Lucky Me? E10K
sparcbox
of workstations over the years, Admin'd a number of servers (e450s,
E35Ks). Adminning is just a small part of my roles as I'm part owner
of a small company, so I can't pretend to be as up on as many topics as
I'd like... but that's why I'm here.
I recently acquired an E10K with the following specs:
Sun Starfire E10000
28x400Mhz CPU
28GB Memory
291GB Storage
Included Parts:
Server Cabinet
7x 501-5693 CPU/Memory System Boards, each with 4x 501-5762 400Mhz
CPUs, and 4GB of Memory (32x 501-2654 - 128MB Modules)
2x 501-5494 Controller Board
2x 501-4346 Controller Board
2x Sun D1000 Storage Arrays w/8x 18.2GB Hard Drives
5x 370-2443 SCSI Interface SBus Module
5x 501-5443 Quad Fast Ethernet SBus Module
1x Pacific Access 16509 VCS Host Interface
2x 540-3441 Power Supply Unit
8x 300-1430 Fan Unit
16x 540-3409 Fan Unit
1x EMS 300-1403-01 Power Distrubution Unit
2x 3Com SuperStack 3 3C16440A Baseline Hub
1x 3Com SuperStack 2 3C16440 Baseline Hub
When the machine arrives, I'd like to be able to start configuring the
machine. As the machine will be used in a relatively small company,
say roughly 10 people hitting the machine for heavy analytic work, I'm
thinking about configuring just one domain and letting it fly on that.
So, all that said, does anyone out there have a good place for
reference materials for someone to bring one of these things up on
line.
I'll likely be attaching a bunch of T3s to the back in time, but want
to get the box up and running first.
I also noticed that in the list of included items that there does not
seem to be a ssp included. Any thoughts there?
I'm also thinking that I'd like to go with Solaris 10. Does anyone
have any thoughts regarding OS? I've got Solaris 8 running now on my
E3500 and a fresh copy of Solaris 10 on an ultra10 that I use to play
with.
Any help that anyone could provide would be greatly appreciated. I
know that I'm looking at a fairly tall learning curve, but it should be
a fun ride.
Oh, and as far as the enviornmental issues... I'm working on getting
power and cooling set now... so, I'll be covered on that. Man, this
thing is a monster.
Best,
sparcbox
Chris Newport
>
> I recently acquired an E10K with the following specs:
> Sun Starfire E10000
> 28x400Mhz CPU
> 28GB Memory
> 291GB Storage
[snip]
You cannot bring up an E10k without the domain keys.
The key file resides on the SSP, which is usually an Ultra5 workstation.
Go back to your supplier and get the SSP and a backup tape of its files,
without this you will need to buy a Sun support contract which is _VERY_
expensive for these systems to get a new key.
Effectively your machine is only good to be stripped for spares without
the key file.
If you are in the UK I may be able to help you get this set up.
Remove the news and the nospam for email.
Frank Cusack
> Sorry I can't help, but do please let us know how you get on. Given
> the cost of these things on eBay (there was one on eBay.co.uk a few
> weeks ago of a similar spec for GBP3K!) I suspect some are going to
> be making their way into private hands soon.
They've been "cheap" for awhile now (but GBP3K sounds insane), but
space and power is a large concern. Now with S10 containers (zones)
and pretty fast x64 HW available, I'd be cautious about getting an E10K
unless you specifically need it.
-frank
Frank Cusack
> E35Ks). Adminning is just a small part of my roles as I'm part owner
> of a small company,
...
> I'm also thinking that I'd like to go with Solaris 10. Does anyone
> have any thoughts regarding OS? I've got Solaris 8 running now on my
> E3500 and a fresh copy of Solaris 10 on an ultra10 that I use to play
> with.
S10 is so much better than the previous generation, if your app isn't
tied to an earlier version you really must upgrade. I get the
impression you're value conscious as well, so you should realize
that anything before S10 is very expensive. IIRC on the order of $100k
(you need the max license regardless of how many CPUs you actually use),
which is probably 5-10x what you paid for the hardware.
If you're only using a single domain, why the E10K over newer (Opteron)
hardware. Power costs are likely to be quite expensive for the E10K.
-frank
Scott Howard
> Lucky me. I am a long time Sun user, I've owned (personally) a number
> of workstations over the years, Admin'd a number of servers (e450s,
> E35Ks). Adminning is just a small part of my roles as I'm part owner
> of a small company, so I can't pretend to be as up on as many topics as
> I'd like... but that's why I'm here.
>
> I recently acquired an E10K with the following specs:
Umm.. why?
Given the power an E10K will chew up, you'll find that something like a
V440 will work out cheaper within at most a few months - and give roughly
the same performance as the E10K.
Scott
Bruce Esquibel
: Umm.. why?
: Given the power an E10K will chew up, you'll find that something like a
: V440 will work out cheaper within at most a few months - and give roughly
: the same performance as the E10K.
I do sympathize with him though.
Within the last month one similar to what he bought was on ebay, I think for
2 grand. After I stopped drooling and reality set in thinking about the
power consumption and shipping costs on a one-ton peice of iron, I quickly
got my finger off the "buy it now" button.
I didn't know about the domain keys and the special workstation needed to
make those things run. Like him (probably) I thought they were like any
other peice of Sun hardware, turn it on and go (more or less).
If anything, one attraction to them is the simple fact that just 4 to 5
years ago you couldn't touch one used for under half a million USD. That and
the notion it probably would be more computer than 99.9% of the worlds
businesses would need, I still wouldn't call the cops for littering if
someone dropped one off outside my front door.
Sort of feel sorry for the guy, sounds like he made one too many plans
before looking under the hood.
-bruce
b...@ripco.com
CJT
That reminds me of Cray machines a few years back -- they went from
being the world's fastest machines to scrap in a remarkably short
time.
--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.
Emmanuel Florac
>
> That reminds me of Cray machines a few years back -- they went from being
> the world's fastest machines to scrap in a remarkably short time.
That's how big iron ends... A couple of months ago, the CEA in France sold
for 5000 euros the NEC supercomputer that was n°4 in 1999 (192 vector
CPUs, 384 GB RAM, not that puny :).
--
Sutor ne ultra Crepidam.
Al Slater
> sparcbox wrote:
>
>>
>> I recently acquired an E10K with the following specs:
>> Sun Starfire E10000
>> 28x400Mhz CPU
>> 28GB Memory
>> 291GB Storage
>
> [snip]
>
> You cannot bring up an E10k without the domain keys.
> The key file resides on the SSP, which is usually an Ultra5 workstation.
> Go back to your supplier and get the SSP and a backup tape of its files,
> without this you will need to buy a Sun support contract which is _VERY_
> expensive for these systems to get a new key.
> Effectively your machine is only good to be stripped for spares without
> the key file.
When we bought an E10k off ebay, we didn't know about keys etc, but once
supplied with the right serial numbers, Sun very kindly sent us the
required keys. No contract required.
Al
Benjamin Gawert
> If anything, one attraction to them is the simple fact that just 4 to 5
> years ago you couldn't touch one used for under half a million USD.
Hmm..I remember that around 4 years ago I was offered several E10ks here
in Europe for prices around 40-60kEUR from various resellers...
Benjamin
Trinean
listed.
However, here's an E10K on eBay right now for about $1000:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=9735408827
I seem to remember within the past year or so there was some guy in the
Boston area selling E10Ks for under $10K.
It's likely a major powerhog and 466 MHz USII CPUs are the fastest it
supports.
Although fully loaded it can support 64 such CPUs with 64 GB of RAM.
A Sun Fire V890 with 8 1.5 GHz US IV+ CPUs and 64 GB of RAM would likely be
pretty close if not better!
The memory is more advanced than the old SIMMs used in the E10k and each US
IV+ CPU is dual core so it's almost like having 16 CPUs.
Not to mention 1.5 GHz vs 466 MHz which is apples and oranges since the
processor technology is so much newer too.
Plus an Sun Fure V890 takes up a lot less space and a lot less power.
Trinean
Andre van Eyssen
> A Sun Fire V890 with 8 1.5 GHz US IV+ CPUs and 64 GB of RAM would likely be
> pretty close if not better!
If someone would sell 890s for what E10ks have been going for, I think
I'd buy one right then and there.
--
Andre
Daniel Rock
Don't forget the additional cost of each unit:
. power consumption
E10k up to 14 kW
V890 up to 3 kW
. failure likelyhood
The E10k has much more components that might fail than the V890
Also the E10k is much older so failures will be more likely
--
Daniel
Andre van Eyssen
> Don't forget the additional cost of each unit:
> . power consumption
> E10k up to 14 kW
> V890 up to 3 kW
Hey, I wouldn't put the 10K anywhere I had to pay for it. Frankly, I
get the feeling the massive weight of it wouldn't have done the floors
in some places I've lived a world of good.
An old machine like a 10K is a bad value proposition for anyone looking
to run it at capacity and rely on it. A 10K is a great deal for anyone
with an excess of space who'd like it to "decorate" the place and have
the joy of typing psrinfo -v and prtconf on a machine like that.
When I was a teenager I had a SPARCstation IPC and while it made a
useful machine, the best part about it was the fact that it wasn't a
PC, it was a "real" computer and hence seemed a lot shinier.
> . failure likelyhood
> The E10k has much more components that might fail than the V890
> Also the E10k is much older so failures will be more likely
Oh, that's easy-fixed! Just buy a second one for spare parts!
I've had all sorts of big heavy machines over the years, and I don't
think I've got the patience for it any more. A pair of E250s clustered,
some storage arrays, a T105 and a Blade 1000 for the desk is all that
lives at home these days. If I want to see big machines, I can do that
at work where one machine room has everything from SPARCstations to a
E25K. I've still got an E3000, but that hasn't seen power in a year and
does a sturdy duty as a side table.
--
Andre.
Trinean
> think I've got the patience for it any more. A pair of E250s clustered,
> some storage arrays, a T105 and a Blade 1000 for the desk is all that
> lives at home these days. If I want to see big machines, I can do that
> at work where one machine room has everything from SPARCstations to a
> E25K. I've still got an E3000, but that hasn't seen power in a year and
> does a sturdy duty as a side table.
Sun Blade 1000s are great. I just picked up one to start using instead of
the trusty old Ultra 10.
And since many of the components are the same as the Sun Blade 2000 I should
be able to get spare parts for many years to come.
However, since nothing ever broke on the Ultra 10 in over 6 years I expect
similar from the new machine.
All equipment is on UPS and never loses power in addition to being in a
temperature controlled area.
I take that back.
The internal speaker on the Ultra 10 is kind of cheap and I listen to a lot
of MP3s so I did eventually have to replace that.
Trinean
Andre van Eyssen
> Sun Blade 1000s are great. I just picked up one to start using instead of
> the trusty old Ultra 10.
Mine replaced an Ultra-60. The Ultra-60 was pretty beefed up but moving
from dual-400 and 2Gb of RAM to dual-900 and 4Gb of RAM was a noticable
improvement. All that RAM means I can run plenty of zones for testing
and development.
> And since many of the components are the same as the Sun Blade 2000 I should
> be able to get spare parts for many years to come.
The same bits are also found in 280R servers, so even more supply for
common bits (CPU, RAM...)
> I take that back.
> The internal speaker on the Ultra 10 is kind of cheap and I listen to a lot
> of MP3s so I did eventually have to replace that.
Sun's sound options are pretty chintzy. I use my Ultra-20 for playing
MP3s with an external sound card and some middle-of-the-road speakers
and a decent amp. One of these days I'll try a USB sound device on
the Blade-1000.
My only other gripe with the Blade-1000 is the fact that getting a
better framebuffer will be hard and/or expensive. The thing that
annoys me is that I've got an XVR-600 on the shelf but it isn't
supported in the Blade. I'd like to be able to play video full-screen
but the UPA framebuffer won't keep up. Again, I've got the Ultra-20
to do that sort of job for me - the Blade is for getting work done.
--
Andre.
Trinean
of
> > the trusty old Ultra 10.
>
> Mine replaced an Ultra-60. The Ultra-60 was pretty beefed up but moving
> from dual-400 and 2Gb of RAM to dual-900 and 4Gb of RAM was a noticable
> improvement. All that RAM means I can run plenty of zones for testing
> and development.
My Ultra 10 was maxed out with 1 GB of RAM and the 440 MHz US IIi CPU.
The OEM 9 GB drive wasn't big enough so I put in a 40 GB from a Sun Blade
150.
The Sun Blade 1000 kills it since it has 4 GB of RAM and dual 750 MHz USIII
CPUs.
Not to mention mirrored 73.4 GB FCAL drives!
> > And since many of the components are the same as the Sun Blade 2000 I
should
> > be able to get spare parts for many years to come.
> The same bits are also found in 280R servers, so even more supply for
> common bits (CPU, RAM...)
True. Plus the RAM is also used in most of the midrange (4800) to high end
systems (25K) so I doubt memory will ever be hard to find.
> > I take that back.
> > The internal speaker on the Ultra 10 is kind of cheap and I listen to a
lot
> > of MP3s so I did eventually have to replace that.
> Sun's sound options are pretty chintzy. I use my Ultra-20 for playing
> MP3s with an external sound card and some middle-of-the-road speakers
> and a decent amp. One of these days I'll try a USB sound device on
> the Blade-1000.
The internal speaker on the Sun Blade 1000 is much better sound quality than
the Ultra 10.
> My only other gripe with the Blade-1000 is the fact that getting a
> better framebuffer will be hard and/or expensive. The thing that
> annoys me is that I've got an XVR-600 on the shelf but it isn't
> supported in the Blade. I'd like to be able to play video full-screen
> but the UPA framebuffer won't keep up. Again, I've got the Ultra-20
> to do that sort of job for me - the Blade is for getting work done.
I'm using a Creator 3D which is what I was used to graphics wise on the
Ultra 10.
The XVR-500 is listed, but not the newer XVR-600.
Strange since both are supported in the lower end Sun Blade 150.
Trinean
Andre van Eyssen
> The Sun Blade 1000 kills it since it has 4 GB of RAM and dual 750 MHz USIII
> CPUs.
> Not to mention mirrored 73.4 GB FCAL drives!
Yep, those internal spindles are nice and fast. Plus you get a socket on
the back to connect more FCAL devices - pity they don't give you a real
GBIC slot though.
> True. Plus the RAM is also used in most of the midrange (4800) to high end
> systems (25K) so I doubt memory will ever be hard to find.
Also 480/490/880/890 boxes.
> I'm using a Creator 3D which is what I was used to graphics wise on the
> Ultra 10.
> The XVR-500 is listed, but not the newer XVR-600.
Yep. Anyone in Australia want to swap a 600 for a 500?
> Strange since both are supported in the lower end Sun Blade 150.
Sun Blade 150 is more recent than Blade 1000. The low end workstation
of that time was the Blade 100.
A couple of colleagues have the new Ultra 45 (at memory) workstations.
Bloody nice looking toys. Bonus points for the clear plastic baffle so
you can take the side off for show-off factor without disrupting the
airflow.
--
Andre.