Orban Loudness Meter
Terresa Cherrie
The Orban Loudness Meter receives a two-channel stereo signal from any Windows sound device and measures its loudness and level. It can simultaneously display instantaneous peaks, VU, PPM, CBS Technology Center loudness, and ITU BS.1770 loudness. The meter includes peak-hold functionality that makes the peak indications of the meters easy to see.
Has anyone else had an issue with this software where you turn the POD off and then the connected laptop locks up ( possibly because the Orban software can no longer detect what you have set as the sound source ) ?
Well, when equalizing six patches of widely varying tones, to be used later through a PA system, I want to get something more reliable and accurate than just trying to compare them with my ears. I use the LKFS number showing on the right in the attachment.
PERCEIVED LOUDNESS is what matters, not a number on a meter...this is ESPECIALLY true when comparing "widely varying tones", crafted at a volume, and in an environment completely different from that in which you intend to use them. The distorted tone @ 80 dB will blow the doors off a clean tone @ 80 dB, EVERY SINGLE TIME. So what good is leveling them all to some arbitrary number? Answer: it's not. Doing it this way, then cranking up to gig volume through a PA is gonna result in levels that are all over the place.
We do a final tune up during sound check but I'm attempting to get the patch levels all close from a LKFS loudness perspective ( at home, in advance ). I don't claim to understand LKFS entirely but it's not the same as decibels or what a VU meter would show.
"LKFS is derived from dBFS, which is decibels referenced in the digital realm to the amplitude level of the most significant bit of the signal, hence Full Scale. LKFS is in fact an amplitude level. However, it is intended to stand in for the subjective quality we call "loudness." In order to make that at least reasonably plausible, LKFS modifies simple amplitude level (as expressed in dB) to more closely resemble what our ears hear under normal television viewing conditions. "
So far the tool has worked pretty well. Our sound guy hasn't given me the impression that my patches are all over the map. Since you can't hear FOH very well from the stage, I'd have to run a 50 foot cable so I could play from the room ---- which would mean going there on an extra trip or earlier than I care to. Different things work for different people/situations. One thing about such tools, though, is they don't suffer from ear fatigue and prevent yelling from spouses who don't want to hear "gig volume." :-)
I have been using voxengo span for several years, but not really for leveling patches...More to check my ears that I have got the pcokets right so I am not killing, vocals, keys etc...The average loudness is only really useful for recording situations for me...Different folks use different tools and preferences of the tools they like, or just ears...If everyone did it the same way, music would be pretty sterile and you wouldn't find those glorious tonal accidents...but just my opinion.
Following on from Open Mic 10, some questions were raised about optimum loudness levels and how to achieve them. I had been having a side bar conversation with @davidp following his recent OBS experiments and some of this was centred on using loudness meters.
Another Loudness Meter, which I believe Mr P has been using provides similar functionality, so I will include a link for that as well. Orban Loudness Meter which is completely free but imho less functionality.
I found using the Loudness Meter allowed me to get an good set up much quicker than in the past, with the knowledge on what True Peak level was required and what my target Integrated LUFS level should be for YouTube.
Audio Input (Guitar/POD Go, Vocals/PlayAcoustic and Drum & Bass BT/Trio+) are connected to my audio interface and fed into OBS as an ASIO Input Capture source. The AIC then has Gain, Limit and Youlean Loudness Meter added (the latter as a VST plugin). With reference to what was said in the above video, I set the limiter to -2 db.
Once those initially levels are set up I will record a video practice run in OBS with all parts and again monitor the levels and tweak the gain in OBS as required. What is also helpful is to convert the OBS video into an audio format (WAV MP3) and drop it into the Youlean standalone meter on the desktop, as you can see the wave form and levels for the whole song. See screenshot of Should Have Listened recorded in OBS.
Interestingly, when the same set up was then recorded in Zoom (from OBS) the overall level dropped. Integrated LUFS for OBS 16.5 and Zoom 19.7. This is something a few of us have suspected for a while but now backed up by evidence. So I could have actually boosted the OBS audio gain by 2-3 db and have still fallen just short of that magical -14 db figure when the audio passed through Zoom. Worth bearing in mind that there is some headroom!
FWIW - in the past many of us have referenced the YouTube Nerd Stat figure of -6 db being the optimum level to aim for (right click on YT screen) and both my OM X songs, recorded using the method above came in at -5.7 db when I did my final Dry Run videos before the show. If I had hit that figure in the past by trial and error, that would be the time to step away and leave everything ready for the show.
I would say that should be the average for YouTube but other streaming services differ level wise. Spotify (not that I use it) seems to be the same as YT at -14db (at the moment). The True Peak limit should stop any overall clipping and I think YT will dial down volume if its too hot. But as the video says YT does not increase DB like other platforms (Spotify) so getting as close as you can is the target.
This video will make more sense of that where there is reference to the loudness levels, used by Spotify -normalization
YouTube would appear to use similar values from what I have seen on various sites.
I was going to include it above but thought it might muddy the waters.
The difference is, Spotify (and others) will raise or lower loudness for consistency but YT will only cap if too loud, not raise. So aim for an Integrated LUFS setting of -14 if uploading to YouTube. I use -16 for wriggle room and also that I can come in a little hot on the OMs because of the style I tend to play or in the last case knowing I was going to let rip on the vox at the end of Turn and I was clipping at the higher level.
The OM X video is showing -2.9db on the Nerd Stats, so I might create an MP3 version and drop it into Youlean LM and see what the stats are for the whole show. That could give us a better target for the future, assuming @adi_mrok did not tweak the audio levels on the Zoom video before posting ?
I dropped an MP3 version of the show into the Youlean Loudness Meter and saw some interesting results. Across the whole show we averaged -17.3 Integrated LUFS, so a little down on the optimum -14 LUFS for YouTube.
Move the volume slide on the YT page and the Volume/Normalized levels will change accordingly. But it still does not explain what a negative or positive db value means ie is the sound short of YTs optimum level or above? Remember YT does not adjust loudness/volume up only down. So I am trying find that answer next.
The first part of this stat is simple. The volume shows where the volume slider currently is as a percentage, with 0% being all the way to the left, and 100% being all the way to the right. The second part of this stat is a little trickier to explain, however.
It is this value that is used to determine the normalisation amount, as YouTube attempts to bring this video in line with their reference volume. This value will not change based on any action taken by you, such as moving the volume slider. In fact, it is fixed at the point of upload, and would only change if the video was edited to adjust the volume, or YouTube changed their reference volume.
Finally a good video from Kenny Gioia using in YouLean LM in your DAW in his case Reaper but should apply to all DAWs. So this could be useful for folks mixing multi tracks and not just prepping for Open Mics. Mr P may have shared this in the past but relevant to this thread.
I have given up on the chase as to why the Nerd Stat of -6 db Loudness level was recommended in YouTube but it was banded around some years back. But these platforms are changing all the time, so it may well be redundant. Certainly if you hit that figure your YT post or OM audio will have a pretty good sound level but you would have some scope to push a little louder. But if you see a positive number, best to dial it back below zero.
Anyway, plenty of stats, figures and tech info for those who like that stuff but at the end of the day a simple Loudness Meter like the one from Youlean, should mean you can optimise your levels for posting or live performances much quicker - with out the constant need for YT uploads and constant stat checks (which I did in the past).
A good article JK. I think if we had been able to put a -1 or -2 db limiter on the shows audio, all those clips on the screenshot would have been avoided. Interestingly, I just drop the OM MP3 into and the Spotify reading came out bang on the money at 0.0 db. And given YT and Spotify have an ILUFS level of -14 it was spot on for YT.
Youlean Loudness Meter 2 which can be obtained as freeware and upgraded to pro at a reasonable price (mho give the tools capabilities). It can be added as a VST plugin to OBS or can run a desktop standalone program.
But the results were surprising. Given the Stats for Nerds result of around -3.5dB I expected Integrated LUFS in the region of -16 to -14. But it was way way softer. Turn on Orban and I see what I expected.
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