Interpreted BASIC?

[F. W.]

Is there a very simple interpreter for BASIC for BASH?

Thanx!

FW

[Martin Gregorie]

On Wed, 24 Mar 2021 10:43:18 +0100, F. W. wrote:

> Is there a very simple interpreter for BASIC for BASH?
>

It would appear that that are three: bwbasic, sdlbasic and yabasic

sdlbasic says its for game development using the SDL library. The SDL
library manages video, audio, input devices, CD-ROM, threads, shared
object loading, networking and timers.

bwbasic looks like a more complete ANSI Standard BASIC interpreter than
yabasic and could be the only one to have a built-in editor.

All are supported on other operating systems as well as Linux.

FYI I used the command line:

sudo apt search "basic interpreter" | less

to find these Raspbian packages. Use "sudo apt install packagename" to
install one or more of them. I have no idea which is the best: I haven't
written BASIC since around 1985.

--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

[Anna Christina Nass]

Am 24.03.21 schrieb me # home.com@3:770/3 in RBERRYPI:

Hallo F.,

FW> Is there a very simple interpreter for BASIC for BASH?

I haven't tried it myself, but there is a "bwBASIC" (Bywater BASIC) which
is a small BASIC interpreter modeled after GW-BASIC.
And there is FreeBASIC, which is more like QuickBASIC/QBASIC, but it is
also a compiler.

Maybe that helps you a little.

Regards,
Anna

[A. Dumas]

On 24-03-2021 12:01, Martin Gregorie wrote:
> It would appear that that are three: bwbasic, sdlbasic and yabasic

> [...]

> sudo apt search "basic interpreter" | less
> to find these Raspbian packages.

Won't you only find packages that have the exact description "basic
interpreter" that way, or is the search cleverer than that?

Two Raspberry Pi related options:
- Gordon's RTB seems to have vanished from the repos but can be
downloaded here:
https://projects.drogon.net/rtb/rtb-download-and-install/ I just tried
it and it still works, and it does GPIO, but unfortunately for OP it
requires a graphical screen. (And to install libsdl-sound1.2 first, even
if you don't use sound.)
- Also graphical, harking back to the inspiration for the Raspberry Pi:
https://www.bbcbasic.co.uk/bbcsdl/

The only interpreter that I saw (in a web search) that does support
command line/batch mode is apparently bwbasic, which is in the standard
repo like you found.

[Martin Gregorie]

On Wed, 24 Mar 2021 12:23:43 +0100, A. Dumas wrote:

> On 24-03-2021 12:01, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>> It would appear that that are three: bwbasic, sdlbasic and yabasic
>> [...]
>> sudo apt search "basic interpreter" | less to find these Raspbian
>> packages.
>
> Won't you only find packages that have the exact description "basic
> interpreter" that way, or is the search cleverer than that?
>

Its cleverer than that: it matches packages using a regex. Changing the
regex to "basic.*interpreter" added one other relevant hit:
'brandy', a BBC BASIC V interpreter

Be aware that 'apt search' is looking at the package's description, not
its name, so a fairly generic regex like the one I used is likely to
include irrelevant packages in its hits list. Since it only displays the
first sentence in each description, its not always obvious why a
particular hit got into the list.

[Adrian Caspersz]

On 24/03/2021 11:23, A. Dumas wrote:
> - Also graphical, harking back to the inspiration for the Raspberry Pi:
> https://www.bbcbasic.co.uk/bbcsdl/

Following is not really the answer to the OP, but I grew up with this
thing, and think the javascript emulation is cool.

https://clp.bbcrewind.co.uk/jsbeeb/index.html

enter the following at the prompt (on a PC keyboard for * use the @
character, next to the return/enter key)

*EXEC !BOOT

and you will be starting the game, Elite ...


The site https://clp.bbcrewind.co.uk may interest some with memories of
long ago, the beginning of my interest in home computing.

--
Adrian C

[ray]

https://www.thefreecountry.com/compilers/basic.shtml
will show you. There is also opencomal which is a basic like language
with more structure.

[druck]

On 24/03/2021 09:43, F. W. wrote:
> Is there a very simple interpreter for BASIC for BASH?

If you are looking for an interactive interpreter as an alternative to a
bash shell, and I would recommend iPython rather than a BASIC variant.
Python is far more powerful language with a vast range of library
modules, and iPython allows you to use all of that interactively.

---druck

[F. W.]

Thank you! Vintage-Basic is excellent!

FW

[Adrian Caspersz]

I'd suggest PowerShell ...

--
Adrian C

[A. Dumas]

On the Raspberry Pi?! Because we're in comp.sys.raspberry-pi here.

[Adrian Caspersz]

Yup.

--
Adrian C

[Folderol]

... or you could run RiscOS and you'd have BBC BASIC built in - an *extremely*
powerful (and quick) version.

Mind you this all depends on what other connectivity you need.

--
W J G

[Gordon Henderson]

In article <605b213f$0$27927$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>,

A. Dumas <alex...@dumas.fr.invalid> wrote:
>On 24-03-2021 12:01, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>> It would appear that that are three: bwbasic, sdlbasic and yabasic
>> [...]
>> sudo apt search "basic interpreter" | less
>> to find these Raspbian packages.
>
>Won't you only find packages that have the exact description "basic
>interpreter" that way, or is the search cleverer than that?
>
>Two Raspberry Pi related options:
>- Gordon's RTB seems to have vanished from the repos but can be
>downloaded here:
>https://projects.drogon.net/rtb/rtb-download-and-install/ I just tried
>it and it still works, and it does GPIO, but unfortunately for OP it
>requires a graphical screen. (And to install libsdl-sound1.2 first, even
>if you don't use sound.)

It should work on the console without any GUI running.

Try running it with the -D flag:

rtb -D

then looking at the list of modes it prints, then you can pick the mode/resolution with

rtb -m X

where X is the mode number listed from the -D command. Mode 0 is usually
the highest resolution one which is the default if you don't use the
-m flag.

RTB (and wiringPi) are sort of on holiday right now - I've had some health
issues in the past year or 2 and am now in the middle of moving house,
so once the dust has settled I'll be doing more with them.

Gordon

[A. Dumas]

On 25-03-2021 17:22, Gordon Henderson wrote:

> A. Dumas <alex...@dumas.fr.invalid> wrote:
>> - Gordon's RTB seems to have vanished from the repos but can be
>> downloaded here:
>> https://projects.drogon.net/rtb/rtb-download-and-install/ I just tried
>> it and it still works, and it does GPIO, but unfortunately for OP it
>> requires a graphical screen. (And to install libsdl-sound1.2 first, even
>> if you don't use sound.)
>
> It should work on the console without any GUI running.
>
> Try running it with the -D flag:
>
> rtb -D
>
> then looking at the list of modes it prints, then you can pick the mode/resolution with
>
> rtb -m X
>
> where X is the mode number listed from the -D command. Mode 0 is usually
> the highest resolution one which is the default if you don't use the
> -m flag.

Right! Thanks. I looked at the documentation and did try the -D flag but
I was another step removed, over ssh, and it just would not start. I
have not tried forwarding the X-server, that seemed a little over the
top for OP who intended it as a bash tool.

> RTB (and wiringPi) are sort of on holiday right now - I've had some health
> issues in the past year or 2 and am now in the middle of moving house,
> so once the dust has settled I'll be doing more with them.

All the best!

[A. Dumas]

On 25-03-2021 17:07, Dennis Lee Bieber wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 12:34:50 +0100, "A. Dumas" <alex...@dumas.fr.invalid>
> declaimed the following:

>
>> On 25-03-2021 11:47, Adrian Caspersz wrote:
>
>>
>> On the Raspberry Pi?! Because we're in comp.sys.raspberry-pi here.
>

> MicroSloth made it somewhat open-source and have ports for four
> architectures/OS... Using the port of .NET runtime...
>
> https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/scripting/install/installing-powershell?view=powershell-7.1
> https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/scripting/install/installing-powershell-core-on-linux?view=powershell-7.1#raspbian

I know... but........ that seems great if you do things with PowerShell
on Windows, not so much as a deliberate/independent choice on the Pi.

[Joe]

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 12:42:24 +0000
Adrian Caspersz <em...@here.invalid> wrote:

Why?

The more sophisticated Windows users think PowerShell is wonderful
because it give them access to a lot of stuff the GUI doesn't touch,
including a lot of things that *should* be in management GUIs e.g.
finding mailbox sizes in the last version of Exchange that I had
dealings with. That shouldn't be a command-line-only job, given what
else the GUI does cover.

But it's *Windows* stuff. *nix has always had a shell (indeed many) to
reach the command-line APIs of various daemons and applications. This
chap wants to get back to BASICs. Why, we don't know. I occasionally
dabble with VBA in Access, and even more occasionally in Excel, but I
have no other use for any form of BASIC.

--
Joe

[Gordon Henderson]

In article <605cbd8a$0$27913$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>,

A. Dumas <alex...@dumas.fr.invalid> wrote:
>On 25-03-2021 17:22, Gordon Henderson wrote:
>> A. Dumas <alex...@dumas.fr.invalid> wrote:
>>> - Gordon's RTB seems to have vanished from the repos but can be
>>> downloaded here:
>>> https://projects.drogon.net/rtb/rtb-download-and-install/ I just tried
>>> it and it still works, and it does GPIO, but unfortunately for OP it
>>> requires a graphical screen. (And to install libsdl-sound1.2 first, even
>>> if you don't use sound.)
>>
>> It should work on the console without any GUI running.
>>
>> Try running it with the -D flag:
>>
>> rtb -D
>>
>> then looking at the list of modes it prints, then you can pick the mode/resolution with
>>
>> rtb -m X
>>
>> where X is the mode number listed from the -D command. Mode 0 is usually
>> the highest resolution one which is the default if you don't use the
>> -m flag.
>
>Right! Thanks. I looked at the documentation and did try the -D flag but
>I was another step removed, over ssh, and it just would not start. I
>have not tried forwarding the X-server, that seemed a little over the
>top for OP who intended it as a bash tool.

If you use ssh -X then it should also work, but it'll be slow. Running it over VNC
also works.

Gordon

[Mayayana]

"Joe" <j...@jretrading.com> wrote

| The more sophisticated Windows users think PowerShell is wonderful
| because it give them access to a lot of stuff the GUI doesn't touch,
| including a lot of things that *should* be in management GUIs e.g.
| finding mailbox sizes in the last version of Exchange that I had
| dealings with. That shouldn't be a command-line-only job, given what
| else the GUI does cover.
|
| But it's *Windows* stuff. *nix has always had a shell (indeed many) to
| reach the command-line APIs of various daemons and applications.

I thought they ported it to Linux. At any rate, that's why
they produced it in the first place. It's superfluous, poorly
designed crap that's not dependably on all systems and has
become a venue for attacks. The only reason they
came out with it was to provide something for Linux
sever admins that would look familiar. As far as I'm concerned,
Linux can have it. Windows script with COM is far more
extensive and adaptable.

[Adrian Caspersz]

On 25/03/2021 20:31, Joe wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 12:42:24 +0000
> Adrian Caspersz <em...@here.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 25/03/2021 11:34, A. Dumas wrote:
>>> On 25-03-2021 11:47, Adrian Caspersz wrote:
>>>> On 24/03/2021 20:45, druck wrote:
>>>>> On 24/03/2021 09:43, F. W. wrote:
>>>>>> Is there a very simple interpreter for BASIC for BASH?
>>>>>
>>>>> If you are looking for an interactive interpreter as an
>>>>> alternative to a bash shell, and I would recommend iPython rather
>>>>> than a BASIC variant. Python is far more powerful language with a
>>>>> vast range of library modules, and iPython allows you to use all
>>>>> of that interactively.
>>>>
>>>> I'd suggest PowerShell ...
>>>
>>> On the Raspberry Pi?! Because we're in comp.sys.raspberry-pi here.
>>
>> Yup.
>>
>
> Why?
>
> The more sophisticated Windows users think PowerShell is wonderful
> because it give them access to a lot of stuff the GUI doesn't touch,

For me PowerShell doesn't absolutely need any such sophistication
(/bloat) like on Windows, but I find it useful as a language on the
command line.

Some people like PHP on the command line, but that's them ..

For scripting use, PowerShell's language features (variables,
conditionals, pipelines, iterations, parameters, heredocs, etc....) have
been stolen from Bash and considerably improved upon.

I float between Bash and PowerShell, though only done a couple of
PowerShell projects on Linux (network card throughput testing was one),
I much prefer the syntax and tools available (VSCODE)

My other pain point lately is the Puppet language and Icinga. ugh...

Replace all! by PowerShell


Has anyone seen my straight jacket?

--
Adrian C

[Adrian Caspersz]

On 25/03/2021 20:31, Joe wrote:

This
> chap wants to get back to BASICs. Why, we don't know.

I think it's an cool admirable thing. I started there.

There are a few non-linux (or linux very hidden) single board computer
projects out there, that power up from cold straight into a BASIC
interpreter command line, just like the old home microcomputers.

The 8-bit guy showed this one on YouTube, and there are others.

Color Maximite 2 - ARM CPU that runs BASIC!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IA7REQxohV4


The Raspberry Pi 400, to me is just screaming to be booted up with a BBC
BASIC prompt without a GUI. Just switch it on, and start coding like
it's 1984... er, 1981.

I occasionally
> dabble with VBA in Access, and even more occasionally in Excel, but I
> have no other use for any form of BASIC.

I used to be an Access developer for many many years, an occupation that
nearly sent me to the nut house ...

I still do a lot of windows things for work, with MS Office but I don't
use VBA or any of the development tools inside Excel or Access.

Instead, I drive the relevant Office COM libraries from PowerShell, to
create spreadsheets with pivot tables from scratch. It is an order of
magnitude faster and avoids living with the underlying often corrupted
file formats of xls and mdb.

It's not a popular programming technique though, and there are folks
that use Access VBA to be quick and dirty. I hate that.

--
Adrian C

[David Higton]

In message <ic5r82...@mid.individual.net>

Adrian Caspersz <em...@here.invalid> wrote:

> The Raspberry Pi 400, to me is just screaming to be booted up with a BBC
> BASIC prompt without a GUI. Just switch it on, and start coding like
> it's 1984... er, 1981.

Then you should run RISC OS on it. The only differences are that the
version of BBC BASIC on it has been improved substantially since the
1980s, and of course it's /much/ faster. And more memory. And...
and...

David

[Folderol]

On 26 Mar 2021 12:04:28 GMT
TimS <timst...@greenbee.net> wrote:

>Fuck to that. There, I think that gem of wit and extreme profundity settles
>the matter.
>

The O/P presumably had a reason for wanting BASIC, so if it does what they
want, where is the problem?

--
W J G

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:27:13 +0000
Adrian Caspersz <em...@here.invalid> wrote:

> The Raspberry Pi 400, to me is just screaming to be booted up with a BBC
> BASIC prompt without a GUI. Just switch it on, and start coding like
> it's 1984... er, 1981.

If you had a BBC Micro in 1981 I'm impressed, there were a handful
of model As shipped in December but even at Torch we didn't get model B
boards until well into 1982.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/

[Adrian Caspersz]

On 26/03/2021 13:43, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> On Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:27:13 +0000
> Adrian Caspersz <em...@here.invalid> wrote:
>
>> The Raspberry Pi 400, to me is just screaming to be booted up with a BBC
>> BASIC prompt without a GUI. Just switch it on, and start coding like
>> it's 1984... er, 1981.
>
> If you had a BBC Micro in 1981 I'm impressed, there were a handful
> of model As shipped in December but even at Torch we didn't get model B
> boards until well into 1982.

Ah true. My one came to me in 1983. I threw a small fortune at it.

I could now connect a Raspberry Pi to it as a tube co-processor, but
apart from playing retro games, I don't think I'd do much else with it
nowadays.

Should do it up and sell it (and get my money back....)

--
Adrian C

[Joe Beanfish]

On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 16:58:26 +0000, TimS wrote:

> On 25 Mar 2021 at 16:46:06 GMT, "A. Dumas" <alex...@dumas.fr.invalid>

> Why would you fart about with that rather than using one of the standard
> shells such as zsh? Not that I'd ever dream of writing a script with a shell
> scripting language.

*Looks at his own thousand line bourne shell scripts...

[Martin Gregorie]

On Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:01:45 +0000, Adrian Caspersz wrote:

> Has anyone seen my straight jacket?
>

Yes, though something I've see recently (a 20,000 line script written
using the Bourne Shell) has left me reeling and gagging and wishing I'd
never see it.

That said, bash is fine for the relatively short scripts I write with it,
but the way that it tends to stop on finding the first error makes it
unsuitable for anything longer than a few tens of lines, in my opinion,
anyway, because the stop-on-error approach makes debugging a large script
very slow unless you writeand test incrementally, which is still slow
going.

The two best scripting languages I've used are the mainframe scripting
language implemented for VME/B the ICL 2900 operating system, and IBM's
OS/400 scripting language, which both have very similar abilities, in
particular:

- very consistent syntax and utility naming conventions: on both OSen you
can reliably guess the name of a utility you've not previously used
though OS/400 muddies this because all names are max 9 characters and it
doesn't use name extensions such as .txt or .html

- VME/B used two names for everything: a long name and and an
abbreviation and the abbreviation formats were equally consistent, so
the deletefile(myfile) command deleted 'myfile' and so did xf(myfile).
You tended to use long names when writing SCL procedures (i.e. shell
scripts) and short names when typing commands into a terminal.

- OS/400 was just carefilr with its horrid short names, but at least if
you knew that if crtcblpgm was the COBOL compiler, crtrpgpgm was the
RPG3 compiler, crtplipgm compoiled PL/1 and crtftnpgm compiled Fortran.

- both compiled their script equivalents (procedures) very fast and had
good error reporting while compiling them.

- both used typed parameters allowed each parameter to be given a type,
name, default value and a short description.

- both had the equivalent of -? or --help but it worked by flashing up
a full-screen display of the procedure name and parameters, showing
type, name default value and description so you just entered your
parameters and hit the 'do it' key.

- both had a well-thought-out equivalent to the Unix/Linux 'apropos'
tool for finding commands by name.

Something like that would be a huge improvement for Linux, especially if
it was somehow possible to agree a more rational set of command names,
but I cant see the latter happening before the heat death of the universe.

[druck]

On 26/03/2021 10:27, Adrian Caspersz wrote:
> The Raspberry Pi 400, to me is just screaming to be booted up with a BBC
> BASIC prompt without a GUI. Just switch it on, and start coding like
> it's 1984... er, 1981.

Put RISC OS on it, and do a *ROMModules and note the number next to
BASIC then do a *Configure Language <number> Next time you boot you'll
be at the BASIC Prompt just like a BBC Micro.

To restore booting to the desktop, use the number for the Desktop module.

---druck

[Vincent Coen]

Hello Ahem!

Friday March 26 2021 13:43, you wrote to Adrian Caspersz:

> On Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:27:13 +0000
> Adrian Caspersz <em...@here.invalid> wrote:

>> The Raspberry Pi 400, to me is just screaming to be booted up with a
>> BBC BASIC prompt without a GUI. Just switch it on, and start coding
>> like it's 1984... er, 1981.

> If you had a BBC Micro in 1981 I'm impressed, there were a handful
> of model As shipped in December but even at Torch we didn't get model
> B boards until well into 1982.

I had a Touch system that was used to migrate MS, DR and others to their drive
formats and more importantly to test said products on it.

We did this for a very large number of PC manufacturers even before IBM got in
on the act.

Around the same time we developed a multi drive formatting machine which was a
bit of a large beast that supported CPM, MPM, DOS (PC and others), GEM & *nix
for drives of 8", 5.25 and 3.5" and the odd odd one such as a 2.5".

When we got orders for specific software we would copy from a master to the
specific format using programs written in C and Basic.

As we were the European distributor for many software vendors covering the
Operating Systems and applications the hardware manufacturers came to us for
their requirements for delivery any where outside the US.

The Company was M.P.I (Microcomputer Products International) and we shut down
mid to late 1985 due to others doing similar but with silly and heavy
discounting even to end users. Needless to say that within 3 months of us
closing most of the others did the same so may be we closed a bit too early :(

At least it allowed to get some flying in over the next few years by going
from
a PPL to IMC, Night, IR, Instructor, Twin, Jet and Commercial licenses and
ratings.

Must have done over 2,000 hours over a period of those 48 months covering
trips all over Europe and Middle East as well as some trips bringing over a
few twins mostly direct from the US to the UK and where ever possible using
the jet streams for max speed (ground) so on some A/C it was well under 12
hours with the odd one or two under 9. Not bad for piston based a/c.
Not can't counting the turbines.



Vincent

[druck]

On 26/03/2021 17:34, TimS wrote:

> On 26 Mar 2021 at 14:53:15 GMT, Joe Beanfish <joebe...@nospam.duh> wrote:
>> *Looks at his own thousand line bourne shell scripts...
>

> Perl or TECO would be clearer.

Only when starting from such a low base.

These days there is Python.

---druck

[Stewart Russell]

On Wednesday, March 24, 2021 at 5:43:19 a.m. UTC-4, F. W. wrote:
> Is there a very simple interpreter for BASIC for BASH?

Given the paucity of useful answers, here are the ones I use:

* Michael Haardt's Bas — http://www.moria.de/~michael/bas/ : command-line interpreter for a pretty complete implementation of ANSI Full BASIC (the one with matrix commands, but this one doesn't allow decimal floating point like the standard expects). There's a slightly updated version available if you substitute 2.6 for 2.5 in the download link.

* Matrix Brandy BASIC VI — http://brandy.matrixnetwork.co.uk/ : a very much improved BBC BASIC VI interpreter, which is able to compete with the RISC OS one for speed. The main brandy executable is graphical, but you can build the tbrandy and sbrandy command-line interpreters that work well from the shell.

* Richard Russell's BBC BASIC for SDL has command-line interpreters — https://www.bbcbasic.co.uk/bbcsdl/index.html : Richard has maintained many versions of BBC BASIC, from BBC BASIC for the Z80 Second Processor to BBC BASIC for Windows. He was also on the language steering committee.

* cbmbasic - Commodore BASIC V2 as a scripting language — https://github.com/mist64/cbmbasic : this is Commodore 64 basic transpiled into C, so you're effectively running 6502 instructions very quickly on your machine. Objectively, it's a fairly terrible BASIC interpreter, but you can call scripts with the #! line, if you must.

There are some other niche BASIC interpreters/compilers:

* freebasic: a compiler that is vaguely inspired by QuickBASIC/Visual BASIC

* PC-BASIC: a very faithful clone of GW-BASIC written in Python

* x11-basic: an interpreter/compiler very much influenced by GFA-BASIC on the Atari ST and Amiga. The developer's been working on this for about 20 years pretty much for their own amusement

* Decimal BASIC: this one can be a little hard to compile, and it doesn't help that most of the docs are in Japanese, but this is a complete (graphical-only) implementation of ANSI Full BASIC with decimal mathematics. Experience the joy of numbers rounding properly!

Of course, you could always run QBasic in DOSbox for all your GORILLAS.BAS needs.

Stewart

[F. W.]

Am 21.04.2021 um 03:13 schrieb Stewart Russell:

>> Is there a very simple interpreter for BASIC for BASH?
> Given the paucity of useful answers, here are the ones I use:

Thank you all.

I decided to use PC-Basic which runs good enough on my Pi 400.

FW

PS: Meanwhile I also fell in love with GEANY for C ;-)