[f-AA] ADS-B out questions answered,,, mostly

[Harvey Brock]

 Continued from previous discussions about "legal" ADSB out for non-electric airplanes. I received this reply today:

  The FAA prohibits use of portable ADS-B Out devices in US airspace. Units produced under TSO-C199 must also be installed as highlighted below from the requirements section of the TSO itself and as referenced in the attached.

 

3. REQUIREMENTS TABS requirements are derived from existing transponder and ADS-B requirements. Equipment meeting only the minimum TABS requirements will provide the capability to be seen by other aircraft equipped with traffic advisory systems but may not support detection by ground surveillance systems relying on full transponder functionality. A designer building equipment to meet this TSO may decide to incorporate more capability than what is outlined in this TSO as long as it meets the applicable requirements in the referenced standards (e.g., RTCA/DO-181E). New models of the TABS identified and manufactured on or after the effective date of this TSO must meet the MPS qualification and documentation requirements for the applicable equipment class defined by this TSO.

 

a. Functionality TABS equipment developed under this TSO are intended to make aircraft with an installed device visible to TAS, TCAS I, TCAS II and ADS-B IN equipped aircraft. TABS functionality is divided into four categories: the transponder function, altitude source function, ADS-B OUT function, and position source function.

 

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[Roger Anderson]

Bull!  It even says that those portable units will provide the capability to be seen by other aircraft.  If I had one I’d use that bad boy and let the legal system sort it out if ever challenged, which I can’t see how that would be done.  I really don’t think that’s an FAA prerogative if portable.  My opinion after two good IPAs.   roger

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[Roger Anderson]

I still think they are responding in terms as to to legality of the equipment meeting 2020 requirements.  roger

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[Harvey Brock]

I think you are right. I clearly made the question based on G, E and D airspace but so far the quoted regs seem to be pertaining to C, B and A airspace.

   I possibly could need to fly into C or B someday but am pretty sure my Champ cabin isn't pressurized well enough to get comfortable in A airspace. Although, the POH seems to indicate it could be done.

Harvey, who sits behind an A75.

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From: aer...@westmont.edu <aer...@westmont.edu> on behalf of Roger Anderson <11...@comcast.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2019 6:26:10 PM
To: aer...@westmont.edu <aer...@westmont.edu>
Subject: Re: [f-AA] ADS-B out questions answered,,, mostly

 

[Roger Anderson]

With that big motor...you can handle it!

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[Cy Galley]

By the time you climb to 18,000 feet, you will be out of gas! <GRIN>

Cy

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[Scott Ely]

Bill Hogan 20,000 ft in a Chief, 1940. Bill taught my dad to fly, and
was a bit of a hero of mine in the 70's, because he had a P-51H.

On 9/12/2019 8:20 PM, Cy Galley wrote:
> By the time you climb to 18,000 feet, you will be out of gas! <GRIN>
>
> Cy
>
>
>

> *From:*aer...@westmont.edu [mailto:aer...@westmont.edu] *On Behalf Of
> *Harvey Brock
> *Sent:* Thursday, September 12, 2019 6:34 PM
> *To:* aer...@westmont.edu
> *Subject:* Re: [f-AA] ADS-B out questions answered,,, mostly

>
>
>
> I think you are right. I clearly made the question based on G, E and D
> airspace but so far the quoted regs seem to be pertaining to C, B and A
> airspace.
>
> I possibly could need to fly into C or B someday but am pretty sure
> my Champ cabin isn't pressurized well enough to get comfortable in A
> airspace. Although, the POH seems to indicate it could be done.
>
> Harvey, who sits behind an A75.
>

> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:*aer...@westmont.edu <aer...@westmont.edu> on behalf of Roger
> Anderson <11...@comcast.net>
> *Sent:* Thursday, September 12, 2019 6:26:10 PM
> *To:* aer...@westmont.edu <aer...@westmont.edu>
> *Subject:* Re: [f-AA] ADS-B out questions answered,,, mostly

>
>
>
> I still think they are responding in terms as to to legality of the
> equipment meeting 2020 requirements. roger
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
> On Sep 12, 2019, at 6:22 PM, Roger Anderson <11...@comcast.net

> <mailto:11...@comcast.net>> wrote:
>
> Bull! It even says that those portable units will provide the
> capability to be seen by other aircraft. If I had one I’d use that
> bad boy and let the legal system sort it out if ever challenged,
> which I can’t see how that would be done. I really don’t think
> that’s an FAA prerogative if portable. My opinion after two good
> IPAs. roger
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
> On Sep 12, 2019, at 6:14 PM, Harvey Brock <harve...@hotmail.com

> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>

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['Botijo G' via aeronca]

Not in a much faster Chief!

Sent from an NDB

> <bill_hogan20000.jpg>
> <hogan20k.jpg>

[Richard Murray]

Harvey if what you asked to do is not written in the regs somewhere then it must not be legal. You are correct in your assumption that when they see portable it is clearly forbidden as a solution to conform top the 2020 mandate. However using a portable device simply to be visible to conforming aircraft is something they haven't thought of yet, and perhaps there is the fear that someone with a portable device might use it to access airspace that is forbidden. Who would know when you think about it.

Roger have another ipa. I agree if I could get a $500 portable device I would turn it on in the interest of safety and let them tell me to be less safe.

Richard in OH who doesn't think the benefits of a portable device is understood, but realizes the opportunity to use it in a manner that is not approved.

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Each sunrise is an opportunity to learn more than you knew the day before.

['Gary Frick' via aeronca]

Well I found a dealer in England on the web and from what I read and she said the issue of ADSB out aint dead. (Notice the rhyme ). It should cover us you can’t rest the unit on the fly but as I understand it we can set to 1200 and we should receive the complete picture, if we stay out of transponder required airspace’s we should be golden. Somebody, like Richard, associate GURU, with Bill Pancake should confirm that. I’m going to order the unit and see how it compares to the G3X touch I have in a little Tecnam. I believe that if it only improves things by 50% it’s money well spent. The best I’ll ever do is class Delta airports anyway. If they haven’t got what I need well there’s always a Taxi. Thoughts from Rome. Make sure my assumptions are correct. Addio from the Castel Sant’Angelo

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> On Sep 13, 2019, at 3:04 AM, 'Botijo G' via aeronca <aer...@westmont.edu> wrote:
>
> Not in a much faster Chief!

['Gary Frick' via aeronca]

Who am I kidding I can’t keep them running long enough to make it past Run up. LOL

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 24, 2019, at 3:19 PM, Gary Frick <garyall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Well I found a dealer in England on the web and from what I read and she said the issue of ADSB out aint dead. (Notice the rhyme ). It should cover us you can’t rest the unit on the fly but as I understand it we can set to 1200 and we should receive the complete picture, if we stay out of transponder required airspace’s we should be golden. Somebody, like Richard, associate GURU, with Bill Pancake should confirm that. I’m going to order the unit and see how it compares to the G3X touch I have in a little Tecnam. I believe that if it only improves things by 50% it’s money well spent. The best I’ll ever do is class Delta airports anyway. If they haven’t got what I need well there’s always a Taxi. Thoughts from Rome. Make sure my assumptions are correct. Addio from the Castel Sant’Angelo