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Ivan Shmakov
Feb 2, 2013, 3:56:40 PM2/2/13
to
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
[Cross-posting to news:comp.windows.x, just in case.]
[...]
>> Hah! First other person I've noticed who's admitted to being happy
>> with twm. I use twm with Slackware 10, 11 and 12.1 on 4 desktops.
> Replying quite belatedly ....
> Another (sometimes) twm user here, though I'm not sure I'd claim to
> be happy with it, exactly. I keep using it, on one of my computers,
> out of habit and for the entertainment value of having people look at
> it and say "WHAT is THAT?!" I like that one changes its
> configuration by editing a text file, but I am starting to warm up to
> how much more keyboard-drivable GNOME seems to be. (I say "seems to
> be" because it's possible I just don't know enough about twm .... )
FWIW, I've used TWM almost exclusively for years, until
switching to Openbox c. 2007, for the better
"keyboard-drivability" of the latter. I've also tried FVWM,
which seems to both be more configurable than TWM (and Openbox),
and allow more actions to be bound to keyboard events.
[...]
>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
There /are/ certain advantages in using "text terminal-based"
software. For instance, one doesn't need to struggle against
the font size being too large or too small in some widget: all
the glyphs are equally legible right from the start. One more
point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from anywhere
on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that are
chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you
to copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
And then, there's GNU Screen...
[...]
--
FSF associate member #7257
>>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
[Cross-posting to news:comp.windows.x, just in case.]
[...]
>> Hah! First other person I've noticed who's admitted to being happy
>> with twm. I use twm with Slackware 10, 11 and 12.1 on 4 desktops.
> Replying quite belatedly ....
> Another (sometimes) twm user here, though I'm not sure I'd claim to
> be happy with it, exactly. I keep using it, on one of my computers,
> out of habit and for the entertainment value of having people look at
> it and say "WHAT is THAT?!" I like that one changes its
> configuration by editing a text file, but I am starting to warm up to
> how much more keyboard-drivable GNOME seems to be. (I say "seems to
> be" because it's possible I just don't know enough about twm .... )
FWIW, I've used TWM almost exclusively for years, until
switching to Openbox c. 2007, for the better
"keyboard-drivability" of the latter. I've also tried FVWM,
which seems to both be more configurable than TWM (and Openbox),
and allow more actions to be bound to keyboard events.
[...]
>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
There /are/ certain advantages in using "text terminal-based"
software. For instance, one doesn't need to struggle against
the font size being too large or too small in some widget: all
the glyphs are equally legible right from the start. One more
point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from anywhere
on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that are
chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you
to copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
And then, there's GNU Screen...
[...]
--
FSF associate member #7257
Mike Spencer
Feb 3, 2013, 12:58:45 AM2/3/13
to
Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> writes:
> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
>
> [Cross-posting to news:comp.windows.x, just in case.]
>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>
> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
three or so weeks a year and from an Osborne 1 (!) via dialup or data-pac
to the same workstations for the remainder of the year. So at one
time I was largely on a terminal.
> There /are/ certain advantages in using "text terminal-based"
> software. For instance, one doesn't need to struggle against
> the font size being too large or too small in some widget: all
> the glyphs are equally legible right from the start. One more
> point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from anywhere
> on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that are
> chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
> random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you
> to copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
emacsen in separate windows is a giant leap ahead. The only place
where I've been really annoyed about inability to copy/paste is, very
occasionally, in xpdf where, AFAIK, it's due to a flag in the file
honored by xpdf, not a flaw in xpdf. (Unless honoring the flag is
considered a flaw. :-)
> And then, there's GNU Screen...
(Picky BTW: Aren't you misusing the term "widget" in the paragraph
above? I thought widgets were the graphic X components that are (can
be) used to make up a window: buttons, slider bars etc.)
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
Stan Barr
Feb 3, 2013, 4:49:39 AM2/3/13
to
On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
> >> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>
> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
>
> There /are/ certain advantages in using "text terminal-based"
> software. For instance, one doesn't need to struggle against
> the font size being too large or too small in some widget: all
> the glyphs are equally legible right from the start. One more
> point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from anywhere
> on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that are
> chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
> random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you
> to copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
X allows copying by marking with the left mouse button and pasting
>>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
> >> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>
> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
>
> There /are/ certain advantages in using "text terminal-based"
> software. For instance, one doesn't need to struggle against
> the font size being too large or too small in some widget: all
> the glyphs are equally legible right from the start. One more
> point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from anywhere
> on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that are
> chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
> random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you
> to copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
with the middle one - mostly anyway!
I went to the trouble of building a modern text-only unix box, Linux
kernel 3.7.5 etc. and it's very useable, does everything except
graphics - including playing music. It has a trackball which allows
me to copy/paste text from any login screen to another. (Just getting
to grips with LaTeX, too. Produces nice output...)
>
> And then, there's GNU Screen...
VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
monitor :-(
--
Cheers,
Stan Barr plan.b .at. dsl .dot. pipex .dot. com
The future was never like this!
Ivan Shmakov
Feb 3, 2013, 7:09:54 AM2/3/13
to
>>>>> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>>>>> On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov wrote:
[Cross-posting to news:comp.unix.misc, for there weren't a good
thread in a long time. Somehow, I also feel that it may be
appropriate to eventually drop news:alt.folklore.computers from
Newsgroups: should this thread progress further.]
[...]
>> One more point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from
>> anywhere on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that
>> are chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
>> random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you to
>> copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
> X allows copying by marking with the left mouse button and pasting
> with the middle one - mostly anyway!
No, it doesn't, unless by "mostly" you mean "when explicitly
coded to allow so by the programmer."
For an example: start Firefox, choose "Help", then "About ..."
Here, try to copy the text inside this widget.
Or, there's an even better example: while choosing "Help", try
to copy the contents of the menu itself.
(As for the sensibility of the task, consider that I'm writing a
Firefox manual, or a similar document.)
Anyway, in X, the contents of any window is -- first and
foremost -- a bitmap image. Whether or not there's a "backing
text" for such an image is left solely to the application
programmer's discretion.
(I guess that NeWS was to be different in that respect.)
> I went to the trouble of building a modern text-only unix box, Linux
> kernel 3.7.5 etc. and it's very useable, does everything except
> graphics - including playing music.
Same here. I don't recall any particular trouble, however.
(JFTR: I'm using Debian GNU/Linux "Squeeze" 6.0. Usually, I'd
set one up via a direct debootstrap(8) invocation, not from the
Debian Installer "shell", as I've recently described in [1].)
[1] news:87fw1zb...@violet.siamics.net (part 1)
news:87bocnb...@violet.siamics.net (part 2)
(in Russian, though.)
> It has a trackball which allows me to copy/paste text from any login
> screen to another.
Alternatively, you could use GNU Screen for keyboard-based
"copypasting." Thanks to the support for incremental search,
copying "all the text from here and back to the previous command
prompt" (for example) is especially convenient.
> (Just getting to grips with LaTeX, too. Produces nice output...)
Indeed. Though, as everything else, LaTeX has its deficiencies.
(AIUI, some of them were recently discussed in
news:comp.text.tex.)
Unfortunately, given the sheer amount of extensions coded in "Ye
Good Olde TeX," there's a little chance that the underlying
language itself will ever improve significantly, which is a
prerequisite of addressing some of the existing issues.
>> And then, there's GNU Screen...
> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give
> you VT-style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
(why, under X, I'd typically use a monochrome, Navy Blue on
White UXTerm, -- I don't deem colors to be all that important),
I have never faced a problem with arbitrary terminal sizes.
For instance, the single Screen session I'm typing this text
within is attached to both an 80 x 31 UXTerm, /and/ a 80 x 27
Linux VT -- at the same time. And, as soon as I'd opt to, I can
detach it from either (or both) of them, and re-attach to any
other terminal I'd need to. (It's especially useful given that
I now use four separate machines at home, and keep SSH'ing
between them all the time.)
Then, there's a "screen locking" feature, which lets you lock
the terminal (the Screen session is attached to), yet retain all
the running applications.
After all these years, I'd dub all these features "essential."
>>>>> On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov wrote:
[Cross-posting to news:comp.unix.misc, for there weren't a good
thread in a long time. Somehow, I also feel that it may be
appropriate to eventually drop news:alt.folklore.computers from
Newsgroups: should this thread progress further.]
[...]
>> One more point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from
>> anywhere on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that
>> are chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
>> random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you to
>> copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
> X allows copying by marking with the left mouse button and pasting
> with the middle one - mostly anyway!
coded to allow so by the programmer."
For an example: start Firefox, choose "Help", then "About ..."
Here, try to copy the text inside this widget.
Or, there's an even better example: while choosing "Help", try
to copy the contents of the menu itself.
(As for the sensibility of the task, consider that I'm writing a
Firefox manual, or a similar document.)
Anyway, in X, the contents of any window is -- first and
foremost -- a bitmap image. Whether or not there's a "backing
text" for such an image is left solely to the application
programmer's discretion.
(I guess that NeWS was to be different in that respect.)
> I went to the trouble of building a modern text-only unix box, Linux
> kernel 3.7.5 etc. and it's very useable, does everything except
> graphics - including playing music.
(JFTR: I'm using Debian GNU/Linux "Squeeze" 6.0. Usually, I'd
set one up via a direct debootstrap(8) invocation, not from the
Debian Installer "shell", as I've recently described in [1].)
[1] news:87fw1zb...@violet.siamics.net (part 1)
news:87bocnb...@violet.siamics.net (part 2)
(in Russian, though.)
> It has a trackball which allows me to copy/paste text from any login
> screen to another.
"copypasting." Thanks to the support for incremental search,
copying "all the text from here and back to the previous command
prompt" (for example) is especially convenient.
> (Just getting to grips with LaTeX, too. Produces nice output...)
(AIUI, some of them were recently discussed in
news:comp.text.tex.)
Unfortunately, given the sheer amount of extensions coded in "Ye
Good Olde TeX," there's a little chance that the underlying
language itself will ever improve significantly, which is a
prerequisite of addressing some of the existing issues.
>> And then, there's GNU Screen...
> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give
> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> monitor :-(
While there may be minor issues with colors under GNU Screen
> monitor :-(
(why, under X, I'd typically use a monochrome, Navy Blue on
White UXTerm, -- I don't deem colors to be all that important),
I have never faced a problem with arbitrary terminal sizes.
For instance, the single Screen session I'm typing this text
within is attached to both an 80 x 31 UXTerm, /and/ a 80 x 27
Linux VT -- at the same time. And, as soon as I'd opt to, I can
detach it from either (or both) of them, and re-attach to any
other terminal I'd need to. (It's especially useful given that
I now use four separate machines at home, and keep SSH'ing
between them all the time.)
Then, there's a "screen locking" feature, which lets you lock
the terminal (the Screen session is attached to), yet retain all
the running applications.
After all these years, I'd dub all these features "essential."
Peter Flass
Feb 3, 2013, 9:01:18 AM2/3/13
to
On 2/3/2013 7:09 AM, Ivan Shmakov wrote:
Any text that's displayed on the screen should be capable of being
copied and pasted. 'Doze has the same problem. I can understand
applications like Acrobat, where sometimes an image is being displayed
rather than text, but *help text*?
--
Pete
>>>>>> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>
> > X allows copying by marking with the left mouse button and pasting
> > with the middle one - mostly anyway!
>
> No, it doesn't, unless by "mostly" you mean "when explicitly
> coded to allow so by the programmer."
>
> For an example: start Firefox, choose "Help", then "About ..."
> Here, try to copy the text inside this widget.
This is a pet peeve of mine. The GUI paradigm should operate uniformly.
>
> > X allows copying by marking with the left mouse button and pasting
> > with the middle one - mostly anyway!
>
> No, it doesn't, unless by "mostly" you mean "when explicitly
> coded to allow so by the programmer."
>
> For an example: start Firefox, choose "Help", then "About ..."
> Here, try to copy the text inside this widget.
Any text that's displayed on the screen should be capable of being
copied and pasted. 'Doze has the same problem. I can understand
applications like Acrobat, where sometimes an image is being displayed
rather than text, but *help text*?
--
Pete
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Feb 3, 2013, 9:08:22 AM2/3/13
to
On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen, instead
I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume script which
makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined in an environment
variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do is type resume in each
window to get right back where I was.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
> On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
> > And then, there's GNU Screen...
>
> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> monitor :-(
Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
>
> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> monitor :-(
connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen, instead
I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume script which
makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined in an environment
variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do is type resume in each
window to get right back where I was.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
Dan Espen
Feb 3, 2013, 11:23:55 AM2/3/13
to
Doesn't make sense, it's the underlying terminal that supplies color.
Here's the solution:
https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=67464
--
Dan Espen
Stan Barr
Feb 3, 2013, 12:53:28 PM2/3/13
to
On Sun, 3 Feb 2013 14:08:22 +0000, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
> On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
>
>> > And then, there's GNU Screen...
>>
>> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
>> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
>> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
>> monitor :-(
>
> Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen, instead
> I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume script which
> makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined in an environment
> variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do is type resume in each
> window to get right back where I was.
>
I'll bear that idea in mind, I sometimes ssh in remotely using my Android
> On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
>
>> > And then, there's GNU Screen...
>>
>> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
>> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
>> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
>> monitor :-(
>
> Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen, instead
> I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume script which
> makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined in an environment
> variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do is type resume in each
> window to get right back where I was.
>
tablet.
Aaron W. Hsu
Feb 3, 2013, 1:35:49 PM2/3/13
to
Peter Flass wrote:
> The GUI paradigm should operate uniformly.
> Any text that's displayed on the screen should be capable of being
> copied and pasted. 'Doze has the same problem. I can understand
> applications like Acrobat, where sometimes an image is being displayed
> rather than text, but *help text*?
Just to throw this in there, the Acme environment in Plan9 follows this
> The GUI paradigm should operate uniformly.
> Any text that's displayed on the screen should be capable of being
> copied and pasted. 'Doze has the same problem. I can understand
> applications like Acrobat, where sometimes an image is being displayed
> rather than text, but *help text*?
pattern, where text is a universal means of interacting with the system. All
the text is selectable and can be used to drive commands.
--
Aaron W. Hsu | arc...@sacrideo.us | http://www.sacrideo.us
לֵ֤ב חֲכָמִים֙ בְּבֵ֣ית אֵ֔בֶל וְלֵ֥ב כְּסִילִ֖ים בְּבֵ֥ית שִׂמְחָֽה׃
Stan Barr
Feb 4, 2013, 2:53:53 AM2/4/13
to
On Sun, 03 Feb 2013 11:23:55 -0500, Dan Espen <des...@verizon.net> wrote:
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>
>>
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>
>>
>> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
>> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
>> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
>> monitor :-(
>
> I'm not a "screen" user but no color?
>
> Doesn't make sense, it's the underlying terminal that supplies color.
>
> Here's the solution:
>
> https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=67464
>
>
Many thanks for that! Problem solved...
>> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
>> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
>> monitor :-(
>
> I'm not a "screen" user but no color?
>
> Doesn't make sense, it's the underlying terminal that supplies color.
>
> Here's the solution:
>
> https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=67464
>
>
However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on
my Sun box either.
Christian Brunschen
Feb 4, 2013, 4:01:07 AM2/4/13
to
In article <slrnkgt9o0...@ID-309335.user.uni-berlin.de>,
and in many ways better than screen:
http://tmux.sourceforge.net/
You can find lots of comparisons if you do a search like "screen vs tmux".
Best wishes,
// Christian
Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
>However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
>I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
>these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on
>my Sun box either.
You might also want to investigate 'tmux', which some claim is more modern
>
>However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
>I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
>these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on
>my Sun box either.
and in many ways better than screen:
http://tmux.sourceforge.net/
You can find lots of comparisons if you do a search like "screen vs tmux".
Best wishes,
// Christian
Ivan Shmakov
Feb 4, 2013, 4:49:18 AM2/4/13
to
>>>>> Christian Brunschen <c...@mer.df.lth.se> writes:
>>>>> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
[It seems that this discussion is no longer relevant to either
AFC or X. Hence trying to move it to news:comp.unix.misc,
though I'm open for other suggestions.]
>> However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
>> I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
>> these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on my
>> Sun box either.
> You might also want to investigate 'tmux', which some claim is more
> modern and in many ways better than screen:
> http://tmux.sourceforge.net/
> You can find lots of comparisons if you do a search like "screen vs
> tmux".
Well, as per the resource which came first in the Web search:
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
The following features are specific to tmux and not shared by
GNU Screen.
Vertical splitting
GNU screen has it only as a patch and has not been added to an
official source code.
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Still, the Debian version [1] of Screen has this patch applied.
[1] http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/screen
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Client/Server System
When the first tmux session is created (equivalent to screen -d
-m), a server instance is started automatically, and the session
runs as a client for that server. Further sessions operate as
clients, connecting to the same server instance (equivalent to
screen -x). [...]
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
I don't understand this one. Given that this feature is
"equivalent to" certain Screen commands, how this can be taken
for "this feature is specific to tmux and not shared by
GNU Screen?"
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Synchronize-panes
tmux can duplicate input to any pane to all other panes in the
same window (not available for panes in special mode e. g.
copy-mode). [...]
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Indeed.
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
The following features are specific to GNU Screen and not shared by
tmux.
[...]
attaching to a serial tty
In GNU Screen, you can connect to a serial device (screen -r
/dev/ttyS0 115200.) Tmux does not support this feature.
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
I wonder if this also means that tmux cannot connect to a pseudo
terminal (pty)? I make occasional use of this feature, as I'm
both interested in "virtualized environments" (as in: KVM, QEMU,
UML, etc.), and in "embedded" software development (as in:
interfacing AVR 8-bit MCU's.) As it seems, this one makes tmux
a no-go for me.
>>>>> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
[It seems that this discussion is no longer relevant to either
AFC or X. Hence trying to move it to news:comp.unix.misc,
though I'm open for other suggestions.]
>> However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
>> I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
>> these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on my
>> Sun box either.
> You might also want to investigate 'tmux', which some claim is more
> modern and in many ways better than screen:
> http://tmux.sourceforge.net/
> You can find lots of comparisons if you do a search like "screen vs
> tmux".
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
The following features are specific to tmux and not shared by
GNU Screen.
Vertical splitting
GNU screen has it only as a patch and has not been added to an
official source code.
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Still, the Debian version [1] of Screen has this patch applied.
[1] http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/screen
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Client/Server System
When the first tmux session is created (equivalent to screen -d
-m), a server instance is started automatically, and the session
runs as a client for that server. Further sessions operate as
clients, connecting to the same server instance (equivalent to
screen -x). [...]
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
I don't understand this one. Given that this feature is
"equivalent to" certain Screen commands, how this can be taken
for "this feature is specific to tmux and not shared by
GNU Screen?"
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Synchronize-panes
tmux can duplicate input to any pane to all other panes in the
same window (not available for panes in special mode e. g.
copy-mode). [...]
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
Indeed.
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
The following features are specific to GNU Screen and not shared by
tmux.
[...]
attaching to a serial tty
In GNU Screen, you can connect to a serial device (screen -r
/dev/ttyS0 115200.) Tmux does not support this feature.
--cut: https://www.wikivs.com/wiki/Screen_vs_tmux --
I wonder if this also means that tmux cannot connect to a pseudo
terminal (pty)? I make occasional use of this feature, as I'm
both interested in "virtualized environments" (as in: KVM, QEMU,
UML, etc.), and in "embedded" software development (as in:
interfacing AVR 8-bit MCU's.) As it seems, this one makes tmux
a no-go for me.
Ivan Shmakov
Feb 4, 2013, 5:18:24 AM2/4/13
to
>>>>> Peter Flass <Peter...@Yahoo.com> writes:
>>>>> On 2/3/2013 7:09 AM, Ivan Shmakov wrote:
>>>>> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>>> X allows copying by marking with the left mouse button and pasting
>>> with the middle one - mostly anyway!
>> No, it doesn't, unless by "mostly" you mean "when explicitly coded
>> to allow so by the programmer."
>> For an example: start Firefox, choose "Help", then "About ..."
>> Here, try to copy the text inside this widget.
> This is a pet peeve of mine. The GUI paradigm should operate
> uniformly.
And it does. As long as XTerm is virtually the only X
>>>>> On 2/3/2013 7:09 AM, Ivan Shmakov wrote:
>>>>> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>>> X allows copying by marking with the left mouse button and pasting
>>> with the middle one - mostly anyway!
>> No, it doesn't, unless by "mostly" you mean "when explicitly coded
>> to allow so by the programmer."
>> For an example: start Firefox, choose "Help", then "About ..."
>> Here, try to copy the text inside this widget.
> This is a pet peeve of mine. The GUI paradigm should operate
> uniformly.
application used. (But even then, XTerm's own menus aren't
"copyable...")
> Any text that's displayed on the screen should be capable of being
> copied and pasted.
development of such "copy any text" (and then, "search any
text", too) applications.
So far, I'm yet to try PDCurses. And also Emacs' own engine.
> 'Doze has the same problem.
> I can understand applications like Acrobat, where sometimes an image
> is being displayed rather than text,
raster images by themselves...
> but *help text*?
blmblm.m...@gmail.com
Feb 4, 2013, 8:06:34 AM2/4/13
to
In article <877gmq30...@violet.siamics.net>,
that the matching attribution is gone?)
> There /are/ certain advantages in using "text terminal-based"
> software. For instance, one doesn't need to struggle against
> the font size being too large or too small in some widget: all
> the glyphs are equally legible right from the start. One more
> point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from anywhere
> on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that are
> chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
> random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you
> to copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
>
> And then, there's GNU Screen...
Indeed. (A "sing it, brother!" about consistent text size.)
>
> [...]
>
--
B. L. Massingill
ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor.
Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
>
> [Cross-posting to news:comp.windows.x, just in case.]
>
> [...]
>
> >> Hah! First other person I've noticed who's admitted to being happy
> >> with twm. I use twm with Slackware 10, 11 and 12.1 on 4 desktops.
>
> > Replying quite belatedly ....
>
> > Another (sometimes) twm user here, though I'm not sure I'd claim to
> > be happy with it, exactly. I keep using it, on one of my computers,
> > out of habit and for the entertainment value of having people look at
> > it and say "WHAT is THAT?!" I like that one changes its
> > configuration by editing a text file, but I am starting to warm up to
> > how much more keyboard-drivable GNOME seems to be. (I say "seems to
> > be" because it's possible I just don't know enough about twm .... )
>
> FWIW, I've used TWM almost exclusively for years, until
> switching to Openbox c. 2007, for the better
> "keyboard-drivability" of the latter. I've also tried FVWM,
> which seems to both be more configurable than TWM (and Openbox),
> and allow more actions to be bound to keyboard events.
>
> [...]
>
> >> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
> >> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>
> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
(Just for the record -- I'm not the one who said that, and it appears
> >>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
>
> [Cross-posting to news:comp.windows.x, just in case.]
>
> [...]
>
> >> Hah! First other person I've noticed who's admitted to being happy
> >> with twm. I use twm with Slackware 10, 11 and 12.1 on 4 desktops.
>
> > Replying quite belatedly ....
>
> > Another (sometimes) twm user here, though I'm not sure I'd claim to
> > be happy with it, exactly. I keep using it, on one of my computers,
> > out of habit and for the entertainment value of having people look at
> > it and say "WHAT is THAT?!" I like that one changes its
> > configuration by editing a text file, but I am starting to warm up to
> > how much more keyboard-drivable GNOME seems to be. (I say "seems to
> > be" because it's possible I just don't know enough about twm .... )
>
> FWIW, I've used TWM almost exclusively for years, until
> switching to Openbox c. 2007, for the better
> "keyboard-drivability" of the latter. I've also tried FVWM,
> which seems to both be more configurable than TWM (and Openbox),
> and allow more actions to be bound to keyboard events.
>
> [...]
>
> >> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
> >> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>
> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
that the matching attribution is gone?)
> There /are/ certain advantages in using "text terminal-based"
> software. For instance, one doesn't need to struggle against
> the font size being too large or too small in some widget: all
> the glyphs are equally legible right from the start. One more
> point is that one can "copypaste" a span of text from anywhere
> on the text VT screen, and not just from the widgets that are
> chosen to allow for such by the programmer. (Check, e. g., a
> random X application's "About" widget: rarely it will allow you
> to copy its contents into another program all that easily.)
>
> And then, there's GNU Screen...
>
> [...]
>
--
B. L. Massingill
ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor.
blmblm.m...@gmail.com
Feb 4, 2013, 8:08:14 AM2/4/13
to
In article <20130203140822.c833...@eircom.net>,
session portable if you want to start something when connected
from one place and finish from another.
"named screen sessions" .... Cool! A feature I didn't know about.
Plus there's the (keyboard-drivable) copy-and-paste, which I often
find useful.
Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
> On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
>
> > > And then, there's GNU Screen...
> >
> > I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> > VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> > 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> > monitor :-(
>
> Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen, instead
> I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume script which
> makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined in an environment
> variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do is type resume in each
> window to get right back where I was.
>
>
"jbex"? <pause to Google> .... Ah. Yes, and it also makes the
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
>
> > > And then, there's GNU Screen...
> >
> > I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> > VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> > 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> > monitor :-(
>
> Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen, instead
> I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume script which
> makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined in an environment
> variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do is type resume in each
> window to get right back where I was.
>
>
session portable if you want to start something when connected
from one place and finish from another.
"named screen sessions" .... Cool! A feature I didn't know about.
Plus there's the (keyboard-drivable) copy-and-paste, which I often
find useful.
blmblm.m...@gmail.com
Feb 4, 2013, 8:09:06 AM2/4/13
to
In article <ic38xdj...@home.home>, Dan Espen <des...@verizon.net> wrote:
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>
> > On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
[ snip ]
> Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
>
> > On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >> And then, there's GNU Screen...
> >
> > I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> > VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> > 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> > monitor :-(
>
> I'm not a "screen" user but no color?
>
> Doesn't make sense, it's the underlying terminal that supplies color.
>
> Here's the solution:
>
> https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=67464
>
used (RedHat and derivatives) "screen" on either a virtual console
or in an xterm displays colors out of the box.
blmblm.m...@gmail.com
Feb 4, 2013, 8:11:47 AM2/4/13
to
> On Sun, 03 Feb 2013 11:23:55 -0500, Dan Espen <des...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
> >
> >>
> >> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> >> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> >> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> >> monitor :-(
> >
> > I'm not a "screen" user but no color?
> >
> > Doesn't make sense, it's the underlying terminal that supplies color.
> >
> > Here's the solution:
> >
> > https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=67464
> >
> >
>
> Many thanks for that! Problem solved...
>
> However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
> I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
> these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on
> my Sun box either.
>
Bug or feature, it does seem to be specific to elinks. I also find
> > Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> writes:
> >
> >>
> >> I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> >> VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> >> 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> >> monitor :-(
> >
> > I'm not a "screen" user but no color?
> >
> > Doesn't make sense, it's the underlying terminal that supplies color.
> >
> > Here's the solution:
> >
> > https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=67464
> >
> >
>
> Many thanks for that! Problem solved...
>
> However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
> I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
> these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on
> my Sun box either.
>
it annoying, and your post motivated me ....
Aha. Apparently elinks doesn't use the terminfo database (which IMO
is the proper way to deal with different terminal types). *HOWEVER!*
it apparently can be configured to use color in screen sessions ....
If you bring up the "Setup" menu and choose "Terminal Options",
you get something where you can say you want color (for whatever
terminal type you're running when you start the program).
Seems to be working here .... "Thanks!" ?
Ivan Shmakov
Feb 4, 2013, 8:35:41 AM2/4/13
to
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
[...]
>>>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
>>>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
> (Just for the record -- I'm not the one who said that, and it appears
> that the matching attribution is gone?)
It isn't, see the fourth (originally: second) line from the top.
>>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
[...]
>>>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
>>>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
> (Just for the record -- I'm not the one who said that, and it appears
> that the matching attribution is gone?)
blmblm.m...@gmail.com
Feb 4, 2013, 8:52:35 AM2/4/13
to
In article <876228y...@violet.siamics.net>,
think there's much controversy ...." comment wasn't mine, and I think
the attribution for that sentence really is gone? since it wasn't you
or me that said it?
Probably not important, just sayin'!
Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> >>>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
> >>>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>
> >> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
>
> > (Just for the record -- I'm not the one who said that, and it appears
> > that the matching attribution is gone?)
>
> It isn't, see the fourth (originally: second) line from the top.
>
Maybe I didn't say that in the clearest way -- I meant that the "I don't
> >>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
> >>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> >>>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
> >>>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla console.)
>
> >> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
>
> > (Just for the record -- I'm not the one who said that, and it appears
> > that the matching attribution is gone?)
>
> It isn't, see the fourth (originally: second) line from the top.
>
think there's much controversy ...." comment wasn't mine, and I think
the attribution for that sentence really is gone? since it wasn't you
or me that said it?
Probably not important, just sayin'!
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Feb 4, 2013, 8:45:12 AM2/4/13
to
On 4 Feb 2013 13:08:14 GMT
found on google :)
blm...@myrealbox.com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
> In article <20130203140822.c833...@eircom.net>,
> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
> > On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
> > Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
> >
> > > > And then, there's GNU Screen...
> > >
> > > I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> > > VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> > > 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> > > monitor :-(
> >
> > Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> > connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen,
> > instead I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume
> > script which makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined
> > in an environment variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do
> > is type resume in each window to get right back where I was.
> >
> >
>
> "jbex"? <pause to Google> .... Ah. Yes, and it also makes the
Ooops - ROT13 involved - means work. I dread to think what you
> In article <20130203140822.c833...@eircom.net>,
> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
> > On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
> > Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Sat, 02 Feb 2013 20:56:40 +0000, Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com>
> >
> > > > And then, there's GNU Screen...
> > >
> > > I prefer multiple terminal sessions 'cos screen only seems to give you
> > > VT- style terminals and I need colour and run an odd screen size -
> > > 128x52 - as I can't find a 132 column font that's readable on my lcd
> > > monitor :-(
> >
> > Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> > connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen,
> > instead I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume
> > script which makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined
> > in an environment variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do
> > is type resume in each window to get right back where I was.
> >
> >
>
> "jbex"? <pause to Google> .... Ah. Yes, and it also makes the
found on google :)
Ivan Shmakov
Feb 4, 2013, 11:58:03 AM2/4/13
to
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
[...]
>>>>>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
>>>>>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla
>>>>>> console.)
>>>> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
>>> (Just for the record -- I'm not the one who said that, and it
>>> appears that the matching attribution is gone?)
>> It isn't, see the fourth (originally: second) line from the top.
> Maybe I didn't say that in the clearest way -- I meant that the "I
> don't think there's much controversy ...." comment wasn't mine, and I
> think the attribution for that sentence really is gone? since it
> wasn't you or me that said it?
And now, it's on the sixth line. (Matching the six GREATER-THAN
>>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> Ivan Shmakov <onei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> blmblm@myrealbox com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
[...]
>>>>>> (I don't think there's much controversy over whether or not a
>>>>>> windowing environment has great advantages over vanilla
>>>>>> console.)
>>>> Huh? I'm using a text VT quite extensively.
>>> (Just for the record -- I'm not the one who said that, and it
>>> appears that the matching attribution is gone?)
>> It isn't, see the fourth (originally: second) line from the top.
> Maybe I didn't say that in the clearest way -- I meant that the "I
> don't think there's much controversy ...." comment wasn't mine, and I
> think the attribution for that sentence really is gone? since it
> wasn't you or me that said it?
SIGN's which precede the quoted text itself.) Which reads:
>>>>> In article <878v815...@nudel.nodomain.nowhere>, Mike Spencer wrote:
> Probably not important, just sayin'!
lines. So, one may think that it /is/ important for me.
Ivan Shmakov
Feb 4, 2013, 12:03:09 PM2/4/13
to
>>>>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> writes:
>>>>> blm...@myrealbox.com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
[Dropping news:comp.windows.x from Followup-To:.]
[...]
>> "jbex"? <pause to Google> .... Ah.
[...]
> Ooops - ROT13 involved - means work. I dread to think what you found
> on Google :)
I don't know about the Google Search, but http://duckduckgo.com/
leads to the ROT13 explanation from the first results' page.
>>>>> blm...@myrealbox.com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
[Dropping news:comp.windows.x from Followup-To:.]
[...]
>> "jbex"? <pause to Google> .... Ah.
> Ooops - ROT13 involved - means work. I dread to think what you found
I don't know about the Google Search, but http://duckduckgo.com/
leads to the ROT13 explanation from the first results' page.
Stan Barr
Feb 4, 2013, 1:08:11 PM2/4/13
to
blmblm.m...@gmail.com
Feb 5, 2013, 9:53:57 AM2/5/13
to
In article <20130204134512.0c2b...@eircom.net>,
> > > Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> > > connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen,
> > > instead I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume
> > > script which makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined
> > > in an environment variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do
> > > is type resume in each window to get right back where I was.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > "jbex"? <pause to Google> .... Ah. Yes, and it also makes the
>
> Ooops - ROT13 involved - means work. I dread to think what you
> found on google :)
>
Actually the first hit when I searched for "define:jbex" was
http://www.ntalk.org/jbex.htm
which makes it clear enough -- for someone who knows about ROT13 anyway.
"You never know" ?
Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
> On 4 Feb 2013 13:08:14 GMT
> blm...@myrealbox.com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <20130203140822.c833...@eircom.net>,
> > Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
> > > On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
[ snip ]
> On 4 Feb 2013 13:08:14 GMT
> blm...@myrealbox.com <blmblm.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <20130203140822.c833...@eircom.net>,
> > Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
> > > On 3 Feb 2013 09:49:39 GMT
> > > Screen really shines when jbexing remotely with likely loss of
> > > connection. I tend not to use the multi-session support in screen,
> > > instead I have a bunch of named screen sessions running and a resume
> > > script which makes the ssh connection and resumes the session defined
> > > in an environment variable. So when I lose connection all I have to do
> > > is type resume in each window to get right back where I was.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > "jbex"? <pause to Google> .... Ah. Yes, and it also makes the
>
> Ooops - ROT13 involved - means work. I dread to think what you
> found on google :)
>
http://www.ntalk.org/jbex.htm
which makes it clear enough -- for someone who knows about ROT13 anyway.
"You never know" ?
Uncle Steve
Feb 5, 2013, 10:32:21 AM2/5/13
to
On Mon, Feb 04, 2013 at 06:08:11PM +0000, Stan Barr wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 09:01:07 +0000 (UTC), Christian Brunschen <c...@mer.df.lth.se> wrote:
> > In article <slrnkgt9o0...@ID-309335.user.uni-berlin.de>,
> > Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
> >>I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
> >>these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on
> >>my Sun box either.
> >
> > You might also want to investigate 'tmux', which some claim is more modern
> > and in many ways better than screen:
> >
> > http://tmux.sourceforge.net/
> >
> > You can find lots of comparisons if you do a search like "screen vs tmux".
>
> I'll certainly ivestigate that.
Screen is wonderful. My bash startup scripts launch it automatically,
> On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 09:01:07 +0000 (UTC), Christian Brunschen <c...@mer.df.lth.se> wrote:
> > In article <slrnkgt9o0...@ID-309335.user.uni-berlin.de>,
> > Stan Barr <pla...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>However still no colour in elinks under screen - probably the reason
> >>I abandoned screen originally - I forget, the old brain gets tired
> >>these days :-( Must be an elinks bug, it wouldn't do colour on
> >>my Sun box either.
> >
> > You might also want to investigate 'tmux', which some claim is more modern
> > and in many ways better than screen:
> >
> > http://tmux.sourceforge.net/
> >
> > You can find lots of comparisons if you do a search like "screen vs tmux".
>
> I'll certainly ivestigate that.
and will resume a detached session by default. Screen allows you to
call a script to generate the status line text; I've written a stupid
little program to display TOD, hostname, battery charge, temperature,
cpu frequency, load average, running/waiting processes, Free memory,
cached memory, and swap usage. It runs every twenty seconds and gives
that invaluable insight into what the running system is doing at any
given time.
I also log every session with a unique filename, so essentially
everything I read or write in a terminal window is logged. (Obviously
this includes passwords, so I'm fairly careful with those logs.) Five
or so years ago I identified a glaring shortcoming to such logs: they
give no indication of the temporal location of any given entry. While
my bash prompt includes command sequence number and time, that is only
a partial solution. I patched the log function in screen to issue
packets including a timestamp and record length so now I can
theoretically playback any given terminal session like a movie. I say
'theoretically' because I haven't yet gotten around to writing the
player.
I'll leave it to your imaginations to think of how much potentially
useful information is included in such logs.
Regards,
Uncle Steve
--
More than a century has passed since science laid down sound
propositions as to the origins of the universe, but how many have
mastered them or possess the really scientific spirit of criticism? A
few thousands at the outside, who are lost in the midst of hundreds of
millions still steeped in prejudices and superstitions worthy of
savages, who are consequently ever ready to serve as puppets for
religious impostors. -- Peter Kropotkin
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