4. Brainstorming for "smallest possible objectives that we can achieve within the first year of establishment of trust"

[kirti]

here we will do brainstorming for "smallest possible objectives that
we can achieve within the first year of establishment of trust"

1. short term objectives-
make sure to suggest some realistic specific objectives that we can
successfully lead to fruition –
keeping in view our limited monetary resources at the very early stage
of building up this trust – and as its mentioned earlier, to gain
credibility amongst members and public we need some true success early
enough, for this lets set our objectives very precise, and these
objectives should be such that they will get well acknowledged by the
public after their accomplishment. .. …so plz do some brainstorming

2. long term goals will be the same that are in our agenda!!!

[kirti]

well, the idea of vijay is right - to have endowment kinda award !!!

and I guess, for the first year it will be more practical to give only
air travel expenses - may be to two persons

500€ each will be sufficient for any person to travel to any
destination from india

so i guess our target should be to get 1000€ (for award) + 200€ (for
some other expenses that might be required for maintenance of our
trust). .. ...well, I took the figures on higher side and in practice
this can be low!

so in total 1200€ should be a reasonable money to be raised for
success of our trust! so with this tentative amount in mind we should
try to explore our resources!


secondly, may be in next year we can see whether we are in a position
to afford 6 months scholarship atleast to one student. .. ...as it
will be more costly - if we consider his living expenses per month to
be around 600-700€ per month - it will be around 3600-4200€. .. ...i
guess this much money we can raise from sponsors only if we are able
to demonstrate that we can achieve our first objective that is to pay
travel expenses for atleast two students!

plz do write your opinions

[Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT]

Other possible short-term objective could be paying anual school fees
(low level schools not the very expensive private schools) for about
10-15 needy students from different areas. Sometimes school
authorities especially class-teachers are also able to tell who should
be given this award.... as they might be aware of their financial
situations in some cases (or in some cases the member might get
information from his or her local area). About the cost for this
purpose - if you consider Rs 2000 per head at max (low level schools),
so it comes to be around Rs 20,000 - 30,000. Depending upon the
available funds, we can increase or recduce the number of awards.

Please comment on the physibility of this type of goal.

[Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT]

Other possibility: Providing necessary books or other necessary
facilities like providing a safe drinking water tank, for the schools
in very unfortunate or underdeveloped state.

This won't cost much. In addition to solving basic problems for them,
we will have more accomplished tasks in the first year. As a result, a
bulkier yearly report and website to attract more sponsors.

I can't guess how much funds we will need for this purpose... so
please make the guesses...and post comments

[Abdul Rehman Nagori]

Instead of providing full scholarship ,in my view it would be much better to have scholarship awards based on financial status of students or we can have 4 50% scholarships in place of 2 full scholarships, or 1 full and 2 part scholarship.

[kirti]

I think abdul is right. .. ...in case if we are not in position to
collect the sum necessary for two scholarships at least we should
initiate or think about giving 50% of scholarship and encourage the
student to apply for another scholarships!

and secondly, I guess it will be good if we will focus our attention
only on higher education/studies. .. ...becoz staying focused will
only help us. .. ...otherwise there are many things to be done and
also important. .. ...but its not our area!!! so better stay away from
drinking water or school children. .. ...there are many other well
established organizations for this. .. ...and I guess we should help
those who are turning down from higher education in developed nations
just because of money! Believe me there are not too many scholarships
for indians go abroad - scholarship to educated students ration is
farely low!

On 13 May, 10:55, "Abdul Rehman Nagori" <pseudofa...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Instead of providing full scholarship ,in my view it would be much better to
> have scholarship awards based on financial status of students or we can have
> 4 50% scholarships in place of 2 full scholarships, or 1 full and 2 part
> scholarship.
>
> On Tue, May 13, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT <
>

[kirti]

yes, i jst forgot to bolster the idea of abdul
to have 1full and 2 partial scholarship. .. ...that way we will have
fare no. of scholarships in the beginning and will help us demonstrate
our effectiveness!!!

On 13 May, 10:55, "Abdul Rehman Nagori" <pseudofa...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Instead of providing full scholarship ,in my view it would be much better to
> have scholarship awards based on financial status of students or we can have
> 4 50% scholarships in place of 2 full scholarships, or 1 full and 2 part
> scholarship.
>
> On Tue, May 13, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT <
>

[Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT]

I am not in agreement with Kirti's idea, as the purpose of the Trust
will not only be higher studies as proposed.... please dont be partial
about the intentions of the Trust.

There is always a scarcity of funds in every area... may it be for
higher studies or primary and seconday education..... I even have
opposite views, you can find many more agencies for giving funding or
scholarships for higher studies (it could be for not many people bcoz
of the amount of money they have to invest on each scholarship, not
bcoz of the shortage of the agencies or Trusts). While there are only
a few organizations which are meant for students of primary and sec.
education systems.

By engaging us only for higher education, we even can't increase the
no. of students receiveing such scholarships drastically.

I am not saying we should not pay attention on need for scholarships
at higher education level.... but it's equally important rather more
important to serve lower level of education.

These are my views.... please post your ideas

[kirti]

Well, I will go with two ideas:
1. Endowment - as it will keep the money flow continuous!
2. One full and other two half scholarships in the first year -
although this no. will be significantly low if instead we target
primary edu or poverty - but its impact will be certainly very high
and which will land up our trust in a well recongnized instituion
once we are well established we can go ahead with the other things as
if accessory things!
So why not to start with bigger things first!!!

I will appreciate if most of the members will keep posting their
opinions on this section - atleast you can list your priorities -
which one first either studies abroad/higher education/primary
education or poverty in school childrens!!! Which one should we
address first - and according to you what will make a greater impact
towards success of our trust! (it will help us know where most of us
faced lots of struggle during our half life ;-) and accordingly we
will focus on those hurdles first!!!)

Well, I personally struggled for almost two years for getting abroad
for higher education studies so I will be biased towards opportunities
for higher education in developed nation first!!!
Finally, I urge all members to post their opinions!!!


On 13 May, 11:36, "Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT"

[Abdul Rehman Nagori]

Well Kirti , You have struggled at higher studies level that's why you know whats the problems at that level, but think of those thousands students that even dont reach to that level.
 i think you would have also seen your friends who didnt went for higher studies just cause they cant afford it.
While there are a lot number of students who didnt reach to that level also.

Its a trust for all. our small help can b very determining to life of lots of students at lower level too, while its taking just a fraction of money then we will allot for higer studies.

[Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT]

I completely agree with Abdul, It's right that there are not many who
can reach the level where they could struggle for scholarships to
study abroad; many even could not complete education till 10th std...
just bcoz of shortage of funds

[Kirti -The Emperor]

Is it possible to go for endowment in that case?

--
"Be Different, Make the Difference!"

Kirtikumar B. Jadhav
DAAD Fellow, Room no: 103
Adalbertstraße-149
44149 Dortmund
Germany
Mobile: + 49 (0) 176 61123422
+ 49 (0) 231 4425095

[Kirti -The Emperor]

well, I jst have a doubt. .. ...should we take other members for granted while deciding our short term objectives? becoz its evident that only three people are concerned about the objectives of the firm!
how can we judge that the decision we are making will be in the best interest/priority of the members!!!

[Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT]

I am also worried abt the same thing

[Kirti -The Emperor]

just one more doubt. .. ...are our messages or posts reaching all the members? bcoz I am not sure how this google page works?

plz let me know if something is wrong with the communication within the group!

On Tue, May 13, 2008 at 2:45 PM, Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT <srcn...@gmail.com> wrote:

I am also worried abt the same thing

[Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT]

Every message should be reaching, if they have selected "Email" as the
method of Delivery or the subscription type.

this is the meaning of the different Subscription types:

No Email; read this group on the web
Email - send each message as it arrives
Abridged Email; send a summary of new activity each day
Digest Email; send all new messages in a single daily email

[Vijayendra]

Can we first look at the student who want to take education in premier
indian institute ? because helping students who wants to go abroad
from India will be littel expensive affair at this stage, so why not
we concentrate on some rural indian part, where people are deprived of
education in biger cities just because they can't afford it...

afterall we are doing some social work in education domain,
irrespective of geographical area where student want to go for
education, but atleast at initial stage we should restrict ourselves
to rural India , which seems more practical and possible short term
goal.. we can have more success compared with sponsering people for
higher education abroad.

and if you look at the current status of all the members of this group
who can actively contribute or get money from sponser our this short
term goal is really acheivable ,and afterall it will be in rupees ,
right ?

Vijendra
CEO, India Operations, ESIT

[Vijayendra]

Dear Founder , no worries, it is reaching to all the people, but
people are reluctant to send reply to this as they are not actively
iterested or they are in hibernation, or in dormant state...
whatever... ????? specially those from US , as there is no single
post from that side....


so lets concentrate on those who are active in the group...


Three cheers for ESIT.. hip hip hurray.....

I am celebrating !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

On 13 May, 17:45, "Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT"

[Suresh Chawrai - Founder, ESIT]

Lets not point out anyone, there are many others as well who are not
active either.... anyway having a positive attitude is very good...
cheers

[Abdul Rehman Nagori]

we have discussed about primary education and about higher education abroad.
but thr remain 1 more area tht is of graduate studies within india.
the fee for various professional courses is so high tht a most person
of low income level cant afford it.i personally have seen students
deviating frm such job oriented coursed to d useless B.Sc degrees.

so Could we can have some proposals for this section from the members???

[Suresh Chawrai]

Thanks abdul for the suggestion,

I think, we'lll have to devide the available funds (which won't be
great in the early stages) to be used into some specific heads as
listed below in the heirarchial levels,

1. at very basic levels
2. intermediate level (std 12th to Graduation)
3. first-higher level (end of graduation to masters) - as suggested by
Kirti and Abdul
4. Second-higher level (masters to phd)

We should contribute at all the levels provided we have sufficient
funds. But as we will be short of funds in the begining, we can go for
the level-1 in the first instance and as the availability of our funds
keep increasing, we should go on adding next level in the hierarchy
(1, 1+2, 1+2+3, and finally 1+2+3+4)

The ideas on the second level have been nicely representedby Kirti
Jadhav in the scheme shown in the pages section linked here -
http://groups.google.com/group/esitrust/web/ideas-on-level-two-of-targets---by-kirti

Please send your comments on this....

[Abdul Rehman Nagori]

If we feel that our major funding sponsors and members will be from higher education level , then my personal view is that we should give a bit more concern to the 3 option ,thats First higher level.
coz going for level 1 or level 2 will give us more number to show ,but will not be providing us the faith or support from those sponsors who are indulged in business with higher level students or there products.

We can also have some non mandatory objects in which we can put tht the student tht is taking scholarship from us has to donate some money to the trust when he will be in a position to do that ,may be 5- 8 years later or so.


and if we concentrate on level 3 initially then we can easily target students from first graduation level tht in my view are easy to convince to take membership thn the higher educatn level students.

[Vijayendra]

My dear friend Abdul,

This is going to be charity trust, and not any sort of business where
members are going to be benifeted, this is trust for those who really
want to get some satisfaction of serving mankind to bring up them in
competitive social environment by helping those unfortunate who are
not able to do it (education which is need of time) just for some
monetary reason.

well about your idea of going by option 3 is ok , but doesnot fit into
trust's short term materialisable agenda, first we have to give out
and prove ourselves, rather thinking at creamy level, think about
those who are below it.

about helping those who are struggling the basic level education is
always a good idea for getting reliable and strong success , which we
can use for expansion of our trust. and for acheiving this goal we
don't need many sponsers..

everything will be done but at it's own time.

I think we all not only should be prepared for contributing the money
but also to meet people personally if need arises coz just sitting on
computer and typing novel idea doesnt make it done in case of charity
trust. we should always think at ground level first.

Vijayendra

On May 16, 9:52 pm, "Abdul Rehman Nagori" <pseudofa...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> If we feel that our major funding sponsors and members will be from higher
> education level , then my personal view is that we should give a bit more
> concern to the 3 option ,thats First higher level.
> coz going for level 1 or level 2 will give us more number to show ,but will
> not be providing us the faith or support from those sponsors who are
> indulged in business with higher level students or there products.
>
> We can also have some non mandatory objects in which we can put tht the
> student tht is taking scholarship from us has to donate some money to the
> trust when he will be in a position to do that ,may be 5- 8 years later or
> so.
>
> and if we concentrate on level 3 initially then we can easily target
> students from first graduation level tht in my view are easy to convince to
> take membership thn the higher educatn level students.
>

> On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 9:45 PM, Suresh Chawrai <srcni...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Thanks abdul for the suggestion,
>
> > I think, we'lll have to devide the available funds (which won't be
> > great in the early stages) to be used into some specific heads as
> > listed below in the heirarchial levels,
>
> > 1. at very basic levels
> > 2. intermediate level (std 12th to Graduation)
> > 3. first-higher level (end of graduation to masters) - as suggested by
> > Kirti and Abdul
> > 4. Second-higher level (masters to phd)
>
> > We should contribute at all the levels provided we have sufficient
> > funds. But as we will be short of funds in the begining, we can go for
> > the level-1 in the first instance and as the availability of our funds
> > keep increasing, we should go on adding next level in the hierarchy
> > (1, 1+2, 1+2+3, and finally 1+2+3+4)
>
> > The ideas on the second level have been nicely representedby Kirti
> > Jadhav in the scheme shown in the pages section linked here -
>

> >http://groups.google.com/group/esitrust/web/ideas-on-level-two-of-tar...

[Suresh Chawrai]

I think Vijendra is very right in giving more emphasis on our
contribution to the primary education, rather than going for the
targets in the next levels, in the first instance. If we have
sufficient active trustees and the God's grace, we shall have enough
funds to contribute to all the four level or perhaps to even more new
targets.

Thanks

Suresh

[Abdul Rehman Nagori]

I totally agree with the thoughts of Vijayendra and the founder.
My views are also for starting works from the basic level initially and i dont think that we will b lacking funds for starting that section.
i already proposed previously that we should target that each member of the group should try to make atleast 5 more members, and if we can do that then we will not be having much pressure to convince sponsors as then we will be having a better contact base and already membership fee can give us a strong fund support.
and im ready to use the member base of my own NGO for this new trust and i hope that of the 300 members i have in my pharma-world group i can surely make 10-50 members.
If even 5 active members take this responsibility and make 5 new members each then also we will having 30 members , and if each give a fee of 1000 INR, then 30000 INR are i think enough to start the level 1 of our activities.

[kirti]

well, I will say be more practical and think!
If we still decide to work on level 1 or 2. .. ...we still dont have
any idea exactly what we want to do. .. ...its something like I want
to go to Zoomritalaiyya. .. ...but I dont know do I need to look in
the map, do I need to take train or bus, do i need ticket for that or
no. - -- ---well, I am very much critical but dont get angry with me-
-- ---I am only suggesting that we need to be more organized and do
some brainstorming for achieving what we are set for- -- ---
uptil now, only 4 members suggested to work on level one and
two. .. ...but none of them (correct me if I am wrong) have given any
thought on how to execute it (or atleast its not in public
domain). .. ...this is very sad!!!. .. ...bcoz this will again prevent
some of our hibernated members from getting active ;-)

Qs are:

1. what schools we wanna target?. .. ...will those from only
maharashtra? or you will encourage from other states too?

2. what will be selection criteria?. .. ...its very important keeping
in view long term vision of our trust- --this will also help us
convince the people

3. how will you make the selection process transparent? (its very
essential - becoz all the members are from different states and in the
end it should not appear that active members are from maharashtra so
the school was selected from maharashtra - and by the way, this is not
a valid argument!!! ]

4. how will you make awareness about our intentions to schools (its
very essential that our words reach all the schools). .. ...it should
not be the case that jst bcoz some schools were not aware about the
opportunity provided by us- -- ---so they could not get the aid! [Keep
in mind - through internet we cant reach these schools!!! and if we do
that means we are targeting wrong schools ;-) ]

5. And if we decide to approach these schools personally- -- ---how
many active members are there who are residing in india and could
really give some time to spread a word? - -- ---believe me, here we
have to be more practical - becoz if we collect money and we fail
short of human resource- -- ---we will loose our credibility!
and this is not gonna help us. .. ...so what is the back up plan? are
we goin to higher some persons (as a part time employee) who are
educated but have no job to spread our word to schools in different
states?

6. schools means exactly what you want to do. .. ...give some thought-
-- ---well, primary education is free (if I am not wrong upto 10th
standard also its free)- -- ---so what is the plan- -- ---are you
willing to sponsor some uniforms to school children in primary schools
or provide books to these children?- -- ---put it in public domain
exactly what we can achieve- -- ---let it be wrong/unfeasible but give
some crude outlines- -- ---so that people can comment and we can pick
up the good suggestions!

7. how will you decide that the children you are giving aid are not
from rich family (Believe me, there are many doctors and engineers in
villages-also some big farmers and their children also go to normal
public schools. .. ...so it wont be the criteria that selecting only
public schools means we are selecting needy children)

By the way- -- ---do we have any backup plan if we feel at any stage
that we are not in a position to fulfill the objective according to
plan 1

8. well, there will be many other Qs that may surface to your mind- --
---but I guess first we need to think about these Qs at the very
beginning if we really want to crystallize our dreams. .. ...

Believe me - Idea is only supported if it is backed by a crude outline/
plan which shows how it can be materialised!!! Saying that we can
gather XX, 000/- INR will not help us unless we convince our members
how we want to spend it!!!

And for God's sake, dont reply to this message emotionally. .. ...be
rational and think positively. .. ...Answering the Qs I raised, will
help us progress only!

By the way- -- ---its always good criticize one's or other's ideas
provided you are justifying and there is nothing wrong in it- -- ---
you can have your own opinions and you have right to express it- -- ---
this is what is democracy!

regards
Kirti





On May 17, 7:40 am, "Abdul Rehman Nagori" <pseudofa...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I totally agree with the thoughts of Vijayendra and the founder.
> My views are also for starting works from the basic level initially and i
> dont think that we will b lacking funds for starting that section.
> i already proposed previously that we should target that each member of the
> group should try to make atleast 5 more members, and if we can do that then
> we will not be having much pressure to convince sponsors as then we will be
> having a better contact base and already membership fee can give us a strong
> fund support.
> and im ready to use the member base of my own NGO for this new trust and i
> hope that of the 300 members i have in my pharma-world group i can surely
> make 10-50 members.
> If even 5 active members take this responsibility and make 5 new members
> each then also we will having 30 members , and if each give a fee of 1000
> INR, then 30000 INR are i think enough to start the level 1 of our
> activities.
>

[Suresh Chawrai]

Dear Kirti,

Thanks for your criticism (although doesn’t include full range of
thoughts), let me inform you that our proposed Trust is not a judicial
body (which doesn’t allow for any emotional interference). Sometimes,
you do need heart to help us take a right decision.

About plan of action: if you have already made a plan of action for
just one example GATE-Fees from 3rd level of our targets, that doesn’t
mean everything has become clear to everyone what are we going to do
for everything coming under 3rd or 4th levels. If you remember or have
read the first page about ESIT, then it clearly mentions that the
members will have to submit the informal reports on the current
situation and needs of their Indian local educational system, which we
can do only after starting the Trust. Upon receiving those reports,
the board of trustees (for Board of Trustees, read the FAQs in pages
section) can then review them and make decisions that where and how
the money be directed. And I think other members have to believe on
the impartiality of the Board. I know we won’t be able to eradicate
all the primary and secondary educational problems of India, so why
not at least only those where our members can easily reach. So no need
to hire people for this purpose. And if some people still think we
dont have full plans for executing in the lower levels, we need to be
positive, work together and we can make plans, rather than wasting too
much time on criticising other levels.

When you ask how are we going to judge the right kids for offering our
financial help, than who can give us a guarantee that you can find the
right candidates for paying train tickets or air-tickets to real needy
people. I know you can’t; because it is a fact that when you try to
burn the dry wood, there are many chances that wet wood will also get
burnt. You know kirti, even after getting full scholarship, I received
travel grant from two different sources (Sir Ratan Tata Travel Grant
and Jawaharlal Nehru Memorial Trust Cambridge Scholarship) – they
couldn’t judge me if I was the real needy person.

Another thing Mr Kirti, you are very well aware of the NIPER’s term-
fees (approx. 14000 INR for 6 months and then 8500 INR for subsequent
terms); and if they can pay Rs 9800 (average) every 6-months, I am
sure there won’t be any problem for them to pay Rs 500 for the train
ticket. OR if any student has been offered a full scholarship to a
foreign university then I don’t think there will be much burden on him/
her to pay for the air tickets. Upon this, if you say that you wanted
to contribute to the initial stages (basic) i.e., before they can get
admissions in the premier institutes in India (like, paying fees for
purchasing the forms for GATE – a competitive exam), then why can’t
you also see even further down the line – very basic needs (the
primary and secondary education). Even after we know all about this,
no one opposed your idea, mate, just because we definitely want to
help those as well (levels 3 and 4), may not be in the initial stages,
but certainly when we are capable of doing it.

I think, the above discussion answers your 1-5 and 7 questions… if you
still have any doubts please don’t hesitate to write back.

I know the primary education in India is free, but there are still
many primary schools where they don’t have right books and other
essential supplies (I mean, chalks, pens, pencils, notebooks, etc …
not the uniforms). I don’t know if you are aware that some schools
even don’t have safe drinking water for its students. Where is the
Government to help them…….. as they can’t reach everywhere (could be
due to many reasons), similarly we won’t be able offer help
everywhere, but at least some places… hopefully. Finally for your
question number 6, the outline can be decided later after identifying
the real situations and needs when we have reports from the members
after the Trust’s commencement.

I too can post many other useful pieces of information and suggestions
if you can pose some more question from you library of many more Qs
(your question no. 8)

About Level 2 from the targets (10th std to the beginning of
Graduation; OR 11th and 12th Stds), I know many people just can’t
continue studies after 10th std just because of monetary problems.
Colleges for 11th and 12th std charge huge fees from its students…. We
can give our helping hands to them also.

I appreciate Kirti for your criticism about the lower levels and I
don’t think anyone will take it personally…thanks for offering such
Qs. As a result some As have come out in the public domain.

I request other also to please post their Qs and As

Suresh

> > > Suresh- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Pravin Shirude- Manager ESIT]

Dear All,
Some good questions and the wonderful answers to them were posted
by some of us...good to see the response...Also Some of the questuons
are too imaginative... Our aim should be to help the "needy people for
education" and should not have any boundaries...provided the available
resources with the trust...so we have to help primary education first
as a start-up thing...as we will have less funds in the begining..as
the trust develops with bigger resources we will definately go to the
higher levels too...
But really and truelly, first and foremost, our main objective is
to get initial write-ups (in the respective thread on the group) for
our website and legal documentation in order to register the trust.
Then we need trustees to pay the membership fee so that initial steps
can be taken and then ask for few sponsors. So please please dont
deviate from these objectives at this stage and start submitting the
write-ups. I hope you people take it in a positive way....come on
guyes we know we all can do it............


Cheers
Pravin

[kirti]

well, man ideas are for criticism. .. ...and your first half of the
message was not at all answering the Qs. .. ...its was jst saying how
and why the other idea could not be executed- - ---and this half was
supposed to be answered in the comments on that level 3 idea- -- ---
and dont say that "no one opposed your idea" (it doesnt make any sense
in replying to my message. .. ....moreover, here comes some emotional
touch)- -- ---and its not an excuse for not making strategy to execute
the level 1 or 2 plan.

secondly, its still very difficult to gather membership money, if we
dont think or make rough outline about how we are going to execute the
idea. .. ...I guess you are understanding the gravity of situation or
importance of this thing!!!
Well, I am just pointing out that how difficult it is to address the
things which are aiming. .. ...and if we are not organized and jst
expecting some God's grace then I dont think we can achieve
anything. .. ... NOW read in between the lines for few more concerns:

>> I know the primary education in India is free, but there are still
>> many primary schools where they don’t have right books and other
>> essential supplies (I mean, chalks, pens, pencils, notebooks, etc …
>>not the uniforms).

so, i hope you must be knowing that most of the schools are run by
some trusts (now its a money making business there. .. ...put some
person's name on the school eg lalitabai vidyalaya etc). .. ...so are
you goin to approach the persons from the concerened trust or
distributing money? or you will select the school list from the
ministry of education of the state and shortlist the schools that are
approved and under poverty zone. .. ...if you do, do we have such
volunteers from within the group who can approach these authorities?

>>I don’t know if you are aware that some schools
>> even don’t have safe drinking water for its students.

How will you figure it out. .. ...how many schools are facing this
problem?. .. ...how many schools you can support?. .. ...and dont tell
me that we will depend on reports from members- -- ---this is not at
all going to help- -- ---this is jst like dreaming in dreams ;-) - --
---so come to reality and start thinking how we can approach to
overcome this problem!

>>Where is the
>> Government to help them…….. as they can’t reach everywhere (could be
>> due to many reasons)

This is like accepting bullshit. .. ...in turn, we should ask
ourselves that are we goin to report such schools that are receiving
less attention from govt to press or ministry of education?. .. ...are
we thinking to do something about this?. .. ...for this we must have
the list of schools? I guess you all are understanding. .. ...come to
practicality and dont blame govt. .. ...let them know where they are
lacking. .. ...this is also a non-monetary help to students in schools

>>, similarly we won’t be able offer help
>> everywhere, but at least some places… hopefully.

If we could convince others about HOW we will spend the
money. .. ...then only we can gather money! So I still urge everyone
to give a thought on how we can materialize and what are the upcoming
hurdles!!!

Finally for your
>> question number 6, the outline can be decided later after identifying
>> the real situations and needs when we have reports from the members
>> after the Trust’s commencement.

Dreaming in dreams! I will say we should better identify the
volunteers who and how many are willing to provide such
data. .. ...put a new thread for this in the forum!!! I guess this way
we will easily sort out the problem- -- ---and we will immediately
know "कि हम कितने पानी में हैं | ;-) well, this way everyone will know
how much successful we will be, if we assume such help!!!

>>I too can post many other useful pieces of information and suggestions
>>if you can pose some more question from you library of many more Qs
>>(your question no. 8)

Well, its not necessary that only I should raise the Qs. .. ...if you
foresee some problems that may become hurdles in our way. .. ...you
are supposed to let the members know about it. .. ...so that atleast
some of them who have idea how to surmount it will help us. .. ...do
express yourself!

>>About Level 2 from the targets (10th std to the beginning of
>>Graduation; OR 11th and 12th Stds), I know many people just can’t
>>continue studies after 10th std just because of monetary problems.
>>Colleges for 11th and 12th std charge huge fees from its students…. We
>>can give our helping hands to them also.

How you intend to approach them. .. ...this is again the same
Qs. .. ...you cant reach them through internet. .. ...ask yourself (i
mean all members) are we goin to advertise our aid in newspapers? is
there anyone who can find out about how much concession we can get for
such charity advertise? and I strongly believe in this case we wont be
targeting leading news papers. .. ...the local newspapers will reach
more to villages than TIMES or sth like that. .. ...how will you
figure it out how are getting demotivated to study because of
money. .. ...how many volunteers we can ask for?

>>I appreciate Kirti for your criticism about the lower levels and I
>>don’t think anyone will take it personally…thanks for offering such
>>Qs. As a result some As have come out in the public domain.

By the way thanks a lot. .. ...however, did you realize that you wrote
the reply only addressing me and not all the members. .. ...it is
essential if you address some queries that are relevant to all
members. .. ...you must address it in general. .. ...and not like
"kirti you might not be knowing. .. .. ;-) " this way they will feel
that they are receiving spam and we are fighting. .. ...I hope you can
understand this! and will not repeat again ;-)

>> I request other also to please post their Qs and As

Instead of such blank call. .. ...make few threads about volunteering
to provide certain data from indian schools (eg list of schools,
schools receiving less attention from Govt, schools in area where
drinking water is problem, schools without teachers etc) . .. ...lets
see how many are there willing to help. .. ...otherwise we need to go
for collaboration with other charity organizations who have human
resources to execute our ideas and provide them the money
instead. .. ...which sounds more practical. .. ...I hope none of us
wants fame and all of us are interested in helping
society! . .. ...then this should not be a problem!

Greetings!
kirti

[PS: I guess, there is nothing like emotional touch from my side ;-)
in the message! ]

> ...
>
> read more »

[GP]

Dear All,

I have been following the discussion for quite some time now.
Frist of all i think it is a beautiful idea to help people in need for
education and all of you guys are making an effort for that.
However, I am still not clear about the goals and objectives of the
trust even thought it is mentioned on the first page.

"‘Education-Support India Trust’ is a completely non-profit
organization, at the moment, being created for the people,
particularly, students in great need for the financial support in
advancing their education at any level."



"non-profit organization": I am sure its not yet an organization as
there are no CEO's, chairmans, etc. At the moment it is an idea in
development

"at the moment": does that mean , there are plans to make profit
afterwards?

"The objectives of the Trust will be multiple, like, supporting
students by getting them the right text books if not accessible due to
monetary crises, supporting local schools in availing them with some
basic facilities (necessary books, sports items, etc), paying fees for
financially poor students on their behalf, awarding scholarships to
the talented students and hence promoting education, giving loan
scholarships and anything thought appropriate by the members of the
Trust"

As far as i know about the group, non of us are millionares or even at
this moment think of collecting millons of dollars of investment
needed to meet such an objective stated above. At least not yet
I know it is meant to be the long term goal for the trust but it is
too much of a bold statement for a group still at its infancy

Personally i would like to help students in need. but also want to be
realistic about it. At least in the beginning , I would be more than
happy to see if our group is able to make a difference in the life of
just a single student. I think the group is strong enough to do that
without the help of any other monetary organization. It will also lay
the basic framework necessary to do the real work. By real work i mean
going to the respective schools/college, talking to administration and
convincing them for distribution of scholarship forms, getting to know
how much money will be needed per student basis, per year. It will
also determine how much we can push ourself.
What i wanted to suggest was, rather than investing efforts in setting
up an administration, first we select just a single student, whom
this group of 55 members can directly help. We organize volunteers
which can first gather this information from schools or colleges. This
info is then discussed/debated in the group and just one person is
selected, after wards money is collected from the members and suitable
method is used to make sure that money is properly utilized. I am
sure most of the current members of this group know each other at some
point in their carriers and trust each other. This will save a lot of
effort in going through beaurocratic procedure. After all, as i
understood, we want to help student in need.

This will also demonstrate that we can deliver.
lets have a humble beginning and then we will estimate how much sky we
can cover.

Gurpreet

> ...
>
> read more »

[kirti]

well, gurpreet you are right to some extent especially about the
suggestion section of your message (by the way, suresh - founder is
the right person to answer the queries raised by you - so I wont touch
that part!!). .. ...and we are also aiming for least possible
objective that we can achieve. .. ...moreover, we have also initiated
to identify the volunteers to do the ground level work. .. ...and
hopefully we will be able to come up with few proposals with the help
of volunteers that should help change the carriers of schools
childrens or college going students. .. ...this way we will have
direct overview of things we need to do!

you can keep yourself updated by having a look at the thread "call for
volunteers from india"

http://groups.google.com/group/esitrust/browse_thread/thread/eaf76e321dccab5c?hl=en-GB#

We appreciate your suggestions and active interest!

kirti

> read more »

[Suresh Chawrai]

Thanks Gurpreet for your message and pointing out the ambiguous words
in the 'About ESIT'. It now reads "‘Education-Support India Trust’
will be completely a non-profit organization being created for the

people, particularly, students in great need for the financial support
in advancing their education at any level."

instead of the previous

"‘Education-Support India Trust’ is a completely non-profit
organization, at the moment, being created for the people,
particularly, students in great need for the financial support in
advancing their education at any level."

Cheers

Suresh

[kirti-Manager ESI]

To Gurpreet:

Well gurpreet, although my reply to your message sounded like I am
speaking on behalf of others. .. ...but I jst want to clarify that it
is my personal opinion only ;-). .. ...I hope you will get response to
your message atleast from the other active members!

Greetz
kirti

On May 18, 6:55 pm, kirti <kir...@gmail.com> wrote:
> well, gurpreet you are right to some extent especially about the
> suggestion section of your message (by the way, suresh - founder is
> the right person to answer the queries raised by you - so I wont touch
> that part!!). .. ...and we are also aiming for least possible
> objective that we can achieve. .. ...moreover, we have also initiated
> to identify the volunteers to do the ground level work. .. ...and
> hopefully we will be able to come up with few proposals with the help
> of volunteers that should help change the carriers of schools
> childrens or college going students. .. ...this way we will have
> direct overview of things we need to do!
>
> you can keep yourself updated by having a look at the thread "call for
> volunteers from india"
>

> http://groups.google.com/group/esitrust/browse_thread/thread/eaf76e32...

> ...
>
> read more »

[Rashim Singh]

Hi Kirti

I think your email makes a lot of sense in term of practicality in achieving what we are aiming at. Now coming to the solution, lets accept the fact that ground work can only be done by India volunteer of this group currently, until some US volunteer is panning to visit India recently. We can do one out of two things:

1) Focus on the municipals school in the city you live in
2) Focus on the village you belong to

The first will be easy and more practical as you can follow and monitor the whole process with investing comparatively less time as to go in some village.

Apart from getting list of schools from govt., i think we should also get list of local NGOs working on education. one of the problem of drop outs at school level is monetary but the other one is lack of proper education due to which kids loose interest. there are groups who actually work on providing after-school education material as well as guidance support to primary and middle school students.

For example, one of the such group in Ahmedabad city, Gujarat. Shaishav is working on the issue of providing after school support to the children of migrant workers in ahemdabad city to keep children in school and prevent child labour. I have not directly worked with them on any project but i got a chance to interact with them when they were visiting US a year back. It is a small but wonderful group and have a great outreach due to networking with NGO all over kuch-surastra area of Gujarat. Parul Ben and her husband Falgun Seth is running the NGO. And the best thing was the model they were working on. You can also contact them on parul...@rediffmail.com, or visit the website http://www.shaishavchildrights.org.

Its just one example, i am sure you can find similar groups in all places and we can work with them to materialize the objectives. The benefit is that we will have someone to monitor the project constantly even if our own volunteers do not have that kind of time and it will save us time in doing a lot of ground work, because they might have already done that.
 
Another way we can do it, once we have some students identified from whatever source, is to  adopt the student by one or more members, such that that group of  members will be responsible for continuing the effort of supporting the education of one particular student through years. This will give some continuity, meaning and certainty to the whole effort. Also, the student will feel security that this help is going to continue for longer than one time or one year.

 thats my two cents...


regards
Rashim

[Rashim Singh]

Just checking if it went through. I am not sure my previous email reached the group. Will fwd it again.

[Suresh Chawrai]

"The following message was posted by Rashim Singh (under a new head,
19 May, 11.18 pm), but i think it" was meant to be put under this head
with a quoted text to the message by abdul (16 May 5.52 pm). Dear
rashim, if you'll reply directly from your daily digest in you gmail
account (you could have successfully done that if you were an email
delivery subscriber) rather than from the group, then an unwanted new
head will be created. My suggestion is that open the group's site and
reply from the group." - Suresh


Dear Abdul


"We can also have some non mandatory objects in which we can put that

the
student tht is taking scholarship from us has to donate some money to
the
trust when he will be in a position to do that ,may be 5- 8 years
later or
so."

Paying back to the society is a great idea and it should be instilled
in
every member of community, but i do not agree with making it a
condition of
support.


Social responsibility and conscious citizen are developed with change
in
mind sets and realization. Lets not make it another "give and take"
situation where i will help back because i received it, so it means if
i
don't receive it directly, then i should not be doing anything.


So, lets focus on the realization part rather than making it a
requirement
for recieving help. thats my point of view.


regards
Rashim



On May 16, 5:52 pm, "Abdul Rehman Nagori" <pseudofa...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> >http://groups.google.com/group/esitrust/web/ideas-on-level-two-of-tar...
>
> > Please send your comments on this....- Hide quoted text -

[Suresh Chawrai]

"Another message by Roshim Singh relocated under this thread - suresh"


Dear All

Sorry for being in hiberation :), its just that some of us are still
trying to understand whats going on here? Since, founding members are
a little more ahead in the game of understanding the objective and
working of ESIT. I am still not sure everything is clear here.

Anyways,

going through some messages, I like some of the suggestions and would
like to re-state them.

1) Finalizing the specific short-term and achievable goals for this
year
2) To be truthful sponosring someone's ticket to US/UK or any where or
giving them scholarship for first six month is a very costly affair.
Think of number of high school kids you can support for getting 12th
and college degree and get some decent education which can translate
into carrer.
3) It does not necessarily have to be premier institutes until they
clear the exam and are unable to attend becoz of funds. It can be
vocational colleges or some other institutes. The goal should to help
them establish a good carrer with their potential and not get an IIT/
NIPER degree only.
4) Now the question is how to identify such students. Someone
suggested looking at rural India. 40% of our population is below
poverty line all over India and definetly finding students should not
be hard. Question is which one to pick and how to determine that they
have potential that if supported will translate into success. It does
not matter in future that every case has to be sucsess, but for first
year and to establish the group, experiments will be difficult. We
will need to some major success stories here for this year.
5) Abdul suggested getting connected to NGOs, i think thats a graet
idea. But i think the source should be something else. There are
organization focusing on primary and some of middle education, like
Asha, Vibha. They work with lots of NGOs in rural India focusing on
education. I think, we have better chance of having good partnership
with good quality NGOs from that source. These NGOs might be great in
helping us identying the right candidates.
6) Lastly, few questions, where are we plan to register the trust,
India or abroad? We should start thinking of how we are going to
transfer foreign currency to India (from donors Abroad). We will need
some kind of FCRA clearance. Will this trust be tax exempt for
recieving donations? Do we have someone who is looking into all
this? If not, then i think we should seriously start thinking about
this in parallel. All this is important when you are handling someone
else money.

Some of these members who are silent and not responding but i think
they must be observing and its important that people realise that this
is going to handled professionally and not haphazardly. Believe me i
am not saying that we can not start until all this is done, but
eventually we will need this and all these are time consuming
processes and should be processed in parallel.

Looking forward to comments.

Thanks and regards
Rashim Singh
US member :)

[Pravin Shirude]

Good to see the comments made by new/hiberating members....As we are
in a process of registration of the trust in India. (vijayendra is
trying his best to get the information at ground level and also with
the help of suggestions from the members of other registered
trust)..as per my knowledge such trusts comes under the tax-exemption
category..so we hope to build on slowly but surely....coming to the
question of helping the right candidate directly or through other
NGOs...its a good suggestion......It would be good if we can help one
student directly..to make our case strong and that will give us some
basis for this trust also....as one of the member (Rajesh Mulchandani)
would be posting a case of such one of the probable needy student very
soon..
Hope to see some comments by other hiberating members too....

Cheers
Pravin