New Work and Revisions

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Joel DuBray

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Apr 17, 2014, 2:25:36 AM4/17/14
to Cary Dube, Joseph Domenici
Hey Cary,

I have new character sprite work for you when you finish the arena. We've decided we want an upward facing attack, and a downward facing attack for all 13 characters. It will be the same specifications as the other attack sprites. Please be sure to compare the transition from the downward facing idle, and the upward facing idle into the attack animation.

On this note, we have some revisions we need for the captive. The transition from captivewalk2 into captiveidle2  has some shadow discrepancies on the sprite. On the captiveleftidle2 into the captiveleftattack1, the hair shifts in an illogical manner. We've also noticed several of the sprites are off center in their idles. We've fixed it in house, but it'd be great if you kept an eye out for it. 

Lastly, we're experimenting with a rotating cannon animation to track the projectile shot which involves removing the cannon from the base so that the barrel can move. Did you put the barrel on a separate layer? Either way can you send me the .psd?

So the to do items are:
1.) send me the three cannons .psd
2.) two captive sprite animation revisions
3.) 6 frame attack animations facing downward/upward for all 13 characters

Of course, the arena tiles come first, but this should be enough to keep you busy after the arena. 

Let me know if you have questions!

Cheers,
Joel

Joel DuBray

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Apr 22, 2014, 10:29:47 PM4/22/14
to fort...@googlegroups.com


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, Apr 22, 2014 at 7:00 PM
Subject: Re: New Work and Revisions
To: Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com>
Cc: Joseph Domenici <josephd...@gmail.com>


Hey guys

Sorry for the delayed response, some family ended up visiting for Easter. I am still working on the arena so Ill pass along what Ive got so far. I can send you the tiles I am using to make the fort, but they are pretty disorganized at this point so I figured I might as well wait until they are finished. I should definitely finish this week, sorry about the delay.

I did not keep the cannon barrels as separate layers I actually made it all on one layer and saved it as a png originally so all I have of the cannons are pngs. I can send you the psds for the firing and muzzle blast animations though if you need those? I can also separate the original sprites myself super quickly and send you psds.

I'll get right on the rest of that stuff when I finish the arena. Also sorry about the off center sprites you can feel free to send me small stuff like that. A formatting error like that I would fix free of charge.

Alright guys thanks for the work as always.

-Cary
Arena.png
invoice20.doc

Joel DuBray

unread,
Apr 23, 2014, 11:21:57 PM4/23/14
to Cary Dube, Joseph Domenici
Hey man,

12 hours is more than I wanted you to spend on this arena. The upward and downward attack animations are now a priority, so the arena doesn't have to be too polished. I like the touches and accents you've added. In your final delivery, I'd appreciate if you kept them on a separate layer so we can play with them later. 

I look forward to your Captive fixes. For the cannon .psd's I'll update you after the attack animations, but our engineering/arena mode isn't really blocked there. 

cheers,

Joel


On Tue, Apr 22, 2014 at 7:00 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys

Sorry for the delayed response, some family ended up visiting for Easter. I am still working on the arena so Ill pass along what Ive got so far. I can send you the tiles I am using to make the fort, but they are pretty disorganized at this point so I figured I might as well wait until they are finished. I should definitely finish this week, sorry about the delay.

I did not keep the cannon barrels as separate layers I actually made it all on one layer and saved it as a png originally so all I have of the cannons are pngs. I can send you the psds for the firing and muzzle blast animations though if you need those? I can also separate the original sprites myself super quickly and send you psds.

I'll get right on the rest of that stuff when I finish the arena. Also sorry about the off center sprites you can feel free to send me small stuff like that. A formatting error like that I would fix free of charge.

Alright guys thanks for the work as always.

-Cary
On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 2:25 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:

Joel DuBray

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May 6, 2014, 12:04:03 AM5/6/14
to fort...@googlegroups.com
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, May 5, 2014 at 8:58 PM
Subject: Re: New Work and Revisions
To: Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com>, Joseph Domenici <josephd...@gmail.com>


Hey guys

I just went to type up an update for this week and realized I totally forgot to send one for last week, so sorry about that. My goal for last week was basically to clean house a little bit as efficiently as possible. I had already put in an hour on the arena before I got that last email so I wrapped it up as quickly as possible after that. Ill include the tiles here as well as the fully assembled arena. Obviously this is just the way I put it together, there is a ton of variation available to you with this tileset so you guys can really make the arena look pretty different from the way I've configured it. I can of course also configure it differently if you guys want, just let me know. Ill also include a quick gif I made of how to put it together the way I set it up. It does include a fair amount of horizontal flipping and 90 degree rotation of tiles so tell me if you guys need the flipped versions saved as seperate files. Also if you guys want the psd, which includes a grid of guides that makes tile placement super easy, I can pass that along as well.

I also did the captive fixes. I changed the shadows on the idle2 sprite to match those on walk2 so let me know if that fixed the issue. I didn't make any changes to the walk2 sprite so I won't include that one. For the left attack this might be something I didn't recover during the computer transfer but I don't have any left attack sprites for the captive on file, so my guess was that it's probably just using a mirrored version of the right attack which would explain why the hair was shifting strangely, so I whipped up a quick left facing attack using a mirrored right attack and the hair from the left idles. I also fixed his shorts so those should make sense in the left attack now as well. All in all this only took a few hours so the invoice is pretty light for that week.

This week I started on the up and downward facing attacks. I didn't have a ton of time to work so all I've got for you so far is the Captain's downward attack. This next week should be much more productive so I'm hoping to knock out most of those attack animations by next weekend.

Sorry again for the late update.

Thanks
-Cary
finalarena.png
arenaguide.gif
captiveidle2.png
arenatiles.zip
captiveattackleft.zip
captainmeleedown.zip
invoice21.doc

Joel DuBray

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May 12, 2014, 11:16:38 PM5/12/14
to fort...@googlegroups.com
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, May 12, 2014 at 8:13 PM
Subject: Re: New Work and Revisions
To: Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com>, Joseph Domenici <josephd...@gmail.com>


Hey guys here's the update for last week. I wasnt sure how the sprites would stand in relation to one another so let me know if the up attack for the able seaman makes sense hitbox-wise. I kept it in pieces so its easy for me to adjust and Ill be using it as the template for the similar attacks just like I did for the right and left attack so I want to make sure its going to make sense in game. May 17th should be no problem. Oh also Ill include the arena psd. I had to merge some things, like the sand tiles, to prevent the file from getting crazy, but most stuff is still seperate and organized into folders.

As always let me know if you need anything changed.

Thanks
-Cary


On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 1:34 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary,

Thanks for the update and the captive fixes. Getting the arena .psd from you would be great. Also that gif is awesome and super helpful, thank you! We've set a hard deadline of May17th for finishing our arena build. This includes the up/down attack animations. I hope that's enough time. 

cheers,
Joel




On Mon, May 5, 2014 at 8:58 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys

I just went to type up an update for this week and realized I totally forgot to send one for last week, so sorry about that. My goal for last week was basically to clean house a little bit as efficiently as possible. I had already put in an hour on the arena before I got that last email so I wrapped it up as quickly as possible after that. Ill include the tiles here as well as the fully assembled arena. Obviously this is just the way I put it together, there is a ton of variation available to you with this tileset so you guys can really make the arena look pretty different from the way I've configured it. I can of course also configure it differently if you guys want, just let me know. Ill also include a quick gif I made of how to put it together the way I set it up. It does include a fair amount of horizontal flipping and 90 degree rotation of tiles so tell me if you guys need the flipped versions saved as seperate files. Also if you guys want the psd, which includes a grid of guides that makes tile placement super easy, I can pass that along as well.

I also did the captive fixes. I changed the shadows on the idle2 sprite to match those on walk2 so let me know if that fixed the issue. I didn't make any changes to the walk2 sprite so I won't include that one. For the left attack this might be something I didn't recover during the computer transfer but I don't have any left attack sprites for the captive on file, so my guess was that it's probably just using a mirrored version of the right attack which would explain why the hair was shifting strangely, so I whipped up a quick left facing attack using a mirrored right attack and the hair from the left idles. I also fixed his shorts so those should make sense in the left attack now as well. All in all this only took a few hours so the invoice is pretty light for that week.

This week I started on the up and downward facing attacks. I didn't have a ton of time to work so all I've got for you so far is the Captain's downward attack. This next week should be much more productive so I'm hoping to knock out most of those attack animations by next weekend.

Sorry again for the late update.

Thanks
-Cary
finalarena.psd
ableseamanattackdown.zip
ableseamanattackup.zip
captainattackup.zip

Joel DuBray

unread,
May 17, 2014, 1:17:55 AM5/17/14
to Joseph Domenici, fort...@googlegroups.com
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, May 16, 2014 at 8:53 PM
Subject: Re: New Work and Revisions
To: Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com>


Hey guys here's a revised version of the attack up. I think it looks better like this with his arms more curved, I was just trying to make him reach as far above him as possible before. Anyway I know tomorrow is your deadline so let me know if this works and Ill use it to bang out the rest of the attack up sprites tomorrow.


On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 2:17 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary, 

Thanks for the update. A quick note on the ableseaman animations: ableseamanattackup4 doesnt reset height, unlike ableseamanattackdown4. I think it loops better when the height resets. 

Also, I like the attack down animation, but the arms on the attack up animation look very stiff. I think it's because they are thin and straight compared to the attack down arms/swings. Before you use it as a template for the rest, I'd like to see one with the arms less stiff/straight. 

For the positioning, just imagine the center of the sprites body in the center of a 32x32 tile and attacking towards the center of the 32x32 tile above them. As long as they are attacking in the cardinal direction, it should look fine. Out hit/collision detection is based off of units relative distance to each other. 

cheers,

Joel




On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 8:13 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys here's the update for last week. I wasnt sure how the sprites would stand in relation to one another so let me know if the up attack for the able seaman makes sense hitbox-wise. I kept it in pieces so its easy for me to adjust and Ill be using it as the template for the similar attacks just like I did for the right and left attack so I want to make sure its going to make sense in game. May 17th should be no problem. Oh also Ill include the arena psd. I had to merge some things, like the sand tiles, to prevent the file from getting crazy, but most stuff is still seperate and organized into folders.

As always let me know if you need anything changed.

Thanks
-Cary
On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 1:34 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary,

Thanks for the update and the captive fixes. Getting the arena .psd from you would be great. Also that gif is awesome and super helpful, thank you! We've set a hard deadline of May17th for finishing our arena build. This includes the up/down attack animations. I hope that's enough time. 

cheers,
Joel


On Mon, May 5, 2014 at 8:58 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys

I just went to type up an update for this week and realized I totally forgot to send one for last week, so sorry about that. My goal for last week was basically to clean house a little bit as efficiently as possible. I had already put in an hour on the arena before I got that last email so I wrapped it up as quickly as possible after that. Ill include the tiles here as well as the fully assembled arena. Obviously this is just the way I put it together, there is a ton of variation available to you with this tileset so you guys can really make the arena look pretty different from the way I've configured it. I can of course also configure it differently if you guys want, just let me know. Ill also include a quick gif I made of how to put it together the way I set it up. It does include a fair amount of horizontal flipping and 90 degree rotation of tiles so tell me if you guys need the flipped versions saved as seperate files. Also if you guys want the psd, which includes a grid of guides that makes tile placement super easy, I can pass that along as well.

I also did the captive fixes. I changed the shadows on the idle2 sprite to match those on walk2 so let me know if that fixed the issue. I didn't make any changes to the walk2 sprite so I won't include that one. For the left attack this might be something I didn't recover during the computer transfer but I don't have any left attack sprites for the captive on file, so my guess was that it's probably just using a mirrored version of the right attack which would explain why the hair was shifting strangely, so I whipped up a quick left facing attack using a mirrored right attack and the hair from the left idles. I also fixed his shorts so those should make sense in the left attack now as well. All in all this only took a few hours so the invoice is pretty light for that week.

This week I started on the up and downward facing attacks. I didn't have a ton of time to work so all I've got for you so far is the Captain's downward attack. This next week should be much more productive so I'm hoping to knock out most of those attack animations by next weekend.

Sorry again for the late update.

Thanks
-Cary
ableseamanattackup.gif
ableseamanattackup.zip

Joel DuBray

unread,
May 19, 2014, 1:12:02 AM5/19/14
to fort...@googlegroups.com
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, May 18, 2014 at 10:11 PM
Subject: Re: New Work and Revisions
To: Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com>, Joseph Domenici <josephd...@gmail.com>


Alright guys here's the update for this week. Sorry its a day late, I've been scrambling trying to get them all done. As always let me know if there is anything I need to correct. Also Ill send you an invoice for these two weeks tomorrow or something I just wanted to get these sent out before I call it a night. Oh I fixed the head reset on the seaman also, I had already fixed it I just forgot to save over those frames when I sent you guys the new file. Anyway here it is.

Thanks
-Cary


On Sat, May 17, 2014 at 2:22 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Also I noticed that the height doesn't reset in state 4 like the attack down. I don't think it's a very important consistency, but it's worth looking into. 


On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 10:48 PM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary,

It's looking much better! Thanks for the iteration. Go ahead and use it for the rest of them!

cheers,

Joel


On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 8:53 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys here's a revised version of the attack up. I think it looks better like this with his arms more curved, I was just trying to make him reach as far above him as possible before. Anyway I know tomorrow is your deadline so let me know if this works and Ill use it to bang out the rest of the attack up sprites tomorrow.
On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 2:17 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary, 

Thanks for the update. A quick note on the ableseaman animations: ableseamanattackup4 doesnt reset height, unlike ableseamanattackdown4. I think it loops better when the height resets. 

Also, I like the attack down animation, but the arms on the attack up animation look very stiff. I think it's because they are thin and straight compared to the attack down arms/swings. Before you use it as a template for the rest, I'd like to see one with the arms less stiff/straight. 

For the positioning, just imagine the center of the sprites body in the center of a 32x32 tile and attacking towards the center of the 32x32 tile above them. As long as they are attacking in the cardinal direction, it should look fine. Out hit/collision detection is based off of units relative distance to each other. 

cheers,

Joel


On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 8:13 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys here's the update for last week. I wasnt sure how the sprites would stand in relation to one another so let me know if the up attack for the able seaman makes sense hitbox-wise. I kept it in pieces so its easy for me to adjust and Ill be using it as the template for the similar attacks just like I did for the right and left attack so I want to make sure its going to make sense in game. May 17th should be no problem. Oh also Ill include the arena psd. I had to merge some things, like the sand tiles, to prevent the file from getting crazy, but most stuff is still seperate and organized into folders.

As always let me know if you need anything changed.

Thanks
-Cary
On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 1:34 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary,

Thanks for the update and the captive fixes. Getting the arena .psd from you would be great. Also that gif is awesome and super helpful, thank you! We've set a hard deadline of May17th for finishing our arena build. This includes the up/down attack animations. I hope that's enough time. 

cheers,
Joel


On Mon, May 5, 2014 at 8:58 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys

I just went to type up an update for this week and realized I totally forgot to send one for last week, so sorry about that. My goal for last week was basically to clean house a little bit as efficiently as possible. I had already put in an hour on the arena before I got that last email so I wrapped it up as quickly as possible after that. Ill include the tiles here as well as the fully assembled arena. Obviously this is just the way I put it together, there is a ton of variation available to you with this tileset so you guys can really make the arena look pretty different from the way I've configured it. I can of course also configure it differently if you guys want, just let me know. Ill also include a quick gif I made of how to put it together the way I set it up. It does include a fair amount of horizontal flipping and 90 degree rotation of tiles so tell me if you guys need the flipped versions saved as seperate files. Also if you guys want the psd, which includes a grid of guides that makes tile placement super easy, I can pass that along as well.

I also did the captive fixes. I changed the shadows on the idle2 sprite to match those on walk2 so let me know if that fixed the issue. I didn't make any changes to the walk2 sprite so I won't include that one. For the left attack this might be something I didn't recover during the computer transfer but I don't have any left attack sprites for the captive on file, so my guess was that it's probably just using a mirrored version of the right attack which would explain why the hair was shifting strangely, so I whipped up a quick left facing attack using a mirrored right attack and the hair from the left idles. I also fixed his shorts so those should make sense in the left attack now as well. All in all this only took a few hours so the invoice is pretty light for that week.

This week I started on the up and downward facing attacks. I didn't have a ton of time to work so all I've got for you so far is the Captain's downward attack. This next week should be much more productive so I'm hoping to knock out most of those attack animations by next weekend.

Sorry again for the late update.

Thanks
-Cary
captainmeleedown.zip
captiveattackup.zip
fistmatemeleedown.zip
fistmateattackup.zip
gunneryofficerattackdown.zip
gunneryofficerattackup.zip
merchantattackdown.zip
merchantattackup.zip
navigatorattackdown.zip
navigatorattackup.zip
sawbonesattackdown.zip
ableseamanattackup.zip
sawbonesattackup.zip
scroungerattackdown.zip
scroungerattackup.zip
stokerattackdown.zip
stokerattackup.zip
ambassadorattackdown.zip
ambassadorattackup.zip
bosunattackdown.zip
bosunattackup.zip
bruteattackdown.zip
bruteattackup.zip
captiveattackdown.zip

Joel DuBray

unread,
May 29, 2014, 4:50:29 PM5/29/14
to fort...@googlegroups.com
shiiiiet.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, May 29, 2014 at 1:36 PM
Subject: Re: New Work and Revisions
To: Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com>


Hey Joel,

Thanks for checking in, here's invoice 22. I assume since you guys are polishing your web build you don't have anything for me currently. If so if you could give me an idea when you might have work for me again that would be great. If you do have stuff for me to do feel free to send it my way, I'm ready any time.

Thanks
Cary


On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:51 PM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary,

I haven't heard from you in a while and wanted to touch base. Don't forget to send me the invoice for this last batch!

cheers,
Joel


On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 10:11 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Alright guys here's the update for this week. Sorry its a day late, I've been scrambling trying to get them all done. As always let me know if there is anything I need to correct. Also Ill send you an invoice for these two weeks tomorrow or something I just wanted to get these sent out before I call it a night. Oh I fixed the head reset on the seaman also, I had already fixed it I just forgot to save over those frames when I sent you guys the new file. Anyway here it is.

Thanks
-Cary
On Sat, May 17, 2014 at 2:22 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Also I noticed that the height doesn't reset in state 4 like the attack down. I don't think it's a very important consistency, but it's worth looking into. 
On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 10:48 PM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary,

It's looking much better! Thanks for the iteration. Go ahead and use it for the rest of them!

cheers,

Joel
On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 8:53 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys here's a revised version of the attack up. I think it looks better like this with his arms more curved, I was just trying to make him reach as far above him as possible before. Anyway I know tomorrow is your deadline so let me know if this works and Ill use it to bang out the rest of the attack up sprites tomorrow.
On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 2:17 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary, 

Thanks for the update. A quick note on the ableseaman animations: ableseamanattackup4 doesnt reset height, unlike ableseamanattackdown4. I think it loops better when the height resets. 

Also, I like the attack down animation, but the arms on the attack up animation look very stiff. I think it's because they are thin and straight compared to the attack down arms/swings. Before you use it as a template for the rest, I'd like to see one with the arms less stiff/straight. 

For the positioning, just imagine the center of the sprites body in the center of a 32x32 tile and attacking towards the center of the 32x32 tile above them. As long as they are attacking in the cardinal direction, it should look fine. Out hit/collision detection is based off of units relative distance to each other. 

cheers,

Joel


On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 8:13 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys here's the update for last week. I wasnt sure how the sprites would stand in relation to one another so let me know if the up attack for the able seaman makes sense hitbox-wise. I kept it in pieces so its easy for me to adjust and Ill be using it as the template for the similar attacks just like I did for the right and left attack so I want to make sure its going to make sense in game. May 17th should be no problem. Oh also Ill include the arena psd. I had to merge some things, like the sand tiles, to prevent the file from getting crazy, but most stuff is still seperate and organized into folders.

As always let me know if you need anything changed.

Thanks
-Cary
On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 1:34 AM, Joel DuBray <joeld...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Cary,

Thanks for the update and the captive fixes. Getting the arena .psd from you would be great. Also that gif is awesome and super helpful, thank you! We've set a hard deadline of May17th for finishing our arena build. This includes the up/down attack animations. I hope that's enough time. 

cheers,
Joel


On Mon, May 5, 2014 at 8:58 PM, Cary Dube <ghost...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey guys

I just went to type up an update for this week and realized I totally forgot to send one for last week, so sorry about that. My goal for last week was basically to clean house a little bit as efficiently as possible. I had already put in an hour on the arena before I got that last email so I wrapped it up as quickly as possible after that. Ill include the tiles here as well as the fully assembled arena. Obviously this is just the way I put it together, there is a ton of variation available to you with this tileset so you guys can really make the arena look pretty different from the way I've configured it. I can of course also configure it differently if you guys want, just let me know. Ill also include a quick gif I made of how to put it together the way I set it up. It does include a fair amount of horizontal flipping and 90 degree rotation of tiles so tell me if you guys need the flipped versions saved as seperate files. Also if you guys want the psd, which includes a grid of guides that makes tile placement super easy, I can pass that along as well.

I also did the captive fixes. I changed the shadows on the idle2 sprite to match those on walk2 so let me know if that fixed the issue. I didn't make any changes to the walk2 sprite so I won't include that one. For the left attack this might be something I didn't recover during the computer transfer but I don't have any left attack sprites for the captive on file, so my guess was that it's probably just using a mirrored version of the right attack which would explain why the hair was shifting strangely, so I whipped up a quick left facing attack using a mirrored right attack and the hair from the left idles. I also fixed his shorts so those should make sense in the left attack now as well. All in all this only took a few hours so the invoice is pretty light for that week.

This week I started on the up and downward facing attacks. I didn't have a ton of time to work so all I've got for you so far is the Captain's downward attack. This next week should be much more productive so I'm hoping to knock out most of those attack animations by next weekend.

Sorry again for the late update.

Thanks
-Cary
invoice22.doc

Joel DuBray

unread,
Jun 2, 2014, 12:25:21 AM6/2/14
to fort...@googlegroups.com
Arena PSD!
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