Libertarianism = failed NeoKKKonservative Liedeology
V for Vendicar
Party of AmeriKKKa.
Now that Libertarianism has all but destroyed the AmeriKKKan state, it has
lost most if not all of it's mindless backers in the nation.
So long Suckers.....
You have no one to blame but yourselves.
Jeffrey Turner
Technically alt.politics.socialism.libertarian is about libertarian
socialism, an older and more interesting political philosophy than the
right-wing sort of Randian libertarianism.
--Jeff
--
I learned that ... the most grinding
poverty is a trifling evil compared
with the inequality of classes.
--William Morris
Michael Price
<Execute_The_Traitor_In_The_White_Ho...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> So sad to see all the Libertarian newsgroups as dead as the Libertarian
> Party of AmeriKKKa.
>
> Now that Libertarianism has all but destroyed the AmeriKKKan state, it has
> lost most if not all of it's mindless backers in the nation.
Yeah it's libertarianism that destroyed the American State because
there has been so much
of that about lately. I mean Frannie and Freddie, the Fed opening the
money pipes, the Iraq war,
the Community Redevelopment Act it's all so libertarian isn't it?
Moron.
Jeffrey Turner
> On Oct 19, 8:50 am, "V for Vendicar"
> <Execute_The_Traitor_In_The_White_Ho...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>So sad to see all the Libertarian newsgroups as dead as the Libertarian
>>Party of AmeriKKKa.
>>
>>Now that Libertarianism has all but destroyed the AmeriKKKan state, it has
>>lost most if not all of it's mindless backers in the nation.
>
> Yeah it's libertarianism that destroyed the American State because
> there has been so much
> of that about lately. I mean Frannie and Freddie, the Fed opening the
> money pipes, the Iraq war,
> the Community Redevelopment Act it's all so libertarian isn't it?
Alan Greenspan admitted as much. I can understand your grasping at
excuses, but some reasoned reflection and education might help.
> Moron.
You should set off your signature better.
--Jeff
>>So long Suckers.....
>>
>>You have no one to blame but yourselves.
Michael Price
> Michael Price wrote:
> > On Oct 19, 8:50 am, "V for Vendicar"
> > <Execute_The_Traitor_In_The_White_Ho...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>So sad to see all the Libertarian newsgroups as dead as the Libertarian
> >>Party of AmeriKKKa.
>
> >>Now that Libertarianism has all but destroyed the AmeriKKKan state, it has
> >>lost most if not all of it's mindless backers in the nation.
>
> > Yeah it's libertarianism that destroyed the American State because
> > there has been so much
> > of that about lately. I mean Frannie and Freddie, the Fed opening the
> > money pipes, the Iraq war,
> > the Community Redevelopment Act it's all so libertarian isn't it?
>
> Alan Greenspan admitted as much. I can understand your grasping at
> excuses, but some reasoned reflection and education might help.
>
Greenspan
over the obvious facts. Every thing I mentioned was the OPPOSITE of
the free market and were causes of the current crisis, yet you believe
that
Greenspan's free market ideas somehow caused it. How? Does the very
existence of free market ideas somehow contaminate the economy so
that even when their precise opposite is enacted they still cause
collapse?
> > Moron.
>
> You should set off your signature better.
>
> --Jeff
Wow, that's really witty. Now go and educate yourself if you are
educatable and
find one thing Greenspan did that was free market.
Jeffrey Turner
You've got to be more careful with your "obvious facts" as there's
been a concerted effort by the right-wing spin machine to assert
blame without enough facts. Fannie and Freddie were late to the
subprime game, getting involved only after their investors complained
that their profits weren't high enough and their shares of the
mortgage market were dropping.
This was a clear example of Gresham's Law operating on investments, as
deregulated and combined investment banks, commercial banks and
insurers had insufficient checks and balances to maintain oversight of
poor loans being upgraded to highly-rated bonds. Once again, Alan
Greenspan, once he recognized his ideological blinders were faulty,
and the two top-level bankers who joined him before Congress admitted
as much under questioning.
>>>Moron.
>>
>>You should set off your signature better.
>
> Wow, that's really witty. Now go and educate yourself if you are
> educatable and find one thing Greenspan did that was free market.
There is none so blind as he who will not see. Greenspan admits he
gave the banks too much rope and they hanged themselves. Why is it
that some usenet trolls think they are more knowledgeable? Ayn Rand
was a fiction writer, not an economist.
--Jeff
Michael Price
Together they had almost half the mortgage market. My facts were
right. Your "fact" that investors complained about low profits I very
much doubt. In fact it was when the management got caught with
their hand in the till that they were made to start loaning money to
people who couldn't pay it back.
> This was a clear example of Gresham's Law operating on investments, as
> deregulated and combined investment banks, commercial banks and
> insurers had insufficient checks and balances to maintain oversight of
> poor loans being upgraded to highly-rated bonds.
But why was government oversight of poor loans necessary? Because
loose monetary policy made those loans look good temporarily. This
would
not have happened in a free market.
> Once again, Alan
> Greenspan, once he recognized his ideological blinders were faulty,
> and the two top-level bankers who joined him before Congress admitted
> as much under questioning.
>
But his so called ideology had nothing to do with the actions that
caused the crisis. The cause of the crisis was government
intervention
and government intervention alone. Often intervention by Alan
Greenspan.
> >>>Moron.
>
> >>You should set off your signature better.
>
> > Wow, that's really witty. Now go and educate yourself if you are
> > educatable and find one thing Greenspan did that was free market.
>
> There is none so blind as he who will not see. Greenspan admits he
> gave the banks too much rope and they hanged themselves. Why is it
> that some usenet trolls think they are more knowledgeable?
Hey moron I asked for some evidence, not the word of Alan Greenspan.
Now find one thing that Greenspan did that was free market. One
thing.
The fact is that the Fed caused this problem, and that's undeniable by
rational beings. So why do you simply take Greenspan's word for it
that
free market ideology caused it.
> Ayn Rand was a fiction writer, not an economist.
>
She was a better economist than you that's for sure.
Jeffrey Turner
The point is, they didn't get in because the CRA forced them to, they
got in because their investors wanted a greater return.
> Together they had almost half the mortgage market. My facts were
> right.
And useless.
> Your "fact" that investors complained about low profits I very
> much doubt.
You don't know much about investors, do you?
> In fact it was when the management got caught with
> their hand in the till that they were made to start loaning money to
> people who couldn't pay it back.
OK, you're completely fact-free now.
>>This was a clear example of Gresham's Law operating on investments, as
>>deregulated and combined investment banks, commercial banks and
>>insurers had insufficient checks and balances to maintain oversight of
>>poor loans being upgraded to highly-rated bonds.
>
> But why was government oversight of poor loans necessary? Because
> loose monetary policy made those loans look good temporarily. This
> would not have happened in a free market.
Loose monetary policy? The banks were making the loans because there
were fees to be made from signing up the loans. The loans were being
sold as top-rated because the mergers put the insurers in a conflict
interest - they worked for the banks that made the loans. So they
"verified" the quality of the loans - and told themselves that there
were so many mortgages in a bundle that a couple defaults wouldn't be
a problem.
>> Once again, Alan
>>Greenspan, once he recognized his ideological blinders were faulty,
>>and the two top-level bankers who joined him before Congress admitted
>>as much under questioning.
>
> But his so called ideology had nothing to do with the actions that
> caused the crisis. The cause of the crisis was government
> intervention
> and government intervention alone. Often intervention by Alan
> Greenspan.
Complete and utter nonsense.
>>>>>Moron.
>>
>>>>You should set off your signature better.
>>
>>> Wow, that's really witty. Now go and educate yourself if you are
>>>educatable and find one thing Greenspan did that was free market.
>>
>>There is none so blind as he who will not see. Greenspan admits he
>>gave the banks too much rope and they hanged themselves. Why is it
>>that some usenet trolls think they are more knowledgeable?
>
> Hey moron I asked for some evidence, not the word of Alan Greenspan.
What evidence did you ever ask of Ayn Rand?
> Now find one thing that Greenspan did that was free market. One
> thing.
He mostly left the banks alone.
> The fact is that the Fed caused this problem, and that's undeniable by
> rational beings. So why do you simply take Greenspan's word for it
> that free market ideology caused it.
Because there's no evidence that the market wanted anything different.
>> Ayn Rand was a fiction writer, not an economist.
>
> She was a better economist than you that's for sure.
Your opinion ain't worth the electrons it's written on.
Michael Price
No they got into it to appease the politicians.
>
> > Together they had almost half the mortgage market. My facts were
> > right.
>
> And useless.
Nope, they were relevant and correct. The claim that
libertarianism
destroyed anything was plainly false and those facts proved it. That
was
the point you originally disputed with me remember?
>
> > Your "fact" that investors complained about low profits I very
> > much doubt.
>
> You don't know much about investors, do you?
I know that if I were one and I found out that management were
committing
crimes I'd be more worried about the government ruining the business
than
not getting the last cent out of every dollar.
>
> > In fact it was when the management got caught with
> > their hand in the till that they were made to start loaning money to
> > people who couldn't pay it back.
>
> OK, you're completely fact-free now.
No you are as proven by the fact that you haven't shown any
knowledge of
what happened at Frannie and Freddie at all.
>
> >>This was a clear example of Gresham's Law operating on investments, as
> >>deregulated and combined investment banks, commercial banks and
> >>insurers had insufficient checks and balances to maintain oversight of
> >>poor loans being upgraded to highly-rated bonds.
>
> > But why was government oversight of poor loans necessary? Because
> > loose monetary policy made those loans look good temporarily. This
> > would not have happened in a free market.
>
> Loose monetary policy? The banks were making the loans because there
> were fees to be made from signing up the loans.
In many cases, no. They were being made to avoid being sued under
the CRA.
> The loans were being
> sold as top-rated because the mergers put the insurers in a conflict
> interest - they worked for the banks that made the loans. So they
> "verified" the quality of the loans - and told themselves that there
> were so many mortgages in a bundle that a couple defaults wouldn't be
> a problem.
>
But the reason they believed there would only be a couple of
defaults was
the housing bubble wasn't it? I mean the whole thing rested on high
real
estate assessments without which nobody would have touched the loans
with a barge pole. And why were assessments rising? Because of the
bubble and hence because of loose monetary policy.
> >> Once again, Alan
> >>Greenspan, once he recognized his ideological blinders were faulty,
> >>and the two top-level bankers who joined him before Congress admitted
> >>as much under questioning.
>
> > But his so called ideology had nothing to do with the actions that
> > caused the crisis. The cause of the crisis was government
> > intervention and government intervention alone. Often intervention by Alan
> > Greenspan.
>
> Complete and utter nonsense.
>
> >>>>>Moron.
>
> >>>>You should set off your signature better.
>
> >>> Wow, that's really witty. Now go and educate yourself if you are
> >>>educatable and find one thing Greenspan did that was free market.
>
> >>There is none so blind as he who will not see. Greenspan admits he
> >>gave the banks too much rope and they hanged themselves. Why is it
> >>that some usenet trolls think they are more knowledgeable?
>
> > Hey moron I asked for some evidence, not the word of Alan Greenspan.
>
> What evidence did you ever ask of Ayn Rand?
>
When she was talking shit I wanted plenty of evidence. Evidently
you don't
have the same standards of her followers. Your complete lack of
evidence
noted.
> > Now find one thing that Greenspan did that was free market. One
> > thing.
>
> He mostly left the banks alone.
>
No idiot, he was the FEDERAL RESERVE CHAIRMAN! It's physically
impossible to leave the banks alone with that job.
> > The fact is that the Fed caused this problem, and that's undeniable by
> > rational beings. So why do you simply take Greenspan's word for it
> > that free market ideology caused it.
>
> Because there's no evidence that the market wanted anything different.
>
There is considerable evidence that the market didn't want it,
specifically
that the market is behaving as it is. You do know what the words "the
market"
mean don't you?
> >> Ayn Rand was a fiction writer, not an economist.
>
> > She was a better economist than you that's for sure.
>
> Your opinion ain't worth the electrons it's written on.
>
And yet you can't refute it.
V for Vendicar
"Michael Price" <nini...@yahoo.com> wrote
> the Community Redevelopment Act it's all so libertarian isn't it?
> Moron.
Sorry Shit Sack, that act didn't force banks to make bad loans.
Uncontroled, unregulated Libertarian greed did.
MORON.
V for Vendicar
"Michael Price" <nini...@yahoo.com> wrote
> I don't think it's "education" that causes you to believe Alan
> Greenspan over the obvious facts.
WHat? Libertarian Greenspan is a liar?
Ahahahahahaha...
Just like you.....
MORON....
V for Vendicar
"Michael Price" <nini...@yahoo.com> wrote
> They might have been late but they certainly made up for lost time.
> Together they had almost half the mortgage market.
And the CRA didn't apply to them since they didn't make any loans directly
to the public.
It's really funny watching you die hard neo-fascists accusing each other of
lying now that your chldish political Liedeology has been exposed as the
collossal failure it was predicted to be.
So much for the Libertarian Pedo Party.
So long Suckers....
V for Vendicar
"Michael Price" <nini...@yahoo.com> wrote
> I know that if I were one and I found out that management were
> committing crimes I'd be more worried about the government ruining the
> business
> than not getting the last cent out of every dollar.
That's odd because you Libertarian Shit Suckers are always complaining about
government not getting every cent out of it's various programs and now when
Libertarian Ideology is absolutely the cause of AmeriKKKa's fiscal crisis,
you suddenly don't care.
Well it always has been a central goal of the Libertarian political
Liedology to see AmeriKKKa go bankrupt rather than pay back what it owes to
it's creditors.
You are getting your wish. DeadBeat.
Michael Price
<Execute_The_Traitor_In_The_White_Ho...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Michael Price" <nini_...@yahoo.com> wrote
>
> > They might have been late but they certainly made up for lost time.
> > Together they had almost half the mortgage market.
>
> And the CRA didn't apply to them since they didn't make any loans directly
> to the public.
They bought up a lot of loans that were made because of the CRA
didn't they
though, liar? Sorry but your stupid delusion that libertarianism
caused the
crisis is exposed for the absurdity it is. Fascists like you caused
it.
>
> It's really funny watching you die hard neo-fascists accusing each other of
> lying now that your chldish political Liedeology has been exposed as the
> collossal failure it was predicted to be.
>
> So much for the Libertarian Pedo Party.
All you've got is smears.
>
> So long Suckers....
Michael Price
<Execute_The_Traitor_In_The_White_Ho...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Michael Price" <nini_...@yahoo.com> wrote
>
> > I know that if I were one and I found out that management were
> > committing crimes I'd be more worried about the government ruining the
> > business
> > than not getting the last cent out of every dollar.
>
> That's odd because you Libertarian Shit Suckers are always complaining about
> government not getting every cent out of it's various programs and now when
> Libertarian Ideology is absolutely the cause of AmeriKKKa's fiscal crisis,
> you suddenly don't care.
Sorry liar but I don't care a bit about government not getting every
cent out of
it's various programs and neither does any libertarian. We don't
think the
programs should happen, the fact that they are badly managed is a
minor point.
Of course the causes of the fiscal crisis are a) the Federal Reserve,
which
libertarians argued against for decades, b) the Community
Redevelopment Act
which libertarians argued against both passing and expanding and c)
Frannie and
Freddie which again libertarians argued against both forming and
protecting
after privatisation.
>
> Well it always has been a central goal of the Libertarian political
> Liedology to see AmeriKKKa go bankrupt rather than pay back what it owes to
> it's creditors.
Space left for you to provide evidence:
>
> You are getting your wish. DeadBeat.
A deadbeat is someone who won't pay debts they contracted, you're
blaming libertarians
for not paying debts others contracted against our recommendation.
Who's the deadbeats,
those who wanted a balanced budget or those who've been cheating their
creditors with
inflation for decades?
Michael Price
<Execute_The_Traitor_In_The_White_Ho...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Michael Price" <nini_...@yahoo.com> wrote
>
> > the Community Redevelopment Act it's all so libertarian isn't it?
> > Moron.
>
> Sorry Shit Sack, that act didn't force banks to make bad loans.
>
you
utterly ignorant man.
> Uncontroled, unregulated Libertarian greed did.
>
That would be more credible if the finance industry wasn't one of
the most
controlled and regulated sectors of the economy.
> MORON.
Michael Price
<Execute_The_Traitor_In_The_White_Ho...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Michael Price" <nini_...@yahoo.com> wrote
>
> > I don't think it's "education" that causes you to believe Alan
> > Greenspan over the obvious facts.
>
> WHat? Libertarian Greenspan is a liar?
Since when has Greenspan actually persued libertarian policies?
Greenspan
has been behaved in the exact opposite of the way a libertarian would
act once
he got power. Face it he's one of your party, essentially a fascist
like you.
>
> Ahahahahahaha...
>
> Just like you.....
>
And yet every time you try to prove I'm a liar you come up with
things like
"Sorry Shit Sack, that act didn't force banks to make bad loans. "
which is a
lie itself.
> MORON....
Topaz
Here are some quotes from the 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica
after the heading Ku Klux Klan:
"Ku Klux Klan, the name of an American secret association of Southern
whites united for self-protection and to oppose the Reconstruction
measures of the United States Congress"
"The various causes assigned for the origin and development of
this movement were: the absence of stable government in the South for
several years after the Civil War; the corrupt and tyrannical rule of
the alien, renegade and negro, and the belief that it was supported by
the Federal troops which controlled elections and legislative bodies;
the disfranchisement of whites; the spread of ideas of social and
political equality among the negroes; fear of negro insurrections; the
arming of negro militia and the disarming of whites; outrages upon
white women by black men"
"The constitutions and rituals of these secret orders have
declarations of principles, of which the following are characteristic:
to protect and succour the weak and unfortunate, especially the widows
and orphans of Confederate soldiers; to protect members of the white
race in life, honour and property from the encroachments of the
blacks"
"To control the negro the Klan played upon his superstitious
fears by having night patrols, parades and drills of silent horsemen
covered with white sheets, carrying skulls with coals of fire for
eyes"
"the Ku Klux movement went on until it accomplished its object by
giving protection to the whites, reducing the blacks to order,
replacing the whites in control of society and state, expelling the
worst of the carpet-baggers and scalawags, and nullifying those laws
of Congress which had resulted in placing the Southern whites under
the control of a party composed principally of ex-slaves."
http://www.ihr.org/ http://www.natvan.com