Fwd: mens network database is now available in Google Docs

[Brighton Feminist]

 

Hi Jackie and all,

 

I think this is the email you're talking about?  You sent it to the brightonfeminist address which isn't the action group one, sorry it's quite confusing now I look at it but here's the difference:

 

brighton...@googlemail.com - this is the address for the group that I send emails about meetings etc from.  It isn't a 'group' email so if you email it it only goes to this email address.

 

feministbri...@googlegroups.com - this is the address to email if you want your message to go to everyone on the googlegroup.  It magically sends the email to everyone who has signed up for it (about 20 ish at the moment).

 

Hope this makes sense?!

 

Anyway below is Jackie's email.  I agree that we don't want to waste our time telling them how to not be sexist.  I think this might be why forming a position statement is a good first step, because then all we are doing is letting them know that there are significant problems with the presentation of their website.  We have things to back this up, but hopefully this isn;t the same as suggesting ways of them improving it/their mission statement in general.  From the perspective of those working in women's services and for feminists I think it's important for us to make it clear that the message portrayed by their site incites anti feminist feeling, possibly hatred towards women.  If this opens up a dialogue with the group then this is a good thing, though if it seems as though we are wasting our time then maybe we need to re-think.

 

What do others think?

 

Laura   

 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: femartgroup brighton <femar...@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 2:55 PM
Subject: Fwd: mens network database is now available in Google Docs
To: brighton...@googlemail.com

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: femartgroup brighton <femar...@gmail.com>
Date: 25 August 2011 14:54
Subject: Re: mens network database is now available in Google Docs
To: Google Docs <nor...@google.com>

dear all

I dont think I'n naturally strategically minded - so its taken a while for my thoughts & concerns to work through.

 

My thoughts are that if we spend hours going through the mens web site pointing out all the things we have a problem with then, we will in effect, be telling them how to change their image and appear less sexist than they actually are.  We would be helping them to present an inaccurate image of the group - an image different from how they actually are.

 

At the moment the web site shows (though perhaps a bit too subteley at first glance) that they have a particular stance (that tends to blame women).

Anyone wanting to know about the group (funders etc.) can see this on the web site; but if we put together a page by page critique - they could use our comments to change some aspects of the web site and thereby they will appear less sexist and more ideologically sound than they actually are!

 

Is there a way of commenting on the site that isnt too specific?

I dont think we should help the group by telling them how to appear less sexist.

I dont think they are niaive and in need of our support.  The more I look at particular things on the site the more I think they must know they are sailing close to the wind with some of their comments and statistics- but they've sort of covered themselves by appearing shambolic and by using other peoples quotes or comments to say all the things they want to say but can't.

 

From a more personal viewpoint , if we engage with them - is it just another case of women doing mens emotional work? - they need to sort themselves out - we cant do it for them. 

 

The question is if we dont respond directly what do we do with all the energy and annoyance we have about it all - its like trying to redirect a train!

 

I'm sure this is very annoying to read - but I would love to hear a way of challenging them that doesn't end up telling them how to appear different to how they actually are!

 

Best wishes to all Jackie, please forward these comments to anyone who would be interested.Thanks

On 23 August 2011 14:11, Google Docs <nor...@google.com> wrote:

You used Gmail's "Open as a Google spreadsheet" link to view the attachment called "mens network database".

By doing this you saved an editable copy online at Google Docs: https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?pli=1&key=0Ao1DK6r0uf2idEJIR3FScGdRMUw0ZXNhMG9pR0JieVE&gmrcpt

Google Docs allows you to:

• Create and edit documents, spreadsheets and presentations online, from anywhere you have Internet access.
  
• Share documents with others, even collaborating on the same document at once, in real time.
  
• Know that your documents are safe. Since your content is stored on Google's secure servers, even if something happens to your hard drive, your documents are protected.

You can always get back to Google Docs directly at https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/?pli=1

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Feminist Brighton

For discussion, activism, consciousness raising, creativity and unity.
Meetings every fortnight

On Twitter:  FeministBrighto

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feministbrighton.wordpress.com

[Margaret Hallah]

Perhaps we should ask the Brighton Men's network to sign up to Women's Aid's Real Men campaign

http://www.realmancampaign.com/?dm_i=674,IBHC,1E9VU1,1HLJL,1

Margaret

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From: Brighton Feminist <brighton...@googlemail.com>
To: feministbri...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, 26 August 2011, 10:00

[Laura Sterry]

Afternoon all,

I have just been doing some reading for uni and stumbled across this quote which has made me feel inspired about our men's network action.  It isn't rocket science but it just seemed to be put rather pertinently:

'A health system that provides women with prenatal and pregnancy care provides an inclusive programme for both women and men, even though men will not need this specific care.  Men are not disabled in this framework, as pregnant women are within the abstracted masculinist standard of universality.' 
Zillah Eisenstein, Against Empire: Feminisms, Racism, and the West, p.198.

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Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2011 17:02:18 +0100
From: marga...@yahoo.co.uk
Subject: Re: Fwd: mens network database is now available in Google Docs
To: feministbri...@googlegroups.com