Hyper-dimensional Travel
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Josh
Jun 28, 2008, 4:31:51 PM6/28/08
to Cripe Quandry
This is the first of my hyperdimensional travel writings inspired by
Imagining the Tenth Dimension, The Universe in a Nutshell and mostly
by Michio Kaku's Hyperspace. It is in it's preliminary stage, so it
needs a lot of refinement, but I really wanted to share my ideas:
Inter/Hyper-dimensional Travel
Try to envision how higher dimensional beings would appear and appear
to us; if a flatlander can only see 2-d cross sections of us, 3ders,
then a 3der could only see undulating cross sections of 4ders as the
aged sporadically. Also, consider the differences between a 4th
spatial dimension and a 4th temporal dimension. The 4th spatial
dimension would be randomly changing shapes moving in inexplicable and
unidentifiable means, sudden disappearance and reappearances, etc.
While the 4th temporal dimension would be patterned/complex aging;
beings would change their age and appearance at a whim by simply
moving around. It would seem more ordered and patterned than 4th
spatial dimension. Try to think of hypercubes as an example of
patterned, cyclical “aging”. Another note, the 4th temporal
dimensional beings would consist of every manifestation of whatever
matter composed them. Trace your own time-line back far enough and you
become your parents. Therefore, we would all be connected in this
massive tree of organic mass if we were viewed as a 4th dimensional
entity. It would be very long and complex, with many nubs where people
died off, but everyone on the planet would trace back to genetic Adam
& Eve and on until oblivion, except when you encountered beings from a
different planet.
Now consider, does the time-line stop with the consciousness of the
individual, with the organic composition of the individual or with the
non-organic composition of the individual? If it's the last one, then
everything in our universe is all connected as a single 4th
dimensional being since we are all composed of the shared matter from
the big bang. The only exception to this are possibly black-holes,
where Hawking's Radiation "manifests new matter", wormholes to other
universes or other dimensional manifestations of matter. Can matter
exist in a form on one dimension and not on lower dimensions? I think
yes. We still exist as a full 3der with a fully fleshed out body even
though the Flatlanders can only witness 2d slices of us when we pass
through their plane of view. So there may be some form of matter in a
higher dimension that we can't see until we can perceive/interact with
higher dimensions. Dark matter maybe? Photons? Subatomic particles?
Superstrings?
Also, matter on a lower dimension may be far more simplified than its
manifestations on a higher dimension or may not even be perceptible on
a higher dimension. We are completely incapable of perceiving/
conceiving of a line or point. Instead, we use 2 and 3 dimensional
representations of them, or avatars if you like religious
connotations. Therefore, at which dimension are we, as 3ders,
imperceptible? However, at those dimensions, we may still be aware of
ourselves and some perception of the higher dimension. How would we,
as 3ders, walk through a higher dimension? A 2der walking a mobius
strip twists all over the bloody place while she only walks in a
straight line. If we were to walk in a straight line in a higher
dimension, it may appear that we are wondering all over the bloody
countryside to travel that one line. Another question, since the
mobius strip pilgrim ends back at her starting point, where do we end
up? If we blindly walk, we may cross our own start point from an
infinite number of different directions or from the same direction an
infinite number of times. Say we walk a straight road while drawing a
line behind us, as we keep walking, we cross our origin on a path
perpendicular to our original direction, so we mark it and keep
walking straight. Next thing we know, we've traveled 4 times the
original time/distance and still ended up back at our origin, but on a
path that's perpendicular to both of the original directions. We do
this again and travel for 1/8th the original time/distance and come at
a path that's 32 degrees offset from our original path and 2 degrees
beneath it's plane. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Without watching where
we're traveling in 4th dimensional space, we could easily spend
infinity walking in “circles”.
If we're in a 4th Temporal dimension, we have infinity to do whatever
we want as we are comprised of all time and it is only possibility or
difference that binds us. If we existed as 4th temporal dimensional
beings, we would be the afore mentioned time tree of all life on earth
who could only perceive slices of possibility (5th dimension according
to 10 dimensional String theory). So to travel in the 4th dimension we
have to carefully watch our surroundings and change our path many
times. The best idea would be a map or constant direction/guidance
from a 4der. A map may trick us up if we can't figure out how to move
in the 3rd perpendicular. Remember that the 1st perpendicular creates
a plane, the 2nd perpendicular creates a body and the 3rd
perpendicular creates a 4d object. The 3rd perpendicular marks the 4th
spatial dimension; think of hypercubes as an example. There's also the
consideration of the 3rd dimension being warped in such a manner that
this path intersection would happen if we were to travel sufficient
distance in a “straight line” through space. We would think we were
going forward the entire time, but eventually we would arrive at our
start point. What about the possibility of traveling through a warped
4th dimensional universe? Maybe it would work like a Mandlebrot set
or a Fractal, where the pattern repeats, but is reoriented each time.
Another thought is the combination of the 4th spatial and 4th
temporal dimensions into the 4th whole dimension. Objects/people would
change appearance through age, rebirth, death and deterioration at
their whims and in varying degrees of perceptible patterns. Think of
complex 3d objects on 2d planes. The simpler the object, the easier
the pattern is to recognize, such as a sphere forming from a point,
growing into a large circle and then shrinking again. So 4ders would
change their appearance in patterns of varying complexity. A more
complex 4der would seem almost random, while a simple 4der would be an
easily recognizable pattern (hypercubes!). All the changes would
happen only through the movement of the 3der relative to the 4der or
the 4der's plane and vice versa. So as we walked past a 4der, the 4der
would change, aging rapidly, dying and deteriorating. If we walked in
the other direction past them, they would regress in age and be
unborn. If we walked in a direction perpendicular to our previous path
(directly at the side of the 4der), we would see them as a
manifestation of wholeness from their birth to death. In the
previously described time tree scenario, they would be infinity. We
would therefore have to walk above or beneath them on this otherwise
intersecting path. To pass a 4der on a path perpendicular to their own
(our 3rd path mentioned above), while staying on the same level as
them, you would have to move in front of or behind them, meaning
before their birth or after their death. Either way, they would not
exist so we wouldn't even notice them. If we turned while passing them
to walk in the original direction, they would appear from nothing and
we'd probably bump noses, unless they were paying attention. The same
goes if we approach them from the other end.
Another idea is that of individuality. In the previously mentioned
time tree, where all things are connected through their shared matter,
there is no such thing as identity. Identity is based upon separation
for the purposes of comparing and contrasting. We know who we are
because we are not everything and we are not nothing, but we are like
some things. So with the time tree scenario, there is no identity
because there is no separation. A 3der in a 4der's world would only be
able to see 3d cross sections bearing multiple identities of the 4der,
but the 4der would recognize that all the identities the 3der was so
interested in are really just different facets of the one 4der.
However, this may only work if the 4der is a time tree comprised of
non-organic connections. A time-tree comprised of organic connections
would manifest all life on a planet, but not the life on other planets
unless it was seeded from that other planet. And a time tree can not
work off of consciousness links unless consciousness is expressed in a
shared manner, i.e. reincarnation. So we would see a myriad of
individuals who all knew everything because they were all the same
thing. As we moved forward and back through this 4d world, the
different Identities would combine, appear and disappear. As we moved
up or down in the 4d world, we would witness infinity stretching out
on the plane we were trying to walk around in before. It's like
walking through a maze where you have to climb walls sometimes to get
past certain sections. Now we could have multiple identities in 4d
space by having matter originating from different sources, such as the
afore mentioned Hawking Radiation or wormholes. What happens if a
being travels through an inter-universal wormhole and fucks a being in
the other universe? We've just connected two 4ders and therefore tied
the 2 universes together. Weird...
Anyways, another possibility is the matter residing on the higher
dimensional plane but not the lower. This allows the matter to not be
bound in a way we are, but may possibly be bound by higher dimensional
laws. If all natural laws of physics are a dimensional expression of
some absolute higher dimensional warping, then what sort of laws would
bind that 4d and how would they be expressed in the dimensions above?
Do our physical laws translate to the dimensions beneath us? Now
imagine trying to view a 2d world. We would see it as a flat plane
that we walked along the surface of. If we ever fell off the plane, or
moved to the side of it, it would be imperceptible when viewed
directly from the side, but would become partially visible again the
instant we moved slightly above or below the plane. Another question
is the size of this 2d world. If it is infinite, as we perceive our 3d
world to be, then we can't "fall off" or "fall through" without
destroying or moving part of that world. A simpler idea is viewing a
2der in our 3d world. When viewed from any angle, they would be
visible to varying degrees. When seen at a perpendicular angle, their
infinity would be completely visible. When viewed at a parallel angle,
they would be completely imperceptible. Or what about the possibility
of passing through the 2d plane universe? Since their plane has no
depth, it should fit neatly between our atoms, thus delivering the
undulating 2d cross sections of ourselves. How would we control our
height within the 2d world? What would keep us from “slipping
through” in whatever direction? And if we only ever walked on the
surface of the 2d world, the 2ders would see us as a pair of
disappearing/reappearing rubber soles, bounding across their universe
in erratic patterns and reeking havoc upon their order.
So what happens when a 3der moves into the 4d world? As we talk to a
4der, they may move around and think we are funny in our closed
finiteness, however, if we take one wrong step so they view us at a
parallel angle to our timeline, we disappear. When they view us at a
perpendicular angle to our timeline, our finiteness is completely
visible to them. Or what if this 4d consists only of the matter
expressed in our 3d universe? We would be a part of this time tree and
would drag it around behind us wherever we went. To speak with a 4d
time tree without hyperdimensional or unique matter would be to talk
with a higher understanding of ourselves. It's a personality of ours
that recognizes its own infinity and our imperceptible fraction of
that unidentifiable infinity.
Another idea is at what dimension are we imperceptible? For example,
we can not perceive a 1dimensional or lower object. Instead, we use 2d
representations of 1d lines and 0d points. How high do we have to go
before we become imperceptible and how would we interact with others
at that point (Nd)? An Nder would require a 4d, 5d, 6d... (yd)
representation of us to track us. The most immediate idea in my mind
is picking up a guide in a higher dimension who acts as a liasion to
the Nders for us. However, if we move too high, the yder guide becomes
imperceptible as well. Can a lesser dimensional being even effect a
higher dimension? Based on the mobius strip, I say maybe.
Imagining the Tenth Dimension, The Universe in a Nutshell and mostly
by Michio Kaku's Hyperspace. It is in it's preliminary stage, so it
needs a lot of refinement, but I really wanted to share my ideas:
Inter/Hyper-dimensional Travel
Try to envision how higher dimensional beings would appear and appear
to us; if a flatlander can only see 2-d cross sections of us, 3ders,
then a 3der could only see undulating cross sections of 4ders as the
aged sporadically. Also, consider the differences between a 4th
spatial dimension and a 4th temporal dimension. The 4th spatial
dimension would be randomly changing shapes moving in inexplicable and
unidentifiable means, sudden disappearance and reappearances, etc.
While the 4th temporal dimension would be patterned/complex aging;
beings would change their age and appearance at a whim by simply
moving around. It would seem more ordered and patterned than 4th
spatial dimension. Try to think of hypercubes as an example of
patterned, cyclical “aging”. Another note, the 4th temporal
dimensional beings would consist of every manifestation of whatever
matter composed them. Trace your own time-line back far enough and you
become your parents. Therefore, we would all be connected in this
massive tree of organic mass if we were viewed as a 4th dimensional
entity. It would be very long and complex, with many nubs where people
died off, but everyone on the planet would trace back to genetic Adam
& Eve and on until oblivion, except when you encountered beings from a
different planet.
Now consider, does the time-line stop with the consciousness of the
individual, with the organic composition of the individual or with the
non-organic composition of the individual? If it's the last one, then
everything in our universe is all connected as a single 4th
dimensional being since we are all composed of the shared matter from
the big bang. The only exception to this are possibly black-holes,
where Hawking's Radiation "manifests new matter", wormholes to other
universes or other dimensional manifestations of matter. Can matter
exist in a form on one dimension and not on lower dimensions? I think
yes. We still exist as a full 3der with a fully fleshed out body even
though the Flatlanders can only witness 2d slices of us when we pass
through their plane of view. So there may be some form of matter in a
higher dimension that we can't see until we can perceive/interact with
higher dimensions. Dark matter maybe? Photons? Subatomic particles?
Superstrings?
Also, matter on a lower dimension may be far more simplified than its
manifestations on a higher dimension or may not even be perceptible on
a higher dimension. We are completely incapable of perceiving/
conceiving of a line or point. Instead, we use 2 and 3 dimensional
representations of them, or avatars if you like religious
connotations. Therefore, at which dimension are we, as 3ders,
imperceptible? However, at those dimensions, we may still be aware of
ourselves and some perception of the higher dimension. How would we,
as 3ders, walk through a higher dimension? A 2der walking a mobius
strip twists all over the bloody place while she only walks in a
straight line. If we were to walk in a straight line in a higher
dimension, it may appear that we are wondering all over the bloody
countryside to travel that one line. Another question, since the
mobius strip pilgrim ends back at her starting point, where do we end
up? If we blindly walk, we may cross our own start point from an
infinite number of different directions or from the same direction an
infinite number of times. Say we walk a straight road while drawing a
line behind us, as we keep walking, we cross our origin on a path
perpendicular to our original direction, so we mark it and keep
walking straight. Next thing we know, we've traveled 4 times the
original time/distance and still ended up back at our origin, but on a
path that's perpendicular to both of the original directions. We do
this again and travel for 1/8th the original time/distance and come at
a path that's 32 degrees offset from our original path and 2 degrees
beneath it's plane. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Without watching where
we're traveling in 4th dimensional space, we could easily spend
infinity walking in “circles”.
If we're in a 4th Temporal dimension, we have infinity to do whatever
we want as we are comprised of all time and it is only possibility or
difference that binds us. If we existed as 4th temporal dimensional
beings, we would be the afore mentioned time tree of all life on earth
who could only perceive slices of possibility (5th dimension according
to 10 dimensional String theory). So to travel in the 4th dimension we
have to carefully watch our surroundings and change our path many
times. The best idea would be a map or constant direction/guidance
from a 4der. A map may trick us up if we can't figure out how to move
in the 3rd perpendicular. Remember that the 1st perpendicular creates
a plane, the 2nd perpendicular creates a body and the 3rd
perpendicular creates a 4d object. The 3rd perpendicular marks the 4th
spatial dimension; think of hypercubes as an example. There's also the
consideration of the 3rd dimension being warped in such a manner that
this path intersection would happen if we were to travel sufficient
distance in a “straight line” through space. We would think we were
going forward the entire time, but eventually we would arrive at our
start point. What about the possibility of traveling through a warped
4th dimensional universe? Maybe it would work like a Mandlebrot set
or a Fractal, where the pattern repeats, but is reoriented each time.
Another thought is the combination of the 4th spatial and 4th
temporal dimensions into the 4th whole dimension. Objects/people would
change appearance through age, rebirth, death and deterioration at
their whims and in varying degrees of perceptible patterns. Think of
complex 3d objects on 2d planes. The simpler the object, the easier
the pattern is to recognize, such as a sphere forming from a point,
growing into a large circle and then shrinking again. So 4ders would
change their appearance in patterns of varying complexity. A more
complex 4der would seem almost random, while a simple 4der would be an
easily recognizable pattern (hypercubes!). All the changes would
happen only through the movement of the 3der relative to the 4der or
the 4der's plane and vice versa. So as we walked past a 4der, the 4der
would change, aging rapidly, dying and deteriorating. If we walked in
the other direction past them, they would regress in age and be
unborn. If we walked in a direction perpendicular to our previous path
(directly at the side of the 4der), we would see them as a
manifestation of wholeness from their birth to death. In the
previously described time tree scenario, they would be infinity. We
would therefore have to walk above or beneath them on this otherwise
intersecting path. To pass a 4der on a path perpendicular to their own
(our 3rd path mentioned above), while staying on the same level as
them, you would have to move in front of or behind them, meaning
before their birth or after their death. Either way, they would not
exist so we wouldn't even notice them. If we turned while passing them
to walk in the original direction, they would appear from nothing and
we'd probably bump noses, unless they were paying attention. The same
goes if we approach them from the other end.
Another idea is that of individuality. In the previously mentioned
time tree, where all things are connected through their shared matter,
there is no such thing as identity. Identity is based upon separation
for the purposes of comparing and contrasting. We know who we are
because we are not everything and we are not nothing, but we are like
some things. So with the time tree scenario, there is no identity
because there is no separation. A 3der in a 4der's world would only be
able to see 3d cross sections bearing multiple identities of the 4der,
but the 4der would recognize that all the identities the 3der was so
interested in are really just different facets of the one 4der.
However, this may only work if the 4der is a time tree comprised of
non-organic connections. A time-tree comprised of organic connections
would manifest all life on a planet, but not the life on other planets
unless it was seeded from that other planet. And a time tree can not
work off of consciousness links unless consciousness is expressed in a
shared manner, i.e. reincarnation. So we would see a myriad of
individuals who all knew everything because they were all the same
thing. As we moved forward and back through this 4d world, the
different Identities would combine, appear and disappear. As we moved
up or down in the 4d world, we would witness infinity stretching out
on the plane we were trying to walk around in before. It's like
walking through a maze where you have to climb walls sometimes to get
past certain sections. Now we could have multiple identities in 4d
space by having matter originating from different sources, such as the
afore mentioned Hawking Radiation or wormholes. What happens if a
being travels through an inter-universal wormhole and fucks a being in
the other universe? We've just connected two 4ders and therefore tied
the 2 universes together. Weird...
Anyways, another possibility is the matter residing on the higher
dimensional plane but not the lower. This allows the matter to not be
bound in a way we are, but may possibly be bound by higher dimensional
laws. If all natural laws of physics are a dimensional expression of
some absolute higher dimensional warping, then what sort of laws would
bind that 4d and how would they be expressed in the dimensions above?
Do our physical laws translate to the dimensions beneath us? Now
imagine trying to view a 2d world. We would see it as a flat plane
that we walked along the surface of. If we ever fell off the plane, or
moved to the side of it, it would be imperceptible when viewed
directly from the side, but would become partially visible again the
instant we moved slightly above or below the plane. Another question
is the size of this 2d world. If it is infinite, as we perceive our 3d
world to be, then we can't "fall off" or "fall through" without
destroying or moving part of that world. A simpler idea is viewing a
2der in our 3d world. When viewed from any angle, they would be
visible to varying degrees. When seen at a perpendicular angle, their
infinity would be completely visible. When viewed at a parallel angle,
they would be completely imperceptible. Or what about the possibility
of passing through the 2d plane universe? Since their plane has no
depth, it should fit neatly between our atoms, thus delivering the
undulating 2d cross sections of ourselves. How would we control our
height within the 2d world? What would keep us from “slipping
through” in whatever direction? And if we only ever walked on the
surface of the 2d world, the 2ders would see us as a pair of
disappearing/reappearing rubber soles, bounding across their universe
in erratic patterns and reeking havoc upon their order.
So what happens when a 3der moves into the 4d world? As we talk to a
4der, they may move around and think we are funny in our closed
finiteness, however, if we take one wrong step so they view us at a
parallel angle to our timeline, we disappear. When they view us at a
perpendicular angle to our timeline, our finiteness is completely
visible to them. Or what if this 4d consists only of the matter
expressed in our 3d universe? We would be a part of this time tree and
would drag it around behind us wherever we went. To speak with a 4d
time tree without hyperdimensional or unique matter would be to talk
with a higher understanding of ourselves. It's a personality of ours
that recognizes its own infinity and our imperceptible fraction of
that unidentifiable infinity.
Another idea is at what dimension are we imperceptible? For example,
we can not perceive a 1dimensional or lower object. Instead, we use 2d
representations of 1d lines and 0d points. How high do we have to go
before we become imperceptible and how would we interact with others
at that point (Nd)? An Nder would require a 4d, 5d, 6d... (yd)
representation of us to track us. The most immediate idea in my mind
is picking up a guide in a higher dimension who acts as a liasion to
the Nders for us. However, if we move too high, the yder guide becomes
imperceptible as well. Can a lesser dimensional being even effect a
higher dimension? Based on the mobius strip, I say maybe.
Marcia Cripe
Jul 1, 2008, 10:57:30 PM7/1/08
to cripe-...@googlegroups.com
josh, i really did try reading the hyperdimensional travel thing, but i just can't quite comprehend it. it's much too abstract for me.
you're poems, however, i really liked. my favorite was where? and i especially like the first stanza.
We blunder through this night, blind
Searching with out hands as I grasp at the intangible
How can we find what can't be seen
when we still think sight is all we need?
So in its stead we use our touch
but that's further from the light which eluded us
i must admit, i've been in counseling ever since february, and i still feel this way. trying and trying, but i don't know what or where, or exactly the point was to begin with. kudos to you! i give you a shining shimmering star! (imagine me doing the jazz hand thing.)
i've been trying to write a love poem to flight of the conchords. i've got the verses, i just need the intro and the outro. i need a great first line, but i'm stumped.
still looking for the music for you. not going to use bit torrent, it seems much to easy for dad to get porn on it. so i'm going to try soul seek and see what happens. i know, i don't care, i prefer to be naive and live in my own happy little world.
marcia
you're poems, however, i really liked. my favorite was where? and i especially like the first stanza.
We blunder through this night, blind
Searching with out hands as I grasp at the intangible
How can we find what can't be seen
when we still think sight is all we need?
So in its stead we use our touch
but that's further from the light which eluded us
i must admit, i've been in counseling ever since february, and i still feel this way. trying and trying, but i don't know what or where, or exactly the point was to begin with. kudos to you! i give you a shining shimmering star! (imagine me doing the jazz hand thing.)
i've been trying to write a love poem to flight of the conchords. i've got the verses, i just need the intro and the outro. i need a great first line, but i'm stumped.
still looking for the music for you. not going to use bit torrent, it seems much to easy for dad to get porn on it. so i'm going to try soul seek and see what happens. i know, i don't care, i prefer to be naive and live in my own happy little world.
marcia
Josh
Jul 2, 2008, 2:07:48 PM7/2/08
to Cripe Quandry
Eh, whatever works for you. No computer needs left for you to ask
about it?
Ironically enough, when I put that poem on the Penny-Arcade forums,
the first thing they suggested was dropping that first stanza. Hm...
On Jul 2, 5:57 am, "Marcia Cripe" <marcia.cr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> josh, i really did try reading the hyperdimensional travel thing, but i just
> can't quite comprehend it. it's much too abstract for me.
>
> you're poems, however, i really liked. my favorite was *where?* and i
> ...
>
> read more »
about it?
Ironically enough, when I put that poem on the Penny-Arcade forums,
the first thing they suggested was dropping that first stanza. Hm...
On Jul 2, 5:57 am, "Marcia Cripe" <marcia.cr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> josh, i really did try reading the hyperdimensional travel thing, but i just
> can't quite comprehend it. it's much too abstract for me.
>
> especially like the first stanza.
>
> We blunder through this night, blind
> Searching with out hands as I grasp at the intangible
> How can we find what can't be seen
> when we still think sight is all we need?
> So in its stead we use our touch
> but that's further from the light which eluded us
>
> i must admit, i've been in counseling ever since february, and i still feel
> this way. trying and trying, but i don't know what or where, or exactly the
> point was to begin with. kudos to you! i give you a shining shimmering
> star! (imagine me doing the jazz hand thing.)
>
> i've been trying to write a love poem to *flight of the conchords*. i've
>
> We blunder through this night, blind
> Searching with out hands as I grasp at the intangible
> How can we find what can't be seen
> when we still think sight is all we need?
> So in its stead we use our touch
> but that's further from the light which eluded us
>
> i must admit, i've been in counseling ever since february, and i still feel
> this way. trying and trying, but i don't know what or where, or exactly the
> point was to begin with. kudos to you! i give you a shining shimmering
> star! (imagine me doing the jazz hand thing.)
>
>
> read more »
Marcellus
Jul 5, 2008, 1:06:42 PM7/5/08
to Cripe Quandry
Hey, where's the poem?
> ...
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Marcellus
Jul 5, 2008, 1:09:53 PM7/5/08
to Cripe Quandry
Maybe all of the dimensions interact not in the material world, but
somewhere else. Perhaps in thought, personal relations, language,
smell. Maybe this is why it is so hard to understand people, because
different aspects are on different dimensions. We see pieces and
think we understand someone, but they turn and all familiarity is
lost. Or maybe this is just a decent metaphor.
> bind that 4d and how would they be expressed in the dimensions above? ...
>
> read more »
somewhere else. Perhaps in thought, personal relations, language,
smell. Maybe this is why it is so hard to understand people, because
different aspects are on different dimensions. We see pieces and
think we understand someone, but they turn and all familiarity is
lost. Or maybe this is just a decent metaphor.
>
> read more »
Josh
Jul 6, 2008, 9:08:27 AM7/6/08
to Cripe Quandry
Yeah, I think I get what you're saying. But arguing from empiricism,
dimensions are nothing more than traits of reality. It's not like a
higher or lower plane, that would be a parallel universe, it's more
like looking at the same things with a different perspective.
Dimensions are used for observation and understanding. One of the
things I mentioned, though, was the possibility of matter being
manifested differently in the different dimensions. Such as one
dimensional objects not existing, or at least not being observable or
conceivable, in our third dimension. Likewise, 5th dimensional
possibility tracks are not observable in 3rd dimensional life, but we
still live through the single possibility we choose at each
intersection. So we sort of witness it, we just don't witness the
alternative tracks.
The poetry she mentions is posted on my xanga, www.xanga.com/ufbad
> ...
>
> read more »
dimensions are nothing more than traits of reality. It's not like a
higher or lower plane, that would be a parallel universe, it's more
like looking at the same things with a different perspective.
Dimensions are used for observation and understanding. One of the
things I mentioned, though, was the possibility of matter being
manifested differently in the different dimensions. Such as one
dimensional objects not existing, or at least not being observable or
conceivable, in our third dimension. Likewise, 5th dimensional
possibility tracks are not observable in 3rd dimensional life, but we
still live through the single possibility we choose at each
intersection. So we sort of witness it, we just don't witness the
alternative tracks.
The poetry she mentions is posted on my xanga, www.xanga.com/ufbad
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Marcia Cripe
Jul 6, 2008, 9:58:55 PM7/6/08
to cripe-...@googlegroups.com
i just realized you change subjects, or whatever it's called in the first stanza. we blunder, but then I grasp and then back to we. that's the only editing i think necessary at this point.
--
When things start making sense something is very wrong.
Josh
Jul 7, 2008, 10:45:12 AM7/7/08
to Cripe Quandry
I don't see why that needs to be changed... >.>
Here's a revised first stanza for you:
So in its stead I use my touch
Here's a revised first stanza for you:
We blunder through this night, blind
Searching with out hands as I grasp at the intangible
How can we find what can't be seen
when I still think sight is all we need?
Searching with out hands as I grasp at the intangible
How can we find what can't be seen
So in its stead I use my touch
Marcia Cripe
Jul 8, 2008, 1:24:07 AM7/8/08
to cripe-...@googlegroups.com
ha ha. that's a travesty to the english language and grammar in particular. just be glad laurie hasn't seen it.
Laurie Cripe
Jul 8, 2008, 8:08:11 PM7/8/08
to cripe-...@googlegroups.com
actually i saw it and liked the first version better. we all blunder b/c we're all here - but it doesn't mean everyone searches and each search is still personal - but within that second sentence it's better as the same subject 'how can we find.. when we still think'
i liked it. my brain is devoid of most thoughts beyond wishing i had a little more sleep lately - sorry i'm not contributing more...
Josh
Jul 9, 2008, 3:42:39 PM7/9/08
to Cripe Quandry
That's actually how I had the original. And the subject change was
really coincidental. I just did it when I typed it out on accident,
but looking at it now I'm reluctant to change the original, especially
for something as silly as grammar. The revised stanza was just to irk
Marcia.
On Jul 9, 3:08 am, "Laurie Cripe" <laurie.cr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> actually i saw it and liked the first version better. we all blunder b/c
> we're all here - but it doesn't mean everyone searches and each search is
> still personal - but within that second sentence it's better as the same
> subject 'how can we find.. when we still think'
>
> i liked it. my brain is devoid of most thoughts beyond wishing i had a
> little more sleep lately - sorry i'm not contributing more...
>
really coincidental. I just did it when I typed it out on accident,
but looking at it now I'm reluctant to change the original, especially
for something as silly as grammar. The revised stanza was just to irk
Marcia.
On Jul 9, 3:08 am, "Laurie Cripe" <laurie.cr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> actually i saw it and liked the first version better. we all blunder b/c
> we're all here - but it doesn't mean everyone searches and each search is
> still personal - but within that second sentence it's better as the same
> subject 'how can we find.. when we still think'
>
> i liked it. my brain is devoid of most thoughts beyond wishing i had a
> little more sleep lately - sorry i'm not contributing more...
>
> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 8:24 AM, Marcia Cripe <marcia.cr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > ha ha. that's a travesty to the english language and grammar in
> > particular. just be glad laurie hasn't seen it.
>
> > ha ha. that's a travesty to the english language and grammar in
> > particular. just be glad laurie hasn't seen it.
>
Josh
Jul 13, 2008, 5:25:23 PM7/13/08
to Cripe Quandry
On Effects and Movement through Hyper-Dimensional Space/Time
Returning to the Mobius Strip, we should consider the movement of
2ders through our 3 Dimensional space. As the 2der progresses along
the surface of the mobius strip, she continually walks in a seemingly
straight line, all the while her path is twisting and turning
erratically through our 3d space. In the same manner, as we consider
our progress through 4th Dimensional time to be a straight line, it is
also likely that we are on an erratic and shifting, possibly cyclical,
path. I repeatedly mention cyclical based off the observations of
closed loop Mobius strips and the cyclical motion of hypercubes.
Considering the 4th Dimensional nature of hypercubes, I think it’s
very important how they move in a simple, repeating pattern through
4th Dimensional space. As stated earlier, I think this is indicative
of the simplicity of a hypercube as a 4d object. If we were to deal
with more complex 4d objects, their patterns may become so complex as
to appear completely random and never ending. To add another degree of
complexity to the equation, there's also the need to consider that
4ders may move and rotate of their own volition, causing the pattern
to be even more complex and irrationally unidentifiable to us.
Anyways, the point of this is to show that our own paths through the
4th Dimension are probably far more complicated than we realize. We
observe ourselves as traveling a strictly linear path through the 4th
Dimension (Time). However, our paths may be twisting and turning
within 4th Dimensional space without our awareness. If we were to
suddenly “ascend” to the 4th Dimension and walk a path we had
previously marked as a straight line from Monday until Sunday on the
3rd week of July in the year 2008 CE in this incarnation of our
universe, we may find that our path really begins the Tuesday after
that final Sunday, jumps to two weeks prior to 2000 years before that
Monday, and sporadically hops around. Of course, our path is still
continuous and the words I am using to try and describe “time hopping”
are much of a misnomer. I believe this is mostly due to our 3rd
Dimensional descriptions of time still being bound to the previously
mentioned linear time. Instead of seeing ourselves as continuously
hopping about throughout time, it’s more important to see that our
linear time paths are not really so linear. Instead of a straight
line, we follow this turbulent, twisting mobius strip of time, or some
other suitable path. If we contrast the simplicity of the mobius strip
with the complexity of our own 3/4d space-time universe's warping, it
is a distinct possibility that our time path resembles more of a
crumpled universe. Since the warping of 3/4d space/time has already
moved to the forefront of science through Einstein’s relativity, then
how would this warping be reflected upon the 4th dimension? More so,
since 4ders would see 4d cross-sections of the 5th Dimension
(Possibility based on 10 Dimensional String Theory), how would a
warping of 4d space be observed by a 4der as she walks along her
possibility path (5th Dimensional ‘Space/Time Line’)?
Another consideration is what, exactly, do we move through in the 4th
Dimension. In the 3rd Dimension, we willfully travel through space
while being constricted to a “linear” time path. It doesn’t matter how
we move, as long as exist in a 3rd Dimensional state and lower, we
move “forward” through time. The only thing we presently have any
effect upon is the rate at which we travel through the 4th Dimension.
Again, referring to Einstein’s relativity, we can slow our progress
through time by accelerating our travel through space or by sitting in
a high gravity well, a massive warping of space/time. So if we were to
become 4ders, we would similarly willfully move, or not move,
throughout 4d space, otherwise known as time. However, at the same
time, we would be constricted to seemingly linear progress through 5th
Dimensional space, or Possibility. One example of this is Douglas
Adams improbability drives. Whenever a space traveler activates her
improbability drive, most notably the Infinite Improbability Drive of
the Heart of Gold, she is cast forward to the required improbability
for the journey necessary and then returned to her sum 0 probability
once she arrives and the drive is deactivated. It’s interesting to
note that this 4th Dimensional warping/travel is used as a means of
nearly instantaneous travel through 3rd Dimensional space. If we refer
back to the 2der’s instantaneous travel by warping through 3rd
Dimensional space (a flatlander walking across a fold in a piece of
paper) then Douglas Adam’s improbability drives start to make more
sense. After all, what is probability but an aspect of possibility?
The more probable an event is, the more possible it becomes. So to
increase one’s improbability is to progress through a series of
possibilities and, essentially, fold our 4th Dimensional selves
through 5th Dimensional space. By folding the 4th through the 5th
Dimension, instead of the 3rd through the 4th, we are able not only to
shortcut through 3rd Dimensional space, but 4th Dimensional time as
well, which likely explains the incredible amount of time travel/
manipulation in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy series, such as
The Restaurant at the End of the Universe scene.
These improbability drives can also be a clue how a 4der would ‘walk’
through their world. First, let us consider the 4der as the time trees
I’ve previously described. Then, for the sake of efficiency and to cut
our imaginations some slack, picture the 4der compressed to a single
entity. The 4der is still comprised of all manifestations of herself,
but we’ve condensed her to a point for the ease of visualization. Now,
as this point moves through her 4d space, she is essentially walking
through a universe of time. As she moves forward and backward, she is
progressing and regressing in age and manifestations. As she moves
sideways or up and down, she is crossing to connecting time paths. All
of this motion combined would give us the impression of her
spontaneously aging and shifting into different beings. Now, while all
of this movement is going on, she is witnessing 4d space/time cross-
sections of possibilities (the 5th Dimension) in the same manner that
we witness 3d cross-sections of time. If we were to chart a ‘time
line’ (for lack of a better word) of her actions, we would notice
that, as it progressed from –x to +x, it would cross multiple
timelines of different possibilities. All of her timelines now stretch
up and down (-y/+y) and she progresses over them. She may start at
some arbitrary ‘neutral’ position, let’s say 0 improbability or
normality for the purpose of conceptualization, and progress higher
and higher towards infinite improbability. For a better visual, her
origin would stretch back infinitely closer to 0 improbability, thus
preventing the dubious question of "what marks 0 improbability?"
Instead of looking for some specific absolute state to identify as
"normal", I think it's more important to maintain normal as an
unreachable control to help sustain the idea of possibility
progression, a negative infinity on the probability line, if you will.
I'm reminded of the infamous question posed to scientists, "what came
before the big bang?" The problem with questions like these, is that
to ask what came "before" something is to suggest that even is still
bound within time. The big bang, however, is an event that, so far,
marks the creation of time. Nothing came before the big bang because
there was no time before the big bang. In the same manner, there is no
absolute normal, only closer and closer degrees to "normality". In
deed, based upon the mobius strip, once again, what we conceive of
'normal' is probably pretty far off the mark. Now this universe in
which we presently live may mark out the 3rd Dimensional embodiment of
the 4th Dimensional time-line of a 5th Dimensional possibility track.
We may be "replaced" by a different possibility track, we may have
come after other possibility tracks, but to bring time into such an
equation is almost complete nonsense. It makes an easier reference for
us to use, but it drastically inhibits the concepts. Instead of
"before" and "after", it's likely that all possibility tracks are
being played out "simultaneously" simply due to them residing on the
5th dimension, above time itself. As I stated earlier, 4th dimensional
time trees are constricted by varying 5th dimensional possibility
tracks and not the other way around. Time, instead, really only
embodies those of us moving and residing within the 3rd and lower
dimensions. So to move in the 4th Dimension would be to move through
your various incarnations and through time itself. Instead of being
born, aging and dying, we could move in whichever directions we
pleased. Because of this, aging in the 4th dimension would be to
progress through different possibilities of one's life.
Returning to the Mobius Strip, we should consider the movement of
2ders through our 3 Dimensional space. As the 2der progresses along
the surface of the mobius strip, she continually walks in a seemingly
straight line, all the while her path is twisting and turning
erratically through our 3d space. In the same manner, as we consider
our progress through 4th Dimensional time to be a straight line, it is
also likely that we are on an erratic and shifting, possibly cyclical,
path. I repeatedly mention cyclical based off the observations of
closed loop Mobius strips and the cyclical motion of hypercubes.
Considering the 4th Dimensional nature of hypercubes, I think it’s
very important how they move in a simple, repeating pattern through
4th Dimensional space. As stated earlier, I think this is indicative
of the simplicity of a hypercube as a 4d object. If we were to deal
with more complex 4d objects, their patterns may become so complex as
to appear completely random and never ending. To add another degree of
complexity to the equation, there's also the need to consider that
4ders may move and rotate of their own volition, causing the pattern
to be even more complex and irrationally unidentifiable to us.
Anyways, the point of this is to show that our own paths through the
4th Dimension are probably far more complicated than we realize. We
observe ourselves as traveling a strictly linear path through the 4th
Dimension (Time). However, our paths may be twisting and turning
within 4th Dimensional space without our awareness. If we were to
suddenly “ascend” to the 4th Dimension and walk a path we had
previously marked as a straight line from Monday until Sunday on the
3rd week of July in the year 2008 CE in this incarnation of our
universe, we may find that our path really begins the Tuesday after
that final Sunday, jumps to two weeks prior to 2000 years before that
Monday, and sporadically hops around. Of course, our path is still
continuous and the words I am using to try and describe “time hopping”
are much of a misnomer. I believe this is mostly due to our 3rd
Dimensional descriptions of time still being bound to the previously
mentioned linear time. Instead of seeing ourselves as continuously
hopping about throughout time, it’s more important to see that our
linear time paths are not really so linear. Instead of a straight
line, we follow this turbulent, twisting mobius strip of time, or some
other suitable path. If we contrast the simplicity of the mobius strip
with the complexity of our own 3/4d space-time universe's warping, it
is a distinct possibility that our time path resembles more of a
crumpled universe. Since the warping of 3/4d space/time has already
moved to the forefront of science through Einstein’s relativity, then
how would this warping be reflected upon the 4th dimension? More so,
since 4ders would see 4d cross-sections of the 5th Dimension
(Possibility based on 10 Dimensional String Theory), how would a
warping of 4d space be observed by a 4der as she walks along her
possibility path (5th Dimensional ‘Space/Time Line’)?
Another consideration is what, exactly, do we move through in the 4th
Dimension. In the 3rd Dimension, we willfully travel through space
while being constricted to a “linear” time path. It doesn’t matter how
we move, as long as exist in a 3rd Dimensional state and lower, we
move “forward” through time. The only thing we presently have any
effect upon is the rate at which we travel through the 4th Dimension.
Again, referring to Einstein’s relativity, we can slow our progress
through time by accelerating our travel through space or by sitting in
a high gravity well, a massive warping of space/time. So if we were to
become 4ders, we would similarly willfully move, or not move,
throughout 4d space, otherwise known as time. However, at the same
time, we would be constricted to seemingly linear progress through 5th
Dimensional space, or Possibility. One example of this is Douglas
Adams improbability drives. Whenever a space traveler activates her
improbability drive, most notably the Infinite Improbability Drive of
the Heart of Gold, she is cast forward to the required improbability
for the journey necessary and then returned to her sum 0 probability
once she arrives and the drive is deactivated. It’s interesting to
note that this 4th Dimensional warping/travel is used as a means of
nearly instantaneous travel through 3rd Dimensional space. If we refer
back to the 2der’s instantaneous travel by warping through 3rd
Dimensional space (a flatlander walking across a fold in a piece of
paper) then Douglas Adam’s improbability drives start to make more
sense. After all, what is probability but an aspect of possibility?
The more probable an event is, the more possible it becomes. So to
increase one’s improbability is to progress through a series of
possibilities and, essentially, fold our 4th Dimensional selves
through 5th Dimensional space. By folding the 4th through the 5th
Dimension, instead of the 3rd through the 4th, we are able not only to
shortcut through 3rd Dimensional space, but 4th Dimensional time as
well, which likely explains the incredible amount of time travel/
manipulation in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy series, such as
The Restaurant at the End of the Universe scene.
These improbability drives can also be a clue how a 4der would ‘walk’
through their world. First, let us consider the 4der as the time trees
I’ve previously described. Then, for the sake of efficiency and to cut
our imaginations some slack, picture the 4der compressed to a single
entity. The 4der is still comprised of all manifestations of herself,
but we’ve condensed her to a point for the ease of visualization. Now,
as this point moves through her 4d space, she is essentially walking
through a universe of time. As she moves forward and backward, she is
progressing and regressing in age and manifestations. As she moves
sideways or up and down, she is crossing to connecting time paths. All
of this motion combined would give us the impression of her
spontaneously aging and shifting into different beings. Now, while all
of this movement is going on, she is witnessing 4d space/time cross-
sections of possibilities (the 5th Dimension) in the same manner that
we witness 3d cross-sections of time. If we were to chart a ‘time
line’ (for lack of a better word) of her actions, we would notice
that, as it progressed from –x to +x, it would cross multiple
timelines of different possibilities. All of her timelines now stretch
up and down (-y/+y) and she progresses over them. She may start at
some arbitrary ‘neutral’ position, let’s say 0 improbability or
normality for the purpose of conceptualization, and progress higher
and higher towards infinite improbability. For a better visual, her
origin would stretch back infinitely closer to 0 improbability, thus
preventing the dubious question of "what marks 0 improbability?"
Instead of looking for some specific absolute state to identify as
"normal", I think it's more important to maintain normal as an
unreachable control to help sustain the idea of possibility
progression, a negative infinity on the probability line, if you will.
I'm reminded of the infamous question posed to scientists, "what came
before the big bang?" The problem with questions like these, is that
to ask what came "before" something is to suggest that even is still
bound within time. The big bang, however, is an event that, so far,
marks the creation of time. Nothing came before the big bang because
there was no time before the big bang. In the same manner, there is no
absolute normal, only closer and closer degrees to "normality". In
deed, based upon the mobius strip, once again, what we conceive of
'normal' is probably pretty far off the mark. Now this universe in
which we presently live may mark out the 3rd Dimensional embodiment of
the 4th Dimensional time-line of a 5th Dimensional possibility track.
We may be "replaced" by a different possibility track, we may have
come after other possibility tracks, but to bring time into such an
equation is almost complete nonsense. It makes an easier reference for
us to use, but it drastically inhibits the concepts. Instead of
"before" and "after", it's likely that all possibility tracks are
being played out "simultaneously" simply due to them residing on the
5th dimension, above time itself. As I stated earlier, 4th dimensional
time trees are constricted by varying 5th dimensional possibility
tracks and not the other way around. Time, instead, really only
embodies those of us moving and residing within the 3rd and lower
dimensions. So to move in the 4th Dimension would be to move through
your various incarnations and through time itself. Instead of being
born, aging and dying, we could move in whichever directions we
pleased. Because of this, aging in the 4th dimension would be to
progress through different possibilities of one's life.
Josh
Aug 13, 2008, 10:36:48 PM8/13/08
to Cripe Quandry
Just ran across that bit again Matt.
I was over on Whitechapel where a guy was talking about hosting an H+
discussion group in Seattle. The relevant portion was another guy
mentioned neural interfaces and how we could use it to "sense" fields
of numbers. Thinking about this, we could create new senses for
ourselves and use those to "feel" higher dimensions. I remember
reading somewhere where some people get magnets embedded in the back
of their hands or something so they can sense the magnetic anti-theft
fields that stores use or other things like that. It got me wondering
if we'd be able to come up with some bit that would allow us to sense
wi-fi, rf, IR, or higher dimensions. I think this is a possibility,
but who knows how far off it is.
Another thing he mentioned was amplified sensations. How taste-testers
and specialists can identify particular ingredients by smell or taste
alone, we could artificially amplify our senses to be able to judge
chemical compound or something like that just by touching it.
> ...
>
> read more »
I was over on Whitechapel where a guy was talking about hosting an H+
discussion group in Seattle. The relevant portion was another guy
mentioned neural interfaces and how we could use it to "sense" fields
of numbers. Thinking about this, we could create new senses for
ourselves and use those to "feel" higher dimensions. I remember
reading somewhere where some people get magnets embedded in the back
of their hands or something so they can sense the magnetic anti-theft
fields that stores use or other things like that. It got me wondering
if we'd be able to come up with some bit that would allow us to sense
wi-fi, rf, IR, or higher dimensions. I think this is a possibility,
but who knows how far off it is.
Another thing he mentioned was amplified sensations. How taste-testers
and specialists can identify particular ingredients by smell or taste
alone, we could artificially amplify our senses to be able to judge
chemical compound or something like that just by touching it.
>
> read more »
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