NLP extracted from text--Anyone want to have some fun? ;)
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greg
Feb 13, 2013, 7:21:06 AM2/13/13
to dharm...@googlegroups.com
Hey Everyone,
I've done a table of the NLP I can find in a section of the Book of Mormon, a religious text; it's not too hard to read, but maybe a little hard to understand. Interestingly, this text was printed in 1829. It contains three lectures/talks from a father to his three sons, with each one being in a different mode (audio/ visual/ kinesthetic).
I'll admit my brain has gotten a little frazzled and I might not have been very careful on the true NLP parts (I hope I didn't make too much up... ;( ).
If anyone is up to it, would you check the correctness/ give your opinion/ feedback on the following. I know it might take a lot of time and work, so I'm not mad if no one tries, but even if just it's an opinion on a better way to say it...
-=
Here's a section on the metaprograms and the table:
-=-=-=
Ok, here's the actual text that came from:
CHAPTER 37
I've done a table of the NLP I can find in a section of the Book of Mormon, a religious text; it's not too hard to read, but maybe a little hard to understand. Interestingly, this text was printed in 1829. It contains three lectures/talks from a father to his three sons, with each one being in a different mode (audio/ visual/ kinesthetic).
I'll admit my brain has gotten a little frazzled and I might not have been very careful on the true NLP parts (I hope I didn't make too much up... ;( ).
If anyone is up to it, would you check the correctness/ give your opinion/ feedback on the following. I know it might take a lot of time and work, so I'm not mad if no one tries, but even if just it's an opinion on a better way to say it...
-=
Here's a section on the metaprograms and the table:
NLP Meta-Programs:
audio/visual/kinesthetic
intensity
repetition
frequency
interval
duration
sequence
time
rhythm (sequence + timing)
direction (away/ toward)
near/ far
left/ center/ right
compare/ contrast
{inside/ outside}/ {self/ others}
source
directness (straight/ curved)
simplicity/ complexity: general/ specific, shallow/ deep, short/ long, overview/ detailed
speed (of speech, of response)
thing/ action
change in all
attachment/ ownership: {hold/ hang on}/ let go
tense vs. relaxed
stuck vs. flowing
appearance: slow, building vs. sudden, explosive
in contex/ out of context
authentic vs. fake
depth of emotional involvement
like vs. unlike (experience-wise)
"like me" vs. "unlike me"
1st person, 2nd person, 3rd person, multiple
concentrate
on ends/ destination vs. concentrate on means/ journey
Meta programming is the process of creating a model of the structural patterns an individual uses to construct, maintain and reinforce their subjective reality. Persistent meta program patterns generate and maintain the continuing personal congruence of behavioral presuppositions one could call personality or identity.
We'll see that Alma has an advanced awareness of communication and the ability to persuade. These three talks are his communication masterpieces.
So, on with the comparisons! Alma’s counsel to his sons looks like this (in parentheses are the chapter:verse; x is if it occurs more than once in the same verse; all references are in the book of Alma):
Table of NLP Summary in Alma's Talks to His Sons
|
|
Helaman |
Shiblon |
Corianton |
|---|---|---|---|
|
Length of speech (total lines, including partials, in columned Book of Mormon) |
543 |
102 |
641 |
|
Learning style |
Visual. Alma speaks of stories, records, images, directions. |
Kinesthetic. It’s about bodily feelings and action. |
Auditory. Alma speaks of words, sounds, hearing, speaking, saying, etc. Alma says, “I say…” 12-15 times (39:1, 15, 17; 40:1, 2×2, 18, (19 x2), (20), 21 x2; 41:1, 2; 42:25) |
|
Amount of imagery |
Lots |
None |
A little |
|
Tempo |
Slow, drawn out Repetitive Detailed |
Intense, one-time Explosive, fast and hard |
Conversational/ normal |
|
Level of Complexity |
Medium |
Simple |
Complex |
|
Ordered by (mainly) |
Nested loop/ chiasmus |
Chronological |
Importance |
|
Journey/ Destination? |
Both |
Journey |
Journey |
|
Depth of Emotion |
Deep |
Deep |
Deep |
|
Duration of topics |
Long |
Extremely short |
Very long |
|
State (Noun)/ Action (Verb) (in general) |
Both |
Action |
State |
|
Number of questions asked |
2 |
0 |
14 (39:1 x2, 5, 17, 18, 19; 40:7; 41:12; 42:17 x3, 19, 21, 25) |
|
Way questions are used |
To summarize and nail Alma’s conclusion |
- |
To initiate and support a conversational topic. |
|
How much Alma relates the content to their personal experiences and testimony |
0 times |
The majority of the time: 38:2, 3, 4, 5, 10, 13, 14; then, Alma’s experience in 38:6, 7, 8, 9 |
The majority of the
topics are related to Corianton’s worries and problems, but
most of the content is theological and from the outside. |
|
Main topics |
“Mysteries” of God, “wisdom” of God: 17 times (37:2, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 11, 12, 14, 18, 19, 21, 35, 38, 39, 40, 41) |
Continue your course, “do”: 38:2. |
Doctrinal, that have to do with Corianton’s sins (the majority). |
|
“Follow my example” |
3 times (37:1, 2 x2) |
0 times |
0 times (But, in 39:1, follow Shiblon’s example) |
|
“I command you” |
4 times (37:1, 2, 20, 27) |
0 times |
3 times (39:10, 12 x2) |
|
“Keep the commandments” |
5 times (37:15 (warned not to transgress), 16 x2, 20, 35) |
0 times Instead, Alma “offers suggestions”, basically: 12 times (1. “I hope that”: 38:2 2. “I trust that”: 38:2 3. “I would that”: 38:6, 10 x2 4. “See that”: 38:11 x2, 12 x2 5. “Balance”: 38:11, 12 6. “May the Lord”: 38:15) |
0 times (Alma speaks of his not following his brother’s good example in keeping the commandments at the very start; after that, of some of his sins; obeying Alma first, then God; etc.—everything *but* “keep the commandments”) |
|
“Keep the commandments and prosper” |
3 times (36:1, 30, 37:13) |
1 time (38:1) |
0 times |
|
Other |
Helaman also learns by “repetition”—he needs to hear something over and over, and is somewhat a “low-key” person. Fascinated with thinking, he is a very non-action person. He is, however, a believer. Alma needs to paint the big picture, in great detail, for Helaman; philosophical/ intellectual in many aspects. The best chiasmus is found in Alma 36, absolutely!! Remember, Helaman is a reader, a thinker, a contemplater—not a doer. Alma purposefully gives Helaman a special message in a special form that will likely encourage him to study it more and appreciate it more deeply; the more it's read, the more he gets it. At the same time, this includes literary elements that encourage intensity and action—two elements Helaman lacks. For example, there are extremes, exaggerations (even if true), short and powerful yet subtle lines, and coloring throughout chapter 36: “I swear unto you”, “none could deliver”, “he surely did deliver”, “voice of thunder”, “the whole earth did tremble”, “Arise”, “If thou wilt of thyself be destroyed, seek no more to destroy the church of God.”, “fell to the earth”, “I could not open my mouth”, “struck with such great fear and amazement”, “racked with eternal torment, for my soul was harrowed up to the greatest degree and racked with all my sins”, “tormented with the pains of hell”, “rebelled against my God”, “I had murdered many of his children”, “the very thought”, “rack my soul with inexpressible horror”, “banished and become extinct”, “racked, even with the pains of a damned soul”, “racked with torment”, “harrowed up by the memory of my many sins”, "oh, what joy, and what marvelous light", "in the gall of bitterness, and am encircled about by the everlasting chains of death", "nothing so exquisite and so bitter as were my pains... nothing so exquisite and sweet as was my joy", "my soul did long to be there", "labored without ceasing", "taste of the exceeding joy of which I did taste", "exceedingly great joy", etc. |
Shiblon is a “high-intensity” person. He hears it hard and fast, strong and powerful; once is enough; very little is repeated in any form. Yet, Alma is very suggestful, no confrontation, doesn’t discuss Shiblon’s current weaknesses; he feels no need to prove anything or convince Shiblon of anything; doesn’t need to come out and clearly say things; no need to paint the “big picture” or detail it. |
Corianton is a
“hesitator”. |
Once more, these few chapters alone should make every person consider (or reconsider) Book of Mormon complexity, richness, and deepness. Each conversation Alma has with his sons is unique on multiple facets; just planning these few chapters would have taken considerable time, even for an intelligent guy, to ensure conformity. Not only that, Alma uses these techniques in very ethical/ moral ways to teach and persuade his children to obey the commandments and do good. Those who maintain that Joseph Smith “invented” the Book of Mormon must realize that if so, he was about 140 years before Grinder and Bandler even started NLP, and about 120 years before Milton Erickson. In these few chapters, Alma’s communication is so unique that Joseph Smith, once more, had to have been not just an excellent communicator, but a true genius. But was this greatness in communication and speaking found in Joseph Smith—outside of the Book of Mormon—during the same time period? The Joseph Smith papers should be very helpful here, as all will be able to see if he ever does that; from what I've seen, not really...
NOTE: If anyone can find any other source Joseph Smith could have copied, used, or studied in this particular way, or even any example of unique NLP communication—used by one character in different conversations in a “fiction” book by any author (especially a literary genius)—please, let me know!!
-=-=-=
Ok, here's the actual text that came from:
CHAPTER 36 (About 73 B.C.)
1
My son, give ear to my words; for I swear unto you, that inasmuch
as ye shall keep the commandments of God ye shall prosper in the land.
2
I would that ye should do as I have done, in remembering the captivity
of our fathers; for they were in bondage, and none could deliver them
except it was the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of
Jacob; and he surely did deliver them in their afflictions.
3
And now, O my son Helaman, behold, thou art in thy youth, and therefore,
I beseech of thee that thou wilt hear my words and learn of me; for I
do know that whosoever shall put their trust in God shall be supported
in their trials, and their troubles, and their afflictions, and shall be
lifted up at the last day.
4
And I would not that ye think that I know of myself—not of the temporal but of the spiritual, not of the carnal mind but of God.
5
Now, behold, I say unto you, if I had not been born of God I should not
have known these things; but God has, by the mouth of his holy angel,
made these things known unto me, not of any worthiness of myself;
6
For I went about with the sons of Mosiah, seeking to destroy the church
of God; but behold, God sent his holy angel to stop us by the way.
7
And behold, he spake unto us, as it were the voice of thunder, and the
whole earth did tremble beneath our feet; and we all fell to the earth,
for the fear of the Lord came upon us.
9
And he said unto me: If thou wilt of thyself be destroyed, seek no more to destroy the church of God.
10
And it came to pass that I fell to the earth; and it was for the space
of three days and three nights that I could not open my mouth, neither
had I the use of my limbs.
11
And the angel spake more things unto me, which were heard by my
brethren, but I did not hear them; for when I heard the words—If thou
wilt be destroyed of thyself, seek no more to destroy the church of
God—I was struck with such great fear and amazement lest perhaps I
should be destroyed, that I fell to the earth and I did hear no more.
12
But I was racked with eternal torment, for my soul was harrowed up to the greatest degree and racked with all my sins.
13
Yea, I did remember all my sins and iniquities, for which I was
tormented with the pains of hell; yea, I saw that I had rebelled against
my God, and that I had not kept his holy commandments.
14
Yea, and I had murdered many of his children, or rather led them away
unto destruction; yea, and in fine so great had been my iniquities, that
the very thought of coming into the presence of my God did rack my soul
with inexpressible horror.
15
Oh, thought I, that I could be banished and become extinct both soul and
body, that I might not be brought to stand in the presence of my God,
to be judged of my deeds.
17
And it came to pass that as I was thus racked with torment, while I was
harrowed up by the memory of my many sins, behold, I remembered also to
have heard my father prophesy unto the people concerning the coming of
one Jesus Christ, a Son of God, to atone for the sins of the world.
18
Now, as my mind caught hold upon this thought, I cried within my heart: O
Jesus, thou Son of God, have mercy on me, who am in the gall of
bitterness, and am encircled about by the everlasting chains of death.
19
And now, behold, when I thought this, I could remember my pains no more;
yea, I was harrowed up by the memory of my sins no more.
20
And oh, what joy, and what marvelous light I did behold; yea, my soul was filled with joy as exceeding as was my pain!
21
Yea, I say unto you, my son, that there could be nothing so exquisite
and so bitter as were my pains. Yea, and again I say unto you, my son,
that on the other hand, there can be nothing so exquisite and sweet as
was my joy.
22
Yea, methought I saw, even as our father Lehi saw, God sitting upon his
throne, surrounded with numberless concourses of angels, in the attitude
of singing and praising their God; yea, and my soul did long to be
there.
23
But behold, my limbs did receive their strength again, and I stood upon
my feet, and did manifest unto the people that I had been born of God.
24
Yea, and from that time even until now, I have labored without ceasing,
that I might bring souls unto repentance; that I might bring them to
taste of the exceeding joy of which I did taste; that they might also be
born of God, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
25
Yea, and now behold, O my son, the Lord doth give me exceedingly great joy in the fruit of my labors;
26
For because of the word which he has imparted unto me, behold, many have
been born of God, and have tasted as I have tasted, and have seen eye
to eye as I have seen; therefore they do know of these things of which I
have spoken, as I do know; and the knowledge which I have is of God.
27
And I have been supported under trials and troubles of every kind, yea,
and in all manner of afflictions; yea, God has delivered me from prison,
and from bonds, and from death; yea, and I do put my trust in him, and
he will still deliver me.
28
And I know that he will raise me up at the last day, to dwell with him
in glory; yea, and I will praise him forever, for he has brought our
fathers out of Egypt, and he has swallowed up the Egyptians in the Red
Sea; and he led them by his power into the promised land; yea, and he
has delivered them out of bondage and captivity from time to time.
29
Yea, and he has also brought our fathers out of the land of Jerusalem;
and he has also, by his everlasting power, delivered them out of bondage
and captivity, from time to time even down to the present day; and I
have always retained in remembrance their captivity; yea, and ye also
ought to retain in remembrance, as I have done, their captivity.
30
But behold, my son, this is not all; for ye ought to know as I do know,
that inasmuch as ye shall keep the commandments of God ye shall prosper
in the land; and ye ought to know also, that inasmuch as ye will not
keep the commandments of God ye shall be cut off from his presence. Now
this is according to his word.
CHAPTER 37
1
And now, my son Helaman, I command you that ye take the records which have been entrusted with me;
2
And I also command you that ye keep a record of this people, according
as I have done, upon the plates of Nephi, and keep all these things
sacred which I have kept, even as I have kept them; for it is for a wise
purpose that they are kept.
3
And these plates of brass, which contain these engravings, which have
the records of the holy scriptures upon them, which have the genealogy
of our forefathers, even from the beginning—
4
Behold, it has been prophesied by our fathers, that they should be kept
and handed down from one generation to another, and be kept and
preserved by the hand of the Lord until they should go forth unto every
nation, kindred, tongue, and people, that they shall know of the
mysteries contained thereon.
5
And now behold, if they are kept they must retain their brightness; yea,
and they will retain their brightness; yea, and also shall all the
plates which do contain that which is holy writ.
6
Now ye may suppose that this is foolishness in me; but behold I say unto
you, that by small and simple things are great things brought to pass;
and small means in many instances doth confound the wise.
7
And the Lord God doth work by means to bring about his great and eternal
purposes; and by very small means the Lord doth confound the wise and
bringeth about the salvation of many souls.
8
And now, it has hitherto been wisdom in God that these things should be
preserved; for behold, they have enlarged the memory of this people,
yea, and convinced many of the error of their ways, and brought them to
the knowledge of their God unto the salvation of their souls.
9
Yea, I say unto you, were it not for these things that these records do
contain, which are on these plates, Ammon and his brethren could not
have convinced so many thousands of the Lamanites of the incorrect
tradition of their fathers; yea, these records and their words brought
them unto repentance; that is, they brought them to the knowledge of the
Lord their God, and to rejoice in Jesus Christ their Redeemer.
10
And who knoweth but what they will be the means of bringing many
thousands of them, yea, and also many thousands of our stiffnecked
brethren, the Nephites, who are now hardening their hearts in sin and
iniquities, to the knowledge of their Redeemer?
12
And it may suffice if I only say they are preserved for a wise purpose,
which purpose is known unto God; for he doth counsel in wisdom over all
his works, and his paths are straight, and his course is one eternal
round.
13
O remember, remember, my son Helaman, how strict are the commandments of
God. And he said: If ye will keep my commandments ye shall prosper in
the land—but if ye keep not his commandments ye shall be cut off from
his presence.
14
And now remember, my son, that God has entrusted you with these things,
which are sacred, which he has kept sacred, and also which he will keep
and preserve for a wise purpose in him, that he may show forth his power
unto future generations.
15
And now behold, I tell you by the spirit of prophecy, that if ye
transgress the commandments of God, behold, these things which are
sacred shall be taken away from you by the power of God, and ye shall be
delivered up unto Satan, that he may sift you as chaff before the wind.
16
But if ye keep the commandments of God, and do with these things which
are sacred according to that which the Lord doth command you, (for you
must appeal unto the Lord for all things whatsoever ye must do with
them) behold, no power of earth or hell can take them from you, for God
is powerful to the fulfilling of all his words.
17
For he will fulfil all his promises which he shall make unto you, for he
has fulfilled his promises which he has made unto our fathers.
18
For he promised unto them that he would preserve these things for a wise
purpose in him, that he might show forth his power unto future
generations.
19
And now behold, one purpose hath he fulfilled, even to the restoration
of many thousands of the Lamanites to the knowledge of the truth; and he
hath shown forth his power in them, and he will also still show forth
his power in them unto future generations; therefore they shall be
preserved.
20
Therefore I command you, my son Helaman, that ye be diligent in
fulfilling all my words, and that ye be diligent in keeping the
commandments of God as they are written.
21
And now, I will speak unto you concerning those twenty-four plates, that
ye keep them, that the mysteries and the works of darkness, and their
secret works, or the secret works of those people who have been
destroyed, may be made manifest unto this people; yea, all their
murders, and robbings, and their plunderings, and all their wickedness
and abominations, may be made manifest unto this people; yea, and that
ye preserve these interpreters.
22
For behold, the Lord saw that his people began to work in darkness, yea,
work secret murders and abominations; therefore the Lord said, if they
did not repent they should be destroyed from off the face of the earth.
23
And the Lord said: I will prepare unto my servant Gazelem, a stone,
which shall shine forth in darkness unto light, that I may discover unto
my people who serve me, that I may discover unto them the works of
their brethren, yea, their secret works, their works of darkness, and
their wickedness and abominations.
24
And now, my son, these interpreters were prepared that the word of God might be fulfilled, which he spake, saying:
25
I will bring forth out of darkness unto light all their secret works and
their abominations; and except they repent I will destroy them from off
the face of the earth; and I will bring to light all their secrets and
abominations, unto every nation that shall hereafter possess the land.
26
And now, my son, we see that they did not repent; therefore they have
been destroyed, and thus far the word of God has been fulfilled; yea,
their secret abominations have been brought out of darkness and made
known unto us.
27
And now, my son, I command you that ye retain all their oaths, and their
covenants, and their agreements in their secret abominations; yea, and
all their signs and their wonders ye shall keep from this people, that
they know them not, lest peradventure they should fall into darkness
also and be destroyed.
28
For behold, there is a curse upon all this land, that destruction shall
come upon all those workers of darkness, according to the power of God,
when they are fully ripe; therefore I desire that this people might not
be destroyed.
29
Therefore ye shall keep these secret plans of their oaths and their
covenants from this people, and only their wickedness and their murders
and their abominations shall ye make known unto them; and ye shall teach
them to abhor such wickedness and abominations and murders; and ye
shall also teach them that these people were destroyed on account of
their wickedness and abominations and their murders.
30
For behold, they murdered all the prophets of the Lord who came among
them to declare unto them concerning their iniquities; and the blood of
those whom they murdered did cry unto the Lord their God for vengeance
upon those who were their murderers; and thus the judgments of God did
come upon these workers of darkness and secret combinations.
31
Yea, and cursed be the land forever and ever unto those workers of
darkness and secret combinations, even unto destruction, except they
repent before they are fully ripe.
32
And now, my son, remember the words which I have spoken unto you; trust
not those secret plans unto this people, but teach them an everlasting
hatred against sin and iniquity.
33
Preach unto them repentance, and faith on the Lord Jesus Christ; teach
them to humble themselves and to be meek and lowly in heart; teach them
to withstand every temptation of the devil, with their faith on the Lord
Jesus Christ.
34
Teach them to never be weary of good works, but to be meek and lowly in heart; for such shall find rest to their souls.
35
O, remember, my son, and learn wisdom in thy youth; yea, learn in thy youth to keep the commandments of God.
36
Yea, and cry unto God for all thy support; yea, let all thy doings be
unto the Lord, and whithersoever thou goest let it be in the Lord; yea,
let all thy thoughts be directed unto the Lord; yea, let the affections
of thy heart be placed upon the Lord forever.
37
Counsel with the Lord in all thy doings, and he will direct thee for
good; yea, when thou liest down at night lie down unto the Lord, that he
may watch over you in your sleep; and when thou risest in the morning
let thy heart be full of thanks unto God; and if ye do these things, ye
shall be lifted up at the last day.
38
And now, my son, I have somewhat to say concerning the thing which our
fathers call a ball, or director—or our fathers called it Liahona, which
is, being interpreted, a compass; and the Lord prepared it.
39
And behold, there cannot any man work after the manner of so curious a
workmanship. And behold, it was prepared to show unto our fathers the
course which they should travel in the wilderness.
40
And it did work for them according to their faith in God; therefore, if
they had faith to believe that God could cause that those spindles
should point the way they should go, behold, it was done; therefore they
had this miracle, and also many other miracles wrought by the power of
God, day by day.
41
Nevertheless, because those miracles were worked by small means it did
show unto them marvelous works. They were slothful, and forgot to
exercise their faith and diligence and then those marvelous works
ceased, and they did not progress in their journey;
42
Therefore, they tarried in the wilderness, or did not travel a direct
course, and were afflicted with hunger and thirst, because of their
transgressions.
43
And now, my son, I would that ye should understand that these things are
not without a shadow; for as our fathers were slothful to give heed to
this compass (now these things were temporal) they did not prosper; even
so it is with things which are spiritual.
44
For behold, it is as easy to give heed to the word of Christ, which will
point to you a straight course to eternal bliss, as it was for our
fathers to give heed to this compass, which would point unto them a
straight course to the promised land.
45
And now I say, is there not a type in this thing? For just as surely as
this director did bring our fathers, by following its course, to the
promised land, shall the words of Christ, if we follow their course,
carry us beyond this vale of sorrow into a far better land of promise.
46
O my son, do not let us be slothful because of the easiness of the way;
for so was it with our fathers; for so was it prepared for them, that if
they would look they might live; even so it is with us. The way is
prepared, and if we will look we may live forever.
47
And now, my son, see that ye take care of these sacred things, yea, see
that ye look to God and live. Go unto this people and declare the word,
and be sober. My son, farewell.
-=
CORIANTON:
CHAPTER 38
1
My son, give ear to my words, for I say unto you, even as I said
unto Helaman, that inasmuch as ye shall keep the commandments of God ye
shall prosper in the land; and inasmuch as ye will not keep the
commandments of God ye shall be cut off from his presence.
2
And now, my son, I trust that I shall have great joy in you, because of
your steadiness and your faithfulness unto God; for as you have
commenced in your youth to look to the Lord your God, even so I hope
that you will continue in keeping his commandments; for blessed is he
that endureth to the end.
3
I say unto you, my son, that I have had great joy in thee already,
because of thy faithfulness and thy diligence, and thy patience and thy
long-suffering among the people of the Zoramites.
4
For I know that thou wast in bonds; yea, and I also know that thou wast
stoned for the word’s sake; and thou didst bear all these things with
patience because the Lord was with thee; and now thou knowest that the
Lord did deliver thee.
5
And now my son, Shiblon, I would that ye should remember, that as much
as ye shall put your trust in God even so much ye shall be delivered out
of your trials, and your troubles, and your afflictions, and ye shall
be lifted up at the last day.
6
Now, my son, I would not that ye should think that I know these things
of myself, but it is the Spirit of God which is in me which maketh these
things known unto me; for if I had not been born of God I should not
have known these things.
7
But behold, the Lord in his great mercy sent his angel to declare unto
me that I must stop the work of destruction among his people; yea, and I
have seen an angel face to face, and he spake with me, and his voice
was as thunder, and it shook the whole earth.
8
And it came to pass that I was three days and three nights in the most
bitter pain and anguish of soul; and never, until I did cry out unto the
Lord Jesus Christ for mercy, did I receive a remission of my sins. But
behold, I did cry unto him and I did find peace to my soul.
9
And now, my son, I have told you this that ye may learn wisdom, that ye
may learn of me that there is no other way or means whereby man can be
saved, only in and through Christ. Behold, he is the life and the light
of the world. Behold, he is the word of truth and righteousness.
10
And now, as ye have begun to teach the word even so I would that ye
should continue to teach; and I would that ye would be diligent and
temperate in all things.
11
See that ye are not lifted up unto pride; yea, see that ye do not boast in your own wisdom, nor of your much strength.
12
Use boldness, but not overbearance; and also see that ye bridle all your
passions, that ye may be filled with love; see that ye refrain from
idleness.
13
Do not pray as the Zoramites do, for ye have seen that they pray to be heard of men, and to be praised for their wisdom.
14
Do not say: O God, I thank thee that we are better than our brethren;
but rather say: O Lord, forgive my unworthiness, and remember my
brethren in mercy—yea, acknowledge your unworthiness before God at all
times.
15
And may the Lord bless your soul, and receive you at the last day into
his kingdom, to sit down in peace. Now go, my son, and teach the word
unto this people. Be sober. My son, farewell.
-=
CORIANTON:
CHAPTER 39
1
And now, my son, I have somewhat more to say unto thee than what I
said unto thy brother; for behold, have ye not observed the steadiness
of thy brother, his faithfulness, and his diligence in keeping the
commandments of God? Behold, has he not set a good example for thee?
2
For thou didst not give so much heed unto my words as did thy brother,
among the people of the Zoramites. Now this is what I have against
thee; thou didst go on unto boasting in thy strength and thy wisdom.
3
And this is not all, my son. Thou didst do that which was grievous unto
me; for thou didst forsake the ministry, and did go over into the land
of Siron among the borders of the Lamanites, after the harlot Isabel.
4
Yea, she did steal away the hearts of many; but this was no excuse for
thee, my son. Thou shouldst have tended to the ministry wherewith thou
wast entrusted.
5
Know ye not, my son, that these things are an abomination in the sight
of the Lord; yea, most abominable above all sins save it be the shedding
of innocent blood or denying the Holy Ghost?
6
For behold, if ye deny the Holy Ghost when it once has had place in you,
and ye know that ye deny it, behold, this is a sin which is
unpardonable; yea, and whosoever murdereth against the light and
knowledge of God, it is not easy for him to obtain forgiveness; yea, I
say unto you, my son, that it is not easy for him to obtain a
forgiveness.
7
And now, my son, I would to God that ye had not been guilty of so great a
crime. I would not dwell upon your crimes, to harrow up your soul, if
it were not for your good.
8
But behold, ye cannot hide your crimes from God; and except ye repent
they will stand as a testimony against you at the last day.
9
Now my son, I would that ye should repent and forsake your sins, and go
no more after the lusts of your eyes, but cross yourself in all these
things; for except ye do this ye can in nowise inherit the kingdom of
God. Oh, remember, and take it upon you, and cross yourself in these
things.
10
And I command you to take it upon you to counsel with your elder
brothers in your undertakings; for behold, thou art in thy youth, and ye
stand in need to be nourished by your brothers. And give heed to their
counsel.
11
Suffer not yourself to be led away by any vain or foolish thing; suffer
not the devil to lead away your heart again after those wicked harlots.
Behold, O my son, how great iniquity ye brought upon the Zoramites; for
when they saw your conduct they would not believe in my words.
12
And now the Spirit of the Lord doth say unto me: Command thy children to
do good, lest they lead away the hearts of many people to destruction;
therefore I command you, my son, in the fear of God, that ye refrain
from your iniquities;
13
That ye turn to the Lord with all your mind, might, and strength; that
ye lead away the hearts of no more to do wickedly; but rather return
unto them, and acknowledge your faults and that wrong which ye have
done.
14
Seek not after riches nor the vain things of this world; for behold, you cannot carry them with you.
15
And now, my son, I would say somewhat unto you concerning the coming of
Christ. Behold, I say unto you, that it is he that surely shall come to
take away the sins of the world; yea, he cometh to declare glad tidings
of salvation unto his people.
16
And now, my son, this was the ministry unto which ye were called, to
declare these glad tidings unto this people, to prepare their minds; or
rather that salvation might come unto them, that they may prepare the
minds of their children to hear the word at the time of his coming.
17
And now I will ease your mind somewhat on this subject. Behold, you
marvel why these things should be known so long beforehand. Behold, I
say unto you, is not a soul at this time as precious unto God as a soul
will be at the time of his coming?
18
Is it not as necessary that the plan of redemption should be made known unto this people as well as unto their children?
19
Is it not as easy at this time for the Lord to send his angel to declare
these glad tidings unto us as unto our children, or as after the time
of his coming?
CHAPTER 40
1
Now my son, here is somewhat more I would say unto thee; for I
perceive that thy mind is worried concerning the resurrection of the
dead.
2
Behold, I say unto you, that there is no resurrection—or, I would say,
in other words, that this mortal does not put on immortality, this
corruption does not put on incorruption—until after the coming of
Christ.
3
Behold, he bringeth to pass the resurrection of the dead. But behold,
my son, the resurrection is not yet. Now, I unfold unto you a mystery;
nevertheless, there are many mysteries which are kept, that no one
knoweth them save God himself. But I show unto you one thing which I
have inquired diligently of God that I might know—that is concerning the
resurrection.
4
Behold, there is a time appointed that all shall come forth from the
dead. Now when this time cometh no one knows; but God knoweth the time
which is appointed.
5
Now, whether there shall be one time, or a second time, or a third time,
that men shall come forth from the dead, it mattereth not; for God
knoweth all these things; and it sufficeth me to know that this is the
case—that there is a time appointed that all shall rise from the dead.
7
And now I would inquire what becometh of the souls of men from this time of death to the time appointed for the resurrection?
8
Now whether there is more than one time appointed for men to rise it
mattereth not; for all do not die at once, and this mattereth not; all
is as one day with God, and time only is measured unto men.
9
Therefore, there is a time appointed unto men that they shall rise from
the dead; and there is a space between the time of death and the
resurrection. And now, concerning this space of time, what becometh of
the souls of men is the thing which I have inquired diligently of the
Lord to know; and this is the thing of which I do know.
10
And when the time cometh when all shall rise, then shall they know that God knoweth all the times which are appointed unto man.
11
Now, concerning the state of the soul between death and the
resurrection—Behold, it has been made known unto me by an angel, that
the spirits of all men, as soon as they are departed from this mortal
body, yea, the spirits of all men, whether they be good or evil, are
taken home to that God who gave them life.
12
And then shall it come to pass, that the spirits of those who are
righteous are received into a state of happiness, which is called
paradise, a state of rest, a state of peace, where they shall rest from
all their troubles and from all care, and sorrow.
13
And then shall it come to pass, that the spirits of the wicked, yea, who
are evil—for behold, they have no part nor portion of the Spirit of the
Lord; for behold, they chose evil works rather than good; therefore the
spirit of the devil did enter into them, and take possession of their
house—and these shall be cast out into outer darkness; there shall be
weeping, and wailing, and gnashing of teeth, and this because of their
own iniquity, being led captive by the will of the devil.
14
Now this is the state of the souls of the wicked, yea, in darkness, and a
state of awful, fearful looking for the fiery indignation of the wrath
of God upon them; thus they remain in this state, as well as the
righteous in paradise, until the time of their resurrection.
15
Now, there are some that have understood that this state of happiness
and this state of misery of the soul, before the resurrection, was a
first resurrection. Yea, I admit it may be termed a resurrection, the
raising of the spirit or the soul and their consignation to happiness or
misery, according to the words which have been spoken.
16
And behold, again it hath been spoken, that there is a first
resurrection, a resurrection of all those who have been, or who are, or
who shall be, down to the resurrection of Christ from the dead.
17
Now, we do not suppose that this first resurrection, which is spoken of
in this manner, can be the resurrection of the souls and their
consignation to happiness or misery. Ye cannot suppose that this is
what it meaneth.
18
Behold, I say unto you, Nay; but it meaneth the reuniting of the soul
with the body, of those from the days of Adam down to the resurrection
of Christ.
19
Now, whether the souls and the bodies of those of whom has been spoken
shall all be reunited at once, the wicked as well as the righteous, I do
not say; let it suffice, that I say that they all come forth; or in
other words, their resurrection cometh to pass before the resurrection
of those who die after the resurrection of Christ.
20
Now, my son, I do not say that their resurrection cometh at the
resurrection of Christ; but behold, I give it as my opinion, that the
souls and the bodies are reunited, of the righteous, at the resurrection
of Christ, and his ascension into heaven.
21
But whether it be at his resurrection or after, I do not say; but this
much I say, that there is a space between death and the resurrection of
the body, and a state of the soul in happiness or in misery until the
time which is appointed of God that the dead shall come forth, and be
reunited, both soul and body, and be brought to stand before God, and be
judged according to their works.
22
Yea, this bringeth about the restoration of those things of which has been spoken by the mouths of the prophets.
23
The soul shall be restored to the body, and the body to the soul; yea,
and every limb and joint shall be restored to its body; yea, even a hair
of the head shall not be lost; but all things shall be restored to
their proper and perfect frame.
26
But behold, an awful death cometh upon the wicked; for they die as to
things pertaining to things of righteousness; for they are unclean, and
no unclean thing can inherit the kingdom of God; but they are cast out,
and consigned to partake of the fruits of their labors or their works,
which have been evil; and they drink the dregs of a bitter cup.
CHAPTER 41
1
And now, my son, I have somewhat to say concerning the
restoration of which has been spoken; for behold, some have wrested the
scriptures, and have gone far astray because of this thing. And I
perceive that thy mind has been worried also concerning this thing. But
behold, I will explain it unto thee.
2
I say unto thee, my son, that the plan of restoration is requisite with
the justice of God; for it is requisite that all things should be
restored to their proper order. Behold, it is requisite and just,
according to the power and resurrection of Christ, that the soul of man
should be restored to its body, and that every part of the body should
be restored to itself.
3
And it is requisite with the justice of God that men should be judged
according to their works; and if their works were good in this life, and
the desires of their hearts were good, that they should also, at the
last day, be restored unto that which is good.
4
And if their works are evil they shall be restored unto them for evil.
Therefore, all things shall be restored to their proper order, every
thing to its natural frame—mortality raised to immortality, corruption
to incorruption—raised to endless happiness to inherit the kingdom of
God, or to endless misery to inherit the kingdom of the devil, the one
on one hand, the other on the other—
5
The one raised to happiness according to his desires of happiness, or
good according to his desires of good; and the other to evil according
to his desires of evil; for as he has desired to do evil all the day
long even so shall he have his reward of evil when the night cometh.
6
And so it is on the other hand. If he hath repented of his sins, and
desired righteousness until the end of his days, even so he shall be
rewarded unto righteousness.
7
These are they that are redeemed of the Lord; yea, these are they that
are taken out, that are delivered from that endless night of darkness;
and thus they stand or fall; for behold, they are their own judges,
whether to do good or do evil.
8
Now, the decrees of God are unalterable; therefore, the way is prepared that whosoever will may walk therein and be saved.
9
And now behold, my son, do not risk one more offense against your God
upon those points of doctrine, which ye have hitherto risked to commit
sin.
10
Do not suppose, because it has been spoken concerning restoration, that
ye shall be restored from sin to happiness. Behold, I say unto you,
wickedness never was happiness.
11
And now, my son, all men that are in a state of nature, or I would say,
in a carnal state, are in the gall of bitterness and in the bonds of
iniquity; they are without God in the world, and they have gone contrary
to the nature of God; therefore, they are in a state contrary to the
nature of happiness.
12
And now behold, is the meaning of the word restoration to take a thing
of a natural state and place it in an unnatural state, or to place it in
a state opposite to its nature?
13
O, my son, this is not the case; but the meaning of the word restoration
is to bring back again evil for evil, or carnal for carnal, or devilish
for devilish—good for that which is good; righteous for that which is
righteous; just for that which is just; merciful for that which is
merciful.
14
Therefore, my son, see that you are merciful unto your brethren; deal
justly, judge righteously, and do good continually; and if ye do all
these things then shall ye receive your reward; yea, ye shall have mercy
restored unto you again; ye shall have justice restored unto you again;
ye shall have a righteous judgment restored unto you again; and ye
shall have good rewarded unto you again.
15
For that which ye do send out shall return unto you again, and be
restored; therefore, the word restoration more fully condemneth the
sinner, and justifieth him not at all.
CHAPTER 42
1
And now, my son, I perceive there is somewhat more which doth
worry your mind, which ye cannot understand—which is concerning the
justice of God in the punishment of the sinner; for ye do try to suppose
that it is injustice that the sinner should be consigned to a state of
misery.
2
Now behold, my son, I will explain this thing unto thee. For behold,
after the Lord God sent our first parents forth from the garden of Eden,
to till the ground, from whence they were taken—yea, he drew out the
man, and he placed at the east end of the garden of Eden, cherubim, and a
flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the tree of life—
3
Now, we see that the man had become as God, knowing good and evil; and
lest he should put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life,
and eat and live forever, the Lord God placed cherubim and the flaming
sword, that he should not partake of the fruit—
4
And thus we see, that there was a time granted unto man to repent, yea, a probationary time, a time to repent and serve God.
5
For behold, if Adam had put forth his hand immediately, and partaken of
the tree of life, he would have lived forever, according to the word of
God, having no space for repentance; yea, and also the word of God would
have been void, and the great plan of salvation would have been
frustrated.
6
But behold, it was appointed unto man to die—therefore, as they were cut
off from the tree of life they should be cut off from the face of the
earth—and man became lost forever, yea, they became fallen man.
7
And now, ye see by this that our first parents were cut off both
temporally and spiritually from the presence of the Lord; and thus we
see they became subjects to follow after their own will.
8
Now behold, it was not expedient that man should be reclaimed from this
temporal death, for that would destroy the great plan of happiness.
9
Therefore, as the soul could never die, and the fall had brought upon
all mankind a spiritual death as well as a temporal, that is, they were
cut off from the presence of the Lord, it was expedient that mankind
should be reclaimed from this spiritual death.
10
Therefore, as they had become carnal, sensual, and devilish, by nature,
this probationary state became a state for them to prepare; it became a
preparatory state.
11
And now remember, my son, if it were not for the plan of redemption,
(laying it aside) as soon as they were dead their souls were miserable,
being cut off from the presence of the Lord.
12
And now, there was no means to reclaim men from this fallen state, which
man had brought upon himself because of his own disobedience;
13
Therefore, according to justice, the plan of redemption could not be
brought about, only on conditions of repentance of men in this
probationary state, yea, this preparatory state; for except it were for
these conditions, mercy could not take effect except it should destroy
the work of justice. Now the work of justice could not be destroyed; if
so, God would cease to be God.
14
And thus we see that all mankind were fallen, and they were in the grasp
of justice; yea, the justice of God, which consigned them forever to be
cut off from his presence.
15
And now, the plan of mercy could not be brought about except an
atonement should be made; therefore God himself atoneth for the sins of
the world, to bring about the plan of mercy, to appease the demands of
justice, that God might be a perfect, just God, and a merciful God also.
16
Now, repentance could not come unto men except there were a punishment,
which also was eternal as the life of the soul should be, affixed
opposite to the plan of happiness, which was as eternal also as the life
of the soul.
17
Now, how could a man repent except he should sin? How could he sin if
there was no law? How could there be a law save there was a punishment?
18
Now, there was a punishment affixed, and a just law given, which brought remorse of conscience unto man.
19
Now, if there was no law given—if a man murdered he should die—would he be afraid he would die if he should murder?
21
And if there was no law given, if men sinned what could justice do, or
mercy either, for they would have no claim upon the creature?
22
But there is a law given, and a punishment affixed, and a repentance
granted; which repentance, mercy claimeth; otherwise, justice claimeth
the creature and executeth the law, and the law inflicteth the
punishment; if not so, the works of justice would be destroyed, and God
would cease to be God.
23
But God ceaseth not to be God, and mercy claimeth the penitent, and
mercy cometh because of the atonement; and the atonement bringeth to
pass the resurrection of the dead; and the resurrection of the dead
bringeth back men into the presence of God; and thus they are restored
into his presence, to be judged according to their works, according to
the law and justice.
24
For behold, justice exerciseth all his demands, and also mercy claimeth
all which is her own; and thus, none but the truly penitent are saved.
25
What, do ye suppose that mercy can rob justice? I say unto you, Nay; not one whit. If so, God would cease to be God.
26
And thus God bringeth about his great and eternal purposes, which were
prepared from the foundation of the world. And thus cometh about the
salvation and the redemption of men, and also their destruction and
misery.
27
Therefore, O my son, whosoever will come may come and partake of the
waters of life freely; and whosoever will not come the same is not
compelled to come; but in the last day it shall be restored unto him
according to his deeds.
28
If he has desired to do evil, and has not repented in his days, behold,
evil shall be done unto him, according to the restoration of God.
29
And now, my son, I desire that ye should let these things trouble you no
more, and only let your sins trouble you, with that trouble which shall
bring you down unto repentance.
30
O my son, I desire that ye should deny the justice of God no more. Do
not endeavor to excuse yourself in the least point because of your sins,
by denying the justice of God; but do you let the justice of God, and
his mercy, and his long-suffering have full sway in your heart; and let
it bring you down to the dust in humility.
31
And now, O my son, ye are called of God to preach the word unto this
people. And now, my son, go thy way, declare the word with truth and
soberness, that thou mayest bring souls unto repentance, that the great
plan of mercy may have claim upon them. And may God grant unto you even
according to my words. Amen.
Mr. Twenty Twenty
Feb 13, 2013, 4:27:01 PM2/13/13
to dharm...@googlegroups.com
Hey mate,
Whoa.
I had no idea that Dharmaville was still in existence, and two....
Nice work.
Goona look it over in detail this weekend.
Be well,
TT
Whoa.
I had no idea that Dharmaville was still in existence, and two....
Nice work.
Goona look it over in detail this weekend.
Be well,
TT
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greg
Feb 14, 2013, 10:30:19 AM2/14/13
to dharm...@googlegroups.com
Yea, revived!
Still putting out great articles, TT.
After putting lots of things off for a long time, I'm finally getting some of them done. I hope to have a few short books out, then more. I guess once you do it, it's not anywhere as bad the second time around, or the third, or...
I recently remembered I even had some of your mp3's I had ordered but got lost on the computer--I felt like it was Christmas again, in February!
The table was done while reading after listening to the Persuasion package, then the metaprograms skeleton list from Leslie Cameron-Bandler, with my own (non NLP lingo stuff!) for things I thought of but either didn't see elsewhere or don't know about.
greg
Still putting out great articles, TT.
After putting lots of things off for a long time, I'm finally getting some of them done. I hope to have a few short books out, then more. I guess once you do it, it's not anywhere as bad the second time around, or the third, or...
I recently remembered I even had some of your mp3's I had ordered but got lost on the computer--I felt like it was Christmas again, in February!
The table was done while reading after listening to the Persuasion package, then the metaprograms skeleton list from Leslie Cameron-Bandler, with my own (non NLP lingo stuff!) for things I thought of but either didn't see elsewhere or don't know about.
greg
Mr. Twenty Twenty
Feb 14, 2013, 6:08:09 PM2/14/13
to Dharmaville
Looks like you are having fun mate.
That's the #1 factor in productivity - and learning.
I have a tiny suggestion. Write - kindle - books.
They are fun, easy to promote, and profitable.
(If you niche them well.)
You've got the mind.
TT
PS: I have a great Mindhacking book up there, that you might want. The link is:
The essence of knowledge is, having it, to apply it; not having it, to confess your ignorance.
What most people need to learn in life is how to love people and use things instead of using people and loving things.
greg
Mar 2, 2013, 1:56:41 AM3/2/13
to dharm...@googlegroups.com
What would be the difference between meta-programs and submodalities?
I'm guessing the things I used would be mostly meta-programs, and a little of both meta-programs and submodalities?
Ha, I can't believe I left out "moving away/ moving toward"!
I'm guessing the things I used would be mostly meta-programs, and a little of both meta-programs and submodalities?
Ha, I can't believe I left out "moving away/ moving toward"!
Mr. Twenty Twenty
Mar 6, 2013, 4:27:00 AM3/6/13
to Dharmaville
A more accurate model is:
Avoiding and Moving Toward.....
Submods: Visual could be movie vs still image.
Another visual submod could be in the movie or image / or watching it.
Another visual submod could be color / black and white.
I'm sure you get the drift.
Might as well drive some traffic. Search http://www.nlplive.com for more.
;)
The essence of knowledge is, having it, to apply it; not having it, to confess your ignorance.
What most people need to learn in life is how to love people and use things instead of using people and loving things.
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