American Ifa
icas...@ifafoundation.org
Have you read the year 2000 reading at our site http://www.ifafoundation.org ?
I also would like your reaction to our concept of American Ifa.
It's posted there now.
E-mail me with your thoughts
Blessings
Philip Neimark
Oluwo
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Before you buy.
g_sm...@my-deja.com
I enjoyed your article on American Ifa and hope others learned from it
as well. I believe that we as Westerners can learn from the Yoruba
culture, but it is not necessary to try and emulate all facets of it.
Ifa is truly universal and applies to all cultures. I find it
unfortunate that a majority of Orisha followers fail to ackowledge this
fact placing emphasis on things such as a Babalawos knowledge of the
Yoruba language as opposed to their character or competence as a
diviner.
I agree with you whole-heartedly on the 12 points you mentioned,
however, they seems to be the same truths that you have stated
previously in your writings. I also have difficulty with the the label
"American Ifa". While I think I understand where you are coming from,
I still dislike labels.
I look forward to reading your articles on the various points you
addressed.
Peace and Blessings
G_smiley
omoy...@my-deja.com
i don't understand this concept of american Ifá. how can it be? Ifá
is what it is...why change it to fit a lifestyle? wouldn't that mean
that Ifá is not for the person, if the person wishes to change it in
order to make the path conform to his or her own selfish needs??? i
understand why lucumi, santeria, and all the other diverged Ifá
traditions exist. there is a valid reason...misplaced africans could
not practice they ways they needed, and wanted to. this is a new
day...americans can follow Ifá exactly as prescribed in this day and
age. i see no reason to americanise Ifá. i strongly feel that as soon
as this happens, Ifá will no longer be Ifá.
Gbadun
OmoYemoja
In article <85gc06$qon$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
oduk...@my-deja.com
Let me attempt to answer your views:
1. It is clear that you do not understand the concept of American Ifa
2. Your accusation that" person wishes to change it...to his own
selfish needs", reflects your own constricted and atrophied world view.
3. Ifa is about basic Truths, not nationalistic viewpoints. Let me try
and enlighten you. I shall use the analogy of Horse and cars.
Originally, we used horses as a way to travel. Later came automobiles,
and they evolved from cranked open air starters, to automatic
transmissions and air conditioning..YET, they all conformed to a BASIC
TRUTH: they were about TRANSPORTATION! Your view, and attitude, is we
should continue riding the horse because that's the way it was done in
the past. IFA's basic Truths can, and must, be expressed in a
MEANINGFUL context of the culture they are expressed in. Some cultures,
after all, still ride the horse as their primary mode of transportation.
4.Who is it you think "proscribes" the path of Ifa? Certainly, it is
not any group of Nationalistic priests regardless of whether the come
from Ile Ife or Habana. Ifa is proscribed through the Sacred Odu...and
I assure you that American Ifa violates none of these basic Truths.
Indeed, we bring many back to life.
Finally, I suggest you read the new article on American Ifa that will
be posted this weekend on our site.
Blessings
Philip Neimark
Oluwo
In article <87d5c5$4v1$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
Eileen & Gladys
things to fit us and our needs. In the process a lot of what I call the
magick of spirituality is lost, hence we lose interest in it sooner or
later. There is something to be said about tradition and why our ancestors
follow it. If you look at Americans today, we really don't have
traditions, and thus we miss out on a lot that brought our ancestors
together and gave them that special something that we can not put our
fingers on.
Gladys
----------
From: omoy...@my-deja.com
To: deja.c...@list.deja.com
Subject: Re: American Ifa
Date: Thursday, February 03, 2000 4:09 PM
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OmoYemoja
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oduk...@my-deja.com
Even though the new article which will appear Saturday ay the
Ifafoundation.org site fully deals with these issues, let me briefly
make two points.
1. Tradition is fine. It has NOTHING to do with results. Ifa is a
pragmatic philosophy designed to provide practical improvements in our
lives. When "tradition" contradicts the cultural reality of where we
live, the results diminish.
2. "Magick" and your attraction to it is self-limiting. The dramatic
RESULTS Ifa can produce is not a matter of Magick, they are a matter of
unerring logic and consistency.
3. Again, i urge you to read this weeks piece on our site
Blessings
Philip neimark
Oluwo
<200002040833250.SM00279@catwoman>,
"Eileen & Gladys" <catw...@sierratel.com> wrote:
> I would tend to agree. We as Americans have away of wanting to change
> things to fit us and our needs. In the process a lot of what I call
the
> magick of spirituality is lost, hence we lose interest in it sooner or
> later. There is something to be said about tradition and why our
ancestors
> follow it. If you look at Americans today, we really don't have
> traditions, and thus we miss out on a lot that brought our ancestors
> together and gave them that special something that we can not put our
> fingers on.
>
> Gladys
>
> ----------
> From: omoy...@my-deja.com
> To: deja.c...@list.deja.com
> Subject: Re: American Ifa
> Date: Thursday, February 03, 2000 4:09 PM
>
> Message from the Deja.com forum:=20
> deja.comm.ifa
> Your subscription is set to individual email delivery
>
> alafia gbogbo omo Orisa!
> i don't understand this concept of american If=E1. how can it be?
If=E1
> is what it is...why change it to fit a lifestyle? wouldn't that mean
> that If=E1 is not for the person, if the person wishes to change it in
> order to make the path conform to his or her own selfish needs??? i
> understand why lucumi, santeria, and all the other diverged If=E1
> traditions exist. there is a valid reason...misplaced africans could
> not practice they ways they needed, and wanted to. this is a new
> day...americans can follow If=E1 exactly as prescribed in this day and
> age. i see no reason to americanise If=E1. i strongly feel that as
soon
> as this happens, If=E1 will no longer be If=E1.
> http://www.deja.com/edit_sub.xp?group=3Ddeja.comm.ifa
> * Read this thread at
> http://www.deja.com/thread/%3C87d5c5%244v1%241%40nnrp1.deja.com%3E
>
> ----------
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>
gran...@my-deja.com
Some people find labels helpful, some do not. The point I see in
American Ifa is not that "we've got our own version now!" but that the
essence of the religion has been brought into 21st Century America
without the unnecessary cultural accretions. It is often difficult to
separate a religion from the culture of its birth. But every major
world religion has gone through the process of cutting away the old
culture so it can be understood and assimilated into the new culture.
A strong religion cannot be harmed by this process- witness the spread
of Buddhism, Christianity and Islam for example. The essence of
Buddhism has not been destroyed despite the fact that it is found in a
myriad of forms from India, where it began, to England and the U.S.,
which have embraced so many of its permutations. There are hundreds of
different types of Buddhism but its essence- the basic teachings of
Buddha- has not changed.
I believe in practicing what works and what seems best to me. But
we'll never all be able to agree on one religion or even a single form
of any religion. So, practice your faith, whatever it is, with love
and joy!
Blessings to all!
Mary
In article <87ffjv$psb$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,