VIPER:bad result
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gabriele
Apr 11, 2012, 2:49:48 AM4/11/12
to DIVA for Rhino
Hi, I made two simple model: the first is a close box, the second is
the same box with a window
the model should be well done: the window is a surface coincident
with one of the faces of the box
The problem is that if I run the simulation(inner temperature) I
obtain the same result in both the models (the graphic are coincident)
It is like if I don't have put the window.
Why?
I'm sure that viper considers the window because in the first model in
the message of say:no windows were included and in the other one
don't say this
best regards
the same box with a window
the model should be well done: the window is a surface coincident
with one of the faces of the box
The problem is that if I run the simulation(inner temperature) I
obtain the same result in both the models (the graphic are coincident)
It is like if I don't have put the window.
Why?
I'm sure that viper considers the window because in the first model in
the message of say:no windows were included and in the other one
don't say this
best regards
Jon Sargent
Apr 11, 2012, 8:35:21 AM4/11/12
to diva-fo...@googlegroups.com
Hi Gabriele,
Viper automatically assumes an HVAC system with heating and cooling set points of 21 and 24 degrees C during occupied hours. So, as long as the HVAC system can handle the loads, the interior temperature should be somewhat constant (regardless of whether there's a window). If you you'd like to change the thermostat settings, I can tell you how.
Best,
Jon
Viper automatically assumes an HVAC system with heating and cooling set points of 21 and 24 degrees C during occupied hours. So, as long as the HVAC system can handle the loads, the interior temperature should be somewhat constant (regardless of whether there's a window). If you you'd like to change the thermostat settings, I can tell you how.
Best,
Jon
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gabriele
Apr 11, 2012, 9:14:22 AM4/11/12
to DIVA for Rhino
thank you very much, this is ok and i would like to know how change
this range, but i'm analizing the night behaviour and it is impossible
that we have the same temperature losing during the night in both the
models.
can be a problem related to the material? can depend on the normal at
the surfaces?
best regards and thank you very much for your answer
On 11 Apr, 14:35, Jon Sargent <j.a.sarg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Gabriele,
>
> Viper automatically assumes an HVAC system with heating and cooling set
> points of 21 and 24 degrees C during occupied hours. So, as long as the
> HVAC system can handle the loads, the interior temperature should be
> somewhat constant (regardless of whether there's a window). If you you'd
> like to change the thermostat settings, I can tell you how.
>
> Best,
>
> Jon
>
this range, but i'm analizing the night behaviour and it is impossible
that we have the same temperature losing during the night in both the
models.
can be a problem related to the material? can depend on the normal at
the surfaces?
best regards and thank you very much for your answer
On 11 Apr, 14:35, Jon Sargent <j.a.sarg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Gabriele,
>
> Viper automatically assumes an HVAC system with heating and cooling set
> points of 21 and 24 degrees C during occupied hours. So, as long as the
> HVAC system can handle the loads, the interior temperature should be
> somewhat constant (regardless of whether there's a window). If you you'd
> like to change the thermostat settings, I can tell you how.
>
> Best,
>
> Jon
>
Jon Sargent
Apr 11, 2012, 9:33:44 AM4/11/12
to diva-fo...@googlegroups.com
Hmmm, yes, I would expect some difference at night. Can you send me your file, as well as the two IDFs you generated (with the window and without)? I'll have a look this evening.
Jon
gabriele
Apr 11, 2012, 9:40:17 AM4/11/12
to DIVA for Rhino
Hi Jon, can you give me your e-mail or otherwise say me how to upload
my files?
thank you very much
On 11 Apr, 15:33, Jon Sargent <j.a.sarg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hmmm, yes, I would expect some difference at night. Can you send me your file, as well as the two IDFs you generated (with the window and without)? I'll have a look this evening.
>
> Jon
>
my files?
thank you very much
On 11 Apr, 15:33, Jon Sargent <j.a.sarg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hmmm, yes, I would expect some difference at night. Can you send me your file, as well as the two IDFs you generated (with the window and without)? I'll have a look this evening.
>
> Jon
>
gabriele
Apr 11, 2012, 9:41:34 AM4/11/12
to DIVA for Rhino
hi Jon can you give me your e-mail or otherwise say me how can I
> Hmmm, yes, I would expect some difference at night. Can you send me your file, as well as the two IDFs you generated (with the window and without)? I'll have a look this evening.
>
> Jon
>
>
> Jon
>
gabriele
Apr 11, 2012, 9:43:49 AM4/11/12
to DIVA for Rhino
hi Jon, can you give me your e-mail, or otherwise can you explain me
how to upload the files?
how to upload the files?
> Hmmm, yes, I would expect some difference at night. Can you send me your file, as well as the two IDFs you generated (with the window and without)? I'll have a look this evening.
>
> Jon
>
>
> Jon
>
gabriele
Apr 11, 2012, 12:57:52 PM4/11/12
to DIVA for Rhino
Hi Jon I Found the way to upload the files
http://www.2shared.com/file/UFJNksFI/for_Jon.html
I made the analysis in the winter extreme day,
thank you for your help
http://www.2shared.com/file/UFJNksFI/for_Jon.html
I made the analysis in the winter extreme day,
thank you for your help
Jon Sargent
Apr 11, 2012, 9:23:36 PM4/11/12
to diva-fo...@googlegroups.com
Hi Gabriele,
Looking at the error file I can see the problem right away:
** Severe ** GetSurfaceData: Some Outward Facing angles of subsurfaces differ significantly from base surface.
** ~~~ ** ...use Output:Diagnostics,DisplayExtraWarnings; to show more details on individual surfaces.
This is saying the window is pointing the wrong way, so it isn't behaving properly. This isn't your fault -- Viper had a bug in version 1.901 where the window normal would occasionally get flipped. I fixed it (I think) in version 1.902, which is posted here:
http://www.grasshopper3d.com/group/diva-for-rhino/forum/topics/diva-for-gh-revision-1-902
Upgrade to the new gha file, and let me know if that solves it...
Best,
Jon
Looking at the error file I can see the problem right away:
** Severe ** GetSurfaceData: Some Outward Facing angles of subsurfaces differ significantly from base surface.
** ~~~ ** ...use Output:Diagnostics,DisplayExtraWarnings; to show more details on individual surfaces.
This is saying the window is pointing the wrong way, so it isn't behaving properly. This isn't your fault -- Viper had a bug in version 1.901 where the window normal would occasionally get flipped. I fixed it (I think) in version 1.902, which is posted here:
http://www.grasshopper3d.com/group/diva-for-rhino/forum/topics/diva-for-gh-revision-1-902
Upgrade to the new gha file, and let me know if that solves it...
Best,
Jon
gabriele
Apr 12, 2012, 5:22:38 AM4/12/12
to DIVA for Rhino
Hi Jon thank you for your professionalism, the new version works but
made the same problem of before
let me know if is it possible solve the problem in other way, maybe
changing the model
thank you so much and let me know
made the same problem of before
let me know if is it possible solve the problem in other way, maybe
changing the model
thank you so much and let me know
> Looking at the error file I can see the problem right away:
>
> ** Severe ** GetSurfaceData: Some Outward Facing angles of subsurfaces
> differ significantly from base surface.
> ** ~~~ ** ...use Output:Diagnostics,DisplayExtraWarnings; to show
> more details on individual surfaces.
>
> This is saying the window is pointing the wrong way, so it isn't behaving
> properly. This isn't your fault -- Viper had a bug in version 1.901 where
> the window normal would occasionally get flipped. I fixed it (I think) in
> version 1.902, which is posted here:
>
> http://www.grasshopper3d.com/group/diva-for-rhino/forum/topics/diva-f...
>
> ** Severe ** GetSurfaceData: Some Outward Facing angles of subsurfaces
> differ significantly from base surface.
> ** ~~~ ** ...use Output:Diagnostics,DisplayExtraWarnings; to show
> more details on individual surfaces.
>
> This is saying the window is pointing the wrong way, so it isn't behaving
> properly. This isn't your fault -- Viper had a bug in version 1.901 where
> the window normal would occasionally get flipped. I fixed it (I think) in
> version 1.902, which is posted here:
>
>
> Upgrade to the new gha file, and let me know if that solves it...
>
> Best,
>
> Jon
>
> Upgrade to the new gha file, and let me know if that solves it...
>
> Best,
>
> Jon
>
Jon Sargent
Apr 12, 2012, 8:38:57 AM4/12/12
to diva-fo...@googlegroups.com
Hi Gabriele,
This is strange. I ran your model using v1.902 and the same weather file (Perugia) and I'm not having the same problem.
As you can see from the attached screenshot, EnergyPlus gives no severe warnings, and the hourly temperature data do indeed look different with and without the window.
Are you sure you replaced the old gha in the Rhinoceros 4.0\Plug-ins\Grasshopper\Components folder, and then restarted Rhino?
Jon
This is strange. I ran your model using v1.902 and the same weather file (Perugia) and I'm not having the same problem.
As you can see from the attached screenshot, EnergyPlus gives no severe warnings, and the hourly temperature data do indeed look different with and without the window.
Are you sure you replaced the old gha in the Rhinoceros 4.0\Plug-ins\Grasshopper\Components folder, and then restarted Rhino?
Jon
gabriele
Apr 12, 2012, 9:02:26 AM4/12/12
to DIVA for Rhino
Hi Jon, maybe i didn't install the new version well: I just drag and
drop into grasshopper the gha file and after i chose replace all, is
it the right procedure?
Anyway i think that also the results that you have obtained are not
realistic too (maybe is a problem of the model that I made): for my
opinion is it not realistic that when you stop the heating system the
curve that describe the temperature losing is the same in both the
model isn't it? i mean that the thin glass let exit more heat than the
walls.
I want to point out that these are comments that i make to an
excellent software, with very very very great potentiality and i think
that in few months it could became the best in the market.
let me know
thank you again
gabriele
> progetto_screenshot.jpg
> 841KVisualizzaScarica
drop into grasshopper the gha file and after i chose replace all, is
it the right procedure?
Anyway i think that also the results that you have obtained are not
realistic too (maybe is a problem of the model that I made): for my
opinion is it not realistic that when you stop the heating system the
curve that describe the temperature losing is the same in both the
model isn't it? i mean that the thin glass let exit more heat than the
walls.
I want to point out that these are comments that i make to an
excellent software, with very very very great potentiality and i think
that in few months it could became the best in the market.
let me know
thank you again
gabriele
> This is strange. I ran your model using v1.902 and the same weather file
> (Perugia) and I'm not having the same problem.
>
> As you can see from the attached screenshot, EnergyPlus gives no severe
> warnings, and the hourly temperature data do indeed look different with and
> without the window.
>
> Are you sure you replaced the old gha in the Rhinoceros
> 4.0\Plug-ins\Grasshopper\Components folder, and then restarted Rhino?
>
> Jon
>
> (Perugia) and I'm not having the same problem.
>
> As you can see from the attached screenshot, EnergyPlus gives no severe
> warnings, and the hourly temperature data do indeed look different with and
> without the window.
>
> Are you sure you replaced the old gha in the Rhinoceros
> 4.0\Plug-ins\Grasshopper\Components folder, and then restarted Rhino?
>
> Jon
>
> 841KVisualizzaScarica
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