does anyone know of specific detrgent/sanitizers?
David M Troutman
I am seeking any recommendation for specific products that are listed as “detergent-sanitizers” that would be in compliance with section 4-301.12 (D) 2 (b) of the food code. Just wondering if anyone is aware of such products on the market. The issue is that NC adopted the 2009 food code in 2012 but before then facilities were allowed to use a three compartment sink for cleaning if they were single service only. Facilities can still apply for a varriance but it would be so much more impler for them if they could use a product mentioned in the code as a detergent – sanitizer. I am having a problem finding such a product to recommend to them. Any information would be helpful and appreiated.
Respectfully,
David M. Troutman, REHS
Director of Environmental Health
Cabarrus Health Alliance
300 Mooresville Road
Kannapolis N.C. 28081
Office 704-920-1211
Fax 704-933-3379
4-301.12 Manual Warewashing, Sink Compartment Requirements.
- (A) Except as specified in ¶ (C) of this section, a sink with at least 3 compartments shall be provided for manually washing, rinsing, and sanitizing equipment and utensils. Pf
- (B) Sink compartments shall be large enough to accommodate immersion of the largest equipment and utensils. If equipment or utensils are too large for the warewashing sink, a warewashing machine or alternative equipment as specified in ¶ (C) of this section shall be used. Pf
-
(C)
Alternative manual warewashing equipment may be used when there are special cleaning needs or constraints and its use is
approved. Alternative manual
warewashing equipment may include:
- (1) High-pressure detergent sprayers;
- (2) Low- or line-pressure spray detergent foamers;
- (3) Other task-specific cleaning equipment;
- (4) Brushes or other implements;
- (5) 2-compartment sinks as specified under ¶¶ (D) and (E) of this section; or
- (6) Receptacles that substitute for the compartments of a multicompartment sink.
-
(D) Before a 2-compartment sink is used:
- (1) The permit holder shall have its use approved; and
-
(2) The
permit holder shall limit the number of
kitchenware items cleaned and
sanitized in the 2-compartment sink, and shall limit
warewashing to batch operations for cleaning kitchenware such as between cutting one type of raw
meat and another or cleanup at the end of a shift, and shall:
- (a) Make up the cleaning and sanitizing solutions immediately before use and drain them immediately after use, and
- (b) Use a detergent-sanitizer to sanitize and apply the detergent-sanitizer in accordance with the manufacturer's label instructions and as specified under § 4-501.115, or
- (c) Use a hot water sanitization immersion step as specified under ¶ 4-603.16(C).
- (E) A 2-compartment sink may not be used for warewashing operations
Cindy Rice
Hi David,
I've worked on locating such a product for several years. I am a food safety expert with Ecolab, and even after consulting the chemical experts at Ecolab, and many FDA officials, to my knowledge, it appears that there is no such product available. My FDA contact agrees that it is a conundrum that this language exists in the Food code yet there is no product that can effectively act as a sanitizer / detergent, and allow the use of a 2-compartment sink, a 2-step process instead of the wash,rinse,sanitize.
There is one product called Mikroklene, made by Ecolab , that is listed as a "detergent/sanitizer -I've attached the label and product information - but here is a comment I received from Ecolab regarding this product.
"I struggle with this one too, even though Mikroklene is listed as a detergent/sanitizer. Technically if you used a non-ionic detergent (that won't damage the sanitizer) you could probably go right from detergent to sanitizer without a rinse but it does not seem like a best practice. You could also use a disinfectant cleaner that requires a rinse but that would not work with most health departments because of potential contamination of the rinse water. Bottom line is that I am not aware of any products on the market that would work. In the interim, I would still vote for the wash, rinse, then spray sanitizer solution."
Good luck, and again, if there is such a product, I'd like to know as well. Take care,
Cindy
Cindy Rice, RS, MSPH, CPFS
EASTERN FOOD SAFETY
70 Christina Drive
Braintree, MA 02184
Ph: 781.356.1467 Fx: 781.356.3960
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Robert W. Powitz
R.W.Powitz & Associates, PC
Office (860) 388-0893, Mobile (860) 395-9214
Email: Pow...@sanitarian.com
To: "foodsa...@googlegroups.com" <foodsa...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 8, 2014 8:17 AM
Subject: [foodsafe-list] does anyone know of specific detrgent/sanitizers?
Tom Johnson
1408 Northland Dr. #407
Mendota Heights, MN 55120
dir:651-686-8499 x101 fax:651-686-7670
cell: 651-587-0418
Andrew Harris
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you are strictly prohibited from printing, storing, disseminating, distributing or copying this communication. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Thank You.
Cindy Rice
I believe the product that you mention here, Andrew, is a sanitizer, that would still require a wash step before rinsing and finally sanitizing. It does not require a post sanitizing “rinse step” , like any other sanitizer.
The problem with eliminating the rinse step in between washing and sanitizing is that detergents could interfere with /damage the sanitizer. Technically if you used a non-ionic detergent (that won't damage the sanitizer) you could probably go right from detergent to sanitizer without a wash but it does not seem like a best practice.
The only product that we have found that can be used for both washing and sanitizing, is “Mikroklene” an Ecolab chemical product. I’ve attached product descriptions here. It is strange that thought the food code has this provision, there is no product that can accomplish this task in one. I’ve consulted with FDA, and Ecolab chemical specialists, and the response is the same, though Mikroklene comes closest to this use, still requires a rinse step in between. Hope this is helpful.
Cindy
Cindy Rice, RS, MSPH, CPFS
Eastern Food Safety
ECOLAB Food Safety Specialties
Together we are keeping the world safe from foodborne illness
From: foodsa...@googlegroups.com [mailto:foodsa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Harris
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2015 8:40 AM
To: foodsa...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [foodsafe-list] Re: does anyone know of specific detrgent/sanitizers?
Hi David,
I ran across this product will searching.
In the directions for restaurant and bar: For dishes, glassware, silverware, cooking utensils, wash with 1 oz/gal of this product and immerse in a solution containing 1 oz/gal of this product. No rinse is required.
Hope this helps.
Andrew Harris, RS/REHS
Summit County Public Health
Akron, Ohio
aha...@schd.org
On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 at 8:17:35 AM UTC-5, David M Troutman wrote:
I am seeking any recommendation for specific products that are listed as “detergent-sanitizers” that would be in compliance with section 4-301.12 (D) 2 (b) of the food code. Just wondering if anyone is aware of such products on the market. The issue is that NC adopted the 2009 food code in 2012 but before then facilities were allowed to use a three compartment sink for cleaning if they were single service only. Facilities can still apply for a varriance but it would be so much more impler for them if they could use a product mentioned in the code as a detergent – sanitizer. I am having a problem finding such a product to recommend to them. Any information would be helpful and appreiated.
Respectfully,
David M. Troutman, REHS
Director of Environmental Health
Cabarrus Health Alliance
300 Mooresville Road
Kannapolis N.C. 28081
Office 704-920-1211
Fax 704-933-3379
4-301.12 Manual Warewashing, Sink Compartment Requirements.
- (A) Except as specified in ¶ (C) of this section, a sink with at least 3 compartments shall be provided for manually washing, rinsing, and sanitizing equipment and utensils. Pf
- (B) Sink compartments shall be large enough to accommodate immersion of the largest equipment and utensils. If equipment or utensils are too large for the warewashing sink, a warewashing machine or alternative equipment as specified in ¶ (C) of this section shall be used. Pf
- (C) Alternative manual warewashing equipment may be used when there are special cleaning needs or constraints and its use is approved. Alternative manual warewashing equipment may include:
- (1) High-pressure detergent sprayers;
- (2) Low- or line-pressure spray detergent foamers;
- (3) Other task-specific cleaning equipment;
- (4) Brushes or other implements;
- (5) 2-compartment sinks as specified under ¶¶ (D) and (E) of this section; or
- (6) Receptacles that substitute for the compartments of a multicompartment sink.
- (D) Before a 2-compartment sink is used:
- (1) The permit holder shall have its use approved; and
- (2) The permit holder shall limit the number of kitchenware items cleaned and sanitized in the 2-compartment sink, and shall limit warewashing to batch operations for cleaning kitchenware such as between cutting one type of raw meat and another or cleanup at the end of a shift, and shall:
- (a) Make up the cleaning and sanitizing solutions immediately before use and drain them immediately after use, and
- (b) Use a detergent-sanitizer to sanitize and apply the detergent-sanitizer in accordance with the manufacturer's label instructions and as specified under § 4-501.115, or
- (c) Use a hot water sanitization immersion step as specified under ¶ 4-603.16(C).
- (E) A 2-compartment sink may not be used for warewashing operations
DISCLAIMER: Email correspondence to and from this address may be subject to North Carolina public records law and/or may be confidential under HIPAA regulations.
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you are strictly prohibited from printing, storing, disseminating, distributing or copying this communication. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Thank You.
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Andrew Harris
The directions on the label specifically say (for restaurant and bar rinse) to wash with product and then immerse in the liquid without a rinse required (I’m assuminmg that with the directions, providing the dilution rate 2 separate times that the assumption would be that an individual would be filling 2 separate sinks – such as a 2 compartment sink). I spoke with the gentleman from LICO and he said that this product could be used in a 2 compartment sink setup – am I missing something..? I’m happy to pass along Ecolabs product sheets to folks as well – I don’t want to specifically endorse one company’s product over another – that’s not what we do.
Thank you!
Andrew B. Harris, R.S.
Summit County Public Health
1867 West Market St.
Akron, OH 44313
330-375-2648 (fax)