Intra Muslim Dialogue
columni...@gmail.com
not most, Pakistanis are busy debating senselessly on topics such as
shia sunni dispute or Salfi and non salfi schools of thought. Some
people have made it a point to criticize Syed Maududi , the founder of
Jamaat.
I have great respect for Syed Maududi. I inquired the purpose
of this criticism and I came to know that the Muslim regimes who lick
the boots of George Bush are afraid of the world Jihad and the
Islamic Order and as such have appointed paid Ulemaa to attack and
spread misgivings of various sorts.
I told them that we are passing through crucial period of
time and should find ways and means to talk to Shia friends and put
and effort to bring back qadianis back into fold of Islam. But instead
of making kafirs muslims these so called ulemaa are busy making kafirs
out of muslims.
Do you have any idea how far this secterianism has spread
and how it is breaking the entire fabric of Muslim society? Give us
you suggestions for a balanced approach to solve this problem.
Secondly I have been waiting comments on the upcoming Book '
AlQuds and Ikhtetame Waqt' and was surprised to see none of you guys
has to say anything about it????
M Javed Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
Some
people have made it a point to criticize Syed Maududi , the founder of
Jamaat.
I have great respect for Syed Maududi. I inquired the purpose
of this criticism
Do make a read of Ikhtilaf-e-Ummat aur Sirat-e-Mustaqeem by Shaeed Yusuf Ludhayanvi. I have read ti and the work of Modudi Sahab do appear in the category of Blasphemy. That's a great book and does clarify many things.
-adnan
columni...@gmail.com
criticising a Master. The problem of traditional ulemaa is that they
learn from Taqlid that is blind following of their teachers. Whereas
people like Syed Maududi, Syed Qutub and Iqbal learn from Quraan,
trying to undestand the Din and are hence talamizur Rahman
( Disciples of Allah SWT).
Only Allah SWT is Free from errors and mistakes. Our beloved prophet
has been Protected by Allahw SWT from making errors. All others are
subject to error. Allah SWT Hath Pardoned human errors of Sahaba Karam
as a reward of their sacrifices. But to probe in a particular
situation who acted more in line with Islamic Injunctions is an
Aalim's right and the earlier Ulemaa have been more harsh then Syed
Maududi.
For your kind information Syed Maududi has been declared Mujaddid of
15the century. If you do not believe me, ask somebody who has
knowledge.
M J Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
I would not believe that . It is as if a fourth grader start
criticising a Master.
jawed sahab,it's not me who's criticising modudi sahab, it was none other than Yousuf Ludyanvi sahab who actually gave the reference of Modudi's OWN work rather putting his own words in others mouth. If you think that luyanvi sahab was a 4rth grade started then I am very disappointed to know. As I said that you can find that book easily in Urdu bazar and that is very great book for knowledge apart from rebutting modudi sahab's claims.
What I think that you are fan of Modudi sahab . this is why you are not willing to listen other point of view and this is also called TAQLEED. I don't have a good mobile cam otherwise i could show you reference of modudi sahab's work which actually appear blasphmeous. I don't say all of his work was bad but he often crossed the limits.
I personally prefer to be open to listen everyone and this is not against what was said by all Imams(from Hanifa(RA) to Hambal(RA) ) that is, reject anything which is against Quran aur Sunnah. I personally prefer to measure someone's work according to quran or sunnah rather just believing in it just because it was written by some famous scholar. When all four imams said clearly to reject anything against quran or sunnah then what's worth of Modudi sahab or Ludyanvi sahab or Taqi/Rafi Usmani sahab?
For your kind information Syed Maududi has been declared Mujaddid of
15the century. If you do not believe me, ask somebody who has
knowledge.
you mean 20th century right? and who declared him mujadid. If a mujadid doesn't even know how to refer Sahabas(RA) and Prophets(RA) in writing then such mujadid is pretty worthless for me and for Islam itself. I say again, please read the Book I mentioned in which all references have been given from Modudi sahab's own book. Modudi ,Ahsan Eslahi were not different than Sirsyed who used to prefer logic over Allah's action. Same disease exist in Ghamidi as well who had link with Ahsan Eslahi sahab.
-adnan
syed baber
ASIF KHAN
apni kitab mayn kisi kay baray mayn galat nahen kaha yay aap kay sochnayn ka
andaz hay. kia hakikat per baat karna galat hay? jo hakikat hay woh tu hay
or aap ko malom hona chaheyay kay mododi sahab ka taluq bhe deooband
maktab-e-fikar say thha..ok
>From: "syed baber" <syed....@gmail.com>
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>Subject: Re: Intra Muslim Dialogue
>Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2007 00:47:17 +0500
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columni...@gmail.com
You mis understood me. The fourth grader I referred to was
not you it was Ludhianvi marhoom. It is typical deobandi style of
arguing against the scholors of Quraan, being jelous of their
popularity and afraid of losing leadership to them. Forget about Syed
Maududi. Take the case of Dr Hamidudllah. That great scholor
translated Qruaan in Frechn and succeeded in converting 10000
Frenchmen to Islam. But they did not permit him to stay in Pakistan.
Dr Fazlurh Rahmn Ansari is not only a great scholor of Islam but was
a Wali. But deobandis again rose againt him. Even Dr Israr a good
scholor of Quraan has not been accepted by him. For them the hidayat
is confined to the Indian Madarsah of Deoband. But if you ask what the
rest of 1100 million muslims are doing as they do have access to
deoband. Are they good Muslims or not. They do not answer this
question.
Remember, Sahaba is a general term. But the Quraan explains
that during the time our beloved prophet had graced the earth with his
presence, some people did not actually believed, some were hypocrites
and so on. Quraan very clearly mentions that those who started
believing in Islam after Fathe Makka are not as good as who laid down
their lives and fought many battles for the sake of Islam. Can you
equate Muawia with Hazrat Abu Bakar or Hazrat Umar or even with Syedna
Usman?. Only by looking at their deeds in the light of Quraan, we come
to know the value of their services. However Yousuf Ludhianvi
glorifies Amir Muawia, he failed to justify his usurption of power and
converting Khilafat to Mulookiat. We have a standard for finding
zalalah fro m hidaya. That was our beloved nabi during his lifetime
and now it is Quraan. Islam recognizes only one King and that is Allah
SWT. Anybody who tries to become a king is a
a tyrant and treacheror. Soverignity over the entire Universe Belongs
to Allah SWT. When Nabi Akram SAW, commanding so much love and
respect of Sahaba did not name a person to lead the ummah. how Muawiah
could do.
I know for fact that Shias are lost and are gumrah. But that
does not mean that we shut our eyes from facts. Hazrat Ali inspite of
some differences served the Islamic cause during caliphate. He not
only provided support and advice to the government but during the time
of crisises fought for it. During the encirclement of Hazrat Usman's
house he made imam Hasan and Imam Husain stand guard at the doors of
Hazrat Usman. Where as shias have made a different firqa and are
hence misled.Even Shah Wali Ullah, another Mujaddid prior to Syed
Maududi preferred Hazrat Ali over HAzrat Usman and was of the view
that if he had succeeded Hazrat Umar, the circumstances would have
been much more favourable to Islam and Muslimeen.
In short read holy Quran with full belief, read and believe sahi
ahadis also, but the history should be read critically in the light
of Quraan and Ahadis. Mullah Ludhianvi and people like him were
serving the tyrant ziaulhaq to dislocate Jammat from its stronghold of
Karachi and Hyederabad, by creating shia sunni differences. He became
utltimtely victim of the dispute. Fatebru ya uli al absar!
M J Iqbal
On Jun 14, 1:58 am, "ASIF KHAN" <asifkaimkh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> baber sahab mayn aap ki baat say itafaq karta hon magar mododi sahab nayn
> apni kitab mayn kisi kay baray mayn galat nahen kaha yay aap kay sochnayn ka
> andaz hay. kia hakikat per baat karna galat hay? jo hakikat hay woh tu hay
> or aap ko malom hona chaheyay kay mododi sahab ka taluq bhe deooband
> maktab-e-fikar say thha..ok
>
>
>
> >From: "syed baber" <syed.ned...@gmail.com>
> >Reply-To: effort-f...@googlegroups.com
> >To: effort-f...@googlegroups.com
> >Subject: Re: Intra Muslim Dialogue
> >Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2007 00:47:17 +0500
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columni...@gmail.com
M J Iqbal
On Jun 14, 1:58 am, "ASIF KHAN" <asifkaimkh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> baber sahab mayn aap ki baat say itafaq karta hon magar mododi sahab nayn
> apni kitab mayn kisi kay baray mayn galat nahen kaha yay aap kay sochnayn ka
> andaz hay. kia hakikat per baat karna galat hay? jo hakikat hay woh tu hay
> or aap ko malom hona chaheyay kay mododi sahab ka taluq bhe deooband
> maktab-e-fikar say thha..ok
>
>
>
> >From: "syed baber" <syed.ned...@gmail.com>
> >Reply-To: effort-f...@googlegroups.com
> >To: effort-f...@googlegroups.com
> >Subject: Re: Intra Muslim Dialogue
> >Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2007 00:47:17 +0500
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syed baber
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Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
But one can't dispute Sahabas(RA) by giving excuse that Islam was completed. I quoted both Quran and hadith to explain the status of Sahabas infront of Allah nad Rasool(SAW) and it DOES effect our DIN when we criticize sahabas. Those who did, we all know their worth now. If there was dispute b/w Ali(RA) and Muwaiya(RA) then it was between them, who are we who dont even follow the 2% of Islam of Sahabas to criticize them? when Criticizing mududi who was nothing but an Islamic scholar is considered bad then I believe worth of sahabas are infinite time more than Modudi or any other scholar.
Long story short, people like Modudi,LUdhyanvi, the four Imams are not more important and credible than all Sahabas Period.
p.s: tat was my last response on this thread
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
syed baber
columni...@gmail.com
If you consider sahaba equal or superior to Huzoor Nabi Karim,
then it is your problem. I wrote very clearly that Amir Muavia was
intrumental in establishing his own kingdom in palce of Kingdom of
Allah SWT established with great sacrifces by Nabi Akram SAW. If
anybody acts against small sunnats everybody blames him but Muavia
broke the Islami Shariat by spending money from public treasury to
promote the leadership of his tribe. The dismantling of khilafat ala
minjah nabuwat was due to greed of power by Amir Muvavia and his
companions. If you consider Ali Karram Allah Wajhu equal or less then
Muavia, then you are in serious trouble. I cannot consider the zaif
riwayat concocted by Yazidis after grabbing the kingdom to be of any
significance. Hazrat Ali was trained and educated by our beloved
prophet whereas Muavia was trained by Abu Sufyan who throught his life
fought against Islam and caused hardships to our beloved Nabi.
Alhamdo Lillah my love for Nabi Karim is the result of my Love of
Allah SWT and those of sahaba because of the love of Nabi Akram SA.
But probably you love Huzoor because of sahaba and Allah Taala on
account of love of Huzoor. Therefore for you your din and for me my
din.
M J Iqbal
On Jun 15, 11:26 pm, "syed baber" <syed.ned...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Assalamo alaikum
>
> Tauba Tauba Allah maaf karay. Kisi Sahabi ko Laanti Abdullah Bin Ubai say
> milana Madudi Sahab kay perokaaroon ka hi shaiwa hosakta hai. Jawed Sahab
> jab Huzoor (peace be upon him) nay Dua ki thee to aap ko maloom hona chahye
> kay Wahi aai thee kay is kay liye dua na ki jay Allah ki taraf say mana
> kardia gia tha , Sharam ka muqam hai kay is baat ko Hazrat Muawiya kay Haq
> may dua say milaya jaraha hai. Aaap laaker dikhain Jam-e-Tarmizi may kay
> Huzoor nay dua ki ho aur Mana kardia gia ho.Worna batain kay Jam-e-Tirmizi
> may jo dua ki hai wo aap ko naozubillah maqbool nazar nahin aarahi hai aur
> Madoodi Sahab ki baat zada achi lagrahi hai. Aur Masha Allah farmatay hain
> kay sub ki hidayat kay liye dua ki Jaweb Sahab ye to Speciallay Hazrat
> Muawiya ka naam layker unkay samnay unkay liye Huzoor (peace be upon him)
> Dua farmarahay hain. Kia ye Sharf her kisi ko Hasil hogaya tha. Ager koi
> Madudi Sahab ki burai karay to aap ko bura lagta hai lekin koi Hazrat Ameer
> Muawiya (R.A) ki burai karay to aap kehtay hain haqeeqat hi to biyan karraha
> hai Masha Allah farmayay kia ye insaaf hai kay Aik Sahabi Rasool ki burai to
> aap ko manzoor hai lekin madoodi sahab ki khamiyaan aap mannay kay liye
> tayyar nahin hain.
>
> Aik baat clear kardoon kay Ahl-e-Sunnat Jamaat ka point of view ye hai kay
> hum Sahabi ko Masoom nahin samajhtay sirf Anbia hi Masoon hotay hain. Sahabi
> say ghalti hosakti hai lekin un ghaltioon ko biyan karkay unki Fazeelat ka
> inkar karna sarasar gumrahi hai aur kuch nahin. Shia bhee to Hazrat Abu
> Bakr, Hazrat Omar, Hazrat Usman (R.A) per ilzamaat lagata hai aur tarah
> tarah ki ghaltiyaan biyan karta hai uskay baray may aap kia kehtay hain.
> Yaqeenan Shia ye karkay Gumrah aur Mulhid-o-Zindeeq hi thera na.
>
> Aik baat aur clear kardoon kay maynay kahin bhee apni post may yazeed ki
> himayat nahin ki hai na hi maynay yazeed ka koi zikr kia hai Yazeed koi
> Sahabi nahin tha. Hazrat Hussain 100% Haq per thay aur Hazrat Hussain
> Nojawanan-e-Jannat kay Sardar hain.Yazeed ka amal Qabil-e-Malamat
> hai.Patanahin aap jawab daytay waqt kyun divert karjatay hain topic
> say maynay kahin
> yazeed ka zikr nahin kia aur aapnay yazeed ka zikr chairdia is liye maynay
> apna point of view batadia hai.
>
> *Shaikh Abdul Qadir Jilani ko kon nahin janta hai Jaker unki Majlis parhain
> wo Hazrat Muawiya kay baray may kia kehtay hain.Ab parhnay walay hi insaaf
> karain kay may Hazrat Ameer Muawiya kay baray may Shaikh Abdul Qadir Jilani
> Ki baat manoon ya Madoodi Sahab ki. Insaaf Shart hai.*
>
> Aakhri baat jo aapnay Hazrat Ameer Muawiya per ilzaam lagaya hai kay ,
>
> "Amire muavia used the funds of baitulmal to win support of tribes".
>
> Aap is baat ka authentic reference dain aur Riwayat ka Zaeef na hona bhee
> Sabit karain, Aik aik rawi ka naam batain otherwise apna ye ilzam wapis
> lain aur Tauba karain. I am waiting for ur complete reference. Maynay aap ko
> Siha-e-Sitta may say Hazrat Muawiya kay Haq may Hadith dikhai hai. Kia aap
> mujhe Siha-e-Sitta may Hazrat Muawiya ki Tanqeed may Hadith Dikhasaktay
> hain.
>
> Allah Hafiz.
>
> > > *We must clearly understand that "Islam" was completed during the life
> > > time of our belove d prophet at Hajjutul Wida and anything happened
> > > thereafter is history. We can dispute on history and can have different
> > > views on it, but it will not affect our Din.
>
> > > But one can't dispute Sahabas(RA) by giving excuse that Islam was
> > > completed. I quoted both Quran and hadith to explain the status of Sahabas
> > > infront of Allah nad Rasool(SAW) and it DOES effect our DIN when we
> > > criticize sahabas. Those who did, we all know their worth now. If there
> > > was dispute b/w Ali(RA) and Muwaiya(RA) then it was between them, who are we
> > > who dont even follow the 2% of Islam of Sahabas to criticize them? when
> > > Criticizing mududi who was nothing but an Islamic scholar is considered bad
> > > then I believe worth of sahabas are infinite time more than Modudi or any
> > > other scholar.
>
> > > Long story short, people like Modudi,LUdhyanvi, the four Imams are not
> > > more important and credible than all Sahabas Period.
>
> > > p.s : tat was my last response on this thread
> > > *- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
syed baber
Adnan Siddiqi
the main problem with moududi and ghamidi sahab that they tried to be oversmart than the sahabis(RA) and picked the things which they considered their weaknesses and started criticizing them. Modudi sahab himself was not a saint either. Atone side he always preached for pardah while the KHansama of his own home was a male. when there is difference between qaul and action then a personality gets disputed itself. modudi sahab might be a good speaker or a scholar but i dont consider him a mujadid anyway due to his writings and I think its due to controversial teachings which couldnt help JI to get any popularity among common men.
/A
syed baber
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
I wonder how followers of Moududi sahab would make themselves
different than shias who also criticize Muwaiya(RA) all the time and
they made several attempts to express anger by making a tunnel to his
shrine and urinate it.
The fact is all sahabas are sahabas. which sahaba is big and which is
not, The Prophet(saw) didn't give us permission to talk about it. What
we were told to follow them and I provided the hadith regarding
sahabas. I wonder what Modudi sahab got after criticizing sahabas?
Were he trying to say that He is more smarter than sahabis? If that
was his aim then I can say that he utterly got failed. If Modudi
offended Sahabis and Rasool than in current times, Ghamidi does same
with Hazrat Omar(RA),AYesha(RA) and Abu Huraira(RA). No Wonder
Prophecy of Rasool(SAW) that people would interpret things according
to their own will in ending times is getting fulfilled.
As I said, I have read Modudi and I can say that he has abused not
onyl sahabas but prophets as well. The way he addressed sahabis and
Rasoools IS offensive. Nobody can deny that because modudi's work is
proof against himself so I don't need some 3rd party to convince about
him. as far as his status of Mujadid and you said "Allah" did that. I
wonder did Allah send Wahi to Jamat-e-Islami about his mujaddid
status? I think its very immature statment. Since my family itself has
few outsiders from Jamat Islami so I often heard such "Holy" words for
Modudi sahab.
Since I myself has a blog ( http://kadnan.com/blog)- I would sure
upload work of Modudi sahab and will leave upto readers to decide that
how writer of such offensive work could be called a Islamic
scholar,leave the status of MUJADDID.
-adnan
syed baber
columni...@gmail.com
I am disappointed!. You being a computer professional and
fairly educated person are behaving in a typical Mullah Style.
Instead of trying to understand the problem, you are making one sided
declarations.
I am a software designer and I cannot develop a software unless
I understand first its system. Even if I make it,it will not work.
Syestem Analysis comes prior to actual coding. Let us understand
Islamic System. In Islam the Sole Creator and Sustainer of the
Universe is Allah SWT. He is the only One Who Has All power and glory
and is the source of all laws. He is Great in Himself. Glory is His
and the Kingdom of entire universe belongs to Him.
After Him in the Organizational heirarchy are Rasul, then
prophets, then Siddiqs, then Shuhda and then salehin. Every status or
position is Given By Him. We do not believe in the greatness of
Sahaba Karam like Hindus believe in greatness of their devi devtas. No
matter what they do they remain, great. In Islam piety comes with
fear of Allah and the one who is more afraid of Allah is nearer to Him
and is thus more respectable.
I hope, you agree with me upto here. In sahaba there were
difference of opinions and in different situations they acted
differently. If someone is asked in a particular situation whose role
was more in line with Islamic Injunctions, and I or your or anybody
for that matter give Quranic Injuctions in favour of one or the other,
I think it cannot be regarded as blasphemy. Because what he is doing
is applying a principle of Quran, ie the highest principle in Islam to
a particular situation. Half learnt Mullah like Ludhianvi start
criticizing such Ulemaa as being disrespectful to sahaba.
Even a common Muslim knows that to raise arms against Muslims is
haram. The holy prophet had prophecied that one of his Sahabis would
be killed by a revolting group. That sahabi was killed by Muavia
forces, thus proving the forecast and confirming the fact that when
Muavia was a baghi and disloyal to established Order of Caliphate.
Established none other but holy prophet himself. So he deprived us of
the golden age of Islam and ruthless and corrupt kingship started,
just after 30 years of caliphate. This was also confirmed by a
prophecy of Huzoor. So there are more than one clear proofs from
Ahadis Rasool that fighting against 4th Caliph was wrong. Syed
Maududi has not written anyting other than this. I have this morning
have seen the book. I am sure you did not read the book.
Now let us do a deal. I buy and read Iftekhilaf Ummat ....... and
you buy and read Khilafat o Mulookiat with open mind. It contains
more than 60 pages to explain the objections made to it. Let us first
read and then see who was right.
I hope you will agree to this proposition. I have great regard for
you and I hope you will also respnd this gesture of goodwill.
M J Iqbal
On Jun 17, 8:26 pm, "syed baber" <syed.ned...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Assalamo alaikum
>
> Masha Allah ab to Jawed Sahab itna aagay chalay gay kay yahan tak kehdia kay
> Madoodi Sahab ko Mujaddid Allah nay Muntakhib kia, Jawed Sahab aap batana
> pasand karaingay kay ye baaat aap ko kaisay maloom hoi , ya aap ko jisnay
> nay bhee batai hai usko kaisay maloom hoi. Ya aaj bhee Jamaat kay logoon per
> wahi aati hai. This is such an immature statement which I was not expecting
> from people like you.I am not terrorising you, I am mentioning the name of
> Abdul Qadir Jilani because he is Peeran-e-Peer and no body is against him
> except shia. All school of thoughts accept him as Peeran-e-peer and Mujaddid
> and Great Islamic Scholar and the words said by him is no more controversial
> in front of anyone. Sahabi Sahabi hota hai, who has given power to Madoodi
> to decide whether Ameer Muawiya is Sahabi or not??, Did you not read the
> Hadith in Jam-e-Tirmizi in which Huzoor Nabi Kareem (pecae be upon him)
> prayed for Ameer Muawiya (R.A) which I have also quoted, Deny this Hadith
> or accept Ameer Muawiya (R.A) as Sahabi.Hazrat Ali (R.A) aur Hazrat Ameer
> Muawiya (R.A) ko laranay walay Ibn-e-Saba kay log thay inmay aapas ka ya koi
> Zaati ikhtilaf nahin tha. In previous 1400 years nobody(Amongst Ahl-e-Haq
> Ulema) has put fingers on Ameer Muawiya except in this century Madoodi has
> present this belief that this is Sahabi and this is not. Madoodi Sahab nay
> shioon ko buhat khush kia hai aur wo madoodi sahab ka reference bhee dia
> kartay hain kay dekho ye kia kehta hai Ameer Muawiya kay baray may ye to
> shia bhee nahin hai. But you cannot make Allah happy by criticizing Sahabas.
>
> *Hubb-e-Sahaba Rehmatullah*
> *Bughz-e-Sahaba Laanatullah*
> > Since I myself has a blog (http://kadnan.com/blog)-I would sure
> > upload work of Modudi sahab and will leave upto readers to decide that
> > how writer of such offensive work could be called a Islamic
> > scholar,leave the status of MUJADDID.
>
> > -adnan- Hide quoted text -
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
M J Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
Adnan!
I am disappointed!. You being a computer professional and
fairly educated person are behaving in a typical Mullah Style.
Instead of trying to understand the problem, you are making one sided
declarations.
it's a very common practise that if one disagrees with other then he bluntly blames "MULLAH" like you just did. Please do keep in mind that Jamat people are more cursed for being a Mullahs in politicsa nd using Islam.
Speaking of Sahabas, I said many times and say again that the debate is pretty useless for us[muslims] to make comments which sahaba is good or which one is not good. Offcourse they were human and NO two humans can think 100% same but one should keep their status in mind before comment about them. Modudi sahab had forgot his own status and started talking about sahabas. Urdu's favorite pharase for such rants is "CHOTA MOO BARI BAAT". Modudi sahab was the best example for that mohwara.
-adnan
I don't want to say further on this topic.
> or accept Ameer Muawiya (R.A) as Sahabi.Hazrat Ali ( R.A) aur Hazrat Ameer
Adnan Siddiqi
Looking at the above episode can you say that all sahabas are equal. No my friend it is your ignorance. Even prophets have different status as has been said in the beginning of 3rd part "Tilka rusu...."
I agree that not all Prophets were equal but mind you that NONE of sahabas had status of any prophet prior to Muhammad(saw). its like employyes of a company start talking about one of directors just because they think he's not as powerful as other directors. that low grade director would still be superior than high status senior employee because that guy was selected as a DIRECTOR just because some comittie chose him as a director.
Jamat's arrogant atittude to poke in every matter regardless they deserve to comment on some matter or not is not appreciated at all.
-adnan
columni...@gmail.com
But one question remains, why are you afraid of reading Maududi,
whereas I am prepared to read and confront Ludhianvi, the paid servant
of Ziaul Haq.You also failed to meet the challenge of asking anybody
in your deobandis or ahle hadis to ask Allah SWT, whether Syed
Maududi is a Mujaddid or not?
M J Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
OK for you your din and for me Mine! End of Story.
But one question remains, why are you afraid of reading Maududi,
whereas I am prepared to read and confront Ludhianvi, the paid servant
of Ziaul Haq.You also failed to meet the challenge of asking anybody
in your deobandis or ahle hadis to ask Allah SWT, whether Syed
Maududi is a Mujaddid or not?
why would I be afraid jawed sahab? I am not afraid of anyone and this is the reason that I oppose Barelviat despite of I belong to a barelvi family. Unlike you, i did have read modudi saheb that's why i was able to say something about him. if you are prepared to read ludyanvi sahib then do buy the book which I had mentioned before.
-adnan
Adnan Siddiqi
OK for you your din and for me Mine! End of Story.
But one question remains, why are you afraid of reading Maududi,
whereas I am prepared to read and confront Ludhianvi, the paid servant
of Ziaul Haq.
:-)
who is not paid servant of the govt? do you want to say that Jamat Islami DIDNOT enjoy power at time of Zia?
-adnan
columni...@gmail.com
to buy and see whether he has written what ludhianvi has accused him
of . I am sure you will not find it.
As far as Jamaat is concerned, I am the most bitter critic of it and
was writing in Jasarat and Jang against it. Because I think it could
not live upto its name. The new topic posted by me also suggests that
MMA was one of the reasons of Musharraf's continuance in power, other
being BB.
So let us read one book each and come back with our comments honestly.
Also please find some Wali or buzurg , there are many in barelvis, to
confirm the fact that whether he was a Mujaddid. But he must not give
his opinion, bust ask Allah SWT and give us His reply.
Keep one thing in mind. In this world, many things are not what they
apper to be and there is no subsitute of experience.
M J Iqbal
On Jun 19, 3:06 pm, "Adnan Siddiqi" <kad...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > -adnan- Hide quoted text -
syed baber
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
syed baber
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
-adnan
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
But tablighis instead of acting on Islam, take it not to their relatives and friends but to far away places.Secondly it is cleary written in Surah Jumah that Nabi Karim recited Quraane Karim in front of people. But these tablighis recite tablighi nisab, which is not the whole din. It has no mention of maamlat, Jehad and Akhlaq. So their dawat is not the same as our holy prophet's.I know for fact that many well known tabighis have accumulated lot of money and are still taking contributions for non existant madarsahs. Have you ever thought in a million strong ijtimaa, not a single Muslim has standing in the eyes of Allah SWT, therefore their prayers are rejectd outright.
yar jawed sahab kia baat karaha hain? didnt sahabas travel from Saudia to all over the world to spread Islam? Hazarat Bilal(RA) and others are resting in peice on non saudi lands. As far as whether they act upon real Islam or not. Its rather better to live with them first then comment about them. Fact of the amtter is that today Islam is not spreading due to Jamat Islami's Political ISLAM but its spreading more due to different tableeghi groups which go all over the world. I know many stories because my friends are tablleeghi jamat members.
As far as Jamaat is concerned, it is no more the party Syed Maududi established. But may I remind you that for a real Muslim politics is not a forbidden tree. Every Muslim should come forward to handle collective matters of the nation. Because good people do not come forward, bad politicians and ethnic parties take control and the result is in front of your eyes.
yes politics is not haram but playing dirty games in name of politics and Islam is not alowed andall Sufis and Aulias of Past discourage power game due to same issue
Dear friend, can you deny that it was only jammat whose 3 members refused to accept increased salary, in the assembly of 342. It is only Jamaat who has rendered innumerable sacrifces in its struggle against ethnicity and lost many sons, one quite recently in Karachi and have sent volunteers in Afghan and Kashmir wars. The sons of Sind Amir, Jan Muhammad Abbasi, and secretary general, Munawer Hasan sustained injuries in Kashmir. Can you show me any other political party with this much sacrifices.They are ideal no more, but educated and intelligent people like you or Syed Babar can make the Jammat the real Jamaate Islami. Or you may try Tanzime Islami of Dr. Israr. Any party which is based on the dawat of Quraane Karim, which was the dawat of our beloved Nabi is closer to Allah and closer to success here and in the hereinafter.
yea its same jamat who supported WARDI by backing 17th ammendmentt. Tanzeem Islami still better, maybe because they have not started political game yet.
-adnan
columni...@gmail.com
what I wrote, below.
I would only say that the Din Nabi Akram brought does not take
you to
far away places first and the source of Hidayat is Quraan Karim and
not
I said "first". One has to obey himself, then spread the word to
near and dear ones and then to community at large and then take the
messge out. There is a very strong Ayat in Quran Karim prohibiting
people to preach what they do not practice.
You are misinformed about new converts to Islam. About 500 non
muslims are embracing Islam in America and Canada alone. They are
converting not because of Tabligh, but because of studying Quran
Directly. I wrote a column in Jang asking Tablighis to use Quran in
inviting people towards din.But they plainly refused. If you are
interested I can show both columns to you. One of my complaints
against deobandis is that they exhort people not to read quran as they
could get wrong meanings. I was so disappointed with their logic. When
a non Muslim can become a Muslim after reading Quran, how a Muslim,
who say auzo billah..........can be misled. They just want to retain
the interpretation of holy book in their hands so that their bread and
butter continues.
I hope you are not a blind tablighi follower. I joined tabligh while
I was still in matric, went to two three places and then realized that
it is not the Dawat of Islam, but is dawat of tabligh, so I gave it
up.
M Javed Iqbal
> > > -adnan- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
syed baber
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
You are misinformed about new converts to Islam. About 500 non
muslims are embracing Islam in America and Canada alone. They are
converting not because of Tabligh, but because of studying Quran
Directly
jawed shab, tell me what's the purpose of Schools and Univarsities and Teachers? as I said i am in touch with people who visit from one state to other for spreading Islam so I don't need some 3rd party unreliable source for tabligish. as far as spreadin Islam, it's even spreading due to Bush's policies so do give credit to him as well.
. I wrote a column in Jang asking Tablighis to use Quran in
inviting people towards din.But they plainly refused. If you are
interested I can show both columns to you. ]
refused for what? maybe i missed ur column so unless i dont see a copy, i cant say anything.
One of my complaints
against deobandis is that they exhort people not to read quran as they
could get wrong meanings. I was so disappointed with their logic. When
a non Muslim can become a Muslim after reading Quran, how a Muslim,
who say auzo billah..........can be misled. They just want to retain
the interpretation of holy book in their hands so that their bread and
butter continues.
i have not met any deobandi yet who said something like this. There is no such logic in deobandies. Yes if you think that we shouldnt read Quran from experts then I think you would also dislike what rasool(saw) did in past that is established first Islamic Madrassah in Madina?
I hope you are not a blind tablighi follower. I joined tabligh while
I was still in matric, went to two three places and then realized that
it is not the Dawat of Islam, but is dawat of tabligh, so I gave it
up.
I am not a blind follower thats the reaso that I dnot follow barelviat. If i was a blind follower then i was praising modudi. The fact is true that people have wrong perception about tablieghis and its due to some blacksheeps but over all purpose of tableegh is effective. Dawat of Islam is nto different than dawat of tableegh. didnt rasool(saw) said ? "pass to others even one ayah"? if this is not tableegh then what is it? my parents also get afraid that I dotn join tabligh but then I clarify them what actually tableegh means. Junaid jamshed and yousuf didnt take sanyas from world but they are following and spreading Islam as well. Unlike Jamat Islami, Tableeghis don't ADVERTISE Islam.
-adnan
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Sometimes your logic is childish. People are not converting to Islam because of Bush policies. As a reaction to american propaganda against Muslims people have read Quran to know what its teachings are. When they read the Quraan with open minds, they realize that such beautiful, forceful and definitive word can be of God Almighty alone.
So they accepted Islam. Bush did not get the credit but Allah and His Quran Do beacuse Allah SWT is Capable of Getting Khair out of shar.
That is why I say we must all read Quraan first. If we do not know Arabic, we can take any easy translation. When we learn Allah SWT's Ahkam ourselves our souls bow down before its Megisty, Power and ecstasy. Contrary to this deobandi ulema boast that since they have extracted all orders from Quran and have put them in the fiqh form, just read fiqh and not Quran. If you have read any books of deobandis you would have been familiar with this logic.
Nobody can dare object to Islamic madarsahs, but we all know that their courses are outdated. Quraan deals with science, signs , sociology, economics, politics and a host of subjects, but our madarsah students do not know what the latest findings and discoveries are. So they fail to point out the facts to Muslims. I will give just one example.
In 1930s an indian scientist ghosh earned noble prize because he tested and proved the fact that plants are alive.It was a big discovery then. Quran Karim has stated this fact 1400 years ago.One day I was reading translation of Ashraf Ali thanvi and he has translated "tukhrijul hai-e minal mayyate........." it by giving the examle of egg and hen. Whereas the Quran was mentioning seed and tree.Because at another place the same ayat has come in the context of ' Faliqe habbe wal nawa .......'. Meaning that It is only He who breaks open the seed , a dead thing and takes out tree a living thing. If Ashraf Ali thanvi had studied Quran with the techniqe and ability of Syed Maududi, he would have mentioned the fact correctly and would have attracted the attention of people of his time. I was so disappointed that I changed the translator.
You have admitted some black sheep in tabligh. Because you have seen them from a distance. Go close to them and you will find very few white sheep among them. Tabligh is a tailor made system to the traders of this country. They go on chillas and tours of 4 months but when come back still take excesive profit, do not pay taxes and often pass on increased price immediately but not the fallen price. Because tabligh does not deal with mamlat. And it does not tell them essence of Islam is "kahirkhwahi". The biggest problem with them is that they are not Mukhlis, which is the most important attribute of a Muslim.
There is no jehad in the tablighi nisab, without which there could have been no Islam. Have you ever thought , if tablighi ijtemaas are so well attended, why there is no positive influence in the society?. Because they say their dealing with Allah SWT is different and that with people different. They fail to see that people are slaves of Allah SWT and no body could appease a Master by being unfair to His slaves.
But these are inner details for which nobody cares. Everybody is in search of easy success. Nobody thinks that there is no short cut to success.
My last observation today is do not take brelvis lightly for blindly following Islam. They have seen the karamats of AQJIlani, Ganjbaksh, Gharibnawaz and Ganjshakar and are content with their knowledge. They are not as empty as a waterless cloud, as deobandis are. I never used to go to mazars. Last year I went for the first time in my life to Ali Hajveri's mazar. Its langar has been feeding people since 950 years. Even a blind can see that it is due to Allah's Mercy alone that people are still getting faiz after such a long time. Deobandis have only advices to offer. But brelvis try to follow the sunnah of Nabi Akram, by being helpful to common man.
M J Iqbal
I read and support Maududi not because of blind support. Because he is the most criticised Muslim author by almost every one. Deobandis, Ahle Hadith, Ahle Sunnat, socialist, secularists and the people under the influence of western culture. If you are open, just read first part of his 6 part tafsir.
Adnan Siddiqi
Adnan Saheb!
Sometimes your logic is childish. People are not converting to Islam because of Bush policies. As a reaction to american propaganda against Muslims people have read Quran to know what its teachings are. When they read the Quraan with open minds, they realize that such beautiful, forceful and definitive word can be of God Almighty alone.
So they accepted Islam. Bush did not get the credit but Allah and His Quran Do beacuse Allah SWT is Capable of Getting Khair out of shar.
Jawed Sahab you are being emotional like people who you curse yourself by labeling them "Typical Mullah". Whya re you comparing Allah with Bush? Wht I said is NOT different than wht are you trying to say. What Bush is doing against Islam is becoming reason for spreading Islam. where did I say Bush become Muslim and started tableegh in USA? kindly baat ko zara samjha karain. if you read aticles from NyTimes,specially by Semour Hersh and then Book by Ms Riddley who was captured by Taliban, both clearly said that today people are Studying more Islam because of too much propaganda against Isam. Man has a curious nature, that is if you ask someone NOT to do something, he would do it anyway. That curiosity lead to study Quran y non muslims and those who got guidance become muslim as well.
Allah will not come on earth Himself to spread his religion,offcourse He uses his sources. Doesn't Allah say himself , i thnk in Surah Al Imran that "They planned and Allah planned and Allah is the best planner" so kindly read again what I am talking about. I also said NOT different than what was said by me. as a Muslim we all know that everything is done by Allah but then its upto Allah's hand that He uses some non-Muslim or some Muslim to spread Islam. We muslims are not Thakeydar of spreading Islam as Allah could use anyone who suits him most.
-adnan
Adnan Siddiqi
You have admitted some black sheep in tabligh. Because you have seen them from a distance. Go close to them and you will find very few white sheep among them. Tabligh is a tailor made system to the traders of this country. They go on chillas and tours of 4 months but when come back still take excesive profit, do not pay taxes and often pass on increased price immediately but not the fallen price. Because tabligh does not deal with mamlat. And it does not tell them essence of Islam is "kahirkhwahi". The biggest problem with them is that they are not Mukhlis, which is the most important attribute of a Muslim.
There is no jehad in the tablighi nisab, without which there could have been no Islam. Have you ever thought , if tablighi ijtemaas are so well attended, why there is no positive influence in the society?. Because they say their dealing with Allah SWT is different and that with people different. They fail to see that people are slaves of Allah SWT and no body could appease a Master by being unfair to His slaves.
Atleast I did admit while you never admitted that today Jamat Islami is nothing but a political agenda to collect Chanda and gain power in politics. If teachings of modudi sahab were so powerful then today jamat islami was darlig of Pakistani people. Now pls don't try to curse Pakistanis by saying they dont love Pakistan. PAkistanis love Islam more than any nation on earth and since u have lived in Middle east and have performed Umrah as well then you know better than me.
when did I say i experienced tablighis from a distance? I have lots of tableeghis friend so I do keep getting news from matter. Instead of looking at other, you never exposed the filth lie among leadership and followers of Jamat Islami. FYI, my TAI ammi herself belongs to Jamat Islami and we all know what kinda nature she has and how "WELL" she treat others. So I dont need to meet mr Qazi Hussaidn Ahmed or that lunatic old man MUnawar Hassan who is uncle my of school friend asim hasan to learn about real face of Islam.
as far as tableeghi jamat, well tell me what your Jamat Islami doing to spred Islam WITHIN muslims and among non-Muslims. Bhai sahab aap kis dunya mey hain? I never hear some jamati made someone muslim, all I keep heardin that they do DHARNA BAZI on roads and Nullahs to kick Mush out.
It doesn't matter you accept or not, fact is that Tableeghis in all over the world are busy to create awareness about Islam. tThese are tableeghis who are bsuy these days in different masjids of posh areas like clifton and defence to spred Islam among elite classes. You said Tableeghis don't talk about Jihad. yes they dont talk about the COMMERCIAL VERSION of Jihad advertised by Qazi Sahab, that is take chanda and have fun. If you want that tableeghis do Dramazy bazi like Qazi Sahab by doing wall chalking against America then sorry, Tableeghis are not stupid and immature enough that they do such things. They rather work on people. This is why their effort bought people like Junaid Jamshed, mUhammad Yousuf(yousuf youhanna), Mushtaq Ahmed,Inzy etc who are not doing their jobs but spreading Islam as well. what Modudi sahab follower did to spread Islam? they rather wasted life to trim the beared to make it looking lovely and acceptable.
so if you dont accept then it doesnt mean it doesnt exist. ever wonder why Tableeghis never face any issue to get visa of non-Muslim countries while Qazi sahab was even banned in netherland? its because tableeghis dont do drama bazy and phadday baazi in name of Islam. Jamatis might call them Yehudi agents btu thtat the childish statment is given by any Muslim when he doesnt find anything to negate something.
I read and support Maududi not because of blind support. Because he is the most criticised Muslim author by almost every one. Deobandis, Ahle Hadith, Ahle Sunnat, socialist, secularists and the people under the influence of western culture. If you are open, just read first part of his 6 part tafsir.
Inshallah in coming posts, i will publish the excerpts of Modudi sahab's work on same forum. the problem is I dont have a good mobile web cam and I am not good at writing in urdu fonts otherwise i would have shared his "Research Work" with everyone here.
But these are inner details for which nobody cares. Everybody is in search of easy success. Nobody thinks that there is no short cut to success.
My last observation today is do not take brelvis lightly for blindly following Islam. They have seen the karamats of AQJIlani, Ganjbaksh, Gharibnawaz and Ganjshakar and are content with their knowledge.
Kindly dont teach me about barelviat or giving justification as I am part of their community. Who si talking about karam of sufis? when did mentioned sufis ever celebrated EID MILADUD NABI(saw) ? where in Islam sahabas (saw) celebrated bday of Muhammad(Saw)? where in Islam was concept of FATIHA KHUWANI, visint shriine etc etc. Do you wana say that BIDDAT is acceptable? Bidat is the curse sent by Allah and His prophet(saw) upon those who are part of bidat even if its a little one.
-adnan
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Do you forget your own mail????? Only in your last mail, it were you who wrote that because of bush many muslims converted to Islam so will you give credit for this to Bush? Upon this I said that credit does not go to him but to holy Quran which is self sufficient to convince the people who read it with open mind.
So you cannot blame me of being sentimental. It is rather you not me who is harping the same old tune.
We as thinking and analytical minds must serve our nation and our ummat by trying to analyze problems facing by them. Our ulema, our education and our information system have something definitely lacking. We must investigate and inform all and sundry so that whoever has any sympathy with them can rectify those and ummah could rise again to the position it was destined for. That is "Kuntum Khair ummatin.....".
By the way the title of best ummat is Given to us with the reasoning that "you Order people to do good and restrain them from the bad". This amr bil maroof and nahi analmunkar is almost absent in our communities. If my sons are arrogant and do not respect elders, everyone will blame me, not the children. Similarly, the present decadence in the Society is attributed to ulema and since deobandis are most vociferous, they are the first to blame. But peope like you who have only heard about tablighis from their friends, ie you have a second hand knowledge or hearsay about them , can be proud of their deeds.
I live in a 100 apartment plaza. The Gifto shop which catered to grocery needs of residents was owned by a tablighi. Whenever I sent children to buy something he will always charge them more. If I sent a 100 rupee note and a single rupee falls short, he will turned him to bring the money from 4 storeys.Although he could take it later. His young son, only 22 years of age took peoples money on profit basis and people because of tablighi sympathies gave him 70 lakh rupees. One day the boy disappeared and the father went on tablighi chilla. People with lot of difficulties contacted him. He returned and said his son has sustained loss and returned two third or half sum. So in a short span of 4 months this young tablighi made 23 lakhs. Such episodes are common and you may find them in every locality of Karachi. The largest money scam of Pakistan the alliance fraud was also done by tablighis. If they were fair, they should have advertised and informed people that they had no relations with the company.
If your aunt is tough and unsymphetic, it is not because of jamaat. In my vicinity lives a young house wife who has two young children but she goes to many houses to invite people to darse quran. My wife is although older than her respects her for her piety and dedication. Jamaat reserchers have done a lot of work on Islamic economics and politics. They not only hold darse quran ijtemaas but also print out Tarjumane Quraan.
which is of the highest standard in Pakistan.
I know there is a general fall in the interest of people every where, but some jamaatis are better than others and certainly better than the rest. Because they know what are the requirements of being a Muslim. Others even do not know. And Quran says that one who knows is like one who has eyes and the one who does not is like a blind.
It is typical deobandi style to criticize every good thing by calling it bidaat. Celeberating Eide Milad is certainly not a bidaat. The sahaba never forgot Huzoor . For them every day was like eide milad. But in this age when people hardly discuss the life and services of Hadi-e Aazam SAW, there is absolutey no harm in celebrating Eide Milad and inform people of his noble character and his fear of Allah SWT. To entertain people with lunch or breakfast or sweets is also desirable. But only enlightening the houses and buildings may fall into israf which is strictly prohibited in Islam. If I can celebrate the death anniversary of my father because of love for him why cant I celebrate the birthday of my beloved prophet. Such stupid self imposed restrictions create dismay and resentment among masses. I challenge the deobandis to show a single ayat or hadis in which people were deplored for celebrating the birthday of Hazrat Musa or Hazrat Isa.
My dear friend .Isalm is the most natural and easy religion which deobandis have made difficult. Nobody has the right to make a thing haram which has not been declared so in Quraan or Hadis.Period.
So if you have certain bad experience from jamaat members you know , I will beg your pardon on behalf of them. But do not miss the best Islamic litrature produced by any scholor in the 20th century. Why the salfis, ie saudis gave him the first Faisal Award for services to Islam. No deobandi got even close.
Also please let me know, if required by asking with akabire deoband, if Imam Abu Hanifa declined to accept the position of Chief Justice of Supreme Court, why Mufti Taqi Usmani accepted it? If he made a mistake why the akabir did not disown him. They are always in league with the corrupt generals and beaucrats. Jamaat atleast is part of opposite group.
M J Iqbal
syed baber
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
columni...@gmail.com
wrote :
" Aur aakhri baat batata chaloon kay Imam Abu Hanifa kay shagird Imam
Abu
Yousuf Chief Justice thay aur buhat famous bhee thay.ye buhat hi bekar
kisim
ka aitraz hai kay Mufti Taqi Usmani Chief Justice kyun banay.Kia
Chief
Justice Banna Jurm hai ??? Reply me plz.Aur ager aap ka aitraz ye hai
kay "
This is typical my party right or wrong, reply. Fiqh Hanafia is known
by Imame Azam. What his disciple does has no efficacy.There is no
comparision between the two.There are two options for a "rajle kar".
(Man of Action). One is that of 'azimat' and the other of 'rukhsat'.
The former is the way of Ahal Allah and the second is that of Ahle
Duniya or 'ibad ur darham'. Imam Hanifa's sacrifice was rewarded by
Allah SWT and he became the most followed imam of fiqh.
This confirms my contention that deobandi ulema are ahle rukhsat, not
ahle azimat. They fall for easy money.Therefore cannot perform acts
of sacrifice and courage Why tablighis are allowed in USA. Because
they could not convince Muslims by spending millions of dollars that
Jihad is no more necesary. But tablighi jamaat has done it for them
for free(or who know they receive funds indirectly). In order to
enable Israel to establish a global government from the throne of
David, ie upon ashes of Masjide Aqsa, USA and her allies are spending
millions of dollars to convince Muslims to give up the concept of
Jihad. Why they made Qadiani sect and what was the distinction between
Muslims and them. Similarly Tablighis do not talk of jihad and even if
they do, they do not give it any importance and think tabligh is
enough for a Muslim's nijat.
The scholors of the Quran on the other hand read out Ayats of Surah
Infal, Surah Taubah and Surah Nisa (Ayat 75) to compel them to
raise against the operators and finding no way to escape the
responsibility, they join a group of martyrs.
As long as people are giving importance to tabligh and ignoring ahle
Quran, their purpose is being served.
The decision then to make is to choose between Ahle Azimat and Ahle
Rukhsat, Ibad ur Rahman and Ibad ud-dinar.
M J Iqbal
On Jun 26, 2:12 pm, "Muhammad Javed Iqbal" <columnist.ja...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> > kisim ka aitraz hai kay Mufti Taqi Usmani Chief Justice kyun banay.KiaChief Justice Banna Jurm hai ??? Reply me
> > plz.Aur ager aap ka aitraz ye hai kay wo Pervaiz Musharraf kay duration
> > may chief justice kyun thay to kia aap abhee jitnay bhee judge hain unko
> > ghalat kehtay hain.Aur Mufti Sahab ka aik bhee faisla aap batadain mujhe
> > jo hukumut kay liye ho ya jismay aap ko koi bias nazar aaya ho pooray 17
> > years may,Sirf aik faisla batadain reference kay sath.Sood khatam karnay
> > ka faisla bhee Mufti Sahab ka tha lekin Ye Pervaiz Musharraf nay unhai
> > dismissed kardia time aanay say pehlay hi.
>
> ...
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
Adnan Siddiqi
http://darsequran.com/weeklyvoice/tjdigital.php
After listening that Jawed Sahab can clarify things about tableeghis like:
-Understandnig about Quran with meaning
-whether they talk about Jihad or Not
-Quranic verses reference about Importance of Sahabas(RA)
Tableegh is not a child's play. The first step of tableegh is to attack on Nafs and this was sunnah of Aulias and Rasool(saw) as well. Jawed sahab would have got failed to experience all this thtswhy he ran away.
-adnan
Muhammad Javed Iqbal
Adnan Siddiqi
Adnan!. You have insulted me!
Insulted? I was just talking about ground realities. Even if you feel offended then I hope yuo wuold have realized that you would be offending sahabis as well and snice they dont exist physically, you just keep thinking about about them
I have not run away. I am still working for Islam and Muslims. It is the tablighi "Akhlaq" to insult persons older than you. As far as Islam is concerned, it requires Muslims to respect the old and love the young. But tablighis have no chapter on Akhlaq or Mamlat, yet they claim to teach the Din in full. "Allah Taala ne hamari Kamyabi aur puri insaniat ki kamyabi apne pure din main rakhi hai. Yeh pura din hamari zindagi main kistrarah aajaye is ke liye mehnat ki zuroorat hai." When a Muslim goes with them to learn the full din, they take him to different places for tabligh and brain wash him so much that he forgets about his obligations to his family and his parents. Tablighi Nisab is not full din!
Jawed sahab , did you bother to listen Molana Tariq's bayan i gave in last mail? if you would have listened then you wuoldnt have bothered to repeat same thing again.Khair! No matter whatever you say, the fact is tableegh is name of PRACTISED relgiion rather dramay bazi Islam of Jamat Islami, that's why they are successful and even made muslims ni african area Congo and even wahabi saudis admitted it when people of COngo performed Hajj in 80s. Saudis don't believe in tableegh kind of things so if they admit then it means great success! Your rant is nothnig but Western propaganda with no proof. Brain washing my Foot? ever wonder how much JI brainwashed during Afghan war and sent innocents in afghan war while his own son was enjoynig luxory ni USA? hypocrisy!
You have closed your eyes in love of toungh twisting lectures of Tariq Jamil and have failed to notice the low moral and intellectual level of tablighis. A tree is known by its fruit and a party by behaviour of its members. Tablighi Jamaat has miserably failed on this count.
I can just laugh at you jawed sahab that I am in lOVE of tariq jamil lectures, even if I am so whats wrong? u r angry coz i dont beliee in blasphemous Modudi who dont nkow how to respect sahabi?
I never said they do not quote Qur'an nor I said they do not mention jihad. But their emphasis is on Tabligh alone.That partial approach has been rejected by Qur'an and Muslims have been ordained to "Enter into Islam in totality"For your kind information, Tariq Jamil has accumulated lot of wealth in the name of Madarsahs, whereas these madarsahs are surviving on asking funds from people. If his accounts are audited, substantial part of his holdings will be disclosed as having been earned from unkwon sources.
Another example of Ignorance. Even a beginner listener of Tariq jamil knows well that He's son of a landlord,a Big landlord of Faisalabad. Why does he need money when he was born with taking gold spoon?
Jawed Sahab difference honay me koi Burai nahin but dil mey BUGHZ rakhna kitna bara gunnah hay, ye shayed aap jantay hee houn.
BTW, you didnt tell me how many people were converted to Islam by Modudi followers? right now modudi followers are busy in politics and halla gulla in name of Islam :-)
columni...@gmail.com
sahabas. No Muslim in right mind would do that. The person who accused
Syed Maududi of offending the Sahaba must be listening the music for
his baseless allegations.
It is childish to say since tarq jamil was born in a land lord family
he does not need money. The fact of the matter is the people who are
rich are in more need of it. But normal human beings like us can do
in lot less.
I have been a hard critic of Jamat Islami and if you read my replys
carefully you will find many complaints against the Jamaat. But I was
only insisting that you read the translation and tafsir of Syed
Maududi so as to have first hand knowledge for true and real Islam in
the light of Holy Quran.
Since you do not appear to do that anytime soon, I see no point in
prolonging the debate.
This is the last posting on the subject. Period.
M J Iqbal
On Jun 29, 9:40 am, "Adnan Siddiqi" <kad...@gmail.com> wrote:
Adnan Siddiqi
Books of modudi sahab are available so one can read himself what he writes about.