Timex Computers
Alvin Albrecht
I thought parts of these e-mails would be interesting to other Timex
users reading comp.sys.sinclair.
Many T/S users in North America are unaware that after Timex Computer Corp
folded in spring 1984, Timex of Portugal continued to sell and manufacture
Timex machines which were marketted mainly in Portugal and some East European
countries (like Poland) until 1989.
At the time Timex folded in North America, it had completely designed a
TS2048 computer, a 3" disk system, a TS2068 computer and rumour has it
a prototype Bus Expansion Unit for the TS2068. Also rumoured was
a TS3068 computer project in development. Only the TS2068 computer
was released to the public.
The TS2068 and TS2048 machines were renamed TC2068 and TC2048 (TC standing
for Timex Computer) - I have no idea why Timex of Portugal dropped the
Sinclair part of TS. The TC2048 turned out to be a 48K Spectrum clone
with a built-in Kempston joystick. From info I've gleaned over the
last year, it used Timex's custom SCLD for control logic (like the TS2068),
but came with only a 16K Spectrum ROM and 48K RAM located in the HOME
bank. It didn't have the AY-3-8912 sound chip and had a Spectrum
compatible bus available off the rear edge connector, though I'm unsure if
any TS2068 bus signals were also available. This makes the TC2048 a
Spectrum clone with the advanced video modes of the TS2068.
Paulo wrote: <pse...@telepac.pt>
> BTW, as for physical differences between the 2048 and the 2068, apart from
>the cartridge slot, they weren't many, at least at first look (the case was
>gray though, whilst the 2048 was black). I know 2 guys that had 2068s, but I
>only have some hints of the capabilities of the system, such as more memory
>and the sound chip, but besides that, the cartridge thing, I'm not very much
>aware of the machine, being it features or numbers (i.e., Kb memory,
>cartridge, stuff like that).
The TS2068 comes with 72K built-in (24K ROM + 48K RAM), with an empty
64K bank available for cartridges. Other than the AY-3-8912 sound chip
and two bidirectional joystick ports, it is quite similar to the
TC2048. The rear bus has much more in common with the ZX81 than the
Spectrum. This allowed Timex to make peripherals that were plug-in
compatible with both the TS1000 and TS2068.
> I believe Timex Portugal also put out other computer stuff, not available
>on the States, but I could be wrong, such as the FDD3000 (dual 3" floppies
>unit), and the Terminal 3000, which LOOKED like a real keyboard, but all I
>know of it is that it was business oriented, and a picture in a Portuguese
>mag. I believe there was also some software for the machines, like language
>interpreters/compilers (C, Pascal, and others), but I never got to see them.
Yes, some of the Timex of Portugal stuff made it back to North America.
The FDD3000 dual 3" disk system (with the 64K local bank of memory) was
sold by Zebra Systems here, but I would guess it is third in popularity
behind the Larken and JLO disk systems, mostly because it used 3"
disks (which is pretty much a European phenomenon), and because the
Larken and JLO systems can use standard IBM drives. I think what
most prompted people to buy it was the fact that CP/M 2.2 was (is)
available for it. The only other system that supported CP/M was the
AERCO disk system.
The Terminal 3000 you are talking about is the most interesting. At
the time of Timex's demise, it was rumoured that the TS3068 was
under development. This is a machine that was to cost $199.95 and
supposedly had features rivalling the Amiga. I'm wondering if
Timex of Portugal completed the design and sold the "TS3068" as the
Terminal 3000. I'd love to hear more about this machine.
>> Was there a lot of TS2068 software written in Portugal?
> I really can't say. I only bought Spectrum software because there was no
>2048 (or 2068, although I saw some cartridges available), but I always
>wished for some game to appear that would use the graphical capabilities of
>the 2048. As I said above, besides "home made" software, nothing really
>"big", commercial ever went out, without being from Timex itself, or from we
>, users. Most of the user base, though, was mostly game oriented, so for
>them, a 2048 was just a "nicer" Spectrum, with better keyboard, joystick
>port, RGB composite output, a decent keyboard, an on/off switch, and better
>(louder) sound output.
> The reason for this is that there wasn't really a large market for software
>, or at least people didn't knew it. I know people that sent games to be
>published by English software houses, so they got a chance of earning some
>money. You can probably found a game called Alien Evolution; it was
>programmed by a couple of guys from here, Portimao, and one of them, Rui
>Tito, is now the owner of the largest software house producer and
>distributor in Portugal.
Just curious..how many Timex machines were manufactured in Portugal?
> Launching a Spectrum only game was sure to hit EVERY computer, whereas a
>Timex one would it at most Portugal, maybe America and some Eastern Europe
>countries like Poland. However, I only recently got to know that TCs were
>sold on East Europe besides Portugal, and that Timex Computer in US went
>bust in 1983, although I always suspected of the American origin of the
>computer (the BASIC OS extensions for support of the extended graphics,
>called Basic 64, was written by Portuguese, though, which made me wonder
>what was that you guys over there used for this...).
I've written my own subroutines to use the extended display modes, as
I'm sure others have. But, for an extension to the BASIC operating
system that uses the 512x192 graphics mode (64x24 text), OS/64 is
available on cartridge. I don't own it, but I understand the operation
of OS/64 is transparent to the program. It doesn't need to use up
any RAM as the BASIC extensions are located on ROM in the cartridge.
> I like to talk to someone that knows Timex stuff. I was getting to know
>quite a bit about this in a Usenet discussion last October, but then my
>14400bps modem went to be fixed, and never got back, so I lost the thread,
>and never caught all of it. I now have a 2400bps modem borrowed from a
>friend of mine, still waiting from my modem (they say they don't know where
>it is, but one thing's for sure: it's the LAST time I ever bought anything
>from them...:-(
I wondered what happened to you!
Alvin
Pedro Mota
I noticed your post about Timex and Timex Portugal products so...
FDD3000: I do have one of these; it still works but the interface that
links it with my Speccy is burned and I am unable to get a replacement
so...
Terminal 3000(?): This was a keyboard that could connect directly to
the FDD 3000 (that is, without the interface for Speccy conectivity). It
boots in CP/M.
BTW I used my Speccy+FDD3000 a lot; that's where I learned dBase,
Wordstar, TurboPascal, MS-BASIC, C... and that may be why I make money
in the software business nowadays :)
Pedro
pm...@caleida.pt
Artur Jasowicz
Alvin Albrecht (seal...@acs.ucalgary.ca) wrote:
: I thought parts of these e-mails would be interesting to other Timex
: users reading comp.sys.sinclair.
: Many T/S users in North America are unaware that after Timex Computer Corp
: folded in spring 1984, Timex of Portugal continued to sell and manufacture
: Timex machines which were marketted mainly in Portugal and some East European
: countries (like Poland) until 1989.
Yes, I still have one of these. Timex 2048 with dual 3" floppy drive was
the first computer in my school's computer lab. Later, polish computers
that ran under clone of CP/M and also had Spectrum mode were installed.
They were called Elwro, if anyone cares to know. :)
: The TS2068 and TS2048 machines were renamed TC2068 and TC2048 (TC standing
: for Timex Computer) - I have no idea why Timex of Portugal dropped the
: Sinclair part of TS. The TC2048 turned out to be a 48K Spectrum clone
: with a built-in Kempston joystick. From info I've gleaned over the
: last year, it used Timex's custom SCLD for control logic (like the TS2068),
: but came with only a 16K Spectrum ROM and 48K RAM located in the HOME
: bank. It didn't have the AY-3-8912 sound chip and had a Spectrum
: compatible bus available off the rear edge connector, though I'm unsure if
: any TS2068 bus signals were also available. This makes the TC2048 a
: Spectrum clone with the advanced video modes of the TS2068.
Actually TC2048 edge connector was slightly modified, especially in the
analog part. It had some signals that were unavailable on Speccy. It was
close enough though, Most speccy interfaces worked fine. As to AY, there
were designs developed in Poland to connect it to Speccy (and Timex) at
the same location as in 128. This way with a bit of patience one could
play music from games for 128 on a Timex. I modified this design slightly
and added 8255 chip that I used to connect to my Apple IIe clone (Basis
108) and transfer data. Actually now I have third version of this card. I
dropped 8255, since I am using AY-3-8910 that has 2 8 bit ports, but I
added SRAM that can be activated instead of ROM. This way I can modify
the OS any way I want :) Anyone interested?
: >> Was there a lot of TS2068 software written in Portugal?
: > I really can't say. I only bought Spectrum software because there was no
: >2048 (or 2068, although I saw some cartridges available), but I always
: >wished for some game to appear that would use the graphical capabilities of
: >the 2048. As I said above, besides "home made" software, nothing really
: >"big", commercial ever went out, without being from Timex itself, or from we
: >, users. Most of the user base, though, was mostly game oriented, so for
: >them, a 2048 was just a "nicer" Spectrum, with better keyboard, joystick
: >port, RGB composite output, a decent keyboard, an on/off switch, and better
: >(louder) sound output.
I have some snaps with 2048 specific games that I've downloaded from nvg,
if my memory serves me right. There must have been some 2048 only software.
: > Launching a Spectrum only game was sure to hit EVERY computer, whereas a
: >Timex one would it at most Portugal, maybe America and some Eastern Europe
: >countries like Poland. However, I only recently got to know that TCs were
: >sold on East Europe besides Portugal, and that Timex Computer in US went
In Poland purchases for schools were supported and sponsored by Polish
government. Software houses wouldn't make too much money in Poland
though. Bootleg software was everywhere back in those happy days, and
noone thought it was wrong to give a friend a copy of your favourite game.
Greetings,
----------------------------------------------
-- Artur Jasowicz --
-- art...@interaccess.com --
-- http://homepage.interaccess.com/~arturj/ --
----------------------------------------------
Paulo Sergio Coelho
Pedro Mota <pm...@caleida.pt> wrote:
Boas!
>I noticed your post about Timex and Timex Portugal products so...
>FDD3000: I do have one of these; it still works but the interface that
>links it with my Speccy is burned and I am unable to get a replacement
>so...
>Terminal 3000(?): This was a keyboard that could connect directly to
>the FDD 3000 (that is, without the interface for Speccy conectivity). It
>boots in CP/M.
And what about a processor? Did the Terminal 3000+FDD3000 combined to
make a fully working computer system?
>BTW I used my Speccy+FDD3000 a lot; that's where I learned dBase,
>Wordstar, TurboPascal, MS-BASIC, C... and that may be why I make money
>in the software business nowadays :)
Yes, there was a lot of stuff available for CP/M, therefore you could
take advantage of it!... Pity I didn't had it...
CU!
Paulo Sergio Coelho
seal...@acs.ucalgary.ca (Alvin Albrecht) wrote:
Hello!
I'm back!!! ;-)
>compatible bus available off the rear edge connector, though I'm unsure if
>any TS2068 bus signals were also available. This makes the TC2048 a
>Spectrum clone with the advanced video modes of the TS2068.
A "better" Spectrum than Spectrum itself I might had.
BTW, can you supply ALL the names, positions, a full (as possible)
description of the back expansion bus on the 2068? I could then
compare it to the Spectrum's one (the one I have access to) and also
_TRY_ to get my 2048 back and see if the signals are more towards
Timex or Sinclair...
>The TS2068 comes with 72K built-in (24K ROM + 48K RAM), with an empty
>64K bank available for cartridges. Other than the AY-3-8912 sound chip
>and two bidirectional joystick ports, it is quite similar to the
>TC2048. The rear bus has much more in common with the ZX81 than the
>Spectrum. This allowed Timex to make peripherals that were plug-in
>compatible with both the TS1000 and TS2068.
Nice, since those were the machines available in the US. I still
would like to know if the Kempston port on the 2048 is bidirectional
or has other ways to access it, as the 2068's way.
>Yes, some of the Timex of Portugal stuff made it back to North America.
>The FDD3000 dual 3" disk system (with the 64K local bank of memory) was
>sold by Zebra Systems here, but I would guess it is third in popularity
>behind the Larken and JLO disk systems, mostly because it used 3"
>disks (which is pretty much a European phenomenon), and because the
Yeah, like the Amstrad's microcomputer line (Sinclair, CPC, etc),
they were also 3". Pretty dumb, as the rest of the world was going
3,5"...
>The Terminal 3000 you are talking about is the most interesting. At
>the time of Timex's demise, it was rumoured that the TS3068 was
>under development. This is a machine that was to cost $199.95 and
>supposedly had features rivalling the Amiga. I'm wondering if
>Timex of Portugal completed the design and sold the "TS3068" as the
>Terminal 3000. I'd love to hear more about this machine.
Doesn't seem so, unfortunately...
>Just curious..how many Timex machines were manufactured in Portugal?
Beats me. Thousands I'd guess. 2068 came first, because when I bought
my Spectrum, in, oh, 1985(?) the first tapes came with "Spectrum,
Spectrum+, TC2068", embodied on the back. Seems that 2048 only took
off later on. I bought (my parents did) my 2048 later on 1987, if
memory serves me correct.
>>computer (the BASIC OS extensions for support of the extended graphics,
>>called Basic 64, was written by Portuguese, though, which made me wonder
>>what was that you guys over there used for this...).
>I've written my own subroutines to use the extended display modes, as
>I'm sure others have. But, for an extension to the BASIC operating
>system that uses the 512x192 graphics mode (64x24 text), OS/64 is
>available on cartridge. I don't own it, but I understand the operation
>of OS/64 is transparent to the program. It doesn't need to use up
>any RAM as the BASIC extensions are located on ROM in the cartridge.
Basic_64 is also very transparent and it also doesn't use all that
memory, just 2000 bytes.
You already have it. Did you like it?
>I wondered what happened to you!
I'm here, finally!! I spend some time downloading the complete
(almost 14000) newsgroup list from my ISP (at 2400) while finishing up
my MIDI interface (hope it works, I haven't tested it yet...). This
while waiting for the list to arrive. Then I had to retrieve ALL the
comp.sys.sinclair. headers. Still, I was downloading some stuff
through Netscape, so all time was well spend :-)
From now on, you can expect finding me, especially on these Timex
discussions!
Bye!
Paulo Sergio Coelho
art...@thymaster.interaccess.com (Artur Jasowicz) wrote:
>: Many T/S users in North America are unaware that after Timex Computer Corp
>: folded in spring 1984, Timex of Portugal continued to sell and manufacture
>: Timex machines which were marketted mainly in Portugal and some East European
>: countries (like Poland) until 1989.
>Yes, I still have one of these. Timex 2048 with dual 3" floppy drive was
>the first computer in my school's computer lab. Later, polish computers
>that ran under clone of CP/M and also had Spectrum mode were installed.
>They were called Elwro, if anyone cares to know. :)
Maybe whoever has/had one of them...:-)
But the Timex didn't had the drives, or did it? Weren't them on a
separate unit, FDD3000 ?
>Actually TC2048 edge connector was slightly modified, especially in the
>analog part. It had some signals that were unavailable on Speccy. It was
>close enough though, Most speccy interfaces worked fine. As to AY, there
I used 2 Spectrum interfaces successfully with my 2048: an RGB +
reset interface (useless, since the Timex had an RGB output already
and an on/off switch), and also an interface that had 2 joystick
ports, and a sound amplifier (it had a bigger speaker inside the box).
This later one was Timex made also, can't remember it's name though. I
still have the box, but the board is long gone...
>were designs developed in Poland to connect it to Speccy (and Timex) at
>the same location as in 128. This way with a bit of patience one could
>play music from games for 128 on a Timex. I modified this design slightly
Eheh, a friend of mine used to hack 128K games so they could use the
AY chip of his TC2068, he had just to swap port addressing, real easy
(according to him).
>I have some snaps with 2048 specific games that I've downloaded from nvg,
>if my memory serves me right. There must have been some 2048 only software.
YES??? WHERE??? NAMES, I WANT N-A-M-E-S !!!!
>In Poland purchases for schools were supported and sponsored by Polish
>government. Software houses wouldn't make too much money in Poland
>though. Bootleg software was everywhere back in those happy days, and
>noone thought it was wrong to give a friend a copy of your favourite game.
Same thing here, until the early 90s, when it was forbidden. Most of
them hacked, so no fancy loaders (most of them), and some incomplete
(like Super Hang-On for example).
People who wanted to make a living out of it, either would send the
programs (games) for an English software house (Gremlin most of the
time) or write commercial/business software, custom made, etc.
Bye!
Alvin Albrecht
Paulo Sergio Coelho <pse...@telepac.pt> wrote:
>Pedro Mota <pm...@caleida.pt> wrote:
>>I noticed your post about Timex and Timex Portugal products so...
>>FDD3000: I do have one of these; it still works but the interface that
>>links it with my Speccy is burned and I am unable to get a replacement
>>so...
>>Terminal 3000(?): This was a keyboard that could connect directly to
>>the FDD 3000 (that is, without the interface for Speccy conectivity). It
>>boots in CP/M.
> And what about a processor? Did the Terminal 3000+FDD3000 combined to
>make a fully working computer system?
Yes. The FDD3000 is actually its own Z80 computer. It has a Z80
processor and its own local 64K of memory. It looks like CP/M
was being run by the controller's Z80 in the controller's RAM
with the Speccy acting as a terminal. In that case, the Terminal
3000 could have been a keyboard + simple communication hardware.
>>BTW I used my Speccy+FDD3000 a lot; that's where I learned dBase,
>>Wordstar, TurboPascal, MS-BASIC, C... and that may be why I make money
>>in the software business nowadays :)
> Yes, there was a lot of stuff available for CP/M, therefore you could
>take advantage of it!... Pity I didn't had it...
Still no word on the Bus Expansion unit for the TC2068 in Portugal...
Does anyone have information on this? I've got a Timex research
photo of a TS2068 hooked up to a BEU (never released), Timex
microdrives (never released) and the TS2050 modem. Any info on
Timex microdrives?
Alvin
Paulo Sergio Coelho
seal...@acs.ucalgary.ca (Alvin Albrecht) wrote:
>>>Terminal 3000(?): This was a keyboard that could connect directly to
>>>the FDD 3000 (that is, without the interface for Speccy conectivity). It
>>>boots in CP/M.
>> And what about a processor? Did the Terminal 3000+FDD3000 combined to
>>make a fully working computer system?
>Yes. The FDD3000 is actually its own Z80 computer. It has a Z80
>processor and its own local 64K of memory. It looks like CP/M
>was being run by the controller's Z80 in the controller's RAM
>with the Speccy acting as a terminal. In that case, the Terminal
>3000 could have been a keyboard + simple communication hardware.
Otherwise known as a "dumb" terminal...
I always thought of the FDD as your "average" FDD system, dual floppy
system, that's all.
>Still no word on the Bus Expansion unit for the TC2068 in Portugal...
>Does anyone have information on this? I've got a Timex research
>photo of a TS2068 hooked up to a BEU (never released), Timex
>microdrives (never released) and the TS2050 modem. Any info on
>Timex microdrives?
I think on the Timex's box was a picture of it connected to a series
of boxes, could that be it?
Also, on the back box's text about the computer, was references to
terms like modems, plotters, etc, stuff at the time completely unknown
to me. The modem they were talking could be very well be that TS2050
one. Specs?
Bye!
Robert Cazares
pse...@telepac.pt (Paulo Sergio Coelho) wrote:
>>Yes, some of the Timex of Portugal stuff made it back to North America.
>>The FDD3000 dual 3" disk system (with the 64K local bank of memory) was
>>sold by Zebra Systems here, but I would guess it is third in popularity
>>behind the Larken and JLO disk systems, mostly because it used 3"
>>disks (which is pretty much a European phenomenon), and because the
> Yeah, like the Amstrad's microcomputer line (Sinclair, CPC, etc),
>they were also 3". Pretty dumb, as the rest of the world was going
>3,5"...
Wow, cool thread/conversation here.
Been a while since I've thought about my old 2068's.
Belive it or not, there was undocumented support for single sided
5.25" drives in addtion to undocumented formatting commands.
I should know, as I had two flavors installed on my FDD3000.
The first 5.25" format command was the same as the 3" drives, 160K
SSSD(I believe). And the second and more interesting 5.25" support was
for Single Sided Quad Density drives. This format allowed for a
whopping 620K on a standard 360K floppy disk. However, you did need
the quad drive to do this. Of course you couldn't flip this disk over
to write to the other side(for obvious reasons)as you could with the
3" diskettes.
Don't immediately ask for more details, as I sold my two systems to a
fellow TS'er in NY which included everything I had, and my long term
memory seems to be failing as well. I did keep one 3" diskette just
for the sake of having one. :)
I think I had just about everything one could have with those systems,
including many CP/M programs, such as Wordstar, dBaseII, MS Basic, and
uhhhh, quite a few other CP/M programs that were ported over that now
seem to elude my memory.
If anyone is really interested in more info, I could contact the guy I
sold my stuff to. He was the same person who ported those CP/M apps to
the 2068_CP/M box.
Bruno Florindo
> pse...@telepac.pt (Paulo Sergio Coelho) wrote:
>
> >>The FDD3000 dual 3" disk system (with the 64K local bank of memory) was
> >>sold by Zebra Systems here, but I would guess it is third in popularity
> >>behind the Larken and JLO disk systems, mostly because it used 3"
> >>disks (which is pretty much a European phenomenon), and because the
>