Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

[Rabinder Koul]

Goutam Chatterji, You have studied for too long in a Christian School and now you are projecting Christianity on Dharma. You don't even understand Baudha that claims that there is no realty (Sat).

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Oct 29, 2011, at 8:52 AM, GOUTAM CHATTERJEE wrote:

BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM

26th September, 1893

I am not a Buddhist, as you have heard, and yet I am. If China, or Japan, or Ceylon follow the teachings of the Great Master, India worships him as God incarnate on earth. You have just now heard that I am going to criticise Buddhism, but by that I wish you to understand only this. Far be it from me to criticise him whom I worship as God incarnate on earth. But our views about Buddha are that he was not understood properly by his disciples. The relation between Hinduism (by Hinduism, I mean the religion of the Vedas) and what is called Buddhism at the present day is nearly the same as between Judaism and Christianity. Jesus Christ was a Jew, and Shâkya Muni was a Hindu. The Jews rejected Jesus Christ, nay, crucified him, and the Hindus have accepted Shâkya Muni as God and worship him. But the real difference that we Hindus want to show between modern Buddhism and what we should understand as the teachings of Lord Buddha lies principally in this: Shâkya Muni came to preach nothing new. He also, like Jesus, came to fulfil and not to destroy. Only, in the case of Jesus, it was the old people, the Jews, who did not understand him, while in the case of Buddha, it was his own followers who did not realise the import of his teachings. As the Jew did not understand the fulfilment of the Old Testament, so the Buddhist did not understand the fulfilment of the truths of the Hindu religion. Again, I repeat, Shâkya Muni came not to destroy, but he was the fulfilment, the logical conclusion, the logical development of the religion of the Hindus.

The religion of the Hindus is divided into two parts: the ceremonial and the spiritual. The spiritual portion is specially studied by the monks.

In that there is no caste. A man from the highest caste and a man from the lowest may become a monk in India, and the two castes become equal. In religion there is no caste; caste is simply a social institution. Shâkya Muni himself was a monk, and it was his glory that he had the large-heartedness to bring out the truths from the hidden Vedas and through them broadcast all over the world. He was the first being in the world who brought missionarising into practice — nay, he was the first to conceive the idea of proselytising.

The great glory of the Master lay in his wonderful sympathy for everybody, especially for the ignorant and the poor. Some of his disciples were Brahmins. When Buddha was teaching, Sanskrit was no more the spoken language in India. It was then only in the books of the learned. Some of Buddha's Brahmins disciples wanted to translate his teachings into Sanskrit, but he distinctly told them, "I am for the poor, for the people; let me speak in the tongue of the people." And so to this day the great bulk of his teachings are in the vernacular of that day in India.

Whatever may be the position of philosophy, whatever may be the position of metaphysics, so long as there is such a thing as death in the world, so long as there is such a thing as weakness in the human heart, so long as there is a cry going out of the heart of man in his very weakness, there shall be a faith in God.

On the philosophic side the disciples of the Great Master dashed themselves against the eternal rocks of the Vedas and could not crush them, and on the other side they took away from the nation that eternal God to which every one, man or woman, clings so fondly. And the result was that Buddhism had to die a natural death in India. At the present day there is not one who calls oneself a Buddhist in India, the land of its birth.

But at the same time, Brahminism lost something — that reforming zeal, that wonderful sympathy and charity for everybody, that wonderful heaven which Buddhism had brought to the masses and which had rendered Indian society so great that a Greek historian who wrote about India of that time was led to say that no Hindu was known to tell an untruth and no Hindu woman was known to be unchaste.

Hinduism cannot live without Buddhism, nor Buddhism without Hinduism. Then realise what the separation has shown to us, that the Buddhists cannot stand without the brain and philosophy of the Brahmins, nor the Brahmin without the heart of the Buddhist. This separation between the Buddhists and the Brahmins is the cause of the downfall of India. That is why India is populated by three hundred millions of beggars, and that is why India has been the slave of conquerors for the last thousand years. Let us then join the wonderful intellect of the Brahmins with the heart, the noble soul, the wonderful humanising power of the Great Master.

[Rabinder Koul]

Suresh ji, There are many instances in Mahabharata where Both Shri Krisha and Shri VedaVyaasa eat meat. Take for example the Raajsooya Yagynya of Yudhishtra. So why this obsessive compulsive insistence of vegetarianism? 

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Oct 29, 2011, at 9:04 PM, Suresh Vyas wrote:

Dear Arjun ji,

So, then what is your understanding of Gita please?

Did you learn Gita from your guru, or just make your interpretation?
How did your guru learn the message of Gita?

Could you please give one specific example of a wrong interpretation of Gita verse done by Prabhupad? What bad consequence the wrong interpretation did?

Are you a bhakti yogi or other yogi?

What damage, if any, the teaching of Chaitanya does to the Vedics?
Whose Gita translation you recommend for the Vedics?

These are my curious questions. You may answer if you like.
Thanks.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:09 PM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

no they practise one of many  bhaktis and their case its known as guadhyia vaishnavism where believe that Swami Chataniya was an incarnation of Krishna himself ...Ive studied their books and literature inside out and there is many distortions especially in their version of the Gita which ends up in total opposite to Krishnas message.This is the problem with many hindus who dont do their research or do not look at everything within a historical context to why certain hindu beliefs arise and evolved but then fall into the monotheist template just like the HKs and the arya samaj also do and many other confused hindus and then they wonder why the enemy spins circles around them...

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2011, 11:43
Subject: Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

They preach krishna bhakti.
Bhakti yog is one of the several yogas Krishna talks about in Gita.

At this time, when we need Vedic unity, there is no need to speak low of any yoga that is not suitable for one.

One can do saadhna of only one yoga. So, a Vedic needs is to respect all types of yogas and yogis, and keep doing one's own yoga / sadhnaa.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

The HKs are not a  genuine source for historical or spiritual facts because just like the Arya Samaj they also push their own version of things..Buddhism itself survived upon the mercy of meat eating hindus and thats a fact..

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>
To: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>
Cc: shyam_n...@yahoo.com; bcm...@gmail.com; satish...@yahoo.com; arjun...@yahoo.co.uk; psab...@hotmail.com; bhano...@gmail.com; hita...@gmail.com; kata...@aol.com; sadhak_...@yahoo.com; jitender...@gmail.com; kri...@hindupedia.com; shankara...@yahoo.com; london...@yahoo.co.uk; tinasa...@yahoo.com; irmamuns...@gmail.com; sande...@hotmail.com; ani...@yahoo.co.uk; govind...@hotmail.com; rishi...@hotmail.com; ranbir...@talktalk.net; culturalbri...@yahoo.com; tcgm...@hotmail.com; vyshv...@gmail.com; live_by...@yahoo.co.uk; drmna...@yahoo.co.uk; rsin...@yahoo.com; brah...@yahoo.com; aryasam...@yahoogroups.com; aryayou...@yahoogroups.com; bhagav...@yahoo.ca; akansh...@yahoo.com; arya...@hotmail.com; mish...@aol.com; msb...@yahoo.com; naveen...@yahoo.co.in; arun_...@yahoo.com; jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in; puneet...@gmail.com; ashwini...@yahoo.ca; eka...@btinternet.com; jayasw...@gmail.com; as_...@rediffmail.com; baksh...@yahoo.com; op.t...@gmail.com; bharat...@gmail.com; ahven...@gmail.com; gir...@aryasamaj.com; arr...@ameritech.net; desi...@googlegroups.com; vijaya...@yahoo.com; ashoks...@rediffmail.com; satyar...@gmail.com; vsg...@yahoo.com; arya.v...@gmail.com; kcg...@yahoo.com; su_...@ymail.com; ajaya...@gmail.com; rajpa...@yahoo.com
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2011, 10:36
Subject: Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

In the time of Buddha many people had become meat eaters.
Even the Vedics were killing animals in sacrifices (yagyas).

Seeing this, (says Bhaktivedant Swami Prabhupad), Buddha saw that the whole humanity is going to hell. Meat eating makes the mind so dull that one cannot understand the science of aatma and paramaatmaa, and therefore one cannot progress spiritually.

So, Buddha did not talk about soul or supersoul (even though he know it), and talked only about pain and suffering. He wanted people to be compassionate so that they could stop killing/eating animals, and become able to understand spiritual science.

The existance of soul is a bit harder to prove, although by inference it can be proved; but existence of pain to the living beings can be easily seen.  So Buddhas said, "Animals also feel pain as you do; so why give pain to animals or kill them?"

Buddhism is not a complete dharma because violence also has it correct and proper use.

Krishna has said that one must fight adharmis and adharma, even violently if so necessary. Buddhism lacks this message. As a result, Dalai Lala recently said that he is unable to convince China to give autonomy to Tibet. In Malaysia Buddhist monks are killed by Muslims. And monk commit suicide for political reason.

So, the Vedic dharma is the complete dharma, and Buddhsim is a subset of it.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

--
Jai Sri KrishNa!
Suresh Vyas

--
Jai Sri KrishNa!
Suresh Vyas

--
Jai Sri KrishNa!
Suresh Vyas

[Rabinder Koul]

History of the Muslim Brotherhood...

http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/mbhood_en.html

Muslim Brotherhood unites with Hitler’s Third Reich

1933-2002

1933 Hitler rises to power

After humiliation of WWI, Germany votes overwhelmingly in favor of Hitler’s Fascist regime.  

  Hitler and Muslim Brotherhood Find Common Ground

Hitler’s vision of ethnic cleansing of non-Aryans becomes appealing to the Wahhabis of the Muslim Brotherhood [vii] .  The West and the Jews is the common enemy.  Muslim Brotherhood acquires Hitler’s methods of genocide to rid the Arab world of its non-Muslims.

1933

 Nazi Parties Appear

Throughout Arab World [viii]

 

Young Egypt.  Led by Muslim Brotherhood member Abdul Gamal Nasser (future Egyptian President).  Young Egypt’s political slogan “One Folk, One Party, One Leader” is a direct translation from German of Nazi slogan.

Social Nationalist Party in Syria [ix] .  Led by Anton Saada (known as the Syrian Fuhrer)

                      
Syrian Social Nationalist Party Flag

1939-1945

 Husseini calls

Nazi Muslim Troops

“Cream of Islam”

Amin Al-Husseini spends WWII in Germany at Hitler’s side.  He establishes Muslim Nazi troops and becomes heavily involved in the genocide of Jews, Gypsies and Serbs. (See Husseini section).

Husseini calls Nazi Muslim troops “the Cream of Islam”.

1944

Amin al Husseini

Co-Founder and President of

Arab League

  Amin Al-Husseini is one of the primary founders and the inspiration of Arab League.  Goal is to reinforce Wahhabi vision of Pan-Islamic unity.  Founding countries are: Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Syria and Yemen. 

Husseini, still in Germany, is appointed to President in Absentia of Fourth Higher Committee of Arab League.

1945

Amin Al-Husseini

Leader of Muslim Brotherhood

 

Mid-1940.  Amin Al-Husseini is appointed leader of Muslim Brotherhood in Jerusalem. He becomes number one active importer of Nazi methodology to the Middle East.  Husseini flees to Egypt.  He is wanted by Yugoslavia for War Crimes and Crimes Against Humanity perpetrated during WWII.

1949-1952

ODESSA

Network 

Nazis Join Muslim Brotherhood

 ODESSA network.  Egypt, home of Muslim Brotherhood, and Syria incorporate thousands of Nazi experts into Egyptian and Syrian army, government and propaganda service. Vatican heavily involved in providing travel visas for Nazi officers.

Amin Al-Husseini providing safe haven to ex-Nazis in Arab lands. He is the main connection with Francois Genoud, Swiss banker of Third Reich, who finances the ODESSA network with money stolen from murdered European Jews.

 

Francois Genoud

Hitler’s Swiss Banker

Finds A New Employer

After World War II, Amin Al-Husseini was visited multiple times in Beirut by Hitler’s Swiss banker, Francois Genoud.

Genoud finances the ODESSA network. He sponsors Arab Nationalism with Nazi money.  In Cairo and Tangiers, Genoud sets up import-export company called Arabo-Afrika, which is a cover to disseminate anti-Jewish and anti-Israeli propaganda.

Genoud sets up Swiss bank accounts for North African liberation armies of Morocco, Tunisia and Algeria.  In partnership with Syria, he sets up Arab Commercial Bank in Geneva.  In 1962, he becomes Director of Arab People’s Bank in Algeria. [x]

Arab League and Muslim Brotherhood :
Voice of Amin Al-Husseini into the 20^th and 21^st Century
1945-2002

Legacy of Death and Hate

Over Ten Million Human Beings Murdered in half a century

[GOUTAM CHATTERJEE]

[Arjun]

The HKs are not a  genuine source for historical or spiritual facts because just like the Arya Samaj they also push their own version of things..Buddhism itself survived upon the mercy of meat eating hindus and thats a fact..

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>
To: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>
Cc: shyam_n...@yahoo.com; bcm...@gmail.com; satish...@yahoo.com; arjun...@yahoo.co.uk; psab...@hotmail.com; bhano...@gmail.com; hita...@gmail.com; kata...@aol.com; sadhak_...@yahoo.com; jitender...@gmail.com; kri...@hindupedia.com; shankara...@yahoo.com; london...@yahoo.co.uk; tinasa...@yahoo.com; irmamuns...@gmail.com; sande...@hotmail.com; ani...@yahoo.co.uk; govind...@hotmail.com; rishi...@hotmail.com; ranbir...@talktalk.net; culturalbri...@yahoo.com; tcgm...@hotmail.com; vyshv...@gmail.com; live_by...@yahoo.co.uk; drmna...@yahoo.co.uk; rsin...@yahoo.com; brah...@yahoo.com; aryasam...@yahoogroups.com; aryayou...@yahoogroups.com; bhagav...@yahoo.ca; akansh...@yahoo.com; arya...@hotmail.com; mish...@aol.com; msb...@yahoo.com; naveen...@yahoo.co.in; arun_...@yahoo.com; jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in; puneet...@gmail.com; ashwini...@yahoo.ca; eka...@btinternet.com; jayasw...@gmail.com; as_...@rediffmail.com; baksh...@yahoo.com; op.t...@gmail.com; bharat...@gmail.com; ahven...@gmail.com; gir...@aryasamaj.com; arr...@ameritech.net; desi...@googlegroups.com; vijaya...@yahoo.com; ashoks...@rediffmail.com; satyar...@gmail.com; vsg...@yahoo.com; arya.v...@gmail.com; kcg...@yahoo.com; su_...@ymail.com; ajaya...@gmail.com; rajpa...@yahoo.com
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2011, 10:36
Subject: Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

In the time of Buddha many people had become meat eaters.
Even the Vedics were killing animals in sacrifices (yagyas).

Seeing this, (says Bhaktivedant Swami Prabhupad), Buddha saw that the whole humanity is going to hell. Meat eating makes the mind so dull that one cannot understand the science of aatma and paramaatmaa, and therefore one cannot progress spiritually.

So, Buddha did not talk about soul or supersoul (even though he know it), and talked only about pain and suffering. He wanted people to be compassionate so that they could stop killing/eating animals, and become able to understand spiritual science.

The existance of soul is a bit harder to prove, although by inference it can be proved; but existence of pain to the living beings can be easily seen.  So Buddhas said, "Animals also feel pain as you do; so why give pain to animals or kill them?"

Buddhism is not a complete dharma because violence also has it correct and proper use.

Krishna has said that one must fight adharmis and adharma, even violently if so necessary. Buddhism lacks this message. As a result, Dalai Lala recently said that he is unable to convince China to give autonomy to Tibet. In Malaysia Buddhist monks are killed by Muslims. And monk commit suicide for political reason.

So, the Vedic dharma is the complete dharma, and Buddhsim is a subset of it.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 6:52 AM, GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Arjun]

theres no such thing as fulfilment in hindu dharma because its always evolving..Its because india took to buddhism under Ashoka it weakened but when Hinduism was revived it took the invaders on and survived.And Bhuddism was not a anti caste movement like this article is claiming ,If Buddhism was some great fulfilment then we wouldn't be seeing the taliban ( ex buddhists) blowing up Buddhist statues in afghanistan which was buddhist at one time..

---

From: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>
To: shyam_n...@yahoo.com; bcm...@gmail.com; satish...@yahoo.com; arjun...@yahoo.co.uk; psab...@hotmail.com; bhano...@gmail.com; hita...@gmail.com; kata...@aol.com; sadhak_...@yahoo.com; jitender...@gmail.com; kri...@hindupedia.com; shankara...@yahoo.com; london...@yahoo.co.uk; tinasa...@yahoo.com; irmamuns...@gmail.com; sande...@hotmail.com; ani...@yahoo.co.uk; govind...@hotmail.com; rishi...@hotmail.com; ranbir...@talktalk.net; culturalbri...@yahoo.com; tcgm...@hotmail.com; vyshv...@gmail.com; live_by...@yahoo.co.uk; drmna...@yahoo.co.uk; rsin...@yahoo.com; brah...@yahoo.com; aryasam...@yahoogroups.com; aryayou...@yahoogroups.com; bhagav...@yahoo.ca; akansh...@yahoo.com; arya...@hotmail.com; mish...@aol.com; msb...@yahoo.com; naveen...@yahoo.co.in; arun_...@yahoo.com; jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in; puneet...@gmail.com; ashwini...@yahoo.ca; eka...@btinternet.com; jayasw...@gmail.com; as_...@rediffmail.com; baksh...@yahoo.com; skan...@gmail.com; op.t...@gmail.com; bharat...@gmail.com; ahven...@gmail.com; gir...@aryasamaj.com; arr...@ameritech.net; desi...@googlegroups.com; vijaya...@yahoo.com; ashoks...@rediffmail.com; satyar...@gmail.com; vsg...@yahoo.com; arya.v...@gmail.com; kcg...@yahoo.com; su_...@ymail.com; ajaya...@gmail.com; rajpa...@yahoo.com
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2011, 5:52
Subject: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

[Arjun]

no they practise one of many  bhaktis and their case its known as guadhyia vaishnavism where believe that Swami Chataniya was an incarnation of Krishna himself ...Ive studied their books and literature inside out and there is many distortions especially in their version of the Gita which ends up in total opposite to Krishnas message.This is the problem with many hindus who dont do their research or do not look at everything within a historical context to why certain hindu beliefs arise and evolved but then fall into the monotheist template just like the HKs and the arya samaj also do and many other confused hindus and then they wonder why the enemy spins circles around them...

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>

To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2011, 11:43

Subject: Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

They preach krishna bhakti.
Bhakti yog is one of the several yogas Krishna talks about in Gita.

At this time, when we need Vedic unity, there is no need to speak low of any yoga that is not suitable for one.

One can do saadhna of only one yoga. So, a Vedic needs is to respect all types of yogas and yogis, and keep doing one's own yoga / sadhnaa.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

[Arjun]

and saying that reading their books will find so many attacks on other gurus and other sects so what vedic unity you talking about ? sorry mate some of us have done our homework...

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>

To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2011, 11:43

Subject: Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

They preach krishna bhakti.
Bhakti yog is one of the several yogas Krishna talks about in Gita.

At this time, when we need Vedic unity, there is no need to speak low of any yoga that is not suitable for one.

One can do saadhna of only one yoga. So, a Vedic needs is to respect all types of yogas and yogis, and keep doing one's own yoga / sadhnaa.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

[Arjun]

ok now you want to me to waste my time on a useless debate on hundreds of emails where we are going to debate prabhupads Gita and then you will copy and paste me how prahbupada's gita is the right one And then you are asking me the typical HK questions when they think they are being clever where i have to tell what bhakti i do or  or which guru i learnt the gita from while hinduism ect while meanwhile Hinduism is being attacked from all sides....Instead of just chanting hare krishna all day go and learn the real message  of the Gita by going out and fighting for the hindu cause and then maybe you might find out krishnas message very clearly..

,Meanwhile heres something to ponder on...Prabhupads controversial   views on women

Lecture on BG 16.7 — Hawaii, February 3, 1975

Prabhupada: Otherwise it doesn’t matter what he is, which family he’s born. It doesn’t matter. Krsna says, you’ll find, mam hi partha vyapasritya ye ‘pi syuh papa-yonayah BG 9.32 . Papa-yoni. To take birth low-grade family, or animal family, these are called papa-yoni. Krsna says that it doesn’t matter if one is born in the papa-yoni, low-grade family. It doesn’t matter. Mam hi partha vyapasritya ye ‘pi syuh papa-yonayah. In the human society, striyah sudras tatha vaisyah, even woman and sudra and vaisya, they are also taken in the category of papa-yoni. Papa-yoni means their intelligence is not very sharp. That is called papa-yoni. And a brahmana means to become very, very highly intellectual. That is called brahmana. Because he’ll understand Brahman.

SB 4.4.3 purport

Prabhupada: Generally, separation between husband and wife is due to womanly behavior; divorce takes place due to womanly weakness. The best course for a woman is to abide by the orders of her husband.

Lecture on SB — Sept. 13, 1969

Prabhupada: In India still, the system is follow(ed) in conservative families that a widow cannot marry. There is no widow marriage in India. They, the… Manu-samhita, the law-givers, the saintly persons, Manu-samhita… Why widow marriage is prohibited? The idea is generally, everywhere, in all countries, the female population is greater than the male population. So the idea is that she has become widow. She was once married. Now if again she is married, another virgin girl, she does not get the chance of being married. Therefore there is no widow marriage according to Hindu scripture. And a man is allowed, if he is, I mean to say able man, he can marry more than one wife. Not that simply marry. To get more than one wife does not mean sense enjoyment. The wife must be maintained very respectfully. She must have good house, good ornaments, good food, good servants.

Lecture on BG — Hawaii, February 3rd, 1975

Prabhupada: To understand Brahman is not the business of tiny brain. Alpha-medhasan. There are two Sanskrit words, alpa-medhasa and sumedhasa. Alpa-medhasa means having little brain substance. Physiologically, within the brain there are brain substance. It is found that the brain substance in man is found up to 64 ounce. They are very highly intellectual persons. And in woman the brain substance is not found more than 34 ounce. You’ll find, therefore, that there is no very great scientist, mathematician, philosopher, among women. You’ll never find because their brain substance cannot go.

Artificially do not try to become equal with men. That is not allowed in the Vedic sastra. Na striyam svatantratam arhati. That is called sastra. You have to understand that woman is never given to be independence. Independence means just like child has to be taken care, similarly, woman has to be taken care. You cannot get your child go in the street alone. There will be danger. Similarly, according to Vedic civilization, Manu-samhita, woman should be given protection. In this way, acara, this is called acara. So the demons, they do not know. The demons, they do not know what is what, how one thing should be treated, how… They do not know. In the Western countries there is no such distinction between man and woman. But there is.

Morning Walk — May 1, 1974, Bombay

Prabhupada: Put problems. I’ll solve.

Yogesvara: Here’s a problem. The women today want the same rights as men. How can they be satisfied?

Prabhupada: Everything will be satisfied. Just like our women, Krsna conscious, they are working. They don’t want equal rights with men. It is due to Krsna consciousness. They are cleansing the temple, they are cooking very nicely. They are satisfied. They never say that “I have to go to Japan for preaching like Prabhupad.” They never say. This is artificial. So Krsna consciousness means work in his constitutional position. The women, men, when they remain in their constitutional position, there will be no artificial (indistinct) (loud traffic noises)

Bhagavan: They say that our women are unintelligent because they submit so easily, but…

Prabhupada: Subway?

Dhananjaya: No. This is also public transport, other trains.

Bhagavan: But actually, our women are so qualified in so many ways, but these girls who simply work in the city can do nothing. They can’t cook, they can’t clean, they can’t sew.

Prabhupada: All rubbish. These modern girls, they are all rubbish. Therefore they are simply used for sex satisfaction. Topless, bottomless…

Letter to Disciple — 23rd October, 1972

My dear Soucharya devi,

…Another item is, you are married wife, so in that position you should serve your husband nicely, always being attentive to his needs, and in this way, because he is always absorbed in serving Krishna, by serving your husband you will also get Krishna, through him. He is your spiritual master, but he must be responsible for giving you all spiritual help, teaching you as he advances his own knowledge and realization. That is the vedic system: The wife becomes a devotee of her husband, the husband becomes a devotee of Krishna; the wife serves her husband faithfully, the husband protects his wife by giving her spiritual guidance. So you should simply do whatever your husband instructs you to do, however he may require your assistance. Of course, the nature of woman is to be attached to her husband and family, so our system is to minimize this attachment by making the ultimate goal of our activity the pleasure of Krishna. Just try to please Krishna always, and no material circumstances will be able to cause you any discomfort.

Hoping this meets you in good health. Your ever well-wisher, A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami

Television Interview — July 9, 1975, Chicago

Woman reporter: But you say women are subordinate to men?

Prabhupada: Yes, that is also natural. Because when the husband and wife are there or the father and daughter is there, so the daughter is subordinate to the father and the wife is subordinate to the husband.

Woman reporter: What happens when women are not subordinate to men?

Prabhupada: Then there is disruption. There is disruption, social disruption. If the woman does not become subordinate to man, then there is social disruption. Therefore, in the western countries there are so many divorce cases because the woman does not agree to become subordinate to man. That is the cause.

SB 9.3.10 purport

Prabhupada: However great a woman may be, she must place herself before her husband in this way; that is to say, she must be ready to carry out her husband’s orders and please him in all circumstances. Then her life will be successful. When the wife becomes as irritable as the husband, their life at home is sure to be disturbed or ultimately completely broken. In the modern day, the wife is never submissive, and therefore home life is broken even by slight incidents. Either the wife or the husband may take advantage of the divorce laws. According to the Vedic law, however, there is no such thing as divorce laws, and a woman must be trained to be submissive to the will of her husband. Westerners contend that this is a slave mentality for the wife, but factually it is not; it is the tactic by which a woman can conquer the heart of her husband, however irritable or cruel he may be. In this case we clearly see that although Cyavana Muni was not young but indeed old enough to be Sukanyā’s grandfather and was also very irritable, Sukanyā, the beautiful young daughter of a king, submitted herself to her old husband and tried to please him in all respects. Thus she was a faithful and chaste wife.

SB 9.6.53 purport

Prabhupada: As stated in Bhagavad-Gita (9.32), striyo vaisyas tatha sudras te ‘pi yanti param gatim. Women are not considered very powerful in following spiritual principles, but if a woman is fortunate enough to get a suitable husband who is spiritually advanced and if she always engages in his service, she also gets the same benefit as her husband. Here it is clearly said that the wives of Saubhari Muni also entered the spiritual world by the influence of their husband. They were unfit, but because they were faithful followers of their husband, they also entered the spiritual world with him. Thus a woman should be a faithful servant of her husband, and if the husband is spiritually advanced, the woman will automatically get the opportunity to enter the spiritual world.

SB 3.23.2 purport

Prabhupada: Here two words are very significant. Devahuti served her husband in two ways, visrambhena and gauravena. These are two important processes in serving the husband or the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Visrambhena means “with intimacy,” and gauravena means “with great reverence.” The husband is a very intimate friend; therefore, the wife must render service just like an intimate friend, and at the same time she must understand that the husband is superior in position, and thus she must offer him all respect. A man’s psychology and woman’s psychology are different. As constituted by bodily frame, a man always wants to be superior to his wife, and a woman, as bodily constituted, is naturally inferior to her husband. Thus the natural instinct is that the husband wants to post himself as superior to the wife, and this must be observed. Even if there is some wrong on the part of the husband, the wife must tolerate it, and thus there will be no misunderstanding between husband and wife. Visrambhena means “with intimacy,” but it must not be familiarity that breeds contempt. According to the Vedic civilization, a wife cannot call her husband by name. In the present civilization the wife calls her husband by name, but in Hindu civilization she does not. Thus the inferiority and superiority complexes are recognized. Damena ca: a wife has to learn to control herself even if there is a misunderstanding. Sauhrdena vaca madhuraya means always desiring good for the husband and speaking to him with sweet words. A person becomes agitated by so many material contacts in the outside world; therefore, in his home life he must be treated by his wife with sweet words.

Morning Walk — March 19, 1976, Mayapura

Prabhupāda: Ādi-puruṣam. Govindam ādi-puruṣam, that puruṣa. Govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi. We are worshiping that supreme and original person. And the women are declaring, “independent.” They are begging door to door to a man, “Please give me shelter. Give me a child,” and they’re independent. One American woman, was…. She was speaking that “In India the woman are treated as slave. We don’t want.” So I told her that it is better to become slave of one person than to slave of become hundreds. (laughter) The woman must become a slave. So instead of becoming slaves of so many persons, it is better to remain satisfied, a slave of one person. So she was stopped. She was the secretary of that Dr. Misra. You know that? And our Vedic civilization says, narī-rūpaṁ pati-vratam: “The woman is beautiful when she remains as a slave to the husband.” That is the beauty, not the personal beauty. How much she has learned to remain as a slave to the husband, that is Vedic civilization. Kokilānāṁ svaro rūpam. The cuckoo, it is black bird, but why people love it? Because of the sweet voice. Kokilānāṁ svaro rūpaṁ vidyā-rūpaṁ kurūpaṇam. A man may be ugly, black, but if he’s learned, everyone will respect him. And narī-rūpaṁ pati-vratam. And the beauty of woman is how much she is devoted and obedient to the husband. So it is very difficult.

Lecture on SB 1.2.2 — Rome, May 26, 1974

Prabhupada: The duty of Vaisnava is to reclaim these fallen souls. Just like Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita, mam hi partha vyapasritya ye ‘pi syuh papa-yonayah. Find out this verse:

mam hi partha vyapasritya
ye ‘pi syuh papa-yonayah
striyo vaisyas tatha sudras
te ‘pi yanti param gatim

Krsna says, “Anyone who comes under My shelter, never mind he is the lowest of the low, lowborn…” The striyo vaisyah… Formerly, even the woman and the mercantile community and sudras, they were also considered as papa-yoni. Papa-yoni means whose brain is not very developed. That is papa-yoni. Blunt-headed. What is that?

Nitai:

“O son of Prtha, those who take shelter in Me, though they be of lower birth—woman, vaisyas merchants, as well as sudras, workers—can approach the supreme destination.”

Prabhupada: So the supreme destination, back to Godhead, back to home, is for everyone. It is not that God… God means for everyone. God does not say, “Only the brahmana class of men, please come here. Others all rejected.” No. He is inviting everyone. Even the lowest of the lowest, low-born, papa-yonayah, women, sudra, or vaisyas, everyone.

Morning Walk — January 9, 1977, Bombay

Prabhupada: I condemn everyone, that “You are all dogs and hogs.” And United Nations a pack of dogs barking. That’s a fact. And in Chicago I said, all women, “You cannot have freedom. You have got only thirty-four-ounce brain, and man has got sixty-four-ounce.” I told them. So I became a subject of very great criticism.

Trivikrama: Women’s liberation.

Prabhupada: I denied, “No, you cannot have.” I told them. One girl in the airship, she was seeing like (makes some gesture-laughter). I asked her, “Give me 7-Up.” “It is locked now.” So I frankly said that “No, no. You cannot have equal rights because your brain is thirty-four ounce.” Actually that’s a fact. Where is woman philosopher, mathematician, scientist? Not a single.

Dr. Patel: Apart from that, I mean, they are made for a particular mission.

Prabhupada: How they can have equal rights? Up to date in the history there is not a single woman who is a great scientist or great philosopher or great…

Dr. Patel: Madame Curie was a…

Prabhupada: All bogus. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: You are getting too harsh on them because…

Prabhupada: No, no. How can I give you equal rights, because your brain is less substance.

Dr. Patel: We cannot degrade our mothers that way.

Prabhupada: It is not degrading. It is accepting the actual fact.

Press Conference — July 9, 1975, Chicago

Reporter (3): (a woman) Where… Do women fit into this social structure? You keep referring to man.

Prabhupada: Woman is not equally intelligent as a man.

Reporter (3): Equal in intelligence?

Prabhupada: Not equal intelligence. In the psychology, practical psychology, they have found that the man’s brain has been found up to sixty-four ounce, woman… Sixty-four ounce, man’s brain. And woman’s brain has been found, thirty-six ounce. So therefore woman is not equally intelligent like man.

Lecture on SB 1.3.21 — Los Angeles, September 26, 1972

Prabhupada: And it has been found that a woman does not have more than thirty-six ounce of brain substance, whereas in man it has been found that he has got up to sixty-four ounce. Now, this is modern science. Therefore generally, generally, woman, less intelligent than man. You cannot find any big scientist, any big mathematician, any big philosopher amongst woman. That is not possible. Although in your country, you want equal status with man, freedom, but by nature you are less intelligent. What can be done? (laughter)

Interview with Trans-India Magazine — July 17, 1976, New York

Prabhupada: So actually this varnasrama system is meant for bringing the man in the lower status of life to the higher status of life. It doesn’t matter one is born in a low-grade family. That is also said by Krsna: mam hi partha vyapasritya ye ‘pi syuh papa-yonayah. Papa-yoni, lower grade. Striyo vaisyas tatha sudrah BG 9.32 . In the human society, woman, the vaisya and the sudra, they are considered in the lower status, not very intelligent.

Lecture on BG 1.40 — London, July 28, 1973

Prabhupada: Canakya Pandita says: visvasam naiva kartavyam strisu raja-kulesu ca. Visvasam naiva kartavyam. “Don’t trust women.” Visvasam naiva kartavyam strisu. Strisu means women. Raja-kula… And politicians. Yes. Visvasam naiva kartavyam strisu raja-kulesu ca. Never the trust the politician and woman. Of course, when woman comes to Krsna consciousness, that position is different. We are speaking of ordinary woman. Because Krsna says, in another place, striyo vaisyas tatha sudrah BG 9.32 . They are considered, women, vaisya, the mercantile community, and sudra, and the worker class, they are less intelligent. Papa-yoni. When the progeny is defective, then they become less intelligent.

SB 1.7.42 purport

Prabhupada: Women as a class are no better than boys, and therefore they have no discriminatory power like that of a man.

BG 1.40 purport

-According to Canakya Pandita, women are generally not very intelligent and therefore not trustworthy.
-As children are very prone to be misled, women are similarly very prone to degradation.

BG 16.7 purport

Prabhupada: Now, in the Manu-samhita it is clearly stated that a woman should not be given freedom. That does not mean that women are to be kept as slaves, but they are like children. The demons have now neglected such injunctions, and they think that women should be given as much freedom as men.

SB 3.31.41, purport

Prabhupada: A woman’s attachment to her husband may elevate her to the body of a man in her next life, but a mans attachment to woman will degrade him, and in his next life he will get the body of a woman.

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>

Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2011, 18:04

Subject: Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Dear Arjun ji,

So, then what is your understanding of Gita please?

Did you learn Gita from your guru, or just make your interpretation?
How did your guru learn the message of Gita?

Could you please give one specific example of a wrong interpretation of Gita verse done by Prabhupad? What bad consequence the wrong interpretation did?

Are you a bhakti yogi or other yogi?

What damage, if any, the teaching of Chaitanya does to the Vedics?
Whose Gita translation you recommend for the Vedics?

These are my curious questions. You may answer if you like.
Thanks.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:09 PM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

[Rabinder Koul]

There are not only Vaishnava Sampradaayas in Dharma. There are Savites and Shaktas, who are not vegetarians...

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Oct 30, 2011, at 2:58 PM, Suresh Vyas wrote:

It is a higher standard in the Vedic dharma for spiritual progress. Additionally, kshatriyas are allowed to eat meat of the animals they kill hunting to practice violence. We do not force anything on others. Karma takes care of actions one does in life. We the Vedics have five Vaishnav sampradayas who preach vegetarianism, which has scientific reasons also for it.

It is said that we can do as Ram did, bot not as Krishna did; we can inly folllow what Krishna says us. And he has not said us to eat animals. I know, sikhs do eat meat, but their dharma is kshatiya dharma.

However, every Vedic should refrain from cow eating.
By eating cow, one loses the identity as a Vedic.

Vedic scriptures do not encourage animal killing or eating.
Gita does not, and Gita is the summary of the Vedas.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

[Arjun]

never knew hitler was spiritually progressive for being a vegetarian or least most of the times..

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>

To: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
Cc: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, 30 October 2011, 11:58

Subject: Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

It is a higher standard in the Vedic dharma for spiritual progress. Additionally, kshatriyas are allowed to eat meat of the animals they kill hunting to practice violence. We do not force anything on others. Karma takes care of actions one does in life. We the Vedics have five Vaishnav sampradayas who preach vegetarianism, which has scientific reasons also for it.

It is said that we can do as Ram did, bot not as Krishna did; we can inly folllow what Krishna says us. And he has not said us to eat animals. I know, sikhs do eat meat, but their dharma is kshatiya dharma.

However, every Vedic should refrain from cow eating.
By eating cow, one loses the identity as a Vedic.

Vedic scriptures do not encourage animal killing or eating.
Gita does not, and Gita is the summary of the Vedas.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 7:50 PM, Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net> wrote:

[Rabinder Koul]

Krishna did not sent special message to you. Mahbharata he is integral part of it.. And I don't recall him admonishing any one for eating Meat.. Heck he himself ate so did Vyaasa and other Rishis...

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

[Arjun]

well whatever his views on Buddhism or Hinduism but he didt become a worshipper of rotting corpse on a wooden cross did he.Even he knew that xtianty  was a load of inbred trash

---

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, 30 October 2011, 19:49
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Valmiki says that Ram and Sita ate meat. But Gautama Buddha oposed meat eating.

In May 1956, a talk by Ambedkar titled "Why I like Buddhism and how it is useful to the world in its present circumstances" was broadcast from the British Broadcasting Corporation, London. In his talk Ambedkar said:

I prefer Buddhism because it gives three principles in combination, which no other religion does. Buddhism teaches prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality). This is what man wants for a good and happy life. Neither god nor soul can save society.

In his last speech delivered in Bombay in May 24 1956, in which he declared his resolve to embrace Buddhism, Ambedkar observed:

Hinduism believes in God. Buddhism has no God. Hinduism believes in soul. According to Buddhism, there is no soul. Hinduism believes in Chaturvarnya and the caste system. Buddhism has no place for the caste system and Chaturvarnya.

It is obvious that Ambedkar regarded Buddhism as a much more rational religion compared to Hinduism, rather the most rational religion. His main objection to Hinduism was that it sanctified inequality and untouchability through its doctrine of Chaturvarnya. Buddhism, on the other hand, rejected Chaturvarnya and supported equality. He commends Buddhism for rejecting god and soul and for emphasizing morality. According to him, prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality), which Buddhism alone teaches, is all that human beings need for a "good and happy life".  

Ambedkar’s final religious act was to embrace Buddhism. His work The Buddha and his Dhamma contains his own understanding and interpretation of Buddhism. We may say that Buddhism as expounded in this book is what Ambedkar embraced and recommended. In this book Ambedkar has tried to interpret Buddhism in a rationalistic manner. Ambedkar did not believe in the existence of god and soul. This is obvious from the reasons he has given for embracing Buddhism as well as from his interpretation of Buddhism in Buddha and His Dhamma. In Buddhism, as interpreted by Ambedkar, there is no place for god and soul. Further, according to Ambedkar, Buddha did not believe in rebirth, karma and moksha as traditionally conceived. Besides, Buddha rejected the varna vyavastha. Buddhism was a totally different religion.

Buddha opposed Hinduism, Hindu rites and rituals. He opposed the Vedas. So Buddhism is a different religion like Christianity and Islam. Some Hindu extremists want to add Buddhism also as a part of Hinduism. They call Buddha as an avatar of Ram, forgetting the fact that the Buddha openly denounced hinduism. Fanatical Gupta kings fought against Buddhism to save Hinduism. So it is foolish to call Buddhism a branch of Hinduism. 

---

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>

To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satishprakash@yahoo.n May 1956, a talk by Ambedkar titled "Why I like Buddhism and how it is useful to the world in its present circumstances" was broadcast from the British Broadcasting Corporation, London. In his talk Ambedkar said:

I prefer Buddhism because it gives three principles in combination, which no other religion does. Buddhism teaches prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality). This is what man wants for a good and happy life. Neither god nor soul can save society.

In his last speech delivered in Bombay in May 24 1956, in which he declared his resolve to embrace Buddhism, Ambedkar observed:

Hinduism believes in God. Buddhism has no God. Hinduism believes in soul. According to Buddhism, there is no soul. Hinduism believes in Chaturvarnya and the caste system. Buddhism has no place for the caste system and Chaturvarnya.

It is obvious that Ambedkar regarded Buddhism as a much more rational religion compared to Hinduism, rather the most rational religion. His main objection to Hinduism was that it sanctified inequality and untouchability through its doctrine of Chaturvarnya. Buddhism, on the other hand, rejected Chaturvarnya and supported equality. He commends Buddhism for rejecting god and soul and for emphasizing morality. According to him, prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality), which Buddhism alone teaches, is all that human beings need for a "good and happy life".  

Ambedkar’s final religious act was to embrace Buddhism. His work The Buddha and his Dhamma contains his own understanding and interpretation of Buddhism. We may say that Buddhism as expounded in this book is what Ambedkar embraced and recommended. In this book Ambedkar has tried to interpret Buddhism in a rationalistic manner. Ambedkar did not believe in the existence of god and soul. This is obvious from the reasons he has given for embracing Buddhism as well as from his interpretation of Buddhism in Buddha and His Dhamma. In Buddhism, as interpreted by Ambedkar, there is no place for god and soul. Further, according to Ambedkar, Buddha did not believe in rebirth, karma and moksha as traditionally conceived. Besides, Buddha rejected the varna vyavastha.

com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>

Sent: Sunday, 30 October 2011 12:13 AM
Subject: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

 

They preach krishna bhakti.
Bhakti yog is one of the several yogas Krishna talks about in Gita.

At this time, when we need Vedic unity, there is no need to speak low of any yoga that is not suitable for one.

One can do saadhna of only one yoga. So, a Vedic needs is to respect all types of yogas and yogis, and keep doing one's own yoga / sadhnaa.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

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[Arjun]

heheh your idea of a fair discussion is that everyone should agree with you and your inferiority complex of being a brown faced native wanting to be a blue eyed blond westerner like that rotting corpse on a wooden cross with his paedophile catholic church which you worship..Theres never been any historical evidence to that character from your bible which is a total joke itself.oh i get it according  to  you because Jerusalem is in the news that somehow make christianty authentic.Well the last 6 months libyia has been the main news so that must mean Colonel Gaddafi must be your saviour lol Ive already given you your hate and rape from the bible which you conveniently ignored knowing its all true

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From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>

Sent: Monday, 31 October 2011, 20:21

Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Arjun is not patient enough for a fair discussion. He does not know, perhaps, that Jesus was not, unlike many gods and goddesses, a character in a mythology or legend or story. Arjun should know that it is not the Jesus on the cross but the resurrected Jesus is the God of the modern civilized world. Supreme Court Judge wrote in the Hindu paper about Jesus:

Krishna Iyer's Christmas greetings

   

Jesus Christ was perhaps history's most radical humanist liberationist who was sent to the Cross and suffered crucifixion for the salvation of suffering humanity. For him, humanity was one and consequent of his suffering, the whole world was free, the former Supreme Court judge and eminent jurist V.R. Krishna Iyer said here on Friday. In his Christmas message, Mr. Krishna Iyer said, “We are all our suffering brother's keeper and must sacrifice all that we possess for the sake of elimination of human deprivation and subjection. In this supremely divine dimension every humanist is a follower of Jesus, I am emphatically a Christian. His great message is meant for all mankind. Therefore Christmas is not confined to Christians. It embraces the rejoicings of all Creation. Only in this sense Jesus Christ, the liberator of the sufferings of the world, will fulfil himself. I bow before you Jesus. Let us strive to wipe every tear from every eye. Let us abandon violence and love everyone even your enemies. That is haven of peace and no war.”

 

 

Christian legacy

Christianity preserved the legacy of Christ, that is, Jesus' revelation to mankind teaching the sole path to heaven and the efficacious means to get there. Christianity eradicated the savage practices of paganism, human sacrifice, mutilation and cannibalism. It developed systems of education, the inception of science and the complex systems of government. Its monks preserved classical literature, history and law, recopying them over and over in their monasteries for posterity when the barbarians swept in and destroyed all. The apex of the humanities was achieved in Christian renaissance art and medieval architecture, in music with Gregorian chant and polyphony. Christianity matured philosophy, metaphysics, cosmology and epistemology. It explored and catalogued the world, reduced savagery and spread civilization. It united nations and races with through its ideology. It introduced the moral code by which most people today live. The popular concepts of justice and decency, mercy and compassion are all Christian-based and Christian chivalry is so deeply ingrained that people expect others to be polite, charitable and well-mannered, even complete strangers to one another. Christianity aids the poor, protects the dignity of women, builds hospitals, orphanages, schools and services them with religious who work solely for the glory of God. It promotes and provides the seven acts of corporeal and spiritual mercy, which benefit society at every level. Most importantly, it educated people about God and their duties to Him and to each other. Christianity would assert many abuses committed by Christians were done in opposition to Christian teaching. 

Even yesterday a case of human sacrifice occurred in North India. What would have happened if Christianity had not come to India with its religious-sanctioning of  burning alive of young widows (sati), brutal killings of lower castes, killing of baby girls immediately after birth(female infanticied) ,child marriage, forcibly killing of aged parents by feeding them with mud and water on the banks of the Ganga, women not allowed to cover their breasts and a multitude of barbarous customs and superstitions?  

Can you burn alive a young widow today?

 

 

 

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From: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>

Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>

Sent: Monday, 31 October 2011 4:30 PM

MARKETPLACE

&lt;img width=&quot;1&quot; height=&quot;1&quot; alt=&quot;&quot; src=&quot;http://us.bc.yahoo.com/b?P=09f47d52-02cf-11e1-ac57-83a795969319&amp;T=1dkqh15qp%2fX%3d1319962404%2fE%3d1705077353%2fR%3dgroups%2fK%3d5%2fV%3d2.1%2fW%3dH%2fY%3dYAHOO%2fF%3d554898057%2fH%3dY29udGVudD0iQXZhdGFycztZYWhvb19QYXJlbnRhbF9Db250cm9sO01vYmlsZTtQb2RjYXN0cztMYXVuY2hfTXVzaWM7TWVzc2VuZ2VyO0tub3dsZWRnZV9TZWFyY2g7TW92aWVzO01haWw7QnJpZWZjYXNlOyIgZGlzYWJsZXNodWZmbGluZz0iMSIgc2VydmVJZD0iMDlmNDdkNTItMDJjZi0xMWUxLWFjNTctODNhNzk1OTY5MzE5IiBzaXRlSWQ9IjQ0NTI1NTEiIHRTdG1wPSIxMzE5OTYyNDA0NjMzMzI2IiA-%2fQ%3d-1%2fS%3d1%2fJ%3dAD238962&amp;U=13cjnv7ua%2fN%3d2ImpGdj8el0-%2fC%3d493064.14543979.14562481.13298430%2fD%3dMKP1%2fB%3d6060255%2fV%3d1&quot;&gt;

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[Arjun]

actually you are crying but now trying to convince us that your are laughing otherwise you wouldnt replying to any of the emails to convince us that your dead zombie corpse on a wooden cross is real..Now do you want more quotes from that toilet rag known as a bible to cry even more ?

---

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>

Sent: Tuesday, 1 November 2011, 7:54

Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

While laughing at your ignorance and biased mind which cannot accept the truth, but repeating the same nonsesne, I feel that I can argue only with intellectuals, Your reply has no relevance to the matter on hand.I'm giving below the true experience of a tourist.

 

09.14.09 | 10:37 AM ET

Delhi rail lines

The train platform at New Delhi central station is about as wretched a place as you’d want to find yourself in the wee hours of the morning. It’s nearly 2 a.m. which, here in India, means that the 8 p.m. overnight to Varanasi should depart in about an hour. Karen and I have staked out a small patch of concrete and dirt that is almost entirely free of rotting garbage and human waste. We’ve gone a full three minutes without anyone trying to beg/sell/pilfer anything, but the Shih Tzu-sized rats are getting bolder. One of them is actually leafing through my Lonely Planet book while another is laying waste to a bag of trail mix from our day pack. I am exhausted and sweaty and cultivating a rash of mysterious origins.

Look, I’m not a sissy. I have trudged through more third-world shitholes than most people have ever heard of, and, by and large, I’ve loved every minute of it. I’ve survived Cambodian bedbugs, bowel-trampling food poison in Petra and a 400-pound Bahamian customs officer with a serious crush on me. And I dig it; I like a challenge.

But right now, I’m spent. There are parts of this experience that I just cannot square with my normally forgiving moral compass. Yes, there’s “cultural distinctiveness,” but there’s also “bereft of civilized decency.” Surely there has to be a point where some foreign cultural norm clashes unforgivably with one’s personal core beliefs. I mean, how far can you open your mind before your brain falls out?

How am I supposed to see beauty when I am so continually confronted with the backward and barbaric?

The four guys at the end of the train platform aren’t helping my attitude even a little. They are staring us down and giggling like a gaggle of Japanese schoolgirls. They’ve been studying us and plotting their approach for about 20 minutes now. When they finally make their play, they each shove someone else to the front of the pack as they approach, physically nominating a spokesman.

The skinny one in the middle summons the courage to ask what they’ve clearly been discussing at length:

Skinny Guy: “Are you a love marriage?”

I’ll be honest and say that I was appalled the first time I flipped open an Indian newspaper and found the “Matrimonials,” an entire section of the paper dedicated to families shilling their daughters in hopes of finding a suitable man. It’s a personal ad, of sorts, with height, weight, education and family status included and there are various sub-categories when the family is looking for a groom of a particular social status or occupation.

Families often go into unrecoverable debt to provide a dowry large enough to attract a higher status groom. Assuming a proper dowry and provided the astrologer sees nothing bad in the commingling of signs, the match is made.

Divorce is legal, but rare. A divorced woman is unlikely to find good employment and a family that takes in a divorced female is thought to bring shame into the house.

The truly tragic lot, however, belongs to widows. A widow is an omen of bad fortune—surely anyone whose husband has died must carry terrible karma—and is often not welcome at family functions or celebrations. Many family members will refuse to touch her or take meals in her presence. It’s not uncommon for widowed women to turn to prostitution or begging to survive.

In rare instances, a widow may choose “sati,” the ritual of joining your dead husband’s funeral pyre and burning to death. The practice was banned in 1987 but it still happens, and women who choose sati are, in some circles, glorified and worshiped.

This is what I am thinking as this tittering flock of strangers hovers in my personal space waiting for a reply.

“Yes,” I tell him, “we’re a love marriage.”

And they giggle and nod and whisper something indecipherable to each other.

Hours later, as we settle into our mercifully cool and quiet train compartment, we meet Claire and Megan. They’re British medical students who, like us, are wrapping up a glorious and torturous month of traveling around India.

Next stop for Claire is Washington, D.C., where she’s landed a highly coveted spot training in an American ER. Brimming with excitement, she tells me that there’s nowhere else for a medical student to get such frequent, hands-on experience with gunshot wounds. Apparently, nowhere else in the world do people shoot each other on such a regular basis.

Late that night, crammed into a single berth, Karen and I are drifting off to the rhythmic clatter of the train. I’m staring at the ceiling and wondering what Claire will think of my country once she’s come and gone. It is equal parts amazing and imperfect, visionary and dysfunctional.

 

We will continue the discussion in the next post with special reference to gods and goddesses, since you have made some silly comments on Jesus.

From: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, 1 November 2011 1:23 PM
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

heheh your idea of a fair discussion is that everyone should agree with you and your inferiority complex of being a brown faced native wanting to be a blue eyed blond westerner like that rotting corpse on a wooden cross with his paedophile catholic church which you worship..Theres never been any historical evidence to that character from your bible which is a total joke itself.oh i get it according  to  you because Jerusalem is in the news that somehow make christianty authentic.Well the last 6 months libyia has been the main news so that must mean Colonel Gaddafi must be your saviour lol Ive already given you your hate and rape from the bible which you conveniently ignored knowing its all true

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, 31 October 2011, 20:21
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Arjun is not patient enough for a fair discussion. He does not know, perhaps, that Jesus was not, unlike many gods and goddesses, a character in a mythology or legend or story. Arjun should know that it is not the Jesus on the cross but the resurrected Jesus is the God of the modern civilized world. Supreme Court Judge wrote in the Hindu paper about Jesus:

Krishna Iyer's Christmas greetings

   

Jesus Christ was perhaps history's most radical humanist liberationist who was sent to the Cross and suffered crucifixion for the salvation of suffering humanity. For him, humanity was one and consequent of his suffering, the whole world was free, the former Supreme Court judge and eminent jurist V.R. Krishna Iyer said here on Friday. In his Christmas message, Mr. Krishna Iyer said, “We are all our suffering brother's keeper and must sacrifice all that we possess for the sake of elimination of human deprivation and subjection. In this supremely divine dimension every humanist is a follower of Jesus, I am emphatically a Christian. His great message is meant for all mankind. Therefore Christmas is not confined to Christians. It embraces the rejoicings of all Creation. Only in this sense Jesus Christ, the liberator of the sufferings of the world, will fulfil himself. I bow before you Jesus. Let us strive to wipe every tear from every eye. Let us abandon violence and love everyone even your enemies. That is haven of peace and no war.”

 

 

Christian legacy

Christianity preserved the legacy of Christ, that is, Jesus' revelation to mankind teaching the sole path to heaven and the efficacious means to get there. Christianity eradicated the savage practices of paganism, human sacrifice, mutilation and cannibalism. It developed systems of education, the inception of science and the complex systems of government. Its monks preserved classical literature, history and law, recopying them over and over in their monasteries for posterity when the barbarians swept in and destroyed all. The apex of the humanities was achieved in Christian renaissance art and medieval architecture, in music with Gregorian chant and polyphony. Christianity matured philosophy, metaphysics, cosmology and epistemology. It explored and catalogued the world, reduced savagery and spread civilization. It united nations and races with through its ideology. It introduced the moral code by which most people today live. The popular concepts of justice and decency, mercy and compassion are all Christian-based and Christian chivalry is so deeply ingrained that people expect others to be polite, charitable and well-mannered, even complete strangers to one another. Christianity aids the poor, protects the dignity of women, builds hospitals, orphanages, schools and services them with religious who work solely for the glory of God. It promotes and provides the seven acts of corporeal and spiritual mercy, which benefit society at every level. Most importantly, it educated people about God and their duties to Him and to each other. Christianity would assert many abuses committed by Christians were done in opposition to Christian teaching. 

Even yesterday a case of human sacrifice occurred in North India. What would have happened if Christianity had not come to India with its religious-sanctioning of  burning alive of young widows (sati), brutal killings of lower castes, killing of baby girls immediately after birth(female infanticied) ,child marriage, forcibly killing of aged parents by feeding them with mud and water on the banks of the Ganga, women not allowed to cover their breasts and a multitude of barbarous customs and superstitions?  

Can you burn alive a young widow today?

 

 

 

From: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, 31 October 2011 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

well whatever his views on Buddhism or Hinduism but he didt become a worshipper of rotting corpse on a wooden cross did he.Even he knew that xtianty  was a load of inbred trash

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, 30 October 2011, 19:49
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Valmiki says that Ram and Sita ate meat. But Gautama Buddha oposed meat eating.

In May 1956, a talk by Ambedkar titled "Why I like Buddhism and how it is useful to the world in its present circumstances" was broadcast from the British Broadcasting Corporation, London. In his talk Ambedkar said:

I prefer Buddhism because it gives three principles in combination, which no other religion does. Buddhism teaches prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality). This is what man wants for a good and happy life. Neither god nor soul can save society.

In his last speech delivered in Bombay in May 24 1956, in which he declared his resolve to embrace Buddhism, Ambedkar observed:

Hinduism believes in God. Buddhism has no God. Hinduism believes in soul. According to Buddhism, there is no soul. Hinduism believes in Chaturvarnya and the caste system. Buddhism has no place for the caste system and Chaturvarnya.

It is obvious that Ambedkar regarded Buddhism as a much more rational religion compared to Hinduism, rather the most rational religion. His main objection to Hinduism was that it sanctified inequality and untouchability through its doctrine of Chaturvarnya. Buddhism, on the other hand, rejected Chaturvarnya and supported equality. He commends Buddhism for rejecting god and soul and for emphasizing morality. According to him, prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality), which Buddhism alone teaches, is all that human beings need for a "good and happy life".  

Ambedkar’s final religious act was to embrace Buddhism. His work The Buddha and his Dhamma contains his own understanding and interpretation of Buddhism. We may say that Buddhism as expounded in this book is what Ambedkar embraced and recommended. In this book Ambedkar has tried to interpret Buddhism in a rationalistic manner. Ambedkar did not believe in the existence of god and soul. This is obvious from the reasons he has given for embracing Buddhism as well as from his interpretation of Buddhism in Buddha and His Dhamma. In Buddhism, as interpreted by Ambedkar, there is no place for god and soul. Further, according to Ambedkar, Buddha did not believe in rebirth, karma and moksha as traditionally conceived. Besides, Buddha rejected the varna vyavastha. Buddhism was a totally different religion.

Buddha opposed Hinduism, Hindu rites and rituals. He opposed the Vedas. So Buddhism is a different religion like Christianity and Islam. Some Hindu extremists want to add Buddhism also as a part of Hinduism. They call Buddha as an avatar of Ram, forgetting the fact that the Buddha openly denounced hinduism. Fanatical Gupta kings fought against Buddhism to save Hinduism. So it is foolish to call Buddhism a branch of Hinduism. 

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satishprakash@yahoo.n May 1956, a talk by Ambedkar titled "Why I like Buddhism and how it is useful to the world in its present circumstances" was broadcast from the British Broadcasting Corporation, London. In his talk Ambedkar said:

I prefer Buddhism because it gives three principles in combination, which no other religion does. Buddhism teaches prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality). This is what man wants for a good and happy life. Neither god nor soul can save society.

In his last speech delivered in Bombay in May 24 1956, in which he declared his resolve to embrace Buddhism, Ambedkar observed:

Hinduism believes in God. Buddhism has no God. Hinduism believes in soul. According to Buddhism, there is no soul. Hinduism believes in Chaturvarnya and the caste system. Buddhism has no place for the caste system and Chaturvarnya.

It is obvious that Ambedkar regarded Buddhism as a much more rational religion compared to Hinduism, rather the most rational religion. His main objection to Hinduism was that it sanctified inequality and untouchability through its doctrine of Chaturvarnya. Buddhism, on the other hand, rejected Chaturvarnya and supported equality. He commends Buddhism for rejecting god and soul and for emphasizing morality. According to him, prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality), which Buddhism alone teaches, is all that human beings need for a "good and happy life".  

Ambedkar’s final religious act was to embrace Buddhism. His work The Buddha and his Dhamma contains his own understanding and interpretation of Buddhism. We may say that Buddhism as expounded in this book is what Ambedkar embraced and recommended. In this book Ambedkar has tried to interpret Buddhism in a rationalistic manner. Ambedkar did not believe in the existence of god and soul. This is obvious from the reasons he has given for embracing Buddhism as well as from his interpretation of Buddhism in Buddha and His Dhamma. In Buddhism, as interpreted by Ambedkar, there is no place for god and soul. Further, according to Ambedkar, Buddha did not believe in rebirth, karma and moksha as traditionally conceived. Besides, Buddha rejected the varna vyavastha.

com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, 30 October 2011 12:13 AM
Subject: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

They preach krishna bhakti.
Bhakti yog is one of the several yogas Krishna talks about in Gita.

At this time, when we need Vedic unity, there is no need to speak low of any yoga that is not suitable for one.

One can do saadhna of only one yoga. So, a Vedic needs is to respect all types of yogas and yogis, and keep doing one's own yoga / sadhnaa.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

The HKs are not a  genuine source for historical or spiritual facts because just like the Arya Samaj they also push their own version of things..Buddhism itself survived upon the mercy of meat eating hindus and thats a fact..

.

__,_._,___

[Rabinder Koul]

We know Jesus is the only Bastard, where God raped the Marry & produced Jesus! That is the beginning of the obsession with Sin.of Christians.

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Oct 31, 2011, at 11:21 PM, Radhakrishnan P wrote:

Arjun is not patient enough for a fair discussion. He does not know, perhaps, that Jesus was not, unlike many gods and goddesses, a character in a mythology or legend or story. Arjun should know that it is not the Jesus on the cross but the resurrected Jesus is the God of the modern civilized world. Supreme Court Judge wrote in the Hindu paper about Jesus:

Krishna Iyer's Christmas greetings

   

Jesus Christ was perhaps history's most radical humanist liberationist who was sent to the Cross and suffered crucifixion for the salvation of suffering humanity. For him, humanity was one and consequent of his suffering, the whole world was free, the former Supreme Court judge and eminent jurist V.R. Krishna Iyer said here on Friday. In his Christmas message, Mr. Krishna Iyer said, “We are all our suffering brother's keeper and must sacrifice all that we possess for the sake of elimination of human deprivation and subjection. In this supremely divine dimension every humanist is a follower of Jesus, I am emphatically a Christian. His great message is meant for all mankind. Therefore Christmas is not confined to Christians. It embraces the rejoicings of all Creation. Only in this sense Jesus Christ, the liberator of the sufferings of the world, will fulfil himself. I bow before you Jesus. Let us strive to wipe every tear from every eye. Let us abandon violence and love everyone even your enemies. That is haven of peace and no war.”

 

 

Christian legacy

Christianity preserved the legacy of Christ, that is, Jesus' revelation to mankind teaching the sole path to heaven and the efficacious means to get there. Christianity eradicated the savage practices of paganism, human sacrifice, mutilation and cannibalism. It developed systems of education, the inception of science and the complex systems of government. Its monks preserved classical literature, history and law, recopying them over and over in their monasteries for posterity when the barbarians swept in and destroyed all. The apex of the humanities was achieved in Christian renaissance art and medieval architecture, in music with Gregorian chant and polyphony. Christianity matured philosophy, metaphysics, cosmology and epistemology. It explored and catalogued the world, reduced savagery and spread civilization. It united nations and races with through its ideology. It introduced the moral code by which most people today live. The popular concepts of justice and decency, mercy and compassion are all Christian-based and Christian chivalry is so deeply ingrained that people expect others to be polite, charitable and well-mannered, even complete strangers to one another. Christianity aids the poor, protects the dignity of women, builds hospitals, orphanages, schools and services them with religious who work solely for the glory of God. It promotes and provides the seven acts of corporeal and spiritual mercy, which benefit society at every level. Most importantly, it educated people about God and their duties to Him and to each other. Christianity would assert many abuses committed by Christians were done in opposition to Christian teaching. 

Even yesterday a case of human sacrifice occurred in North India. What would have happened if Christianity had not come to India with its religious-sanctioning of  burning alive of young widows (sati), brutal killings of lower castes, killing of baby girls immediately after birth(female infanticied) ,child marriage, forcibly killing of aged parents by feeding them with mud and water on the banks of the Ganga, women not allowed to cover their breasts and a multitude of barbarous customs and superstitions?  

Can you burn alive a young widow today?

 

 

 

---

From: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>

Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>

Sent: Monday, 31 October 2011 4:30 PM

MARKETPLACE

&lt;img width=&quot;1&quot; height=&quot;1&quot; alt=&quot;&quot; src=&quot;http://us.bc.yahoo.com/b?P=09f47d52-02cf-11e1-ac57-83a795969319&amp;T=1dkqh15qp%2fX%3d1319962404%2fE%3d1705077353%2fR%3dgroups%2fK%3d5%2fV%3d2.1%2fW%3dH%2fY%3dYAHOO%2fF%3d554898057%2fH%3dY29udGVudD0iQXZhdGFycztZYWhvb19QYXJlbnRhbF9Db250cm9sO01vYmlsZTtQb2RjYXN0cztMYXVuY2hfTXVzaWM7TWVzc2VuZ2VyO0tub3dsZWRnZV9TZWFyY2g7TW92aWVzO01haWw7QnJpZWZjYXNlOyIgZGlzYWJsZXNodWZmbGluZz0iMSIgc2VydmVJZD0iMDlmNDdkNTItMDJjZi0xMWUxLWFjNTctODNhNzk1OTY5MzE5IiBzaXRlSWQ9IjQ0NTI1NTEiIHRTdG1wPSIxMzE5OTYyNDA0NjMzMzI2IiA-%2fQ%3d-1%2fS%3d1%2fJ%3dAD238962&amp;U=13cjnv7ua%2fN%3d2ImpGdj8el0-%2fC%3d493064.14543979.14562481.13298430%2fD%3dMKP1%2fB%3d6060255%2fV%3d1&quot;&gt;

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__,_._,___

[Rabinder Koul]

Mrr Pee: 

 Do you agree that Jesus was not the son of Maty's husband? There are only two answers, he was or he was not. If was son of Mary's husband then he is not Son of so called god. So all Christian theology falls on its face. If on the other hand he was not the Son of Mary's husband, then God at least committed and Mary committed Adultery with god, per the definition of Christians view. In both cases he becomes a bastard. It is logically flawless, and you being what you are too dumb to understand that. Is it too honest and difficult for you.

I have already shown you earlier that Christianity is founded on the contradicting principles earier, and you had no response to logical deductions, perhaps you are still getting Modern. Me as a Brahman, ha ve been educated far befor your Jesus was even born. I have heard recently some of you have wanted to show him visiting Kashmir and getting educated their. (May be you may want to read that Rozabal .) I understand some of you have realized that true civilization the master civilization was in Indio, and now want ti claim that this illegitimate child Jesus came to India to redeem himself.  But I don't think he could ever be redeemed.

Even Indus valley civilization; that is long time ago before you changed changed your parentage, from brown to white, to feel better about the way you feel about yourself, the toilets were built within the houses. You need to really educate yourself. 

Mr Pee, you can make g=fool of these Christian idiots, whole of the medical Science tells you that a woman who givens birth, is no more Virgin. But then how can you tell it to a person who believes that earth came in to existence in 4001 BC, and the life did not arise out of the evolution, and the earth is Flat. These are the Christian beliefs, clearly what you think is Modern..What idiots are these Christians that they believe in fairy tails.  You want to buy Brooklyn bridge, I am selling it...

This Jesus was not even an ordinary Sanyasi, for he was very quarrelsome and disruptive. Finally caught for his crimes and literally nailed for it. He was so powerful, that he could not even defend himself. That shame has been transformed for you modern idiots as he dies for you. He died for his grave crimes, served him right... But that was not last of the christian crime, You continued that with Pagans of Europe, Pagans of Armenia, Turkey and finally grand slam in the Holocaust. In the Annals of world history, there no more wicked a community than the Christians followed by Muslims. 

You see I told you Christianity is all about sex. As if they have been made the Cowkidars of the female parts.  There is nothing else in Bible except killing and teh sexual morality. EVen the knowledge is a sexula crime, so it is a dangerous thing for Christians. You should thank Arabs who took Indian Mathematics and educated the christian of the Europe, Later on Jesuits came here stole the Calculus from teh Pingla Svhool and passed itas Newtons and Lebinitz creation. Theft, foolery, usurping, Genocides and teh holocausts are Christin doing. Look your ugly face in the Mirror and feel ashamed, if their is even an ounce of Indianness left in you. You see so long you look brown, Christians will lookdown upon you, and as Indian you lookdown upon yourself. You must be living a miserable l;ife. I pity you...

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Nov 1, 2011, at 10:32 PM, Radhakrishnan P wrote:

Rabinder Koul in his frustration has given a reply which once again reveals his venom against modern civilization - an offspring of Christianity. A few years ago orthodox Hindus, following Manu's code, used to build their home latrine away from home. They could not think of a toilet inside a house, for it is against Hindu ethics and Vedic rites. Now everybody is insisting on bath-attached bedroom. These people  want European toilet too! 

Koul has made a derogatory remarks on Jesus. What he fails to understand is that it was virgin birth that gave divinity to Jesus. Otherwise he would be an ordinary sanyasi. While immaculate nature emerges from Jesus' life, Dr. Ambedkar gives the following from his book, Dr. Babasahib Ambbedkar writings and Speeches, Vol.4: "Krishna belonged to the Vrasni (yadava family). The Yadavas were polygamous. Yadava kings had innumerable wives and innumerable sons. According to Matsya Purana, King Taittiri, an ancestor of Krishna, married his own daughter and begot her son by name Nala. Krishna’s son Sambha was attracted by his mother’s well developed physical features, especially breasts. The Matsya Purana tells how Samba lived an illicit life not only with his own mother but also with the other wives of his father Krishna. Hindu scriptures tell us that Krishna came to know about this sexual got angry and cursed Samba and his wives for their illicit sex. There is a reference to this secret sex in the Mahabharata also. Satyabhama, Krishna’s wife, asked Draupadi the secret of her power over her five husbands. Draupadi warned Satyabhama against staying in private with her stepsons. Samba’s bother, Pradyumna (Krishna’s another son) married his foster mother Mayawati. What morals! What gods! Sons marrying mothers; fathers having sex with daughters! What moral lesson can we get from such gods and goddesses immersed in sexual debauchery?

Koulji can now see the difference from the holy life of Jesus and other gods (and goddesses too).

 

---

From: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
Cc: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>; Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 2 November 2011 5:11 AM

MARKETPLACE

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[Dirgha Raj Prasai]

Jesus Christ, Christian Religion its Origin

By Dirgha Raj Prasai
The ideological differences on Jesus Christ and the Christian religion
are being analyzed with emphasis on historical facts and being
centralized on question pertaining to the search of the starting point
of the world’s religions. The ancient Vedic Hindu religion is the
genesis of civilization. Vedic traditional Hinduism of the old age is
the devotee of the Panchadeva (five Gods). ‘Omkar Jagat (followers of
OM) is the devotee of Vedic Hindu traditions. The worship of Gods and
Goddess- Ganesh (an elephant headed God), Bhagawati (Goddess), Surya
(Sun), Shiva (Lord Shiva) and Bishnu(the creator of the world), is
compulsory for one who is facing crisis. We confer respect to one
another on account of the ancient Vedic Hindu religion. We want Nepal
to remain a stable Hindu and Buddhist nation. Nepal is the birth place
of both these two religion-Hindu and Buddha. First of all, we should
be convinced that the religion is realization; not talk, not doctrine,
nor theories, however beautiful they may be. It is being and becoming,
not hearing or acknowledging; it is the whole soul becoming changed
into what it believes. So,
religion is the manifestation of the Divinity already in man. Then, we
should understand that the Hindu religion is very ancient, practical
and democratic in the way of human life.
Muslim and Christian religions took birth long after the creation of
Hindu religion and its civilization. Hindus and Buddhists of Nepal are
highly liberal. They respect either of the religions, Christian and
Muslim. However, Hindus will not tolerate the attempt made on
attacking the popular religion of this place by coming here and trying
to evangelize people following other religions. In Nepal, Hindus and
Buddhists do not bear any ill will towards Muslims. This is so because
Muslims follow their own religion and respect Hinduism and Buddhism,
not attack them. So we are not angry towards Muslims. Hindus of Nepal
are suspicious and angry towards the Christian workers brokers.
Christian's supporters want to destroy Nepal’s identity. Some Nepalese
were turned into Christians before 1768 A.D after the Malla rulers
came under influence.
After 1768 A.D the creator of the big Nepal, Prithvi Narayan Shah
chased away Capuchin and Christian preachers due to their suspicious
activities. So, from then they bore a negative attitude towards Nepal.
Facts are not obtained by being angry. Shiva, Buddha and Jesus Christ
did not find the right path without deep meditation. The Christians
must know who they are, where the religion started and then give
respect to other religions. To refrain from all evils, to do what is
good, to purify the mind; these are the lesson of all religions. Then,
why are Christians forgetting our history and their
originality-'Hinduism'?
'Long before the dawn of civilizations in other parts of the world,
the Vedic sages and seers of Nepal and Bharatavarsha (India) evolved a
scientific, universal and eternal way of life, Sanatana Dharma or
Hindu Dharma, which spread to distant continents. The Rishis
discovered that the source of all creation is a nameless, formless
Supreme Being--Parama Purusha--who's Energy or Power manifests as the
entire universe. Modern science agrees with the truth that the entire
creation is manifestation of Consciousness or Consciousness - Force as
Sri Aurobindo rightly calls. Sun, the source of material world and all
forms of life was adored as Savitru -- the stimulator or one who
vivifies--and His power, as Gayatri--that which protects those who
live in tune with Nature. Sun, without which life is impossible, was
symbolically represented in the Fire--Agni--and adoration of Fire--
Agnihotra -- came into existence.' (Mohan Gupta)
In the context of world religions, we should research the originality
of the religions. Jesus Christ and his mother Mary were influenced by
Hindu. It may be the Christianity was founded on the life and
teachings of a Jew named Jesus Christ. "Christ" is a title and it
comes from the Greek form of the Hebrew Messiah, meaning 'anointed
one.' The English word "Jesus" comes from the Greek form of the Hebrew
Joshua, a common name which means 'savior.' Christianity was founded
on the life and teachings of a Jew named Jesus Christ. Among all
religions of the world, Hindu religion is considered as an ancient
religion that is recognized as the foundation of civilization and as
the most liberal democratic way of life. Almost, 250 years ago, when
present India (Hindustan) was not in existence, there were more than
25 nations, the great King Prithvi Narayan Shah expressed 1768 –"Nepal
is true Hindustan"
Dr. Swami Prapannacharya in his book ‘Bed Ma Ke Chhha’ has quoted from
Sri Baba Swanker, preacher Gopalacharya, Dr. Bukanin, Dr. Spencer,
Russian intellectual Dr. Nikal Sanoto from a book ‘Unknown Life of
Jesus’ that, “The birth of Jesus Christ was in a Hindu family of
India. There is a statue of Christ’s mother 'Mary' in Florence. Such a
statue is also found in the Church of Macmillan. In the statue Mary is
wearing a just Nepalese & Indian's women's dress (Sari-Cholo) like
that of Hindu queen and a red patch of vermillion (Tika) on the
forehead like that of Hindus. Many western intellectuals have also
believed that Christ took birth in a Hindu family. ‘God is Light’ is
the line of Lord Shiva, light of Christians.
In an art house in Munich, Germany a statue of Jesus Christ is found
wearing a robe of a Hindu ascetic with a patch of red vermillion-mark
made on forehead (Tika). In the statue found in Florence Jesus is
wearing a sacred thread (Janai) like that of a Hindu Bhramin. A
picture found at the Vatican Palace in Rome shows Christ having a
length of bound hair beginning at the center of a shaved head (known
as Tupi in Hinduism) and wearing cloth worn round the waist (Dhoti),
looking an appearance of a righteous man (Sadhu). An authoritarian
regime of Israel executed Christ who had stayed in Nepal for six years
doing meditation. He came back from the grave, as he had acted as if
dead, with the power of meditation and left for India.
An Indian scholar Rajiv Malhotra writes-'The fact is that the Vaidik
Yogic path of embodied-knowing seeks to dissolve the historical ego,
individual and collective, as false. It sees the Christian fixations
on history and the associated guilt, as bondage and illusions to be
erased
through spiritual practice. Its physical postures are only the tip of
an iceberg, beneath which is a distinct metaphysics with profound
depth and breadth. Its spiritual benefits are undoubtedly available to
anyone regardless of religion.'
Similarly, an Indian scholar Prem Sabhlok expresses-The metaphysics of
Socrates and Plato influenced so much the Western social and spiritual
thought and brought enlightenment to the West that today WEST
describes “Plato as philosophy and philosophy as Plato.” We the
followers of Vedic Sanatan Dharma in India seem to have forgotten that
that source of his writings and philosophy was Vedic metaphysics.
Before Plato, Pythagoras went from Samos (Greece) to land of Ganga to
learn Geometry. He would not have gone such a long and strange journey
had the reputation of Brahmin’s (Vedic) science not been long
established in Europe. (Francois. M. Voltaire). Plato left Athens for
about one decade and visited Prasava (Persia), Ariana (Iran) and North
West part of the then India-land of Aryans. He seems to have discussed
a number of metaphysical concepts with the then Vedic Rsis and
Munnies. On his return to Athens, he propagated those thoughts without
making any reference to Vedic Rsis and Munnies. However, the influence
of Vedic metaphysics is clearly visible in Plato’s writings/books. '
So, it is proved that Jesus was influenced on Vedic Hindu philosophy.
And He had traveled again and again in this pious-land-Nepal & India.
We can see a tomb of Jesus Christ kept in Kashmir. Christ traveled
through what is now Nepal and India from 13-30 years seeking religions
teachings. There are facts that suggest he read Vedic teachings in
Kashi, Jagannath, Bihar and Nalanda. He went to Lumbini and visited
mountains of Kumbakarna, Gaurishankar and Mt. Everest south of Tibet.
It is mentioned in the Sanskrit language in a Puran (theology) book.
It is also mentioned in this theology ‘The mother of Jesus was
pregnant in younger age before her marriage.’ We can see the
similarity between Kuntee and Mary so Jesus Christ represents Karna.
Kuntee bore a child Karna before her marriage.
Similarly, an intellectual M.K. Shrestha has written, 'The mother of
Jesus Christ Mary had become pregnant before she had married. The
problem was solved when she accepted one carpenter Yusuf (Joseph) as
her husband. First he denied accepting her. Let it be- Jesus Christ
came to India at the age of 12/13 with businessmen. He spent some days
with Jainmuni (sage) in Rajasthan. Then he studied Ved in Kashi and
Jagannathpuri. He achieved enlightenment through meditation in India.
Jesus Christ preached on love, benediction, compassion and mercy by
learning from ancient Vedic Hindu religion. He has shown honor to Veda
in his books. He believed in Bhramh (the creator), Bishnu( the
preserver and protector), Maheshwor (manager of truth, beauty &
wellbeing) and ‘OM’. The word 'OM’later changed into ‘Omen’. The
manuscript of Christ can be read at the 'Summit University' in France.
The tradition that precedes a birth, death, marriage and christening
in Churches by priests and pastors corresponds with the Hindu
traditions. There is a hexagon of Hindu Goddess ‘Saraswati’ (Goddess
of Intellect) in the national insignia of Israel’s Jews.(Nepal
Samachar Patra) The cross is the sign of Christ- hanging.
An analyst, Dr. Tilak B. Shrestha says-' The concept of ‘Christ’ comes
from the legend of ‘Krishna’ of the Hindu pantheon. Hindus believe
that God incarnated as Krishna to teach the ‘Karma Yoga.’ It may be
noted that the lesson of ‘Karma yoga’ is primary and the belief in
incarnation is only secondary. However, it is also believed Krishna to
state that whenever world is in pain; he will incarnate to heal it. It
is a universal declaration of love of God for its creation, not a
political statement. In those ancient times, though difficult, people
did migrate. The people migrating to the Middle East from the east
were collectively known as Hebrews. One sub-group of such Hebrews is
‘A-Brahman’. They were the erstwhile Hindu ‘Brahmans’ who quit rigors
of Brahmanism and migrated to the west. In Sanskrit, the prefix ‘A’ is
used to negate. Thus, ‘A-Brahman’ means ‘no longer Brahmans.’ This is
the origin of the Jewish name ‘Abraham’. This group also carried the
promise of Krishna as their legend. The word ‘Krishna’ Hellenized to
‘Chrisnos’. Greek language tends to substitute ‘T’ for ‘N’, and it
became ‘Christos’. Similar interesting phonetic substitution in
Japanese is ‘R’ for ‘L’ and in Chinese ‘L’ for ‘R’. You might have
heard Japanese democracy and ‘erection’, and Chinese noodle and
‘lice’. The Greek word ‘Christos’ became ‘Christ’ in Hebrew. The
meaning of the legend also changed with the new environments. This
definition is believed by Jewish people and claimed by Jesus. By the
way, ‘Jesus’ is known as ‘Yesu’, ‘Yusuf’, ‘Isa’ etc. in different
languages. Thus to bring Christianity in line with other two
religions, Constantine convened and presided over the Christian
council in 325 AD, in Nicea. Christianity then following Judaism had
only one God. Jesus supposed to be God’s son.
Prof. Jitendra Dhoj Khand, 'Supreme God: Body, Will, Wisdom, and Work
2010)' writes-'In 1887 a Russian war correspondent, Nicolas Notovitch,
visited India, Nepal, and Tibet. He claimed that, at the lamasery or
monastery of Hemis in Ladakh, he learned of the "Life of Saint Issa,
Best of the Sons of Men." Issa is the Arabic name of Jesus. His story,
with a translated text of the "Life of Saint Issa," was published in
French in 1894. According to Kersten, the Bhavishyat Maha Purana - the
9th of 18 of Sanatana Dharma known as the Puranas - asserts that
Israelites settled in India, and in verses 17-32, describes the
arrival of Jesus. One day, Shalivahana, the chief of the Shakas, came
to a snowy mountain (assumed to be in the Himalaya Mountains). There,
in the Land of the Hun (= Ladakh, a part of the Kushan empire), the
powerful king saw a handsome man sitting on a mountain, who seemed to
promise auspiciousness. His skin was like copper and he wore white
garments. The king asked the holy man who he was. He replied: I am
called Isaputra (son of God), born of a virgin, minister of the
non-believers, relentlessly in search of the truth.' O king, lend your
ear to the religion that I brought unto the non-believers ... Through
justice, truth, meditation, and unity of spirit, man will find his way
to Isa (God, in Sanskrit) who dwells in the centre of Light, who
remains as constant as the sun, and who dissolves all transient things
forever.
The blissful image of Isa, the giver of happiness, was revealed in the
heart; and I was called Isa-Masih (Jesus the Messiah).[ According to
some Muslims on the subcontinent, the Ahmadiyyas in particular, the
further sayings of Muhammad mention that Jesus died in Kashmir at the
age of one hundred and twenty years. Ahmadiyyas have advocated this
view for over 100 years. Muslim and Persian sources purport to trace
the sojourn of Jesus, known as Isa, or Yuz Asaf ("leader of the
healed") along the old Silk Road to the orient. The books, Christ in
Kashmir by Aziz Kashmiri, and Jesus Lived in India by Holger Kersten,
list documents and articles in support of this view. They believe Yuz
Asaf to be buried at the Roza BAL shrine in Srinagar, India. The "Life
of Issa" begins with an account of Israel in Egypt, its deliverance by
Moses, its neglect of religion, and its conquest by the Romans. At the
age of thirteen the divine youth, rather than take a wife, leaves his
home to wander with a caravan of merchants to India (Sindh), to study
the laws of the great Buddha.' Similarly, Hikmat Bista writes-'In
bible a dark period is mentioned. During this period no one knew where
Christ was. In fact he was in University of Taxyashila, popularly
known as Taxela. Now it is in Pakistan. There he was studying.

'Issa is welcomed by the Jains, but leaves them to spend six years
among the Brahmins, at Juggernaut, Banaras, and other places, studying
the Vedas and teaching all castes alike. The Brahmins oppose him in
this, and he denounces them and their sacred books, especially
condemning caste and idolatry. When they plan to put him to death, he
flees to the Buddhists, and spends six years among them, learning Pali
and mastering their religious texts. He goes among the pagans, warning
them against idolatry and teaching a high morality. At twenty-nine,
Issa returns to his country and begins to preach. He visits Jerusalem,
where Pilate is apprehensive about him. The Jewish leaders, however,
are also apprehensive about his teachings yet he continues his work
for three years. He is finally arrested and put to death for
blasphemy, for claiming to be the son of God. His followers are
persecuted, but his disciples carry his message out over the world.'
It is viewed that Jesus Christ was in India and Tibet, particularly in
Nepal. Nepal is the original place of Brahma, Vishnu, and Shiva. The
source of Tantra and Yoga Meditation is Shiva. Rig Veda is directly
belong to Lord Brahma. The division of four Vedas, Mahabharat, 18
Purana, and Bhagavad-gita were written by Veda Vyas of Nepal. His sons
were Pandu and Dhirtarastra – their sons were Pandava and Kaurava.
Their war is called the Mahabharata. The Pashupatinath and the
Muktinath are in Nepal. In addition, Brahma, Vishnu, and Shiva are in
the burning light at Muktinath of Nepal – this shows "Trinity".
Maharishi King Janak's daughter Sita - Queen of Lord Ram was at
Janakpur of Nepal. Lumbini is birthplace of Gautama Buddha and Lumbini
is in Nepal. Hence, Jesus Christ must have studied most of the
literatures and practiced of meditation and Tantra in Himalayan
Mountains of Nepal. This is the reason He became closer with Supreme
God and declared son of God along with Trinity –Father, Son, and
Sprit.We can read the destructive conspirator history of Christian
brokers in south Asia here.
This Christianization started since the European Missionaries landed
in Indian and Sri Lankan shores and established themselves, especially
in the colonial period. Despite independence, the process of
Christianization has increased, thanks to the imposition of the
Christian concept called
‘secularism’ by the political leadership of both countries, showing
scant regard to the native cultural heritage and religious traditions.
Then, they adopted their strategies by the Church to achieve this goal
can be summed up as: 1.Influencing the leadership of both LTTE and the
Sri Lankan Government. 2. Influencing the leadership of the Dravidian
Parties of Tamil Nadu
and forming an unholy nexus with them; spreading the myth of
“Christian Missionaries’ contribution to Tamil. 3. Acquiring vast
stretches of lands, as much as possible, in the name of education and
health care, and planting Churches along the stretches so that
neighborhood citizens are coerced and converted easily 4. Baptizing
Thiruvalluvar, hijacking*Thirukkural* and doing things in his name.
Inventing a St. Thomas-Thiruvalluvar connection and spreading that
myth. Thiruvalluvar and Thirukkural are a stop gap arrangement, a
transit point, through which the transformation from Hindu to
Christianity takes place. 5. Sowing anti-Veda and anti-Sanskrit poison
and dividing the Saiva Mathams, thereby separating a section in the
name of “Tamil Saivam” and controlling them. A few Saiva Mutts, who
flirt with the Atheist Dravidian
Parties, are allegedly backed by the Church to go all out against
Vedic culture, Agama Worship and Sanskrit usage6. Corrupting the
secretariats and officials of Vaishnava Mutts-and Saiva Adheenams and
purchasing their lands through them, thereby liquidating their assets
immensely. Many Mutts have sold their lands to Christians.7.
Influencing the Government to interfere in Temple affairs and harass
the Mathams and Adheenams through the Hindu Religious and Charitable
Endowment Department.Changing Hindu traditions through government
ordinances to suit their agenda.8. Erasing- “Hindu” identity and
establishing a “Tamil” identity through inculturation, Tamil
chauvinism and Tamil separatism, with the intention to
totally Christianize the state.'
We know- the Christian mission is to highlight the peoples of the
world through information sharing and networking. To gathering,
manage and distribute strategic population, progress indicator and
ministry activity information to maximize the visibility of the
least-reached peoples to the Church. The goal is a comprehensive,
accurate, validated, public ally available list of all the
ethno-cultural people groups of the world, to be a least-reached
peoples networking resource to the Christian mission community and to
enhance the flow of information between Great Commission organizations
by using standardized data coding. This also enables any Christian
missionary organization anywhere in the world to source any
ethno-cultural or ethno-linguistic Data. So assuming that somebody at
the CIA headquarters wants information on a particular district or
region all that needs to be done. The brokers of Christians use to
say- 'God is allowing us to "spy out the land" that we might go in and
claim both it and its inhabitants for Him.' The CIA has publicly
admitted for covert intelligence operations in many parts of the
world. Being Sonia Gandhi Italian Christian, Majority Indians are
converting to the Christian religion because the government of India
(Congress (I) has given grants to Christian charities that are
involved in conversion activities in India. The proponents of
faith-based initiatives want US government funds to go to those
churches and Christian NGOs that consider conversion as part of
rehabilitation activities. Since the USAID funds Christian NGOs in
Nepal and India and also since US trans-national Christian NGOs like
World Vision and CARE are heavily involved in development initiatives,
their role in evangelical activities is not a matter of conjecture.
'Christians misappropriated the name of Jesus and produced a demonic
religion called Christianity which came into existence during the
period of King Constantine, four hundred years after the death of
Jesus the Christ. Christianity attempted to wipe out the Jews and was
at loggerheads with Islam which came into existence later. The
Crusades were waged and millions of people perished in the wars. The
Semitic religions under the control of fanatic and fundamentalist
bigots unleashed reins of terror destroying human societies.'
In Nepal, the 'United Mission to Nepal' has been working offering the
sugarcoated poison to the greedy and poor people. United Mission to
Nepal writes in its secret guide-line-' The only consultation before
the Board meeting on how to worldwide Church should partner with the
Nepali Churches is an opportunity to share experience and explore the
musicological implications of the various ways in which Member Bodies
and UMN in this country can relate to the Christian community.' There
is no simple formula in Nepal or in our home countries that answer all
our questions in trying to be faithful to Christ's commission.' UMN's
has written a dangerous conspiracy to destroy the mind of Nepalese
people-' In Recruitment we plan to continue the work of 'enlisting',
'fresh solders' for work in God's mission in Nepal throughout the
financial year.' So, in Nepal, Christian mission is spreading like the
locust (dangerous insects). UMN has programmed the strategy- 'We
should give highest priority to developing the capacity of Nepali
organization to respond to the needs of Nepal. UMN's demonstrated
effectiveness in providing services to the poor, training individual
Nepalis, developing Nepali companies and institutions, contributing to
vital infrastructure and modeling innovate approaches to meeting human
need can be carried forward into the future by Nepal organization. We
hope that many wills-'reach unity in the faith and attain to the full
measure of the fullness of Christ'. How conspirator style they are
lunching after-1998?
Similarly, in 1835 Lord Mecaule and in 1856 Caldwell used weapons to
enforce Christianity after colonizing India. Their blasphemous act of
disintegrating the Hindu religion has tainted the Christian religion.
Those taking part in the publicity of the Christian religion indulge
in fighting amongst each other. They are in the habit of
discriminating each other. To show them different to that of Hindu
religion, Christianity has shown utter disregard to the wearing of red
vermillion (Tika and Sindhur), resorted to burning scriptures of codes
of conduct of Vedic Hindu and Buddhism and vandalizing statues. Due to
such acts Christian religion has taken in the form of a religious
terrorism. Christians have moved in against the sentiment of Jesus
Christ and absorbed the non-religious ways by abandoning Vedic
tradition and indulging in self-driven motives of taking over state
powers.
James Madison (American Statesman, 1751-1836, Co-Author Declaration of
independence) Christianity is full of superstition, bigotry, and
persecution’. Thomas Paine (1737-1809), the American Statesman wrote:
‘What is it the Bible teaches us? — Rapine, cruelty and murder
President Thomas Jefferson--The Christian God is cruel, vindictive,
capricious and unjust.’ Charles Dickens.--‘Missionaries are perfect
nuisances and leave every place worse than they found: -- ‘His Majesty
the King has ordered that there shall be no Brahmins in his land and
that they should be banished.' I order that no Hindu temples be
erected in any of the territories of my king and that Hindu temples
which already have been erected be not repaired and must be destroyed.
(The Inquisition--Francis Xavier--Sonia's UPA Government-
Bhagavaandaas Tyaagi-2010,Nov.25 )

This is a matter of such extremity that brings destruction to oneself.
Those in Nepal who in ignorance have sold themselves to the economic
incentives of Christian missions have raped their own identity. We
condemn the absorption into an artificial road of those who have
gotten the Vedic Hindu religion to cremation and helped in
establishment of Christian colony. If it necessitates there will be
attack on them. If Christians do not respect the Vedic Hindu religion
then Nepalese Hindus will not tolerate the Christian conspiracy.
The British Empire, spreading in Asia, after getting hold of its
influence in India had eyed on mountainous region of Nepal. Then the
great King Prithbinarayan Shah fought against the Brutishness'
destructive design from attack this pious Land-'Himabatkhanda-Nepal'
and saved this sovereign-Land. It was not an easy task to fight
British imperialistic force in the mid 18th century. Now, since 2005,
the Christian Missions are active to do so. But, Hindus are paying the
price for their intellectual laziness, for choosing comfort over hard
thinking. Most of these 'thinkers' have never opened the Bible. It is
a matter of grief that the Christian saints and brokers ordered to
destroy the temples where they kept the idols of Hindu's God & Goddess
and to break the statues of Hindu idols into tiny pieces. That was
their goal to destroy Hindu & Buddha culture and make the country a
Christian nation. Hinduism has a deep philosophical and spiritual
heritage that has repeatedly mesmerized the world including western
scientists, leaders and philosophers. So, it is a high time Nepal and
all the Hindus in the world should be careful to save her indigenous
culture. Some Christians erected Churches without any agreement after
2005; they had not to so such behavior. As such voices are raised by
the employees of brokers of Christianity, Christian religion is
becoming unpopular. In Arab nations due to the pressure mounted by the
Christian nations of the west, they are forced to view them as their
enemy.
When my opinion published on- 'Jesus Christ and Christian Religion its
origin' in different online, then the > www. Y-jesus.com < released
the questions about Jesus Christ. 'Who was the real Jesus? If a court
of law were to evaluate the evidence for Jesus Christ, what would it
conclude about his identity? Is it possible to discover the true
historical Jesus? Many scholars have carefully studied the facts about
this person who has so greatly influenced human history. The articles
on this website reveal the truth regarding Jesus of Nazareth.
Archaeologists, historians, textual scientists and New Testament
scholars examine the wealth of evidence making him the most unique
person in the history of our world. You will find answers to questions
asked by skeptics about his existence, the credibility of his claims,
his true identity, his fulfillment of prophecy, his resurrection, his
relevance to our lives today, and the reliability of the New Testament
gospels. So what do the facts tell us? Can we trust the New Testament
accounts of Jesus, or are the skeptics right? We invite you to examine
the evidence. Was Jesus a Real Person? Was there a Da Vinci
Conspiracy? Is Jesus God? Are the Gospels True? Was Jesus the Messiah?
Did Jesus Really Rise from the Dead? Is Jesus Relevant Today?' But, I
have answered already in my analysis.'

In the context of discussion Mr.Adelfo Del Rosario writes
aggressively- ' Whatever you have seen done wrong or any wrong doings
done by other Christians to defect your worship of your HINDU gods, I
should say that these Christian have their own personal interpretation
but not of the real meaning and the true teaching of the CATHOLIC
CHRISTIAN CHURCH. For us who understand the real teachings and meaning
of what JESUS CHRIST has taught us, we cannot allow to do bad or worst
things against our dear brothers and sister regardless of race, creed
and religion. JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF manifested the true sacrifice he
had received from those people who had crucified HIM and as a true
CATHOLIC CHRISTIAN it is a must to follow HIS works deeds and
manifestation of the true LOVE. In behalf of those Chrisitian who had
done wrong to all of you, I myself would kneel down in front of you to
ask forgivessness of the mistakes they had created against you. it is
almost like the thing experienced by our dear Pope Paul IV who was
attacked and knifed, yet he had visited the person in jail who had
knifed HIM and yet forgiven the assault of the person. It is really
hard for any human being to practice the act of forgiveness when they
had been attacked or assaulted by the offender, yet JESUS CHRIST had
shown that anybody can do this act of forgiveness to share LOVE and
peace.'- May 26, 2011
Please, let is be- America destroyed Hiroshima and Nagasaki of Japan
in the Second World War with the nuclear weapons created by Jew
scientist Einstein. When the then American President Roosevelt asked
Einstein what he wanted the latter has answered, “I want a Jew state.”
In this sense the Americans must have declared Israel ‘a Jew state’.
When Einstein was asked to preside over the presidency of the nation
he swiftly declined to do so. In Israel the sign which is common with
Hindu Goddess ‘Saraswoti’ was made the symbol Shatkon (angle having
six bases) of Jew. It is an inspiration from the Hindu religion. Jews
who fled Iran many centuries ago came to south Asia, Hindu Kings gave
them refuge. Jews have never forgotten those centuries of Hindu
generosity in south Asia, when they were persecuted everywhere else in
the world.
But the Christians are pouncing on Hindus wherever they contact and
show the attraction of money as attraction to transform them into
Christians. Their design is ending the Hindus’ identity. Actually, in
the long term, such conspiratorial actions reverse a defeat for the
Christians themselves. The attempt to control human beings desire
cannot be called religion. Aren’t there other options than religion to
achieve the goal of establishing colonies?
Hindu religion and its culture are respected by many big intellectuals
around the world. The western renowned philosophers-Voltaire, George
Bernard Shaw, German scholar Nitse, Megasthaniz and Fai-Han have
written many books supporting the Hindu philosophy expressing the
evolutionary process of the world's civilization. Hindu philosophy is
incomparably greater intellectual work than the Bible? According to
Encyclopedia of Religions and Ethics, signs of Hindu religion are even
found in the present Islamic country like Iran. A stone scripture of
486 BC found in Iran contains the words Hindu and Hindus. Even an
ancient Parsi scripture 'Shatir' has lifted a word of Ved Vyas- 'I am
a true Hindu born in a Hindu country'. An international scholar Aldus
Huxley said-'The oldest aspects of Hindu mythology give place to the
most profound and subtle utterances about the nature of ultimate
reality, it is in itself a liberal education in humility, tolerance
and suspense of judgment.' An Indian scholar says- S. Kalyanaraman
says- Hinduism was a storehouse of knowledge and enlightenment and, if
fully
researched, could provide answers to the issues facing the contemporary
society.
Dr Mrs. Hilda Raja writes- We have politicized the church and the
echo. You have misused your position and authority to barter and
bargain. I know from experience that the Evangelical churches hate
the Catholic Church and their ‘bishops’ and pastors do their best to
wean Catholics to their churches. The Catholic Church has greater
credibility, is monolithic and has political power. The damages done
to the catholic churches must be the handiwork of the Christian
youth. I believe in Jesus and what He stood for-a just society. He did
not establish a religion. Do not use Him to justify your
aggrandizement and divisive strategies. “My kingdom is not of this
world”. Finally let me remind you that TRUTH was crucified by the
conspiracy of priests and the civil authorities-the same is being done
down the ages.
NEWSWEEK COLUMNIST Ms Lisa Miller says-'we are all Hindus. The Rig
Veda, the most ancient Hindu scripture, says: "Truth is one, but the
sages speak of it by many names." A Hindu believes there are many
paths to God. The most traditional, conservative Christians have not
been taught to think like this. They learn in Sunday school that their
religion is true, and others are false. Let us all say "OM." when you
chant "OM," it will resonate not only in the room but down through the
ages.' May 13, 2010 at > http://www.newsweek.com/id/237910
The Christian calendar had started 57 years after the start of Bikram
Sambat. After Jesus Christ was worshipped legitimately then the
calendar was commenced in memory of him after 400 years. When this
calendar came into effect they took references of months, days from
the Bikram Sambat (Nepalese Era). Adityabar (Sunday) was taken as
Sunday in remembrance of Sun. In this day Christians pray. Sombar
(Monday) is the day of Moon-Monday, Mangalbar( Tuesday) is the day of
welfare-Tuesday (God of Mars), Budhabar (Wednesday) which is Horse
day, Brishaspatibar is Thursday (Thor’sday-The Thunder), Sukrabar is
Friday (Wife of Odin) and Sanibar is Saturday meaning-The day of
Saturn (Roman God of Agriculture). The word Day was taken out of
Sanskrit word Diwa. The month of September is from Saptabar, October
is of Ostabar, December from Dasambar. The March Month is related to
Ganesh-Mangalb. The word Mother is taken from Matri and Father or
Peter from Pitri. There are many words that in time have changed in
such a way.
The ‘Omen’ word used by Christian is similar to the ‘OM’ used by
Hindus. Hindus worship the Sun God on Sunday; similarly the Christians
worship Christ on Sunday. In view of all these, the Christian nations
and Christian mission ought to respect the greatness of Hinduism and
competent views of it. Many words had taken from Sanskrit. Mother
(Maathru), Father (Pithru), Bhraatha(Braathru), Geriatric(Jaraa),
Nose(Naasikaa), Mortal(Mruthyaha), Door(Dwaaraa), Two(Dhwe),
Three(thri), Divine(Divya) and so on.
The Sanskrit word made Samittee from which Committee was made. The
word Prasad is like Palace, Charitar for Character, Danta for Dante.
Like Christianity developed from Hinduism the Greek, Latin took birth
from Sanskrit language. Famous French intellect Dr. Jekreliot Bible
has accepted the Hindu science. He says 'The Hindu Revelation (Veda)
is of all revelations, the only ideas are in perfect harmony with
modern science as it proclaims the slow and gradual formation of the
world." German philosopher Nieztse has said, 'The law book of Manu is
incomparably greater intellectual work than the Bible.'
May this analytical and research-based work in regard to who Jesus
Christ was and what religion was he influenced of and how Christian
religion started to be considered by all. We, Hindus respect the only
Jews state 'Israel' of the world. Lastly, it is our appeal to the
Christian missions and Christian nations that they confer their rich
respect to the only pure Hindu nation of Nepal. May there be efforts
to the effect of eradicating the negative views of Hindus towards
Christianity. So, all the Christians and Christian world must regard
the Vedic Hindu religion and NEPAL as a 'Hindu Kingdom.'
Email: dirghar...@gmail.com

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[Arjun]

shall i give you all the details of thousands of paedophile cases involving the church around the world..Just type paedophile and church in google and you will get even a longer sermon than the sermon on the mount itself lol

---

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>

To: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
Cc: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 2 November 2011, 0:55

Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

The old tradition still continues.

 

Bhubaneswar, Oct 31 (IANS) A 50-year-old self-proclaimed godman was detained for questioning in Orissa after villagers complained that he had killed a three-year-old boy in a human sacrifice, police said Monday.

Ganeswara Patabandha, a resident of Sundhola village, about 400 km from here, was detained Sunday after the villagers alleged he killed the boy Oct 26 for monetary gain.

Police inspector Trilochan Sethi said the boy, Anirudha Dal, was allegedly found in a village well during a search by the residents.

According to the villagers, the boy's left leg little finger was chopped off and the tongue had turned black.

The residents caught hold of Patabandha as he was found to be practicing black magic in the area.

'They handed him to the police on Sunday after he allegedly confessed his crime before a village committee.

From: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
Cc: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>; Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>

Sent: Wednesday, 2 November 2011 8:48 AM

Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Mrr Pee: 

 Do you agree that Jesus was not the son of Maty's husband? There are only two answers, he was or he was not. If was son of Mary's husband then he is not Son of so called god. So all Christian theology falls on its face. If on the other hand he was not the Son of Mary's husband, then God at least committed and Mary committed Adultery with god, per the definition of Christians view. In both cases he becomes a bastard. It is logically flawless, and you being what you are too dumb to understand that. Is it too honest and difficult for you.

I have already shown you earlier that Christianity is founded on the contradicting principles earier, and you had no response to logical deductions, perhaps you are still getting Modern. Me as a Brahman, ha ve been educated far befor your Jesus was even born. I have heard recently some of you have wanted to show him visiting Kashmir and getting educated their. (May be you may want to read that Rozabal .) I understand some of you have realized that true civilization the master civilization was in Indio, and now want ti claim that this illegitimate child Jesus came to India to redeem himself.  But I don't think he could ever be redeemed.

Even Indus valley civilization; that is long time ago before you changed changed your parentage, from brown to white, to feel better about the way you feel about yourself, the toilets were built within the houses. You need to really educate yourself. 

Mr Pee, you can make g=fool of these Christian idiots, whole of the medical Science tells you that a woman who givens birth, is no more Virgin. But then how can you tell it to a person who believes that earth came in to existence in 4001 BC, and the life did not arise out of the evolution, and the earth is Flat. These are the Christian beliefs, clearly what you think is Modern..What idiots are these Christians that they believe in fairy tails.  You want to buy Brooklyn bridge, I am selling it...

This Jesus was not even an ordinary Sanyasi, for he was very quarrelsome and disruptive. Finally caught for his crimes and literally nailed for it. He was so powerful, that he could not even defend himself. That shame has been transformed for you modern idiots as he dies for you. He died for his grave crimes, served him right... But that was not last of the christian crime, You continued that with Pagans of Europe, Pagans of Armenia, Turkey and finally grand slam in the Holocaust. In the Annals of world history, there no more wicked a community than the Christians followed by Muslims. 

You see I told you Christianity is all about sex. As if they have been made the Cowkidars of the female parts.  There is nothing else in Bible except killing and teh sexual morality. EVen the knowledge is a sexula crime, so it is a dangerous thing for Christians. You should thank Arabs who took Indian Mathematics and educated the christian of the Europe, Later on Jesuits came here stole the Calculus from teh Pingla Svhool and passed itas Newtons and Lebinitz creation. Theft, foolery, usurping, Genocides and teh holocausts are Christin doing. Look your ugly face in the Mirror and feel ashamed, if their is even an ounce of Indianness left in you. You see so long you look brown, Christians will lookdown upon you, and as Indian you lookdown upon yourself. You must be living a miserable l;ife. I pity you...

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Nov 1, 2011, at 10:32 PM, Radhakrishnan P wrote:

Rabinder Koul in his frustration has given a reply which once again reveals his venom against modern civilization - an offspring of Christianity. A few years ago orthodox Hindus, following Manu's code, used to build their home latrine away from home. They could not think of a toilet inside a house, for it is against Hindu ethics and Vedic rites. Now everybody is insisting on bath-attached bedroom. These people  want European toilet too! 

Koul has made a derogatory remarks on Jesus. What he fails to understand is that it was virgin birth that gave divinity to Jesus. Otherwise he would be an ordinary sanyasi. While immaculate nature emerges from Jesus' life, Dr. Ambedkar gives the following from his book, Dr. Babasahib Ambbedkar writings and Speeches, Vol.4: "Krishna belonged to the Vrasni (yadava family). The Yadavas were polygamous. Yadava kings had innumerable wives and innumerable sons. According to Matsya Purana, King Taittiri, an ancestor of Krishna , married his own daughter and begot her son by name Nala. Krishna ’s son Sambha was attracted by his mother’s well developed physical features, especially breasts. The Matsya Purana tells how Samba lived an illicit life not only with his own mother but also with the other wives of his father Krishna . Hindu scriptures tell us that Krishna came to know about this sexual got angry and cursed Samba and his wives for their illicit sex. There is a reference to this secret sex in the Mahabharata also. Satyabhama, Krishna ’s wife, asked Draupadi the secret of her power over her five husbands. Draupadi warned Satyabhama against staying in private with her stepsons. Samba’s bother, Pradyumna ( Krishna ’s another son) married his foster mother Mayawati. What morals! What gods! Sons marrying mothers; fathers having sex with daughters! What moral lesson can we get from such gods and goddesses immersed in sexual debauchery?

Koulji can now see the difference from the holy life of Jesus and other gods (and goddesses too).

 

From: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
Cc: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>; Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 2 November 2011 5:11 AM
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

We know Jesus is the only Bastard, where God raped the Marry & produced Jesus! That is the beginning of the obsession with Sin.of Christians.

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Oct 31, 2011, at 11:21 PM, Radhakrishnan P wrote:

Arjun is not patient enough for a fair discussion. He does not know, perhaps, that Jesus was not, unlike many gods and goddesses, a character in a mythology or legend or story. Arjun should know that it is not the Jesus on the cross but the resurrected Jesus is the God of the modern civilized world. Supreme Court Judge wrote in the Hindu paper about Jesus:

Krishna Iyer's Christmas greetings

   

Jesus Christ was perhaps history's most radical humanist liberationist who was sent to the Cross and suffered crucifixion for the salvation of suffering humanity. For him, humanity was one and consequent of his suffering, the whole world was free, the former Supreme Court judge and eminent jurist V.R. Krishna Iyer said here on Friday. In his Christmas message, Mr. Krishna Iyer said, “We are all our suffering brother's keeper and must sacrifice all that we possess for the sake of elimination of human deprivation and subjection. In this supremely divine dimension every humanist is a follower of Jesus, I am emphatically a Christian. His great message is meant for all mankind. Therefore Christmas is not confined to Christians. It embraces the rejoicings of all Creation. Only in this sense Jesus Christ, the liberator of the sufferings of the world, will fulfil himself. I bow before you Jesus. Let us strive to wipe every tear from every eye. Let us abandon violence and love everyone even your enemies. That is haven of peace and no war.”

 

 

Christian legacy

Christianity preserved the legacy of Christ, that is, Jesus' revelation to mankind teaching the sole path to heaven and the efficacious means to get there. Christianity eradicated the savage practices of paganism, human sacrifice, mutilation and cannibalism. It developed systems of education, the inception of science and the complex systems of government. Its monks preserved classical literature, history and law, recopying them over and over in their monasteries for posterity when the barbarians swept in and destroyed all. The apex of the humanities was achieved in Christian renaissance art and medieval architecture, in music with Gregorian chant and polyphony. Christianity matured philosophy, metaphysics, cosmology and epistemology. It explored and catalogued the world, reduced savagery and spread civilization. It united nations and races with through its ideology. It introduced the moral code by which most people today live. The popular concepts of justice and decency, mercy and compassion are all Christian-based and Christian chivalry is so deeply ingrained that people expect others to be polite, charitable and well-mannered, even complete strangers to one another. Christianity aids the poor, protects the dignity of women, builds hospitals, orphanages, schools and services them with religious who work solely for the glory of God. It promotes and provides the seven acts of corporeal and spiritual mercy, which benefit society at every level. Most importantly, it educated people about God and their duties to Him and to each other. Christianity would assert many abuses committed by Christians were done in opposition to Christian teaching. 

Even yesterday a case of human sacrifice occurred in North India. What would have happened if Christianity had not come to India with its religious-sanctioning of  burning alive of young widows (sati), brutal killings of lower castes, killing of baby girls immediately after birth(female infanticied) ,child marriage, forcibly killing of aged parents by feeding them with mud and water on the banks of the Ganga, women not allowed to cover their breasts and a multitude of barbarous customs and superstitions?  

Can you burn alive a young widow today?

 

 

 

From: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, 31 October 2011 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

well whatever his views on Buddhism or Hinduism but he didt become a worshipper of rotting corpse on a wooden cross did he.Even he knew that xtianty  was a load of inbred trash

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, 30 October 2011, 19:49
Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Valmiki says that Ram and Sita ate meat. But Gautama Buddha oposed meat eating.

In May 1956, a talk by Ambedkar titled "Why I like Buddhism and how it is useful to the world in its present circumstances" was broadcast from the British Broadcasting Corporation, London. In his talk Ambedkar said:

I prefer Buddhism because it gives three principles in combination, which no other religion does. Buddhism teaches prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality). This is what man wants for a good and happy life. Neither god nor soul can save society.

In his last speech delivered in Bombay in May 24 1956, in which he declared his resolve to embrace Buddhism, Ambedkar observed:

Hinduism believes in God. Buddhism has no God. Hinduism believes in soul. According to Buddhism, there is no soul. Hinduism believes in Chaturvarnya and the caste system. Buddhism has no place for the caste system and Chaturvarnya.

It is obvious that Ambedkar regarded Buddhism as a much more rational religion compared to Hinduism, rather the most rational religion. His main objection to Hinduism was that it sanctified inequality and untouchability through its doctrine of Chaturvarnya. Buddhism, on the other hand, rejected Chaturvarnya and supported equality. He commends Buddhism for rejecting god and soul and for emphasizing morality. According to him, prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality), which Buddhism alone teaches, is all that human beings need for a "good and happy life".  

Ambedkar’s final religious act was to embrace Buddhism. His work The Buddha and his Dhamma contains his own understanding and interpretation of Buddhism. We may say that Buddhism as expounded in this book is what Ambedkar embraced and recommended. In this book Ambedkar has tried to interpret Buddhism in a rationalistic manner. Ambedkar did not believe in the existence of god and soul. This is obvious from the reasons he has given for embracing Buddhism as well as from his interpretation of Buddhism in Buddha and His Dhamma. In Buddhism, as interpreted by Ambedkar, there is no place for god and soul. Further, according to Ambedkar, Buddha did not believe in rebirth, karma and moksha as traditionally conceived. Besides, Buddha rejected the varna vyavastha. Buddhism was a totally different religion.

Buddha opposed Hinduism, Hindu rites and rituals. He opposed the Vedas. So Buddhism is a different religion like Christianity and Islam. Some Hindu extremists want to add Buddhism also as a part of Hinduism. They call Buddha as an avatar of Ram, forgetting the fact that the Buddha openly denounced hinduism. Fanatical Gupta kings fought against Buddhism to save Hinduism. So it is foolish to call Buddhism a branch of Hinduism. 

From: Suresh Vyas <skan...@gmail.com>
To: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>
Cc: GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satishprakash@yahoo.n May 1956, a talk by Ambedkar titled "Why I like Buddhism and how it is useful to the world in its present circumstances" was broadcast from the British Broadcasting Corporation, London. In his talk Ambedkar said:

I prefer Buddhism because it gives three principles in combination, which no other religion does. Buddhism teaches prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality). This is what man wants for a good and happy life. Neither god nor soul can save society.

In his last speech delivered in Bombay in May 24 1956, in which he declared his resolve to embrace Buddhism, Ambedkar observed:

Hinduism believes in God. Buddhism has no God. Hinduism believes in soul. According to Buddhism, there is no soul. Hinduism believes in Chaturvarnya and the caste system. Buddhism has no place for the caste system and Chaturvarnya.

It is obvious that Ambedkar regarded Buddhism as a much more rational religion compared to Hinduism, rather the most rational religion. His main objection to Hinduism was that it sanctified inequality and untouchability through its doctrine of Chaturvarnya. Buddhism, on the other hand, rejected Chaturvarnya and supported equality. He commends Buddhism for rejecting god and soul and for emphasizing morality. According to him, prajna (understanding as against superstition and supernaturalism), karuna (love), and samata (equality), which Buddhism alone teaches, is all that human beings need for a "good and happy life".  

Ambedkar’s final religious act was to embrace Buddhism. His work The Buddha and his Dhamma contains his own understanding and interpretation of Buddhism. We may say that Buddhism as expounded in this book is what Ambedkar embraced and recommended. In this book Ambedkar has tried to interpret Buddhism in a rationalistic manner. Ambedkar did not believe in the existence of god and soul. This is obvious from the reasons he has given for embracing Buddhism as well as from his interpretation of Buddhism in Buddha and His Dhamma. In Buddhism, as interpreted by Ambedkar, there is no place for god and soul. Further, according to Ambedkar, Buddha did not believe in rebirth, karma and moksha as traditionally conceived. Besides, Buddha rejected the varna vyavastha.

com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "aryayou...@yahoogroups.com" <aryayou...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "arr...@ameritech.net" <arr...@ameritech.net>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>; "rajpa...@yahoo.com" <rajpa...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, 30 October 2011 12:13 AM
Subject: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

They preach krishna bhakti.
Bhakti yog is one of the several yogas Krishna talks about in Gita.

At this time, when we need Vedic unity, there is no need to speak low of any yoga that is not suitable for one.

One can do saadhna of only one yoga. So, a Vedic needs is to respect all types of yogas and yogis, and keep doing one's own yoga / sadhnaa.

jai sri krishna!
-sv

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

The HKs are not a  genuine source for historical or spiritual facts because just like the Arya Samaj they also push their own version of things..Buddhism itself survived upon the mercy of meat eating hindus and thats a fact..

MARKETPLACE

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[Arjun]

then why has modern civilisation dumped Christianity and continues to ridicule and expose it as backwardness and stupidity.? Thats because civilisation dumped Christianity in the first place to become modern..now some more madness from the unholy bible.Who needs the devil when the biblical god is enough lol

SEX AND OBSCENITY IN THE BIBLE

GENESIS
17:9-14 Circumcision mandated
19:1-8 Rape virgins instead of male angels
19:30-38 Righteous man impregnates his 2 daughters while drunk
24:2-3, 9 Place your hand "under the thigh" (sexual organs) of someone swearing sacred oaths
25:1-6 Keeping mistresses is not adultery
32:25 God grabs Jacob's testicles
34:1-31 Brothers are riled when sister is defiled
35:2 Reuben sleeps with father's concubine
38:1-10 Onan's method of birth control not approved
38:12-30 Tamar plays the harlot to seduce father-in-law
39:1-20 Women tries to rape man
47:29 Joseph ordered to place his hand under father's thigh
EXODUS
20:26 God specifies building of altar to prevent exposure of nakedness
22:19 Death decreed for bestiality
33:17-23 God moons Moses
NUMBERS
31:1-18; 28-47 God commands genocide of Midianites, Moses orders that virgins be kept, other captives slain
5:11-31 God's fidelity test for women only
LEVITICUS
12:1-8 Bible calls childbirth a sin and bearing females a greater sin than bearing males
15:16-18 Sperm and intercourse are unclean
15:19-33 Menstruation unclean; elaborate rules
15:29-30 Women must make sin offering for menstrual periods
18:22 Homosexuality declared an abomination
18:23 More bestiality
19:1,20-22 Man gets forgiven, slave girl gets flogging
20:10 Adulterers shall be put to death
20:13 Death decreed for homosexuals
20:15-16 Death decreed for bestiality (& beast)
26:29 Curse: Eat your sons and daughters
DEUTERONOMY
3:1-7 Kill men, women, & children
21:10-14 God okays captured maidens as trial wives
22:5 Men's clothing not to be worn by women, & vice versa
22:13-21 A bride not a virgin must die
22:23-26 Virgin raped in city given no pity
23:12-14 Defecation: Carry paddle, dig hole, & cover up
25:5-10 Woman has cause to spit in man's face
25:11-12 A woman shall have her hand cut off for touching a penis
22:28-29 Paying father to have sex with daughter
23:1 Man "wounded in the stones" can't enter congregation
23:2 Children born out of wedlock condemned as bastards to 10th generation
23:10-11 Cleanliness called for in nocturnal emissions
24:1 Man can divorce wife through eviction
28:27 Hemorrhoids ("emerods") punishment for sin
28:30 Lord's curse: Another man shall lie with groom's bride first
28:53-57 Curse: Eat your own body & children
JUDGES
3:20-22 Dagger in fat king's gut gets "dirt" out
4:4-22 Hammer & nail murder by woman
8:30 Gideon had many wives, concubines
11:29-40 Jephtha's daughter: human sacrifice
19:1-30 Woman raped and ruined by homosexuals
21:6-25 Amidst carnage virgins captured for wives
RUTH
3:6-9 To "hook" him as husband, Ruth sleeps with Boaz
4:9-10 Boaz buys Ruth
I SAMUEL
5:9-12 Philistines "smitten with emerods" as punishment for stealing ark
6:1-5 To placate God, make golden emerods
15:3 God orders Saul to kill suckling babes
18:23-27 200 foreskins gain David a king's daughter
25:22,34 Any that pisseth against the wall
II SAMUEL
3:7 More concubine hanky-panky
11:1-27 Uriah sent to lose his life so David can get his wife
12:7-12 Obscene performance to be viewed by all Israel
5:13 David had many wives, concubines
Chapter 13 Amnon rapes his sister
16:20-23 Absalom copulates with father's concubines on rooftop
20:3 David imprisons concubines for above
I KINGS
1:1-4 Virgin as therapy for sick old man unsuccessful
11:1-10 Wise Solomon has wives and concubines galore
14:10 Him that pisseth against the wall
16:11 One that pisseth against a wall
21:21 Him that pisseth against the wall
II KINGS
6:24-33 "So we boiled my son, and did eat him"
9:8 Subject not mentioned in sermons
23:7 Male houses of prostitution destroyed
I CHRONICLES
1:32-33 Abraham's concubines have children
II CHRONICLES
11:21 King Rehoboam had 18 wives & 60 concubines
ESTHER
Chapters 1-2 Sexual contest to decide new queen
SONG OF SOLOMON (the whole thing!)
ISAIAH
3:16 "...and the Lord will discover their secret parts"
9:20 Every man shall eat the flesh of his own arm
14:21-22 Slaughter children for fathers' iniquity
16:11 Biblical boast: "My bowels shall sound like an harp"
36:12 Eating dung and drinking piss
JEREMIAH
16:4 Grievous, obscene deaths
LAMENTATIONS
2:19 Something to lament
4:10 Women boil children for food
EZEKIEL
4:12-15 God says: Eat bread defiled with dung
5:8-10 What's for dinner?
8:2 Lord's loins make guest appearance
16:15 Fornications pour out
16:36-37 Their "filthiness poured out..."
23:1-40 Sex organs and ejaculate of harlots' lovers compared to asses & horses
29:7-8 God performs bloody castration via a sword
HOSEA
1:2-11 God tells Hosea to take whore to wife
2:1-15 Complications ensue (lewdly described)
NAHUM
3:4-6 Lord: "I will discover thy skirts upon thy face"
MALACHI
2:1-4 An angry god will spread feces on your faces
MATTHEW
5:27-30 A man may lust but it's not considered just
5:31-32 Man can divorce wife for fornication only
19:3-9 Man who divorces and remarries is adulterer
19:12 Castrate yourself for Jesus
22:24 Law of Onan (you have to marry your dead brother's wife)
LUKE
2:21 Eight day old Jesus is circumcised
ACTS
5:38 Eunuch baptized
15:24 Circumcision is not commandment
16:3 Paul circumcises adult
ROMANS
1:26-32 Gay men and lesbians "worthy of death"
I CORINTHIANS
6:18-20 Abstain from sex
7:1-40 To be more holy, refrain from sex wholly
7:18-19 If you're not circumcised, stay that way
GALATIANS
5:1-4 Paul speaks against circumcision
REVELATION
17:1-6 A whore is stripped, eaten and burned

---

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>

To: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
Cc: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, 1 November 2011, 19:32

Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Rabinder Koul in his frustration has given a reply which once again reveals his venom against modern civilization - an offspring of Christianity. A few years ago orthodox Hindus, following Manu's code, used to build their home latrine away from home. They could not think of a toilet inside a house, for it is against Hindu ethics and Vedic rites. Now everybody is insisting on bath-attached bedroom. These people  want European toilet too! 

Koul has made a derogatory remarks on Jesus. What he fails to understand is that it was virgin birth that gave divinity to Jesus. Otherwise he would be an ordinary sanyasi. While immaculate nature emerges from Jesus' life, Dr. Ambedkar gives the following from his book, Dr. Babasahib Ambbedkar writings and Speeches, Vol.4: "Krishna belonged to the Vrasni (yadava family). The Yadavas were polygamous. Yadava kings had innumerable wives and innumerable sons. According to Matsya Purana, King Taittiri, an ancestor of Krishna , married his own daughter and begot her son by name Nala. Krishna ’s son Sambha was attracted by his mother’s well developed physical features, especially breasts. The Matsya Purana tells how Samba lived an illicit life not only with his own mother but also with the other wives of his father Krishna . Hindu scriptures tell us that Krishna came to know about this sexual got angry and cursed Samba and his wives for their illicit sex. There is a reference to this secret sex in the Mahabharata also. Satyabhama, Krishna ’s wife, asked Draupadi the secret of her power over her five husbands. Draupadi warned Satyabhama against staying in private with her stepsons. Samba’s bother, Pradyumna ( Krishna ’s another son) married his foster mother Mayawati. What morals! What gods! Sons marrying mothers; fathers having sex with daughters! What moral lesson can we get from such gods and goddesses immersed in sexual debauchery?

Koulji can now see the difference from the holy life of Jesus and other gods (and goddesses too).

 

From: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>

Cc: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>; Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 2 November 2011 5:11 AM

MARKETPLACE

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[Arjun]

The Myth of Christianity Founding Modern Science and Medicine
(And the Hole Left by the Christian Dark Ages*)

Commentary by Jim Walker

Over the years I have received several letters from Christians attempting to salvage their religion by claiming that Christianity established modern science and medicine. Without Christianity, they claim, we would not have science, medicine or hospitals. Almost invariably, they mention scientists such as Isaac Newton, Kepler, Galileo, Tycho Brahe, Copernicus, Boyle, Haller, Euler, Vesalius, or others who believed in a Christian god. Moreover, some love to report that the Church continues to finance and encourage experimental science, including the Vatican Observatory as one of the oldest astronomical institutes in the world, and the Trinity College at the University of Cambridge which claims many alumni scientists. Therefore, from these examples (don't you see?) Christianity established modern science.

Nothing about this arrogant Christian claim could stand further from the truth.

Please understand that this kind of Christian apologetic argument fails for several reasons which fall into the trap of several fallacies including: appeal to ignorance (failing to understand the history of Christianity in how it did little to inspire science during the Dark Ages); confusing correlation with causation (just because a scientist accepts religion doesn't mean his science derived from religion); and non sequiturs (it doesn't follow that just because a few scientists believed in God that science resulted from it). The myth also spreads through the bandwagon fallacy (appealing to the popular notion that Christianity began modern science), and confirmation bias (list all the Christian scientists, but exclude their rejection of dogmas that conflicted with their science).

Just because Christians did scientific work has nothing to do with the founding of science. Not only does it not follow, but science existed long before Christianity, practiced by the Ancient Greeks and Romans. Nor did science derive from the pagan religions as even then, scientists sometimes held views contrary to the prevailing religions. The ancient theological opponents did not have the encompassing institutional power as did Christianity during the Dark Ages. The historian Richard Carrier observes, "In contrast, the groups that opposed science in classical antiquity were small, few, rare, and ultimately powerless. That is exactly the opposite of what happened under Christianity." During the medieval period the little science that did occur progressed with little religious influence or, in most cases, in spite of Christianity, but not because of it.

From its very beginning, the Church has served as a stumbling block against scientific progress. By the time Theodosius proclaimed Nicene Christianity a state religion in 380 CE, progressive science had already stopped. Richard Carrier (through personal correspondence) puts it this way: "Even pagans, though cherishing their scientific heritage (unlike Christians who generally did not), and applying that heritage more avidly than their Christian peers, appear to have given up on advancing science. And then pagans slowly died out, leaving only Christians who were even less interested in such advancement or how to achieve it." Up until this time, Greek and Roman science and medicine stood at the pinnacle of reasoned thought. Although the Christians conserved their own biblical and religious exegesis, they did little to conserve pagan scientific writings to the same degree. The little that the Christians did save just barely survived. As Kenneth Clark wrote, "What with prejudice and destruction, it's surprising that the literature of pre-Christian antiquity was preserved at all. And in fact it only just squeaked through. In so far as we are the heirs of Greece and Rome, we got through by the skin of our teeth." We owe the real foundations of science to the ancient Greeks and Romans, not to the Christians.

A Christian mob murdered the mathematician and philosophy teacher, Hypatia, in 415 CE. I use this date to mark the beginning of the Dark Ages, and its end at the beginning of the Renaissance in the 14th century because of the almost total lack of progressive science done during this period (most scholars today refer to the Dark Ages as the Early Middle Ages. See notes below). Hypatia's death serves as a convenient marking point, not because she died as the last pagan (pagan persecution lasted for centuries after) but because she lived as the last non-Christian of any merit that would teach science in the Western Christian world. Moreover, around this time, the Western Empire had begun to die. The Renaissance marks the approximate time when science began its catch-up with the ancient pagans.

As John Romer wrote in Testament, "As the Western Empire died, it left behind it empty cities with marble ruins lying like great skeletons, at their centres. Slowly the population was transformed into separate and modest nations of small farms and savage armies. There was little international trade and almost total illiteracy." Although Christianity did not cause the fall of the Roman Empire, its reliance on religion did little to improve conditions necessary for free scientific inquiry.

When Christians took over Europe, they abandoned many of the accomplishments of their predecessors. The great Roman aqueducts represented one of the greatest engineering feats of the ancient world that provided clean water to cities and industrial sites for centuries. The wonderful Roman roads once provided a way for transport throughout the Roman Empire. When the Christians took over they no longer supported these great public services and the aqueducts, sewers, and roads became ruins -- monuments to the past glory of Rome.

As Ruth Hurmence Green once wrote, "There was a time when religion ruled the world. It is known as The Dark Ages," yet the Church did little in regards to science. Although the Church educated their male clergy, in Western Europe the majority of women, the poor, and and serfs remained ignorant. The first schools didn't appear in Europe until around 400 years after the beginning of the Dark Ages. King Charlemagne started the schools, and over time the schools fused with the church to become cathedral schools, but these schools taught mostly to male students for careers in the church, not for scientific investigation into nature. Degree-granting universities didn't appear until centuries later.

Although the Church did not initially purposely set out to destroy scientific works, the atmosphere of faith over reason stymied much scientific thought. The few Christians that did any science during the early Dark Ages had little or no impact on later Renaissance scientists.

Many Christians believe that Christianity invented the first hospitals in the name of Christian charity, but the history of medical care betrays this belief. The earliest known institutions that claimed to provide cure came from the ancient pagans, long before Christianity. Albert Lyons writes, "Among the first Roman institutions to be dispensed with were those of law and medicine."

The earliest mention of cure centers came from Egyptians where they aimed to provide medical care in their temples. The Greeks also used their temples dedicated to the healer-god Asclepius where they admitted the sick (the medical profession still uses the Rod of Ascelepius, a serpent wound around a staff, as its medical symbol. The serpent, of course, represents Satan in Christian culture). The ancient Roman medical men had a fundamental understanding of medicine and used various surgical instruments and medicines that looked surprisingly similar to that of the late 19th century. The Romans created hospitals called valetudinaria for the care of sick slaves, gladiators and soldiers at around 100 BCE. Some credit the Sinhalese (Sri Lankans) as responsible for the introduction of the first dedicated hospitals (Sivikasotthi-Sala) to the world at around 4 BCE. The first teaching hospital came from the Persian Empire where physicians taught students, at the Academy of Gundishapur in the 6th and 7th centuries.

The first Christian medieval hospitals in the West conducted their institutions more through ecclesiastical means rather than medical. They did little to cure the sick by trying to advance medicine. They used these hospitals more as hostels (where the etymology of "hospital" came from), and almshouses for the poor. At their best Christian matrons used simple pagan folk methods such as simple foods, herbs, washing of wounds, etc. Dark Age Christian hospitals represented religious institutions, run mostly by nuns or monks, not by trained physicians (except for Eastern hospitals which, according to Richard Carrier, "were more similar to Asclepiea, with religious methods and hospice care combined with a few attending doctors applying pagan science of yore, even surgery." In spite of the honorable goal of treating the sick and poor, almost nothing happed to improve medical care. At its very best, Christian medicine did not advance past that of Galen, the Greek physician of 2nd century who wrote medical texts and whose theories dominated Western Christian medicine for over 1300 years. Not until the 1530s (during the Renaissance) did the physician Andreas Vesalius surpass Galen in the area of human anatomy.

During the Black Death in the 1300s, the Christian masses panicked and looked for supernatural solutions. They thought the plague came as an act of God, not nature. The Church could do nothing to fight the plague and, as a result, the people eventually began to question the ability of the Church to solve problems. This inspired William Langland, in a poem composed during the plague, to write:

"In religious orders and in all the realm among rich and poor That prayers have no power to hinder these plagues. For God is deaf nowadays and deigns not to hear us And for our guilt grinds good men all up to death."

In "The Black Death," Philip Ziegler writes: "The picture one forms to explain this seeming ingratitude on the part of the people towards their priests is that of a clergy doing its daily work but with reluctance and some timidity; thereby incurring the worst of the danger but forfeiting the respect which it should have earned. Add to this a few notorious examples of priests deserting their flocks and of conspicuous courage on the part of certain wandering friars, and some idea can be formed of why the established Church emerged from the Black Death with such diminished credit." The historian, John Kelly also agrees with Ziegler: "Despite the losses sustained by the clergy, the plague weakened the authority and prestige of the institutional Church." The Church's failure to solve the plague opened the eyes of the people to look elsewhere for solutions instead of from prayers and priestly sermons. In, A distant mirror: the calamitous 14th century, Barbara Tuchman writes, "By a contrary trend, education was stimulated by concern for the survival of learning, which led to a spurt in the founding of universities. Notably the Emperor Charles IV, an intellectual, felt keenly the cause of 'precious knowledge which the mad rage of pestilential death has stifled throughout the wide realms of the world." He founded the University of Prague in the plague year of 1348 and issued imperial accreditation to five other universalities. . ."

As for those who expressed heretical thoughts contrary to Church dogma, things did not fair well for scientists. The early 1500s brought the Protestant Reformation along with wars of religion in Germany and France. Both Protestant and Catholic authorities reasoned that control of the press coordinated between Church and State could prevent the spread of heresy. The first Roman blacklisting occurred in 1559 under the direction of Pope Paul IV and entire works of some 550 authors got on the Roman index, including authors of subjects ranging from botany, medicine, geography, and cosmography. Christians burned the priest Giordano Bruno to death in 1600 for the charge of holding opinions contrary to the Catholic faith. Bruno praised Copernicus for establishing a scientific explanation for heliocentrism and published dialogues on the subject. (By the way, The Greek thinker, Aristarchus of Samos, developed the first heliocentric theory around 270 BCE, not Copernicus as many Christians falsely believe.) Although the Church did not specifically kill Bruno for his scientific theories, his religious heresy, along with his astronomical theories fell prey to the results of religious dogma. In 1603, Bruno's works appeared on the Index Librorum Prohibitorum (List of Prohibited Books). The Prohibitorum aimed to protect the faith and morals of the faithful by preventing the reading of immoral books or works containing theological errors, although it also contained scientific works by the astronomer Johannes Kepler, Francis Bacon, Rene Descartes, Blaise Pascal and others. (Click here for a list of authors and works on the Prohibitorum). It took until 1966 before Pope Paul VI finally abolished the Prohibitorum. Regardless of how these blacklists ultimately affected science or not, it shows that the Church had little interest in free enquiry, especially when it conflicted with Church dogma.

During a Roman Catholic Inquisition, they imprisoned Galileo for his heretical beliefs of a heliocentric solar system and forced him, under threat of torture, to recant. In spite of his recantation, Galileo had to spend the rest of his life under house arrest. Isaac Newton studied occult religion in secret. If some of the Anglican Christian authorities had discovered this, they would have labeled him a heretic (Newton also studied the pseudo-scientific practice of alchemy), but Newton's scientific work stood separate from his religious investigations. And how revealing to realize that although Newton made great advancements in science, not one of his religious investigations bore the slightest fruit, not to mention the valuable time he wasted that might have gone further to scientific advancement.

Science comes not from ideology or religion; it derives from natural human curiosity and the will to know, not the will to believe. Humans have an evolved innate built-in curiosity and science cannot survive without it. Even our early paleolithic ancestors knew how to make tools, predict the path of the sun through the celestial sphere and made star maps as depicted in the Lascaux cave paintings. You just can't have free scientific inquiry without curiosity. But humans also have the capacity to fool themselves and to believe without evidence (faith). The conflict between natural curiosity, skepticism and faith exists to this day.

The Old Testament starts with the condemnation of eating from the the tree of knowledge (Gen. 2:17) and the term "Doubting Thomas" derived from the New Testament (John 20:24-29) refers to one that refuses to believe something without direct evidence. Church fathers expanded on these unscientific biblical ideas.

Some of the most influential early church fathers, not only did not inspire curiosity, in many cases, they reviled it. Peter Harrison claims, "From the patristic period to the beginning of the seventeen century curiosity was regarded as an intellectual vice." Early church fathers such as Tertullian despised Greek philosophy, and issued warnings against curiosity. He thought that curiosity ought not range beyond the rule of faith; restless curiosity, the feature of heresy. The Christian apologist Lactantius wrote, "when God revealed the truth to man, He wished us only to know those things which it concerned man to know for the attainment of life; but as to the things which related to a profane and eager curiosity He was silent, that they might be secret. Why, then, do you inquire into things which you cannot know, and if you knew them you would not be happier." Augustine also warned against the dangers of curiosity in his Confessions, "For over and above that lust of the flesh which lies in the delight of all our senses and pleasures--whose slaves are wasted unto destruction as they go far from you--there can also be in the mind itself, through those same bodily senses, a certain vain desire and curiosity, not of taking delights in the body, but of making experiments with the body's aid, and cloaked under the name of learning and knowledge." Although these views did not represent the views of all the clergy, it certainly could not have helped develop an atmosphere of free inquiry. A common view of the church held that scriptural knowledge trumped knowledge gained through the senses. Augustine, in his Literal Commentary on Genesis, thought of scriptural knowledge as vastly superior to knowledge gained by other means but he worried that Christians might express absurd opinions on cosmological issues, thus provoking ridicule, so he thought Christians should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation. Although the medieval Christians did not condemn scientific investigation, they simply thought it inferior to knowledge gained through God. The whole of education throughout the middle ages (and only the late middle ages) appears nothing more than a catch-up with what the ancient pagans had long known. And when this attitude later met with pure non-religious scientific investigation, scientists had to fight, tooth-and-claw, against Christian dogma to get their ideas accepted and one still had to live as a Christian believer (pretend or not) or else fear ostracism, or ridicule.

Revealingly, the scientists that Christians usually cite, lived during the Renaissance or the Age of Enlightenment when the Church began to lose its power and the populace began to wake up from its religious stupor. None of them (except for a very few), lived during the Dark Ages. If the foundation of science depended on Christianity, then why-oh-why didn't science develop and flourish during the Dark Ages at the height of Christian power and influence? They had centuries to invent or advance astronomy, chemistry, and mathematics, but they didn't. Why not? Because to do good science, you need an environment that encourages scientific thought, and the Church did little in this regard.

It came from scientific and enlightenment minds that influenced religion to bend its ways to concede to science, not the other way around. The Renaissance and the period of the Enlightenment came as a result from people beginning to reject certain religious beliefs. Renaissance means 'rebirth' and represented a cultural movement based on humanism to regain ancient classical sources that the Church had long suppressed or ignored. Moreover, the Renaissance inspired new ways of thinking about, not only science, but literature, philosophy, art, politics, and religion. The Age of Enlightenment (beginning approximately around the 18th century) represented the time when reason trumped religion as the primary source for thought. It resulted in the first concepts of secularism and the blasphemous idea that one does not need religion at all for workable investigations into nature.

The Church also frowned on the practice of alchemy thus chemistry, without which the understanding of matter could not have happened. Although Democritus first theorized about the nature of atoms in 460 BCE, it took until the 1800s before John Dalton performed experiments about the nature of atomic matter. Astronomy got limited to calendric events, and any discovery that went against the Bible's version of the cosmos could not have occurred. Natural history (biology) could not develop because any thought that went against Genesis would put any researcher in conflict with the Church. In the Dark Ages, math did not develop past that of the ancients and any new developments in mathematics got borrowed from other cultures. Geometry, trigonometry, fractions, division, multiplication, decimals, and algebra developed long before the Dark Ages. The introduction of Hindu-Arabic numerals to Europe came to Leonardo of Pisa (also known as Fibonacci, famous for the Fibonacci numbers) but he did little to advance theories of mathematics. Although many cite Fibonacci for the Fibonacci sequence, he did not discover it as ancient Indians knew it well before the Christian Europeans. Even the Greeks developed the precursors to calculus. Arguably, the first original science done by Christians didn't occur until the beginning of the Renaissance by the Oxford Calculators, some 1,400 years after the beginning of Christianity!

Recently scholars recovered an ancient text called The Archimedes Palimpsest, a codex written by Archimedes that revealed that the Greeks knew about infinity (both infinities and infinitesimals) long before the advent of Christianity. Ironically a monk had used the Archimedes papers to create a prayer book. A monk (or monks) scraped off the Archimedes text and wrote prayers in Greek in its place (the monks reused parchment in those days because of its durability and value). Although it may not have been the intent of the monks to destroy Archimedes' text, the codex remained hidden for centuries until modern scientists found a way to retrieve the hidden text. Had the monks understood the Archimedes codex, they probably would have recognized its importance and protected it. The embarrassing question remains: why didn't they? Imagine how different the world might look today if, instead of overwriting the codex, they had developed Archimedes' math hundreds of years before Leibniz and Newton invented calculus in the late 1600s?

Not only the scientists but the scientific institutions that Christians usually cite also came well after the Dark Ages. The Trinity College in Cambridge didn't come into existence until 1546 and only because King Henry VIII wanted to close down the universities. Katherine Parr, the queen, intervened and convinced her husband not to close two of them but to combine them to create a new college. (Katherine Parr, by the way, held heretical and reformed ideas about religion that would have put her in danger by the Church only a few years earlier.) The British Kingdom confiscated the lands from the Church to establish the college, thus, the Trinity College only pays an indirect homage to religion in the name "Trinity" (of which Isaac Newton, by the way, did not believe in, among many other scientists).

Although a few minor observatories existed during the Renaissance period, the Vatican Observatory didn't come into existence until 1891, and not for scientific inquiry but to establish a better calendar to determine the time to celebrate religious events. It hardly stands as the best example of astronomical observation and I suspect that the Church's support comes mainly as a propaganda ploy to say in effect: "See, we support science too," when in fact, it still opposes many scientific truths, or utilizes god-of-the-gaps thinking to justify only the most obvious scientific facts. The Greek, Roman, and Arabic names for the stars, planets and constellations also shows the absence of Christian influence. Unfortunately for Catholics, they can no longer use the observatory in their support for science because Pope Benedict XVI decided to dismantle the observatory to make more room for visiting diplomats.

Science never needed religion or any ideological system for its support or advancement, and the best scientific research centers today have nothing at all to do with religion. On the contrary, many faith-based systems oppose scientific inquiry that relies on evidence, free investigation, and reason. It also bears importance to reveal that throughout the history of science, not one scientific truth required god or any supernatural agent. On religion's end, it bears equal revelation to understand that religion and supernatural belief has never uncovered a single workable fact about nature or the universe. Not one. Everything we know about nature comes from scientific inquiry.

Scientific facts have never derived from religion, but religion has conceded to science. But even here, the Church's concessions to science have come through bitter delay. For example, not until 1992 did Pope John Paul II acquit Galileo, 359 years after his indictment of heresy! The Pope even conceded to the idea of evolution "as an effectively proven fact," over 130 years after Darwin's first publication of the fact. How in the world can anyone argue that Christianity founded modern science when the Church disagreed with the very people who made some of the most important scientific discoveries in history?

Protestant Christians like to point out that the Reformation changed Christianity for the better and they love to blame Islam for its backward scientific and political progress because it never went through a reformation as did Christianity. In a sense, Protestantism did improve the conditions for science, if only because the Reformation weakened the power of the Church, but it did little to encourage scientific investigation itself. Protestantism, from its very beginning, abhorred scientific reasoning. Martin Luther, its founder, condemned using reason and taught that faith alone should fill the minds of Christians. The Reformation only set Christians against Christians which resulted in hundreds of years of wars and intolerance. The only reason why Christianity appears more scientifically modern than Islam comes from the historical fact that Christianity conceded to science and reason through heretical enlightenment thinkers. As for Islam, it needs an Enlightenment, not a Reformation!

It also bears importance to realize that fundamental Christians never accept science on scientific facts alone but always with the condition that an invented theological explanation must accompany a scientific fact. Thus theists can only accept evolution by hypothesizing that god uses evolution as his method for creating life. The Big Bang theory can only earn acceptance when it accords with the belief of a god created universe (although many quantum physicists today think that the Big Bang didn't serve as an absolute beginning and probably never had one). These religious explanations use God-of-the-gaps thinking that, if you think about it, has as much relevance to factual knowledge as do Tinker Bell and Captain Hook.

And who represents the best and most honorable person of charitable medical care that religionists love to point to? Mother Teresa, of course. Unfortunately once one looks closely at her brand of care-giving, the idea of proper medical care goes out the window. Christopher Hitchens' reports that Mother Teresa's donated income went mostly to religious institutions, not the poor and suffering. Moreover, she wanted to keep the poor in poverty because of her faith of "Christ in the broken body," and that to come close to Jesus, the poor must suffer like Jesus. Even more damaging, her Church belief that condoms and other forms of contraception, went against God, allowed the poor to get infected with the HIV virus and other sexually transmitted diseases. More people died as a result of dangerous Church beliefs than Mother Teresa could ever have hoped to save.

Unfortunately, many Christian church authorities and Christian political leaders today, continue to place barriers against science. Many fundamentalist Christians reject modern biology, geology, and physics. Many deny climate change, birth control methods, stem cell research and other scientific advances that could save millions of people, if not, eventually, the entire human race. George W. Bush's administration kowtowed to the Religious Right and reduced scientific research in place of faith based initiatives. Many fundamentalist Christians want to eliminate Darwin's theory of evolution and replace it with theological Creationism. Some have even succeeded in using political means to change school boards across America to ban evolution from biology books and to teach Intelligent Design (an oxymoronic euphemism for Creationism) in its place. Scientists today sometimes still have to fight tooth-and-claw.

Christian faith healers still go around the world preaching that their god can immediately cure hidden diseases, blindness, arthritis, and many other disorders (except, oddly, for the visible ailments such as compound fractures, amputations, or even a simple pimple). When modern medicine does happen to cure them, they thank god instead of the doctors who actually saved them. Many devout Christians believe in miracles over modern science.

I don't know about you but when I search for a doctor to cure me, I don't want one who believes in superstitions, miracles, or divine intervention (for how could I ever know if he resorts to his faith rather than his medical training?). I want a doctor who uses the best scientific medical knowledge at his disposal and that means a doctor who doesn't hold Christian or any religious beliefs. When I want to understand how nature and the universe works, I read from scientific literature, not holy scripture. Scientists reveal the workings of nature, not priests, ministers or shamans.

The graph(†) above represents an approximate graph of the advancement of science through time.

The Christian Dark Ages represents a time in the history of Europe where scientific advancement not only halted but went backwards. The hole left by the Dark Ages bears the imprint of scientific ignorance that lasted longer than the Roman Empire. Imagine where scientific advancement would stand today if not for the scars left by Christianity.

During the Renaissance, and especially the Age of Enlightenment, people began to wake up. Many freethinkers and scientists rejected orthodox religion and replaced it with unitarianism, deism, or non-theistic philosophy. During the 1800s and after, scientists no longer had to fear religious persecution in any form. As never before in the history of mankind, scientists began to reject theocracy entirely. And what happened as a result of the freedom from religious influence? Science literally exploded with new ideas and discoveries! Since the early 1900s, the majority of the world's productive scientists held no theological beliefs, and the percentage of nonbelievers continued to rise every decade. Of course nontheism, in itself, cannot account for advances of science, but by eliminating religious beliefs that go contrary to science, it allows scientific research to go forth without unnecessary barriers.

Christianity, by its very biblical and supernatural nature, represents the antithesis of science, and its main claim to the advancement of science comes from its own weakening influence. Daniel Dennett observed that the Haggia Sofia in Constantinople, once served as the church of the Byzantine Empire, then a Mosque, and now exists as a museum, and predicts that the Vatican might one day turn into a Museum of Roman Christianity. It already has gone a long way toward that end. The Catholics once ruled Europe but now their their ruling territory (Vatican city), has gotten reduced to a mere 0.44 square kilometers, and much of that area already consists of museums (and a cheesy tourist gift shop). So bravo to those who dilute and weaken religion so that science can advance in an environment of free inquiry.

---

From: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>

To: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
Cc: Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, 1 November 2011, 21:33

Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Koulji

                   You are repeating the same ignorance. Your reply has no relevance and therefore it is nonsense. There was no evidence to prove that decimal system, zero were invented in India. There was no such talk during the Mughal period. It was only in the 18th century after the British established schools and colleges, this false claim was made after copying from Maths text books taught in colleges by the British.

 It is to dispel such ignorance  that Maths, surgery, planes existed in ancient India, V.S.Naipaul, Nobel laureate, says in his book, An Area of Darkness, “It is well that Indians are unable to look at their country directly, for the distress they would see would drive them mad. And it is well that they have no sense of history, for how then would they be able to continue to squat amid their ruins, and which Indian would be able to read the history of his country for the last thousand years without anger and pain? It is better to retreat into fantasy and fatalism, to trust to the stars in which the fortunes of all are written – there are lectures in astrology in some universities – and to regard the progress of the rest of the world with the tired tolerance of one who has been through it all before. The aero plane was known to ancient India , and the telephone, and the atom bomb: there is evidence in the Indian epics. Surgery was highly developed in ancient India : here, in an important national newspaper, is the text of a lecture proving it. Indian shipbuilding was the wonder of the world… Naipaul stresses the fantasy of Indians. If there were eminent scientists in ancient India , and if there were airplanes, why is it bullock carts are still to be seen today in every city in India ? Naipaul gives a common street scene on page 215. “A child was squatting in the mud of the street; the hairless, pink-skinned dog waited for the excrement. The child, big-bellied, rose; the dog ate.”  

Eighteenth century India was squalid. It invited conquest. But not in the Indian eyes: before the British came, as every Indian will tell you, India was rich, on the brink of an industrial breakthrough.” pp.212-213.

European writers like Colebrooke gave an exaggerated picture about the scientific achievements of ancient India in their craze to identify Indian Brahmins with the Aryans of Europe .

But Naipaul stresses the fantasy of Indians. If there were eminent scientists in ancient India , and if there were airplanes, why is it bullock carts are still to be seen today in every city in India ? Naipaul gives a common street scene on page 215. “A child was squatting in the mud of the street; the hairless, pink-skinned dog waited for the excrement. The child, big-bellied, rose; the dog ate.”

Koulji sir,

           If  Indians could not invent in the modern era  such ordinary things as fans, watches, spectacles, fountain pens, flush-out toilets,torch lights, and a thousand other ordinary things invented by Christian Europe, how could  can we say that surgery, aeroplanes etc ., were known to ancient Indians?

Are you using dining table for eating? Why don't you sit on the floor and eat? That is our traditional way of eating. Manu's code and Vedic instructions tell us that human latrine should built far away from the house. How can we have the stinking human excrement and urine inside a house, argued Brahmins.

 Mr Koul, Are you having toilet attached bathroom? Do you prefer European toilet? Wow! Why this hypocrisy? Back to the Vedas! Back to traditional Hindu living. Oh! We had aeroplanes in ancient India. There was pushpavimana!  Hi!ha!ha!

---

From: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>
To: Radhakrishnan P <radhakr...@yahoo.co.in>
Cc: Rabinder Koul <arr...@ameritech.net>; Arjun <arjun...@yahoo.co.uk>; "ska...@yahoo.com" <ska...@yahoo.com>; Raj Pandit <rajpa...@yahoo.com>; GOUTAM CHATTERJEE <gchatt...@gmail.com>; "shyam_n...@yahoo.com" <shyam_n...@yahoo.com>; "bcm...@gmail.com" <bcm...@gmail.com>; "satish...@yahoo.com" <satish...@yahoo.com>; "psab...@hotmail.com" <psab...@hotmail.com>; "bhano...@gmail.com" <bhano...@gmail.com>; "hita...@gmail.com" <hita...@gmail.com>; "kata...@aol.com" <kata...@aol.com>; "sadhak_...@yahoo.com" <sadhak_...@yahoo.com>; "jitender...@gmail.com" <jitender...@gmail.com>; "kri...@hindupedia.com" <kri...@hindupedia.com>; "shankara...@yahoo.com" <shankara...@yahoo.com>; "london...@yahoo.co.uk" <london...@yahoo.co.uk>; "tinasa...@yahoo.com" <tinasa...@yahoo.com>; "irmamuns...@gmail.com" <irmamuns...@gmail.com>; "sande...@hotmail.com" <sande...@hotmail.com>; "ani...@yahoo.co.uk" <ani...@yahoo.co.uk>; "govind...@hotmail.com" <govind...@hotmail.com>; "rishi...@hotmail.com" <rishi...@hotmail.com>; "ranbir...@talktalk.net" <ranbir...@talktalk.net>; "culturalbri...@yahoo.com" <culturalbri...@yahoo.com>; "tcgm...@hotmail.com" <tcgm...@hotmail.com>; "vyshv...@gmail.com" <vyshv...@gmail.com>; "live_by...@yahoo.co.uk" <live_by...@yahoo.co.uk>; "drmna...@yahoo.co.uk" <drmna...@yahoo.co.uk>; "rsin...@yahoo.com" <rsin...@yahoo.com>; "brah...@yahoo.com" <brah...@yahoo.com>; "aryasam...@yahoogroups.com" <aryasam...@yahoogroups.com>; "bhagav...@yahoo.ca" <bhagav...@yahoo.ca>; "akansh...@yahoo.com" <akansh...@yahoo.com>; "arya...@hotmail.com" <arya...@hotmail.com>; "mish...@aol.com" <mish...@aol.com>; "msb...@yahoo.com" <msb...@yahoo.com>; "naveen...@yahoo.co.in" <naveen...@yahoo.co.in>; "arun_...@yahoo.com" <arun_...@yahoo.com>; "jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in" <jeetbh...@yahoo.co.in>; "puneet...@gmail.com" <puneet...@gmail.com>; "ashwini...@yahoo.ca" <ashwini...@yahoo.ca>; "eka...@btinternet.com" <eka...@btinternet.com>; "jayasw...@gmail.com" <jayasw...@gmail.com>; "as_...@rediffmail.com" <as_...@rediffmail.com>; "baksh...@yahoo.com" <baksh...@yahoo.com>; "op.t...@gmail.com" <op.t...@gmail.com>; "bharat...@gmail.com" <bharat...@gmail.com>; "ahven...@gmail.com" <ahven...@gmail.com>; "gir...@aryasamaj.com" <gir...@aryasamaj.com>; "desi...@googlegroups.com" <desi...@googlegroups.com>; "vijaya...@yahoo.com" <vijaya...@yahoo.com>; "ashoks...@rediffmail.com" <ashoks...@rediffmail.com>; "satyar...@gmail.com" <satyar...@gmail.com>; "vsg...@yahoo.com" <vsg...@yahoo.com>; "arya.v...@gmail.com" <arya.v...@gmail.com>; "kcg...@yahoo.com" <kcg...@yahoo.com>; "su_...@ymail.com" <su_...@ymail.com>; "ajaya...@gmail.com" <ajaya...@gmail.com>

Sent: Wednesday, 2 November 2011 8:48 AM

Subject: Re: [aryayouthgroup] Re: BUDDHISM, THE FULFILMENT OF HINDUISM (-Swami Vivekananda at the Chicago Parliament of Religions on 26th September, 1893)

Mrr Pee: 

 Do you agree that Jesus was not the son of Maty's husband? There are only two answers, he was or he was not. If was son of Mary's husband then he is not Son of so called god. So all Christian theology falls on its face. If on the other hand he was not the Son of Mary's husband, then God at least committed and Mary committed Adultery with god, per the definition of Christians view. In both cases he becomes a bastard. It is logically flawless, and you being what you are too dumb to understand that. Is it too honest and difficult for you.

I have already shown you earlier that Christianity is founded on the contradicting principles earier, and you had no response to logical deductions, perhaps you are still getting Modern. Me as a Brahman, ha ve been educated far befor your Jesus was even born. I have heard recently some of you have wanted to show him visiting Kashmir and getting educated their. (May be you may want to read that Rozabal .) I understand some of you have realized that true civilization the master civilization was in Indio, and now want ti claim that this illegitimate child Jesus came to India to redeem himself.  But I don't think he could ever be redeemed.

Even Indus valley civilization; that is long time ago before you changed changed your parentage, from brown to white, to feel better about the way you feel about yourself, the toilets were built within the houses. You need to really educate yourself. 

Mr Pee, you can make g=fool of these Christian idiots, whole of the medical Science tells you that a woman who givens birth, is no more Virgin. But then how can you tell it to a person who believes that earth came in to existence in 4001 BC, and the life did not arise out of the evolution, and the earth is Flat. These are the Christian beliefs, clearly what you think is Modern..What idiots are these Christians that they believe in fairy tails.  You want to buy Brooklyn bridge, I am selling it...

This Jesus was not even an ordinary Sanyasi, for he was very quarrelsome and disruptive. Finally caught for his crimes and literally nailed for it. He was so powerful, that he could not even defend himself. That shame has been transformed for you modern idiots as he dies for you. He died for his grave crimes, served him right... But that was not last of the christian crime, You continued that with Pagans of Europe, Pagans of Armenia, Turkey and finally grand slam in the Holocaust. In the Annals of world history, there no more wicked a community than the Christians followed by Muslims. 

You see I told you Christianity is all about sex. As if they have been made the Cowkidars of the female parts.  There is nothing else in Bible except killing and teh sexual morality. EVen the knowledge is a sexula crime, so it is a dangerous thing for Christians. You should thank Arabs who took Indian Mathematics and educated the christian of the Europe, Later on Jesuits came here stole the Calculus from teh Pingla Svhool and passed itas Newtons and Lebinitz creation. Theft, foolery, usurping, Genocides and teh holocausts are Christin doing. Look your ugly face in the Mirror and feel ashamed, if their is even an ounce of Indianness left in you. You see so long you look brown, Christians will lookdown upon you, and as Indian you lookdown upon yourself. You must be living a miserable l;ife. I pity you...

Ravindra Koul

अस्मद्रूपसमाविष्ठ: स्वात्मनात्मानिवारणे 

शिव: करोतु निजया नम: शक्त्या ततात्मने 

On Nov 1, 2011, at 10:32 PM, Radhakrishnan P wrote:

Rabinder Koul in his frustration has given a reply which once again reveals his venom against modern civilization - an offspring of Christianity. A few years ago orthodox Hindus, following Manu's code, used to build their home latrine away from home. They could not think of a toilet inside a house, for it is against Hindu ethics and Vedic rites. Now everybody is insisting on bath-attached bedroom. These people  want European toilet too! 

Koul has made a derogatory remarks on Jesus. What he fails to understand is that it was virgin birth that gave divinity to Jesus. Otherwise he would be an ordinary sanyasi. While immaculate nature emerges from Jesus' life, Dr. Ambedkar gives the following from his book, Dr. Babasahib Ambbedkar writings and Speeches, Vol.4: "Krishna belonged to the Vrasni (yadava family). The Yadavas were polygamous. Yadava kings had innumerable wives and innumerable sons. According to Matsya Purana, King Taittiri, an ancestor of Krishna , married his own daughter and begot her son by name Nala. Krishna ’s son Sambha was attracted by his mother’s well developed physical features, especially breasts. The Matsya Purana tells how Samba lived an illicit life not only with his own mother but also with the other wives of his father Krishna . Hindu scriptures tell us that Krishna came to know about this sexual got angry and cursed Samba and his wives for their illicit sex. There is a reference to this secret sex in the Mahabharata also. Satyabhama, Krishna ’s wife, asked Draupadi the secret of her power over her five husbands. Draupadi warned Satyabhama against staying in private with her stepsons. Samba’s bother, Pradyumna ( Krishna ’s another son) married his foster mother Mayawati. What morals! What gods! Sons marrying mothers; fathers having sex with daughters! What moral lesson can we get from such gods and goddesses immersed in sexual debauchery?

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[Dirgha Raj Prasai]

Thanks !
Namaste !
You have released the fact history on Jesus and Christianity. But
there are come confusions in this long analysis. We should never
forget to explain that the brokers of Christian, almost 75% are
following the fallious tecnic to destroy the furtile mind of the
religious socities-Hindus and Buddhists. So, I am sending the story of
Jesus Christ, Christians religion and its originality.
Namaste !

Jesus Christ, Christian Religion its Origin

By Dirgha Raj Prasai (Nepal)

>> writings and Speeches, Vol.4: "Krishnabelonged to the Vrasni (yadava

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