[f-AA] Quick Introduction

[Bob Jacoby]

Hi,

I've been lurking for a little while and thought I'd take a moment to introduce myself.

Retired last April and purchased a 7AC. "3JA" went in for annual in August 2015 and it wound up being a partial restoration. I'm working on my A&P, so this all counts toward my required experience. 3JA flew again on January 30, 2016 - two weeks after her 70th birthday.

[Duane Fey]

Welcome Bob!

What a beauty! Are you sure everything is OK with your Champ? You don't
have an oil slick on your firewall.

Cheers,

Duane
'46 Chief, N85981

Hi,

_______________________________________________
Aeronca mailing list
Aer...@westmont.edu
http://mail.westmont.edu/mailman/listinfo/aeronca

[Mark Peterson]

Officially, welcome.
And job nicely done!

Mark

"Cherish the Minnesota State Fair. Wherever you find beauty and simplicity and truth, know that there is a committee somewhere planning to improve it — don't let them do it."  
 — Garrison Keillor

From: jaco...@bellsouth.net
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2016 08:12:26 -0400
To: aer...@westmont.edu
Subject: [f-AA] Quick Introduction

The partial restoration included a new firewall baffle (and Steve's Gascolator):
Refurbished engine control panel:
new control cables:
and a whole host of other things. Here's my current project:
Some of you might recognize this as the 7AC from the Phoenix AIG auction. This plane is now back in Jacksonville and being disassembled. I also purchased a new (70-year-old) fuselage and a set of wings. This one might take a while, but so far seems to be coming along nicely. The list has been extremely helpful as I figure out how things all work, and I hope to meet many of you at Middletown. Bob in Jacksonville, FL

[Roger Anderson]

Bob.  Welcome!  Wow...nice!   I'm always envious of those of you that can do that type work.   An oil change pretty much is the upper limits of my mechanical skills.  roger

---

From: "Bob Jacoby" <jaco...@bellsouth.net>
To: aer...@westmont.edu
Sent: Monday, April 25, 2016 7:12:26 AM
Subject: [f-AA] Quick Introduction

Hi,

I've been lurking for a little while and thought I'd take a moment to introduce myself.

Retired last April and purchased a 7AC.  "3JA" went in for annual in August 2015 and it wound up being a partial restoration. I'm working on my A&P, so this all counts toward my required experience.  3JA flew again on January 30, 2016 - two weeks after her 70th birthday.

[image/jpeg:image1.JPG]

The partial restoration included a new firewall baffle (and Steve's Gascolator):

[image/jpeg:image2.JPG]

Refurbished engine control panel:

[image/jpeg:image3.JPG]

new control cables:

[image/jpeg:image4.JPG]

and a whole host of other things.

Here's my current project:

[image/jpeg:image5.JPG]

[Richard Murray]

Bob,

Welcome from the shadows. Hope you will continue to share your progress, trials, and tribulations. I was fortunate to acquire enough hours (3200+) working on my Champ (and a few other projects) to get my 8610 from the FSDO last year. It really helped me to keep a spreadsheet of the dates, times, and what I worked on. I also kept a blog with pictures of the restoration work and lots of dialog. I sent the ASI my spreadsheet and a link to the blog and getting the signoff was 'a piece of cake'.

Richard in OH ready to head to the hangar for some R&R (remove and repair)

[John Rodkey]

Welcome, Bob!  Nice yellow champ, and challenging white project champ!

Any time you want to chime in, feel free!  I love it when those who can actually do stuff contribute to the conversation.

John

The partial restoration included a new firewall baffle (and Steve's Gascolator):

Refurbished engine control panel:




new control cables:

and a whole host of other things.

Here's my current project:

Some of you might recognize this as the 7AC from the Phoenix AIG auction.  This plane is now back in Jacksonville and being disassembled. I also purchased a new (70-year-old) fuselage and a set of wings. This one might take a while, but so far seems to be coming along nicely.

The list has been extremely helpful as I figure out how things all work, and I hope to meet many of you at Middletown.

Bob in Jacksonville, FL



_______________________________________________
Aeronca mailing list
Aer...@westmont.edu
http://mail.westmont.edu/mailman/listinfo/aeronca

--

John (poobah) Rodkey - N9361E 11AC at Goleta

[Rafael]

Hey hey you mean the test of us dont???? Lol

Transmitted from an NDB 

[Lucy Ooi]

Nice to meet you! What a great looking Champ! Good luck with the project!

Lucy
N4009B
"Rudolph"

[John Rodkey]

I was meaning it as contrast with my abilities, but you can take it whatever way you wish. :)

[Rafael]

Lol ok ok

Transmitted from an NDB 

[Gregory Horrell]

Nice picture of the firewall and gascolator. Did you remember to bend the cotterpin on the gascolator so it won't vibrate out and your bowl loosen?

Gregg Horrell

Juneau, AK

[jcpa...@comcast.net]

Richard,
8610?

Jim

----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Murray <murra...@gmail.com>
To: aer...@westmont.edu
Sent: Tue, 26 Apr 2016 17:16:10 -0000 (UTC)
Subject: Re: [f-AA] Quick Introduction

Bob,

Welcome from the shadows. Hope you will continue to share your progress,
trials, and tribulations. I was fortunate to acquire enough hours (3200+)
working on my Champ (and a few other projects) to get my 8610 from the FSDO
last year. It really helped me to keep a spreadsheet of the dates, times,
and what I worked on. I also kept a blog with pictures of the restoration
work and lots of dialog. I sent the ASI my spreadsheet and a link to the
blog and getting the signoff was 'a piece of cake'.

Richard in OH ready to head to the hangar for some R&R (remove and repair)

On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 12:25 PM, Roger Anderson <11...@comcast.net> wrote:

> Bob. Welcome! Wow...nice! I'm always envious of those of you that can
> do that type work. An oil change pretty much is the upper limits of my
> mechanical skills. roger
>

> ------------------------------
> *From: *"Bob Jacoby" <jaco...@bellsouth.net>
> *To: *aer...@westmont.edu
> *Sent: *Monday, April 25, 2016 7:12:26 AM
> *Subject: *[f-AA] Quick Introduction

[Ben Higginbotham]

Faa form 8610 is the one you fill out stating why you are eligible for an airframe and or powerplant maintance certificate. You either have accumulated the appropriate hours and have an A&P willing to sign stating that he supervised you or you graduated from a part 145 school in the appropriate course for the certificate you seek.

Ben

[Sam Burke]

Bob, 

Welcome. Nice looking bird. What is that black metal tube shown in one of your photos mounted below the carb? Does it have a part number and what is it for?  My airbag only has a hole in the bottom (see photo). 

Regards, 

Sam N6404C 1947 L16a C85-12 

Santa Maria, CA 

[jcpa...@comcast.net]

Thanks.

[Bob Jacoby]

Good eye, and thanks for pointing out the unbent cotter pin.  Fortunately, my IA caught the issue before we buttoned it up.

---

From: Gregory Horrell <ryanae...@gmail.com>
To: aeronca <aer...@westmont.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2016 12:43 AM

Subject: Re: [f-AA] Quick Introduction

[Bob Jacoby]

Black metal tube from the bottom of the air box:

So the gas leaks from the carburetor onto the ground instead of inside the cowling because they all drip! (LOL)

Actually it's part number 1-2572 (Tube Exhaust - Carburetor Air Scoop) it can be seen installed in engineering drawing 7–446.  I can only guess the purpose, but it does do a good job dribbling gas onto the ground.

Related "Carburetor, it's what's for dinner", http://www.beefitswhatsfordinner.com/, (or, "What husbands do when their wives are at work").

Here's a picture of a Stromberg NA– 3B which I'm rebuilding for 3JA (the flying Champ which will receive an overhauled motor within the next few months).  Prior to disassembly I'm putting the carb through repeated cycles of 150°F in the oven (soaked with Kroil) followed by freezing.  Anything hotter than 150°F is hard on the float (in my opinion). Also I don't shock cool (or heat). I let it adjust to room temperature prior to going into the freezer (or oven). The most difficult part of fixing these old carburetors is they all seem to have stripped screw heads - from repeated over tightening using the wrong size screwdriver blade.  I have very small easy outs and a fixture for the milling machine to hold the carburetor for drilling the pilot hole. The screw extractors are so small I use the spindle on the mill to guide the extractor, otherwise they snap pretty easy.

The temperature cycles really loosen up the parts if you're patient and I'll typically do is many as six cycles on a delicate part. Incidentally, you can burn the Kroil smell out of your oven by putting it up to 400° F after the parts are removed.  Regarding toxicity , I'm still here so I guess it's not poisonous. However if I suddenly stop posting it's either because the Kroil fumes killed me, or my wife caught me with this in her oven and she killed me (at least I used the old cookie sheet).

Strombergs appear to leak for one, or more, of the following reasons: (1) leaky needle valve, (2) fuel level set too high, (3) idle air bleed hole not repositioned as per 1958 Bendix SB74, and/or (4) the main gasket (part #46) wasn't properly installed. The gasket should be soaked in a 50-50 mixture of Fuel Lube and acetone for a couple days (the mixture should be about the consistency of room temperature cream of mushroom soup). Afterward loosely wrap the gasket in tinfoil so air can circulate, but dust cannot settle, for a few days. Gently wipe the excess off the gasket and install with proper torque.  This "secret recipe" also works on the cork gascolator gaskets. You've just got to sink the cork gasket with wire mesh (or by some other means) so it gets fully saturated.

And, I tend to agree with the others – while these carburetors appear simple, there is a whole host of things that need to be done extremely well for it to remain reliable.

Sorry for the long post, this is all very fascinating (and fun).

<IMG_4512.jpeg>

[Scott Johnson]

Great post!  I'm going to look for a large toaster oven for the hanger. 

Scott

[Roger Anderson]

Keep posting!  (ok John?)  Like free A&P type info.  I do pay up later for good info with the approved currency of choice....a quality brew.   You relating these efforts do remind me of growing up at my house.  My Dad frequently had various airplane and other type components either on the kitchen table, baking in the oven, or scattered around the house.  Occasional pieces of airplane needing covering would be here and there also.  Our house frequently smelled of various chemicals and toxic cleaning agents.  We all survived though I guess without too much ill effect.   roger

---

From: "Bob Jacoby" <jaco...@bellsouth.net>
To: aer...@westmont.edu

Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 8:20:42 AM
Subject: Re: [f-AA] Quick Introduction - Black Metal Tube

Black metal tube from the bottom of the air box:

So the gas leaks from the carburetor onto the ground instead of inside the cowling because they all drip! (LOL)

Actually it's part number 1-2572 (Tube Exhaust - Carburetor Air Scoop) it can be seen installed in engineering drawing 7–446.  I can only guess the purpose, but it does do a good job dribbling gas onto the ground.

Related "Carburetor, it's what's for dinner", http://www.beefitswhatsfordinner.com/, (or, "What husbands do when their wives are at work").

[joer...@suddenlink.net]

That tube directs the hot air from the muffler outside the cowling when carburetor heat is not selected. Examine your airbox with the flapper in both positions and imagine both airpaths in both positions. The air through the filter goes either up the carb or out the bottom of the box and the air from the heat muff goes either out the bottom of the box or up the carb. Not having the tube doesn't seem to be a problem for most airplanes. Once in a while having that hot air get into the cowling may aggravate a high oil temp issue.
I suspect the passage of air through the shrouds on the hanlon wilson or cessna mufflers is necessary for cooling of the muffler so if the carb heat flapper was an on/off device instead of a direct the air here or there device the mufflers would get much, much hotter when the air wasn't flowing and would enjoy a shorter life. jrh

---- Bob Jacoby <jaco...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> Black metal tube from the bottom of the air box:
>
> So the gas leaks from the carburetor onto the ground instead of inside the cowling because they all drip! (LOL)
>
> Actually it's part number 1-2572 (Tube Exhaust - Carburetor Air Scoop) it can be seen installed in engineering drawing 7–446. I can only guess the purpose, but it does do a good job dribbling gas onto the ground.

[Sam Burke]

Thanks JRH

Since I have had nigh oil temperatures in the past I will pass on the tube extension to my airbag. Good explanation.

Sam N6404C 1947 L16a C85-12

Santa Maria, California

[John Rodkey]

The tube extension should improve the heat situation - funnels excess heat outside the cowling, reducing heat in the oil tank.

John

[Sam Burke]

John, 

Well, that is good news. Tell me how that is the case? Where can I purchase this heat box tube and how does it attache? From the attached photo of my engine, you can see I only have a hole at the bottom of the heat box. 

Regards, 

Sam N6404C 1947 USAF L16a C85-12 

Santa Maria, CA 

[Doug Rounds]

Not hard to make.

[John Rodkey]

You get an aluminum flange of the appropriate size, attach to the proper sized tube, drill and rivet into the bottom of your airbox. 

I have done so but the vibration tends to shake them apart, and that leaves bits of metal in your airbox which can be sucked up into your engine.  So when the last one got shaken off my airplane, I just left it off.

John