Has anyone heard of pcDuino?

[Milan]

Hi All,
Just wanted to see if anyone has come across pcDuino? www.pcduino.com
I have RasPi running XBMC and I came across this thing which seems to have more grunt behind it compared to RasPi, so was just wondering if anyone had any experience with it?
Wondering if it is worth upgrading. I mean arduino shields compatibility is also nice feature but not sure how arduino libraries actually translate to its environment.
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciate.
Cheers,
Milan

[Luke Weston]

I've got no idea what they mean by "Moreover, it has hardware headers interface compatible with Arduino."

It's plain to see from the photo that they do not even have pin headers in an arrangement that is mechanically compatible (without even going into electrical/software compatibility) with Arduino shields.

There are obviously some 0.1" pin headers on the board for some sort of external GPIO. However those digital IOs are only tolerant of 3.3V logic levels (maybe even 1.8V, whatever the I/O voltage of the A10 ARM SoC is), so even if you can use wires to cable up an Arduino shield dangling off the headers on the board, it's not a plug-and-play solution to just use any Arduino shield you want. And we haven't even gotten to the question of Arduino software compatibility!

Basically, it's a low-ish-cost embedded ARM SoC SBC running Linux, and that's all well and good, but it's not really Arduino-anything.

On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 5:58 PM, Marco Bresciani <hypnor...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Milan,

I was planning to come along to the general Tuesday meeting tomorrow to take my first look at a hacker space.  If you will be attending, then I can bring my pcDuino for you to look at.

I won't be coming in until around 8pm or 9pm, so if you think that you would like more tinkering time with it, then you can borrow it until the next meeting.  I won't be needing it until then.

Marco

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[Milan]

Thanks Marco for the offer.
Unfortunatelly I will not be able to make it tonight.
What have you used pcDuino for? or what did you intend to do with it?

On Monday, April 8, 2013 5:58:05 PM UTC+10, Marco Bresciani wrote:

Hi Milan,

I was planning to come along to the general Tuesday meeting tomorrow to take my first look at a hacker space.  If you will be attending, then I can bring my pcDuino for you to look at.

I won't be coming in until around 8pm or 9pm, so if you think that you would like more tinkering time with it, then you can borrow it until the next meeting.  I won't be needing it until then.

Marco


On Monday, April 8, 2013 11:31:47 AM UTC+10, Milan wrote:

[Milan]

Hi Luke,
Thanks for your insight. Getting cables plugged into shields is probably not the best way to use them but it would not be that much of a problem.
My real concern was actually geting shields to work through pcDuino and how to get programming working between the two.
Cheers,
Milan

On Monday, April 8, 2013 8:00:23 PM UTC+10, Luke Weston wrote:

I've got no idea what they mean by "Moreover, it has hardware headers interface compatible with Arduino."

It's plain to see from the photo that they do not even have pin headers in an arrangement that is mechanically compatible (without even going into electrical/software compatibility) with Arduino shields.

There are obviously some 0.1" pin headers on the board for some sort of external GPIO. However those digital IOs are only tolerant of 3.3V logic levels (maybe even 1.8V, whatever the I/O voltage of the A10 ARM SoC is), so even if you can use wires to cable up an Arduino shield dangling off the headers on the board, it's not a plug-and-play solution to just use any Arduino shield you want. And we haven't even gotten to the question of Arduino software compatibility!

Basically, it's a low-ish-cost embedded ARM SoC SBC running Linux, and that's all well and good, but it's not really Arduino-anything.

On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 5:58 PM, Marco Bresciani <hypnor...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Milan,

I was planning to come along to the general Tuesday meeting tomorrow to take my first look at a hacker space.  If you will be attending, then I can bring my pcDuino for you to look at.

I won't be coming in until around 8pm or 9pm, so if you think that you would like more tinkering time with it, then you can borrow it until the next meeting.  I won't be needing it until then.

Marco


On Monday, April 8, 2013 11:31:47 AM UTC+10, Milan wrote:

Hi All,
Just wanted to see if anyone has come across pcDuino? www.pcduino.com
I have RasPi running XBMC and I came across this thing which seems to have more grunt behind it compared to RasPi, so was just wondering if anyone had any experience with it?
Wondering if it is worth upgrading. I mean arduino shields compatibility is also nice feature but not sure how arduino libraries actually translate to its environment.
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciate.
Cheers,
Milan

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[Marco Bresciani]

Hi Milan,
Sorry for the delay in my reply, I have been snowed under at work.

In answer to your question, I have an existing project that has an Arduino heart that I put together to test out the coin counter from SparkFun.  It is a small coin operated fortune telling machine along the same lines as the "Mystic Seer" that appeared in an old episode of the Twilight Zone, except that mine has an animated skull head with glowing eyes, and a little thermal printer to print fortunes.

I will be replacing the Arduino with a pcDuino and a webcam to add a photo booth feature that will print their faces on their date/time stamped fortunes.  It will use simpleCV for their face to be detected and cropped.  It will also use a wireless access point broadcast its earnings to a simple iPhone app.

Although SimpleCV is too slow for realtime operation, it is perfectly fine for processing still images.

For this updated project, a pcDuino $57.34 + WiFi Dongle $14.30 ($71.64), would replace an Arduino Uno $28.64 + microSD Shield $14.30 + CMUcam v4 sheild $95.59 + Real Time Clock Module $14.30 + Arduino Wi-Fi Shield $81.25 ($234.08).

If it works OK then I am thinking of replacing a Mac mini I have in a gallery piece I made called 'The digital portrait of Dorian Gray', where the software morphs a 'painting' into your face, and then ages it before your very eyes.

So far I have only played with the Linux and Android side of pcDuino, putting all types of server software, and seeing how far you can take it by testing out some 3D games.  It's pretty fast.

In simple projects, I normally prototype on Arduino and then use an ATTiny if I don't need any shields, for size and cost.  I did this with a simon type tapping game I put inside a matchbox, (and hid the electronics behind a fake layer of matches).  It has a piezo speaker for sound effects and would tap back using a miniture motor.

Now, if I have to make anything that would require more than a stand alone Arduino, I will definitely be using the pcDuino in as it does away with many shields.  If you did need one, you can use any existing shield and plug it in via ribbon cable, just as long it was compatible with 3.3v, as it uses this voltage for logic levels like some of the newer Arduino models (7 of them in fact).

According to AdaFruit "Now the coolest new sensors, displays and chips are 3.3V and are not 5V compatible. For example, XBee radios, and SD cards and accelerometers all run on 3.3V logic and power."  So I guess that makes sense, (though I wish they had made it so you could just plug the shields straight into the board without the ribbons).

Programming the pcDuino is exactly the same experience as programming a traditional Arduino, so if you are familiar with the Arduino, then you are familiar with the pcDuino.  It even has an Arduino IDE that you can install on board so you can program it with it.  Very meta!

I haven't yet, but according to someone that has had experience in porting over third party libraries to the pcDuino, he said that they do no need to be reprogrammed, they just need to be included in the appropriate header files and placed in the correct directory.

So you can just use it as a real, value-for-money, Arduino on steroids.  The one and only proviso I have seen so far is that they haven't implemented interrupts yet, but they say it is coming.

With all the extra speed and memory and all the shields it replaces, it is fairly easy to program around the lack of interrupts, for now.  It seems to have everything else, plus!

The last thing I need to mention is that nearly every week, a driver comes out that takes advantage of on-board hardware acceleration, so things are getting faster and faster on it all the time.

..which reminds me, I have left my pcDuino in the Melbourne Hacker Space if anyone wants to play with it.  Without the included microSD card it boots up as an Android, but it boots up in Lubutu if it the card is inserted.  Anyone that does want to see how fast it is in Linux, would you mind installing the recently released patch at "http://www.pcduino.com/?page_id=14" that fixes a bug and brings the CPU speed back to the full 1,000MHz, instead of the current 400MHz?  Thanks.

I hope this helps, Milan.

Marco

[Milan]

Thanks Marco for a very detailed response.
Now I am definitelly more tempted to get one knowing that if I get stuck there is someone experienced with it.
Cheers,
Milan

[tubular]

Marco, 

I'm making an adapter to break out the Pcduino to standard Arduino shield header spacings.   I stopped by the space last night and took some measurements and photos.   

We'll get the PCB made on the quickturn service tomorrow, which means we should have it back in time for next week 

Thanks for leaving it at the space.  

regards

Lachlan

[Marco Bresciani]

I am glad that you found it useful, Lachlan. 

I am in no rush to get it back at the moment because I am tied up with some other projects, but I would love to buy one of your adapters if you are getting any spares made up. :-)

[Marco Bresciani]

You're welcome, Milan.

You should also take a look at the Udoo.  It is another great little AOS board (Arduino-On-Steroids) with additional features for a little extra money.   So now, depending upon what your requirements are, there are a growing amount of options that you can use to tailor fit to any sized project.

What a great time in history it is to be a hacker!
Marco

[Geoff]

This looks like a good deal for a good dev. board and there is a 10% discount for 10 and only one shipping charge of $11. 

Could CCHS look at buying a qty of them and sell them to members?

Some ideas on how this might work:

They could be sold at one of price and the difference going to the club, while members would save the shipping. Payment could be required upfront.

http://electronhobbies.com/159-pcduino.html

Regards

Geoff

[Andy Gelme]

hi Geoff,

On 2013-04-17 05:17 , Geoff wrote:
> Could CCHS look at buying a qty of them and sell them to members ?

Two potential issues ...

1) The CCHS probably doesn't want to put its money into holding stock.
We end-up being a poorly run JayCar.

2) The time taken to organize out-weighs the financial benefit.

> They could be sold at one of price and the difference going to the
> club, while members would save the shipping. Payment could be required
> upfront.

What appears to be working best at the moment ... is that a motivated
CCHS members states "I'm buying X ... anyone else interested ?" ... and
others join in. Pretty much like what you are proposing ... without any
additional overheads imposed on the CCHS (in terms of management).

Should the organizing member choose to contribute some funds to the
CCHS, buy a tool that the CCHS lacks ... or pay their facility fee ...
then that is awesome.

Given that situation ... when you consider carefully the statement "CCHS
look at buying a qty and sell them" ... it is important to ask ...

- What exactly does that mean (who does what) ?
- How does it differ from the "motivated CCHS member" scenario ?
- What is the real benefit, when all the effort is considered ?

I'm all for bulk purchasing, saving shipping costs, etc.

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[Marco Bresciani]

Hi Lachlan,

How did you go with the PCB? Are there any spares available for purchase?  Do you still need more time for experimentation with the pcDuino that I left behind at the space?

Marco

On Tuesday, April 16, 2013 10:45:59 AM UTC+10, tubular wrote:

[tubular]

Hi Marco, 

I ordered a couple of the boards that should be here late this week.  One's for you, one I'll hang onto for the space.   

Its a strange, coathanger shaped board because I didn't want to cover and thermally insulate the A10 too much.  There is a jumper to enable each of the analog/digital signals, or to insert a series resistor for level conversion etc

If we need more for anyone we can just run them on panels with the other boards

cheers

Lachlan 

[Marco Bresciani]

Hi Lachlan,

That's great about the board!  Thanks for that.

Let me know how much that was and who I can leave the money with at the space.

I will coming in to pick up the pcDuino on Saturday as I need it on Monday, but if you still need it I can bring it back on Tuesday night.

Marco

[Marco Bresciani]

Hi Lachlan,

You did a GREAT job on the adapter board!  I like the way you added the option fpr that extra header for mechanical stability.

Thanks for soldering the headers on.

I should be able to bring it back on Tuesday evening if you need it, but even if you don't I would like to come in and pay you for the board.

I could probably leave it there at the space for another week if anyone wants any hands on testing.

Thanks again,

Marco


On Sunday, April 28, 2013 6:01:58 PM UTC+10, tubular wrote:

[tubular]

Marco 

Not a problem.  You'll note there are still a few jumpers etc to solder, tapped spacers to make it more solid, then look at the signal levels to see if a level shifter would be a good investment for rev2.   I'd also like to use the ampmodu headers which are a little bit shorter, and available in smt or through hole, as I think it would come up a little bit neater.    

I'll be at the space Tuesday but only until 7:30 or so.  If you can make it by then, great, perhaps we can fire it up and do some basic tests, if not then have a play and let me know if anything needs changing 

cheers

Lachlan 

[Marco Bresciani]

Lachlan,

Yes I noticed the stabilizing jumpers, and the perfectly aligned spacer holes.  Very clever.

I was planning to get there at around 8pm, but I will try to get there earlier.  If not, then I can experiment with the board and then drop off the pcDuino (and payment) at the next meeting on Saturday for a week.

Marco