Towing Powerfab 125 WTD

[disasterix]

Hi,
New to this group and to Powerfab diggers.
Can anyone explain, or preferably send me a pic, of how the tow hitch
configures. I can't work it out and the instruction manual doesn't
explain it in terms I understand.
Also, can anyone confirm that the swapping of the wheels, powered
front for unpowered back, is not possible with the 125WTD because of
the different sizes of the box section axles, so that the powered
wheels and motors have to be carried separately, or is mine just
different?
Thanks.

[JohnD]

Hi,

My guess is that you are missing some of the stickers and plates on
the machine.

1/. There is no need to swap the axles.
There should be two thumb wheels on the hydraulic lines of the driven
axles
(two per side). These originally had stickers indicating the positions
for towing
and driving (they basically bypass the rest of the hydraulic system).
Thus all you
do to tow is turn them clockwise for driving and anticlockwise for
towing.
It's important that you get this right on any hydraulic drive motors
as you can nerf
up your hydraulics if you pump fluid back through the system with the
motors.

2/. Towbar.
There should be (or was) a plate on the right hand side near the seat
showing how
to arrange the boom, outriggers and the towbar for towing. The towbar
is easy just
pull out the pin holding it up, lower it and reinsert the pin in the
outer link
arrangement that drops down over the towbar arm. The geometry is
arranged
to take care of itself. The boom is a bit more complicated and needs
care. The original
equipment seems to have been an arrangement of chains, clamps and
shackles but this is
missing on my machine. Basically this is supposes to strap the boom
and dipper up
pulling against the outriggers so that the outriggers can fall down
and the boom
cant move sideways, down or out.

Dont forget that the towing wheels need to be road legal! They are
great chunky
things (Terra tyres) on mine - which I believe are not.

That's a bit long winded. Assuming that your email address is a...
etc I will attempt
to forward a photo of the diagram on the plate.

JohnD

[a...@uk2.net]

Hi John,
Thanks for the reply.
Would appreciate a pic of the tow hitch diagram if you can forward it to my Email, I just can't make it out, although with your description, I'll try again tomorrow.

The issue about the wheels is rather more complicated. Even if the tyres are road legal, (mine are large and nobbly and are road legal to 20mph), the wheel motors, even when disengaged by moving the levers as you suggest, must not be run at more than 30 to 35mph max as they are piston motors and (according to Charles Miller at Powerfab.co.uk) have been known to seize or explode (!) at higher speeds. It is also illegal to tow a trailer without suspension at speeds greater than 20mph. I want to tow my Powerfab to France and would need to get to the lagal maximum for a car and trailer to make the journey bearable.
The 125 WT does, I think, have interchangeable axles but the WTD has a 75mm box section axle on the driven wheels and only 60mm at the other end, so you see my problem.
I'm probably able to fabricate something to make the wheels interchangeable but though I'd check first with those more experienced than I.

Any more information on strapping the boom, dipper and outriggers would be appreciated too as there's nothing to hint on how to do it on my machine.
Its clearly had, not only a long life, but a hard one too.  Lots of welding repairs and wear in pins and bushes. I'm spending quite a lot of time (and soon probably money) on repairs to make a good machine of it.
Thanks again and best regards,
Andy Talbot.
Shropshire.

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[David Chandler]

Hi  just a quick reply   

where abouts are you as if near to some one it is often better to see rather than explain/pics etc.....on another forum (similar size to this) I found that I'm 2 miles from another member
Will look at sending some details later from my powerfab on the drawbar and ram clamps/support intransit....... new computer so still trying out

Dave C

Chesterfield

Derbyshire

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From: "a...@uk2.net" <a...@uk2.net>
To: diggers-du...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Fri, 27 May, 2011 22:59:08
Subject: Re: Re: Towing Powerfab 125 WTD

[a...@uk2.net]

Hi Dave,
Quite a distance from you I'm afraid. I'm Just north of Oswestry in north Shropshire about half way between there and Llangollen just over the border.
Thanks for the reply and look forward to some more info.
Andy T

[Tom Carty]

Hi

 

I had a similar issue.  Although it was towable on the large wheels, I was afraid that towing any distance might damage the hydraulic motors.  I got a ‘socket’ made into which I could put the towing wheels, and which would fit into the driven wheels axles.  Relatively easy with a bit of channel iron with a good thick wall. External dimensions to fit into the driven wheel end of the chassis, and internal dimensions to take the towing wheel axles. However, because I had 3 buckets in all, I then ended up with needing to carry spare buckets and the driven wheels in the towing vehicle.  It didn’t really work out for me and I ended up borrowing a 4 wheel braked trailer when I needed to go any distance.  Bringing a Powerfab to France would, IMO, be best done by putting the digger on a proper trailer.   

 

Tom

 

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From: diggers-du...@googlegroups.com [mailto:diggers-du...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of a...@uk2.net
Sent: 27 May 2011 22:59
To: diggers-du...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Re: Towing Powerfab 125 WTD

 

Hi John,

[disasterix]

Well I got the tow hitch sorted thanks to John D. It was so obvious
when I got it right that I will have to put it down to having a senior
moment!
I've now discovered that the powered wheels have suspension units
built in.
So now I'm really confused.
The suspension would be a waste of time and money on the part of the
manufacturer if the digger can't be towed at more than 25 to 30 mph
(as it can be towed at 20mph without suspension), which is what I've
been told is the maximum that the hydraulic motors can stand. And the
sales brochure says ".. by simply changing the front and rear
wheels....(it can be) self trailered at 40mph.
So how do you change the front and rear wheels and how fast can I go?
You're probably right, get a trailer!
Andy T.

[Alun Goodall]

By putting on larger diameter wheels, the distance travelled per revolution
will be less, thus the speed of the motor will be lower etc etc

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[Alun Goodall]

Or maybe distance travelled is more per revolution!

[a...@uk2.net]

Thanks Alun.
Unfortunately going from the 12" wheels that are on the digger to the 185/60x15's that I have kicking around,  only gives you 43mph instead of 40mph. Now if I could get some of those skinny tractor wheels off a crop sprayer!
I will see what I can get in a higher profile tyre, full profile 185x13's will give 51mph at the same rpm so that might be a fix.
Thanks again,
Andy T.

[Mark & Jane]

Hi Andy. In my experience (having owned several 125WTD's) with 15" wheels fitted they tow perfectly fine at 56mph! (90kph) never had an issue with the drive motors after.
My own brochure puts the WTD at 50mph limit, but doesn't say with what wheels!!
Good luck.

[Narrowboatseb]

My two pence worth is the outcome of towing at 50+ mph will depend on
motor condition and crucially, the amount of water in the oil. Water =
cavitation, even tho it's at low pressure due to the by-pass, I
suspect water / oil condition will affect the wear on the motors.
Personally, I would never tow one, but I grew up with a contractor,
who had a 360 machine, ( modern fiat hitachi job) who would not track
his machine 1/2 mile, due to motor wear. He used his machine all day,
every day, and would be on max adjustment of his tracks at the end of
year one, despite not tracking any distance. Towing hundreds of
miles , MUST cause enormous wear, irrespective. A powerfab is unlikely
to do much more than a mile or two a day even if worked hard..... But
that's just my opinion. A maxi pallet is £100 to send, a drive motor
is much more... Stick it on a pallet! It will even save you fuel!!

[JohnD]

Hi Andy,

I tried to send a photo of the diagram on the plate but this list has
obscured your email - I thought that
was the case, but I tried with what I could see anyway. I'm afraid
that this moderated list is causing
tremendous delays. I can also see that my email address has appeared
in your reply which rather defeats
the point of hiding them. The best thing you can do is email me your
address and I'll forward any some
photos without delay.

Trying to take your digger to France casts a rather different slant on
this - I had assumed that you were
talking local towing. Reading through other postings you are not the
first person to attempt to expatriate one
of these machines to France. The last person to do this ended up
loading his into the back of a Mercedes Van.
I bought my own machine from a German engineer who encountered the
same problem as yourself in his desire
to export the machine to Germany - but I dont think that should put
you off, you just need to know the rules and
perhaps apply some ingenuity as you have worked out for yourself.

The published maximum tow speed according to the Powerfab literature I
have is 40mph. I would be very
nervous about towing for a long distance at this speed which
presumably explains Mr Millers conservatism.
I am suspicious of the 20mph restriction on towing without suspension
- I can find no mention of it and have
never heard of it before. Perhaps another subscriber can elaborate on
this one. There is a limit of 750kg if the
load is unbraked but the 125wtd is (by design) under this limit.

Finally if you look at one of my other posts I am having no luck
sourcing replacement pins and bushes etc with
Powrfab.co.uk. If you can find a better supplier such as a good
machine shop that wont charge the earth then
please let us all know!

JohnD

[Jim]

The above picture supplied by JohnD shows the towing arrangement for the Powerfab.

Note to John. You are experiencing delays in the group as for some reason
Google thinks your messages may be spam. I think it may be the word
subscribe in your email address which is causing it. I don't always get to
read the spam report straight away, hence the delays. Normally once I
approve someone for the group all their posts are instant. This is the first
time there has been a problem.

For my part, I would prefer to transport the digger a long distance on a
decent modern trailer!

Cheers, Jim

[David Chandler]

Hi

 Where the diagram shows chain and shackle  I use a ratchet and a short strap in the same place and I find is better as the ratchet can be tightened and chain chips the paint work (I'm not to bothered as mine is working m/c). At the front end I sit the stabalizers in same position as in diagram with another ratchet strap hooked into the pivot end of stabalizer then round top of bucket and  back to the other stabalizer pivot, this with a clamp over the ram as on the pics on web site (see blue machine)  mine is pipe insulation with angle iron to right length held in place with 3 industrial velcro straps.

Hope some of this is of some use to you. I do tow 125wt on road frequently.

PS light board (3') I fit to bucket with long bungee wraped round both sides of dipper and thro bucket you will probaly have to extend the wire by about 1.5m

 

good luck

Dave

Chesterfield

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From: Jim <flamin...@gmail.com>
To: diggers-du...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wed, 1 June, 2011 21:10:54

Subject: Re: Towing Powerfab 125 WTD

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[a...@uk2.net]

Thanks John D for the pic of the hitch and restraining arrangement for the digger arm.

I am tending towards the trailer idea as even though (as I have just discovered) the 125WTD does have suspension built in, the wear on the wheel motors for a 500 mile journey must be equivalent to at least two years normal use. As I understand that parts for the wheel motors are getting difficult to find, it might be wise to preserve them as best one can.
Also my car is nowhere near big and heavy enough to tow an unbraked trailer the weight of the Powerfab. Converting a powerfab so that it has a braking system would be interesting but maybe a step too far.

Narrowboatseb's idea of a Maxi pallet would be great if it was £100, but to take a digger of this size and weight to France is a minimum of £1000. I could buy a decent trailer for that and sell it when I'm done. Thanks also to narrowboatseb for pointing out the necessity for clean oil. Mine is clearly contaminated and one of my first jobs is to change the oil and filter.

The reference to the 20mph limit for trailers without suspension is UK Construction and Use Regulations Regulation 22. I don't have a copy and the only internet reference is from the Farmers Guardian, 2nd June 2011

    "Most UK agricultural trailers are fitted with braking systems designed to operate within the 20mph (32kph) UK speed limit for

   vehicles without suspension. Which is at odds with the fact that the vast majority of tractors are now capable of 25mph (40kph)

   and more than a few can manage 30mph (50kph)."

Thanks to everybody for the help I've received and I'll let you know what happens.
Regards,
Andy T.

[David Chandler]

Hi I should have forwarded a message to you    markeyo a member of this forum took his powerfab 125wt to france in a 'medium wheelbased merc sprinter' Dec/ Jan 2011
Hope of some help

Dave C

Chesterfield

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From: "a...@uk2.net" <a...@uk2.net>
To: diggers-du...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Thu, 2 June, 2011 11:22:46
Subject: Re: Re: Towing Powerfab 125 WTD

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