blackboard bold semicolon
Art Werschulz
I am trying to produce a blackboard bold semicolon. My test file is as
follows:
<testfile>
\documentclass[12pt]{article}
\usepackage{amsfonts}
\begin{document}
$R{\mathbb{;}}S$ and $R;S$ should look different (the semicolon should
be blackboard bold and normal, respectively). Also, look at
$\mathbb{R;S}$ and $R;S$ the complete math expressions should be
blackboard bold and normal, respectively).
\end{document}
</testfile>
Following the advice in the "Comprehensive LaTeX Symbol List", I have
tried this using the amsfonts, amssymb, txfonts, pxfonts, mathbbol, bbm,
and dsfont packages (with the variant versions of the \mathbb command).
I didn't try the bbol or mbboard packages, since they are not installed.
None of these produced a blackboard bold semicolon---just the normal
semicolon.
Note that the blackboard bold semicolon showed up ok in "tex testfont",
using bbold10 (or bbold17) as the test font.
Any idea what I'm doing wrong here? Thanks.
--
Art Werschulz (8-{)} "Metaphors be with you." -- bumper sticker
GCS/M (GAT): d? -p+ c++ l u+(-) e--- m* s n+ h f g+ w+ t++ r- y?
Internet: agw STRUDEL comcast.net
Ulrike Fischer
> Hi.
>
> I am trying to produce a blackboard bold semicolon.
Is this what you want?
\documentclass[12pt]{article}
\usepackage{amsfonts,bm}
\begin{document}
$R;\bm{;}S$
\end{document}
--
Ulrike Fischer
Robin Fairbairns
>I am trying to produce a blackboard bold semicolon. My test file is as
>follows:
>
><testfile>
>\documentclass[12pt]{article}
>\usepackage{amsfonts}
>
>\begin{document}
>$R{\mathbb{;}}S$ and $R;S$ should look different (the semicolon should
>be blackboard bold and normal, respectively). Also, look at
>$\mathbb{R;S}$ and $R;S$ the complete math expressions should be
>blackboard bold and normal, respectively).
>\end{document}
></testfile>
>
>Following the advice in the "Comprehensive LaTeX Symbol List", I have
>tried this using the amsfonts, amssymb, txfonts, pxfonts, mathbbol, bbm,
>and dsfont packages (with the variant versions of the \mathbb command).
>I didn't try the bbol or mbboard packages, since they are not installed.
>
>None of these produced a blackboard bold semicolon---just the normal
>semicolon.
>
>Note that the blackboard bold semicolon showed up ok in "tex testfont",
>using bbold10 (or bbold17) as the test font.
>
>Any idea what I'm doing wrong here? Thanks.
i _think_ it's only bbold that has semicolons, so you need to use
those fonts. since you're not _getting_ bbold, i assume you've not
loaded the bbold package. (since the package comes with the fonts in
the distributions i can see -- miktex, tex-life and old tetex, if you
can look at the fonts with testfont, you've presumably got bbold.sty.)
note that bbold seems only to be available as metafont source, so the
output won't look good in sufficiently old versions of adobe reader,
and some printers simply won't accept it.
--
Robin Fairbairns, Cambridge
Dan
No. The semicolon won't be blackboard bold even if bbold.sty
is used. The problem is in the definition of \mathbb; it will
switch all _letters_ to use the bbold font. Internally, a _letter_
is a character with a \mathcode of the form "7xxx, and typically
only letters or letter-like symbols have this kind of code.
The first digit of the mathcode of a character usually represents
the type of math atom it is (0 for \mathord, 3 for \mathrel, 6 for
\mathpunct, etc.) The 7 represents \mathord but with the added
capability of being able to shift families. Since the semicolon
has the \mathcode 603B it is constrained to be a \mathpunct
from family 0, and resides in slot 0x3B.
I don't know of any meaning assigned to a blackboard bold
semicolon, and I find it hard to even see how it could be legibly
written on a blackboard, so I suspect that the correct answer is:
don't change the semicolon at all. This is especially true if the
semicolon in
$\mathbb{R;S}$
has the same meaning as the one in
$A;B$.
This is not a matter of making the fonts match. A change of
math font will typically imply a change of meaning.
That said, if it really is needed, load the mathbbol package
instead of the bbold package and try the following
\DeclareMathSymbol{\bbsemicolon}{\mathpunct}{bbold}{"3B}
Then you can use "\bbsemicolon" instead of ";" where needed.
Of course, you can replace the name \bbsemicolon if that is too
much to type. If the semicolon has some other function than
punctuation, the \mathpunct may need to be replaced with
something else.
Dan
Art Werschulz
I received a lot of good suggestions, which I tested out:
<snip>
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{amssymb}
\usepackage{mathbbol}
\usepackage{bbold}
\usepackage{mathtime}
\DeclareMathSymbol{\bbsemicolon}{\mathpunct}{bbold}{"3B}
\newcommand{\covr}{\mathrel{\hbox{\textbb{;}}}}
\newcommand{\covb}{\mathbin{\hbox{\textbb{;}}}}
\newcommand{\covo}{\mathord{\hbox{\textbb{;}}}}
\newcommand\bbsemi{\mathop{\mbox{\textbb;}}}
\begin{document}
\begin{tabular}{ll}
\verb|$R\bbsemicolon S$| & $R\bbsemicolon S$ \\
\verb|$R\covr S$| & $R\covr S$ \\
\verb|$R\covb S$| & $R\covb S$ \\
\verb|$R\bbsemi S$| & $R\bbsemi S$
\end{tabular}
\end{document}
</snip>
The last three look identical to my naked eye, and I like their spacing
better than the first. I'll probably choose \mathbin, since the
semicolon is being used as a binary operator.
--
Art Werschulz (agw STRUDEL comcast.net)
207 Stoughton Ave Cranford NJ 07016
(908) 272-1146
G. A. Edgar
> The last three look identical to my naked eye, and I like their spacing
> better than the first. I'll probably choose \mathbin, since the
> semicolon is being used as a binary operator.
A slightly off-topic question:
What is (or will be) a bbb semicolon used for?
--
G. A. Edgar http://www.math.ohio-state.edu/~edgar/
Art Werschulz
"G. A. Edgar" <ed...@math.ohio-state.edu.invalid> writes:
> A slightly off-topic question:
> What is (or will be) a bbb semicolon used for?
A text that I am using for a discrete math class uses said character to
represent composition of relations. More precisely, if $R$ is a
relation from $A$ to $B$ and $S$ is a relation from $B$ to $C$, then
$R\bbsemi S$ is a relation from $A$ to $C$ defined as
\[(a,c)\in R\bbsemi S \iff \exists b\in B: (a,b)\in R \land (b,c)\in S.\]
In other words, $R\bbsemi S=S\circ R$.
Although the book does mention the usual notation ($S\circ R$),
he uses his more idiosyncratic notation almost exclusively. In
particular, he uses the bb semicolon notation in all the exercises.
So I figured that I had better use his notation on the exam, lest the
students freak out.
Mariano Suárez-Alvarez
> Hi.
>
> "G. A. Edgar" <ed...@math.ohio-state.edu.invalid> writes:
>
> > A slightly off-topic question:
> > What is (or will be) a bbb semicolon used for?
>
> A text that I am using for a discrete math class uses said character to
> represent composition of relations. More precisely, if $R$ is a
> relation from $A$ to $B$ and $S$ is a relation from $B$ to $C$, then
> $R\bbsemi S$ is a relation from $A$ to $C$ defined as
> \[(a,c)\in R\bbsemi S \iff \exists b\in B: (a,b)\in R \land (b,c)\in S.\]
> In other words, $R\bbsemi S=S\circ R$.
>
> Although the book does mention the usual notation ($S\circ R$),
> he uses his more idiosyncratic notation almost exclusively. In
> particular, he uses the bb semicolon notation in all the exercises.
> So I figured that I had better use his notation on the exam, lest the
> students freak out.
Computer scientists tend to want to turn everything
into Pascal code.
-- m