What Apple is trying to tell us....

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Ian Feldman

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Apr 3, 1990, 10:48:28 PM4/3/90
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Here are some previews of coming Apple-attractions, as described
in the invitational booklet for the 1990 Apple Worldwide Developers
Conference, to be held in San Jose, CA, on May 7-11.... a month
AFTER the MacWorld SF Exhibition. Below are few selected, more
juicy bits; those in quotes verbatim. Each entry refers to a
single session, though many more sessions are scheduled. [My
own comments like this].


Monday, May 7th
---------------
System Software Overview - 90min
System 7.0 and its features. `A prelude to more technical sessions
and so important that no other competing sessions are scheduled'.

Getting More from MPW - preview of an 'integrated help system that
lets you slip straight to Inside Macintosh information without
leaving the confines of the editor'. [Mark the use of _confines_].

Virtual User: An Automated Testing Tool -- 'simplifies testing of
complex application software' (script-based). [The Gorilla DA -
the Real Bad Behaved Monkey DA ;-)]


Tuesday, May 8th
----------------
Interapplication Communications Overview -- a 6+3/4 hours' session.
Whole IAC Architecture, 'for techies and marketers that will whet
your appetite'. PPC Toolbox calls across AT networks. Apple-
Events[tm], AppleScript[tm], Edition Manager 'which allows your
applications to share data dynamically with other applications'.
Much more.

Graphics File Formats -- the 'chance to see the new graphics file
format that we're developing. Learn why it's a better format for
conveying and sharing graphics information among applications and
how you can prepare for its debut'. [Let's hope for one that is
broadly PC- and X-Windows-compatible].

N&C Event -- 90 minutes -- `Hear an announcement by our networking
and communication people on a matter that is of importance to all
developers'. [Introducing the AppleTalk Telepathic Communications
Superset, no doubt ;-)]


Wednesday, May 9th
------------------
Designing for Apple OS Independence -- 'Tired of rewriting
applications with each new System version? Now you can learn design
practices that will ensure that your applications run on Apple
operating systems, current and future, including A/UX'

Apple, The Interface and Everything -- 'Bruce Tognazzini, Apple's
Human Interface Evangelist, will discuss the intergalactic
importance of interface integrity. In this context, the importance
of the number "42" will also be discussed'. [Smells of Ted Nelson's
projected XANADU servers in orbit around Mars].

Truth About TrueType -- '...we'll look at the variety and state of
the art of the tools available for creating TrueType fonts'.
[Tools? What tools? Where?]

A Glimpe of the Future of the Macintosh Graphics -- 'see directions
Apple is taking in graphics [...] a peek at new graphics
capabilities as well as the integration of the line layout manager
and new printing architecture'.


Thursday, May 10th
------------------
HyperCard Surprise - 135 minutes -- 'Shh! It's a surprise. Don't
miss it'. [The long-promised Mr.Coffee interface, multiple cards on
screen and the incrementally compiled HyperTalk II, the Sequel. Not
available until Boston in August. The second longest session,
after the IAC one].

HyperTalk and New Debugging Tools -- 'see HT's latest commands and
syntax additions, as well as demos and the use of new debugging
tools'.

Extended XCMD architecture -- 'we'll provide sample source code'

Using the Help Manager in System 7.0 -- `Learn how to use and [..]
incorporate its features into your applications'.

Using the Alias Manager in System 7.0 -- `Overview and tutorial
[...]; allows your applications to track the locations of files'.


Friday, May 11th
----------------
Macintosh OS vs. Everyone Else -- 60min -- 'We'll show you why we do
what we do, how we do it and why we're ahead'

-------------------------------------------------------

So much the schedule. We're also told that due to Apple's "doing
their part for the environment" all conference materials will be
distributed, for the first time, "on a compact disk", that all
attendees will receive afterwards [video or CD-ROM? --if]. Could
be Apple's way of telling us all to read-their-lips and get those
Apple CD-ROM drives. Audio and video tapes will also be available
after the event though.

General: a beautiful brochure; all insights gained at the conference
fall under non-disclosure clause, "not to be used for any article or
news story without the express permission of the Apple Corporation's
Public Relations Departement"; US$ 195.- per day attendance fee; hotels
from US$ 56-135/ single/ day; registration form offers choice of
__Medium __Large __X-Large T-shirt and __Yes __No to vegetarian
meals. Also a mysterious "I checked in early gift" is mentioned,
twice. Ie, no small-T-shirt-size, non-vegetarian, late check-ins
need apply ;-))


--Ian Feldman / ianf%nada....@uunet.uu.net <--- the only safe route
/ "observe the emacs-style expression-dash-misuse"

Howard P. Marvel

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Apr 4, 1990, 1:44:04 PM4/4/90
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In article <40...@apple.Apple.COM> ch...@Apple.COM (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
>jk...@andrew.cmu.edu (Jonathan King) writes:
>
>>Maybe he's also trimming out all the fluff and misinformation, too.
>>But seriously, why did this guy get a renewed permit to mint money
>>over Hypercard 2.0 when there are many more deserving folks inside
>>Apple who could probably put the clown to shame?
>
>Consider this a general comment, not necessarily aimed at Jonathan King.
>He's the latest, handy example.
>
>Why is it impossible to post anything about anything these days on USENET
>without someone flaming? Either the posting, the person posting it, or
>finding some third, unrelated issue to flame on?
>
Let's all sit back and relax.

1. The original posting about the Goodman book was useful
information. That is, Chuq's post, as always, was useful in informing
us as to the likely time window for HyperCard 2.0. Thanks.

2. The king post did not strike this reader as an attack on Chuq. In
particular, it was an attack on Goodman, and on Goodman's special
treatment by Apple. I noted no criticism of Chuq, who I do not
believe works on the HyperCard project in any case, right?

3. The King post strikes me as absolutely appropriate. The argument,
as I understand it, is that Goodman made a fortune marketing a bad set
of books with an implicit Apple endorsement, that (implicitly) other
authors could have done better, and that Apple is repeating the
mistake. This may be an issue for debate, but it certainly does not
qualify as an off-the-wall criticism.

4. Hence, King's post seems inappropriate only to the extent that it
is offered as a follow-up rather than as a de novo posting, hardly a
major failing.

5. Chuq's postings are clearly valuable, and therefore we should
offer him our thanks and perhaps a gift certificate for a thicker
skin. After all, his cogent discussion of word processors did induce
me to purchase the copy of Full Write that is now gathering dust on my
shelf. 8-) I can understand the sensitivity over the net's low
standards of conduct, but I simply think that the sensitivity is
misplaced in this case and would hope that we could continue to
receive his fine contributions.

6. As to King's point, I heartily agree that his books are among the
least satisfactory contributions to the HyperCard literature. I'd
much rather see Apple make someone else rich. I nominate Jeanne
DeVoto of Apple.

Chuq Von Rospach

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Apr 4, 1990, 12:19:23 AM4/4/90
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ia...@nada.kth.se (Ian Feldman) writes:

> Apple, The Interface and Everything -- 'Bruce Tognazzini, Apple's
> Human Interface Evangelist, will discuss the intergalactic
> importance of interface integrity. In this context, the importance
> of the number "42" will also be discussed'. [Smells of Ted Nelson's
> projected XANADU servers in orbit around Mars].

This is one I hope I don't miss. Tog's stuff is something else.

> HyperCard Surprise - 135 minutes -- 'Shh! It's a surprise. Don't
> miss it'. [The long-promised Mr.Coffee interface, multiple cards on
> screen and the incrementally compiled HyperTalk II, the Sequel. Not
> available until Boston in August. The second longest session,
> after the IAC one].

Hmm. I wonder if there's any connection between this and Bantam's
announcement that Danny Goodman's 3rd edition of the Hypercard book ships in
July (it was in a recent Publisher's Weekly). I wonder why he's revising it?
Nah. Probably coincidence. He's just fixing bugs in his scripts.

> all conference materials will be
> distributed, for the first time, "on a compact disk", that all
> attendees will receive afterwards [video or CD-ROM? --if]. Could
> be Apple's way of telling us all to read-their-lips and get those
> Apple CD-ROM drives.

I would assume it's a CD-Rom instead of a proceedings. I don't know for
sure. I don't even think Apple cares if it's an Apple CD-Rom drive, as long
as it's a CD-Rom drive (actually, I bet apple DOES care....)

--

Chuq Von Rospach <+> ch...@apple.com <+> [This is myself speaking]

There is no truth to the rumor that the April 2 earthquake in England was
King Arthur expressing his opinion on the new poll tax.

Jonathan King

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Apr 4, 1990, 12:41:28 PM4/4/90
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ch...@Apple.COM (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
> ia...@nada.kth.se (Ian Feldman) writes:
>
> > HyperCard Surprise - 135 minutes -- 'Shh! It's a surprise. Don't
> > miss it'. [The long-promised Mr.Coffee interface, multiple cards on
> > screen and the incrementally compiled HyperTalk II, the Sequel. Not
> > available until Boston in August. The second longest session,
> > after the IAC one].
>
> Hmm. I wonder if there's any connection between this and Bantam's
> announcement that Danny Goodman's 3rd edition of the Hypercard book ships in
> July (it was in a recent Publisher's Weekly). I wonder why he's revising it?
> Nah. Probably coincidence. He's just fixing bugs in his scripts.

Maybe he's also trimming out all the fluff and misinformation, too.


But seriously, why did this guy get a renewed permit to mint money
over Hypercard 2.0 when there are many more deserving folks inside

Apple who could probably put the clown to shame? I mean, we *won't*
need the 90-page chapter on the Mr. Coffee interface he is madly
typing up, but we *will* need the seven plus or minus two pieces of
real information that will be buried deep within his chatty text. I
expect the new book will be a two volume set retailing for $50.00 if
the new version of Hypercard is anything like one might expect.

jking

Chuq Von Rospach

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Apr 4, 1990, 1:21:21 PM4/4/90
to
jk...@andrew.cmu.edu (Jonathan King) writes:

>Maybe he's also trimming out all the fluff and misinformation, too.
>But seriously, why did this guy get a renewed permit to mint money
>over Hypercard 2.0 when there are many more deserving folks inside
>Apple who could probably put the clown to shame?

Consider this a general comment, not necessarily aimed at Jonathan King.


He's the latest, handy example.

Why is it impossible to post anything about anything these days on USENET
without someone flaming? Either the posting, the person posting it, or
finding some third, unrelated issue to flame on?

Every time someone from Apple seems to open their mouth, someone jumps on
them. Or jumps in their general direction. I realize that Apple bashing
is a favorite hobby of some people, and I also realize that some times Apple
DOES deserve some bashing.

But I, personally, am tired of being bashed from all sides. When I
posted the 1 year warranty stuff, all I saw for a few days was how it
wasn't good enough.I'm tired of watching people who don't understand
the business whine. I'm tired of being a convenient target. This kind
of behavior is rampant on USENET, and I think it's inappropriate.
Unfortunately, I seem to be in the minority.

I'm tired of it, and I'm not willing to put up with the bashing any more.
I'm only going to post things when I feel it's important enough to warrant
wading through the inevitable flames. If that means the net won't get
information it might otherwise get, well, tough. People who act like idiots
should not be surprised when people stop talking to them.

Of course, I know I'm going to get flamed for this.... But it'll be the last
flame. I've got better things to do with my time than put up with this stuff.

Nothing personal, Jonathan. You're the last in a LONG string of noisemakers.
Not even particularly noisy, either -- but the straw that breaks the camels
back isn't always the biggest or heaviest. It's just the last.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled flamewar, already in progress.

chuq (email address: unlisted)

John Doner

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Apr 4, 1990, 8:43:56 PM4/4/90
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In article <40...@apple.Apple.COM> ch...@Apple.COM (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
=But I, personally, am tired of being bashed from all sides. When I
=posted the 1 year warranty stuff, all I saw for a few days was how it
=wasn't good enough.I'm tired of watching people who don't understand
=the business whine. I'm tired of being a convenient target. This kind
=of behavior is rampant on USENET, and I think it's inappropriate.
=Unfortunately, I seem to be in the minority.
=
=I'm tired of it, and I'm not willing to put up with the bashing any more.
=I'm only going to post things when I feel it's important enough to warrant
=wading through the inevitable flames. If that means the net won't get

Please reconsider, Chuq. I certainly value your postings and I'm sure
others do, too. Don't let those with quick fingers and bad manners
spoil it for everyone.

John E. Doner | "The beginner...should not be discouraged if...he
Mathematics, UCSB | finds that he does not have the prerequisites for
Santa Barbara, CA 93106| reading the prerequisites."
do...@henri.ucsb.edu | --Paul Halmos, Measure Theory

Matt McNally

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Apr 5, 1990, 11:07:09 AM4/5/90
to
An open letter to Chuq Von Rospach-

Chuq Von Rospach (ch...@apple.com) writes:

>I'm tired of watching people who don't understand
>the business whine. I'm tired of being a convenient target. This kind
>of behavior is rampant on USENET, and I think it's inappropriate.
>Unfortunately, I seem to be in the minority.

Although I do find value in many of the critical responses on the net,
I to agree that what might be expressed as an opinion, or productive criticism,
all to often degenerates into a whining tirade against 'the establishment'.
I am not denying the value of critical thought, or suggesting that
any establishment (eg. company, university or user group) should be
exempt from criticism. But I am weary of those who seem to forget
that any establishment is actually a dynamic system with multiple (and
often conflicting) goals that may lead to non-optimal solutions for certain
groups. It's fine to say 'I wish the <noun> would do this', but I don't see
that we really have any right to write 'The <noun> should do this', or worse
yet 'what fools made the <noun> do this, I would have done this'.

I do disagree though with your sentiment that you 'seem to be in the
minority'; indeed, each group on the net seems to be plagued by only
three or four real, for lack of a better term, 'reactionaries'.
These individuals, who certainly aren't the majority, may post out of purely
emotional or personal reasons and often seem to forget 'fairness' or the
inherent complexities of 'the system' wether it be a company such as Apple
or any other group of individuals. The majority of readers on the net
only seem to post when the have a question or an answer to a specific question.
These 'silent' masses are the real majority who post messages that contain
valuable opinions, suggestions and realistic criticism. They may not be as
vocal as others but they are the reason why I follow this group, and why I
hope you will reconsider your decision to withdraw from the net. Should
we be angry with those who may post with a lack 'tact', or simply focus on
those posts written by people seeking understanding instead of personal
glory/satisfaction/revenge?

I really do understand your sentiments, but I hope that when you ask
yourself 'Why bother?' you will remember that your posts, and those by
others from the various 'establishments', are appreciated, and probably
more important to those of us out here on the net than anyone would
like to admit.

Cio.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matt M. McNally - 'Macintosh II Initiative' Research Programmer/Dugan
Carnegie Mellon, H&SS Dean's Office, Pittsburgh 15213
mm...@andrew.cmu.edu | Baker Hall 369B, (412) 268-6990

Have you read your Tao today?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jim von Schmacht

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Apr 5, 1990, 1:11:32 PM4/5/90
to
Well, Chuq, we could just let them queue up for MacLeak subscriptions...since
most of 'em bitch about cost anyway they probably won't want to pay the
$75/year for information which is more rumour than fact. Grow up, people,
you are getting this info at no cost (other than net connections). The people
you have been flaming have no obligation to provide the information which you
so greatly desire, but so little appreciate. Chuq, can we add another proposed
split to comp.sys.mac? Suggestion: comp.sys.mac.flamewar. Do I hear a second?
*SPLASH*
I just dowsed myself with flame retardant so....


--
Jim von Schmacht Senior Member, Project Test Staff Ashton Tate Corporation
Disclaimer: Standard Issue
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It isn't the years - it's the mileage" -Indiana Jones

Tim Maroney

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Apr 5, 1990, 2:57:45 PM4/5/90
to
jk...@andrew.cmu.edu (Jonathan King) writes:
>>Maybe he's also trimming out all the fluff and misinformation, too.
>>But seriously, why did this guy get a renewed permit to mint money
>>over Hypercard 2.0 when there are many more deserving folks inside
>>Apple who could probably put the clown to shame?

In article <40...@apple.Apple.COM> ch...@Apple.COM (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
>Why is it impossible to post anything about anything these days on USENET
>without someone flaming? Either the posting, the person posting it, or
>finding some third, unrelated issue to flame on?

I'm not sure, Chuck. Since you're the one flaming, while King is simply
expressing a legitimate critical opinion of Danny Goodman's verbose and
unhelpful HyperCard book, perhaps the person to ask is yourself.

>Every time someone from Apple seems to open their mouth, someone jumps on
>them. Or jumps in their general direction. I realize that Apple bashing
>is a favorite hobby of some people, and I also realize that some times Apple
>DOES deserve some bashing.

Right. "There are many more deserving folks inside Apple who could
probably put the clown to shame" is now "Apple bashing". This should
easily take the "Most Feeble Flame Rationalization of 1990" award.

Why not just admit that you're flaming King because you hoped to gain
status from your announcement about Goodman's book, and you resent
having King point out that most sensible people don't care for
the book, so that you gain no status from it?

>But I, personally, am tired of being bashed from all sides.

A rather telling comment in this context. King never even mentioned
Chuck, yet Chuck is being bashed. Again, this points to the loss-of-status
explanation for Chuck's flame -- he perceives a negative opinion of
Goodman's book as both Apple-bashing and Chuck-bashing.

>When I
>posted the 1 year warranty stuff, all I saw for a few days was how it
>wasn't good enough.I'm tired of watching people who don't understand
>the business whine. I'm tired of being a convenient target. This kind
>of behavior is rampant on USENET, and I think it's inappropriate.
>Unfortunately, I seem to be in the minority.

WAAAAAAHHHH!!! MOMMMMYYYYY!!!

>I'm tired of it, and I'm not willing to put up with the bashing any more.
>I'm only going to post things when I feel it's important enough to warrant
>wading through the inevitable flames. If that means the net won't get
>information it might otherwise get, well, tough. People who act like idiots
>should not be surprised when people stop talking to them.

Don't slam the door on your way out. I assure you, very few people
will miss your puerile contributions. However, since this is about the
four dozenth posting of this type I've seen from you in the last eight
years, I'm not taking this too seriously. Indignant statements of
resignation, from the net in general or from various obscure
net.offices, is your defining form, always accompanied with a statement
of what idiots everyone else on the net is. I only hope that one day,
you're serious, and you don't come back.
--
Tim Maroney, Mac Software Consultant, sun!hoptoad!tim, t...@toad.com

"The pride of the peacock is the glory of God.
The lust of the goat is the bounty of God.
The wrath of the lion is the wisdom of God.
The nakedness of woman is the work of God."
- Blake, "The Marriage of Heaven and Hell"

Gregory S. Fox

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Apr 5, 1990, 3:01:00 PM4/5/90
to
On 4-Apr-90, Chuq Von Rospach writes:

> [Triggering post by Jon King deleted]

> Why is it impossible to post anything about anything these days on
> USENET without someone flaming? Either the posting, the person
> posting it, or finding some third, unrelated issue to flame on?

> Every time someone from Apple seems to open their mouth, someone
> jumps on them. Or jumps in their general direction. I realize
> that Apple bashing is a favorite hobby of some people, and I also
> realize that some times Apple DOES deserve some bashing.

> I'm tired of it, and I'm not willing to put up with the bashing
> any more.

This could mark the beginning of an unpleasant trend, so it's time to
speak up. To be succinct;

- I am greatly appreciative of the help I've gotten from these boards,
especially the thoughtful answers to stupid questions which I asked
[still ask :-)] when I was getting started. Invaluable.

- I also appreciate the technical threads that occur. More than once,
I've been forewarned of something tricky or interesting, learned of
a better approach, or tried things of which I was ignorant.

- When I see a flame, especially one devoid of real information, my
typical reaction is, "What a jackass", and I avoid that thread. It's
not that negative feedback is worthless, or that I don't have my own
qualms, but I can't see wasting time and bandwidth whining about a
trade-off or constraint or work-around when there are other things
I need to know and do. For whatever problems the Mac has, there's
undoubtably someone at Apple who's unhappy about them. They have
to sign their names to the product. It's the same with my own
software.


I can't think of a good way to improve the signal-to-noise ratio on
usenet, but I don't want people to think that their efforts go
unappreciated. And to the flamers out there, here's a clue: think
"feedback". It reflects on you, too. Do you want to improve the mac
environment, or are you just pissing into the wind?

Flames to e-mail,
--Greg

Robert Stanley

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Apr 9, 1990, 5:38:34 PM4/9/90
to
Well, just to add another 2 cents in the (doubtful) hope of persuading
flamers to just not say anything, here are all the people at Apple who
have provided me with an answer, directly or indirectly, over the last
several years. I stopped counting at the end of last year, and I know
that many of these names have moved on to other things, but my thanks
to you all anyway. Without the answers I found in your postings, some
of my working life would have been much tougher.

a...@apple.UUCP (Art Willis)
al...@Apple.COM (Alan Mimms)
al...@cambridge.apple.com (Andrew L. M. Shalit)
and...@apple.UUCP (Richard Andrews)
ant...@Apple.COM (Antonio Ordonez)
atk...@Apple.COM (Andy Atkins)
aus...@Apple.COM (Glenn L. Austin)
bat...@apple.UUCP (Ken Laws)
ba...@apple.UUCP (Allen J. Baum)
b...@apple.UUCP (bill coderre)
bc...@apple.UUCP (Brian Case)
bld...@apple.UUCP (Brian Hurley)
bl...@Apple.com (Brian Bechtel)
bur...@Apple.COM (Vicki Burich)
ca...@Apple.COM (Carl C. Hewitt)
ca...@Apple.COM (Randy Carr)
cart...@apple.com (Bryan 'STAKMan' Carter)
cass...@Apple.COM (David Casseres)
che...@goofy.apple.com (Harry Chesley)
ch...@apple.com (Paul Snively)
ch...@Apple.COM (Chuq Von Raspach [Apple: day 1!]) (Chuq Von Rospach)
cmc...@cdp.UUCP [[Charles McCabe]]
cor...@apple.UUCP (Someone Else) [[Cory ...]]
cre...@Apple.COM (Mike Cremer)
d...@apple.UUCP (Dan Allen)
da...@apple.UUCP (Darin Adler)
desn...@Apple.COM (Peter Desnoyers)
dg...@apple.UUCP (David Goldsmith)
dku...@apple.com (Derek "Slack" Kueter)
dly...@Apple.COM (David Lyons)
do...@apple.UUCP (Tom Dowdy)
d...@f.gp.cs.cmu.edu (Duane Williams)
d...@apple.UUCP (David W. Berry)
dwe...@Apple.COM (Dave Wells)
dy...@Apple.COM (Patrick Dyson)
ea...@apple.com (Earl Wallace)
edd...@apple.UUCP (Ken Eddings)
e...@Apple.COM (Mike Smith)
enw...@Apple.COM (Tim Enwall)
fa...@apple.com (Erik E. Fair)
fi...@Apple.COM (Robert Fish)
fl...@Apple.COM (Charles Flaig)
flo...@apple.UUCP (Stephen Flowers)
fra...@Apple.COM (Frank Flynn)
ge...@Apple.COM (Geoff Peck)
gg...@apple.com (Gordon Garb)
gla...@Apple.COM (Gary LaVoy)
gol...@apple.UUCP (Phil Goldman)
Gr...@AppleLink.Apple.Com (Greggy)
gr...@apple.UUCP (Grady Ward)
h...@apple.UUCP (Byron Han, Licensed To Dream.)
h...@apple.UUCP (Byron Han, fire fighter)
h...@Apple.COM (Byron Han, Architect)
h...@Apple.COM (Byron Han, wyl E. coyote )
h...@Apple.COM (Byron Han)
h...@apple.COM (Byron Han, Project Scapegoat)
ho...@apple.UUCP (Bayles Holt)
hux...@apple.UUCP (Fred Huxham)
jac...@apple.UUCP (Hernan'Jackie' Macapanpan)
jde...@Apple.COM (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
jer...@Apple.COM (Jeremy Bornstein) [ -jeremy bjornsten ]
jer...@Apple.COM (Jerry Godes)
j...@apple.UUCP (John Kullmann)
j...@Apple.COM (John Kevin Calhoun)
jmp...@Apple.COM (Mike Puckett)
joe...@apple.UUCP (Joe MacDougald)
j...@Apple.COM (Jon Singer)
jor...@apple.UUCP (Jordan Mattson)
j...@apple.com (John R. Galloway)
j...@Apple.COM (Jeff Miller)
kat...@apple.UUCP (Jim Kateley)
ka...@Apple.COM (Alex Kazim)
ke...@apple.UUCP (Keith Rollin)
ke...@apple.UUCP (Kent Beck)
kmce...@Apple.COM (Kevin McEntee)
ko...@apple.UUCP (Peter "Arrgh" Korn)
ks...@appleoz.oz.au ( A/UX Support)
ks...@appleoz.UUCP (Kent Sandvik - A/UX Support)
ku...@apple.UUCP (Kurt Hasel)
l...@apple.UUCP (Ed Lai)
le...@Apple.COM (Jonathan Patrick Leech)
len...@apple.UUCP (Robert Lenoil)
goofy!Apple.COM!liv...@apple.com (John Livesey)
l...@Apple.COM (Larry Rosenstein)
macl...@apple.com (Matthew MacLaurin)
mal...@Apple.COM (Malcolm Slaney)
ma...@apple.com (mark lentczner)
mi...@apple.com (mikel)
mjoh...@Apple.COM (Mark Johnson)
mu...@Apple.COM (Jim Murphy)
no...@apple.UUCP (Donald N. North)
or...@apple.com (Tim Oren)
pale...@Apple.COM (Jack Palevich)
par...@Apple.COM (Sean Parent)
pet...@Apple.COM (Steve Peters)
ph...@apple.UUCP (Phil Ronzone) (Philip K. Ronzone)
Pie...@apple.com (Kurt Piersol)
goofy!apple.com!pme...@apple.com (Paul Mercer)
p...@Apple.COM (Pete Helme)
rek...@Apple.COM (Paul Rekieta)
rew...@Apple.COM (Richard Ewing)
ri...@Apple.COM (Rick Fleischman)
r...@apple.com (Rick Holzgrafe)
r...@apple.UUCP (Rick Daley)
ru...@Apple.COM (Owen R. Rubin)
s...@Apple.COM (Steve Cisler)
sc...@apple.UUCP (scott douglass)
sheb...@Apple.COM (Andrew Shebanow)
shoe...@Apple.COM (Mike Shoemaker)
SI...@applelink.apple.com (Eric Ulevik)
sp...@Apple.COM (Dave "Spud" Kalin)
sta...@Apple.COM (Andy Stadler)
ste...@apple.UUCP (Bryan Stearns)
ste...@Apple.COM (Oliver Steele)
s...@apple.com (Steve Maller)
sus...@apple.UUCP (Joshua Susser)
te...@apple.UUCP (Ed Tecot)
tee...@Apple.COM (Michael Teener)
ti...@Apple.COM (Timo Bruck)
to...@apple.UUCP (Toby Farrand)
to...@apple.UUCP (Tom Taylor)
use...@apple.UUCP (usenet manager at apple)
win...@apple.UUCP (Dan Winkler)
w...@Apple.COM (Walter Smith)
ws...@apple.com (Will S. Johnston)
za...@Apple.COM (Zarko Draganic)

and, from a timewarp, or other wormhole in space:

Brian Schipper
Landon Dyer

I make no attempt to single anyone out for particular praise, although I
am sure that some of these will be familiar to many readers. On the other
hand, I would like to thank Byron Han for a most entertaining series of
signatures...

Once again, my thanks to you all.

Robert_S (also licensed to dream)
--
Robert Stanley UUCP: uunet!mitel!sce!cognos!roberts
Cognos, Inc. INET: roberts%cogno...@uunet.uu.net
(Research) Voice: (613) 738-1338 x6115

Robert Fuhrer

unread,
Apr 20, 1990, 4:34:12 PM4/20/90
to
In article <45...@hub.UUCP> do...@henri.UUCP (John Doner) writes:
>In article <40...@apple.Apple.COM> ch...@Apple.COM (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
>> But I, personally, am tired of being bashed from all sides. This kind
>> of behavior of behavior is rampant on USENET, and I think it's
>> inappropriate. Unfortunately, I seem to be in the minority.

>
>Please reconsider, Chuq. I certainly value your postings and I'm sure
>others do, too. Don't let those with quick fingers and bad manners
>spoil it for everyone.

Here, here! I sympathize with Chuq completely. But, if enough of us
who value intelligence, understanding, and humanity speak up, maybe the
now-silent majority can turn the tide against what I hope is the vocal
minority. Let's not give up on the world just yet, as tiring as it is!

Robert M. Fuhrer
Computer Science Dept.
Columbia University
r...@cs.columbia.edu

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