
> >> My computer is powered by pedal-driven generators run by
> >> underfed,
> >
> > Whatever.
> >
> > -K
>
> Sounded like a joke to me.

Yes, but a bit dry if so.

-K

Alan Mackenzie

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Jan 6, 2002, 2:06:14 PM1/6/02
to
A. L. Meyers <nospa...@replyto.because.this.is.invalid> wrote on 03
Jan 2002 22:21:45 +0100:
> Alan Mackenzie<no...@example.invalid> writes:

[ .... ]

>> I suspect when I finally upgrade to a new PC I'll have to use
>> ratpoison, since SVGATextMode has not been upgraded for more modern
>> graphic cards, and 80x25 would be horribly restricting.

> Don't despair, Alan. Have a look at the framebuffer device, fbdev, AKA
> vesaframebuffer. Beautiful text consoles using GNU/Linux. Slackware has
> done a very nice job making them easy to use for those like me
> suffering from brain amputation. They even provide ready to customise
> XF86Config files so there is no annoying (and time consuming) video
> modes switching between the text console and X, unless you have a
> monitor > 17 ". For the rest one just puts something like "vga=792"
> into lilo.conf .

Appreciated. Where do I find fbdev? I tried searching the Slackware
website, to no avail, after having had a quick look round my "new"
distribution (SuSE 7.0).

> Lucien

--
Alan Mackenzie (Municn, Germany)

A. L. Meyers

unread,
Jan 6, 2002, 2:28:54 PM1/6/02
to
Alan Mackenzie<no...@example.invalid> writes:

> A. L. Meyers <nospa...@replyto.because.this.is.invalid> wrote on 03
> Jan 2002 22:21:45 +0100:
>

> > Don't despair, Alan. Have a look at the framebuffer device, fbdev, AKA
> > vesaframebuffer. Beautiful text consoles using GNU/Linux. Slackware has
> > done a very nice job making them easy to use for those like me
> > suffering from brain amputation. They even provide ready to customise
> > XF86Config files so there is no annoying (and time consuming) video
> > modes switching between the text console and X, unless you have a
> > monitor > 17 ". For the rest one just puts something like "vga=792"
> > into lilo.conf .
>
> Appreciated. Where do I find fbdev? I tried searching the Slackware
> website, to no avail, after having had a quick look round my "new"
> distribution (SuSE 7.0).

If you put e.g. "vga=791" in your /etc/lilo.conf, run lilo (no
errors), reboot and get a Tux penguin in the upper left hand corner of
your screen during boot, this means SuSE and your kernel support fbdev.

Using Slackware 8.0 with X 4.1. fbdev is actually an X executable, a
full video driver like Mach64 etc. In Slack 8.0 it lives in
/usr/X11R6/bin/ and is called Xvfd. The module is fbdev_drv.o .
Here is the appropriate XF86Config which should lead the way.
Have deleted some sections but please excuse the verbosity.
===========================

Cheers,

Lucien

(snip)
# **********************************************************************
# Refer to the XF86Config(4/5) man page for details about the format of
# this file.
# **********************************************************************

# This XF86Config file is designed for use with the Linux framebuffer console.
# This generic interface should work with nearly all video cards (although
# not every card will support every resolution). To use the Linux framebuffer
# console, you need to enable these kernel options:
# Using 'make menuconfig', in 'console drivers', enable:
# [*] VGA text console
# [*] Video mode selection support
# [*] Support for frame buffer devices (EXPERIMENTAL)
# [*] VESA VGA graphics console
# [*] Advanced low level driver options
# <*> 8 bpp packed pixels support
# <*> 16 bpp packed pixels support
# <*> 24 bpp packed pixels support
# <*> 32 bpp packed pixels support
# <*> VGA characters/attributes support
# [*] Select compiled-in fonts
# [*] VGA 8x8 font
# [*] VGA 8x16 font
# If you have a Matrox or ATI Mach64, you might try enabling the options having
# to do with those cards as well. However, if the card is VESA compliant, you
# don't really need to (and it might cause problems, possibly)
#
# Next, if this file is not already named /etc/X11/XF86Config, make a copy
# with that name. This file ships with the name XF86Config-fbdev to avoid
# overwriting an existing config file.
#
# To get the kernel to start in VESA framebuffer mode, you need to pass it
# a vga= init string at boot time. For example, if you use LILO you'll
# probably find a vga=normal string in your /etc/lilo.conf. If you edit that
# to one of the values in this table:
#
# Colours 640x480 800x600 1024x768 1280x1024 1600x1200
# --------+---------------------------------------------
# 256 | 769 771 773 775 796
# 32,768 | 784 787 790 793 797
# 65,536 | 785 788 791 794 798
# 16.8M | 786 789 792 795 799
#
# ...such as this for 1024x768x64k:
# vga = 791
# and then reinstall LILO by running 'lilo' as root, then at the next boot
# Linux should start in a VESA framebuffer console mode.
#
# For more information on how to activate the Linux frame buffer, see
# /usr/src/linux/Documentation/fb/vesafb.txt.
#
# Enjoy! :)
# -- volk...@slackware.com
#

# **********************************************************************
# Module section -- this section is used to specify
# which dynamically loadable modules to load.
# **********************************************************************
#
Section "Module"

# This loads the DBE extension module.

Load "dbe" # Double buffer extension

# This loads the miscellaneous extensions module, and disables
# initialisation of the XFree86-DGA extension within that module.
SubSection "extmod"
Option "omit xfree86-dga" # don't initialise the DGA extension
EndSubSection

# This loads the font modules
Load "type1"
Load "freetype"
Load "speedo"

# This loads the GLX module
Load "glx"

EndSection

# **********************************************************************
# Files section. This allows default font and rgb paths to be set
# **********************************************************************
(snip)

# **********************************************************************
# Server flags section.
# **********************************************************************

Section "ServerFlags"

# Uncomment this to cause a core dump at the spot where a signal is
# received. This may leave the console in an unusable state, but may
# provide a better stack trace in the core dump to aid in debugging

# Option "NoTrapSignals"

# Uncomment this to disable the <Crtl><Alt><BS> server abort sequence
# This allows clients to receive this key event.

# Option "DontZap"

# Uncomment this to disable the <Crtl><Alt><KP_+>/<KP_-> mode switching
# sequences. This allows clients to receive these key events.

# Option "Dont Zoom"

# Uncomment this to disable tuning with the xvidtune client. With
# it the client can still run and fetch card and monitor attributes,
# but it will not be allowed to change them. If it tries it will
# receive a protocol error.

# Option "DisableVidModeExtension"

# Uncomment this to enable the use of a non-local xvidtune client.

# Option "AllowNonLocalXvidtune"

# Uncomment this to disable dynamically modifying the input device
# (mouse and keyboard) settings.

# Option "DisableModInDev"

# Uncomment this to enable the use of a non-local client to
# change the keyboard or mouse settings (currently only xset).

# Option "AllowNonLocalModInDev"

EndSection

# **********************************************************************
# Input devices
# **********************************************************************
(snip)
# EndSection

# **********************************************************************
# Monitor section
# **********************************************************************

(snip)

# **********************************************************************
# Graphics device section
# **********************************************************************

# Any number of graphics device sections may be present

Section "Device"
Identifier "VESA Framebuffer"
Driver "fbdev"
#VideoRam 4096
# Insert Clocks lines here if appropriate
EndSection

# **********************************************************************
# Screen sections
# **********************************************************************

# Any number of screen sections may be present. Each describes
# the configuration of a single screen. A single specific screen section
# may be specified from the X server command line with the "-screen"
# option.
Section "Screen"
Identifier "Screen 1"
Device "VESA Framebuffer"
Monitor "My Monitor"

# You shouldn't need to set a default depth as the server will use
# whatever the framebuffer is set to. If you insist on setting it, make
# sure it matches the setting for your framebuffer.
# DefaultDepth 8

Subsection "Display"
Depth 8
EndSubsection
Subsection "Display"
Depth 16
EndSubsection
Subsection "Display"
Depth 24
EndSubsection
Subsection "Display"
Depth 32
EndSubsection

EndSection

# **********************************************************************
# ServerLayout sections.
# **********************************************************************
(snip)


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Paolo Bientinesi

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Feb 1, 2002, 1:14:08 PM2/1/02
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> 1. preponderately text console
>
> 2. preponderately X

definitely 1
--
PaulDj

pau...@cs.utexas.edu bie...@imc.pi.cnr.it

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