Re: Re: [Gmail-Users] Gmail is Marking Authentic Emails as Spam!

[F2@YAHOO from MBP TO GMail]

Hi Andy,

I posted a few days ago after exporting 12 yrs worth of Yahoo mail on my MacBook Pro into a Gmail account, and encountered the same problem of Gmail thinking 48 old messages were spam, when they weren’t, and getting caught in the endless loop….    I can’t recall exactly what I did, only that it involved labeling the improperly-identified messages in the Spam folder (calling the label “e-mails Gmail thinks are spam” or some such), then MOVING the contents of the e-mails with the newly-created label into the in-box from spam, and then deleting the temporary label I just created.  

All I know is it worked, and unfortunately I cannot confirm the approach since, I don’t have any problems, with no e-mails marked as spam.…  If not that, it was something close to that kind of approach.

It turns out it’s the same kind of approach that resolves another iPhone 4 bug, where the native iPhone mail app gives sorting priority to the most-recently imported e-mails, NOT sorting by the dates of the e-mails themselves (i.e. it ignores the date/time stamps of the e-mails).  In that case, I took all 8,000 messages found in the in-box (where they displayed properly on the Gmail browser) and created a temporary label (which I called, "reimported for the sake of the iPhone"), moved the labelled e-mails into the In-box, and deleted the label.  My iPhone sorted them properly after that….

Of course, the easier answer is to just run the Gmail iOS app on the iPhone, and let it handle e-mail.

Dave

On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:21 PM, Andy <AI.e...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 10:47 AM, DavePeres <feefer...@gmail.com> wrote:

I found a solution.

Create a label (called "email Gmail thinks are spam") and move all the contents of the spam folder into it.  Then move the contents of the new label into the inbox, and Gmail seems to be able to not think it's spam any longer.

How is this different than simply moving those messages from Spam to the Inbox?

Google has only one chance to mark a message as Spam: when it arrives.  Once it has that opportunity, it can't mark the same message as Spam again.  A different message (that looks the same) might end up in Spam again, but that's not the same thing.

Andy

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[Jeff Baker]

It is now the middle of 2015 and Gmail's spam filters have not improved.  It still randomly puts it's own Google Analytics emails in spam.  But it is random. I'll get one email sent to my inbox one day and another day an email that looks almost exactly the same will go to spam.  I press "Not Spam" on email messages all the time and yet new emails will still end up in Spam.  It is my opinion that Gmail's spam filters are not trainable.

On Sunday, March 4, 2012 at 9:03:02 AM UTC-8, Tom Rodman wrote:

I've been seeing a lot of "slippage" with the quality of spam filtering in Gmail and Google Apps lately, too. For me, among the "oddities," they've been treating their own emails (from Google Music, and Google Analytics, at least) as Spam, and it seems that no matter how many times I indicate these are "Not Spam," it doesn't get corrected.

Has G "blacklisted" itself? :)

[saikat]

Gmail is marking legitimate email as spam. It used to happen every
once in a while but now instead of sending legitimate (but perhaps
bulk) mails to bulk it’s sending them to bulk.

Surprisingly, even the Google calender notification mails are sent to
Spam!! I have already missed few important events because of this.

This Gmail help link ( http://support.google.com/mail/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=9008
) tells that if you create a filter then it would never send any mail
with that filter to spam but all my Google calender event reminders
are added ‘Calender’ label automatically using a filter, and still
they are ending up in Spam?

Is there any way to stop this from happening?

[Andy]

> Gmail is marking legitimate email as spam.

Yes, it can happen. Gmail's spam filters are trainable, they can
effectively be set to be more or less sensitive, and sometimes they
will mark things as spam when they aren't. I don't know the exact
mechanism of Gmail's spam filter ... how much is based on content of
the message and how much is otherwise (headers, sender's domain, etc.)
... but spam detection is not an exact science. It is a constantly
moving target.

You need to mark them as Not Spam, to help re-train your account's spam filter.

> This Gmail help link  ( http://support.google.com/mail/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=9008
> ) tells that if you create a filter then it would never send any mail
> with that filter to spam but all my Google calender event reminders
> are added ‘Calender’ label automatically using a filter, and still
> they are ending up in Spam?

Does your filter include the "Never send to spam" option? If not,
edit your filters and add it. That's what they were suggesting by
using a filter to keep non-spam out of spam. Simply having a filter
to label a message won't keep it out of spam. That link didn't make
this very clear.

Andy

[saikat]

Thanks Andy.

Yes, that's what I am doing, marking all the mails as 'not spam' and
hoping it will correct itself.

How could you set it to be more or less sensitive though? is there
some settings for that?

[Andy]

> Yes, that's what I am doing, marking all the mails as 'not spam' and
> hoping it will correct itself.

It should. But it will never be 100% perfect. (Those Google Calendar
alerts are kind of funny. The same thing happened to me. You would
think that Google ought to know its own emails aren't spam.)

> How could you set it to be more or less sensitive though? is there
> some settings for that?

There is no setting, not precisely. You are affecting how sensitive
it is by clicking "Not spam". This helps train the spam filter.
Sometimes it works right away, sometimes it is stubborn, sometimes you
just have to use your own filter to keep things from going into Spam.

Andy

[Luis Santos]

Of course no automated algorithm can be 100% perfect.

But there are acceptable errors and unacceptable errors.

GMail marking a google calendar notification as spam is an unacceptable error!

--

Att

Luis Santos

2012/2/19 Andy <AI.e...@gmail.com>

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[Tom Rodman]

I've been seeing a lot of "slippage" with the quality of spam filtering in Gmail and Google Apps lately, too. For me, among the "oddities," they've been treating their own emails (from Google Music, and Google Analytics, at least) as Spam, and it seems that no matter how many times I indicate these are "Not Spam," it doesn't get corrected.

Has G "blacklisted" itself? :)

[Hilmy Hasanuddin]

Filter and Gmail algorithm...

Well, nowadays, you can not always certain that our email is clean of every malware. We don't know how important is your email account, thus everybody just keep trying to break everyone's email by guessing password, injecting a script, trojan horse or some other things danger to your desktop's health, or just trying to steal CC number, or else.

I figure, Gmail algorithm knows what they are doing. In my own opinion, sometimes false alarm may not look like it's appearance. IMO, lot of people out there perhaps making a joke (or not) by marking Calendar as spam, or in some point (in some servers), some virus/malwarescript/badware are waiting to hitchhike piggybacking their way to do us harm, unless we are some web programming expert, we will never know that such thing. I'm just glad that Gmail is "algorithmly strong", that my email still haven't throwing anything legit to spam. Apps or no apps.

This is just a friendly reminder that computer and internet network are vast area. We tend to plant antivirus, firewall, malwarebytes, but our friend or Colleague is not aware of this. They got a badware in their mailbox, and they are sending email to us, what to do? We work everyday to use the goodware all the time, that we forgot, Gmail is trained not only to stop spam but also to stop badware. Therefore, I still believe Gmail filter is doing their best job.

---

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Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2012 09:03:02 -0800 (PST)

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Subject: Re: [Gmail-Users] Re: Gmail is Marking Authentic Emails as Spam!

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[Andy]

> Has G "blacklisted" itself? :)

The way I look at it (and I am not "in the know", and could easily be
wrong), Gmail's spam filtering probably uses a combination of content
within the body of the message itself, and stuff in the email headers
(which we mostly don't see, but you can use "Show original" to see the
full headers of any message). My guess is that those emails from
Google Calendar, Google Music, etc., might not be formatted with the
"correct" header information to make them look 100% kosher, so Gmail
flags them as spam.

How could this happen, when those emails also come from within Google?
Probably because Google is a big company, and the people writing the
Google Calendar and Google Music applications, don't work in the Gmail
department, so they may not know the correct things to do to make
their emails look good. They are only humans, not infallible.

That's my guess.

If we knew people in the Google Music department, perhaps we could
suggest to them that they sit down with the Gmail folks and find out
what they are doing wrong in their bulk emails.

I have seen references to Gmail Help about people who send legitimate
bulk email that consistently ends up in people's Spam folder, and what
they do wrong in the headers that causes that. My guess is these
other Google programmers haven't read those recommendations.

It is also true that spam is a constantly moving target. The people
who send spam are always trying to make them get past the filters,
while the people who write the filters are always trying to make them
more clever, to catch those spam emails designed to thwart the
filters. In the process, there may be some collateral damage.

Andy

[Thomson]

I know people who haven't figured out how to turn off the calendar
notifications, so their workaround might be to mark them as spam in
gMail. Then as you note, if enough people do this then gMail's
filters might come to "believe" Google Calendar notifications are
actual spam and begin automatically sending everyone's gCalendar
notifications directly to the spam folder.

Human nature is very difficult to overcome... if it were not the world
would be a better place. :\


On Mar 4, 9:09 pm, "Hilmy Hasanuddin" <hilmy.hasanud...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Filter and Gmail algorithm...
>
...
>
> I figure, Gmail algorithm knows what they are doing. In my own opinion, sometimes false alarm may not look like it's appearance. IMO, lot of people  out there perhaps making a joke (or not) by marking Calendar as spam,...

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tom Rodman <tom92...@gmail.com>
> Sender: gmail...@googlegroups.com
> Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2012 09:03:02
> To: <gmail...@googlegroups.com>
> Reply-To: gmail...@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Gmail-Users] Re: Gmail is Marking Authentic Emails as Spam!
>
> I've been seeing a lot of "slippage" with the quality of spam filtering in
> Gmail and Google Apps lately, too. For me, among the "oddities," they've
> been treating their own emails (from Google Music, and Google Analytics, at
> least) as Spam, and it seems that no matter how many times I indicate these
> are "Not Spam," it doesn't get corrected.
>
> Has G "blacklisted" itself? :)
>
> On Wednesday, February 22, 2012 9:13:55 AM UTC-8, Luis Santos wrote:
>
> > Of course no automated algorithm can be 100% perfect.
>
> > But there are acceptable errors and unacceptable errors.
>
> > GMail marking a google calendar notification as spam is an unacceptable
> > error!

> > *
> > *
> > *--*
> > *Att*
> > *Luis Santos
>
> > *
> > *
> > *

>
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[Kenneth Ayers]

Are you looking at these emails that shouldn't be in spam using conversation view?  Try turning conversation view off to see if that makes a difference.  I.e., if there's another email that appears to be part of the same conversation that is regarded as spam, the whole conversation may be visible from spam.

On Wed, Aug 8, 2012 at 1:37 PM, GPaisley <gpai...@gmail.com> wrote:

I have added senders to my address book, created filters to send e-mail to my inbox and it STILL goes to my spam folder.  I mark it as "not spam" and then in about 15 minutes, it shows back up in my spam folder.  I have 4 e-mails that have bounced back to my spam folder probably six times today.

Gmail used to have a brilliant spam folder, and I never missed anything, but somethign changed about 4-5 months ago and now I get all kinds of letitimate mail  sent to my spam folder.

Any ideas of what I am missing?

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[Gordon Paisley]

no—these are standalone e-mails.  I know what you mean, but they are not in conversation view.

 

From: Kenneth Ayers

Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 11:07 PM

To: gmail...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: [Gmail-Users] Re: Gmail is Marking Authentic Emails as Spam!

 

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[Andy]

> I mark it as "not spam" and then in about 15 minutes, it shows back up in my spam folder.

I have never seen an email spontaneously re-appear in the Spam folder,
and I'd be very surprised if that is really happening. Unless an
email in the same thread arrived during those 15 minutes (and was sent
to Spam), then I don't think this could happen. As far as I know,
Gmail applies labels ONLY (a) when they arrive, or (b) when we tell it
to. The rest of the time it isn't sitting there trying to decide
whether existing messages already received, ought to be marked as
Spam, or otherwise have its labels changed on us.

So I wonder whether you inadvertently caused the message to go back to
Spam (hit the wrong button?), or if it didn't successfully get moved
out of the Spam folder in the first place.

But I'm no expert ... just a Gmail user.

Andy

[Gordon Paisley]

I know what you're saying, but I am really not doing anything to send it back.  I have created a filter for some items (mailing lists) multiple times, but it still sends to spam.  I have noticed that if I mark it as read in the inbox that it doesn't go back to spam.  It's as if gmail forgets what I told it to do after 15 minutes and then re-scans unread items in my inbox and re-sends them to spam.

Andy

[Andy]

> I know what you're saying, but I am really not doing anything to send it
> back. I have created a filter for some items (mailing lists) multiple
> times, but it still sends to spam. I have noticed that if I mark it as read
> in the inbox that it doesn't go back to spam. It's as if gmail forgets what
> I told it to do after 15 minutes and then re-scans unread items in my inbox
> and re-sends them to spam.

Hmm ... I forgot one more thing. It is also possible that you
received a "duplicate" message in the intervening 15 minutes. Gmail
has this really incredibly nasty habit (they call it a "feature") that
it deletes "duplicate" messages when they arrive, leaving no trace.
But it might have triggered the new appearance in the Spam folder,
before the duplicate was erased.

Gmail's/Google's definition of "duplicate" does not agree with mine.
They are fairly liberal about what constitutes a duplicate, worthy of
being deleted.

Andy

[Zack (Doc)]

I have also never seen this, and it doesn't even really make sense.  All filters, including spam filters, happen upon the message when it is delivered to your box, not repeatedly run.  The scenario Andy described below where a new message to the thread is the only option I can think of, and if you're not seeing it perhaps it was a deleted duplicate that re-initialized the message.

Another one I thought of is if there's an offline client at work here.  I know Eudora and Thunderbird can/do run their filters at pre-defined intervals, so it could see the message moved, and chose to move it back, itself.

On Wed, Oct 10, 2012 at 10:20 PM, John Dorrestyn <joh...@gmail.com> wrote:

HI all in the group :-)
did anyone find an answer to the email going to the spam folder and being marked as not spam and then it jumping back to the spam folder?
My mother has this exact scenario going on for her and she is not happy about it.
Today she had 8 legit emails in her spam folder, marked them all as Not Spam and 5 ended up back in the spam folder and she keeps trying to 'move' them, but they keep ending back in the spam folder.
I have never seen this happening and i have been using Gmail for many years now.
Any ideas appreciated.
Thanks.

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[Billy Bender]

I have the exact same problem Andy described.

I mark mail in my spam folder (that was sent from me to me) as not spam.  Then I check back a little later and its back in spam.  This has been happening over the last month or so.

I use only the web browsers to read gmail...no client software.

I have my email as a contact.

I have a filter set up to handle emails from me to me.

And all these things work when I first send the email.   I see it in my inbox.

But given enough time and its into the spam folder for the message.

So Andy is not crazy and I am not either.  Any ideas for us non-crazy folks with this real problem?

[GreenGuy]

Create a new filter, make it so that any message from "@" (every email) will have "Never send to Spam" checked off.

It helped me

[DavePeres]

I had the same problem after importing12 yrs of e-mails stored on my laptop from Yahoo into Gmail, where the web browser interface insisted that some old messages were spam, even right AFTER I told it they weren't.

The solution which worked for me was to create a new label (called "Messages Gmail thinks are spam") and then move ALL the contents of the spam folder into it (there's an option to select ALL contents of the spam folder on the middle of the page, so you don't have to repeat the process).   I then moved all the e-mails back into the Inbox, and Gmail doesn't think they're spam any longer. 

Dave

[DavePeres]

I found a solution.

Create a label (called "email Gmail thinks are spam") and move all the contents of the spam folder into it.  Then move the contents of the new label into the inbox, and Gmail seems to be able to not think it's spam any longer.

Dave


On Friday, February 17, 2012 10:54:37 AM UTC-8, saikat wrote:

[Andy]

On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 10:47 AM, DavePeres <feefer...@gmail.com> wrote:

I found a solution.

Create a label (called "email Gmail thinks are spam") and move all the contents of the spam folder into it.  Then move the contents of the new label into the inbox, and Gmail seems to be able to not think it's spam any longer.