[GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system.

[Bruce Hislop via Gmclist]

Anyone using these:

http://www.centramatic.com/wheel-balance.rhtml?type=Light-Duty

I did a search and found a single thread from 2014 which immediately went sideways off topic.

Anyway, from youtube videos I saw, everyone seems to be happy with them.

I've had my wheels dynamically balanced last year and again this year. Last year they balanced them without my tire pressure sensor in place, So I had
to pay them to do it again!! Before that I had beads which seemed ok, but they seemed to get stuck in the wrong place many times and a railway track
would usually shake them loose and back to normal again.

Anyway, just came back from 3,000 miles of shaking so looking for something better.

--
Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that

_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org

[Emery Stora via Gmclist]

I used Centramatic balances from 1973 to 1979 on my Dodge Travco. At that time they weee a round tube filled with oil and small ball bearings. They clipped inside the rim of my 17-1/2” wheels. Today they are on a disc which mounts behind the wheel lugs.
I haven’t used the new style but the old ones worked very well. I met the inventor and bought mine from him at an FMCA convention booth

Emery Stora

[Ken Burton via Gmclist]

My suggestion is go back to the balancing beads and this time use air-soft pellets from Walmart in the sporting goods section. The are plastic and
will not cake together from moisture or excessive use of rubber lub. 1 bottle will do more than just your coach. Cost $10.00 to 15.00. Weight out
six 4 oz. bags. Break the bead of each tire and throw then inside. No need to remove the existing wheel weights. One coach we put them in the guy
showed up with a big c-clamp and was able to break the tire bead loose without removing the wheel from the coach.
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana

[tonka6cuda6--- via Gmclist]

Bruce is there any high end car shops or Euro performance car shops in your area? Alot of times those shops will have high speed balancing machines
for those wide/thin side walled euro tires.

Alot of the balancers in use today in general shops dont spin the tires very fast so you'll end up with wheels that are ok for the average use but not
good enough for stuff like this....we had the same problem at VW when i worked there till they installed the high speed balancer.

The the best option in my opinion, although not to common, is "on vehicle" balancing".....i did a bunch of that as well. You might be able to get it
done at a semi truck tire shop but i would call and ask first.
--
Rich Mondor,

Brockville, ON

77 Hughes 2600

[Ken Henderson via Gmclist]

I heartily agree with Ken B. Over the years with the GMC I've used
conventional balancing with and without truing, and Counteract balancing
beads. The current set of tires, nearing 6 years old and replacement
before GMCMI Mansfield, were balanced with the Walmart airsoft pellets when
installed. I've already got the 6 bags of with 4 oz. each ready (from the
jar I bought 6 years ago) for the new set. I MAY have noticed a little
unbalance a couple of times, below 30 mph. Otherwise, the balance has been
excellent -- at least as good as with any of the other techniques.

Ken B's advice is perfect AFAIC.

Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, Troy-Bilt APU, etc., etc., etc.
www.gmcwipersetc.com

[John R. Lebetski via Gmclist]

I got fed up and bought a 240V Central Machinery computer spin balancer for home. Then bought the wall
mount coated weight selection package from Rubber Inc. Never looked back. When I get any new tires mounted for any vehicle ( I bring in loose wheels
never the vehicle) I check them for balance and have to correct 50% of them that come up .50 or more wrong. They don't care, it's not their car or RV
close enough is good enough for most people not to complain and actually take time off to come back. Looking for a tire machine now to eliminate that
step too.
--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II

[Bruce Hislop via Gmclist]

I think I had CounterAct beads (can't recall the name brand for sure) in them up to last year. They seemed to work Ok for the first couple of years
then became hit and miss. I figured they were getting stuck together somehow because a RR track or a good bumpy road seemed to improve them.

I may try the Airsoft beads. They seem larger so maybe they don't get stuck as easily. Having to break the bead isn't fun. These tires are from
spring 2013 so I plan on replacing them over the winter so I don't want to spend alot of money on them.

Thanks

[Bob Heller via Gmclist]

In 2017 I bought a spin balancer and some weights and now mount and balance my own tires.

The latest version: https://www.derekweaver.com/rodders-garage/wheel-balancers/weaver-w-937-40-wheel-balancer/

I got tired of the vehicles (cars, rv) shaking at highway speeds after tires being replaced. I also got tired of taking the cars or, for the GMC, the
tires/wheels back to the tire shops to be rebalanced over and over again. In the GMC tires, both airsofts and ceramic beads worked OK some of the time
but were inconsistent. I gave the ceramic beads to Ken H, hopefully he has better luck with them than I did.

We had taken our vehicles to Walmart, Sears, and several local tire shops with limited success.

Some reasons why I gave up and bought my own balancer:

example: I found that the Michelin tires purchased at Sears for the Avalon were in better balance with no weights than with those Sears had put on.
Took it back, they say it's fine. Got my balancer and balanced them properly and the car is smooth again. Donna drove around for over a year with
shaking tires.

example: For the tires purchased at Walmart, the Dodge rims take hammer on weights for the inner and stick-on weights for the outer, there is a ledge
just behind the spokes to put the sticky weights on. Walmart put the proper weights on the inner but nothing on the outer. I put the proper outer
sticky weights on and the van rides smooth again. Brand new tires, van drove fine on the old tires, Walmart says everything was as good as it gets.

example: On the GMC tires, I watched the local shop guy spin balance one of them. Then I told him to hit the button spin it again. Different reading.
Spin again, different reading. Over and over. Apparently his balancer was not calibrated or something was wrong with it. Can't balance a tire
accurately if the machine isn't working properly.

example: Crown Vic drives fine, old Goodyear tires are worn, go to local shop and buy 4 new Falken tires, car now shakes at highway speed. Take it
back several times, better but not right. Now I have my balancer and find several tires over 1 oz out. Rebalance and car drives almost as good as it
did with the old tires. Falkens are awesome in the rain though.


Anyway, the usual disclaimers: JWID and YMMV.
--
Bob Heller
1974 X-Canyonlands 26ft
Original 455 except for timing chain, Rockwell intake, valve covers.
Ferrara air bags. 147k miles.
Winter Springs FL

[Emery Stora via Gmclist]

Another thing to watch when a shop is doing your balancing. DO NOT let them use a cone to hold the wheel on the balancer. It will not work properly especially on Alcoa type wheels. They must use a lug mounted adapter. If they argue with you after they hav balanced with a cone ask them to loosen it and rotate it 00 degrees and check the balance. It will be way off.

Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick CO

[Dave Stragand via Gmclist]

I also would recommend finding a shop near you that has a Hunter Road Force GSP9700 balancer. It balances not just on weight, but also on wheel runout and sidewall flex inconsistencies by means of a roller that simulates driving down the road.

Over the years I have had great success with shops that have these balancers... and they usually charge the same as a shop with a regular spin balancer.

You can find one near you by going to
https://www.hunter.com/gsp9700.

-Dave
1978 Transmode near Pittsburgh

[Jim Kanomata via Gmclist]

We were introduced to a Silica Balancing Bead that comes in a pack and all
you do is throw it in the tire , air it up and drive it for few miles and
the packet opens up and distributes.
In the past the material will ball up,etc.
Silica behaves differently.
Tom Hampton of Grandview GMC has been using them for while and we have
followed his lead.
They are around $ 6.00 a pack.
We stock them.

--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
ji...@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502

[Dolph Santorine via Gmclist]

Dave:

That’s great information. What a cool piece of technology.

What it does makes complete sense.

https://www.hunter.com/wheel-balancers/road-force-elite <https://www.hunter.com/wheel-balancers/road-force-elite>

Dolph

DE AD0LF

Wheeling, West Virginia

1977 26’ ex-PalmBeach
Howell EFI & EBL, Reaction Arms, Manny Transmission

“The Aluminum and Fiberglass Mistress"

[Ken Burton via Gmclist]

While Ken H. was using Counteract in the same time frame I was using Equal. Neither of us had any real complaints but when someone suggested airsoft
beads / pellets, I tried them on my 4 wheel 11,000 GVW trailer. They worked great. Since then I have used them in just about everything. I get most
of my odd ball tires mounted and balanced at Walmart and they are use to me. $10.00 each. One time I left a couple of tires there to be mounted and
picked up that evening. The tire guy called me about 1.5 hours later and asked where the bags of airsoft beads were. I forgot to leave them and was
then about 70 miles away. He said, do not worry about it. I'll mount them, balance them, and then break the bead on only one side so the tire vs.
rim position will not move. When you come in we can just drop the airsoft beads in and air them up again. OR I can go grab a new bottle off of
the shelf in Sporting Goods and charge you for one bottle. How much weight do you want in each tire?

The point is more and more places are becoming use to people using airsoft beads and this place knew enough to call me when I forgot to leave the
pre-measured baggies of them with the tires.

I like the airsoft because they work, are inexpensive, and you do not need filtered valve cores. They also do not clump if installed with moist air.
Just do not put slime in your tires later. I assume that will make them clump.

Ken B.

Ken Henderson wrote on Thu, 08 August 2019 16:50

[John R. Lebetski via Gmclist]

Once I get 00 on my spin balancer I loosen and rotate the assembly some random amount and repeat. If different then the wheel was not homed correctly
on the machine. Since I am not being hounded to get to the next vehicle, I can repeat 3 or more times for locked consistent results. The other clue is
at first spin you are off by like 2.50 or more. Don't just hammer on weights like the kid at the tire place would do. Question the concentric fit to
the machine. I find the Alcoa hubs are high precision and that you have to select the correct cone size. Not unlike seating a wheel bearing before
adjusting, I spin the wheel as it snugs to help self center it. If an assembly is in question after consistent good balance, I have removed it and
started over just to prove it is correct. That way I don't get " come backs" which would actually be me to my garage.

--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II

[James Hupy via Gmclist]

Many years ago, when dirt was young, I worked weekends and evenings in a
SERVICE STATION. A flying A, if memory serves me. I used to mount and
balance bias ply tires, this was before radials. The balancer was a Coates
& Clark, and the mounting machine was an Iron Tireman. Mostly steel wheels
in those days. The wheels were nearly all miles out of round, and wobbled
like crazy. Even newer stuff was poorly made. It was always a challenge to
get them mounted and balanced correctly. There were syncrobalancers back
then. They mounted like hubcaps. Never had one apart, but they rattled like
they were full of lead shot or ball bearings. Anyhow, it was always a big
hassle to get them spot on. Promised myself 2 things back then. Never work
in a tire shop, or an exhaust shop. Never did, either.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

[Bruce Hislop via Gmclist]

Dave,
I checked your link for a tire shop using the Hunter GSP9700 and it shows up that the local tire shop I used last year and again last month has this
machine!

Both time they put the same guy on my job. This past time I saw him hammering the clip-on weights onto my aluminum wheels so I walked back to ask him
not to use those (my experience is they fall off too easily). He was having a hard time understanding me since he is a recent immigrant. I then
noticed all the stones stuck in the tire. I had to drive through construction on their street so It was pretty well loaded with stones.

I'm not sure whether to go back to this place and give them one more shot at it.

[Dave Stragand via Gmclist]

Back in the 1980's, a customer at our Goodyear came back complaining of
a bad vibration from one of the front tires I had replaced less than an
hour before. I found the affected wheel, but no matter how I added
weight it simply would not balance. I decided to completely remount the
tire and hope for better luck. Only then did I see that I had somehow
knocked our valve stem puller tool down inside the tire. That tool
weighed probably 8 ounces or more, but remained remarkably quiet inside
the tire. Once removed, it balanced without issue.

These days mounting always seems include balancing, but back then we
charged around $30-$40 for balancing a set of 4. At least half of the
folks skipped it as that was the price of a whole average tire.
Considering that we sometimes used up to 5 ounces or more of weights to
balance out a wheel or tire, I can only imagine how those cars must have
felt to drive without being balanced.

I wonder how many GMCs rolled on 6 unbalanced tires in those days?

-Dave
1978 Transmode near Pittsburgh

[Bruce Hislop via Gmclist]

FYI, Heard back from Centramatic. One of the Centramatic guys had a Royale so they designed a set to clip on the inside of the wheel as Emery noted
on his Travco.

They made about 60 sets of these to fit the OEM 16.5" rims and the 16" aluminum. They haven't promoted them in a while though.

Anyone out there still using one of these 60 odd sets?

[Nelson Wright via Gmclist]

All this discussion on wheel/tire balancing and no mention of tire truing? I thought that we found this to be the solution for the rear wheel bounce. I know it has worked for me for the last many years.



Sent from my iPhone
Nelson Wright
78 Royale rear bath
Currently on the VA Skyline Drive

Orlando Fl.

[John R. Lebetski via Gmclist]

Thr problem with trueing is that then the tread is running true, but the carcas is not. This can cause uneven stiffness as it rotates. Driving a GMC
with newer balaced tires, good shocks, proper FE and quite exhaust on smooth road is a lot like being in smooth air in a Gulfsteam G aircraft.

--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II

[gene Fisher]

On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 11:13 AM Dave Stragand via Gmclist <
gmc...@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:

> Back in the 1980's, a customer at our Goodyear came back complaining of
> a bad vibration from one of the front tires I had replaced less than an
> hour before. I found the affected wheel, but no matter how I added
> weight it simply would not balance. I decided to completely remount the
> tire and hope for better luck. Only then did I see that I had somehow
> knocked our valve stem puller tool down inside the tire. That tool
> weighed probably 8 ounces or more, but remained remarkably quiet inside
> the tire. Once removed, it balanced without issue.
>
> These days mounting always seems include balancing, but back then we
> charged around $30-$40 for balancing a set of 4. At least half of the
> folks skipped it as that was the price of a whole average tire.

> Considering that we som you etimes used up to 5 ounces or more of weights

--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html

[Johnny Bridges via Gmclist]

When I balanced wheels - as a kid in a service station and later on the Spridget racer - used a machine which spun the wheel on the car, on which you
mounted a round assembly with a shaft and four rings you could hold from spinning with your fingers. The rings moved weights around in large and
small increments. With the first one, you put your freehand on the can - suspension if it's reachable - and dangled a finger as you adjusted the
weights, looking for a non - shaking finger which indicated balance. The windows in the weight adapter told you how much weight and where to put it.
The later model had a strobe with a meter in it and a pickup which you place near the lower control arm. As the wheel came into balance the meter
would drop into the green zone and the strobe would light where the weight noted on the adapter should be placed. These balanced the entire spinning
assembly - wheel, bearings, and drive axles as appropriate.

--johnny
--
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell