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[hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
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eric machine
Mar 1, 2013, 10:23:13 AM3/1/13
to hylafa...@hylafax.org
Hi everyone,
I just wondering whether this can be done.
1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I take a normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via hylafax or through a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax document quality drops so much in faxing? I thought its transmitting data and it shouldn't lose any data via the PSTN network?
2. Can fax machine send fax in color? Let's assume 1 side is Xerox MFP which is capable to scan in color and sendfax. The other side is hylafax. Can the receiver side see the fax in color?
Any help? Thanks.
I just wondering whether this can be done.
1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I take a normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via hylafax or through a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax document quality drops so much in faxing? I thought its transmitting data and it shouldn't lose any data via the PSTN network?
2. Can fax machine send fax in color? Let's assume 1 side is Xerox MFP which is capable to scan in color and sendfax. The other side is hylafax. Can the receiver side see the fax in color?
Any help? Thanks.
shouldbe q931
Mar 1, 2013, 11:16:16 AM3/1/13
to hylafa...@hylafax.org, eric machine
On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 3:39 AM, eric machine <eric.m...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I just wondering whether this can be done.
>
> 1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I take a
> normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via hylafax or through
> a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax document quality drops so much
> in faxing? I thought its transmitting data and it shouldn't lose any data
> via the PSTN network?
Fax does have ECM capabilities, but this needs to be supported and
> Hi everyone,
>
> I just wondering whether this can be done.
>
> 1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I take a
> normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via hylafax or through
> a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax document quality drops so much
> in faxing? I thought its transmitting data and it shouldn't lose any data
> via the PSTN network?
enabled by both sides
Fax does have hi resolution modes, but this needs to be supported and
enabled by both sides
Fax ECM is not the same as TCP
T.38 uses JPEG (a "lossy" method) of compression.
> 2. Can fax machine send fax in color? Let's assume 1 side is Xerox MFP which
> is capable to scan in color and sendfax. The other side is hylafax. Can the
> receiver side see the fax in color?
mean that is has support for faxing in colour
Hylafax has colour support
T.38 uses JPEG compression
> Any help? Thanks.
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Chris Weiss
Mar 1, 2013, 11:19:14 AM3/1/13
to eric machine, hylafa...@hylafax.org
> 1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I take a
> normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via hylafax or through
> a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax document quality drops so much
> in faxing? I thought its transmitting data and it shouldn't lose any data
> via the PSTN network?
standard faxing is done via scanlines, similar to how analog broadcast
> normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via hylafax or through
> a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax document quality drops so much
> in faxing? I thought its transmitting data and it shouldn't lose any data
> via the PSTN network?
TV was done, so there absolutely is a loss of quality. there are
setting on quality (normal, fine, superfine), but the higher the
quality the longer the phone call takes, and if it's long distance
this can get expensive. ECM can improve this, if your modem than the
receiving system support it.
> 2. Can fax machine send fax in color? Let's assume 1 side is Xerox MFP which
> is capable to scan in color and sendfax. The other side is hylafax. Can the
> receiver side see the fax in color?
support it, but again both your modem and the receiving system need to
support the same extensions.
the reality is, if you want really high quality, fax is not the
transport you want. email that sucker.
Lee Howard
Mar 2, 2013, 1:29:15 AM3/2/13
to eric machine, hylafa...@hylafax.org
On 02/28/2013 07:39 PM, eric machine wrote:
> 1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I
> take a normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via
> hylafax or through a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax
> document quality drops so much in faxing? I thought its transmitting
> data and it shouldn't lose any data via the PSTN network?
Traditional fax is not greyscale; traditional fax is monochrome. So if
> 1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I
> take a normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via
> hylafax or through a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax
> document quality drops so much in faxing? I thought its transmitting
> data and it shouldn't lose any data via the PSTN network?
the source image is color or greyscale then the fax machine or HylaFAX
must convert it to a monochromatic image before faxing it. The process
of doing that conversion involves dithering algorithms, and the way that
it looks will vary depending on the dithering algorithm used. HylaFAX,
by default, uses the default algorithm provided by Ghoscript, and this
algorithm is fairly grainy as it seems to be optimized for data size
rather than readability.
If you're using HylaFAX+ then you can try putting either:
DITHERING=libtiff-fs
.. or...
DITHERING=gs-stocht
.. into /var/spool/hylafax/etc/FaxModify to see if it looks better for you.
> 2. Can fax machine send fax in color? Let's assume 1 side is Xerox MFP
> which is capable to scan in color and sendfax. The other side is
> hylafax. Can the receiver side see the fax in color?
libjpeg. Do...
sendfax -O usecolor:yes -d <number> <color-image.pdf>
Sample: http://mail.mainpine.com/files/color-fax.pdf
Be aware that color images are at least eight-times larger than their
monochromatic counterparts. So they usually take a long time to send.
Thanks,
Lee.
Lee Howard
Mar 4, 2013, 1:22:30 PM3/4/13
to eric machine, hylafa...@hylafax.org
On 03/02/2013 08:23 AM, eric machine wrote:
> a. It looks like HylaFax+ can do a lot of things like mentioned by
> Lee. But can this be done on the HylaFax version?
>
> Thus, do you advise me to use HylaFax+ instead of HylaFax open source?
HylaFAX+ is open source. http://hylafax.sourceforge.net
> b. Is ECM a software which I need to install on my hylafax server? Or
> is it built-in into traditional fax machine?
Most fax machines support ECM. HylaFAX has ECM enabled by default, but
it can be turned off.
> c. so if hylafax, i enable color. But the destination fax doesn't,
> what will happen? Fax fails or will send a mono color fax instead?
When sending a color fax with HylaFAX+ using "sendfax -O usecolor:yes"
it will prepare both color and monochrome images of the fax and will
send color if possible, but if not, then will send monochrome. If you
want it to only send color and to not send anything to the receiver if
it does not support color, then use "sendfax -O usecolor:only".
> a. It looks like HylaFax+ can do a lot of things like mentioned by
> Lee. But can this be done on the HylaFax version?
>
> Thus, do you advise me to use HylaFax+ instead of HylaFax open source?
HylaFAX+ is open source. http://hylafax.sourceforge.net
> b. Is ECM a software which I need to install on my hylafax server? Or
> is it built-in into traditional fax machine?
Most fax machines support ECM. HylaFAX has ECM enabled by default, but
it can be turned off.
> c. so if hylafax, i enable color. But the destination fax doesn't,
> what will happen? Fax fails or will send a mono color fax instead?
When sending a color fax with HylaFAX+ using "sendfax -O usecolor:yes"
it will prepare both color and monochrome images of the fax and will
send color if possible, but if not, then will send monochrome. If you
want it to only send color and to not send anything to the receiver if
it does not support color, then use "sendfax -O usecolor:only".
eric machine
Mar 4, 2013, 1:40:26 PM3/4/13
to Lee Howard, hylafa...@hylafax.org
Hi everyone,
Thanks so much replying.
Few more questions to go.
a. It looks like HylaFax+ can do a lot of things like mentioned by Lee. But can this be done on the HylaFax version?
Thus, do you advise me to use HylaFax+ instead of HylaFax open source?
> Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 22:28:56 -0800
> From: fax...@howardsilvan.com
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> DITHERING=gs-stocht
>
> ... into /var/spool/hylafax/etc/FaxModify to see if it looks better for you.
Thanks so much replying.
Few more questions to go.
a. It looks like HylaFax+ can do a lot of things like mentioned by Lee. But can this be done on the HylaFax version?
Thus, do you advise me to use HylaFax+ instead of HylaFax open source?
b. Is ECM a software which I need to install on my hylafax server? Or is it built-in into traditional fax machine?
c. so if hylafax, i enable color. But the destination fax doesn't, what will happen? Fax fails or will send a mono color fax instead?
Any help? Thanks.
> Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 22:28:56 -0800
> From: fax...@howardsilvan.com
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> On 02/28/2013 07:39 PM, eric machine wrote:
> > 1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I
> > take a normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via
> > hylafax or through a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax
> > document quality drops so much in faxing? I thought its transmitting
> > data and it shouldn't lose any data via the PSTN network?
>
> Traditional fax is not greyscale; traditional fax is monochrome. So if
> the source image is color or greyscale then the fax machine or HylaFAX
> must convert it to a monochromatic image before faxing it. The process
> of doing that conversion involves dithering algorithms, and the way that
> it looks will vary depending on the dithering algorithm used. HylaFAX,
> by default, uses the default algorithm provided by Ghoscript, and this
> algorithm is fairly grainy as it seems to be optimized for data size
> rather than readability.
>
> If you're using HylaFAX+ then you can try putting either:
>
> DITHERING=libtiff-fs
>
> ... or...
> On 02/28/2013 07:39 PM, eric machine wrote:
> > 1. If I take a document and grayscale it, it looks way better if I
> > take a normal document, scan and fax it through whether its via
> > hylafax or through a traditional fax machine. Why does the fax
> > document quality drops so much in faxing? I thought its transmitting
> > data and it shouldn't lose any data via the PSTN network?
>
> Traditional fax is not greyscale; traditional fax is monochrome. So if
> the source image is color or greyscale then the fax machine or HylaFAX
> must convert it to a monochromatic image before faxing it. The process
> of doing that conversion involves dithering algorithms, and the way that
> it looks will vary depending on the dithering algorithm used. HylaFAX,
> by default, uses the default algorithm provided by Ghoscript, and this
> algorithm is fairly grainy as it seems to be optimized for data size
> rather than readability.
>
> If you're using HylaFAX+ then you can try putting either:
>
> DITHERING=libtiff-fs
>
>
> DITHERING=gs-stocht
>
> ... into /var/spool/hylafax/etc/FaxModify to see if it looks better for you.
Lee Howard
Mar 4, 2013, 8:41:02 PM3/4/13
to eric machine, hylafa...@hylafax.org
On 03/04/2013 04:45 PM, eric machine wrote:
> Thanks so much :)
>
> By the way, do you have a list of your clients using HylaFax+?
>
> Any big names? I just trying to reposition to my bos which one to
> consider investing time and money into.
>
> Any help? Thanks.
You're always welcome to ask on the mailing list for anyone who may want
to divulge what they're using, but typically my clients tend to want to
remain anonymous.
However, it's easy-enough to just look at the mailing list archives to
try and get a sense of it. Unfortunately for that endeavour, I get a
lot of HylaFAX-related communication off-list. As I said, they enjoy
anonymity.
> Thanks so much :)
>
> By the way, do you have a list of your clients using HylaFax+?
>
> Any big names? I just trying to reposition to my bos which one to
> consider investing time and money into.
>
> Any help? Thanks.
You're always welcome to ask on the mailing list for anyone who may want
to divulge what they're using, but typically my clients tend to want to
remain anonymous.
However, it's easy-enough to just look at the mailing list archives to
try and get a sense of it. Unfortunately for that endeavour, I get a
lot of HylaFAX-related communication off-list. As I said, they enjoy
anonymity.
eric machine
Mar 5, 2013, 9:56:53 AM3/5/13
to Lee Howard, hylafa...@hylafax.org
Thanks so much :)
By the way, do you have a list of your clients using HylaFax+?
Any big names? I just trying to reposition to my bos which one to consider investing time and money into.
Any help? Thanks.
> Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 10:22:11 -0800
By the way, do you have a list of your clients using HylaFax+?
Any big names? I just trying to reposition to my bos which one to consider investing time and money into.
Any help? Thanks.
> From: fax...@howardsilvan.com
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> On 03/02/2013 08:23 AM, eric machine wrote:
> > a. It looks like HylaFax+ can do a lot of things like mentioned by
> > Lee. But can this be done on the HylaFax version?
> >
> > Thus, do you advise me to use HylaFax+ instead of HylaFax open source?
>
> > Lee. But can this be done on the HylaFax version?
> >
> > Thus, do you advise me to use HylaFax+ instead of HylaFax open source?
>
> > b. Is ECM a software which I need to install on my hylafax server? Or
> > is it built-in into traditional fax machine?
>
> > is it built-in into traditional fax machine?
>
> Most fax machines support ECM. HylaFAX has ECM enabled by default, but
> it can be turned off.
>
> it can be turned off.
>
> > c. so if hylafax, i enable color. But the destination fax doesn't,
> > what will happen? Fax fails or will send a mono color fax instead?
>
> > what will happen? Fax fails or will send a mono color fax instead?
>
eric machine
Mar 5, 2013, 10:42:12 AM3/5/13
to Lee Howard, hylafa...@hylafax.org
Hi Lee,
Few more questions.
a. Could I use AvantFax on top of HylaFax+? If not, any recommendations?
b. Could I send faxes with microsoft office documents as attachments?
c. Do you have any .NET API to communicate with Hylafax+?
d. Do you allow custom cover pages in html and .doc/.docx format?
e. lastly, can I use YajHFC to connect to HylaFax+?
Any help? Thanks.
Thanks.
> Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 17:40:41 -0800
Few more questions.
a. Could I use AvantFax on top of HylaFax+? If not, any recommendations?
b. Could I send faxes with microsoft office documents as attachments?
c. Do you have any .NET API to communicate with Hylafax+?
d. Do you allow custom cover pages in html and .doc/.docx format?
e. lastly, can I use YajHFC to connect to HylaFax+?
Any help? Thanks.
Thanks.
> Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 17:40:41 -0800
> From: fax...@howardsilvan.com
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> On 03/04/2013 04:45 PM, eric machine wrote:
> > Thanks so much :)
> >
> > By the way, do you have a list of your clients using HylaFax+?
> >
> > Any big names? I just trying to reposition to my bos which one to
> > consider investing time and money into.
> >
> > Any help? Thanks.
>
> >
> > By the way, do you have a list of your clients using HylaFax+?
> >
> > Any big names? I just trying to reposition to my bos which one to
> > consider investing time and money into.
> >
> > Any help? Thanks.
>
Lee Howard
Mar 5, 2013, 2:40:19 PM3/5/13
to eric machine, hylafa...@hylafax.org
On 03/05/2013 06:50 AM, eric machine wrote:
> a. Could I use AvantFax on top of HylaFax+?
Yes.
> a. Could I use AvantFax on top of HylaFax+?
> If not, any recommendations?
I don't use AvantFax, myself. Most of what I use is custom-tailored for
the application.
> b. Could I send faxes with microsoft office documents as attachments?
only accepts Postscript, PDF, and TIFF.
> c. Do you have any .NET API to communicate with Hylafax+?
> d. Do you allow custom cover pages in html and .doc/.docx format?
the server-side continuation pages are of a proprietary Postscript-like
format.
> e. lastly, can I use YajHFC to connect to HylaFax+?
Lee Howard
Mar 5, 2013, 7:07:29 PM3/5/13
to eric machine, hylafa...@hylafax.org
On 03/05/2013 03:52 PM, eric machine wrote:
>
> Could I use the API here http://www.hylafax.org/content/HylaFAX_APIs
> to talk to Hylafax+?
Yes.
> So basically for microsoft office, I need to manually add this
> functionality into HylaFax+ right? But it is possible right?
Typically the filetype conversions are handled client-side so that the
server only has to deal with Postscript, PDF, or TIFF (and in some cases
PCL). If you really, really wanted to burden the server with the
MSOffice -> PDF conversions, then you're welcome to modify the code.
However, I would think that this is something you'd still want done on
the client.
If you're using the sendfax client then sample conversion approaches are
already in typerules. Here is a more-elaborate example...
-----------------------------------------
# MS Office (Word) conversion using antiword or unoconv. Install
antiword or unoconv
# (which uses OpenOffice/LibreOffice) and enable this if you want it.
It may produce
# imperfect renderings, but they're better than nothing, perhaps.
#0 short 0xd0cf ps antiword -p letter -m
8859-1.txt %i > %o
0 short 0xd0cf pdf unoconv -f pdf -o %o %i
#0 short 0xd0cf error Microsoft Word Document
support not configured
# Office 2007 uses a zipped Open-XML file format. Magic typing
# cannot distinguish between those files and other zip v2.0 files.
0 long 0x504b0304 error filetype conversion support
not configured
#>4 byte 0x14 error Zip v2.0 support not
configured
>4 byte 0x14 pdf unoconv -f pdf -o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Dd][Oo][Cc]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Dd][Oo][Cc][Xx]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Xx][Ll][Ss]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Xx][Ll][Ss][Xx]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Rr][Tt][Ff]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
-----------------------------------------
Please note that the "filename" typing is a HylaFAX+ feature.
>
> Could I use the API here http://www.hylafax.org/content/HylaFAX_APIs
> to talk to Hylafax+?
Yes.
> So basically for microsoft office, I need to manually add this
> functionality into HylaFax+ right? But it is possible right?
Typically the filetype conversions are handled client-side so that the
server only has to deal with Postscript, PDF, or TIFF (and in some cases
PCL). If you really, really wanted to burden the server with the
MSOffice -> PDF conversions, then you're welcome to modify the code.
However, I would think that this is something you'd still want done on
the client.
If you're using the sendfax client then sample conversion approaches are
already in typerules. Here is a more-elaborate example...
-----------------------------------------
# MS Office (Word) conversion using antiword or unoconv. Install
antiword or unoconv
# (which uses OpenOffice/LibreOffice) and enable this if you want it.
It may produce
# imperfect renderings, but they're better than nothing, perhaps.
#0 short 0xd0cf ps antiword -p letter -m
8859-1.txt %i > %o
0 short 0xd0cf pdf unoconv -f pdf -o %o %i
#0 short 0xd0cf error Microsoft Word Document
support not configured
# Office 2007 uses a zipped Open-XML file format. Magic typing
# cannot distinguish between those files and other zip v2.0 files.
0 long 0x504b0304 error filetype conversion support
not configured
#>4 byte 0x14 error Zip v2.0 support not
configured
>4 byte 0x14 pdf unoconv -f pdf -o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Dd][Oo][Cc]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Dd][Oo][Cc][Xx]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Xx][Ll][Ss]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Xx][Ll][Ss][Xx]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
0 filename ^.*\.[Rr][Tt][Ff]$ pdf unoconv -f pdf
-o %o %i
-----------------------------------------
Please note that the "filename" typing is a HylaFAX+ feature.
eric machine
Mar 5, 2013, 7:48:28 PM3/5/13
to Lee Howard, hylafa...@hylafax.org
Thanks Lee.
Any idea? Thanks.
So basically for microsoft office, I need to manually add this functionality into HylaFax+ right? But it is possible right?
Any help? Thanks again.
> Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 11:40:03 -0800
Any idea? Thanks.
So basically for microsoft office, I need to manually add this functionality into HylaFax+ right? But it is possible right?
> Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 11:40:03 -0800
> From: fax...@howardsilvan.com
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
eric machine
Mar 5, 2013, 10:07:01 PM3/5/13
to Lee Howard, hylafa...@hylafax.org
Thanks so much :) I will give this a try :)
Just 1 last question.
Could I use a proxmox's virtual machine to install linux and then install hylafax+? Right now I have a fax gateway and I can point a DID fax to this VM IP Address.
Or should I use a physical machine to test instead? I still have a spare server - 1 Quad Core and 4GB of RAM. Will that be sufficient for testing?
Any help? Thanks.
> Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 16:07:09 -0800
Just 1 last question.
Could I use a proxmox's virtual machine to install linux and then install hylafax+? Right now I have a fax gateway and I can point a DID fax to this VM IP Address.
Or should I use a physical machine to test instead? I still have a spare server - 1 Quad Core and 4GB of RAM. Will that be sufficient for testing?
Any help? Thanks.
> Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 16:07:09 -0800
> From: fax...@howardsilvan.com
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> To: eric.m...@hotmail.com
> CC: hylafa...@hylafax.org
> Subject: Re: [hylafax-users] Sending Fax in true quality?
>
> On 03/05/2013 03:52 PM, eric machine wrote:
> >
> Yes.
> >
>
> > So basically for microsoft office, I need to manually add this
> > functionality into HylaFax+ right? But it is possible right?
>
> > So basically for microsoft office, I need to manually add this
> > functionality into HylaFax+ right? But it is possible right?
>
John Hudak
Mar 5, 2013, 11:39:29 PM3/5/13
to eric machine, Lee Howard, hylafa...@hylafax.org
Eric:
In a previous message you inquired about using MS Office files with YajHFC
client. I replied that you would browse to the directory where the MS
office files were located and then select the desired .doc, docx, .ppt,
pptx, etc files you want to send. This is in error and I apologize.
In order for Yajhfc to send the files to HylaFAX the following file formats
must be used: .ps, .pdf, .jpg, .jpeg, .png, gif, .tif, .tiff, .htm, .html
Almost all of these formats can be generated by the office apps prior to
being selected by yajhfc.
-John
In a previous message you inquired about using MS Office files with YajHFC
client. I replied that you would browse to the directory where the MS
office files were located and then select the desired .doc, docx, .ppt,
pptx, etc files you want to send. This is in error and I apologize.
In order for Yajhfc to send the files to HylaFAX the following file formats
must be used: .ps, .pdf, .jpg, .jpeg, .png, gif, .tif, .tiff, .htm, .html
Almost all of these formats can be generated by the office apps prior to
being selected by yajhfc.
-John
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