LD / Catbird fight over Capital Stack again

[skibrian]

Cat Bird at 7am:

"Nightmare day for P shares, LD.  Take a look atvthe realtime. FNMAS down $3 and FNMFO down to only $500 with well over a 90% lose. No MOMO here!"

Shares materially up at time of my post:
http://finance.yahoo.com/quotes/fmcc,fnma,fmckj,fmcki,fmccm,fmcck,fmcct,fmcci,fmckk,fmccg,fmcch,fmccl,fmccn,fmcco,fmccp,fmccj,fregp,fmckp,fmccs,fmcko,fmckm,fmckn,fmckl,fnmap,fnmao,fnmfo,fnmam,fnmag,fnman,fnmal,fnmak,fnmah,fnmai,fnmaj,fnmas,fnmat,fnmfm,fnmfn/view/v2?bypass=true&ltr=1

no apology from cat bird.  he's always right.

[skibrian]

I can't imagine the activity at ihub and yahoo.  I haven't looked in years!  Whatever they are doing has to be 10x more crazy than the other google board.

At ihub, we used to refer to the YMB board (at that time ca. 2012) as a butch of monkeys masturbating to the latest news.  then the NWS happened and all their joy went away and the haters entered ihub.  And then we left.

[seysmont]

FNMAS is halted news pending. Why would they halt just one preferred?

[skibrian]

seys...link????

years ago, you remember a ton of hours long halts?  it was always the trading platform failing.

anyway, how do you know?

[seysmont]

http://www.otcmarkets.com/market-activity/suspended-symbols?search=fnmas&searchType=symbol

[seysmont]

I see news pending on my system lol

It's weird

[neo]

Scottrade says it is a technical trading issue on OTC...nothing breaking in the way of news...over 200 affected securities

[skibrian]

that looks like a glitch.  they would have to halt everything.  nor did I see a report news is pending.  that would be a shocker.

[seysmont]

To be honest, I think what happened is someone on Interactive Brokers got liquidated. IB have autoliquidate feature. Some forex or Asian based trader hit margin call, and they autoliquidated into no market. FMCC was affected, NTDOY for some reason had zero size and $13 print, and FNMAS 50K printed $4 down. Probably IB took the loss, that's why they are trying to figure out what happened. Again, speculation. IB is the biggest autoliquidate primary broker that I know that operates internationally. 

[skibrian]

@seys, I have no idea what that rambling was all about.

will have to take your word for it ;)

[seysmont]

All those prints are dated at around 3am. There is no market at 3am in any US stocks. Nobody even trades them. I think the pre-market opens at 4am, so those trades must have been automatic sales of some sort. And probably not on the US time either. By the timing it looks like and Asian timeline, their markets are trading around that time.

[mhill_fin]

It's the all too typical case of p-share envy. There really is no known cure.

[joseph s]

Yeah. It is ridiculous. Own what you own and argue for what you think will happen. It is very evident that our board is stable and healthy. All views are welcome. When views are stifled and muffled, everyone suffers. I dont like CJ's negativity right now but he may be right

[skibrian]

@Joe

Over the weekend, more people posted here than the other board.

Scoreboard.

Where the discourse takes place, there influence will be

[joseph s]

Agree, Ski. Where alternate views are welcome, people will come.

People will come, Ray. People will most definitely come.

Not sure quantity is as important as quality. I think we have good quality

[littlede...@gmail.com]

Its no no fight SKI....da devil did da DD.....Da devil confident on da Ps like da devil said many many times....da priority rules don't just disappear because a blog/analyst or a hedgy guy wish it to be gone.........Da MOMO club DD is solid and stands......Da devil no no mad at cat because cat is a goober....da sayin is P and Cs will both make monies.....we just don't know da CONVERSION......da conversion.....con- ver-sion.......da devil felt so bad dat da devil did not even want to gloat.....trust da devil...da devil can showboat and gloat wit da best of dem.....not to poo poo on commons because we have common goobers reading did board too....but....remember.....and as always....go figure...devil

[mhill_fin]

Looks like my boy Catbird is back at it...

[skibrian]

that is probably the funniest thing I've seen in a month!

What I was shaking my head at is the last 12 hours of posting over there have been pointless debates about the visibility of the bid/ask.

like it even matters.  boring me to tears.

the substance, chiefly by simsla in the last day, is much more interesting here...

[mhill_fin]

lol. The goings on over there are great comical relief.

[skibrian]

now they think we are only preferred stock champions LOL.  that's rediculous.  I think preferred is the short term play, common the possible long term play...after preferred stock paid back.  Everyone has their own thesis.  I'm not here to say who's right.  Ackman bought common, Berkie bought preferred.  neither are dummies.  anyway, the fight continues, and they finger this board LOL

https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!topic/freddienfannie/0_pfIBf7smw

Crooks winning

11:36 AM (3 minutes ago)

i think most pfds owners moved to other board. they were claiming victory lap on monday, then got hamered 7% yesterday and again 7% today FNMAS. personally, i think pfds has even greater risk. media is going after hedge funds and it is a political suicide to make pfds at par (paulson, berkowitz). i hear they were quitely going to snug it in a plan that would make pfds whole but failed as it was exposed. there is no way dividends are restored, so pfds have a huge downside. receivership is not an option, so berkwitz liquidation does not work (media will expose that pfds are getting something in liquidation). i would not touch pfds, they wil go down a lot more (and commons are volatile, hard to say anything). the crap about pfds are higher in chain does not apply to this political mess.

[seysmont]

I think he is trying to make any sort of sense from what he hears in the media. It's a big mistake. What they say doesn't have to be consistent or make sense. I generally avoid making constructive arguments because of this. Anything politically based can't be modeled, because it's not factual. So whatever these people say is irrelevant. It's better to focus on the end result. If $0, try to find a method to arrive to it, if par, try to find a method to arrive to that. I can't arrive to $0, though. The only thing close is infinite conservatorship. The risk of conservatorship increases, so I can see why Mnuchin is motivated to end this. 

[mhill_fin]

Yep, I believe both classes of stock have some extremely smart people in them. They know the advantages and pitfalls of each and are realistic with their expectations.

Unfortunately, the best and brightest common shareholders are getting drowned out on the public message boards by the not-so-best-and-brightest common shareholders.

[skibrian]

"Unfortunately, the best and brightest common shareholders are getting drowned out on the public message boards by the not-so-best-and-brightest common shareholders."

...nail on the head

[skibrian]

more click bait for us...don't bite!

PS -- all common shareholders welcome to post here if you keep it civil!

https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!topic/freddienfannie/0_pfIBf7smw

Crooks winning

12:04 PM (50 minutes ago)

the victory lap by pfds holders on other baord and bashing of commons is working out great. fake news on the media and manipulated court system would not allow us to to do high five , even paulson and berkowitz helping trump didn't do anything. trump wants all of sweep for the wall

 

https://finance.yahoo.com/quotes/FMCC,FNMA,FMCKJ,FMCKI,FMCCM,FMCCK,FMCCT,FMCCI,FMCKK,FMCCG,FMCCH,FMCCL,FMCCN,FMCCO,FMCCP,FMCCJ,FREGP,FMCKP,FMCCS,FMCKO,FMCKM,FMCKN,FMCKL,FNMAP,FNMAO,FNMFO,FNMAM,FNMAG,FNMAN,FNMAL,FNMAK,FNMAH,FNMAI,FNMAJ,FNMAS,FNMAT,FNMFM,FNMFN/view/v1

[ron...@comcast.net]

I wrote:

That doesn't tell me why his statements are common friendly. You're not actually deducing anything from his remarks, but rather remarkably you've come to his statements with a pre-commitment to commons and even a conspiracy theory about pfds vs commons. Rather than deducing a conclusion from his statements, you're using them as a wax nose to fit your own preconceived end game scenario.

------

And I hold mostly common.

[skibrian]

I'm just glad we are getting free advertising over there!

[mhill_fin]

Nice Ron. The smart money commons knows there is no other alternative to the 30 yr, like Ackman says. It's just a matter of time. Better things to do than invent additional pie in the sky conspiracy theories. There are already enough real conspiracies as it is.

[ron...@comcast.net]

If anything I would've found Mnuchin's remarks anti common because they didn't rule our R ship.

[littlede...@gmail.com]

As far as I know, Equity has Ps and Cs.  How all of a sudden Equity is just C, da devil do not know.   Can Crooked Winner please explain?.....

Also Mnuchin is addressing the GSE issue and not just to commons.......all talk about MNuchin is for commons is just chatter.......go figure..devil

[ron...@comcast.net]

Ps are a hybrid... Sometimes even called fixed income by Merrill

[littlede...@gmail.com]

Ps are called Preferred Stock.  Common Stocks and Preferred Stocks have very different distinct characteristics within Equity.  And yes, Preferred stock with its dividend payment characteristics can provide a fix income up to the point of redemption or default. 

[skibrian]

a top CPA out of KPMG that mentored me loves to use the phrase "can't fix stupid".  I think he learned it in the army before college when he was drafted into the last days of the Vietnam War.  It's become a favorite quote of mine too.