Re: [CCHS] Basic welding instruction

[Stuart Young]

I'm interested in learning how to weld properly, so if something comes up, I'll be in it.

I did a tiny bit of welding back in secondary school, but not much since.

On 30 April 2013 16:29, danielt <daniel....@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi everyone,

Is anyone in the community willing run some introductory sessions for those wanting to learn some hobby welding (arc/mig/??)?

I've been out to visit CCHS twice back before the Hawthorn site was set-up. I'm not yet a member but I think I've found the project that will make me one.

I'm a software developer, but I also enjoy working on cars and bikes. There's a number of small projects I'd like to try that I can't because they need basic mild steel welding:

- mounting plate for a fire extinguisher 

  (connecting three flat pieces into a triangle)

- fixing a damaged car seat bracket 

  (extending a flat piece by about 6cm)

- making a removable exhaust silencer 

  (metal tube with flat end plate)

- And maybe a custom luggage bracket for my motorbike

I've spent a few evenings reading and watching intro welding videos and these seem to be within the 'high school metalwork' level of difficulty. But before I could take that on I'd need to learn the basics, safety and practice.

I'm very happy to contribute to costs of running some training, and I have 20 years of programming experience and a lot of basic car maintenance skills that I could pass on to anyone interested.

Thank you,

dan

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[damie...@gmail.com]

I'm curious about it, too.

Don't have any specific projects in mind, but think it would be a useful skill to learn. Same goes for being able to eyeball a weld and tell if it's up to scratch, know what thickness and types of materials you can use or weld together, and any associated safety issues/measures/equipment.

Cheers,

Damien

Damie...@gmail.com

[dhemsley]

I would be inteterested in welding as well.

Dayle

[Scott Penrose]

I will register myself as an amateur welder, with lots of safety equipment, a MIG and Arc welder - but no expert.

Problem is there is a big difference between doing, and teaching - am I good enough to teach? Maybe beginners.

Anyway, if you can't find someone better, I am around.

Scooter

[Joshua Mesilane]

Hi All,

I'm also an amateur welder, I've built a couple of trailers, heaps of stuff around the property and plenty of track welding at the miniature railway. Although I'm not a paid up member I'd be happy to do so in order to assist.

I've got a single phase mig, a petrol powered stick welder and (soon) a plasma cutter (good for cutting up scrap to practice).

My only thoughts on this topic are:

You'll need quite a few welding masks, especially if doing demos.

You're going to need a bunch of rods (I've probably got some old ones here that I can donate)
You're going to need plenty of scrap steel and have it cut up.

You're going to need someone open, particularly if using a mig. I'm not sure the space is a suitable place to be conducting this kind of thing. When welding you want a large, well ventilated, open space. You could do it at the space but you'd want some large steel plates to put on the bench to prevent bad things like fires and the like (remember, we're talking about melting steel here)

You'll probably need 2 or 3 welders, maybe a couple of sticks and a mig. I'll suggest that for beginners, although harder you're better off to start learning how to stick weld, as once you can stick you'll be able to mig (Mig is easy in comparison). You'll also need a power source that's up to scratch, as welders are juice hungry.

I've probably got some scrap bits here that you could use for practice.

Cheers,

Josh

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[Darren Freeman]

On Mon, 2013-04-29 at 23:29 -0700, danielt wrote:
> Is anyone in the community willing run some introductory sessions for
> those wanting to learn some hobby welding (arc/mig/??)?

I would be keen to attend as a student if someone is willing to run
this. I think it's a great idea!

Have fun,
Darrem

[Keith Franks]

I'm heaps keen to learn welding and I have projects that need me to learn. Count me in to learn.

[Scott Penrose]

Although multiple welders would be good, we need to consider power. Most are 15Amp, although quite frankly 10Amp is heaps. But not 3 at once.

Space could be an issue too - but we could do maybe 1 stick, one mig, and one plasma cutter for demo. Ohhh... plasma cutter - on my wish list :-)

Scott

[Joshua Mesilane]

Hey Scott,

At that point you really have to ask yourself, are you doing a demo, or are you teaching people. If there's a big enough group if you've only got one or two units, how do you share it around everyone?

Cheers,

Josh

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0416039082
jo...@zindello.com.au
http://www.zindello.com.au/

[Scott Penrose]

On 30/04/2013, at 8:30 PM, Joshua Mesilane <jo...@zindello.com.au> wrote:

At that point you really have to ask yourself, are you doing a demo, or are you teaching people. If there's a big enough group if you've only got one or two units, how do you share it around everyone?

Yes good point. Gut feel though is that the size of the space, power requirements, our teaching skills etc would mean we can't really do more than 2 or 3 students for hands on. By the time you get through safety, setup, demo, etc, that is my gut feel. Also I think even if we had more than 1 welder, I would not want to be responsible for more than one welder concurrently.

Scott

[Joshua Mesilane]

Oh absolutely, You would only ever have as many units going as you had power AND competent operators.

---
VK3XJM
0416039082
jo...@zindello.com.au
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[Luke Weston]

I don't think we have *any* 15A single-phase GPOs at the space, which is probably important to point out.

So if you've got a welder with a 15A 3-pin plug it's probably completely unusable at the space.

Although with an appropriate breakout box you could break out the 3-phase outlet to many 15A GPOs.

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[Luke Weston]

By the way, I'm interested, particularly if we have access to a MIG or two in addition to ye good old stick welder. :)

[Joshua Mesilane]

Hi Luke,

You can also run a 15A welder, by using a cable with a 10A plug on one end, a 15A socket on the other AND (And this and is a MUST to be legal) an inline 10A Circuit Breaker/RCD combo. There are also plenty of small welders around that run off a 10A outlet.

FWIW, if I get new tyres for the petrol powered unit, that becomes a moot point. Perhaps this is something we can plan a little further down the track?

Cheers,

Josh

---
VK3XJM
0416039082
jo...@zindello.com.au
http://www.zindello.com.au/

On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 8:52 PM, Luke Weston <reindeer...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Luke Weston]

I was *just* about to bite your head off but then I got up to reading the bit where you mentioned putting the 10A circuit breaker in there. :)

I thought it was important to mention, because whilst 10A small welders do exist, 15A is probably the most common.

[Scott Penrose]

On 30/04/2013, at 8:58 PM, Joshua Mesilane <jo...@zindello.com.au> wrote:

You can also run a 15A welder, by using a cable with a 10A plug on one end, a 15A socket on the other AND (And this and is a MUST to be legal) an inline 10A Circuit Breaker/RCD combo. There are also plenty of small welders around that run off a 10A outlet.

Yes that is how they do the caravan adapters.

-- 

Scott Penrose

sco...@dd.com.au

http://scott.dd.com.au/

[Luke Weston]

But if I see anyone filing down the earth pin on a 15A welder's plug to fit it in a 10A GPO I won't be amused. :)

[Joshua Mesilane]

Luke: You should know me well enough by now to know I would not recommend something so silly :P

Scott: Yep, I've got a caravan as well, why do you think I know? :)

---
VK3XJM
0416039082
jo...@zindello.com.au
http://www.zindello.com.au/

[Joshua Mesilane]

Ditto. This is a nono.

---
VK3XJM
0416039082
jo...@zindello.com.au
http://www.zindello.com.au/

--

[Luke Weston]

Of course you never recommended that, I know you wouldn't, and I never said you recommended that!

[James Denier]

Maan.. I'm in for welding if and when it happens.

If we can only do two or three at a time it could perhaps be arranged on a special day or a Saturday after the younglings have left?

If we have enough interest, perhaps multiple sessions could be done. I, for one, would be happy to pay for the privilege of learning to weld as I'm sure I'll be needing it soon in the future.

[Joshua Mesilane]

Once I tidy up my shed, if people are willing to travel for the day I wouldn't mind hosting it. I've got a 4 car garage/shed that's set up for working on "stuff" although probably only really suitable for maybe 2 "competent" operators and 2 or 3 "students" I also have 2 15A GPOs, a nice big mig and access to plenty of other welders if needbe.

I'm located out in the outer south western suburbs. It's only a thought, but the shed tidy up would mean it'll be a couple (maybe a few) months off.

---
VK3XJM
0416039082
jo...@zindello.com.au
http://www.zindello.com.au/

[Luke Weston]

I think we can do it at the hackerspace perfectly practically with a small amount of furniture rearrangement, at a dedicated time where we're not also trying to share the space with all the different people doing all the things in the space that people want to do.

On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 9:26 PM, James Denier <james....@gmail.com> wrote:

[Luke Weston]

Thanks Josh, that would be great.

If you're willing to donate time and use of your space that would be really attractive. And it means you don't need to transport welders. :)

Indeed, I think the most practical way to do it is to use *somebody's* generously provided external space which is already well suited to welding, where the nature of the space, power infrastructure, ventilation, etc. are already set up in a way that is well suited to welding and welders are already available on site.

[Keith Franks]

Is it worthwhile doing an instructive session on a week night to a bunch of people and cover concepts, theory, safety, etc prior to doing any hands on stuff?

That way a bunch of people would be one step away from actually using a welder, and be able to rotate more users around an actual machine on another day.

Keith.

[Andy Gelme]

hi Keith,

On 2013-05-1 08:11 , Keith Franks wrote:
> Is it worthwhile doing an instructive session on a week night to a
> bunch of people and cover concepts, theory, safety, etc prior to doing
> any hands on stuff ?

Yes, good idea. A good time to make some plans, prepare and gauge real
interest (which appears high).

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[Darren Freeman]

On Tue, 2013-04-30 at 20:52 +1000, Luke Weston wrote:
> Although with an appropriate breakout box you could break out the
> 3-phase outlet to many 15A GPOs.

I have designed and loosely costed a three-phase to 6x 15A GPO breakout
box with combo RCD / circuit breakers. (I used to work part-time as an
electrical panel builder during my engineering degree.)

I can build it in an afternoon and it will be around $200-$250 using a
mixture of L&H and Bunnings components. Cheaper if we get some donated
parts.

Ideally, we would reuse a three-phase 5-pin plug to save about $85. The
other major expense is the enclosure, so getting a donation on that
would save whatever that ends up costing.

I would aim to mount it to the wall near the outlet, and then use 15A
extension cords as needed. (So long as it's still considered portable
equipment.)

It would also be really good to get one of the available machines to
make up a nice front panel with lettering.

Have fun,
Darren