Correct lighting..

[Sean Roth]

I am trying to tackle the lighting issue inside my car now.   When I open the doors with the key not in the ignition, what lights should I have on?

 

Also, in my car, the red door warning light on the dash comes on when the engine compartment is open.  Is that normal?

 

What activates the dome lights?   My immediate project is to get my dome lights to work. I don’t have any energy to the wires.

 

Thanks,

 

Sean

 

 

 

***Please do not reply if you are driving, I can wait until you are parked***

 

From: dmct...@googlegroups.com [mailto:dmct...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Rice
Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2013 2:54 PM
To: dmct...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [DMCToday] Door alignment proceedure

 

One of my doors is slightly out of alignment.  According to someone on another forum, this is a good proceedure for aligning doors.  I just thought I would post it here just in case the other forum goes down some day.  I'm in no rush to make my car perfect but I do want the information handy for whenever I get around to doing this.  Has anyone tried this?

 

1. Remove door strut
2. Pop door open
3. Remove striker pins
4. Remove outer door seals
5. Loosen door hinges
6. Apply small amount of oil above and below hinge bolts
7. Lower door slowly and let free fall last several inches (repeat free fall several times and close firmly by hand each time)
8. Tighten hinge nuts until just snug
9. Repeat #7
10. Repeat #8
11. Repeat #7 and # 8 until door hinge nuts show no movement then tighten each firmly
12. Lean against door and inspect alignment, repeat procedures #5, 7 and 8 if necessary
13. Set one striker pin at a time.
14. Striker pin adjusts in a rectangular box configuration: left/ right, up/down ( there are effectively six positions.)
15. Striker pin adjustment is trial and error but note you moves and result
16. Replace outer door seals flush and only barely above edge of fender. There is no need to slam doors.

NEVER DRIVE WITH DOOR OPEN, IT IS A SERVERE STRAIN ON DOOR AS WELL AS HINGE and causes misalignment"

 

-Steve Rice

Proudly banned from DMCTalk

#16510

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[Farrar Hudkins]

Sean,

No, the "door ajar" light should not come on when the engine cover is open.

It's too late for me to try to help you, besides which I'm too drowsy thanks to cold medicine, so I hope this circuit diagram helps. I'd start by checking the diodes, but that's only because I've had one of them go bad on my car. Every car is different...

Farrar Hudkins
#2613

[Sean Roth]

 

 

Thanks

 

 

 

***Please do not reply if you are driving, I can wait until you are parked***

 

--

[brobertson@carolina.net .]

-----Original Message-----
From: "Farrar Hudkins" [fhud...@gmail.com]
Date: 04/16/2013 09:50 PM
To: dmct...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [DMCToday] Correct lighting..

www.dmctoday.com--- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "dmctoday" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to dmctoday+u...@googlegroups.com.To post to this group, send email to dmct...@googlegroups.com.Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/dmctoday?hl=en.For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.

[brobertson@carolina.net .]

Throw the diodes away, especially if you're running incandescent bulbs in the courtesy lights. They suck several volts out of the circuit. Replacing the diodes with jumpers yields significantly brighter illumination. Note that the line to the door ajar indicator needs to be left off unless you replace its incandescent bulb with an LED bulb, otherwise you'll drain the battery backwards through the courtesy light grounds. (LED bulb is itself a diode which prevents that from happening).

Bill.

[Stephen Rice]

I'll try to make a YouTube video of how my lights are setup when I get off work today. One important thing to mention is that your dome lights wont work correctly if you replaced them with LEDs and still have your dimmer module in the relay compartment. Remove your dimmer module (its the white one) and your dome lights might start working.

Steve Rice
-Proudly banned from DMCTalk
#16510

[Sean Roth]

Even with the car off it will drain?

Sean

***Please do not reply if you are driving, I can wait until you are
parked***

-----Original Message-----
From: dmct...@googlegroups.com [mailto:dmct...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf

Of brobe...@carolina.net .
Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2013 12:50 AM
To: dmct...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [DMCToday] Correct lighting..

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[Sean Roth]

I just want to use regular bulbs. I don't plan on keeping the door opened
for any period of time at car shows or on display anywhere.

Thanks,

Sean Roth
Elite Texas Properties
Cell (678) 478-8432
Fax (866) 924-5585

***Please do not reply if you are driving, I can wait until you are
parked***


-----Original Message-----
From: dmct...@googlegroups.com [mailto:dmct...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Stephen Rice
Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2013 8:19 AM
To: dmct...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [DMCToday] Correct lighting..

[brobertson@carolina.net .]

I misspoke last night: it's not the constant grounds in the courtesy lights that will drain the battery without a diode to the dash indicator -- it's the constant feeds. Apologies. Courtesy lights are not keyed to either of the ignition switch relays (they are live all the time). Without a diode, current will flow backwards through the dash indicator bulb and ground itself through various other dash bulbs. That's the whole purpose of this diode: https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/541888_550530951658826_377793341_n.jpg (schematic makes it look like the diode is in/near the binnacle, but it's really one of the three footwell diodes).

If you replace the footwell diodes with jumpers, Red/Blue wire to the dash indicator must be left off. Unless of course you replace the incandescent indicator bulb with an LED bulb, which is itself a diode. Good news is that by virtue of being located in the lower outside corner the dash indicator bulb can be changed without removing the binnacle.

Bill.

[Stephen Rice]

As promised, here is a quick video showing how the courtesy lights work in a Delorean.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOWOVnnvfto&feature=youtu.be

-Steve Rice
Proudly banned from DMCTalk
#16510

[Farrar Hudkins]

And this is what happens with Dave McKeen's solid state module installed. (Note: my parcel shelf lighting has been modified.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4X-wnJIJ_0

Farrar Hudkins
#2613

[brobertson@carolina.net .]

The plunger wires Steve showed you are switched grounds. Each courtesy light has a Purple hot wire into it (hot all the time), then two grounds: one direct to the battery, one switched by the door plungers. At the fixtures themselves the grounds are Black (direct) and Purple/White (switched). Switched grounds change colors at the diodes before going off to each door plunger. Direct grounds allow you to turn the courtesy lights on while the doors are closed -- so called "map light" mode.

Front courtesy light wires go up the passenger A pillar then across the roof. They are quite accessible under the dash by the glovebox before disappearing inside the pillar.

Rear courtesy light wires pass through the relay compartment (part of that big bundle), then across the bottom of the rear window. Easiest way to access them is to pull the carpeted bulkhead out.

Once you understand how the courtesy light circuit works, and where the wires are accessible, you can have all sorts of fun modifying it:
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/385223_266955840016340_84748342_n.jpg
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/319943_266956406682950_1097101003_n.jpg

Bill.

[Stainless]

After watching Steve's video, and since I am unable to figure out what is going on with my interior lights, I also shot a video explaining my problem. Hopefully you can enlighten me as to what may be causing this behavior. Thanks!

Jared

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcwmNQmzX4w&list=UUM0vuwGyydFdvnhBY3bna0g&index=2

[stev...@gmail.com]

Steve is somewhere in Mexico right now so he can't take any pictures of his wiring for you.  My guess is something is wrong with the door plunger wiring.  Hopefully someone will chime in with a better answer than me.  

Have you looked at John Hervey's website lately?  Somewhere on his website there is a picture of how those dome lights are supposed to be connected.  

Also, are you using led bulbs or incandescently for your dome lights?  It looks like you are using incandescents but I thought I would ask.  LED lights are not compatible with the dimmer module.  If you are running LEDs remove your dimmer module from the relay compartment and see what happens.  Shoot, remove it even if you have incandescents and see what happens.  I believe Hervey has a picture of the module on his website as well.  

Boy do I miss my Delorean already.  It has ice cold AC and the place I'm staying at for the next two nights has zero air conditioning. It's hot down here.  Oh well, at least I'm only paying the equivalent of 12 USD a night.    

Steve Rice

Roughing it in Mexico

#16510

--

[Bill Robertson]

The courtesy light circuit can seem mysterious, but once you understand its basic principles it makes perfect sense.

First & foremost: each fixture has 3 wires:
- Purple: 12v into the fixture (from fuse #12)
- Black: ground direct (more or less) to the battery
- Purple/White: ground to the battery via the door plungers

The fixture has 3 positions:
- Centered: no wires are connected
- Flipped one way: Purple is connected to Black -- light comes on irrespective of doors
- Flipped other way: Purple is connected to Purple/White -- light comes on when a door is open (plunger out)

Purple goes on the side with only one terminal.
Black goes on the side with two terminals (doesn't matter which one)
Purple/White goes on the side with two terminals (doesn't matter which one)

Operationally it doesn't matter which way the fixture is inserted into it's hole, but for "map light" mode (light on with the doors closed) you do get better compartment illumination with the lens flipped towards you.

Where things get interesting is the three diodes right above the front frame wye in the driver's footwell. Diodes serve these purposes:
- One diode prevents the battery from draining backwards through the door ajar light/other instrument cluster bulbs
- One diode prevents the passenger door edge lights coming on when the driver's door is open
- One diode prevents the driver door edge lights coming on when the passenger door is open

These diodes commonly present two problems:
- They drop several volts under the best of circumstances, leading to dimmer bulb illumination
- They have been known to fail

I'm a big fan of throwing the diodes away (actually just removing them and saving them as spares for other diodes in the car) in favor of jumpers. Biggest advantage of doing this is instantly brighter courtesy lights. Note that unless you put an LED bulb in the door ajar light it will still need a diode, otherwise your battery will drain. LED bulbs are by design self contained diodes.

To diagnose the courtesy light circuit (you obviously can skip some of these steps)
- Verify 12v at the Purple wire in each fixture. If 12v is missing check for 12v in and out of Fuse #12. The Purple wire junction under the console is soldered together, so unless a PO has cut into the purple wires you should not have any continuity breaks between Fuse #12 and the fixtures.
- Verify continuity between the Black wire in each fixture and the battery
- Verify continuity between the Purple/White wire in each fixture and both door plungers -- Purple/Blue on the driver side and Purple/Pink on the passenger side. If either side is missing continuity it's time to play with the diodes (see below)
- Verify continuity between the Black wire at each door plunger and the battery

To check the diodes:
- Unplug all three diodes
- Female quick connect with two Purple/White wires is the line from the fixtures (and the delay module -- we'll get to that later)
- Female quick connect with Purple/White and Red/Blue wires is the line to the door ajar indicator (Purple/White wire is just a jumper from the quick connect above)
- Male quick connect with two Purple/Blue wires is the line out to the driver door plunger (and the driver door edge lights)
- Male quick connect with two Purple/Pink wires is the line out to the passenger door plunger (and the passenger door edge lights)
- Connect the female quick connect with two Purple/White wires to the male quick connect with two Purple/Blue wires. This completes the circuit from the fixtures to the driver door plunger. Courtesy lights should go on & off with the driver door plunger. If they do not go on & off with the driver door plunger bypass the plunger by connecting the Purple/Blue and Black wires at the plunger together with a jumper. The plungers are pretty crappy switches and do lose contact easily. If the circuit is working normally, plug one of the diodes back in between the female quick connect with two Purple/White wires and the male quick connect with two Purple/Blue wires and see if the circuit still works.
- Connect the female quick connect with two Purple/White wires to the male quick connect with two Purple/Pink wires. This completes the circuit from the fixtures to the passenger door plunger. Courtesy lights should go on & off with the passenger door plunger. If they do not go on & off with the passenger door plunger bypass the plunger by connecting the Purple/Pink and Black wires at the plunger together with a jumper. The plungers are pretty crappy switches and do lose contact easily. If the circuit is working normally, plug one of the diodes back in between the female quick connect with two Purple/White wires and the male quick connect with two Purple/Pink wires and see if the circuit still works.

If any of the above checks fail you know where your problem is.

Bill.

 

[Stainless]

Bill,

You win the prize for the best and most informative post on this topic. I sure miss you and Steve on the "other" forum. I could always count on very informative troubleshooting tips and ideas from the both of you.

I'll be back home next week to be able to start diagnosing this further. Until then, thank you.

[Bill Robertson]

History of the other forums:

DMCTalk:
- Sean Mullins originally put me on "moderated" status (every post had to be approved by him before updating). He did this to prevent me publicly posting something incriminating I learned about him.
- After Sean disappeared, Mike (the guy from Florida without a car) started taking forever to update my posts. Since Sean was gone, and I saw no need for moderated status anymore, I complained about it here: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?3539-Upgraded-and-Improved-Tail-Light-Boards&p=50017#post50017 -- boom, instant banishment. Were Mike and Sean secret homosexual lovers? What was Mike's dog in the fight?
- "Assipter" became the new moderator after Mike disappeared. I tried to make super secret accounts, but he and Mike Lund made it their personal mission to figure them out and delete them, not because I was posting anything controversial, but just because they could. Power trip? Personal vendetta? Don't get me to lying -- neither of them ever communicated anything directly to me, accounts just disappeared. Ron Pirkle was kind enough to eMail me who was doing it (but still no explanation why).

DML:
David Teitelbaum, Marc Levy, Harlold McElcraft, Arnie Brandon, et al have held a grudge against me for years because I refuse to kiss their rings as Grand Old Men of the hobby (I've owned my car since 2002, so I'm not exactly a whipper snapper myself). The New Jersey crowd were ass wholes the first time I met them in 2003. They've pitched pitched hissy fits for years, but the straw that broke the camel's back came when I pointed out that just because Rob Grady didn't wash away in Superstorm Sandy don't assume all Long Islanders were okay -- Louis Duet (a DMA member thank you very much) was homeless and I felt really bad for him. Start reading November 1 forward: http://www.projectvixen.com/dmcnews-archive/mail6.html Mike Greise sent me an eMail message that I was permabanned, and that was that.

I don't need ass wholes or people on power trips. My car runs, thank you very much. Just got back from a trip to Pennsylvania. Less than two weeks I will be driving to Indianapolis. The real irony is none of the DMCTalk moderators have a running car, if they even own a DeLorean at all. It's all an online ego trip, Ron Pirkle excepted (though his car still doesn't run).

Anyway, I am more than happy to help any way I can. Do you live anywhere between North Carolina and Indianapolis? I'll be passing through shortly and help you with your car in person. Ask anyone who's been to any gathering that Steve or I attended -- we're the guy's actually helping other owners with their cars while everyone else stands around pontificating and prevaricating.

Bill.

[Bill Robertson]

This accidentally got posted to the Brandon Barber thread (answered immediately following):

-----Original Message-----
From: rothsean@...
Date: 05/05/2013 11:40 AM
To: dmct...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: [DMCToday] Changing to LED lights

I want to put LED lights into my door running lights. 

Do I need to add a resistor or anything? Or do I just buy LED bulbs and swap?

Sean



LED bulbs are designed to be plug & play. They produce very pure color wavelengths, so you always want to match bulb color to your lens color (putting a white LED bulb behind a red lens for example yields dim illumination since the lens filters out most of the light produced). Also, not all LED elements are created equal. I have found that SMD elements produce the most lumens. Even at that, not all SMD's are created equal -- 5050's produce more lumens than other SMD's, largely because they actually have three circuits in each chip (a 3x3 array of nine 5050 SMD's actually has 27 light producing circuits).

Most people running LED bulbs in their door lights have bulbs with a circle of 5 hemispherical elements (significantly less lumens than SMD elements). This produces a so called "dot of light." I mitigated that somewhat by running bulbs with 9 hemispherical elements, which do make a larger dot of light, but still clearly circular in shape: https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/392407_267173789994545_1797256303_n.jpg

Going onto eBay to hyperlink an example of my bulbs, I just found these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251198702960
http://www.ebay.com/itm/261141336898
This style bulb was not available (on eBay at least) when I installed mine several years ago. Needless to say I placed a $10 order for a set before writing this message. I anticipate they will work even better than my current 9 element bulbs.

Bill.

[roth...@suddenlink.net]

How about LEDs?

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

---

From: Bill Robertson <brobe...@carolina.net>

Sender: dmct...@googlegroups.com

Date: Sun, 5 May 2013 12:03:44 -0700 (PDT)

To: <dmct...@googlegroups.com>

ReplyTo: dmct...@googlegroups.com

Subject: [DMCToday] Re: Correct lighting..

[Bill Robertson]

Those are LED bulbs (plug & play 194's in this case).

The challenge with the door edge lights is the shape of the rubber fixture. Fixture is very shallow, which pretty much rules out 194 bulbs with side firing elements (you wouldn't want those anyway because side firing elements would just get buried in the rubber, and the one useful element would be jammed up against the lens -- if the bulb fit at all). You want shallow bulbs with as many forward firing elements as possible.

If replacement fixtures weren't so expensive I'd buy a set, cut off the sockets, then adapt 3x3, or maybe even 4x4, 5050 SMD array's to them (the bulbs I just purchased have 1210 chips which unfortunately are only half as bright as 5050's -- at least they are ready to rumble, and being square should look better in the fixtures).

A neat trick to reduce "dot of light" syndrome is to flip the lens inside out -- diffuses the light much better.

Bill.

[Stephen Rice]

For what its worth I got my LED bulbs from Video Bob.  I think I paid abuot $20 for a set which included LEDs for the doors and instrument clusters.  I've been pleased with them but if you do install LEDs in the instument cluster make sure you don't install a LED for the battery indicator light.  You need an incandescant #162 bulb for the alternator circuit to work correctly. 

 

-Steve Rice

Somewhere in the Carribean

#16510

[dvonk]

On Sunday, May 5, 2013 2:03:44 PM UTC-5, Bill Robertson wrote:

...

Going onto eBay to hyperlink an example of my bulbs, I just found these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251198702960
http://www.ebay.com/itm/261141336898
This style bulb was not available (on eBay at least) when I installed mine several years ago. Needless to say I placed a $10 order for a set before writing this message. I anticipate they will work even better than my current 9 element bulbs.

Bill.

so did you get these square bulbs installed yet?  im curious to see how they look in the fixture compared to the hemispherical 'dot' LEDs.