Brandon Hume - hume -> BOFH.Ca, http://WWW.BOFH.Ca/
AFAIK, Dennis was doing some maintenance on the web server - I'll ping
an email to the maintainers list and see what's up...
The site has a page up that says all assets are frozen until further
It's a bit of a strange front page. Someone has a sense of humor, which
I can't say is too closely aligned with mine. Very odd.
Sounds like kindergarden. But with Dennis gone, I'm sure Phil has the
normal operations restored within days. - But the ,,blastwave.org''
domains is gone, I guess.
Legal representation for the affairs of Blastwave.org Inc. are
handled by Deeth Williams Wall LLP in Toronto Canada. ( DWW.com )
There are more informations available to me but I told the persons that
I keep them for myself.
I think your guesses are mostly on-track.
Looks like Dennis no longer wishes to make the "blastwave.org" domain
available to the team of non-profit volunteers who wish to continue
doing CSW packaging, unless he can control business access to it.
He has revoked use of his domain from us. So, we are forced to look
elsewhere. I'm starting discussion for a new domain to use, on the
"CSW packaging" shall indeed resume in a few days(well probably more
like a week)
once we get fixed on a new domain name, etc.
stay tuned :)
For CSW packages, see http://www.suncsw.de.
> If you check osol-discuss at opensolaris.org you'll see that he made
> some comments and it seems that he has been engaged by a legal firm
> due to license/copyright infringements. This is all speculation
this is the usual bullshit that comes out of Dennis mouth. Just ignore
it. His primary objective was to make money out of blastwave. That will
never happen (because CSW is software packaged by the community for free
and because noone would ever buy it in a way that it is profitable for
Dennis). What we saw yesterday was done because he is highly frustrated.
It is not the first time Dennis did that and he screwed around with a
lot of people in the past, but this times it seems that he has to face
the consequences by getting kicked out of the community. From my point
of view this should have happened a long time ago. But the people
tolerated the behaviour of this madman and let him in charge of to many
assets (for example DNS domains). As a consequence a lot of people left
the project - as least that is what I heard and experienced.
yes, it's temporary for now. It is unclear what the new, long-term
domain will be.
There wont be any package updates for a while. (week or two?)
[although if you want to give feedback on the look of the website,
that's fine :) I'm very happy that I managed to get our bugtracking
system updated and working again, after way too long :( ]
So, at this point, just keep your pkg-get configs exactly where they
pointed to a few days ago, and please be patient.
When we (the actual people behind CSW packaging, rather than "the
owner of the blastwave.org domain") get an official, long-term-safe
domain name to use, then we'll post where to update from.
reading all this really makes me sad, but it also shows that you have
absolutely no idea of what you're talking about
just to clear some things up, Dennis never indented to make money out of
blastwave with his recent actions, did you ever ask yourself what
happens with blastwave when he's not there anymore (he provides all the
machines and connectivity after all)
so creating a blastwave trademark and transferring it to a community
makes sense to me, he also stated that he doesn't want to work on the
old Solaris 8 cruft anymore (who's still using Solaris 8 x86 anyway?)
and want's to move ahead (OpenSolaris/IPS stuff)
so I'm looking forward for seeing fresh pkgs for Solaris 10 and
OpenSolaris from Dennis/blastwave :)
Anil Gadre and company's marketing wonks have the best data on
usage of EOLd, legacy supported, currently supported and
shipping Solaris versions, and currently shipping (Open)Solaris
but they're not telling.
Depending on how much client data pkg_get spews to Blastwave or
other CSW package sources, they might be able to make a good
guess of usage of CSW packages on different Solaris versions from
their access_log and agent_log's.
I'm not sure you can infer a whole lot from the preferences of
CSW package maintainers which I suspect tend to resemble developers
and more likely use leading edge development platforms.
Again, Anil Gadre and company's marketing wonks probably have good
data on (Open)Solaris package maintainers, developers, and ISVs
and how their preferences relate to the preferences of Sun's customers,
but I haven't seen it summarized in a way a JAVA stockholder might
For the record, Thomas joined up, in 2003, and was a highly dedicated
maintainer, until at least mid-2005 or later. One of the best we ever
had, and one of the few "early maintainers", that truely knows some of
the early history, that is buried in the "private" mail archives (some
of which might even be not even archived any more) So he has more
right than some, to have a claim to know what he's talking about.
and Dennis is what? a nobody? Like I said, you guys did never mention in
this thread how much heart and soul Dennis put into Blastwave and you
also never said that you appreciated the countless hours and all the
infrastructure Dennis put into/provided for Blastwave; instead you're
just ranting and telling things from a very blinkered view :(
> and Dennis is what? a nobody? Like I said, you guys did never mention
> in this thread how much heart and soul Dennis put into Blastwave and
> you also never said that you appreciated the countless hours and all
> the infrastructure Dennis put into/provided for Blastwave; instead
> you're just ranting and telling things from a very blinkered view :(
I'm happy to see there are still people out there who -DO- know how to
give credit. Ranting is much easier and seen a lot more between humans.
A 'hear hear' for your mails!
Dick Hoogendijk -- PGP/GnuPG key: 01D2433D
++ http://nagual.nl/ | SunOS 10u5 05/08 ++
> > For the record, Thomas joined up, in 2003, and was a highly dedicated
> > maintainer, until at least mid-2005 or later.... So he has more
> > right than some, to have a claim to know what he's talking about.
> and Dennis is what? a nobody? Like I said, you guys did never mention in
> this thread how much heart and soul Dennis put into Blastwave and you
> also never said that you appreciated the countless hours and all the
> infrastructure Dennis put into/provided for Blastwave; instead you're
> just ranting and telling things from a very blinkered view :(
You dont know much more about Dennis, other than what HE HIMSELF has
You have zero first-hand knowlege. You dont think that's a "very
Dennis "donated" hardware and bandwidth: == "good"
Dennis thought that entitled him to OWN the project: == "bad".
There's a lot more I could say, but I'll leave it at that.
I'm really new man here, but have anyone from you tried pkgsrc to
compile sw on solaris.
It is completely open-source project, developed by NetBSD developers.
You can run it on
Solaris, Mac OS X, Aix, Irix, Linux and other OSes.
Agreed. Own your own pkg system locally with pkgsrc or start a new
blastwave easily with pkgsrc.
Blastwave.org is all working fine now, and probably
has been for some time now.
I myself just used it to install something, and it worked
NOTE: You do have to get a new pgp key.
The "why" for the need for the new pgp key is *very much* related
to what happened and to why he was forced to pause operations for repairs.
As I understand it, the site got hacked (that might well
not be quite the correct word, but whatever did happen,
the effect is much the same), and he's been working
his tail off to recover from it.
Eventually he'll tell us more, but for now he's trying
to not make too many waves. My understanding is
that he may eventually be forced to take some legal action.
As I understand it, he's put a whole lot of money into blastwave out of
his own pocket and bank account, and perhaps even *more* than that. :-(
And support from Sun? I gather they're putting their own
money behnd sunfreeware. ("Not Invented Here" is apparantely
a *real* downer among the sun higher-ups!)
To me that's just yet another reason to ask "what the hell do those
people at sun think they're doing!"
I think they maybe do supply blastwave some hardware (and software).
Could I perhaps be correct in inferring from the above that this guy
is thinking of taking advantage of whatever hacking (or worse, maybe much
worse) that befell blastwave.org to perhaps set himself up
in competition to Dennis and blastwave.org?
Taking advantage of disasters seems to be popular these days,
at least here in America...
Myself, I'm sticking with Dennis and "his" blastwave.org.
Now, I don't know about you guys, but for myself,
I don't think I'd feel quite right, deep down, doing anything
I agree with but a single of the above statements, which is:
(Please note that I removed his (telling?) ":)".)
> Could I perhaps be correct in inferring from the above that this guy
> is thinking of taking advantage of whatever hacking (or worse, maybe much
> worse) that befell blastwave.org to perhaps set himself up
> in competition to Dennis and blastwave.org?
Before showing yourself to be even more foolish, please look up who did
found blastwave.org. Hint, it was not only Dennis.
> Myself, I'm sticking with Dennis and "his" blastwave.org.
Your post shows that you dont understand the history of the packages
that you have enjoyed using so much up until now :-}
"This guy", (ie: me, Philip Brown) is the actual founder of CSW
Dennis, was an original sponsor of it, providing hardware, and a
However, CSW packaging was never "his".
He sure TALKED a lot like it was, in public. but the only thing that
"belonged" to him, were the domain name, and the hardware.
He liked to talk as though "blastwave.org" and the CSW packaging
project, were interchangable, and synonymous. Which then gave people
the *impression*, that he owned/controlled/invented CSW packaging,
since he did actually own "blastwave.org".
However, this is most definitely not the case.
There are/were multiple "projects at blastwave.org". CSW was one of
them. However, it was not one that Dennis "owned".
I have run it ever since I started it.
If you doubt this, then doing a little research on older versions of
the website, with sites such as archive.org, will hopefully clear up
For example, comparing the various incarnations of the "about page":
It's a bit tough to wade through all the neck-deep misdirection:
Dennis made some of the versions rather murky.
But some of them still show a little more clarity.
Such as the "history" section, shown on this archived version:
The "blastwave.org" site and build servers were born out of a
movement which had little in the way of resources. In the
Phil Brown set up *his* pkg-get software repository and *his*
initial set of
about 50-100 packages. [...]
Hopefully, you have a clearer view now, of what belongs to Dennis,and
what does not.
Here's something else I've learned:
There's apparantely a he-said/she-said conflict in the description
of "what happened" and "whose fault".
I *think* I have this right:
Phil Brown complains that the cause of all this grief was
that Dennis Clarke took-down "Blastwave". That it was only
AFTER THAT, and in reaction to it (for benefit of sun customers)
did whatever he has done to set up an alternate service.
Dennis Clarke says that Phil Brown et al "took" software, etc
from blastwave-computers, and made other software unavailable
to him (whithout which he couldn't operate blastwave's services?),
and it was ONLY AFTER THAT that he took down blastwave, as a
way of protecting what was left, and so that he could in a few
days recover and then go back "on the air".
So it's a question of who did what WHEN.
actually, it's a question of what is true, and what is not. Plus some
facts that you are missing.
(Note: What i write, is related to the LATEST problems with Dennis
over the July-Sept 2008 timeframe. It does not address the problems
that he caused earlier this year, when again, he tried to remove
support for solaris 8 in future packages, and brought things to a halt
for a while then as well.)
Any actual CSW maintainers at the time (july-aug 2008), can tell you
that what you wrote (and attributed to Dennis), is not true.
"took", implies that I somehow "removed" things or disabled things
that he could previously use, from his servers. This is not true.
It might also imply that I somehow "copied without permission". This
is also not true. Dennis has no intellectual property rights to the
things I copied.
What IS true, and that you dont mention, however, is that Dennis
claimed that those people who were interested in continuing to work on
solaris 8 packages, could do so, under the domain name
"csw.blastwave.org", without any interference from him.
We had all come to an agreement, including Dennis, that those who
wished to focus on "solaris 10 and upward" packages, would work on a
"new" project in the blastwave domain, whereas those people interested
in keeping full solaris 8 compatibility, would work on "CSW".
This was supposed to be a parallel but cooperative effort. People
could work on either, or both, as they chose. Dennis had made it clear
that he was not interested in solaris 8 (and considered it a waste of
time), and was going to focus on sol10+ packages. I, in my turn, had
made it clear that I was going to focus on csw.blastwave.org, and
ignore the new project.
He then reneged on his word, when it became clear to him, that we
expected him to live up to his word, and have no control over or
involvement with machines involved in the project . We used machines
outside Dennis's control to build csw.blastwave.org, to ensure that he
could not repeat the mess he made back in may 2008.
When we made it clear that he was going to have no access to them...
*THAT* is when he shut down blastwave.org:
when we made it clear that he was no longer going to have the power to
try to force things his way, by dint of him controlling the build
machine hardware and web server related to the project.
He had previously agreed that the "main" www.blastwave.org webserver,
would have top-level references to the webserver at
csw.blastwave.org. he never followed through on that either. Rather,
when the time came to do that, and he saw the webserver we had running
there, and saw how fully complete and independant of his control it
was... he chose to exert the only "control" he had left, and yank the
csw.blastwave.org DNS name from us.
There was nothing stopping him from continuing with his planned new
solaris 10 focused packaging efforts.
He is the one that shut US down.
Dennis has apparrently thrown around accusations of "slander" against
me. The ultimate defense against slander is the truth.
Any blastwave maintainer at the time, can corroborate that what I have
said here is true.
Furthermore, if Dennis would like to give permision to publically
reproduce what he wrote on the internal maintainers list, I and others
would be happy to post the copies of the list emails that we have, as
This is not an impossible to solve "my word against his" situation. I
can PROVE that what I have said is true, by many witnesses, and his
> Sounds like someone on some legal team needs to sue the pants of this
> guy and take EVERYTHING he owns--house, land, car, wife/husband, and
For the avoidance of doubt, who is "this guy"? The person you quoted
(Phil), or Dennis?
Rich Teer, SCSA, SCNA, SCSECA
My Online Home Inventory
> actually, it's a question of what is true, and what is not.
This may only highlight my ineptitude with search engines but I wonder
why you haven't submitted a clear and concise account of all this
somewhere so prominent that the interested user base can't miss it
(even opencsw.org). Whether or not anyone believes his account, Dennis
has at least made an effort to do this. No doubt your first loyalty
lies with like-minded package maintainers, but I imagine you must be
mightily pissed off by now with the legions of frustrated end users
speculatively taking sides based upon random of paragraphs of sniping
between both parties. As someone recently said, maybe you just don't
This is helpful.
Wouldn't you rather see some harmony and parallel development for the
S8-S10 and S11+ brigades?
That's good advice.
It would appear that Blastwave "may" die due to this situation. The
trust that customers had in the project should be checked at the door
now. Only time will tell for sure weather it survives. It's truly a
shame that a good project like Blastwave has turned ugly. Everything
is not perfect in the Open Source community after all. I'm sure it's
quite the balancing act when people are involved. That's why man
created contracts, licenses, and signed agreements.
Some companies may have been relying on this Blastwave service to
enhance the capabilities of Solaris, an already great operating
system, no matter what version they are using. The simple fact is
that if the part is true about Phil not wanting to move ahead with
Solaris 10 & 11 then he could be considered an very cranky old geek
indeed. (Who really knows, other than them and the roaches). Solaris
8 is completely dead in my eyes and Solaris 9 is nearly there as
well. We must move on, we will move on; with our without
Blastwave.Org and its bickering maintainers.
Some IT staff may find it too difficult to continue their support on
Solaris due to the lack of a good open source service provider. They
WILL move on to one of the many Linux distros. It appears that even
the Sparc processor is on it's way out the door, even though the T2
and Rock processors have and will continue to challenge the
competitors. The new Sparcs are very appealing to web/DB services.
Some admins don't have the luxury (time) to figure out how to get the
multitude of packages to play nice together. Sometimes the skillset
is not there, due to many reasons we can all relate to, if we check
our arrogance. Let's face facts, it's getting more difficult to find
talented UNIX admins and engineers. No wonder companies continue to
flock to Microsoft Windows and Linux.
This kind of crap with Blastwave will only compound the problems Sun
is having. It's a real shame too. We may find ourselves without
Solaris someday. It may just be in the history books. I'm a huge
supporter of Solaris on Sparc. There's no better way to do it
IMHO. I have limited skill-sets myself (who doesn't... really?), and
I'm considered one of the best in my area for Solaris; only because
most have moved to a Microsoft Windows flavor. The Blastwaves, and
Sun Freewares of the world has helped me and my customers over the
years to succeed in their business plans. We, the Solaris admins,
will do our best to continue the fight, but the future looks dim at
the moment for anything Sun Microsystems. A Linux flavor, though not
perfect themselves, is appealing at times, especially dealing with
Open Source Software and the complexities it brings to the table.
It's getting harder and harder to find verdors willing to build or
even port their software to Solaris.
We can't leave this for Sun to fix, they have their own issues
supporting what they have and keeping employees employed.
Just my thoughts.
Long live Solaris.
It looks like much of what was blastwave (and its mirrors) moved
Blastwave itself came back online too after that, but I don't
know what the status of that is now.
I haven't tried downloading or updating anything since the split.
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]