Inventory Thread

[Chris Lum]

Moving the thread on inventory to here for easier browsing:

Chris Sun 1/13/08 10:21 AM:
Hi guys, I'm starting this thread to discuss any ideas for the
inventory system. Currently we're just brainstorming since our
inventory needs will largely be dependent upon our gameplay, IP, and
any other considerations like puzzles, combat, or other systems.

My initial thoughts are to go with a more minimalist system, since in
general Adventure games tend to be less inventory heavy than
traditional RPGs. With fewer inventory slots to juggle, each item
then seems to carry more weight, and finding new items to fill it out
is more akin to an FPS or action-adventure game like Zelda where
getting a new weapon, item, or puzzle piece is a pretty big deal (and
usually enchances gameplay tactics for the player). This is less
prevalent in RPGs, where a lot of items end up being vendor trash or
incremental steps of an earlier item (ie, potion, hi-potion, mega
potion, rusty sword, steel sword, flame sword).

Because our game IP is largely about balancing between having material
goods and being stronger in the other plane, I figure that there will
need to be enough items to make the player want to hold on to some of
them (or at least make it a more weighty decision to fully give up
items), but not too many, which would lessen their individual impact
and make the game seem clunky for an Adventure game.

At most, having a range of items akin to an old Zelda game would be
good; more than a King's Quest game but less than a full RPG.
Hopefully we can decide on a set range of items later down the road.

Anyway, sorry for getting sidetracked. On to my brainstorm ideas for
the inventory system!

** I thought about using an inventory ring system used in varying
forms in games like Secret of Mana, Beyond Good and Evil, and to an
extent, even Tron 2.0. What I like about this system is that it looks
slick, it's easy to understand and pull up, it doesn't pull you out of
the game since it does not bring up a separate screen (which I think
is essential for an Adventure game -- which is usually all about
immersion), and it forces us to minimize our item range to those that
are really going to be important (a more pure design in my opinion,
not bogged down by filler items).

** Another thought I'm throwing out there for consideration is
something like a Tron 2.0 system (if you haven't played Tron 2.0, I
can let you guys borrow it, just let me know), which actually turns
the inventory into a sort of mini-game in itself. Basically in Tron,
you loaded up programs (abilities and functions, like data scanning,
weapons, hacking programs etc.) into a ring with a set amount of
slots. Some programs would take up more slots than others. Also,
occasionally your character would get hit with things like viral
attacks -- which would then "infect" one or more of your programs
forcing the player to run a Defrag or Anti-viral routine to start
cleaning them up. Failing to do so would me that the virus would then
spread to adjacent programs. I liked this system since it fit the
theme of the game and provided a fun mini-game on top of the standard
FPS combat. I'm not saying we should use this model, but I liked the
idea of having inventory being something other than just a place to
store and equip items.
-> Maybe something to do with each item slowly building up a material-
reliance rating the longer and more often you use it, making it harder
to let it go in the future. Say the player grew really attached to
wearing a chainmail vest or mace, the more he/she uses it it will
build up a reliance rating (like durability in reverse). When trying
to enter the other plane, the player will then have to perform a
certain action (some kind of ritual, meditation? Maybe a mini-puzzle
or game?) in order to decrease reliance on their items until it is
within an acceptable range. Decreasing the rating closer to 0 will
give them full range of powers in the other plane.

** For our game, we might decide that part of our balancing system is
integrated into inventory management. Having certain items on you
when you attempt to enter the other plane will have various effects on
you in the other plane or possibly prevent you from entering
altogether. Perhaps having certain items equipped in certain slots
would determine what sort of affect it had on you on the other side --
having a big badass sword in your right hand in the material realm
would debuff that same hand and any powers it might have, like a force
push, weakened by a % or something to that affect (maybe that's too
complex).

Anyway, these are all just brainstorm ideas. Feedback and thoughts?

[Chris Lum]

Dante Sun 1/13/08 12:43 PM:

** I really like this idea of Inventory Quick Slots. If I understand
this right, the player should hold a button down that pops up a quick
inventory selector? This is the kind of system becoming popular in
XBox360 games, like in Rainbow 6 when you choose to put a silencer on
or change weapons? So... the player has their regular inventory of
stuff, but a quick select system when they need to get to something
really fast. Am I on the right track in understanding this? I would
really like to borrow Tron and see that system, never played it!


** I also like the idea that inventory items can stop you from
traveling to the other plane, and buff or debuff you there as well.

** I like the initial idea of a reliance rating. But is the rating
good or bad? How should this work? I'm not sure I understand this so
much yet, I'd like to see how it can tie into the IP.

** One thing I really like about RPGs like the Elder Scrolls, is all
the stuff you can pick up! In Morrowind I actually made use of the
houses you get at the end of the game, and sometimes got player plug
ins to have my own house earlier on. I'd use my house to display all
the cool stuff I came across along my journeys, like cool armor and
weapons (Set them up on manequins (another plug-in)). I also liked
making use of storing items places. A large part of wanting to keep
items was for the economy system. So... that brings me to my opinion,
which is, I like picking up random shit. Even if its not related to
the main plot, maybe side plots? Or why not be able to sell the crap?

** The last comment brings me to this question-> Are we planning on
having an Economy system? Or are we going to have a straight follow
the story system that doesn't rely on resources? Also taking into
consideration that an Economy system may drive us away from the scope
of keeping this project small (maybe...).

[Chris Lum]

Tyler Sun 1/13/08 2:42 PM:

An economy system would drive us away from making this a small
project, and it would drive it away from being a straight up
adventure game, as would having lots of items. I too like picking up
tons of stuff, but in an adventure game, where you are often combining
one item with another, or "using" and item to interact with the
environment, it becomes cumbersome the more items you have, because
you start trying out every item on something in the environment when
you are stuck somewhere.. A way to solve this would be to have two
slots, and one was a quest or important non-droppable items slot, and
the rest is just for fun.
The reliance system is cool, but I really don't see how power,
strength, or any of these concepts would manifest into a game with no
combat in it's initial plan. In fact all the item related discussion
seems to me to sound exactly like an RPG item model, so if you want to
make an RPG, sounds cool, whichever, but if you want to make it
adventure then we should do that. Either way, a decision needs to be
made about that before talking and thinking about all these stats, we
need to define what their purpose is in the first place.
The Witcher for example, which I just started yesterday, does have
that cool "important" or "non-important" item organization, but it's
also an RPG,a nd also has combat and an economy, so there is a reason
for the other items.....

[Chris Lum]

Dante Sun 1/13/08 4:09 PM:

** First, some clarification. Any mention of stats and such from me,
should only be in the Tech threads, where I'm citing examples. Whether
we have stats on NPCs is still to be discussed, depending on the
development of the IP. And, I think we all agreed already on no
combat. So if we have stats, they will not be combat related. If we do
have any stats like Strength or Dexterity, they will determine game
events and story (Think Quest for Glory). I'm not assuming anything on
this yet.

** I was under the impression this is an Adventure game, not a
traditional RPG. So I also vote for keeping the project steered toward
adventure. But, our adventure game is very different than a
traditional point n click. Firstly, we are in full 3d. Just that fact
gives us a lot of options in deciding what is in the game.

** To go with the IP we have so far, I want to put in a vote for a non-
traditional economy system. We can't let this get out of hand and get
beyond the scope of an adventure project. But... what if the character
collects objects in the magic plane, like orbs or something, that can
be used to cash in on items that advance the game. Or if you receive
money for doing things in the real world that allow you to get items
that advance the game. This could make it seem like there is an
economy system, but really we are just putting in checks to make sure
the player has done certain conditions before the story continues.
( I.E. Player can only have the 4 orbs needed if he completed the
necessary story arcs to continue). Thoughts?

** I like the idea of separate inventory slots for items. If the
player finds something that will interact with the environment, he
could say something like. "I think this will come in handy for
something important", and place the object in a quest items slot
instead of the standard slot. Whatever fills the non-quest intractable
items slot should depend on stuff we develop AFTER the main game is
complete. Extra junk, wearable items, etc... etc... this is all polish
and aesthetics, add-ons. We don't need this stuff, but we should keep
a space in inventory for this stuff for the option to add it in, also
we might end up needing other types of items depending on our IP
development. Options are good.

Thoughts? Agreements? Disagreements?

[Chris Lum]

Tyler Sun 1/13/08 4:59 PM:

Agreements only. I like the faked economy/collect'to'continue
attitude, and options are always good, yes. If anything, we can use
them later for something completely unimportant to the game for look
or for fun, like your idea of wearable items...

> ...
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> read more »

[Gera Gundorov]

After reading through your posts, I find myself somewhere in between
on the issues of economy and inventory. When the player goes into the
spirit plane, are there apparitions or any kind of anomalies there ---
> A-la-Lord of the Rings? Or does he simply disappear and reappear at
another location? I would find that kind of strange to be honest, but
then again, I'm not really aware of the powers you all had in mind for
him.

If the former is something along the lines of what you considered,
the character might possess a limited number of vessels that can trap
these various anomalies and you would have a counter over the vessel
image(1-99, for example). Players can only stack similar creatures
per container, forcing them to choose which to collect. That would
free up the inventory slots and will give those players who like
gathering booty an opportunity to do so. Maybe they can play a role
similar to his physical weapons/armor. They can sway the reliance
system towards the plane side, as weapons/armor would do the
opposite.

Is the hero infamous in his world, or a nobody? Will people
recognize him in the streets, or does he approach everyone himself?

As the Crusaders and Cathars roamed the lands and religion ruled
all, there were still people practicing the dark arts. The players
might be able to trade these spirits they capture in exchange for
items that progress the game, grant you access to special areas, etc.,
thus creating a sort of a fake trade of goods/services economy. And
it would add another layer to gameplay, when players would have to
locate, by whatever means, these individuals.

Perhaps the character can unleash these captured spirits in the real
world, who would materialize temporarily and scare the nickers off the
pursuers/attackers. A non-physical attack. That could create an
action atmosphere with out having to actually fight in the game.

What do you think?

G

[Tyler Fermelis - Artist]

Good thoughts. I think the character should be more of a nobody. It's
more rewarding to be a somebody in the end of a game if you started as
a nobody, as cliche as it seems. In general, I think this would suit
us better. George, to catch you up with what we've discussed, we had
stated the the other world was in fact another place, but that in no
way is set in stone. In fact, the other world is probably the thing
we've set in the least amount of stone, and would do well to
develop...
I personally like the idea of being transported to another place,
however am open to all opinions and would love to hear more. I like
the idea of a captured spirit to scare someone in real world. Either
way we go, we could implement that if everyone likes, as a way to pass
some part of the game. I like the idea of scaring someone in
particular who gives the player subtle clues about their phobia. This
seems more fitting to the adventure theme of specific memorable
moments than that of an rpg, ie: kill lots of similar things (ghosts)
and scare lots of people, to get lots of gold.

[dantef...@gmail.com]

Moving last few posts to IP thread.