Pylons vs. Django

[Feross]

Hey everyone,

I'm a new Python user and I'm looking for a web development framework to build a database-driven website. I've looked at the various Python web frameworks out there and I've settled on either Django or Pylons, but I'm not sure which to choose.

Things I've heard about Django that I like:

- All the Django documentation is in one place.

- The community is larger = more help for newbies.

- It has a handy admin interface for adding content quickly.

Things I've heard about Pylons that I like:

- It's easier to customize and swap components in and out. 

- It uses SQLAlchemy out of the box. (I've never used it, but I hear that it's better than Django's ORM)

- It uses Mako out of the box. (Again, I've never used it, but I hear that it's better than Django's templating system).

I'm not sure how important SQLAlchemy and Mako support is, so I'd like to hear opinions from some more experienced Python and Django users.

Thanks,

Feross

[Juan Hernandez]

Well, just by using SQLAlchemy makes this framework worth a try

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[Feross]

SQLAlchemy is that hard to use? I've only heard good things about it... In any case, I'm giving Django a shot right now. I'm still curious to hear some opinions about Pylons vs. Django.

Feross

On Sun, Sep 5, 2010 at 2:18 PM, Feross Aboukhadijeh <fer...@stanford.edu> wrote:

SQLAlchemy is that hard to use? I've only heard good things about it... In any case, I'm giving Django a shot right now. I'm still curious to hear some opinions about Pylons vs. Django.

Feross

[Juan Hernandez]

On Sun, Sep 5, 2010 at 4:49 PM, Feross <fer...@gmail.com> wrote:

SQLAlchemy is that hard to use? I've only heard good things about it... In any case, I'm giving Django a shot right now. I'm still curious to hear some opinions about Pylons vs. Django.

The main difference between SQLAlchemy and Django's ORM is that Django's ORM is fully integrated within a web development framework. Let's say that you want to have a model that will include an email address, it would me something like this:

email = models.EmailField(xxxx)

By having that said in the model, you can inherit that into a form that will automatically verify whether the data you are trying to enter is a valid email address whereas SQLAlchemy is just an ORM, 

SQLAlchemy is just an ORM (well, ORM is just one part of what it really is) and it is probably the most powerful ORM in the market now. You can do very complex data handling and exchange with a very stable persistence layer that will give you a lot of power

This is a huge topic and those differences must be studied. Whether you want a fully capable web framework or if your data processing is very complex is up to you, your app and your skills

Hope that helps

Juan

[Feross]

Juan,

Thanks for the reply - that's good to know. I think Django is best for me right now.

Feross

--

[Steven Elliott Jr]

You can use sqlalchemy with django too

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[bruno desthuilliers]

A few points:

* It's as easy to swap components in Django as it is with Pylons. The
main difference is that Django components are well integrated in the
framework so 1/ you don't have much to do to use them and 2/ you loose
some very usefull features - that just don't exist OOTB in Pylons - if
you don't use them.

* SQLAlchemy is possibly the most feature-complete, comprehensive and
powerful "SQL layer" (much more than just "an ORM" ) ever written. Now
this comes with a price : complexity and learning curve. That's what
I'd choose for a truely complex and critical RDBMs based app, but
definitly NOT for most web apps.

As an experienced Python and web developper, while I do think Pylons
is possibly one of the most flexible and powerful web frameworks
around, I still prefer Django for it's level of integration and ease
of use. I've been using Django since the 0.96 days, and I'm still
waiting for a project I'd rather do with Pylons.


My 2 cents...

[Martin Chiteri]

Hi,

I understand that you can use whatever templating engine you so wish
with django, so if you feel that Mako or Genshi is better for you, you
can plug them into django and start using them. It might help to know
that Guido Van Rossum actually prefers django templates :)

Regards,
Martin.

[Sandro Dutra]

1. It's possible to use Mako and SQLAlchemy with Django too, as Steven writes.

2. As Bruno writes, Django it's a easy-learn piece of software and Pylons uses third-party software (and 2 powerfull ones), so, to extract the full power of Pylons you've a major learning curve, while Django is sit and start write for most simple kinds of webapps.

3. At the end, it's a personal choice, you've to try the 2 options by yourself and choose that one you fell confortable with. It's complicated to say what's is suitable for you based on my point of view, but if you want simplicity and fast learning, try Django, if you want the power of a huge template system and complex database relations, try Pylons. If you've time, try 2.

I think Django is sufficient to most web projects.

2010/9/6 bruno desthuilliers <bruno.des...@gmail.com>