Greg's Copland special-effects thingie is here

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Michael Sattler, San Francisco

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Jun 22, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/22/95
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...and is wonderful. It's shareware (US$10) named "Aaron" - look for it
at Info-Mac mirrors everywhere. It's just magnificent. The only thing I
can't seem to get to work is the menu-bar clock in the Date & Time: when I
select Espy Sans 10 I get some other font. Sigh.

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|
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Gary L. Gray

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Jun 22, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/22/95
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In article <msattler-220...@slip1008.sirius.com>,

msat...@jungle.com (Michael Sattler, San Francisco) wrote:

> ...and is wonderful. It's shareware (US$10) named "Aaron" - look for it
> at Info-Mac mirrors everywhere. It's just magnificent. The only thing I
> can't seem to get to work is the menu-bar clock in the Date & Time: when I
> select Espy Sans 10 I get some other font. Sigh.
>

I agree. It's amazing!!! I went into Greg's Buttons and changed the System
font to Espy Sans Bold 10 and it seems to do the trick for the clock.

Greg comes through again!

Best regards,

/-------------------------------------------------------------\
| Gary L. Gray (814) 863-1778 |
| Assistant Professor fax: (814) 863-7967 |
| Engineering Science & Mechanics glg...@engr.psu.edu |
| Penn State University gl...@psu.edu |
| ftp://coriolis.esm.psu.edu//pub/gray AOL: GLGray |
|-------------------------------------------------------------|
| mechanical systems, nonlinear dynamics and chaos, stability |
\=============================================================/

Kir...@psu.edu

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Jun 22, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/22/95
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In article <glgesm-2206...@horseshoe.esm.psu.edu>,

glg...@engr.psu.edu (Gary L. Gray) wrote:

> I agree. It's amazing!!! I went into Greg's Buttons and changed the System
> font to Espy Sans Bold 10 and it seems to do the trick for the clock.
>
> Greg comes through again!

Very sharp. No complaints here, although the trash icon did seem to
benefit from a two pixel shift to the right. Any coments on what it might
take to implement the "drawer" feature for shrunken windows?

-K6

Jase Pittman-Wells

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Jun 22, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/22/95
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Kir...@psu.edu writes:

>Very sharp. No complaints here, although the trash icon did seem to
>benefit from a two pixel shift to the right. Any coments on what it might
>take to implement the "drawer" feature for shrunken windows?

I keep looking at the Trash, and the text below the icon looks
off-center, due to that shadow on the right.

I'm not sure if that's what you were driving at when you say the Trash
icon *did* benefit from a 2-pixel shift. Do you mean there's an update
that fixes this icon??

Jase
--
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Jase Pittman-Wells * Home of the Army of Lovers Page and the V Page! * M
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Marc

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Jun 22, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/22/95
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In article <msattler-220...@slip1008.sirius.com>,
msat...@jungle.com (Michael Sattler, San Francisco) wrote:

> ...and is wonderful. It's shareware (US$10) named "Aaron" - look for it
> at Info-Mac mirrors everywhere. It's just magnificent. The only thing I
> can't seem to get to work is the menu-bar clock in the Date & Time: when I
> select Espy Sans 10 I get some other font. Sigh.
>

I got it from:
ftp://ftp-2.amug.org/info-mac/_User_Interface/aaron-10b2.hqx

-----------
Marc R
http://www.iii.net/users/mer/Welcome.html

Robert Cassidy

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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> In article <msattler-220...@slip1008.sirius.com>,
> msat...@jungle.com (Michael Sattler, San Francisco) wrote:
>
> > ...and is wonderful. It's shareware (US$10) named "Aaron" - look for it
> > at Info-Mac mirrors everywhere. It's just magnificent. The only thing I
> > can't seem to get to work is the menu-bar clock in the Date & Time: when I
> > select Espy Sans 10 I get some other font. Sigh.
> >
>

> I agree. It's amazing!!! I went into Greg's Buttons and changed the System
> font to Espy Sans Bold 10 and it seems to do the trick for the clock.
>
> Greg comes through again!
>

> Best regards,
>

A comment...

The small icons used for the folders didn't strike me. The little tab on
the top looks square, not rounded. Sombody released a set of folder icons
on the net that have a very nicely rounded tab. I've replaced mine but I
wonder what everyone elses opinions are.

--
Bob Cassidy
UC Irvine

BLAM DSGN

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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Great work on the Copland extension. I did however find one somewhat major
conflict, the radio buttons & check boxes conflict with Quark XPress 3.31
for 68k macs but not for Powermacs. Instead of drawing buttons, it draws
only a black diamond. Aside from this, the extension is wonderful.

Kir...@psu.edu

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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In article <rmcassid-230...@dante.eng.uci.edu>, rmca...@uci.edu
(Robert Cassidy) wrote:


> A comment...
>
> The small icons used for the folders didn't strike me. The little tab on
> the top looks square, not rounded. Sombody released a set of folder icons
> on the net that have a very nicely rounded tab. I've replaced mine but I
> wonder what everyone elses opinions are.

Are we talking about the ics8's here? If so, I'd like to compare. Any
chance that the set you substituted has a name?

-K6

Allen G. Newman

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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In article <3sdbmb$o...@rjo02.embratel.net.br>, Christiano Vilhena
<cvil...@embratel.net.br> wrote:

>Does anybody here knows how to activate the "window drawer" function
>on Aaron?

Use ResEdit to replace the WDEF resource of Aaron with the WDEF resource
of Copland WDEF 1.0b13. It works perfectly as far I can tell.
_
----------------------- | | | | _ | | ---------------------
Allen G. Newman |_| | | |_ |\| PGP Public Key
ane...@charlie.usd.edu | | |_ |_ |_ | | available on request.

Kir...@psu.edu

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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In article <3sd2vf$l...@crl10.crl.com>, ja...@crl.com (Jase Pittman-Wells) wrote:

> Kir...@psu.edu writes:
>
> >Very sharp. No complaints here, although the trash icon did seem to

> >benefit from a two pixel shift to the right. Any comments on what it might


> >take to implement the "drawer" feature for shrunken windows?
>
> I keep looking at the Trash, and the text below the icon looks
> off-center, due to that shadow on the right.
>
> I'm not sure if that's what you were driving at when you say the Trash
> icon *did* benefit from a 2-pixel shift. Do you mean there's an update
> that fixes this icon??

This may not be a problem for most people. But with the low shadow
contrast of the grey "slate" desktop I use, the can appeared off-center
and was constantly catching my eye.

I meant that I changed the icon myself and felt that it looked better
*after* I had done so. Thus the *did*.

If you find the current icon distracting, you can easily change its
positioning with ResEdit.

Mail if you need more details.

Regards,
-K6

Christiano Vilhena

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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Does anybody here knows how to activate the "window drawer" function
on Aaron?

[ ]s

Christiano

cvil...@embatel.net.br

Robert Cassidy

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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Yeah, I'll try and look it up and post on Monday. There are about 8 sets
and I think only one had the nice ics8's. I'll get back to ya on that one.

Allen G. Newman

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Jun 23, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/23/95
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In article <3sd2vf$l...@crl10.crl.com>, ja...@crl.com (Jase Pittman-Wells) wrote:

>Kir...@psu.edu writes:
>
>>Very sharp. No complaints here, although the trash icon did seem to

>>benefit from a two pixel shift to the right. Any coments on what it might


>>take to implement the "drawer" feature for shrunken windows?

Use ResEdit to replace Aaron's WDEF resource with the WDEF resource from
Copland WDEF 1.0d13.

>I keep looking at the Trash, and the text below the icon looks
>off-center, due to that shadow on the right.
>
>I'm not sure if that's what you were driving at when you say the Trash
>icon *did* benefit from a 2-pixel shift. Do you mean there's an update
>that fixes this icon??

You can edit or replace the icons with whatever you want in ResEdit.

Aaron 1.0b2's Trash icon is not "authentic" -- look at the "full trash"
icon and note that the handle on the lid does not match the published
Copland screen shots, and that the shading gradation in both is a bit more
choppy.

I sent Greg my Trash icons that I made from the Macworld
captured-from-screen-shot Trash icons on AOL. He thanked me for them so
maybe they'll show up in the next version when he fixes the bug that
causes pushbuttons to turn into horizontal sliders(!) in Open/preview
dialogs.

Wyo Bopper

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Jun 24, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/24/95
to
I'm very impressed with Aaron. Good job Greg!

I have two suggestions that I would like to see included in future
versions if possible.

First, I think that the close and zoom box buttons should be 3D when you
push them. They should "push in" like the other buttons.

Second, I would like to see the 3D progress bars previewed in the Mac
magazines added.

I don't know how hard adding these will be or if it is technically
possible, but I think it would complete the "Copland 7.5" effect nicely.
Roland E. Miller, III
Mechanical Engineer

Jase Pittman-Wells

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Jun 24, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/24/95
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I'm trying Aaron out, and when using ZTerm 1.0b3, clicking on
the scroller acts like I'm really clicking in the gray scrollbar
areas.. Anybody else have this problem?

Michael Russell Dong

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Jun 24, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/24/95
to
In article <3sipql$d...@crl3.crl.com>, Jase Pittman-Wells <ja...@crl.com> wrote:
>
>I'm trying Aaron out, and when using ZTerm 1.0b3, clicking on
>the scroller acts like I'm really clicking in the gray scrollbar
>areas.. Anybody else have this problem?
>

I have this problem too. I also ran into an incompatibility with the
Scrolling Control Panel from Apple (Aaron doesn't work when it's loaded).

The scrolling control panel, btw, lets you control the throttle and
live scroll features of a scrollable window.


--
| Michael R. Dong / md...@galaxy.csc.calpoly.edu
| California Polytechnic \ md...@trumpet.aix.calpoly.edu
| San Luis Obispo, CA / http://www.csc.calpoly.edu/~mdong

Iain Anderson

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
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rmca...@uci.edu (Robert Cassidy) writes:

<cuts>

] A comment...
]
] The small icons used for the folders didn't strike me. The little tab on


] the top looks square, not rounded. Sombody released a set of folder icons
] on the net that have a very nicely rounded tab. I've replaced mine but I
] wonder what everyone elses opinions are.

]

I don't like the new Copland icons much (large or small), they're a bit
"chunky" if you know what I mean. The Appearance Manager, when it arrives,
should be flexible, so we won't have to put up with anything we don't like
in the (superficial) interface. Hopefully, it'll have the power of Aurora/
MacMakeover, Greg's Buttons, Church Windows, and some "Church Controls"
equivalent.

BTW, you might like (ahem) /gui/grf/manilla-folder-icons.hqx on Info-Mac. :)

Best of luck,
Iain.

--
..............C..s..O..u..N..b..F..v..O..e..R..r..M..t..............
What does your nose smell like? Hold at arm's length and test again.
Iain Anderson - ia...@cit.gu.edu.au - http://www.cit.gu.edu.au/~iain/

John Hirsch

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
to
I seem to have some unusual problems with Aaron, at least nobody has
mentioned them yet...

When used in conjunction with Greg's Buttons (3.7.1), I'm getting random
2-D buttons in dialogs that used to have 3-D buttons. But it comes and
goes - one time I'll bring up the dialog and they're 2-D, the next time
they're 3-D. Or some are 2-D and some are 3-D. Very weird. In all cases,
the 3-D buttons do look like the Greg's Buttons 3-D, not the Aaron 3-D.

So, I tried taking Greg's Buttons out, but then my System font won't
change to Espi Sans Bold 10. It stays as Chicago. I even removed all my
extensions and the result was the same. It wouldn't substitute my font.
Also, it looks like Aaron is supposed to update the icon for the System
File suitcase, but mine looks like the same old suitcase. The other icons
work great, though.

Just thought I'd mention it, in case someone else is also experiencing
this behavior. I think the extension's great!! Love those scroll bars, and
the WDEF is much more stable on my machine than the Copland WDEF beta. :-)

--
John....@mixcom.com

Hi there.

Allen G. Newman

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
to
In article <rmcassid-230...@dante.eng.uci.edu>, rmca...@uci.edu
(Robert Cassidy) wrote:

>In article <Kirby6-2306...@tsppp44.cac.psu.edu>, Kir...@psu.edu wrote:
>
>> In article <rmcassid-230...@dante.eng.uci.edu>, rmca...@uci.edu
>> (Robert Cassidy) wrote:
>

>> > The small icons used for the folders didn't strike me. The little tab on
>> > the top looks square, not rounded. Sombody released a set of folder icons
>> > on the net that have a very nicely rounded tab. I've replaced mine but I
>> > wonder what everyone elses opinions are.

To me, it looks like Aaron's folder icons are a perfect match to what's
shown in the Copland screen shots (I have gifs from MacUser to compare
with), so I'm not sure what your preference is.

Jason C. Charnick

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
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In article <3sir4s$2...@phoenix.csc.calpoly.edu>,

md...@phoenix.csc.calpoly.edu (Michael Russell Dong) wrote:

> In article <3sipql$d...@crl3.crl.com>, Jase Pittman-Wells <ja...@crl.com> wrote:
> >
> >I'm trying Aaron out, and when using ZTerm 1.0b3, clicking on
> >the scroller acts like I'm really clicking in the gray scrollbar
> >areas.. Anybody else have this problem?
> >
>
> I have this problem too. I also ran into an incompatibility with the
> Scrolling Control Panel from Apple (Aaron doesn't work when it's loaded).
>
> The scrolling control panel, btw, lets you control the throttle and
> live scroll features of a scrollable window.

Where can you get a hold of this scrolling control panel? I'd love to have
live scrolling features, a la ZTerm 1.0b3, and X-Windows.

Jason

--
Jason Charnick
c/o Boston University
char...@acs.bu.edu

Any opinions contained here within are subject to the ownership of Major League Baseball. Any rebroadcast, reproduction, or retransmission of the these opinions without the express written consent of Major League Baseball or its subsidiaries is strictly prohibited. Or something like that.

Jonathan D. Gift

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
to
In article <3sir4s$2...@phoenix.csc.calpoly.edu>,
md...@phoenix.csc.calpoly.edu (Michael Russell Dong) wrote:

> I have this problem too. I also ran into an incompatibility with the
> Scrolling Control Panel from Apple (Aaron doesn't work when it's loaded).

Can I ftp this from Apple? If so, do you have a dir/file name?
Thanks.

jg...@primenet.com

"Hey, I think I've finally got the hang of i-"

Matthew Kapus

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
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jg...@primenet.com (Jonathan D. Gift) wrote


>In article <3sir4s$2...@phoenix.csc.calpoly.edu>,
>md...@phoenix.csc.calpoly.edu (Michael Russell Dong) wrote:
>
>> I have this problem too. I also ran into an incompatibility with the
>> Scrolling Control Panel from Apple (Aaron doesn't work when it's loaded).
>
>Can I ftp this from Apple? If so, do you have a dir/file name?
>Thanks.
>
> jg...@primenet.com
>

It's written by Ken McLeod of the Support Tools Development Group at
Apple, but is unsupported by Apple.
You can get it at:
http://hyperarchive.lcs.mit.edu/HyperArchive/Archive/gui/scrolling.hqx

mka...@u.washington.edu
http://alfred1.u.washington.edu:8080/~mkapus

David Lewis

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
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Regarding the folder icons... these look much better than the blue ones...

<ftp://ftp.ucs.ubc.ca//pub/mac/info-mac/gui/grf/
silver-copland-icons.hqx>

Mike Schwartz

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Jun 25, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/25/95
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In article <charnick-250...@ppp-83-15.bu.edu>,
char...@acs.bu.edu (Jason C. Charnick) wrote:

->Where can you get a hold of this scrolling control panel? I'd love to have
->live scrolling features, a la ZTerm 1.0b3, and X-Windows.

You can probably find it on Info-Mac or Umich. Easier way to find it is
just to use HyperArchive to search it.

--
Michael Schwartz
ru...@wimsey.com

"In cyberspace, nobody knows you're canadian, eh?"
---------
Microsoft Network is prohibited from redistributing this work in any form, in whole or in part. Copyright (c), Michael Schwartz, 1995.
License to distribute this post is available to Microsoft for $1000. Posting without permission constitutes an agreement to these terms. Please send notices of violation to Postm...@microsoft.com and ru...@wimsey.com.
Portions of this .sig licencsed from Joe Ragosta (doc...@interramp.com)

Peter Moller

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
One question: Isn't the window border just toooo wide? I find that a major
problem. Anyone else?

(Apart from that: great work!)


--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Department of Computer Science, Lund Institute of Technology
Box 118, S-221 00 LUND, Sweden, tfn +46 -46 10 41 56, fax +46 -46 13 10 21

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
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In article <msattler-220...@slip1008.sirius.com>,
msat...@jungle.com (Michael Sattler, San Francisco) wrote:

> ...and is wonderful. It's shareware (US$10) named "Aaron" - look for it
> at Info-Mac mirrors everywhere. It's just magnificent. The only thing I
> can't seem to get to work is the menu-bar clock in the Date & Time: when I
> select Espy Sans 10 I get some other font. Sigh.

The system font I use is Espy Sans BOLD 10. Just set the menu-bar clock
font to Chicago 12 and Aaron will do the rest.

-- Greg Landweber
gr...@math.harvard.edu
(author of "Greg's Buttons" and "Greg's Browser")

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to

> In article <glgesm-2206...@horseshoe.esm.psu.edu>,
> glg...@engr.psu.edu (Gary L. Gray) wrote:
>

> Very sharp. No complaints here, although the trash icon did seem to
> benefit from a two pixel shift to the right. Any coments on what it might
> take to implement the "drawer" feature for shrunken windows?

We're redoing the trash icon slightly, although I still find it unsatisfying.

If you mean the Drawer feature from the Copland WDEF, that wouldn't be too
hard to implement. However, that isn't what Copland really does. First of
all, the widget in the menu bar is really a WindowShade toggle that rolls up
the window to its title bar. We'll be implementing that in the next version.

As for the real drawers, they appear whenever you drag the window to the
bottom of the screen. The window lives just below the screen, and when
you click the tab, the window slides up to become visible. Clicking the
tab again drops the window back down. This is much harder to implement,
but we're working on it. I know at least one other person who is working
on such a hack, too.

-- Greg Landweber
gr...@math.harvard.edu
(author of Greg's Buttons, Greg's Browser, and Aaron)

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <3sdbmb$o...@rjo02.embratel.net.br>, Christiano Vilhena
<cvil...@embratel.net.br> wrote:

> Does anybody here knows how to activate the "window drawer" function
> on Aaron?

Aaron doesn't have that feature...yet.

BTW, please note that Aaron is $10 shareware. Read the docs for more info.

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <rmcassid-230...@dante.eng.uci.edu>, rmca...@uci.edu
(Robert Cassidy) wrote:

> The small icons used for the folders didn't strike me. The little tab on
> the top looks square, not rounded. Sombody released a set of folder icons
> on the net that have a very nicely rounded tab. I've replaced mine but I
> wonder what everyone elses opinions are.

The small icons in Aaron exactly match those in the Copland screen shots
on the MacUser web page.

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <3seq8d$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, blam...@aol.com (BLAM
DSGN) wrote:

That will be fixed in the next version.

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <3shndn$n...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, wyob...@aol.com (Wyo
Bopper) wrote:

> First, I think that the close and zoom box buttons should be 3D when you
> push them. They should "push in" like the other buttons.

We tried that, but we didn't think it looked good. The problem is that the
icons are very small and have a lot of detail. A full pixel shift is too
much in this case.

On the other hand, the title bar widgets are just resources, so you can try
editing them with ResEdit. If you come up with something that you think looks
good, send me a copy!

> Second, I would like to see the 3D progress bars previewed in the Mac
> magazines added.

There aren't any system progress bar routines to patch; each application does
its progress bars separately. Still, I am thinking of patching at least the
Finder to do Copland-style progress bars.

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <john.hirsch-25...@wwvvww.mixcom.com>,
john....@mixcom.com (John Hirsch) wrote:

> When used in conjunction with Greg's Buttons (3.7.1), I'm getting random
> 2-D buttons in dialogs that used to have 3-D buttons. But it comes and
> goes - one time I'll bring up the dialog and they're 2-D, the next time
> they're 3-D. Or some are 2-D and some are 3-D. Very weird. In all cases,
> the 3-D buttons do look like the Greg's Buttons 3-D, not the Aaron 3-D.
>
> So, I tried taking Greg's Buttons out, but then my System font won't
> change to Espi Sans Bold 10. It stays as Chicago. I even removed all my
> extensions and the result was the same. It wouldn't substitute my font.
> Also, it looks like Aaron is supposed to update the icon for the System
> File suitcase, but mine looks like the same old suitcase. The other icons
> work great, though.

Both of these bugs should be fixed in the next version. Please let me know
if they persist.

UASTUREP

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
The Drawer function's true usefulness is that fact that the drawers
can be opened from within applications without returning to the Finder
(i.e. the menus stay the same,etc.) That would approximate it to be
closer to a clipping file where you can grab the file and drag and drop as
opposed to the simple "minimizing" function of Windowshade. With the
return to the Finder, the drawers would lose their real usefulness. For
more info see the October 3rd,1994 issue of MacWeek. That REAL drawer
function will be in Copland.

Gregory D. Landweber

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <peterm.804154997@adils>, pet...@dna.lth.se (Peter Moller) wrote:

> One question: Isn't the window border just toooo wide? I find that a major
> problem. Anyone else?

It is the same size as in all the Copland screen shots.

Tim Streater

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Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <greg-26069...@glandweb.student.harvard.edu>,

gr...@math.harvard.edu (Gregory D. Landweber) wrote:

>In article <peterm.804154997@adils>, pet...@dna.lth.se (Peter Moller) wrote:
>
>> One question: Isn't the window border just toooo wide? I find that a major
>> problem. Anyone else?
>
>It is the same size as in all the Copland screen shots.
>

Hmmm. I tried Aaron today (1.0b2). I am not that convinced.

1) The borders *are* too wide. It would be nice to be able to adjust them
(this was one of my beefs with Motif. Others are too numerous to mention,
but the fact that the only way in Motif to adjust stuff like that was by
editing some crappy and obscure file called .Xsettings or whatever was a
major one). Adjustments should be done via a CP. How about building it
into Buttons?

2) The 3-D effect fails under the menubar clock. I use Times/18pt here and
don't intend to change (I have a feeling this was addressed in earlier
posts but missed them, sorry).

3) The 3D effect in windows. The problem here is not only the extra
real-estate taken up by the border, but the fact that, overall, it looks
funny because you have this 3D window with 2D contents. The 7.0 windows
are 3D-ish anyway, but without the fat border.

4) The Epsi bold font is nice, I use it with GB at the moment.

5) The icons are a bit naff. They look too Windows/Openlook-ish for my
taste. And if you have a folder icon which is special (e.g. those from 4D)
they look like the old ones.

6) I did have a crash/hang, although that may have been the Launcher. I
tried to move the Launcher on my 2nd screen (Q610 with Radius card) and
someone must have rung ALL STOP down to the engine room.

I should point out that, although I will exercise my free will and not use
Aaron, I do appreciate Greg's having created it, if it allows us to see
what the future looks like. So far I don't like it particularly.

--
Tim.

MegaWatt

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <t.c.streater-2...@mac-tim.dante.org.uk>,
t.c.st...@dante.org.uk (Tim Streater) wrote:

>Hmmm. I tried Aaron today (1.0b2). I am not that convinced.
>
>1) The borders *are* too wide. It would be nice to be able to adjust them
>(this was one of my beefs with Motif. Others are too numerous to mention,
>but the fact that the only way in Motif to adjust stuff like that was by
>editing some crappy and obscure file called .Xsettings or whatever was a
>major one). Adjustments should be done via a CP. How about building it
>into Buttons?

You have to understand that the window can be dragged by the frame. To
make the frame smaller would defeat this purpose.

I haven't seen the rest, so I cannot comment.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
MegaWatt |
| _____ _____ _____ _ _
- AKA - | |__ / | ___ || ___ \ | | | |
| / / | |_| || |_/ / | | | |
Aaron L. Bratcher | / /__ | ___ || __/ |_| |_|
University of Chicago | |_____||_| |_||_| (_) (_)
mega...@noproblem.uchicago.edu |
----------------------------------------------------------------------


Gary L. Gray

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to

> I seem to have some unusual problems with Aaron, at least nobody has
> mentioned them yet...
>

> When used in conjunction with Greg's Buttons (3.7.1), I'm getting random
> 2-D buttons in dialogs that used to have 3-D buttons. But it comes and
> goes - one time I'll bring up the dialog and they're 2-D, the next time
> they're 3-D. Or some are 2-D and some are 3-D. Very weird. In all cases,
> the 3-D buttons do look like the Greg's Buttons 3-D, not the Aaron 3-D.
>
> So, I tried taking Greg's Buttons out, but then my System font won't
> change to Espi Sans Bold 10. It stays as Chicago. I even removed all my
> extensions and the result was the same. It wouldn't substitute my font.
> Also, it looks like Aaron is supposed to update the icon for the System
> File suitcase, but mine looks like the same old suitcase. The other icons
> work great, though.
>

> Just thought I'd mention it, in case someone else is also experiencing
> this behavior. I think the extension's great!! Love those scroll bars, and
> the WDEF is much more stable on my machine than the Copland WDEF beta. :-)
>

Exactly the same things have been happening to me. I have also noticed the
intermittent 2D buttons. In addition, I found the only way to get Espy as
my System font was to use Greg's Buttons to do it.

Best regards,

/-------------------------------------------------------------\
| Gary L. Gray (814) 863-1778 |
| Assistant Professor fax: (814) 863-7967 |
| Engineering Science & Mechanics glg...@engr.psu.edu |
| Penn State University gl...@psu.edu |
| ftp://coriolis.esm.psu.edu//pub/gray AOL: GLGray |
|-------------------------------------------------------------|
| mechanical systems, nonlinear dynamics and chaos, stability |
\=============================================================/

Sam Huffman

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <ZBIR.95Ju...@nickel.ucs.indiana.edu>,
zb...@nickel.ucs.indiana.edu (zachery joseph bir) wrote:

> >>>>> "Gregory" == Gregory D Landweber <gr...@math.harvard.edu> writes:
>
> Gregory> In article <3sdbmb$o...@rjo02.embratel.net.br>, Christiano


> Gregory> Vilhena <cvil...@embratel.net.br> wrote:
>
> >> Does anybody here knows how to activate the "window drawer"
> >> function on Aaron?
>

> Gregory> Aaron doesn't have that feature...yet.
>
> Greg,
>
> Please don't hate me for this, and I _will_ register, but I found an
> easy way to "hack" aaron to give the drawer effect. Open up a copy of
> the Copland WDEF floating around amug (the latest version is
> preferable) with ResEdit, and copy out the entire 'wdef' resource, and
> paste it into aaron. It maintains everything else, and gives the click
> on the button to "drawerize" the open window.
>
> So far (three days now of intensive use), it's stable, so you may want
> to try it out yourself...
>
> Expect that check, Greg, you've done some really cool things...
>
> Zac
>
> Gregory> BTW, please note that Aaron is $10 shareware. Read the
> Gregory> docs for more info.
>
> Gregory> -- Greg Landweber gr...@math.harvard.edu (author of Greg's
> Gregory> Buttons, Greg's Browser, and Aaron)
> --
> Zachery J. Bir - zb...@indiana.edu
> Mac Specialist - ACCESS MicroCenter / Consultant - UCSPCC GraphixZone
> work: (812) 855-0910 / (812) 855-1854 - home: (812) 336-3066
> http://nickel.ucs.indiana.edu/~zbir/

My understanding is that the Copland WDEF does some really skanky things
to get the drawer effect, and therefore it causes some significant
problems with a few very common applications. I believe the author of the
WDEF himself suggested that people stay away from the drawer "feature". He
left it in the current release after an earlier beta with the feature was
leaked out...

Sam Huffman

Randy Stokes

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
I may have found another bug/conflict: When Aaron is loaded on my Centris
610 running System 7.5, it seems the Open File dialog box in JPEGView 3.2
is screwed up; the normal buttons for Open, Cancel, etc. on the right side
of the box aren't obscured by what appear to be slider type controls.
Clicking in that area, or trying to manipulate the sliders, produces no
results. Double clicking on the name of a file in the window seems to
work fine, however.

Randy Stokes
rst...@indirect.com

In article <greg-26069...@glandweb.student.harvard.edu>,
gr...@math.harvard.edu (Gregory D. Landweber) wrote:

> -- Greg Landweber
> gr...@math.harvard.edu
> (author of Greg's Buttons, Greg's Browser, and Aaron)

Randy Stokes
rst...@indirect.com

zachery joseph bir

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to

ar...@tiac.net

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <megawatt-260...@fpm-mac-17.uchicago.edu>,
mega...@noproblem.uchicago.edu (MegaWatt) wrote:

: In article <t.c.streater-2...@mac-tim.dante.org.uk>,


: t.c.st...@dante.org.uk (Tim Streater) wrote:
:
: >Hmmm. I tried Aaron today (1.0b2). I am not that convinced.
: >
: >1) The borders *are* too wide. It would be nice to be able to adjust them
: >(this was one of my beefs with Motif. Others are too numerous to mention,
: >but the fact that the only way in Motif to adjust stuff like that was by
: >editing some crappy and obscure file called .Xsettings or whatever was a
: >major one). Adjustments should be done via a CP. How about building it
: >into Buttons?
:
: You have to understand that the window can be dragged by the frame. To
: make the frame smaller would defeat this purpose.
:

I would rather have the option to *resize* the window by dragging the
frame (a la Windoze). Any chance of seeing this option in future releases?

--Art

--
Boston Ska home page
http://www.tiac.net/users/artc
finger ar...@artc.tiac.net for PGP public key

Jase Pittman-Wells

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
rst...@indirect.com (Randy Stokes) writes:
>I may have found another bug/conflict: When Aaron is loaded on my Centris
>610 running System 7.5, it seems the Open File dialog box in JPEGView 3.2
>is screwed up; the normal buttons for Open, Cancel, etc. on the right side
>of the box aren't obscured by what appear to be slider type controls.
>Clicking in that area, or trying to manipulate the sliders, produces no
>results. Double clicking on the name of a file in the window seems to
>work fine, however.

That happens on my System 7.5 IIsi, also. Sometimes those slider
controls appear, then sometimes the normal 2-D buttons appear.

Jase
--
*** http://www.crl.com/~jase/html/homepage.html *** I
Jase Pittman-Wells * Home of the Army of Lovers Page and the V Page! * M
ja...@crl.com * * 1
*** Visit the expanded and updated V Home Page! *** 2

Gregory D. Landweber

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <glgesm-2606...@horseshoe.esm.psu.edu>,

glg...@engr.psu.edu (Gary L. Gray) wrote:

> In article <john.hirsch-25...@wwvvww.mixcom.com>,
> john....@mixcom.com (John Hirsch) wrote:
>
> > When used in conjunction with Greg's Buttons (3.7.1), I'm getting random
> > 2-D buttons in dialogs that used to have 3-D buttons. But it comes and
> > goes - one time I'll bring up the dialog and they're 2-D, the next time
> > they're 3-D. Or some are 2-D and some are 3-D. Very weird. In all cases,
> > the 3-D buttons do look like the Greg's Buttons 3-D, not the Aaron 3-D.
> >
> > So, I tried taking Greg's Buttons out, but then my System font won't
> > change to Espi Sans Bold 10. It stays as Chicago. I even removed all my
> > extensions and the result was the same. It wouldn't substitute my font.
> > Also, it looks like Aaron is supposed to update the icon for the System
> > File suitcase, but mine looks like the same old suitcase. The other icons
> > work great, though.
> >
> > Just thought I'd mention it, in case someone else is also experiencing
> > this behavior. I think the extension's great!! Love those scroll bars, and
> > the WDEF is much more stable on my machine than the Copland WDEF beta. :-)
> >
>
> Exactly the same things have been happening to me. I have also noticed the
> intermittent 2D buttons. In addition, I found the only way to get Espy as
> my System font was to use Greg's Buttons to do it.

Both of these bugs will be fixed in 1.0b4 (due out tomorrow).

-- Greg Landweber
gr...@math.harvard.edu
(author of Greg's Buttons, Greg's Browser, and Aaron)

Gregory D. Landweber

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <rstokes-2606...@s54.phxslip4.indirect.com>,
rst...@indirect.com (Randy Stokes) wrote:

> I may have found another bug/conflict: When Aaron is loaded on my Centris
> 610 running System 7.5, it seems the Open File dialog box in JPEGView 3.2
> is screwed up; the normal buttons for Open, Cancel, etc. on the right side
> of the box aren't obscured by what appear to be slider type controls.
> Clicking in that area, or trying to manipulate the sliders, produces no
> results. Double clicking on the name of a file in the window seems to
> work fine, however.

This will be fixed in 1.0b4.

Steve Muncy

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
In article <3sngin$4...@crl10.crl.com>, ja...@crl.com (Jase Pittman-Wells) wrote:

>rst...@indirect.com (Randy Stokes) writes:
>>I may have found another bug/conflict: When Aaron is loaded on my Centris
>>610 running System 7.5, it seems the Open File dialog box in JPEGView 3.2
>>is screwed up; the normal buttons for Open, Cancel, etc. on the right side
>>of the box aren't obscured by what appear to be slider type controls.
>>Clicking in that area, or trying to manipulate the sliders, produces no
>>results. Double clicking on the name of a file in the window seems to
>>work fine, however.
>

>That happens on my System 7.5 IIsi, also. Sometimes those slider
>controls appear, then sometimes the normal 2-D buttons appear.

I have also noticed the same thing on my IIvx with both SimpleText and
ClarisWorks 4.0 (using sys 7.5.1).

------------------------------------
Steve A. Muncy
Dallas, Texas
smu...@onramp.net
http://rampages.onramp.net/~smuncy/sam.html

Steven M. Blacher

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to

> I may have found another bug/conflict: When Aaron is loaded on my Centris
> 610 running System 7.5, it seems the Open File dialog box in JPEGView 3.2
> is screwed up; the normal buttons for Open, Cancel, etc. on the right side
> of the box aren't obscured by what appear to be slider type controls.
> Clicking in that area, or trying to manipulate the sliders, produces no
> results. Double clicking on the name of a file in the window seems to
> work fine, however.

Yes, I've had the same conflict with JPEGView (and the same problem with
the Open Directory Dialog Box has also shown up in Clarisworks). However,
I wrote to Greg about it, who wrote back that he knows of this bug, and
is working on a fix for the next release of Aaron.

Steven

_________________________________________
Steven M. Blacher / Wellfleet Productions
13910 Old Harbor Lane, Suite 209
Marina Del Rey, California 90292
Tel: 310.821.8867 Fax: 310.827.7878
Email: sb...@primenet.com

onseteng

unread,
Jun 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/26/95
to
I realize that it is only trying to duplicate the screenshots, but
I for one would be willing to give up exact duplication for
non-confliction (if that's a word).

-onseteng.


Gregory D. Landweber

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to
In article <sbwp-26069...@ip210.lax.primenet.com>,

sb...@primenet.com (Steven M. Blacher) wrote:

> Yes, I've had the same conflict with JPEGView (and the same problem with
> the Open Directory Dialog Box has also shown up in Clarisworks). However,
> I wrote to Greg about it, who wrote back that he knows of this bug, and
> is working on a fix for the next release of Aaron.

I just send Aaron 1.0b4 to macgifts last night, so it should appear on the
internet archives any day now.

Daniel Ebneter

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to

> I may have found another bug/conflict: When Aaron is loaded on my Centris
> 610 running System 7.5, it seems the Open File dialog box in JPEGView 3.2
> is screwed up; the normal buttons for Open, Cancel, etc. on the right side
> of the box aren't obscured by what appear to be slider type controls.
> Clicking in that area, or trying to manipulate the sliders, produces no
> results. Double clicking on the name of a file in the window seems to
> work fine, however.
>

I experienced the same while experimenting with Quicktime, MIDI Manager
and the QT Musical Instruments (just Symbionts loaded, no Aaron).
So maybe QT is to blame ... JPEGView can make use of it,I think.
Does the problem disappear without Aaron?

Daniel

--
Daniel Ebneter University of Bern,Switzerland
ebn...@iap.unibe.ch Institute of Applied Physics
---------------------------------------------------------------------

K.G. Spence

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to
Both the new WDEF extensions are extremely well done, and obviously involved a lot of hard work.
Copland WDEF 13 *seems* to redraw quicker than Aaron, and is now absoloutely stable (at least
on my 68K) Does anyone know if there will be a release implementing the "hi-tech" option also
featured in MacWorld, or a ChurchWindows plug-in to accomplish the same task? The screen
shots looked really interesting.


Christopher J Stone

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to
Excerpts from netnews.comp.sys.mac.system: 26-Jun-95 Re: Greg's Copland
special-.. by zachery joseph bir@nicke
> >>>>> "Gregory" == Gregory D Landweber <gr...@math.harvard.edu> writes:
>
> Gregory> In article <3sdbmb$o...@rjo02.embratel.net.br>, Christiano
> Gregory> Vilhena <cvil...@embratel.net.br> wrote:
>
> >> Does anybody here knows how to activate the "window drawer"
> >> function on Aaron?
>
> Gregory> Aaron doesn't have that feature...yet.
>
> Greg,
>
> Please don't hate me for this, and I _will_ register, but I found an
> easy way to "hack" aaron to give the drawer effect. Open up a copy of
> the Copland WDEF floating around amug (the latest version is
> preferable) with ResEdit, and copy out the entire 'wdef' resource, and
> paste it into aaron. It maintains everything else, and gives the click
> on the button to "drawerize" the open window.

You don't understand that the drawerize feature found in Copland WDEF
doesn't work exactly the way it will in copland. And it also has a few
bugs in it. Greg will probably try to implement it properly if he puts
that feature in a new version.

-----------
Chris Stone
cjs...@CMU.EDU
Please try these sites and give me feedback.
http://cayman.hss.cmu.edu/BH239/staff/Stone/HTML/Stonepage.html

Ken Hince

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to
I've just tried out Aaron...has anyone noticed this?

The very first scan line on the screen seems to be done under the old
system...not under Aaron. This is the line at the top of the menu
bar. I've noticed it because I have my all my applications with
different colored menu bars, which works fine without Aaron, but
with it the very first scan line reverts back to grey (or is it
white...I can't quite tell.

Ken

John Fannin

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to
In article <greg-26069...@glandweb.student.harvard.edu>,
gr...@math.harvard.edu (Gregory D. Landweber) wrote:

> In article <rstokes-2606...@s54.phxslip4.indirect.com>,
> rst...@indirect.com (Randy Stokes) wrote:
>
> > I may have found another bug/conflict: When Aaron is loaded on my Centris
> > 610 running System 7.5, it seems the Open File dialog box in JPEGView 3.2
> > is screwed up; the normal buttons for Open, Cancel, etc. on the right side
> > of the box aren't obscured by what appear to be slider type controls.
> > Clicking in that area, or trying to manipulate the sliders, produces no
> > results. Double clicking on the name of a file in the window seems to
> > work fine, however.
>

> This will be fixed in 1.0b4.
>

> -- Greg Landweber
> gr...@math.harvard.edu
> (author of Greg's Buttons, Greg's Browser, and Aaron)

I think it has something to do with Quicktime 2.0
I isolated tons of extensions and it seemed Quicktime was making the Open
File box goofy. I think this is a fine extension. Looking forward to
your upload tomorrow!

Allen G. Newman

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to

There was a bug where a white line would remain while viewing full-screen
pics in JPEGview, but it was fixed in later versions of Aaron.
_
----------------------- | | | | _ | | ---------------------
Allen G. Newman |_| | | |_ |\| PGP Public Key
ane...@charlie.usd.edu | | |_ |_ |_ | | available on request.

Allen G. Newman

unread,
Jun 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/27/95
to
>In article <greg-26069...@glandweb.student.harvard.edu>,
>gr...@math.harvard.edu (Gregory D. Landweber) wrote:
>>In article <peterm.804154997@adils>, pet...@dna.lth.se (Peter Moller) wrote:
>>> One question: Isn't the window border just toooo wide? I find that a major
>>> problem. Anyone else?
>>It is the same size as in all the Copland screen shots.
>Hmmm. I tried Aaron today (1.0b2). I am not that convinced.
>
>1) The borders *are* too wide. It would be nice to be able to adjust them

I saved all the gifs of the "real" Copland from MacUser's Web site and
Copland's WDEF is virtually perfect visual match. The border width is the
same. (I viewed my gif of a Copland window *in* an Aaron-ized window --
there's an image to make you nuts!)

>2) The 3-D effect fails under the menubar clock. I use Times/18pt here and
>don't intend to change (I have a feeling this was addressed in earlier
>posts but missed them, sorry).

I wrote to Greg about this. See, I'm not the only one! :)

>3) The 3D effect in windows. The problem here is not only the extra
>real-estate taken up by the border, but the fact that, overall, it looks
>funny because you have this 3D window with 2D contents. The 7.0 windows
>are 3D-ish anyway, but without the fat border.

That's why they also redid the icons as perspective drawings.

>4) The Epsi bold font is nice, I use it with GB at the moment.

Yep! The light Epsy is nice too, Aaron or not. I'm thinking about trying
to fix all my apps that use Geneva to use Epsy instead.

>5) The icons are a bit naff. They look too Windows/Openlook-ish for my
>taste. And if you have a folder icon which is special (e.g. those from 4D)
>they look like the old ones.

To each his own!

It's a major pain to redo custom folders, since Folder Icon Maker can't
change the shape of an icon's mask, but I took a couple hours and tried
anyway, cleaning up in ResEdit. I have a LOT of custom folders. Getting
into a work rhythm got me through that drudgery and now everything looks
cool. Guess that means I have to keep Aaron now, 'cause even if I dump it
I'll still have Copland-style custom folders! Where's my checkbook? :)

srjg...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu

unread,
Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to
pet...@dna.lth.se (Peter Moller) wrote:

>My only whish (besides thinner window borders) is *proportional scroll bars*.
>Please, please, please, please??? I know it requires a lot of changes, but it's
>*really* useful and well worth the effort, IMHO.
>

Sorry, but what are proportional scrollbars? I hope you don't mean
scrollbars where the slide gets shorter the further into a long document
you get. I HATE that, I'm looking for real-time scrolling instead.

S. Johnson


Martin Jourdan

unread,
Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to
In article <peterm.804320512@adils>, pet...@dna.lth.se (Peter Moller) wrote:

> Well, that's nice, but they are still too wide. I mean: if System 8 will have
> that fat borders, I will be very dissapointed at Apple. They take up a *lot*
> of space and doesn't give anything back - no functionality or anything.

Yes they give you a new functionality back: you can move a window by
dragging any border, not only the title bar. Now try to grab a
one-pixel-wide border! ;-)

BTW, for those who are not in Copland, you can get this with "Stretch", a
shareware control panel by Ross Tyler. In fact, you can move or resize
(depending on modifier keys) by dragging any border. And Stretch installs
fatter borders (4 pixels) to help you do that.

Martin Jourdan

Action Charme, INRIA, Rocquencourt, France
Phone +33-1-39-63-54-35, fax +33-1-39-63-56-98, Martin....@inria.fr
#include <std_disclaimer.h>

Doan Stafford

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Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to
1. I certainly applaud Greg's shareware, but

2. PLEASE send comments about it directly to Greg--the address is
gr...@math.harvard.edu--, and Greg, PLEASE respond in private e-mail, rather
than here...

3. Thanks.

4. >>"please note that Aaron is $10 shareware. Read the docs for more
info." Please pay your shareware fees.

Doan Thiel Stafford
Member, QMUG/LA.
--

Peter Moller

unread,
Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to
>>1) The borders *are* too wide. It would be nice to be able to adjust them

>I saved all the gifs of the "real" Copland from MacUser's Web site and
>Copland's WDEF is virtually perfect visual match. The border width is the
>same. (I viewed my gif of a Copland window *in* an Aaron-ized window --
>there's an image to make you nuts!)

Well, that's nice, but they are still too wide. I mean: if System 8 will have


that fat borders, I will be very dissapointed at Apple. They take up a *lot*
of space and doesn't give anything back - no functionality or anything.

BTW: I don't think the interface to System 8 is frozen yet (I mean the Apple
default theme), things may change.

My only whish (besides thinner window borders) is *proportional scroll bars*.
Please, please, please, please??? I know it requires a lot of changes, but it's
*really* useful and well worth the effort, IMHO.

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Peter....@dna.lth.se, System Wet-Nurse @ DNA & LUDAT
Department of Computer Science, Lund Institute of Technology
Box 118, S-221 00 LUND, Sweden, tfn +46 -46 10 41 56, fax +46 -46 13 10 21

H. Chou

unread,
Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to

>>5) The icons are a bit naff. They look too Windows/Openlook-ish for my
>>taste.

actually, whoever posted this is right about certain things about copland
looking Windows-ish. i have windows 95 at work. mostly what i notice are
the windows themselves. both os have fat borders (almost stone-looking,
as if someone chiseled these windows) and that little grab thing in the
lower right corner. i know its purpose on a mac--to resize a window. but
in windows, you can resize a window from any window border, so i don't
know the purpose except maybe for looks.

but i think both aaron and the wdef are nice previews of what to expect
next year from apple.


Jase Pittman-Wells

unread,
Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to
pet...@dna.lth.se (Peter Moller) writes:
>[..]

>My only whish (besides thinner window borders) is *proportional scroll bars*.
>Please, please, please, please??? I know it requires a lot of changes, but it's
>*really* useful and well worth the effort, IMHO.

I agree with you completely on that one, but I fear that Apple has this
high-minded notion that they won't do it because Windows 95 and Unix GUI's
already do it; if the MacOS did it too then it wouldn't be unique.

Yes, a stupid rationalization, but that's what people have said to me
in the past when I ask about this.. (but not Apple people, so there's
still hope..!)

Jase Pittman-Wells

unread,
Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to
Doan_S...@pop.com (Doan Stafford) writes:
>1. I certainly applaud Greg's shareware, but
>2. PLEASE send comments about it directly to Greg--the address is
>gr...@math.harvard.edu--, and Greg, PLEASE respond in private e-mail, rather
>than here...

I rather enjoy seeing the replies here. It's nice to follow the
progress of things.

You could use a killfile if you don't like seeing these posts...

Jase Pittman-Wells

unread,
Jun 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM6/28/95
to
srjg...@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu writes:
>>My only whish (besides thinner window borders) is *proportional scroll bars*.
>>Please, please, please, please??? I know it requires a lot of changes, but it's
>>*really* useful and well worth the effort, IMHO.

>Sorry, but what are proportional scrollbars? I hope you don't mean


>scrollbars where the slide gets shorter the further into a long document
>you get. I HATE that, I'm looking for real-time scrolling instead.

It would be nice if the appearance manager will give you the option
of having either of these -- proportional scrollbars and real-time
scrolling.