Hell and Damnation (for lack of a better title)
tim_be...@my-deja.com
Moe,
The fact that you were a member of TCS and TBC shows (to me anyway)
that they weren't all about control or hell and damnation. But this
was the feeling at the time, one of the impressions it left. When it
comes to this subject, I can't prove anything to anyone. Don't want to
try either. It's just honest recollection.
You (and people like you) were the reason I felt half-way normal at
school during some goofy developmental years. Sitting behind you in
class, you never made me feel controlled, guilty or "bad" in any way.
You weren't full of yourself...you were just yourself. I would have
been far more likely to listen and consider a message from a person
like that.
By the way, Marsha is right about not apologizing for your opinion.
The whole purpose for this website is to communicate and to give your
opinion.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
mars...@my-deja.com
I agree with Tim. It wasn't so much the members that we knew that made
people feel this way.
I know this may be a cheap shot, but haven't those leaders been such
great role models??
On that note, this was only my opinion when I heard "persist". Didn't
like it then, don't think I like it now, unless it is as Bob stated,
persistant in prayer.
And also, thank God that now we all do have our own opinions and we can
accept others' as well. Even if we don't care for the other opinions,
we can like the person.
mo...@my-deja.com
I haven't been ignoring y'all about this subject. I have just been busy.
The only night we have free each week is Thursday, and I haven't had
time to check the website.
I'm not sure which leaders you are referring to, Marsha, that weren't
good role models from Temple, so I can't speak directly to that. I
truly believe both the church and the school were very legalistic in
their approach to living a Christian life. And I have to admit, church
and school were all about social time to me during high school, so who
knows what was said. I don't. During chapel and church, I'm sure I
spent all my time writing notes and trying to get some guy to notice me.
I just don't remember hell and damnation messages.
The concept that Northridge has changed to seems totally different than
the Temple I remember. It seems to me they are realizing that it is not
all about being Baptist. It is about worshipping our one true God, and
reaching out to the lost. I admit the persist until they come sounds
offensive. But I hope they mean persist through prayer and love,
without judgment. Winning others to Christ is not about what we can do,
but totally about the Holy Spirit moving in someone's life. There is
nothing I or anyone else can do except present God's message and plan.
The rest is up to Him.
mo...@my-deja.com
Anyways, Tim, I appreciate your kind words. You were one of my closest
friends in high school. But I am sure that if you asked Marsha her
impression of me in high school, you would get a totally different
picture.
What I harbor against Temple now that I am all grown up is the fact they
wanted to decide what was sin for me. (This may be what you all are
referring to.) To them, I was sinning if I listened to WRIF, went to
movies, and played war with cards. But I was rebellious enough not to
care what "they" thought. And I still don't care. I am also wise enough
now and through careful study of the Bible to know that there certain
things that the Bible clearly states are sin. There are also things
that may be a sin for one person, but not for another. It's about
where our devotion lies. Okay, I'm preaching, but let's take a benign
example: eating chocolate cake. If I am eating chocolate cake because
I just had a horrible day and I feel I deserve it, and that it will make
me feel better, then eating that cake becomes a sin. I am replacing a
devotion with God, whom I should be turning to make me happy, with a
devotion to cake. Now, if I am eating that cake because it tastes
great and I want to enjoy God's perfect food with thanksgiving of His
provision, it's a different story.
Okay, Preacher Moe is done
Hugs and kisses and love to all,
Moe
mars...@my-deja.com
mo...@my-deja.com wrote:
> I didn't get to finish last night. Hubby had to use the phone
urgently.
>
> Anyways, Tim, I appreciate your kind words. You were one of my
closest
> friends in high school. But I am sure that if you asked Marsha her
> impression of me in high school, you would get a totally different
> picture.
20 years ago.
Was just stating that "persist" sounded strong and why it scared me. I
was not speaking for everyone, just wanted to say how I felt.
However, for the record, what I thought of people back 20 years ago,
sure has changed a lot since meeting them again.
> What I harbor against Temple now that I am all grown up is the fact
they
> wanted to decide what was sin for me. (This may be what you all are
> referring to.) To them, I was sinning if I listened to WRIF, went to
> movies, and played war with cards. But I was rebellious enough not to
> care what "they" thought. And I still don't care. I am also wise
enough
> now and through careful study of the Bible to know that there certain
> things that the Bible clearly states are sin. There are also things
> that may be a sin for one person, but not for another. It's about
> where our devotion lies. Okay, I'm preaching, but let's take a benign
> example: eating chocolate cake. If I am eating chocolate cake
because
> I just had a horrible day and I feel I deserve it, and that it will
make
> me feel better, then eating that cake becomes a sin. I am replacing a
> devotion with God, whom I should be turning to make me happy, with a
> devotion to cake. Now, if I am eating that cake because it tastes
> great and I want to enjoy God's perfect food with thanksgiving of His
> provision, it's a different story.
Moe-you have just put what I was trying to say in MUCH better words
than I could have ever done. Never was really good in English. Was
probably too busy getting the boys to notice me too. Guess I should
have studied more--none of the boys noticed anyways.
b...@idealsys.net
mo...@my-deja.com
Marsha, I want to make myself clear. I didn't think for a minute you
were dredging up anything old. I just wanted to point out that Tim said
somthing along the lines that he would have listened to someone like me.
My whole point was what he thought of me was not a mutual opinion held
by others. I was not a nice person to everyone. But I was nice to Tim.
But by God's grace, I have changed...now I am nice to no one. Okay,
I'm just kidding.
I wish I would have listened more, too. I often feel like I have wasted
so much precious time pursuing things that are temporal rather than
things that are eternal. The boys really didn't notice me!!! At least
you dated! But now that's okay, good things come to those who wait, and
I have a really good thing.
I was going to sign this, Peace, Love, and Rock and Roll, but since we
are on a spiritual theme, I'll use my next favorite closing.
"May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the
fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all." 2 Cor. 13:14
Love y'all,
Moesy
mars...@my-deja.com
well. I still don't think I would have done differently with gym
class, tho. I still would have done anything to get out of that!
Good things do come to those who wait!! Got a good thing here too!
I'll say it for ya,
Peace, Love, and Rock and Roll -- right back at ya babe.
mars...@my-deja.com
words so I won't create such a mess.
tim_be...@my-deja.com
mars...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <89eun4$lbk$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> b...@idealsys.net wrote:
> > Very well put, Moesy. Amen.
> >
> From now on, I am going to go through Moe for putting my thoughts into
> words so I won't create such a mess.
Marsha (and Others)
You didn't create a mess. I'm not sure why you might think that
(unless you said it with a touch of sarcasm). As far as I could tell
you expressed yourself honestly about something of great importance to
you. You were't malicious about it. It was just straight forward with
hopes of getting some feedback and better understanding. Ya know, to
try to set things better. Afterall, you were there. It didn't seem
like you jumped to any conclusions. You had a few years to think about
this.
Hey look, I believe in giving credit where credit is due. But also
criticism where it is due. We can't go back and express ourselves to
certain "powers that be," but we can do it here (with each other) from
time to time. I don't think that's a total waste of time.
Anyway, support for all ideas/feelings on this regardless of which way
you see it.
b...@idealsys.net
mars...@my-deja.com
thread.
We can get back to that now... or go to Renee's where she wants to go
out to dinner one night. I like that idea!
mars...@my-deja.com
Thanks Tim.
I responded once and it looks like Deja's not going to post it.
Sometimes Deja gets me so confused (guess that is not too hard to do.
haha :)
I was not being sarcastic. Moe has a great with with words (you all
do) and she said just what I wanted to say. And if I could have said
it like that, then, I thought, this wouldn't have created such a mess.
I guess I could have used a better word than mess.
And I guess I am, even tho I say I am not, somewhat defensive and read
something in a way that it wasn't really said. I do that a lot it
looks like.
Let's go to a different subject...like meeting for dinner like Renee
said!!
Renee
> Let's go to a different subject...like meeting for dinner like Renee
> said!!
>
Great...how about March 15?
tim_be...@my-deja.com
Plenty of confusion in this crazy life, but one thing's for sure. I'm
ready to give a hug to anyone of ya that might need it.....
Marsha, Moe, Bobby, Renee, but not necessarily in that order. Corny,
eh? Well whatever!
mars...@my-deja.com
Renee <sch...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > Let's go to a different subject...like meeting for dinner like Renee
> > said!!
> >
>
> Great...how about March 15?
>
Renee
mars...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <89kenn$ibe$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> Renee <sch...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Let's go to a different subject...like meeting for dinner like
Renee
> > > said!!
> > >
> >
> > Great...how about March 15?
> >
> Sounds good. Where? What time?
Marsha, there's no problem with me staying in the metro area that
night. So what is good for you? Around 6:00? As for food, I'm
flexible; do you have any suggestions? Do you think anyone else will
join us?
b...@idealsys.net
> Do you think anyone else will join us?
I can't - we have a regular engagement on Thursday nights.
mars...@my-deja.com
b...@idealsys.net wrote:
>
> > Do you think anyone else will join us?
>
> I can't - we have a regular engagement on Thursday nights.
>
Renee-any place is good for me. There are quite a few good places by
you there at your work!. I could meet you at 6pm.
How 'bout it anyone else??
Renee
mars...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <89sdl4$4d8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> b...@idealsys.net wrote:
> >
> > > Do you think anyone else will join us?
> >
> > I can't - we have a regular engagement on Thursday nights.
> >
> On my calendar, March 15 is a Wednesday.
>
> Renee-any place is good for me. There are quite a few good places by
> you there at your work!. I could meet you at 6pm.
>
> How 'bout it anyone else??
My calendar also says March 15 is a Wednesday...how about it, Bob?
Well, there's Mexican, Italian, J. Alexander's which is a mix,
Applebee's. What sounds good to you?
mars...@my-deja.com
Renee <sch...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> In article <89utr2$o62$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> mars...@my-deja.com wrote:
> > In article <89sdl4$4d8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> > b...@idealsys.net wrote:
> > >
> > > > Do you think anyone else will join us?
> > >
> > > I can't - we have a regular engagement on Thursday nights.
> > >
> > On my calendar, March 15 is a Wednesday.
> >
> > Renee-any place is good for me. There are quite a few good places
by
> > you there at your work!. I could meet you at 6pm.
> >
> > How 'bout it anyone else??
>
> My calendar also says March 15 is a Wednesday...how about it, Bob?
>
> Well, there's Mexican, Italian, J. Alexander's which is a mix,
> Applebee's. What sounds good to you?
> >
there lots when I worked in the area.
Ya, Bob, do you think you can handle it?? Just kidding.
How about Carol??
b...@idealsys.net
Carol
> > My calendar also says March 15 is a Wednesday...how about it, Bob?
> >
> > Well, there's Mexican, Italian, J. Alexander's which is a mix,
> > Applebee's. What sounds good to you?
> > >
> > > Macaroni Grill sounds good, how about there?? I used to get to go
> there lots when I worked in the area.
> Ya, Bob, do you think you can handle it?? Just kidding.
> How about Carol??
Carol is working on the babysitter issue. :)
mo...@my-deja.com
I wish I could go out to eat, I might go to the Macaroni Grill here and
pretend I am with you.
But somebody's birthday is March 16. Her initials in high school were
RRR. So those of you going make something special of her 39th birthday.
Love,
Moesy
Carol
> Carol is working on the babysitter issue. :)
Got it straightened out, but I have a 7:30pm curfew!
Renee/Marsha, do you want me to send out an email inviting others in the
area???
Carol
mars...@my-deja.com
Carol <gom...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> > Carol is working on the babysitter issue. :)
>
> Got it straightened out, but I have a 7:30pm curfew!
>
> Renee/Marsha, do you want me to send out an email inviting others in
the
> area???
>
> Carol
>
there sooner, go right ahead. I could probably get there by 5:30p
myself.
We'll have to have a bday cake for RRR!!!
Yes, send out emails!! That sounds good.
mars...@my-deja.com
mo...@my-deja.com wrote:
> This thread is getting almost as long as the Sorry Bob thread.
>
> I wish I could go out to eat, I might go to the Macaroni Grill here
and
> pretend I am with you.
>
> But somebody's birthday is March 16. Her initials in high school were
> RRR. So those of you going make something special of her 39th
birthday.
>
> Love,
> Moesy
>
Thanks for the RRR info!
Carol
do you think Renee? I'll send out an email as soon as we confirm the
time.
Renee
Moe, I can't believe you remember that date. BTW...who's RRR again?
See all who can make it to the Mac Grill (Haggerty & 7 Mile) on March
15 at 5:30!
Love...Renee
Carol
> Carol, go ahead with the email; 5:30 is just fine for me.
>
> Moe, I can't believe you remember that date. BTW...who's RRR again?
>
> See all who can make it to the Mac Grill (Haggerty & 7 Mile) on March
> 15 at 5:30!
>
> Love...Renee
>
5:30 it is then! I'll send out the email.
Carol
jillsl...@my-deja.com
Deja forum for so long and I hadn't read my emails for some time!
Tonight, though, I have to go to NorthRidge Church and be persistant in
winning over those awful sinners. Actually, someone had a point in
their rebuttals to the intolerance issue and thought it would be great
if NorthRidge believed that you should win people through prayer, etc.
and not be judgemental. If you were to get your hands on any other
literature that the church has produced, visit the web site
(NorthRidgeChurch.com) or attended even one service, you would see that
that is the message that is now preached each and every service. It is
not longer the country club of who is keeping up the Jones', who
daughter is pregnant, who's sleeping with who's husband and all that
other crap. Actually those weren't even the most damaging. It was who
was seen walking out of the movie theater, sho didn't come to church
last week, etc!!! Actually Brad Powell goes to the movies and even
talks about them. To make an even bigger impression on ya'll, they
showed a clip from Mrs. Doubtfire a few months ago when the topic of
the day was "love." It was some poignant moment from the move that was
totally relevant. And just about two years ago they were having a golf
outing that afternoon, so they showed clips from "Happy Gilmore!" To
understand how they do that for those of you who have never been to the
new building, we no longer use hymnals since we don't sing them, but
read the song lyrics off the two "big screens!" It's a trip, but not
such a bad thing.
Remember not to read too much into words like persistant, though.
Although it conveys what was intended, it does have negative
connotations for those of us who were negatively influenced by the
former TBC regimes. I believe what was meant was to be persistant is
asking people to come to church, be persistant in letting them know
what God has done in your life. Not being judgemental is one of the
biggest things they talk about now. People are there now because they
want to be not because they feel they have to attend church. It has
grown so much since they moved to Plymouth that the place is bursting
at the seams also. Phase II building is starting in June! I would
like to be persistant in asking anyone to meet me there any Sunday for
the 11:15 service! And everyone is invited to attend on Sunday, April
9 (not sure of the time yet). Church is going to be held at Compuware
Arena so we can fit all the people into one building at the same time!
(There are now two services for those who didn't know).
Enough!!! Just thought someone who actually goes there should shed
some light on this subject.
mars...@my-deja.com
Will have to go check it out. >
jillsl...@my-deja.com
How was dinner last night? Sorry I missed it. I missed church, too!
Had to take my daughter to the doctor; she hurt her knee skating.
Maybe next time!
Yes, you should try NorthRidge some time. It really is a great place.
TOTALLY different, hence the name change. I think too many people had
recollections of hell fire and damnation with "Baptist" and the
Henderson, Dollar regimes, hence the name change.....
mars...@my-deja.com
jillsl...@my-deja.com wrote:
> Hey Marsha!
>
> How was dinner last night? Sorry I missed it. I missed church, too!
> Had to take my daughter to the doctor; she hurt her knee skating.
> Maybe next time!
>
> Yes, you should try NorthRidge some time. It really is a great place.
> TOTALLY different, hence the name change. I think too many people had
> recollections of hell fire and damnation with "Baptist" and the
> Henderson, Dollar regimes, hence the name change.....
>
I had to miss dinner myself. We are having day care problems - teacher
quit, center director fired.... and the main office had a meeting with
us parents to explain what is happening and what they are doing about
it. And as it was, Mike didn't get home from work til 3am. YEOWCH.
I hope every had fun. Let us know who was there and what ya'll talked
about. We should try to schedule another one soon.
mars...@my-deja.com
jillsl...@my-deja.com wrote:
> Hey Marsha!
>
> How was dinner last night? Sorry I missed it. I missed church, too!
> Had to take my daughter to the doctor; she hurt her knee skating.
> Maybe next time!
>
> Yes, you should try NorthRidge some time. It really is a great place.
> TOTALLY different, hence the name change. I think too many people had
> recollections of hell fire and damnation with "Baptist" and the
> Henderson, Dollar regimes, hence the name change.....
>
Renee
again, maybe the end of April or early May.
We basically caught up with what is going on in each others lives.
Carol and I learned about home schooling from Bob and Joyce and Bob
also explained about Northridge. I didn't know Temple changed its name.
Hope we can get together.
Renee