Re: UUCP on eternal september

[Paul Edwards]

On 08/01/24 14:52, immibis wrote:
> On 1/8/24 06:19, Paul Edwards wrote:

(This is the first time I have ever added
another newsgroup (eternal-september.talk)
so I'll see if this works - I put that first
so hopefully followups go there)

>> I would potentially give you a (cheap)
>> computer or more likely smartphone (to
>> be used as a computer) if it was going
>> to be used to run PDOS/get PDNet going
>> or similar.
>
> That would be an impedance mismatch. User interfaces designed for the
> IBM PC's big screen and keyboard just don't work well on phones, because
> they are fundamentally different devices. That's not to say their CPUs
> don't work the same way, but a computer is more than just a CPU. The
> human interface peripherals are radically different.

Not anymore.

That's what PdAndro (pdos.org) is for. You
attach a US$2 keyboard to your smartphone
and you have something like MSDOS, except
it is a native ARM app. It's still proof of
concept and there was a lot of activity on
it in the last few days.

You can already do this if you use Bochs,
but that is x86, not ARM.

If the screen is too small (it seems fine
to me), you can use a tablet.

This is an alternative reason for PDOS
(apart from nuclear war) - to give people
without computers a computer. Almost
everyone in the Philippines has a smartphone,
but almost no-one has a PC.

> Typing on a full-size keyboard is very good, once you have enough
> practice, but typing on a phone-sized virtual keyboard on a touchscreen
> is terrible due to the missing physical feedback.

Sure. And it took me a long time to realize
that you could attach a keyboard to a
smartphone.

>>> It does sound interesting, and it is interesting, but if me or you
>>> actually lived in that scenario, we'd have much bigger problems than a
>>> lack of communication. If you live in North Korea, how will
>>> communicating with the outside world make your life better?
>>
>> The intention is not to communicate with the
>> outside world. That's what the rest of these
>> people are doing, because then they get a cut
>> of the action. Since I'm not after a cut of
>> the action (or at least - not in the same way),
>> I have/can afford a different approach.
>
> Then who are you trying to communicate with?

I would like to communicate with my neighborhood.

And I would like others in the world to be able
to communicate with theirs.

Without relying on Facebook group chat - which
is exactly what my wife uses to communicate with
her family - all physically located within a 0-2
hour drive.

I'm not particularly expecting Facebook to censor
or ban the group (I note that Yahoo groups
disappeared though) - it's more that I'm creating
a backup. Or the ISP could ban them too.

Basically if someone wants to censor me from
talking to my neighborhood, I want them to go
to the effort of getting the police to kick
down my door, not just have some individual or
company able to click ban/delete on a computer
screen.

> But it's no use, because a computer can't protect the privacy from the
> people who are *physically* watching you because the government has
> assigned them to live in your house and make sure you don't do anything
> the government doesn't like.
>
> Technological solutions can't solve social or political problems.

I'm not sure about that. My wife has reported
that people are saying things to her via
Facebook that they would be too shy to say
in person.

>> In my case, it is for North Koreans etc to
>> communicate a little further than their house.
>>
>> A USB stick (already being passed around with
>> movies on it) to their neighbor or relative in
>> *that other house*.
>
> Alright, that's fair. I don't know how you'd
> get the software to them, though.

The same USB sticks they are getting movies on?

> Have you seen people's reviews of the leaked copy of Red Star
> OS, which is the only OS they're allowed to use?

"allowed"? They're not allowed to watch the
movies either.

Also, this may be more useful in a milder
place. I think the Nigerian government shut
down the internet for political reasons. But
that highlights the fact that the internet
was available in the first place.

So you can get the PdNet software in the
first place. But the Nigerian government
would have to go to much more effort
(likely beyond their ability) to take it away.

>> Hey - I've noticed that all these communist
>> officials seem to be living high off the hog -
>> I thought communism was supposed to make
>> everyone equal?
>
> Remember, the person you pass the USB stick to will be *handsomely
> rewarded* if they can tell the police who wrote this message.
>
> That's how most political power structures maintain themselves, actually
> - by rewarding people for oppressing each other, the people collectively
> ensure their own oppression.

Sure. And this process *already exists*.

What's missing is Fidonet (or UUCP) technology
to go alongside the contraband movies.

>> Note that I don't actually want a physical
>> revolution - 100,000 dead Iraqis in 1991
>> showed what happens when civilians armed
>> with pea-shooters go up against helicopter
>> gunships - I just want free-flowing debate
>> so that the hypocrisy is exposed
>
> what use is that? identifying hypocrisy doesn't protect you from the
> guns the hypocrites are wielding.

From time to time there is an opportunity.
Sometimes out of the blue (like Tunisia).
You can't predict that turning over a
street vendor's cart will trigger a chain
of events.

Other times it is more direct (like Iraq).

When a future opportunity happens, I want
as many people against the previous dictator
as possible.

BFN. Paul.

[Daniel65]

Paul Edwards wrote on 13/1/24 9:38 am:

> On 08/01/24 14:52, immibis wrote:
>> On 1/8/24 06:19, Paul Edwards wrote:
>
> (This is the first time I have ever added another newsgroup
> (eternal-september.talk) so I'll see if this works - I put that
> first so hopefully followups go there)

No!! If you want the follow-up to go to eternal-september.talk, you
should have added it as a Followup-To: address .... just as I have
done! ;-P ..... I hope!!

--
Daniel