ODR-DabMux service label UTF-8 (accent) ?

[Fabien]

Hello,

I've a problem in ODR-DabMux with an service with a label with accent. Label don't support UTF-8 ?

In the PAD, I do not have the problem with the accent.

My DabMux config : https://pastebin.com/zA5VXQAH

My MUX configuration file is well encoded in UTF-8 (Unix)

Am I mistaken somewhere?

Thanks :-)

[Fabien]

Ok I just saw: "ODR-DabMux does not do character conversion for the labels"

I am also aware that "many receivers have 14-segment displays that probably cannot display such characters anyway"

Finally, according to what Matthias said: we could directly take the character from the EBU table.

I found this EBU table. But in practice, how to put this character in the label?

[Peter Whisker]

I pipe all PAD text through the program “recode html..ISO-8859-1” on Linux. This sorts out display of accents etc.

 

Peter

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[Fabien]

Hello Peter,

Yes for PAD but for label in MUX conf ?

[Peter Whisker]

No, I have not got it to display accented characters.

 

Peter

 

From: crc-mm...@googlegroups.com [mailto:crc-mm...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Fabien
Sent: 08 February 2018 10:40
To: mmbtools <crc-mm...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: ODR-DabMux service label UTF-8 (accent) ?

 

Hello Peter,

 

Yes for PAD but for label in MUX conf ?

 

 

--

[Stefan Pöschel]

Hello Fabien,

while EBU Tech 3264 is a standard for subtitling that is still widely in
use, its charsets have nothing to do with DAB and another, more flexible
system of dealing with accents etc. ;-)

The "Complete EBU Latin based" charset that is used here can be found in
ETSI TS 101 756, in Annex C.

Currently the only way to use chars like e.g. "äöü" is to directly use
the respective character code, though it looks strange in the mux config
and in the console output of ODR-DabMux.

@Peter:
ODR-PadEnc is fine with UTF-8 input and will convert available
characters correctly, if they are also present in the EBU charset.

Best regards,
Stefan

Am 08.02.2018 um 11:41 schrieb Peter Whisker:
> No, I have not got it to display accented characters.
>
>  
>
> Peter
>
>  
>

> *From:*crc-mm...@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:crc-mm...@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Fabien
> *Sent:* 08 February 2018 10:40
> *To:* mmbtools <crc-mm...@googlegroups.com>
> *Subject:* Re: ODR-DabMux service label UTF-8 (accent) ?

>
>  
>
> Hello Peter,
>
>  
>
> Yes for PAD but for label in MUX conf ?
>
>  
>
>  
>
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[Fabien]

Hello Stefan,

I try with label "Radio Cit0x82" (0x82 = é) but indeed it's not work ;-(

thanks

[Matthias Brändli]

Hello all,

I'll copy the utf-8 to EBU Latin converter from ODR-PadEnc, that will be
much more convenient.

mpb

[Matthias Brändli]

Hi all,

The latest release v1.3.3 of ODR-DabMux now supports labels in utf-8. If
it is not possible to convert them, they are taken as-is, so that
previous hacks still work.

Stefan, I also updated the charset.h and .cpp in ODR-PadEnc, you should
not see any change of functionality. But it now supports converting both
ways.

Other changes are shown in the ChangeLog.

Cheers
mpb

[Fabien]

Great!! Thanks for this reactivity Matthias -:)

But where can I download the last release ? In GitHub, I see only v1.3.2

Thanks

[Dennis Wynes]

In terminal:
git checkout next
git pull
then compile as normal.

[Peter Whisker]

Works well too :-) Thanks

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[Fabien]

Yes! accents work! Thanks very much Matthias

[Matthias Brändli]

Sorry I forgot to update the master branch :-/ It's done now.

Good to hear it works. But keep in mind that some receivers cannot show
these characters!

mpb

On 09/02/18 17:40, Fabien wrote:
> Great!! Thanks for this reactivity Matthias -:)
> But where can I download the last release ? In GitHub

> <https://github.com/Opendigitalradio/ODR-DabMux>, I see only v1.3.2
> Thanks
>

[Colin Dexter]

Hi Matthias,

When you are using for example a â char it is on the mux counting as using two chars.

Op vrijdag 9 februari 2018 21:21:07 UTC+1 schreef Matthias Brändli:

Sorry I forgot to update the master branch :-/ It's done now.

Good to hear it works. But keep in mind that some receivers cannot show
these characters!

mpb

On 09/02/18 17:40, Fabien wrote:
> Great!! Thanks for this reactivity Matthias -:)
> But where can I download the last release ? In GitHub
> <https://github.com/Opendigitalradio/ODR-DabMux>, I see only v1.3.2
> Thanks
>
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[Matthias Brändli]

Hi Colin,

I don't understand what you mean with this, can you describe more in detail?

mpb

On 16/02/18 07:15, Colin Dexter wrote:
> Hi Matthias,
>
> When you are using for example a â char it is on the mux counting as
> using two chars.
>
>
>
> Op vrijdag 9 februari 2018 21:21:07 UTC+1 schreef Matthias Brändli:
>
> Sorry I forgot to update the master branch :-/ It's done now.
>
> Good to hear it works. But keep in mind that some receivers cannot show
> these characters!
>
> mpb
>
> On 09/02/18 17:40, Fabien wrote:
> > Great!! Thanks for this reactivity Matthias -:)
> > But where can I download the last release ? In GitHub
> > <https://github.com/Opendigitalradio/ODR-DabMux
> <https://github.com/Opendigitalradio/ODR-DabMux>>, I see only v1.3.2
> > Thanks
> >
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[Peter Whisker]

I suspect Colin means that UTF-8 is two bytes so is it counted as one or two characters in the label?

Peter

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[Stefan Pöschel]

It counts as one byte, because the EBU Latin based charset (to which the
labels are converted) consists only of one byte chars; see the ETSI TS
101 756 Annex C which I mentioned in an earlier post.

Note that it is also possibe to directly use UTF-8 labels with DAB. But:
- some chars e.g. the mentioned "â" consume two bytes for one char
- not all receivers support UTF-8
- ODR-DabMux currently doesn't support it

Regards,
Stefan

[Colin Dexter]

Hi Matthias,

If you use a 16-character label with for example one char like "â", the ODR-DabMux indicates that the label is too long. If you then delete one character, it will work.

So a char like "â" is counting for to chars on the mux.

Regards Colin

Op vrijdag 16 februari 2018 10:30:48 UTC+1 schreef Matthias Brändli:

Hi Colin,

I don't understand what you mean with this, can you describe more in detail?

mpb

On 16/02/18 07:15, Colin Dexter wrote:
> Hi Matthias,
>
> When you are using for example a â char it is on the mux counting as
> using two chars.
>
>
>
> Op vrijdag 9 februari 2018 21:21:07 UTC+1 schreef Matthias Brändli:
>
>     Sorry I forgot to update the master branch :-/ It's done now.
>
>     Good to hear it works. But keep in mind that some receivers cannot show
>     these characters!
>
>     mpb
>
>     On 09/02/18 17:40, Fabien wrote:
>     > Great!! Thanks for this reactivity Matthias -:)
>     > But where can I download the last release ? In GitHub
>     > <https://github.com/Opendigitalradio/ODR-DabMux
>     <https://github.com/Opendigitalradio/ODR-DabMux>>, I see only v1.3.2
>     > Thanks
>     >
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[Matthias Brändli]

On 16/02/18 12:11, Stefan Pöschel wrote:
> - ODR-DabMux currently doesn't support it

v1.3.3 supports it now, and converts to EBU Latin.

I'll see where the length check is, thanks Colin for the explanation.

mpb

[Stefan Pöschel]

Am 16.02.2018 um 17:09 schrieb 'Matthias Brändli' via mmbtools:
> On 16/02/18 12:11, Stefan Pöschel wrote:
>> - ODR-DabMux currently doesn't support it
>
> v1.3.3 supports it now, and converts to EBU Latin.

What I meant was to use the UTF-8 charset in the actual DAB transmission
(which is currently not supported).

[Matthias Brändli]

On 16/02/18 17:15, Stefan Pöschel wrote:
> What I meant was to use the UTF-8 charset in the actual DAB transmission
> (which is currently not supported).

Sorry, I read too fast. You are correct.

ODR-DabMux reads UTF-8 labels, converts to EBU Latin.

The DAB spec describes UTF-8 labels, which ODR-DabMux doesn't support.

mpb

[Matthias Brändli]

Hi Colin,

latest 'next' should fix this issue. Thanks for the report!

mpb

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[Lindsay Cornell]

We had a long discussion yesterday in the WorldDAB TC about handling non-Latin scripts for FIG labels and dynamic labels.  We made a list of things that need more looking into, which we should do over the next weeks before the next meeting in June.  We haven't come to solid conclusions, but I think that the idea that FIG 1 labels should really only use EBU-Latin (due to existing receiver implementations) and that any other script requirements should be met using FIG 2 labels (which supports 16 characters per label rather than 16 bytes) is likely to firm up.  So if anyone was thinking about non-Latin labels, creating the FIG 2 labels would be good.  Issues we are thinking about are text direction, bidirectional text, precomposed vs decomposed code points, combining character handling... Feel free to contribute - maybe we should start a new thread.

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[Colin Dexter]

Hi Matthias,

Thanks for the fast fix. It works perfect now.

Regards Colin.

Op vrijdag 16 februari 2018 17:42:05 UTC+1 schreef Matthias Brändli:

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[Matthias Brändli]

Keep us updated! I'll write "implement FIG Type 2 labels" on my TODO
list for now.
mpb

On 16/02/18 18:29, Lindsay Cornell wrote:
> We had a long discussion yesterday in the WorldDAB TC about handling
> non-Latin scripts for FIG labels and dynamic labels.  We made a list of
> things that need more looking into, which we should do over the next
> weeks before the next meeting in June.  We haven't come to solid
> conclusions, but I think that the idea that FIG 1 labels should really
> only use EBU-Latin (due to existing receiver implementations) and that
> any other script requirements should be met using FIG 2 labels (which
> supports 16 characters per label rather than 16 bytes) is likely to firm
> up.  So if anyone was thinking about non-Latin labels, creating the FIG
> 2 labels would be good.  Issues we are thinking about are text
> direction, bidirectional text, precomposed vs decomposed code points,
> combining character handling... Feel free to contribute - maybe we
> should start a new thread.
>
> On 16 February 2018 at 16:42, 'Matthias Brändli' via mmbtools

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