Gathering the lands

[Vladimir Sibirov]

Hello, FBP world!

In one of the recent discussions on this mailing list I made an assumption that a consistent specification of Flow-based paradigm and its terminology would help FBP researchers to communicate more effectively and stop the FBP world from splitting into two or more worlds every quantum moment. As this assumption has met several agreements, I decided to continue this initiative.

The goal is to create a compact specification for FBP systems and a knowledge base covering these main areas:

1. Definition of Flow-based programming. What it is and what it isn't.

2. Classification of Flow-based systems. By several aspects. Related paradigms are also linked in it.

3. Terminology. After a hot dispute we should agree about common terms while our tower of Babel isn't too high yet.

4. Basic principles. Common rules of FBP systems design and implementation.

5. Knowledge base. Mostly linking to articles existing in FBP-related wikis, then it could be completed with new entries with the effort of many people.

First of all, I'd like to answer why we would need yet another FBP resource. The most comprehensive source of knowledge in the domain currently is the J. Paul Morrison's book, but it is not available to everyone from all around the world in just a few clicks, neither can it serve as a quick reference. Then comes Paul's FBP Wiki which contains a lot of useful entries on FBP terms and principles, but it lacks straight organization (very hard to get started using the knowledge base for a newcomer) and its style is still very personal in several places rather than encyclopedic. Cunningham's FBP wiki is similar. I may be wrong, but I suppose that other personal wikis keep moving into their personal directions. An effort of the public mind is required in order to meet the synergy.

Then, I suppose that the material should be licensed under Creative Commons BY-SA, submitted/edited by enthusiasts and moderated by a few authorized supervisors.

Initially somebody is going to create the outline of the specification. I can do it if the community agrees, because I need it anyways for my paper. Then exact sections and entries can be written by several participants. Terms and principles are going to be discussed intensively before final decision is made (with some weighted sum criteria I suppose), this has to be considered when choosing the workflow.

Technically I can currently offer the following possibilities of implementation:

1) Maintain this specification in the existing FBP Wiki on Paul's site. Discuss every term and entry in this mailing list and track votes manually. Pros: continue the existing work and inherit the existing knowledge-base on-site. Cons: comments/discussions of exact sections would be cumbersome this way, possibly some other limitations on customization.

2) Build this knowledge base in a wiki farm, e.g. Wikia. Wikia provides wiki hosting, a modern system and forum-style discussions. Pros: well-developed wiki service, depends less on participants' resources. Cons: on-page comments could be preferred over forums, 3rd level domain and standard Wikia layout. Note: most of other wiki farms have similar pros and cons.

3) Install a wiki system (e.g. Wacko, Tiki or MoinMoin) on some host and register a suitable domain for it. Pros: more control over the infrastructure, can choose almost any collaboration/comments method desired. Cons: somebody needs to maintain the infrastructure others will rely on.

I would like to ask if FBP term in the above is going to be used "in-large" (a class of component-based data flow oriented software systems) or "in-small" (Morrison's FBP specification and implementation). If Paul insists on FBP being used mostly in "in-small", then it should be probably substituted above with the term "Dataflow" or we might be forced to pick some other "in-large" term for all the systems of the class.

Looking forward to some feedback from all active/episodic FBP researchers,

Regards,

Vladimir Sibirov

[Paul Morrison]

Yes, that sounds like an excellent idea to me. Re the in-large vs in-
small question, I'd say to go with the in-large first, and then cut
back (e.g. by spinning off other forums (fora)) if it gets *too*
wide. I had a similar problem with my FBP-like category on the wiki,
and the similar chapter in my book - there are some pretty different
implementations out there that still have some FBP-like
characteristics, and it's going to be tough to know how to categorize
them.

Re an appropriate medium, I would like to offer a Bulletin Board I
have just set up (a few days ago, honestly!) - it can be accessed at
http://www.jpaulmorrison.com/phpbb. It has a few fora set up so far,
but we can add more categories and more fora. We can also designate
more people as administrators, as people step up who are interested.
I have only been using it for a few days, literally, so I am not too
familiar with what it can do - but feel free to experiment and let me
know what works and what doesn't!

PS Vladimir, I'm still not sure why people in your neck of the woods
have difficulty using one of the ebook formats, and use e.g. Kindle
for PC/MAC or Adobe Digital Editions - although I agree the book can't
be used as a quick reference.

By the way, Ernesto Compatangelo in Aberdeen has suggested we need a
[Java]FBP textbook - could one feed into the other?

[Tom Young]

Hi Vladimir,

You might find

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AqcHR01C1GJ7dDU5T0tkWHgzVURhWGw3cy1kOGJqQVE&hl=en

interesting.  It is a link to a shared spreadsheet of FBP (and FBP-like) implementations.  There is an online form for adding more entries.    The spreadsheet  was mentioned somewhere previously this discussion.    

   Cheers,

              Tom Young

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[Vladimir Sibirov]

Hello again,

Sorry for the delay, I wanted to get something done before continuing
the discussion. First of all I'd like to reply to the messages above.

As for FBP in-large and FBP in-small, I decided to cover a larger set
of systems with the in-large approach (as the subject of this thread
suggests) and focus on the most interesting subset of it where
necessary.

As for the [Java]FBP textbook, I can't really tell anything without
any further details on Ernesto's proposal.

I would like to thank Tom for pointing me to the spreadsheet. This
will help a lot and has already helped to start the classification
page, I have also linked to the spreadsheet in the wiki.

As for the medium, I've chosen a combined solution. I have created a
free wiki account at Wikidot.com (after a brief analysis of other wiki
farms) and registered a handy domain which reflects the generic
approach and the associative spirit of the initiative:
http://flowbased.org. Anyone can join it and start contributing. Most
of modern wiki features are supported there, including revision
control, wiki syntax, etc. What I like a lot is that it has on-page
comments and you can receive updates by email or RSS. This will help
us to discuss particular articles and sections.

This mailing list is still a good way to notify people about progress
and discuss some problems in general. I'm also looking forward to the
new Paul's forums. Although I've chosen a wiki workflow and comments
system, phpBB has a nice way to create polls, so we can actually make
polls there for each arguable term and hold some discussions there.

As you can see if you visit http://flowbased.org, I have already
started structuring the specification and adding some contents there.
At this stage I would like to invite everyone to join the initiative
and to start contributing contents. A quick registration is required
on site to add or edit articles. I would like to make Paul and some
other authorities here the administrators/moderators of the new
knowledge base. As I said before, we will be linking to existing
entries in other wikis where appropriate to reduce contents
duplication.

In particular, here is what kind of work which I plan for the
following days, per section:

http://flowbased.org/definition – I haven't taken the responsibility
to write the actual definitions there that would brief, clear and
precise enough. So, input of this kind is welcomed.

http://flowbased.org/classification – I have added basic criterion
there but it needs better descriptions and actual examples of systems.

http://flowbased.org/principles – this section is almost blank, put
your ideas there.

http://flowbased.org/terms – I have added essential terms there, as
presented in Morrison's book with other variants given in braces. If
you know other variants, please add them in braces too, with the
source of that variant given in italics. Feel free to complete the
descriptions and add more terms too. After collecting terms and their
variants we will make polls at http://jpaulmorrison.com/phpbb/. After
we decide the particular words for the terms, each term will be either
linked with an existing article in another wiki or given its own page
with a more complete description (if necessary).

http://flowbased.org/links – this is going to be a huge list of
FBP-related resources. I've added just a few of them, feel free to add
more.

Looking forward to more feedback and other enthusiasts,

--
Best regards,
Vladimir

2011/4/12 Tom Young <twy...@twyoung.com>

[Paul Morrison]

Hi Vladimir,

This seems like a great start! I certainly wish you lots of luck, and
I will do anything I can to support the effort.

As I mentioned before, please let me know if you want new fora added
to the phpbb site. Actually, if we start to use it (in addition to
http://flowbased.org ), I should probably add you as administrator/
moderator - and anyone else who wants to volunteer. Feel free to add
me as administrator/moderator to http://flowbased.org - but I may be
too close to one particular approach to be really objective :-)

Regards,

Paul

On Apr 16, 11:26 am, Vladimir Sibirov <trustmas...@kodigy.com> wrote:

>
<snip>

>
> As for the medium, I've chosen a combined solution. I have created a
> free wiki account at Wikidot.com (after a brief analysis of other wiki
> farms) and registered a handy domain which reflects the generic
> approach and the associative spirit of the initiative:http://flowbased.org. Anyone can join it and start contributing. Most
> of modern wiki features are supported there, including revision
> control, wiki syntax, etc. What I like a lot is that it has on-page
> comments and you can receive updates by email or RSS. This will help
> us to discuss particular articles and sections.
>
> This mailing list is still a good way to notify people about progress
> and discuss some problems in general. I'm also looking forward to the
> new Paul's forums. Although I've chosen a wiki workflow and comments
> system, phpBB has a nice way to create polls, so we can actually make
> polls there for each arguable term and hold some discussions there.
>

<snip>