Point Adjustments

[Wild Bill Myers]

This message is specifically for the Team Captains, but anyone who is
a member of the League, please feel free to chime in with your
thoughts. Warning: it's a little long.

Liz and I have been passing e-mails back and forth about some point
discrepancies I have found as I reviewed the numbers on the scoresheet
thus far. Liz has been doing an incredible job, and I haven't found
any glaring errors, just some missed point opportunities here and
there and some places where the points may be incorrect.

We came up with some things together, and she and I have some other
items we'd like to get everybody's thoughts on:

1.) Repeat foods - At first we thought that if the food was the same,
and the time frame was the same, they should be counted as repeat
foods. This brought up a discussion on tamales, pizza, ribs, etc.
Liz pointed out that the eaters thought that the tamales between
Lewisville and Berryhill were different. I pointed out that pizza can
be different when purchased from different places, and that judging by
the rib numbers at the various events, there is a possibility that the
TYPE of rib being used may be different (baby-backs versus spareribs
{more bones in the spareribs}). The Costa Vida Burrito contest is
another example - Eric Booker set the original record using 6 ounce
Burritoville Burritos. Costa Vida Burritos were 18 ounces; these
records should be considered individually.

Proposal: A food is only considered a "repeat" food when it comes from
the same contest sponsor and the contest is the same length of time.

2.) Weird foods - Liz brought this up. If the above rule does not
apply, the type of food will apply. Liz specifically said donuts - we
should not count records for glazed donuts the same as creme-filled
donuts.

Proposal: Foods that are named the same but are different
consistencies or make-up will be considered different foods.

3.) Contest points - as we are not getting full information from IFOCE
regarding how many points each contest is worth, I propose that we
make all contests equal the same, WITH the exception of contest that
are considered our majors AND have qualifying rounds to get in. We
have had this discussion before; I believe it was decided to count the
Nathan's and Krystal Qualifiers as 50 points, with the finals equal
100. And the eaters get points for all qualifers, not an average of
points, as it limits runaway points by the eaters who do one qualifier
and make it to the finals. An eater who wins their first qualifier
and makes it to the finals has the possibility of 54 points; likewise,
an eater who does three qualifiers has the possibility of 54 point.

Proposal: All contests are worth 50 points, with the exception of the
Nathan's and Krystal Finals, which are worth 100 points.

4.) Multi-level contests - Contests such as the St. Patty's Day
showdown, Broadway at the Beach, and the upcoming Spike events that
have multiple heats. Liz and I agreed that these contests should be
considered as one contest, not four or five. The eaters would still
get quantity points for the foods they ate, but their final ranking
would determine how many contest points they receive.

Proposal: Multi-heat contests will be counted as one contest, with the
eaters receiving quantity points for all foods eaten, and contest
points for their final ranking for that contest.

5.) Should each Nathan's or Krystal qualifier, if repeated in the same
location, count as an individual event for Establishing New Record
and / or Breaking Existing Record points?

6.) Two contests stick out as possible non-counting events. Wing Bowl
15 to this point has not counted, except for negative contest points
and quantity points.
I propose that we do NOT count any attendance points, positive or
negative, for Wing Bowl 15, for the following reasons:
1.) Accurate totals do not exist for all competitors.
2.) There was an unequal footing for entry. Five entrants were hand-
selected by IFOCE, and the Arbitron listening-area lock-out kept
everyone else out.
3.) Judging - make your own opinions about that. When was the last
time you didn't see Rich LeFevre, Bob Shoudt, Chip Simpson,
Steakbellie, and Wing Kong near the top of the results page?

I also propose that we do not count attendance points for Lancaster
Shoo-Fly pie, due to the poor judging and loss of results. We do have
results for most competitors 10 and up, but no numbers for Russ Keeler
due to the judges loss of his plates. If we do count attendance
points, then we need to consider how many points to give to Russ, who
may have been in the money, judging from conversations I have had with
some of the eaters from that side of the table.

Please comment and make suggestions. I don't think these proposals
will cause any major point adjustments, just a little evening out.

[Liz K]

Excellent points, all. Some of these things we did debate at the
beginning of the year, while others are certainly valid points of
change based on how the IFOCE scoring ended up and all that. I'd like
to get opinions on this and I'll weigh in, too. Thanks for this,
Bill!

[Eric Livingston]

I love all of this. Really, nicely done!
#5. Believe it or not I have NO opinion on this and I am open to
arguments going either way.

#6 I'm ok with disallowing WingBowl. Despite being 'Eating
Entertainment' I dont know if it qualifies as CE.

I'd gladly vouch for Russ and give him my position in the least. He
ate more than me and was cleaner. It would be a shame for Pat B to
lose a world record too.

On 10/2/07, Wild Bill Myers <gnaw...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>

[Liz K]

1.) Repeat foods--Proposal: A food is only considered a "repeat" food when it comes from

the same contest sponsor and the contest is the same length of time.

I agree with this in theory, and I think in MOST cases, this will be the standard.  I do think we should defer to the IFOCE if they are going to count something as a record.  I counted the burritos as a record because Skinnyboy sent me something that led me to believe they were counting it as a broken record.  If that's not the case, I'll change the points to a set record.


2.) Weird foods - Proposal: Foods that are named the same but are different

consistencies or make-up will be considered different foods.

definitely!  This kinda goes hand-in-hand with the above rule.

3.) Contest points - Proposal: All contests are worth 50 points, with the exception of the

Nathan's and Krystal Finals, which are worth 100 points.

I don't have a problem with this.  For the most part, this is how it's done, with the exception of a couple contests at the beginning of the year that weren't awarded IFOCE points or were awarded 25 points.  We can award them retroactively.

4.) Multi-level contests - Proposal: Multi-heat contests will be counted as one contest, with the eaters receiving quantity points for all foods eaten, and contest points for their final ranking for that contest.

This should be how it's done now.  If anything's not counted like this, it's a mistake!

5.) Should each Nathan's or Krystal qualifier, if repeated in the same location, count as an individual event for Establishing New Record and / or Breaking Existing Record points?

I say no on this one.  It just gets complicated (for me). :-)  

6.) Two contests stick out as possible non-counting events.  

I propose that we do NOT count any attendance points, positive or

negative, for Wing Bowl 15...

I don't really care, except we fought about this a lot at the beginning of the year and landed where we landed.  I'd just as soon leave it.

I also propose that we do not count attendance points for Lancaster
Shoo-Fly pie, due to the poor judging and loss of results. 

I definitely don't want to toss this contest completely.  I gave Russ credit for 5.21 pounds of pie (an average between Steakbellie and Chris Abatsas, and did award him a point for a 9th place finish.  I'm fine with that unless you all aren't!

[Hoover]

#1-3 Yes on the proposals.
#4 If contests have heats, yes they should be counted as one event.
Otherwise they can be counted seperately. Like Liz said, I think this
is what she is doing already.
#5 No. Location should not affect points on any personal best or a
new record. Food/sponsor/time I believe are the only things that
should matter.
#6 Wing Bowl should maybe at least have appearance points awarded as
though it were an exibition. It looks like from the eatfeats database
that no real totals were posted on the majority of the field.

Shoo-Fly pie I think was pretty accurate through at least 7th I
thought. I say if a few that were not included like you say Keeler
was, I didn't know anything about that, I think we can take his word
for it on the honor code to award points. I think he and others, if
this is the case, deserve to have their poundage posted and points
awarded.