SOPA / PIPA & Singapore
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Mohd Hisham
Jan 18, 2012, 7:21:22 AM1/18/12
to Creative Commons Singapore
Hi Everyone,
While approving new members to the discussion list, there was a
question that came along with the membership request. It goes like
this
"...
Hello! I have always been releasing works under creative commons
licences and I am a huge advocate of copyleft and opensource. I'm
interested in finding out whether anything is being done to make sure
that something like SOPA does not ever become legislation in Singapore
and whether I can help, or what else we can do about it.
..."
For reference and sense of what is happening, here are some links
below.
http://americancensorship.org/
http://fightforthefuture.org/pipa/
http://trustnerds.org/
What are your thoughts about this? Some of my own concerns is that,
there may be a likelihood that CC may be irrelevant if something
similar to SOPA are to take effect in Singapore.
best regards,
Mohd Hisham
While approving new members to the discussion list, there was a
question that came along with the membership request. It goes like
this
"...
Hello! I have always been releasing works under creative commons
licences and I am a huge advocate of copyleft and opensource. I'm
interested in finding out whether anything is being done to make sure
that something like SOPA does not ever become legislation in Singapore
and whether I can help, or what else we can do about it.
..."
For reference and sense of what is happening, here are some links
below.
http://americancensorship.org/
http://fightforthefuture.org/pipa/
http://trustnerds.org/
What are your thoughts about this? Some of my own concerns is that,
there may be a likelihood that CC may be irrelevant if something
similar to SOPA are to take effect in Singapore.
best regards,
Mohd Hisham
debbie ding
Jan 18, 2012, 6:23:41 PM1/18/12
to Creative Commons Singapore
Hello there!
Actually that was me. My name is Debbie; I guess you would describe me
as a writer/artist and educator.
I wrote that because I was wondering if anyone here is checking how
similar legislation on the internet will be passed here.
From recent comments (eg: http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1176385/1/.html)
it seems that this is under consideration at this point but I knew
very little about how the law or its recommendations are being
drafted? This seemed like a likely group where people who might be
interested in this issue would be centralised.... Does anyone in this
group know more?
I don't think CC would be rendered irrelevant by SOPA, it is just that
the very notion of copyright infringement and free information on the
creative commons are operating on different planes of logic. And the
laws like SOPA could potentially damage the ecology of the internet
that is required to sustain the creative commons. Call me a pessimist
but I'd imagine that its not inconceivable that this sort of thing
could be passed in Singapore if we don't watch closely what is
happening and demand that the anti-piracy laws should not become
exploitable, litigious loopholes for the censorship of content
creators...
I could not have made the work I currently make without all the
information on the internet, and from learning so much from reading or
using opensource material and code. I try to give back and share
information as well by building publicly available reference wikis for
my students (with material that I write), and I also keep sites/blogs
for all my projects, sharing detailed information on how I make them.
Anyway, would be nice to hear the thoughts of others on this too!
Cheers,
Debbie
http://psychogeoforensics.org
http://dreamsyntax.org/patterns
On Jan 18, 8:21 pm, Mohd Hisham <mhisha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
>
> While approving new members to the discussion list, there was a
> question that came along with the membership request. It goes like
> this
>
> "...
> Hello! I have always been releasing works under creative commons
> licences and I am a huge advocate of copyleft and opensource. I'm
> interested in finding out whether anything is being done to make sure
> that something like SOPA does not ever become legislation in Singapore
> and whether I can help, or what else we can do about it.
> ..."
>
> For reference and sense of what is happening, here are some links
> below.
>
> http://americancensorship.org/http://fightforthefuture.org/pipa/http://trustnerds.org/
Actually that was me. My name is Debbie; I guess you would describe me
as a writer/artist and educator.
I wrote that because I was wondering if anyone here is checking how
similar legislation on the internet will be passed here.
From recent comments (eg: http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1176385/1/.html)
it seems that this is under consideration at this point but I knew
very little about how the law or its recommendations are being
drafted? This seemed like a likely group where people who might be
interested in this issue would be centralised.... Does anyone in this
group know more?
I don't think CC would be rendered irrelevant by SOPA, it is just that
the very notion of copyright infringement and free information on the
creative commons are operating on different planes of logic. And the
laws like SOPA could potentially damage the ecology of the internet
that is required to sustain the creative commons. Call me a pessimist
but I'd imagine that its not inconceivable that this sort of thing
could be passed in Singapore if we don't watch closely what is
happening and demand that the anti-piracy laws should not become
exploitable, litigious loopholes for the censorship of content
creators...
I could not have made the work I currently make without all the
information on the internet, and from learning so much from reading or
using opensource material and code. I try to give back and share
information as well by building publicly available reference wikis for
my students (with material that I write), and I also keep sites/blogs
for all my projects, sharing detailed information on how I make them.
Anyway, would be nice to hear the thoughts of others on this too!
Cheers,
Debbie
http://psychogeoforensics.org
http://dreamsyntax.org/patterns
On Jan 18, 8:21 pm, Mohd Hisham <mhisha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
>
> While approving new members to the discussion list, there was a
> question that came along with the membership request. It goes like
> this
>
> "...
> Hello! I have always been releasing works under creative commons
> licences and I am a huge advocate of copyleft and opensource. I'm
> interested in finding out whether anything is being done to make sure
> that something like SOPA does not ever become legislation in Singapore
> and whether I can help, or what else we can do about it.
> ..."
>
> For reference and sense of what is happening, here are some links
> below.
>
Justin Lee
Jan 18, 2012, 9:18:55 PM1/18/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
Hi Deb,
There are lots of misconceptions about SOPA and PIPA. The reason behind these 2 acts is mainly because content producers like Hollywood are losing "potential revenue" due to piracy, and they have come up with various solutions to try and curb that, SOPA and PIPA being some of the more drastic solutions.
The main gist is that content producers like yourself will be able to tell DNS servers (will explain later) to not allow resolving of domain names that infringe copyright. DNS servers reside locally, and they are the backbone of the Internet to translate friendly names like "google.com" into computer numbered addresses like "8.8.8.8". Since DNS servers reside locally within the country and the jurisdiction is within the country (as opposed to trying to shut down the actual server with infringing content in another country), it allows content producers the ability to potentially stop people within the country from accessing sites that infringe their content.
In layman's term as a consumer, what this means is that potentially if any content is deemed infringing copyrights, you as a consumer within the country will not be able to access that content anymore. Let's say Wikipedia infringes content from some media conglomerate or some book written by some guy, these people can just say "Hey, Wikipedia has infringed my copyrighted works, block them from Singapore." That's the "dumb-case" scenario, but potentially could happen. Consumers within Singapore will not be able to access content. Think "Great Firewall of China".
Another view, you as a content producer sometimes require to "mix" content in and might potentially infringe copyrights unintentionally. Your website could potentially be blocked from Singapore and nobody can access that content.
What needs to be done is really to come up with a solution on 2 angles - Consumer and Content Producers.
Big ass content producers like Hollywood, Sony Pictures/Music need to start embracing the internet by making their content readily accessible worldwide to the mass audiences - of course at a price. The reason for piracy is really the ability to access the content consumers want. If they make it easy to consume, fewer people will turn to the alternative choice. If the barrier of entry to purchase content is lower than other forms of piracy like "torrenting" or "streaming", I assure you that human nature will take the lower barrier. Similarly, making consumers aware of legal sources to actually purchase these content. How many people are more than willing to buy from the iTunes store, but can't in Singapore?
These content producers also need to start thinking of reducing production cost, producing better creative works, and demolish the old model of licensing. Stop whining about losing money. Content producers like yourself need to understand and embrace the nature of internet, which is all about freedom of information and content, sharing that content readily to everyone. By restricting the content flow within the internet due to maximizing profits, you're in fact minimizing profits in the long run.
Where does Creative Commons come in? Licensing under CC gives people the ability to share content across the internet, embracing the very nature of what the internet is all about while retaining rights to yourself. Personally, I think every creative content on the internet should by default be licensed under CC. CC will not become obsolete, but will be the exact opposite of what SOPA and PIPA is trying to achieve.
So solutions to stop online piracy and protect intellectual property? Be more open, make content easily accessible, use CC license or something similar. From a legal standpoint, revamp the copyright law or create a new digital copyright law. That's how you go about solving this problem, not some stupid SOPA or PIPA shit.
Regards,
Justin Lee
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Kevin Lim
Jan 18, 2012, 10:39:42 PM1/18/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
Healthy discussion Hisham, Debbie, and Justin,
--
--
Kevin Lim
Cyberculturalist
http://theory.isthereason.com // @brainopera
This email is: [ ] bloggable [X] ask first [ ] private
Not too different from what Justin said, my straightforward take is that SOPA is the 'slippery slope' to a totalitarian Internet for the States, and like China's impact on the third world, other countries would start to emulate. The way CC would be affected, is when social networking services we depend on to share content, gets shut down (e.g. Youtube, SoundsCloud), because infringing content may be on it (even as part of a remix).
Piracy will continue to thrive through other means.
Kevin Lim
@brainopera
--
--
Kevin Lim
Cyberculturalist
http://theory.isthereason.com // @brainopera
This email is: [ ] bloggable [X] ask first [ ] private
BruceQ
Jan 19, 2012, 2:09:47 AM1/19/12
to Creative Commons Singapore
Hi all,
I just joined as well, based on an interest in the potential of such
draconian legislation passing in Singapore. As a bit of background,
I'm a visual artist working in Singapore - although little of my
content is currently distributed online, I see this changing in the
next few years, and I too am very much reliant on resources available
online.
Just to share some recent news, the blackout has resulted in the bills
losing a certain amount of support, though their chief advocate, Lamar
Smith, has vowed to continue pushing them next month.
My understanding at this point is that the bills as currently
constituted have dropped the DNS de-listing provision, although the
rest of the language remains vague enough for rights-holders to have a
great deal of leeway.
There's an interesting discussion on the Law Minister, K Shanmugam's
facebook page as well: https://www.facebook.com/k.shanmugam.page/posts/147669282014158
Without knowing the specific language and provisions in any proposed
amendment to Singapore's own copyright enforcement regime, it does
seem difficult to articulate a response except in generalities - that
heavy-handed legislation fails to stop piracy while hurting everyone
else. However, it does seem that the US is quite keen to export SOPA/
PIPA wholesale, as seen in this recent guardian article:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2012/jan/05/us-pressured-spain-online-piracy
So I believe that the type of legislation that will eventually be
presented will resemble SOPA/PIPA to a large extent.
As an interesting aside, the New Asia Republic's recent article on the
subject suggests that if SOPA/PIPA pass in the states, it will apply
here as well, due to the provisions of our free trade agreement.
Cheers
Bruce
> > )
> >http://americancensorship.org/http://fightforthefuture.org/pipa/http:...
I just joined as well, based on an interest in the potential of such
draconian legislation passing in Singapore. As a bit of background,
I'm a visual artist working in Singapore - although little of my
content is currently distributed online, I see this changing in the
next few years, and I too am very much reliant on resources available
online.
Just to share some recent news, the blackout has resulted in the bills
losing a certain amount of support, though their chief advocate, Lamar
Smith, has vowed to continue pushing them next month.
My understanding at this point is that the bills as currently
constituted have dropped the DNS de-listing provision, although the
rest of the language remains vague enough for rights-holders to have a
great deal of leeway.
There's an interesting discussion on the Law Minister, K Shanmugam's
facebook page as well: https://www.facebook.com/k.shanmugam.page/posts/147669282014158
Without knowing the specific language and provisions in any proposed
amendment to Singapore's own copyright enforcement regime, it does
seem difficult to articulate a response except in generalities - that
heavy-handed legislation fails to stop piracy while hurting everyone
else. However, it does seem that the US is quite keen to export SOPA/
PIPA wholesale, as seen in this recent guardian article:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2012/jan/05/us-pressured-spain-online-piracy
So I believe that the type of legislation that will eventually be
presented will resemble SOPA/PIPA to a large extent.
As an interesting aside, the New Asia Republic's recent article on the
subject suggests that if SOPA/PIPA pass in the states, it will apply
here as well, due to the provisions of our free trade agreement.
Cheers
Bruce
> > On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 7:23 AM, debbie ding <04.4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hello there!
>
> > Actually that was me. My name is Debbie; I guess you would describe me
> > as a writer/artist and educator.
>
> > I wrote that because I was wondering if anyone here is checking how
> > similar legislation on the internet will be passed here.
> > From recent comments (eg:
> >http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/117638...
>
> > Hello there!
>
> > Actually that was me. My name is Debbie; I guess you would describe me
> > as a writer/artist and educator.
>
> > I wrote that because I was wondering if anyone here is checking how
> > similar legislation on the internet will be passed here.
> > From recent comments (eg:
> > )
>
> > > What are your thoughts about this? Some of my own concerns is that,
> > > there may be a likelihood that CC may be irrelevant if something
> > > similar to SOPA are to take effect in Singapore.
>
> > > best regards,
> > > Mohd Hisham
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Creative Commons Singapore" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > creativecomm...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > creativecommonssin...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/creativecommonssingapore?hl=en.
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Creative Commons Singapore" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to creativ
>
> --
> --
> Kevin Lim
> Cyberculturalisthttp://theory.isthereason.com// @brainopera
> > > What are your thoughts about this? Some of my own concerns is that,
> > > there may be a likelihood that CC may be irrelevant if something
> > > similar to SOPA are to take effect in Singapore.
>
> > > best regards,
> > > Mohd Hisham
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Creative Commons Singapore" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to
> > creativecomm...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > creativecommonssin...@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com/group/creativecommonssingapore?hl=en.
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Creative Commons Singapore" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to creativ
>
> --
> --
> Kevin Lim
Ivan Chew
Jan 20, 2012, 12:39:28 AM1/20/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
Justin - I found your summary explanation of the tech bits re: SOPA/
PIPA very useful and clear to a layperson like me. Have you blogged or
posted that any where?
PIPA very useful and clear to a layperson like me. Have you blogged or
posted that any where?
Debbie - I can't comment authoritatively on the legal or technical
aspects of SOPA/ PIPA. But thinking aloud: The speculative coffee-shop
talk I hear all the time is that Singapore follows US law closely (in
terms of precedence or actual legal amendments), particularly after
the Free Trade Agreements. So any change to IP laws in the US would
trickle down to Singapore somehow.
Re: this statement, I have some thoughts:
>>>
... the very notion of copyright infringement and free information on
the creative commons are operating on different planes of logic.
>>>
On infringement and CC/ copyright, this might be a separate matter
from altogether. you can adopt CC and still have your rights
infringed. E.g. if someone uses my CC-licensed works and did not
attribute it to me, that's still infringement.
ivan
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Every Book its Reader; Every Reader his Book"
S.R. Ranganathan. 1892 - 1972
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://RamblingLibrarian.blogspot.com
http://MyRightBrain.wordpress.com
http://ccmixter.org/people/ramblinglibrarian
http://www.google.com/profiles/ramblinglibrarian
http://flavors.me/ivanchew
Justin Lee
Jan 20, 2012, 12:56:50 AM1/20/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com, creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
Hey Ivan,
Nope, didn't blog about this. But I'll be hosting a Tech Talk Coffee Shop episode this Saturday on Skype to talk about SOPA and PIPA if you'll like to join us and chime in your thoughts.
This is open to anyone interested to voice their thoughts. My Skype id is triplez82.
Sent from my iPhone
Kanako Honma
Jan 20, 2012, 1:03:40 AM1/20/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
Hi, Do you guys have interests in having a real talk with this topic?
I was thinking to set up the CC-SG meetup on the 2nd Friday in Feb or March. Let's have "SOPA/PIPA in Singapore" as a discussion topic. Will check the venue availability and keep you posted.
Justin, a great entry. It should be disseminated in your blog or CCSG blog.
Hisham and Ivan, what do you think?
Bruce, regarding exporting SOPA/PIPA to other countries, I was thinking the same. I assume it'd be easy to do so to Singapore by applying Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) as TPP covers IP as well.
Best regards,
Kanako
I was thinking to set up the CC-SG meetup on the 2nd Friday in Feb or March. Let's have "SOPA/PIPA in Singapore" as a discussion topic. Will check the venue availability and keep you posted.
Justin, a great entry. It should be disseminated in your blog or CCSG blog.
Hisham and Ivan, what do you think?
Bruce, regarding exporting SOPA/PIPA to other countries, I was thinking the same. I assume it'd be easy to do so to Singapore by applying Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) as TPP covers IP as well.
Best regards,
Kanako
Ivan Chew
Jan 20, 2012, 1:23:25 AM1/20/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
Yeah, if Justin is OK with it, we can post to the CC Singapore blog.
From my reading, it seems factually accurate and all that.
>>>
Justin, a great entry. It should be disseminated in your blog or CCSG
blog. Hisham and Ivan, what do you think?
>>>
From my reading, it seems factually accurate and all that.
>>>
Justin, a great entry. It should be disseminated in your blog or CCSG
blog. Hisham and Ivan, what do you think?
>>>
Kanako - organising a CC Singapore meetup is great! At least just
getting people to understand what SOPA/ PIPA is about. I've to admit
my understanding is extremely shallow. You mentioned TPP, which is way
over my head. So I'd love to learn more, from a credible source like
yourself.
Bruce - thanks for the link to Shanmugam's FB post. Reading the
comments posted (to Shanmugam), seems to me there are different levels
of understanding of what SOPA/ PIPA. It reminded me of attempts to
organise similar "Occupy Wall Street" in Singapore. I mean,
Singaporeans heard about the movement but not many really understood
the root causes, disparities and inequalities in the US context.
ivan
Justin Lee
Jan 23, 2012, 7:38:05 AM1/23/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
I'm ok.
Kanako Honma
Jan 26, 2012, 12:48:20 AM1/26/12
to creativecomm...@googlegroups.com
Hi guys,
I'll set up a meetup on 10 Feb (Fri) evening at Hackerspace@sg.
Let's talk about this topic; SOPA/PIPA and Singapore.
Will any of you in this thread free&keen to join?
Hi Ivan, Hisham, (I'm confused which of you is an admin for the blog)
Shall we post the detail to the CCSG blog?
I'm thinking to set an event on FB as well.
Best regards,
Kanako
PS.
Ivan@hackerspace will help me to host this at the venue.Kanako Honma
mobile: (+65)9683-5827
blog: http://kanakohonma.wordpress.com/
waiwai: http://heartoftheasia.blogspot.com/
I'll set up a meetup on 10 Feb (Fri) evening at Hackerspace@sg.
Let's talk about this topic; SOPA/PIPA and Singapore.
Will any of you in this thread free&keen to join?
Hi Ivan, Hisham, (I'm confused which of you is an admin for the blog)
Shall we post the detail to the CCSG blog?
I'm thinking to set an event on FB as well.
Best regards,
Kanako
PS.
Ivan@hackerspace will help me to host this at the venue.
mobile: (+65)9683-5827
blog: http://kanakohonma.wordpress.com/
waiwai: http://heartoftheasia.blogspot.com/
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