Re: Digest for facility-registry@googlegroups.com - 3 updates in 2 topics

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Amit Mishra

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Feb 24, 2017, 11:29:57 PM2/24/17
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Dear Scott,

Greetings!

My name is Amit Mishra from India. I wanted to understand whether paying money every year to GS1 for health facility codes would be wise decision or not for any country. Since Luhn algorithm could be used to generate facility IDs even within country.

Please clarify.

Regards,
Amit

 

Dr. Amit Mishra
Project Lead
Centre for Health Informatics
Ministry of Health & Family Welfare
NIHFW Campus, Baba Ganganath Marg l Munirka, New Delhi-110067
Mobile:   +91 9910011595 I E-mail:  dr.ami...@gmail.com

 


On Fri, Feb 24, 2017 at 3:54 AM, <facility...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Scott Teesdale <stee...@instedd.org>: Feb 23 11:28AM -0800

Hi Matt - we chatted about this today on our FR call. Here were a few of
the key notes that might be helpful.
 
- The standard isn't proprietary, but can have some costs to implement
of course
- GS1 focuses on supply chain use cases, but there is nothing that
would stop you from using a GLN for other types of nodes. One of the key
components of it is that they are also commonly used for like identifying
nursing stations, doors, or other more granular details within a location -
likely overkill for your wells and osm example.
- It uses a check digit approach similar to the luhn algorithm we have
used for other facility registry things.
- It seems easy enough to store this kind of ID in a facility registry,
to promote interoperability and other uses... but some additional
exploration about how they are created and managed would be important to
consider.
 
Here is some helpful links as well...
- http://www.gs1.org/docs/idkeys/GS1_Global_Location_Numbers.pdf
- http://www.gs1.org/docs/healthcare/GLN_Healthcare_Imp_Guide.pdf
- http://www.gs1.org/gln
 
Matt what are some of the other alternatives you have come across? For
example we chatted quickly about things like what3words as well today.
 
Best,
Scott
 
 
 
On Tuesday, December 20, 2016 at 11:37:21 PM UTC-6, mlberg wrote:
Scott Teesdale <stee...@instedd.org>: Feb 23 07:33AM -0800

Hi All,
 
We have a facility registry community call scheduled for today (Feb 23) at
11am ET or 6pm EAT. A few potential topics to discuss include:
 
- Implementation Updates and Q/A?
- GLN's and GS1
- Facility Registries and Open Data Initiatives like OSM, HDX, etc.
- Site-level Planning and Facility Registries
- AOB - Bring your own updates / topics - we will prioritize based off
of who can join the call.
 
We hope you are able to join, please see the linked details to access our
notes and the google hangout for the meeting (link
<https://wiki.ohie.org/display/resources/Feb+23%2C+2017+OHIE+FR+Meeting>)
 
Best,
Scott
Carl Leitner <litl...@gmail.com>: Feb 23 11:04AM -0500

Sorry that I will be unavailable today. Hope to catch up with you all
later.
 
Cheers,
-carl
 
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Scott Teesdale

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Feb 25, 2017, 12:08:49 AM2/25/17
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Hi Amit, 

I am a bit new to GLNs but we had a nice conversation on the topic last week during our community meeting.  What we discussed though is that GLNs arn't proprietary; but there likely would be other costs associated with implementing the standard.  The associated GS1 standard has a more supply-chain focus - with the ability to nest equipment, in rooms, behind doors, in wards, inside a facility...   To date this is a much more granular type of spatial identification than facility registries have used... but if a supply chain system was using them - a FR could certainly seek to integrate on that ID to promote interoperability. 

In general though the luhn algorithm approach is a lighter touch way to identifying sites - and likely fits most common facility registry scenarios. 

Amit - are you working on setting up a facility registry in India?  We would love to learn more about your work. Thanks for joining our group!

- Scott 

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Bob Jolliffe

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Feb 25, 2017, 7:20:58 AM2/25/17
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Hello Amit

I haven't followed the discussion too closely, but I would have to agree with your concern.  It wouldn't make sense to have to pay GS1 in order to identify your own facilities.  Its a question of sovereignty and a dangerous route to travel.  Mind you I would have similar concerns over the use of SNOMED-CT - which GOI has been happy to pay for :-)

Bob

Derek Ritz

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Feb 25, 2017, 3:27:27 PM2/25/17
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Hi all.

I think we should be very clear -- the GLN is not a proprietary specification. The extra costs that are being referred to need to identified and evaluated; I'll be surprised if they are not simply implementation-related (which is the case whether GLN or any other ID scheme is being deployed).

What we should be equally clear about is that there is significant value in ecosystems... it is from these that we enjoy the all-important "network effect". Ecosystems are not free; it takes a lot of effort and cost and ongoing nurturing for an ecosystem to thrive. Where there already are ecosystems -- such as GS1 and their GLN database -- it is smart for us to want to "join" them and to leverage the value that has already been created there.

Scott -- have I correctly captured the gist of your earlier points? Sorry if I have not...

Warmest regards,

Derek.
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Scott Teesdale

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Feb 25, 2017, 5:24:47 PM2/25/17
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Hi Derek - Yes I think you hit the nail on the head. 

Best,
Scott

Carl Leitner

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Feb 27, 2017, 9:35:27 AM2/27/17
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The costs to issue GLNs seem to vary by country, and may require joining the GS1 country office:
  http://www.gs1.org/contact/overview
The type of membership required depends on factors such as the number of locations and annual revenue.  

As an example, you can see the fee schedule for joining GS1 Australia here:
which shows an annual fee up to $15k, and here is a fee schedule for Tanzania:
which looks like it is up to $25k annually.

Note also that there is “special” pricing for healthcare in Canada. 
Not sure if these extends elsewhere, but here is more info:



Cheers,
-carl
 
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Scott Teesdale

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Mar 8, 2017, 6:41:52 AM3/8/17
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Hi Carl, Thanks for the clarification on the country level fee’s - that is super helpful. 

Amit, sounds like there isn’t a strong reason for you to use the GS1 at this point - would you agree?   Seems as though the Luhn / check-digit approach to identifying facilities makes the most sense.  We would be curious which direction you ultimately decide to go. 

Best,
Scott


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Scott Teesdale
Project Manager - InSTEDD
Email: stee...@instedd.org
Skype: scott.teesdale
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