DFDS-skibsforlis.
Flemming Damgaard Larsen
Omkring 1910-14 var der en af DFDS's passagerer-både til Amerika, der gik
ned ved Skotland.
Mine spørgsmål er:
1. Hvor findes der lister over de omkomne ?
2.Hvormange mennesker omkom ?
3.Hvor findes der noget skrevet om dette forlis ?
4. Hvor mere præcist ved Skotlasnd gik skibet ned og hvornår ?
Med venlig hilsen
Flemming Damgaard Larsen.
E-mail: ar...@ra.dk
http://www.netby.net/Centrum/Alle/Damgaard
B. G. D. Wennerström
Flemming Damgaard Larsen <ar...@ra.dk>
> Omkring 1910-14 var der en af DFDS's passagerer-både til Amerika, der gik
> ned ved Skotland.
>
> Mine spørgsmål er:
> 4. Hvor mere præcist ved Skotlasnd gik skibet ned og hvornår ?
På landsarkivet i Viborg har jeg søgt i _mikrokort_ over Danske søulykker,
jeg kan ikke huske hvem der udgiver de bøger, men de kommer hvert år.
Alternativ, ring til DFDS i København
Venlig hilsen Göran !
Ulrich Alster Klug
Der blev i sin tid i anledning af DFDSes 100 eller var det 125 års dag
udgivet en bog om samtlige skibe, som DFDS havde haft i løbet af rederiets
tid.
Der er fuld beskr. angående rutefart m.v. samt passagerstr. og meget andet
om skibene, samt mange billeder. -
Thingvalla gik ned, men det er vel ikke den, du tænker på?
Der var jo også skibe, som kom ud for ulykker, men blev repareret og kom i
fart igen.
I tilfælde af sø-ulykker, havari, afholdes søforhår ved, jeps, sø- og
handelsretten, men det sker vistnok i den havn, hvortil passagerer og
besætning og kaptajn ankommer (hvis han altså ikke går ned med skibet, som
han egentlig skal...., fordi skibet kun ejes af rederiet, indtil kaptajnen
går fra borde; derefter kan den, der bjærger skibet tage det i
besiddelse....).
Titanics søforhør blev jo også afholdt i New York, så vidt jeg ved, selvom
skibet var ejet af et engelsk rederi.
Der skulle vist findes passagerlister på LAK, men jeg kender desværre ikke
arkivfonden, for jeg har aldrig selv brugt disse lister.
Med venlig hilsen - Kind regards
Ulrich Alster Klug
HP: http://www.dannebroge.subnet.dk
http://www.dannebrog.subnet.dk
Flemming Damgaard Larsen skrev i meddelelsen ...
>Hej nyhedsgruppe.
>
>Omkring 1910-14 var der en af DFDS's passagerer-både til Amerika, der gik
>ned ved Skotland.
>
>Mine spørgsmål er:
>
>1. Hvor findes der lister over de omkomne ?
>2.Hvormange mennesker omkom ?
>3.Hvor findes der noget skrevet om dette forlis ?
>4. Hvor mere præcist ved Skotlasnd gik skibet ned og hvornår ?
>
Hans Mikkelsen
354 km V for Ydre Hebrider. Kan det være den ulykke? trods årstallet.
Hans Mikkelsen
Ole Kristensen
Flemming Damgaard Larsen skrev i meddelelsen ...
>Hej nyhedsgruppe.
>
>Omkring 1910-14 var der en af DFDS's passagerer-både til Amerika, der gik
>ned ved Skotland.
Halløjsa
Det er ikke mange oplysninger, du giver os Flemming !!.
Så prøv selv at snuse på følgende Link !.
http://www.ukdiving.co.uk/wreck.htm
Men Du finder vist ikke nogen passagerlister på denne Link !.
Hugge Hej i varmen
Ole Kristensen
Assens
Flemming Damgaard Larsen
Det vil jeg ikke udelukke.
Var det et DFDS-skib ?
Har du flere oplysninger om dette forlis.
Med venlig hilsen
Flemming Damgaard Larsen.
E-mail: ar...@ra.dk
http://www.netby.net/Centrum/Alle/Damgaard
Hans Mikkelsen skrev i meddelelsen <7mvuj0$l8e$1...@news.inet.tele.dk>...
Benny Skou Mortensen
Flemming Damgaard Larsen <ar...@ra.dk> skrev i en
nyhedsmeddelelse:hd%k3.554$dG2...@news.get2net.dk...
For nogle år siden læste jeg en bog om det pågældende forlis. Der var
overlevende, som i redningsbåd sejlede til Skotland. Andre endte på
Færøerne.
Jeg kan selvfølgelig ikke huske, hvad bogen hed, men jeg mener at Rockall
indgik i bogens navn (15 sømil fra Rockall - eller noget i den retning).
Det var et DFDS skib.
Mvh
Benny Skou Mortensen
John Thomsen
<ar...@ra.dk> wrote:
>Hej nyhedsgruppe.
>
>Omkring 1910-14 var der en af DFDS's passagerer-både til Amerika, der gik
>ned ved Skotland.
>
>Mine spørgsmål er:
>
>1. Hvor findes der lister over de omkomne ?
>2.Hvormange mennesker omkom ?
>3.Hvor findes der noget skrevet om dette forlis ?
>4. Hvor mere præcist ved Skotlasnd gik skibet ned og hvornår ?
>
Desværre er de fleste af DFDS' egne arkiver forlængst blevet
destrueret, delvis pga fejltagelser og egenrådige "lagerforvaltere",
men en ingeniør XX skulle være ved at skrive på en ny historisk
gennemgang af rederiet incl. forudgående fusioner, ikke mindst - som
vi kan have interesse i - Thingvalla-linien (både skibs- og
rederi-navn) og Dansk Amerika Linie.
Der skulle være et ret godt arkiv/bibliotek om civil søfart beliggende
på Blegdamsvej...
Bare et par spor....
John
Birgit Lundsmark
John Thomsen skrev i meddelelsen <37975d1d...@news.cybercity.dk>...
Ja, bilioteket på Blegdamsvej er alletiders, og personalet er meget
hjælpsom, der sidder 3 personer, du kan være heldig hvis der er billeder, så
scanner de dem ind på en diskette til dig, og ellers fotokopier.
De har samtidig et kæmpe udvalg af bøger om skibe/skibsfart, det er et sted
der bare ikke er særlig godt besøgt, brug det og deres personale, se er bare
så flinke, og ved hvad det drejer sig om.
Venlig hilsen
Birgit
lund...@vip.cybercity.dk
http://users.cybercity.dk/~bcc19853/
Ulrich Alster Klug
adresse + navnet på det????
Birgit Lundsmark
København Ø, desværre har jeg kun deres gamle tlf. 31 42 26 10, men når jeg
kommer derhen her i august måned, skal jeg spørge efter det nye.Ulrich Alster Klug skrev i meddelelsen <7njvdb$70e$3...@news.inet.tele.dk>...
Benny Skou Mortensen
Om DFDS's "Oslo", som sank i 1904 findes følgende på siden:
http://www.njscuba.com/isrg/wreck-info/messages/1331.html
Dear William,
The Det Forende D/S owned the Ss "Norge" at her time of sinking.
She was build in 1881 by the famous shipyard of Alexander Stephens & Sons at
their Linthouse Yard in Glasgow Scotland.
She was originale build for the Belgum Company of Theodore C. Engels & Co.
Allso nown as the "Engels Line" home port Antwerp.
She was called after a famous Flemish Freedomfighter(from the french
supresion) and national hero from the Middle Ages called "Pieter de Conink"
She was build from iron and was fitted with a 2 cylinder compound engine of
1400 ihp, with ,two DB- Scotch boilers , her dimensions were
,346,6x38,3x32,8 feet, 3359 BRT. Three mast and a single funnel.
Her lauchdate 11-6-1881
maiden voyage on the service from Antwerp-New York -Boston route 25-6-1881
On 27-2-1889 she was sold for 700.000 Francs to
A/s DAmpskibsselskabet Thingvalla from Kjobenhavn Denmark and renamed
"Norge"
On 11-9-1889 after extensive repeirs to hull and machinary in Antwerp in the
period 1-5-1889 to 28-8-1889 she left on her new service route from
Stettin-Copenhagen-Christiania-Christianssand-New York.
Om 10-10-1898 she was sold to the DFDS, Kjobenhavn
Service "Skandinavien-America Linien"
Route Stettin-Swinemunde-Copenhagen-Christiania-Christianssand-New York
5-10-1898 first voyageon the route.
Last voyage:22-6-1904
On voyage from Copenhagen to New York with 727 passengers and 68 crew
members she struck Rockall at 7.45 am in foggy weather. Her engines were
reversed and she came off the rocks but sank because of here severe damage
to bottom and bow.
582 passengers and 45 crew members drowned making it the worst Danish
disaster in her shipping history.
The trawler "Silvia" rescued 27 persons, SS "Cervona" 32 and 70 people were
saved when the captains boat was picked up by ss Energie.
wreckhound Holland
info from C. Hocking Disasters at sea .
DFDS 1866-1991 ship development through 125 years from paddle steamer to
Ro/Ro Ship.
Hvis der kan være tale om lidt "tidsforskydning", kan der evt. være tale om
dette forlis.
Der er i øvrigt skrevet en bog om dette forlis. Titlen husker jeg ikke.
Mvh
Benny
ben...@post2.tele.dk
John Thomsen <sir_...@vip.cybercity.dk> skrev i en
nyhedsmeddelelse:37975d1d...@news.cybercity.dk...
> On Sun, 18 Jul 1999 17:30:36 +0200, "Flemming Damgaard Larsen"
> <ar...@ra.dk> wrote:
>
> >Hej nyhedsgruppe.
> >
> >Omkring 1910-14 var der en af DFDS's passagerer-både til Amerika, der gik
> >ned ved Skotland.
> >
> >Mine spørgsmål er:
> >
> >1. Hvor findes der lister over de omkomne ?
> >2.Hvormange mennesker omkom ?
> >3.Hvor findes der noget skrevet om dette forlis ?
> >4. Hvor mere præcist ved Skotlasnd gik skibet ned og hvornår ?
> >
>
> Desværre er de fleste af DFDS' egne arkiver forlængst blevet
> destrueret, delvis pga fejltagelser og egenrådige "lagerforvaltere",
> men en ingeniør XX skulle være ved at skrive på en ny historisk
> gennemgang af rederiet incl. forudgående fusioner, ikke mindst - som
> vi kan have interesse i - Thingvalla-linien (både skibs- og
> rederi-navn) og Dansk Amerika Linie.
>
> Der skulle være et ret godt arkiv/bibliotek om civil søfart beliggende
> på Blegdamsvej...
>
TrygveGuttesen
iøvrigt
alt om skibe.Jeg tror det hedder Svendborg skibsregister og det er i det gamle
Fattighusmuseum i Svendborg.
Venlig hilsen Trygve Guttesen
Se iøvrigt på min hjemmeside Http://home3.inet.tele.dk/trgu Breve fra en
Sømand
John Thomsen skrev:
Ulrich Alster Klug
Det må jeg besøge en dag.
Med venlig hilsen - Kind regards
Ulrich Alster Klug
Birgit Lundsmark skrev i meddelelsen <7nk6e0$mp8$1...@news.cybercity.dk>...
Christine Armas
rakkened ned på alle andre, Araberer, de sorte, Russere, alle som ikke var
Danskere. Christine Armas
Christine Armas
til Kbhn i 1947 men jeg ved ikke mere hvad der skete med linien. Der er jo ikke
så mange linier tilbage, den Norske, den Hollandske og så den Engelske med det
er jo mere cruises. Venligst Christine Armas Melbourne Florida
tri...@bellsouth.net
Benny Skou Mortensen wrote:
John Thomsen
<tri...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Hvad skete der med Dansk Amerika Linien. Min Mor og rejste med Falstria f=
>ra NY
>til Kbhn i 1947 men jeg ved ikke mere hvad der skete med linien. Der er j=
>o ikke
>s=E5 mange linier tilbage, den Norske, den Hollandske og s=E5 den Engelsk=
>e med det
>er jo mere cruises. Venligst Christine Armas Melbourne Florida
>tri...@bellsouth.net
>
Dansk Amerika Linie blev så vidt jeg ved en del af DFDS - Det Forenede
Dampskibs Selskab - som igen ejes af J. Lauritzen koncernen der også
sejler med polar- og køleskibe.
Forud var gået en anden koncentration idet DAL var skabt over
Thingvalla, der både var et selskab og et enkelt skib med dette navn.
Navnet klinger islandsk og det gjorde deres andre skibe også. Geysir
og Gullfoss bl.a.
Sidst i 1800-årene var den danske amerika-sejlads ganske betydelig,
men i 1900-årene tabte den betydeligt terræn til først Norsk Amerika
Linie og siden Svenska Amerika Linjen (Kungsholm, Gripsholm og
Stockholm som stødte sammen med italienske Andrea Doria).
Derudover er en del af den danske USA-trafik i dette århundrede sket
på den polske amerika-linies skibe, som f.eks. Batory.
Peter H.
John Thomsen skrev i meddelelsen
>
>Dansk Amerika Linie blev så vidt jeg ved en del af DFDS - Det
Forenede
>Dampskibs Selskab - som igen ejes af J. Lauritzen koncernen der også
>sejler med polar- og køleskibe.
>
>Forud var gået en anden koncentration idet DAL var skabt over
>Thingvalla, der både var et selskab og et enkelt skib med dette navn.
>Navnet klinger islandsk og det gjorde deres andre skibe også. Geysir
>og Gullfoss bl.a.
>
Liners, bortset fra at rederiet hed Skandinavien-Amerika Linien. Det
blev skabt, da DFDS overtog Thingvalla Linien i 1898. Linien lukkede i
1935. Der medfulgte ved overtagelsen 4 skibe, hvis skæbne desværre
ikke nævnes i bogen. Noget tyder imidlertid på, at de i 1902-3 blev
erstattet af 3 nybygninger: Oscar II, Hellig Olav, United States og et
i 1904 indkøbt skib: C. F. Tietgen, som i 1913 blev udskiftet med
Frederik VIII. Disse skibe var i drift til 1931, Fr. VIII dog til
1935, hvor linien lukkede.
Iflg. samme værk var ØK involveret i Amerikafarten dels med egne
skibe, dels via Baltic American Line mellem Libau (Østpreussen) og New
York. men det var efter 1. hhv. 2. verdenskrig, så det er uinteressant
i denne sammenhæng.
--
M.v.h.
Peter Herstoft
John Thomsen
Beskrivelserne stammer fra en Emigrations-Ships-List jeg deltog i for
nogle år siden:
GEISER
The "Geiser" was an iron ship built in 1881 by Burmeister & Wain of
Copenhagen. Her dimensions were length 313ft x beam 39.2ft, 2831 gross
tons, one funnel, three masts, single screw, speed 11 knots.
Accommodation was provided for 50-1st, 50-2nd and 900-3rd class
passengers. She sailed on her maiden voyage from Copenhagen -
Christiana(Oslo) - Christiansand - New York on 10.1.1882. Sailed on
her last voyage on 12.7.1888. from Stettin -Copenhagen - Christiana -
Christiansand - NY when she was in collision when homeward bound with
the "Thingvalla" off Sable Island on 14.8.1888. The "Geiser" sank
within 5 minutes with the loss of 105 lives. [Posted to the
Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 8 August 1997]
-----
HEIMDAL
desværre p.t. ingen oplysninger, men vistnok (også) et skib i
Thingvalla-flåden og/eller SAL
----
HEKLA
The "Hekla" was the second vessel of that name as the first one
foundered in 1883. She was also an iron ship, built in 1884 by Scott &
Co. of Greenock. She was 3258 gross tons, length 330.2ft x beam
41.9ft, one funnel, three masts, single screw, speed 11 knots. There
was accommodation for 40-1st, 30-2nd and 800-3rd class passengers. She
made her maiden voyage on 14.5.1884 from Copenhagen - Christiana -
Christiansand - New York. She stayed on this service with occasional
calls at Stettin. On 27.5.1897 she collided with the "Mississippi" off
the Newfoundland banks and was slightly damaged. In 1898, the company
was taken over by the Scandinavian - American Line but they retained
her name and she was kept on the same service.In 1905 she was sold to
another Danish company and renamed "Eduard Regel", and in 1909 was
sold to a Russian company and renamed "Minsk". She was scrapped in
1910. [Posted to the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 8
August 1997]
-----
HELLIG OLAV
The "Hellig Olav" was a 10,085 ton vessel built in 1903 by A.Stephens
& sons at Glasgow for the Scandinavian - American Line of Denmark. Her
dimensions were 500.8ft x 58.3ft. and she had a straight stem, one
funnel and two masts. Twin screw and a speed of 15 knots. There was
accommodation for 130 1st, 140 2nd and 1,400 3rd class passengers. On
3.6.1903 she made her maiden voyage from Copenhagen - Christiania
(Oslo) - Christiansand -New York. In 1922 she was converted to cabin
and 3rd class only and in 1927 to cabin, tourist and 3rd class
accommodation. She continued on the same service until she was
scrapped at Blyth in 1934.. Her last voyage was on 6.9.1931 from
Copenhagen - Oslo - NY - Christiansand - Oslo - Copenhagen [Posted to
the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 11 & 30 July 1997]
----
ISLAND
endnu et Thingvalla-skib, men desværre ikke noget på det p.t.
-----
THINGVALLA
Thingvalla was build by danish warf Burmeister & Wain, Cph. and
launched October 1874 to "Dampskibsselskabet" (=Steamship comapny) for
their East Asia Lines. Originally rigged as a barque, later probably
as a barquetine... A model is placed on the Museum of Trade and Sea on
castle Kronborg (yes, Hamlet, Elsinore etc.) north of Copenhagen. On
14 August 1888, the outward (New York) bound Thingvalla collided with
the homeward (Copenhagen) bound Geiser. The Thingvalla was seriously
damaged (the Geiser sank, with the loss of 105 lives), but after
transferring her 455 passengers to the Hamburg American liner Wieland,
was able to proceed under her own steam to Halifax for repairs. After
being repaired she resumed service and continued to sail for the
Thingvalla Line, and its successor, the Scandinavian-American Line,
until she was sold in 1900. [Posted to the Emigration-Ships Mailing
List by John Thomsen - 20 June 1997]
-----
ESTONIA
The "Estonia" was built as the "Czar" for the Russian American Line by
Barclay, Curle & Co.Ltd, Glasgow in 1912. She was 6503 gross ton
vessel, length 425ft x beam 53.2ft, two funnels, two masts, twin screw
and a speed of 15 knots. There was accommodation for 30-1st, 260-2nd
and 1,086-3rd class passengers. Launched on 23/3/1912 as the "Czar"
for the Russian American Line, she was chartered to Cunard in 1917,
and in 1921 came under the control of the Baltic American Line who
renamed her "Estonia". She commenced her first voyage for this company
on 11/1/1921 when she left Glasgow for New York (arr.23/1, dep.1/2),
Danzig and Libau. On 23/2/1921 she sailed from Libau on her first
voyage to Danzig, Boston and New York. In Feb.1925 she was rebuilt to
carry 290-cabin class and 500-3rd class passengers and in March 1926
rebuilt again to accommodate 110-cabin, 180-tourist and 500-3rd class
passengers. On 31/1/1930 she left Danzig on her last trip to
Copenhagen, Halifax and New York and was then sold to the Gdynia
America Line of Poland who renamed her "Pulaski" and ran her on their
New York and South America services. She was scrapped at Blyth in
1949. [North Atlantic Seaway by N.R.P.Bonsor, vol.4, p1511] There is
an excellent photograph of this ship in North Atlantic Seaway, vol.4.
[Posted to the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 16 October
1997]
-----
FRANKLIN
The "Franklin" of 1871 was built by T.R.Oswald & Co, Sunderland for
the German company, Baltischer Lloyd. She was an 1,878 gross ton ship,
length 282ft x beam 36ft, clipper stem, one funnel, two masts, iron
construction, single screw and a speed of 11 knots. I don't have any
information on her passenger capacity. She was launched in June 1871
and commenced her maiden voyage from Stettin to Copenhagen and New
York on 8/8/1871. On 6/8/1874 she sailed on her last voyage from
Stettin to Copenhagen, Antwerp, New York(arr.15/7/1874) and Stettin.
She made a total of 14 round voyages on this service. In 1874 she was
sold to the Italian company, Rubattino of Genoa and renamed "Batavia".
On 23/11/1877 she was wrecked on Capy Shoals near Marseilles.There was
an earlier American vessel (1850) with the same name. [Posted to The
ShipsList by Ted Finch - 2 November 1997]
-----
JAN BREYDEL
The SS "Jan Breydel" was built by C. Mitchell & Co, Walker-on-Tyne in
1880 for the Engels Line of Belgium. She was a 3414 gross ton ship,
length 340ft x beam 40ft, one funnel, three masts [on which she
carried sails, barquentine rigged], iron construction, single screw
and a speed of 11 knots. I have no information on the number or class
of passengers carried. Launched in January 1880, she commenced her
maiden voyage from Newcastle to New York and back to Antwerp on
16/8/1880. On 25/9/1880 she started a joint service with the White
Cross Line between Antwerp and New York, until her last voyage started
on 19/7/1888. In September of that year she was sold to the Thingvalla
Line of Denmark, and renamed "Danmark". On 27/9/1888 she commenced her
first voyage for this company from Antwerp to New York and back to
Copenhagen and then commenced sailing between Copenhagen, Christiania
[Oslo], Christiansand, and New York. On 6/4/1889 she foundered at sea,
the crew and passengers being rescued by the Atlantic Transport Line
vessel "Missouri". There is a picture of this vessel under sail, in
"North Atlantic Seaway" Vol.3. p.994 by N.R.P.Bonsor. [Posted to the
Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 17 September 1997]
-----
KURSK
The "Kursk" was built by Barclay, Curle & Co. Glasgow in 1910 for the
Russian American Line. She was a 7,858 gross ton vessel, length 450ft
x beam 56.2ft, two funnels, two masts, twin screw and a speed of 15
knots. Accommodation for 120-1st, 178-2nd and 1,288-3rd and 4th class
passengers. Launched on 7/7/1910, she sailed from Libau on her maiden
voyage to New York on 2/11/1910. She commenced her last voyage from
Libau to Copenhagen, Halifax and New York on 7/7/1914 and was
transferred to the Glasgow - New York service on 5/11/1914. On
20/11/1914 she sailed on her first voyage from New York for Archangel
and in 1917 came under Cunard management under the British flag. In
1921 she went to the Baltic American Line and was renamed "Polonia"
and on 23/1/1921 sailed on her first voyage between Glasgow, New York,
Danzig and Libau. On 8/3/1921 she started her first voyage from Libau
to Danzig, Boston and New York and in September of that year was
refitted to carry 300-cabin and 500-3rd class passengers. In Oct.1927
she was further altered to carry 120-cabin, 180-tourist and 500-3rd
class passengers. On 31/10/1929 she commenced her last voyage from
Danzig to Copenhagen, Halifax and New York and in 1930 went to the
Polish Gdynia America Line. They used her from 11/4/1930 on their
Danzig -Copenhagen - Halifax - New York service and from 28/5/1930 on
the Gdynia -Copenhagen - Halifax - New York run. She commenced her
last voyage on this run on 2/5/1933 and was transferred to the
Constanza - - Haifa service until 1939 when she was scrapped in Italy.
.[Posted to the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 22
October 1997]
-----
LATVIA
The "Latvia" was built by Barclay, Curle & Co.Ltd, Glasgow in 1908 as
the "Russia" for the Russian American line. She was a 8,596 gross ton
vessel, length 475ft x beam 57.7ft, two funnels, four masts, twin
screw and a speed of 15 knots. Accommodation for 40-1st, 56-2nd and
1,626-3rd class passengers. She was launched on 19/3/1908 and after
running for this company between Libau and New York, was laid up at
Kronstadt in Aug.1914. In 1917 she was renamed "Rossija" and later
"Russ". In 1921 she went to the Baltic American line and was renamed
"Latvia". She commenced her first voyage for this company on 11/7/1921
when she left Libau for Danzig, Halifax and New York. In Aug.1921 she
was rebuilt to carry cabin class and 3rd class passengers only and on
7/2/1923 commenced her last voyage from Libau to Danzig, Copenhagen
and New York after making a total of nine round voyages on the
N.Atlantic run. She was sold to Osaka Shosen Kaisha of Japan in 1924
and renamed "Fuso Maru" and rebuilt with two masts. In 1938 her name
was respelt as "Huso Maru" and on 31/7/1944 she was torpedoed and sunk
off Luzon, Philippines by the US submarine "Steelhead". [North
Atlantic Seaway by N.R.P.Bonsor, vol 4, p.1512] .There is a photograph
of this ship as the "Russia" in North Atlantic Seaway, vol.3. [Posted
to the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 16 October 1997]
-----
LITUANIA
The "Lituania" was built by Barclay, Curle & Co.Ltd, Glasgow in 1915
as the "Czaritza" for the Russian American Line. She was a 6,598 gross
ton ship, length 440ft x beam 53.4ft, two funnels, two masts, twin
screw and a speed of 15 knots. There was accommodation for 30-1st,
242-2nd and 1,052-3rd class passengers. Launched on 14/2/1915, she ran
on the New York service for the Russian American Line and in 1917 came
under Cunard management, keeping the same name. In 1921 she went to
the Baltic American Line and was renamed "Lituania", commencing her
first voyage on 8/2/1921 when she sailed from Libau to Danzig,
Copenhagen, Boston and New York. In Dec.1924 she was rebuilt to carry
290-cabin and 500-3rd class passengers, and in Feb.1926 was rebuilt
again to accommodate 110-cabin, 180-tourist and 500-3rd class
passengers. On 19/2/1930 she commenced her last voyage from Danzig to
Copenhagen, Halifax and New York and was then sold to the Gdynia
America line of Poland who renamed her "Kosciuszko" and ran her
between Poland and New York and S.America. In 1940 she went to the
Polish Navy and was renamed "Gdynia" and in 1946 was taken over by the
British and named "Empire Helford". She was scrapped at Blyth in 1950.
[North Atlantic Seaway by N.R.P.Bonsor, vol.4,p.1512] There is a
photograph of this ship as the "Czaritza" in North Atlantic Seaway,
vol.3. [Posted to the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 16
October 1997]
-----
PILSUDSKI
The "Pilsudski" was a motorship built in 1934 by Cantieri Riuniti
dell' Adriatico, Monfalcone, Italy for the Gdynia America Line of
Poland. She was a 14,294 gross ton vessel, length 498.8ft x beam
70.8ft, two funnels, two masts, twin screw and a speed of 17 knots.
There was accommodation for 370-tourist class and 400-3rd class
passengers. Launched on 19/12/1934, she left Gdynia on her maiden
voyage to Copenhagen and New York on 15/9/1935. She commenced her last
voyage Gdynia - Copenhagen - Halifax - New York on 11/8/1939. At the
outbreak of war, she was converted to an Armed Merchant Cruiser, but
was sunk on 26/11/1939 near the mouth of the River Humber by a mine
laid by German destroyers, while on passage from the Tyne to
Australia. [North Atlantic Seaway by N.R.P.Bonsor, vol.4, p.1599]
There is an illustration of her sister ship "Batory" in NAS,
vol.4,p.1595. [Posted to the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted
Finch - 18 October 1997]
-----
NORGE desværre p.t. ingen oplysninger. Bemærk iøvrigt muligt flere
skibe med dette navn. Formentlig også i Thingvalla-flåden og/eller SAL
-----
STAVANGERFJORD
The "Stavangerfjord" was a well known vessel belonging to the
Norwegian American line. Built be Cammel Laird & Co, Birkenhead in
1917, she was a 12,977 gross ton vessel, length overall 553ft x beam
64.2ft, two funnels, two masts, twin screw and a speed of 16 knots.
Accommodation for 88-1st, 318-2nd, and 820-3rd class passengers.
Launched on 21/5/1917, she sailed on her maiden voyage from Birkenhead
on 29/4/1918 to New York, where she was laid up. On 11/9/1918 she
sailed from New York to Christiania [Oslo] and in October made her
first run from Christiania to Christiansand, Stavanger, Bergen and New
York. In 1924, she was converted to fuel oil and her accommodation
altered to carry cabin class and 3rd class passengers. In 1930 she was
rebuilt again to carry 147 cabin class, 207 tourist class and 820-3rd
class passengers. In 1938 she was modernised and on 9/12/1939
commenced her last voyage from New York to Bergen and Oslo where she
was laid up. In 1940 after the German invasion of Norway, she was used
as a depot ship and in 1945 was used as a troopship between Norway and
New York. In 1946 she was refitted to carry 122-1st, 222-cabin and
335-tourist class and on 31/5/1946 resumed the Oslo - Bergen - New
York service. On 9/12/1953 her rudder carried away in mid-Atlantic and
she was escorted to Oslo. In 1956, she was refitted and her tonnage
increased to 14,015 gross tons and accommodation altered to carry
66-1st, 184-cabin and 402-tourist class passengers. On 18/11/1963 she
left Oslo on her last voyage to Copenhagen, Stavanger, New York,
Bergen and Oslo. Scrapped in 1964 at Hong Kong. There is a photograph
of her in "North Atlantic Seaway" Vol.4. p1436 by N.R.P.Bonsor.
[Posted to the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch -10
September 1997]
-----
UNITED STATES (2)
The "United States" belonged to the Danish "Scandinavian American
Line". She was a 10,095 gross ton liner built in 1903 by A.Stephens
and sons at Glasgow. Her dimensions were 500.8ft x 58.3ft. one funnel,
two masts, twin screw, 14 knots. There was accommodation for 130 1st,
140 2nd, and 1400 3rd class passengers. She sailed between Copenhagen
- Christiana (Oslo) - Christiansand - New York. In 1922 she was
converted to carry cabin class passengers instead of first and second
class, and in 1928 converted again for cabin, tourist, and third class
passengers. In 1934 she was laid up due to the depression and
subsequent lack of trade, and in 1935 was seriously damaged by fire at
Copenhagen, sold to shipbreakers and scrapped at Leghorn. [Posted to
the Emigration-Ships Mailing List by Ted Finch - 8 July 1997]
-----
Arne Feldborg
06:30:28 GMT i <37c9b3e3...@news.cybercity.dk>:
>Her er lidt om nogle emigrantskibe med en vis relation til Danmark.
>Beskrivelserne stammer fra en Emigrations-Ships-List jeg deltog i for
>nogle år siden:
>
Ved du - eller andre her - tilfældigvis noget om, hvilken rute /
forbindelse der typisk blev brugt af personer der (u)heldigvis
ikke nåede at få bilet til Titanic,?
To af mine slægtninge var i den situation, og rejste derfor
allerede i marts måned - samme år.
--
mvh, A:\Feldborg
Lokalsamfund mv.: http://www.haunstrup.dk/
ISDN telefon OSS: http://www.haunstrup.dk/feldborg/isdn/
John Thomsen
Feldborg) wrote:
>sir_...@vip.cybercity.dk (John Thomsen) skrev Tue, 31 Aug 1999
>06:30:28 GMT i <37c9b3e3...@news.cybercity.dk>:
>
>>Her er lidt om nogle emigrantskibe med en vis relation til Danmark.
>>Beskrivelserne stammer fra en Emigrations-Ships-List jeg deltog i for
>>nogle år siden:
>>
>Ved du - eller andre her - tilfældigvis noget om, hvilken rute /
>forbindelse der typisk blev brugt af personer der (u)heldigvis
>ikke nåede at få bilet til Titanic,?
>
>To af mine slægtninge var i den situation, og rejste derfor
>allerede i marts måned - samme år.
Som du måske husker, stod Titanic ud fra Liverpool, og det var ganske
typisk, bl.a. fordi et par af de store rederier også var hjemmehørende
dér. Det var også ganske praktisk fordi eksempelvis irerne udgjorde en
helt pæn andel af emigrationen.
For danskere (og andre skandinaver) var det nogenlunde almindeligt at
sejle til Hull i England (med flere mindre skibe) og så videre med
jernbanen tværs over til Liverpool. Det "hjalp" også lidt på den
samlede udgift, da det jo naturligt nok var Atlanterhavs-billetten der
var den dyre del.
Men det jeg tidligere beskæftigede mig med var altså den mere direkte
trafik, hvor danske (og skandinaviske) skibe også havde en vis
betydning. Vi ser der nogle nydelige "broderier" på land- eller
vandkortet med skibe der starter i Polen eller Østpommern og så
anløber København, Göteborg, Oslo, Kristiansand og evt. Bergen inden
de stikker rigtigt til søs. Og i den anden ende også kan anløbe f.eks.
både Halifax på New Foundland og eksemplevis Boston for så siden at nå
New York og Ellis Island.
Ser du i den danske Emigrationsdatabase, så er der i perioden
1868-1903, mellem de ca. 300.000 registrerede hen ved 75.000
svenskere, og det må jo betyde at de har brugt Danmark som springbræt
enten til det næste i England eller til den direkte tur. Der er også
en hel del nordmænd, selv om der ret tidligt var en betydelig trafik
fra navnlig Bergen og direkte over.
Jeg har ikke nogen "dokumentation" for alt dette, men skylder det en
række indtryk jeg har fra diverse diskussionsfora om emnet.
Men det kunne da være interessant - for flere? - at få belyst
trafikken yderligere....?
John
Christine Armas
Stavangefjord, dog er jeg ikke sikker på om det var 62 eller 63, og jeg
mener det var begge veje. På det tidspunkt rejste jeg hjem til Dk næsten
hver sommer, med Stavangerfjord, Bergensfjord og Oslofjord. De to
sidstnævnte havde noget som var meningen at skulle forhindre søgang, som
man kalder det, det virkede bare ikke syntes jeg. Selv om at de var meget
mere moderne of bekvemme, altså Bergensfjord og Oslofjord, så syntes vi
at Stavangerfjord var både morsommere og kønnere, der var den flotteste
gammeldavs træ trappe i midten som, såvidt jeg husker, mellem hvor
spisesalonen og de størrere af andre salonerner, såsom alle kontorer og
lille læsesalon osv. var. Vi havde ikke privat bad, med jeg var ung og
ligeglad dengang. Også var kahytterne små men jeg var ligeglad med det
siden jeg jo tilbragte lidt tid iseng. I baderummerne var der både frisk
og saltvand til at bade. Men i sammeligning med "LOVEBOAT", så var disse
rejser meget småt med organiseret underholdning, vi havde dog bingo og
filmet hesteløb, når der var søgang så vi ikke kunne danse, der var også
et orkester, men ikke mange timer. Og med hensyn til måltiderne, der var
sandelig ikke nogen luksus der, ihjertfald ikke for os i turistklasse. Der
var ingen midnat snacks, vi fik mad fra sømændene, i deret lokaler. Når vi
prøvede at danse på dækkene sent, med transister radioer altså, så blev vi
spulede ned og væk af officerene, ihvertfald af de mere sadistiske. Jeg
har også sejlede på Stockholm, på den sidste rejse inden dens uheldige
ram på Andrea Doria. Såvidt jeg husker, så sejlede Stockholm aldrig
derefter på Svenske Amerika linien, jeg mener den blev soldt til
Tyskland. .
Christine Armas
Halifax, som jo ikke så ud af noget, en lille havn, en lille by,
tilsydenladende, og hvorfor har jeg aldrig fundet ud af hvorfor, andet at
måske det var for at tage proviat ombord.
John Thomsen wrote:
> On Tue, 31 Aug 1999 07:27:19 GMT, feld...@haunstrup.dk (Arne
> Feldborg) wrote:
>
> >sir_...@vip.cybercity.dk (John Thomsen) skrev Tue, 31 Aug 1999
> >06:30:28 GMT i <37c9b3e3...@news.cybercity.dk>:
> >
> >>Her er lidt om nogle emigrantskibe med en vis relation til Danmark.
> >>Beskrivelserne stammer fra en Emigrations-Ships-List jeg deltog i for
> >>nogle år siden:
> >>
Peter H.
Christine Armas skrev i meddelelsen
<37D69428...@bellsouth.net>...
>Jeg var faktisk også overræsket over at vi stoppede, med Stockholm, i
>Halifax, som jo ikke så ud af noget, en lille havn, en lille by,
>tilsydenladende, og hvorfor har jeg aldrig fundet ud af hvorfor ...
Mon ikke det var for at afsætte emigranter, der ville til Canada, så
de ikke behøvede at komme til USA først? (Måske var
indrejseformaliteterne ikke så strikse i Canada.)
Desuden ligger det på vejen. Halifax ligger nemlig på Nova Scotia (-
selvom jeg må indrømme, at jeg ofte selv tager fejl).
--
M.v.h.
Peter Herstoft
Christine Armas
vi stoppede der. Det var mest det der forundrede mig, der var
tilsydenladende ingen grund til at stoppe et sted hvor der intet var. Men
måske hentede vi nogle som skulle hjem til Sverige eller resten af Skan.
trille