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Beltane Fire Festival

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Steve Glover

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Apr 25, 2006, 1:43:45 PM4/25/06
to
Keep the Fires Burning!

Beltane Fire Festival 2006

Sunday April 30th, Calton Hill, Edinburgh 9pm - 1am

Advance tickets are still on sale for £3. Also, if you buy before the
night, you don't have to queue up as much. The event starts around
9:30pm, so not queuing is a good way to make sure you see everything.

Tickets are available from:

* The Hub, Castlehill, Edinburgh, EH1 2NE. Tel: 0131 473 2000
https://www.hubtickets.co.uk/
* Ripping Records (South Bridge)
* http://www.beltane.org
* Forest Cafe

http://www.beltane.org/images/beltane-email-flyer.jpg

Tickets will be on sale on the night for £5 from about 6ish at the foot
of Carriage Drive (the Waterloo Place steps will be closed off).


The Event

On the 30th of April, Beltane Fire Society celebrates the coming of
Summer with Edinburgh's 19th annual Beltane Fire Festival, on Calton
Hill.

Crowds of 12,000 will gather to witness this revival of the ancient
Celtic festival of Beltane. Three hundred voluntary performers will
celebrate the ending of winter and the season of new growth with
drumming, fire performance, revelry and a fantastical procession around
the hill. Providing a magical air of anticipation, and world-renowned
intense visual spectacle.

The Story

The procession begins on the Acropolis where a neid fire is lit by
ancient methods using a bow drill. This flame lights the torchbearers
and reveals the May Queen, the mother aspect of the triple goddess and
Queen of the Summer. Leading the Horned God and flanked by her White
Warrior Women and the mighty Processional drummers, the May Queen is
guided by the Blue Men, druidic spirit guides and her way is lit by the
torchbearers. The procession passes anti-clockwise around Calton Hill,
the May Queen awakening and uniting the elements of Air, Earth, Water
and Fire. When the circuit of the hill is almost complete, the court is
ambushed by the Red Men and their Beastie Drummers - spirits from the
underworld symbolising chaos, mischief and lust. They are repelled by
their opposites, the White Warrior Women, representing truth, law and
order. The celebrations reach their climax as the Horned God; his lust
stirred by the lascivious Red Men, reaches out and touches the May
Queen. He is stripped of his winter coat and reborn as the Green Man,
representing the first new growth of the coming Summer. He is crowned by
the May Queen and they light a sacred bonfire to burn the old so we may
bring in the new. The festival ends with the coming together of White
and Red in a courtly dance symbolising the need for a balance of both
order and chaos.

The Society

The Beltane Fire Society is managed by a voluntary committee, and all
the performers are volunteers. All the costs of the event used to be
covered by fundraising events such as post-festival clubs, and voluntary
donations. Performers also commit large amounts of time and money into
producing their costumes, and props. The rising cost of producing and
insuring such a large and spectacular event (now over £30,000) has led
to ticketing the event being necessary to cover some of the costs.
However, as we currently receive no public funding, ticketing alone does
not fund the event completely, and we are still seeking donations,
putting on clubs and pursuing other forms of fundraising to allow us to
continue with this spectacular and unique Scottish cultural event.

For more information go to: www.beltane.org


--
Steve Glover, Fell Services Ltd.
Home: steve at fell-services dot net, 0131 551 3835
Away: steve.glover at ukonline dor co dot uk, 07961 446 902


Ian Johnston

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Apr 26, 2006, 5:43:19 PM4/26/06
to
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 17:43:45 UTC, Steve Glover
<st...@fell.demon.co.uk> wrote:

: This flame lights the torchbearers


: and reveals the May Queen, the mother aspect of the triple goddess and
: Queen of the Summer. Leading the Horned God and flanked by her White
: Warrior Women and the mighty Processional drummers, the May Queen is
: guided by the Blue Men, druidic spirit guides and her way is lit by the
: torchbearers.

Bloody hell, and I though Glastonbury was bad for silly New Age
cobblers.

Is there any romanticised Victorian myth from any part of the UK that
hasn't been woven into this charade?

Yours in tolerance,

Ian

PS Where does the money go? All 36,000 - 60,000 quid of it, depending
on how mant mugs buy advance tickets...

--

TheMgt

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Apr 26, 2006, 5:54:23 PM4/26/06
to
Ian Johnston wrote:

> Bah, humbug.

It's fun. Same reason we have Xmas but without all the shopping.

Ian Johnston

unread,
Apr 26, 2006, 6:03:31 PM4/26/06
to
On Wed, 26 Apr 2006 21:54:23 UTC, TheMgt <the...@morningstar.eu.org>
wrote:

: Ian Johnston wrote:
:
: > Bah, humbug.
:
: It's fun. Same reason we have Xmas but without all the shopping.

Fair enough. It's just that it seems perilously close to face
painting, which is abhorrent to all persons of intelligence and
sensitivity.

Ian

Halmyre

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Apr 27, 2006, 4:27:14 AM4/27/06
to

It's just an excuse to strew litter all over Calton Hill.

--
Halmyre

ceci, n'est pas un signature

Alex Bird

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Apr 27, 2006, 5:01:22 AM4/27/06
to
Ian Johnston wrote:

> Bloody hell, and I though Glastonbury was bad for silly New Age
> cobblers.

Glastonbury *is* silly, there are no crystals involved in Beltane ;o)

> Is there any romanticised Victorian myth from any part of the UK that
> hasn't been woven into this charade?

Actually myths from all over Europe, but as the core characters were
known in most cultures, and no-one knows much about the ancient
celebration of Beltane, we might as well weave our own tale.

> PS Where does the money go? All 36,000 - 60,000 quid of it, depending
> on how mant mugs buy advance tickets...

In rough descending order:
Council charge for using the hill
Insurance
Police
Rock Steady Stewards
Bodypaint

The performers are not paid anything, and contribute ~90% of the costs
of costumes, rehearsal space, etc. as well as taking part in busks and
other fundraising activities to fund the festival.
Since ticketing started, because the contributions punters were putting
in the buckets were woefully inadequate, the festival has just about
broken even, any profits go back into the society for the other
quarterly festivals, which are not ticketed.

Looks like it's going to be a fantastic Beltane night, and advance
tickets are almost half the walk-up price!! nudge nudge.

Alex x

a l l y

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Apr 27, 2006, 5:17:46 AM4/27/06
to

"Ian Johnston" <ian.g...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cCUlhtvFIYkV-pn2-XpcL5mXSTdEr@localhost...
Hmph. Must be Grumpy Old Men season....

;-)

ally


Steve Glover

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Apr 27, 2006, 5:09:05 AM4/27/06
to
In article <cCUlhtvFIYkV-pn2-k2Jzxsd27EEy@localhost>, Ian Johnston
<ian.g...@btinternet.com> writes

>On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 17:43:45 UTC, Steve Glover
><st...@fell.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>: This flame lights the torchbearers
>: and reveals the May Queen, the mother aspect of the triple goddess and
>: Queen of the Summer. Leading the Horned God and flanked by her White
>: Warrior Women and the mighty Processional drummers, the May Queen is
>: guided by the Blue Men, druidic spirit guides and her way is lit by the
>: torchbearers.
>
>Bloody hell, and I though Glastonbury was bad for silly New Age
>cobblers.

That's what I get for pasting in unadulterated press release copy....
It's lots more fun than it sounds, honest!

>Is there any romanticised Victorian myth from any part of the UK that
>hasn't been woven into this charade?

Some. Of May-related stuff alone, there's no Morris, no Hobby Horse and
no dancing round a May-pole. Oh, and no Wicker Man with a local cop in
it (this may be because the Police have one of the production staff in
the control room at Fettes as^W a^W hostage^W).

>Yours in tolerance,
>
>Ian
>
>PS Where does the money go? All 36,000 - 60,000 quid of it, depending
>on how mant mugs buy advance tickets...

Let's see now. Paint and paraffin, something towards costume materials
and puppetry - lots of little things like that add up very quickly when
spread over more than three hundred performers. Hire of rehearsal space
over the last ten weeks or so.

All of those are surprisingly cheap, especially when so much comes from
performers' own pockets.

Then there's the backstage/production expenses: Hire of staging and
scaffolding, plus fencing to cordon off things like production areas and
paraffin storage. Vehicle hire. Ticket booths, toilets (the standard
rule - admittedly for a daytime event - is one portaloo per 500 people
per eight hours).

Lastly the really big numbers. Almost but not quite hiring the Hill from
the Council, and getting it clean again afterwards (we've had years
where we've picked up virtually all the rubbish ourselves, but still had
to pay the Council - if they were half as strict on the folk who ran the
torchlight procession between Christmas and Hogmanay, we wouldn't have
picked up quite so many bucketloads of nails and bits of rusted metal
from the area of the fire at our walkthrough last Sunday). Entertainment
license. Insurance (in these post-911 days, we pay more and more for
less and less actual cover). Professional stewarding (I've worked for
Rock Steady, and I've been involved in training Beltane's own voluntary
stewards - our own lot are pretty darn' good, but the rules say we get
the professionals in). Emergency services (the Police seem to take more
of a hands-off approach, with a control room at Fettes rather than a pod
on the Hill, but I think there's an ambulance and a fire engine "on
call" somewhere close by).

It all adds up to something approaching 400,000 - hence the various
groups of performers doing busks on Princes Street or running clubs or
putting on musical/dramatic events.

And three months ago most of the performers had never even met....

Steve

Steve Glover

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Apr 27, 2006, 5:17:38 AM4/27/06
to
In article <Cf%3g.294$4I6...@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net>, Halmyre
<nos...@this.address> writes

>It's just an excuse to strew litter all over Calton Hill.

If it is, it's not the only one. I've been up the Hill once or twice a
week with the stewards and torchbearers for the last ten weeks or so,
and at the end of March we were still finding remains of bank-sponsored
garden candles from an event in December.

And please don't get me started on the mess from burning the "longship".
If real longships had that amount of rusty metal - nails, hinges, sharp
and twisted strips up to 20cm in length - they'd never have floated.

Also, unlike the torchlight procession or Hogmanay, we try to keep the
Hill glass-free by having a decanting station at the bottom to allow
folk to pour their drink into plastic containers.

Steve

M Holmes

unread,
Apr 27, 2006, 7:53:16 AM4/27/06
to
Ian Johnston <ian.g...@btinternet.com> wrote:

> Is there any romanticised Victorian myth from any part of the UK that
> hasn't been woven into this charade?

I was dissapointed at the lack of werewolves.

FoFP

angus_...@hotmail.com

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Apr 27, 2006, 8:02:00 AM4/27/06
to
> I was dissapointed at the lack of werewolves.

They were turned away at the gate. "Thanks, but no fangs".

Angus

Jim O'D

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Apr 27, 2006, 8:25:17 AM4/27/06
to

howl!

M Holmes

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Apr 27, 2006, 8:45:10 AM4/27/06
to
angus_...@hotmail.com wrote:

>> I was dissapointed at the lack of werewolves.

> They were turned away at the gate.

For not having any Sterling?

FoFP

Ronald Raygun

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Apr 27, 2006, 8:56:21 AM4/27/06
to
M Holmes wrote:

> I was dissapointed at the lack of werewolves.

They must have been elsewere.

Ian Johnston

unread,
Apr 27, 2006, 2:32:50 PM4/27/06
to
On Thu, 27 Apr 2006 09:09:05 UTC, Steve Glover
<st...@fell.demon.co.uk> wrote:

: It all adds up to something approaching 400,000 - hence the various

: groups of performers doing busks on Princes Street or running clubs or
: putting on musical/dramatic events.

Fair enough, and good luck tae ye.

Ian

--

The Tattie Howker

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Apr 28, 2006, 5:04:30 AM4/28/06
to

That and drum bands.

If its one thing that annoys me about new age hippies its they way they
pretend they like listening to just drums like its some basic tribal
instinct or something.

TTH

Ian Johnston

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Apr 28, 2006, 5:40:06 AM4/28/06
to
On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 09:04:30 UTC, The Tattie Howker
<the_tatt...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

: Ian Johnston wrote:

: > Fair enough. It's just that it seems perilously close to face

: > painting, which is abhorrent to all persons of intelligence and
: > sensitivity.
:
: That and drum bands.
:

: If its one thing that annoys me about new age hippies...

One thing? One thing? You must have very high standards of annoyance.

The thing which annoys me most is the way they pretend to reject all
the trappings of our horrid consumerist car-obsessed capitalist
society while living on social security (if male) or an allowance from
Daddy at the Old Rectory (if female) and spending their time driving
to festivals to sell gullible fifteen year olds bits of polished
quartz at exhorbitant prices.

In short, show me a white person with dreadlocks and facial piercings
and I'll show you a hypocrite.

Ian

angus_...@hotmail.com

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Apr 28, 2006, 6:28:19 AM4/28/06
to
> The thing which annoys me most is the way they pretend to reject all
> the trappings of our horrid consumerist car-obsessed capitalist
> society while living on social security (if male) or an allowance from
> Daddy at the Old Rectory (if female) and spending their time driving
> to festivals to sell gullible fifteen year olds bits of polished
> quartz at exhorbitant prices.

Poor houses and soup kitchens, that's the kind of thing they need.

Luxury! Back in my day, we got by on half a slice of organic bread and
a cup of ecofriendly Bovril if we were lucky. And father would belt us,
not with real leather of course, if we didn't polish the healing gems
so he could see his dreadlocks in 'em. Then we'd walk 20 miles t'hippy
fair to sell our wares.

You try to tell the young people of today that ... they won't believe
you.

Angus

Ronald Raygun

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Apr 28, 2006, 7:03:41 AM4/28/06
to
angus_...@hotmail.com wrote:

> Luxury! Back in my day, we got by on half a slice of organic bread and
> a cup of ecofriendly Bovril if we were lucky. And father would belt us,
> not with real leather of course, if we didn't polish the healing gems
> so he could see his dreadlocks in 'em. Then we'd walk 20 miles t'hippy
> fair to sell our wares.
>
> You try to tell the young people of today that ... they won't believe
> you.

I don't believe you either, so I guess I must be young and of today.
And there was me thinking I was a living-in-the-past old grump.

angus_...@hotmail.com

unread,
Apr 28, 2006, 7:21:30 AM4/28/06
to

> I don't believe you either, so I guess I must be young and of today.
> And there was me thinking I was a living-in-the-past old grump.

Old enough to remember Monty Python, surely?

Angus

M Holmes

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Apr 28, 2006, 7:32:59 AM4/28/06
to
angus_...@hotmail.com wrote:

> Luxury! Back in my day, we got by on half a slice of organic bread and
> a cup of ecofriendly Bovril if we were lucky. And father would belt us,
> not with real leather of course, if we didn't polish the healing gems
> so he could see his dreadlocks in 'em. Then we'd walk 20 miles t'hippy
> fair to sell our wares.

That's nothin'. When I were a lad we 'ad t' get up at six in t' mornin'
an' make new string for t' dogs. We 'ad raw lentils for breakfast an' a
can o' Guarana to wash 'em down. Then we 'ad t' build our school out of
bits we found in a skip.

You tell that t' t' young ones of t'day and they won't believe you.

FoFP

Janet deJanet

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Apr 28, 2006, 4:24:36 PM4/28/06
to

Wow. You realise that ranting on about wild stereotypes like says far
far more about you than about the people you purport to describe. What
a deeply nasty person you seem, Ian.

Ian Johnston

unread,
Apr 28, 2006, 5:43:23 PM4/28/06
to
On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 20:24:36 UTC, Janet deJanet <an...@google.gov.uk>
wrote:

: Wow. You realise that ranting on about wild stereotypes like says far

: far more about you than about the people you purport to describe. What
: a deeply nasty person you seem, Ian.

Do I detect a dreadlock speaking?

Ian
--

Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted

Richard Tobin

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Apr 29, 2006, 3:22:06 PM4/29/06
to
In article <CheetahPRO_v2...@blackcat.demon.co.uk>,
Mike Dickson <mi...@blackcat.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>Incidentally, 'Saying <x> about <y> says far more about you than <y>' is
>a rather hackneyed way of disagreeing with him without having to
>actually come up with anything to disagree about.

It may be when you say it, but sometimes it's just true.

-- Richard

Ian Johnston

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Apr 30, 2006, 7:19:38 AM4/30/06
to
On Sat, 29 Apr 2006 15:33:23 UTC, mi...@blackcat.demon.co.uk (Mike
Dickson) wrote:

: In article <2006042821252775249%anon@googlegovuk> an...@google.gov.uk wrote...
:
: > Wow. You realise that ranting on about wild stereotypes like says far


: > far more about you than about the people you purport to describe.

:
: Not if he's correct. Which he is.
:
: Incidentally, 'Saying <x> about <y> says far more about you than <y>' is


: a rather hackneyed way of disagreeing with him without having to
: actually come up with anything to disagree about.

"Ad hominem", isn't it?

Ian

urchaidh

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May 1, 2006, 8:46:21 AM5/1/06
to
Mike Dickson wrote:
> If there's one thing that annoys me about new age hippies it's that they
> are new age hippies.

A remarkable display of tollerance, and from a man who is clearly the
result of an unfortunate drunken fumble between Jeremy Clarkson and
Anne Widdecombe. Hurrah for Mike.

angus_...@hotmail.com

unread,
May 1, 2006, 10:45:57 AM5/1/06
to

> : Incidentally, 'Saying <x> about <y> says far more about you than <y>' is
> : a rather hackneyed way of disagreeing with him without having to
> : actually come up with anything to disagree about.
>
> "Ad hominem", isn't it?
>
> Ian

Unless you're into hip-hop, in which case it'd be 'ad eminem'.

Angus

Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted

Robert Sneddon

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May 1, 2006, 5:05:44 PM5/1/06
to
In message <CheetahPRO_v2...@blackcat.demon.co.uk>, Mike
Dickson <mi...@blackcat.demon.co.uk> writes

>Interesting. As Anne Widdecombe is happy to tell everyone that she has
>never 'horiziontally jogged' in her life then it must be assumed that I
>am someone the product of a virgin birth and hence, the Messiah.

With that level of displayed innocence I can only concur with your
self-diagnosis since even the most callow and pure of heart has heard of
the classic "up against the wall" knee-trembler, usually by direct
experience before their fifteenth year behind the bike sheds.
--
To reply, my gmail address is nojay1 Robert Sneddon

Craig Cockburn

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May 1, 2006, 5:19:02 PM5/1/06
to
In message <1146494757.0...@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com>,
angus_...@hotmail.com writes
Some views on the festival here....

http://feeds.feedburner.com/siliconglen?m=99

--
Craig Cockburn ("coburn"). M.Sc., CITP,
Owner, http://www.siliconglen.com/
Home to the first online guide to Scotland, founded 1994.
Scottish blog, FAQ, weddings, website design, stop spam and more!

Message has been deleted

urchaidh

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May 2, 2006, 4:51:41 AM5/2/06
to
Mike Dickson wrote:
> urch...@gmail.com lifted high his right left and blew forth...
> Interesting. As Anne Widdecombe is happy to tell everyone that she has
> never 'horiziontally jogged' in her life

Well of course she's going to deny it, just look at the result of the
union; enough to turn anyone to celiabacy.

Message has been deleted

the_tattie_howker

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May 3, 2006, 8:29:13 AM5/3/06
to

Now **>if<** (emphasis for Ian) its one thing that bugs me about hip
hoppers, its they way they pretend they're making music.

And that's just part of what bugs me about the New Age Hippy drum
thing.

TTH

angus_...@hotmail.com

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May 3, 2006, 11:16:16 AM5/3/06
to
> > Unless you're into hip-hop, in which case it'd be 'ad eminem'.
>
> Now **>if<** (emphasis for Ian) its one thing that bugs me about hip
> hoppers, its they way they pretend they're making music.

Chasten thy ascerbic pen, Herr Howker -- there's hiphop, and there's
hiphop.

All this 'breeks aroond ma arse' gangster stuff (cf. "young men etc."
thread), that swirls around the charts no matter how hard you flush, is
but a mere gnat's chuff to the genre as a whole; quite simply, it is
but the most commercial successful, nothing more.

I challenge cynics to listen to RjD2's Smoke And Mirrors and say that,
while it is for the most part arranged and processed samples, they are
not processed and arranged in a way that is pleasing to the ear.

(Postscript: I am part-musician teetering on old fartdom; not some daft
youth in a beanie hat)

> And that's just part of what bugs me about the New Age Hippy drum
> thing.

New Age Hippy Hiphop? That'd be something.

Angus

Message has been deleted

Roland Watson

unread,
May 5, 2006, 10:00:45 AM5/5/06
to

More postmodern supermarket spirituality fumbling for relativistic meaning
whilst maintaining its hedonistic individualism.

The old school pagans would have offered up a few virgins to appease the
global warming gods. I guess the Council didn't sign off the human sacrifice
permits or they couldn't find enough virgins in Edinburgh.

Roland (grumpy old absolutist)

"Ian Johnston" <ian.g...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cCUlhtvFIYkV-pn2-k2Jzxsd27EEy@localhost...
> On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 17:43:45 UTC, Steve Glover
> <st...@fell.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> : This flame lights the torchbearers
> : and reveals the May Queen, the mother aspect of the triple goddess and
> : Queen of the Summer. Leading the Horned God and flanked by her White
> : Warrior Women and the mighty Processional drummers, the May Queen is
> : guided by the Blue Men, druidic spirit guides and her way is lit by the
> : torchbearers.
>
> Bloody hell, and I though Glastonbury was bad for silly New Age
> cobblers.
>
> Is there any romanticised Victorian myth from any part of the UK that
> hasn't been woven into this charade?
>
> Yours in tolerance,
>
> Ian
>
> PS Where does the money go? All 36,000 - 60,000 quid of it, depending
> on how mant mugs buy advance tickets...
>
> --
>


Kenneth Russell

unread,
May 26, 2006, 5:23:45 AM5/26/06
to
On 2006-05-05 15:00:45 +0100, "Roland Watson" <rol...@artesyncp.com> said:

> More postmodern supermarket spirituality fumbling for relativistic meaning
> whilst maintaining its hedonistic individualism.

And the problem with that is...?

Surely it's better to at least fumble for your own relativistic (aka
tolerant) meaning than to buy blindly by accident of birth into
off-the-shelf religion that uses fear and hate to brainwash you into
persecution of minorities (and majorities such as women) not to mention
genocide of weaker cultures that have the temerity to think differently.

People who use relativism as a dirty word almost always mean that they
have privileged access to The One Truth, which is not just unpleasantly
arrogant but very dangerous indeed!

M Holmes

unread,
May 26, 2006, 8:23:39 AM5/26/06
to
Kenneth Russell <kenru...@theworldsfinestdirectors.com> wrote:

> People who use relativism as a dirty word almost always mean that they
> have privileged access to The One Truth, which is not just unpleasantly
> arrogant but very dangerous indeed!

Mike Adams is a US prof who uses his website to bait feminists, liberals
and other scions of the politically correct pantheon. I was amused by
one exchange in the feedback pages where he accused fans of "The Vagina
Monologues" of supporting child-rape, so long as it was perpetrated by
lesbians (there's a scene where a woman reminisces of a sexual awakening
as a child where she was raped by a lesbian). During the exchange, one
of the VM apologists claimed that feminists found child-rape as
abhorrent as anyone else.

Professor Adams wryly welcomed her conversion from the world of
relativist morals and the discovery that there are some absolutes out
there.

For those interested in such PC-baiting he's at:

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/mikeadams/archive.shtml

I find him occasionally amusing but also sometimes tedious in
Bible-bashing homosexuals. What is amazing in reading his site though is
the sheer lunacy that's been implemented through PC in some US
universities. As one wag put it "It seems to me that at Brown U, the
lunatics have takeen over the asylum and are charging 20,000 per year to
share the experience."

FoFP

Gordon Hudson

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May 26, 2006, 11:28:58 AM5/26/06
to

"Kenneth Russell" <kenru...@theworldsfinestdirectors.com> wrote in message
news:2006052610240775249%kenrussell@theworldsfinestdirectorscom...

> On 2006-05-05 15:00:45 +0100, "Roland Watson" <rol...@artesyncp.com> said:
>
>> More postmodern supermarket spirituality fumbling for relativistic
>> meaning
>> whilst maintaining its hedonistic individualism.
>
> And the problem with that is...?
>
> Surely it's better to at least fumble for your own relativistic (aka
> tolerant) meaning than to buy blindly by accident of birth into
> off-the-shelf religion that uses fear and hate to brainwash you into
> persecution of minorities (and majorities such as women) not to mention
> genocide of weaker cultures that have the temerity to think differently.

Oh dear.
You should not say things like that about Muslims in public as you could get
in trouble for inciting racial hatred.

Kenneth Russell

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May 26, 2006, 2:08:35 PM5/26/06
to
On 2006-05-26 16:28:58 +0100, "Gordon Hudson"
<gor...@usenet3.hostroute.co.uk> said:

It describes Christians far more than Muslims (though they are often
equally nasty pieces of work). Islamic extremism is a recent phenomenon
and mostly a reaction to modern crusades by Bush and Blair (and their
earlier ilk). But Christians preaching hatred and inciting mass-murder
goes back countless centuries, and their persecution of gays today on
the basis of received 'truth' is pure evil. Possessed by the devil, the
lot of them!

And anyway, Muslims aren't a 'race', any more than Christians,
paedophiles, National Front members, or any other similar group. People
choose to be abusers, but can't choose their genetic heritage.

Roland Watson

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May 29, 2006, 10:49:43 AM5/29/06