Stern Gland Packing has Packed it in

[grandpiper]

It's the usual scenario, water in the bilge and sleepless nights worrying that my the automatic bilge pump working overtime will flatten the battery and eventually La Mouette will sink to a watery grave. 

 

The main culprit of course is the stern gland.  I crawled into the engine bay on the weekend with the torch and found that you could actually see it dripping.  There must be some sort of catchment moulded into the fibreglass where it then drains in to the bilge.  Have seen little trickles of water under the engine lately and suspected the stuffing box.  I don't really want to wait until the boat is slipped at the end of the year but then again, I don't want to attempt to do it whilst it is in the water, in case I get the nut off and water floods in and not be able to get if fixed or get the nut back on. 

 

I tried to tighten it up a bit with a set of stilsons, but it wouldn't tighten any more, and in fact the rubber hose was twisting when I attempted to nip it up - the bronze is a pretty green colour and I couldn't see if there was a lock nut on it.  I think that it might be screwed all the way in as I couldn't see any thread poking out either.

 

Perhaps fellow Compass owners can answer a couple of questions, bearing in mind that my whole set up appears to be standard - ie standard YSE8 engine etc.  I presume that the prop shaft etc is standard too.  There are no grease nipples or provision for greasing however,

 

1. Can I remove the fuel tank to give myself a bit more room to lay on top of the engine to attempt this sort of work?

2.  With the boat still in the water, is is safe just to undo the nut and slip in another piece of packing and then do the nut up again without sinking the boat?

3.  What size packing hemp/flax do I need?  This is tricky because you have to pull the old stuff out to find out the size and then go to Whitworth's to buy some new stuff whilst water is busy filling up the boat.

4.  Is there a lock nut, or is the whole bronze hex one pieice?

5.  Which direction do the threads go, ie do I turn the spanner anti clockwise to undo it?

6.  Whilst crawling around in the engine bay (why do all my hobbies involve crawling around engine bays), I noticed a lever with a piece of piano wire sitting on the top of the gearbox casing.  The wire wasn't connected to anything - is this the remote lever for the de-compression lever?  The chain on the manual starting unit has been removed, so I was wondering if the remote decompression lever has been disconnected as well.  Couldn't find anything in the engine manual about it.

 

BTW the water was dripping at the rate of a drip once every two seconds and the bilge will fill up to where to pump is in a day or so - so I am concerned.

 

Thanks in advance

Andrew

 

 

 

 

[Graeme Lock]

Andrew;

There was a thread on working on the gland in the water some time ago.
Do a search and you'll find it. I have gone a further step and and
removed the prop shaft in the water, with no problem.

Before you attack it though, it sounds like you need to educate
yourself on how the gland goes together, so you can go the right way
about disassembling it. It has a RH thread, and you need two spanners
to undo it (I use pipe wrenches). The rear hex is the locknut. Make
sure you don't twist the flexible hose.

Cheers, Graeme

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[ninoxyacht]

The wire sounds like a decompression lever puller, I recall I had one on my YSE8.

I can't help you technically much because I haven't done this job.

When I bought my boat the surveyor said the stern gland needed doing/replacing and the yard took out the engine and replaced the stern gland. No other viable access. It went on the slip for a/foul and fill in old toilet inlet/outlet holes, pressure wash above, water pump, etc. Once on the slip, the cost component for the stern gland was $600 (plus labour? not sure). And done in one or two days while back home.

I have removed the propeller whilst swimming underwater, but it was a long job. I have scrapped my YSE8 and am getting used to an 8HP outboard motor on the transom, but later will go into a well. The Yanmar was about 40 years of age and the overhaul or repair sounded like it would cost more than I wanted to pay. Mostly happy with the OB now, but have kept the shaft in for now.

 

 

 

[transall]

Andrew,

I share your concerns as have the same problem and out the following to you as a suggestion based on my experiences/observations.

The stuffing box (bearing) should have a grease nipple attached, it should always be fully packed with grease, even unto to the point tat you see grease

ousting from the bearing. Tools grease gun (small one).

As I understand, water comes up the shaft from the cut less bearing and enters the stuffing box…it is designed to do this as it cools the cutless bearing,

- the water overtime forces the grease from the stuffing box and hence the drip. The grease and water once free from the stuffing box drops onto the shaft

between the stuffing box and the gearbox, which overtime (grease) flies all over the place (small amounts over time = dirty engine bay etc), the water being

flung of the shaft does the same, but unlike the grease the water falls to the bilge. Next time observe the drip before engaging the gear box after you engage

the "drip" goes ? (so assumption is "it only leaks when I shut down the engine" ) what is actually happening it's still leaking as the water is being flung of the shaft due to centrifugal force.

So before you undertake the action you describe, highly suggest try repacking the stuffing box with grease (it is most likely devoid of grease, other than whats

within the bearing for lubrication….not sufficient to stop water ingress up the shaft.

Meantime, if you do not have a solar panel/s to trickle charge the battery/s I would be investigating this option as not only gives peace of mind with auto bilge pump operation but also keeps battery/s fully charged which makes for longer battery life and performance.

Hope this is of assistance

[Mando C29]

Grandpiper,

Having been down this road myself, my advice is (and you may not want to hear this) is to attack it with the boat on the slip. There's too much to go wrong trying to do it in the water (in my opinion). When on the slip I would: remove and replace the rubber with good quality truck radiator hose pipe,(make sure you stick it place with marine sikaflex), replace the clamps with "Cat" clamps (these are the ones that are about 16mm wide and need to be done up with a socket), repack the gland and at the same time tap a grease nipple into the bronze housing,check the shaft for wear and generally familiarise yourself with all aspects of what goes on down there.Try to make sure that when the gland is done up it lightly clamps the shaft at the 50% thread point ie so that you have adjustment for and aft in case it doesn't either leak enough or too much.Also, try to finish up with the grease nipple at the top!!!It may also be a good time to have a quick check of the alignment of the shaft to the engine.

Hope all this helps, as relying on a bilge pump to keep the boat dry is like painting over rust!

Regards,

Maurice Mando C29  

On Monday, August 17, 2015 at 4:38:55 PM UTC+10, grandpiper wrote:

[C30 Stargazer]

My two cents worth. Stargazer had water coming through her stern gland filling up the bilge in a few weeks. I paid a shipwright/mechanic to do the work whilst I did the antifouling etc when slipped. 1) the bronze/brass fitting was so worn the hole was not round anymore. So whilst it could be reused, it would never be a great outcome. I had it replaced. The hose was old - so had that replaced. But there was not enough space to refit the new hose - the glass had to be ground back to expose enough flange to seat the new hose. The prop shaft was found to be worn badly (lack of stern bearing). In our case, this meant that any new bearing would flog out quickly. So sadly I had a new shaft machined. Sometimes the shafts are corroded where the gland sits - and if so the options are to change the length of hose and set the stern gland on a fresh piece of shaft - or replace the shaft. The packing is essentially wax impregnated rope. The friction of the spinning shaft melts the wax which seals the gland. Over time, tightening the gland nut stops leakage but eventually, one replaces the packing - which can be done in situ but is so much easier and safer on land!

My new shaft/gland is perfect - and the bilge pump is now very underemployed.

I tell you this to give an example of why I think doing the work on a slip is the way to go. If you know the gear is new and you're just replacing the packing - that is one thing - but you may have other work needed.

Lastly, a retired friend of mine was Chief Engineer on merchant vessels and some of the old cruise ships.He noted that they still used the old packing system - except the gland can be stripped off half at a time - and they would renew the packing in the water.....

I wish you well with the work!!
Bruce

On Monday, August 17, 2015 at 4:38:55 PM UTC+10, grandpiper wrote:

[grandpiper]

Thanks for the help guys

 

I think doing it on dry land is definitely the way to go - but until then I will just have a go at nipping it up and see if that helps - but I am not going to have a go at pulling it to bits in the water. 

 

As I mentioned, it's going to get slipped at the end of the year, so I will persevere with it until then - unless it starts getting worse.  Will do the whole kit and kaboodle, packing, new rubber hose and clamps etc. and install a grease nipple.  As I am not sure what size packing to get, I will make that call when I get the old packing out.  Might even replace the cutlass bearing at the same time - goodness knows how old that is - if the freeplay isn't too bad, I might leave it alone and do it next year. 

cheers

Andrew

[Maeling]

Andrew, On my way to Melb at this moment, so can't send you a book.  Will send you an extract on stuffing boxes tonight offline and perhaps contribute some more here.

Geoff Raebel

On Monday, August 17, 2015 at 4:38:55 PM UTC+10, grandpiper wrote:

[Maeling]

In the next few days I will lit a brand new yanmar YSB8 - owner looking for $4000

Geoff Raebel

[Maeling]

Andrew, posted separately to you my section on the 3 types of stern glands and goods & bads.  I have forgotten what city you are in. If Sydney, you can get the teflon plaited rope from them but the first thing you need is a spray can of LANOTECH like WD40 but lanolin based to cut the verdegris  A few pre soaks with this could save a lot of effort.  You will have found access to the gland is near impossible on a C28. This is why some owners have cut a large side port from the quarter berth gland.  If doing so, I would start with 4 x 30ish mm holesaw holes to mark the corners.  This will reduce stress points compared to a square corner.

The photo sent is a rudder packing gland just to be sure the correct type is identified.  It is probably in my text but with packing: lay the rope around the shaft and cut it square across to make a ring that touches itself, make a second. When fitting, the joins should be 180 deg apart.  You need to do the job on a slip or when careened against a wharf even 600mm down the water is at a greater pressure.

Best of luck

Geoff Raebel

[Andrew]

Hi Geoff,
 
Thanks for the info - still keen to get the book as no doubt there is lots of valuable information in there.  I guess the stern gland will be one of many issues that I face on my journey with La Mouette.  I have put myself on the waiting list for a marina berth as it's frustrating trying to do all the little maintenance issues on a slip mooring.  On the to-do list is a few fibreglass repairs, so my learning curve in that area is going to be quite steep - fortunately there are some good resources on You-tube which will be invaluable and the access to power tools from the marina will make life a lot easier.
 
cheers
Andrew
 

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Date: Tue, 18 Aug 2015 01:02:36 -0700
From: scou...@gmail.com
To: compass-y...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Stern Gland Packing has Packed it in

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